----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2004
10:13 AM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] was formula,
now HELP for b/f
"It is so important to acknowledge the
importance of breastfeeding and breastmilk but it doesn't mean that those
who cannot bf for whatever reason love and nurture their babies any
less than those who bf. Many women I know also juggle the despair of not
giving their baby the 'best' the worry that causes and the shame they feel
bottling in front of bf women as well as their constant sense of failure or
inadequacy as mothers. This is a terrible thing and we should be supporting
these women and providing them with our nurturing skills to enhance their
sense of selves. bf success doesnt not mean a 'better' mother." -
Belinda
What a beautiful letter, Belinda. This is so
true -mothers definitely need support to ENJOY their
babies. These are so often the mums who call me saying "I need to
learn infant massage - I dont feel as though this baby is mine" - it is
beautiful to see their confidence and bonding "click" after just a few weeks
or sooner - and perhaps because things (birth/ breastfeeding) havent
worked out, they are nurturing very consciously and connectedly - I
wholeheartedly agree that although breastfeeding is a wonderful mothering
tool, it isnt a guarantee of a "better mother".
Interestingly, although I feel strongly about
not "pussyfooting" around about breastfeeding as the "biological norm" - and
I was probably the speaker judith was referring to at ACT /NSW ABA
conf, (My talk was "Not Guilty -promoting breastfeeding, promoting
guilt), I have been quite pleasantly surprised that I dont FEEL
any "different" ?? "judgemental "(not sure of the word here, but
somebody expressed sympathy to the bottle fed baby) towards a
bottlefeeding pair (and I have sat and bottlefed a twin at classes recently)
- hopefully, mothers do sense my empathy at their sadness,
but for me, when I am with mums it simply "is" however she is feeding
her baby.
The mothers' stories come out as part of normal
discussion. A very sad one lately was a mum whose bub refused the breast -
(Formula in hosp nursery/ caesar/ haemorrrhage/ infection) and after
expressing/ bottling for 4 months (she was seeing an LC, but also
interestingly as she practised massage her supply increased dramatically ??
bonding effects enhancing oxytocin) , she has had a return of cancer and is
having chemo - she had herself been breastfed for 3 years so was under
no illusions about breastfeeding both as an optimum food , or a physical
_expression_ of love between mother and child - and as Belinda expressed - the
despair about not giving her baby the best was enormous - it is very
sad to have a mothering experience clouded with these feelings so early on.
I do feel tho that when we deny or are
complacent about the value of breastfeeding, we actually deny women a chance
to grieve because we arent fully acknowledging their losses - its like
saying to a woman who has a traumatic birth - "never mind you have a healthy
baby - move on".
As Rita and Abbey have described - the
feelings are grief and deep sadness, not guilt -no mum is a "failure"
-whether she tries to breastfeed or not -I imagine the hurt from a previous
experience could deter some mums from attempting to breastfeed at all
with subsequent babies - there is no worse emotion than disappointment.
My own first child was a "drugged" baby , who became ill and required ICU
care -he was fed formula as a newborn, no doubt sensitising him with
allergens and resulting in asthma, I also wonder at the effects of
formula on his tiny developing neurostransmitters - although there is a
family history, he is (so far) the only child who has developed a
bipolar/affective disorder - bipolar with some psychotic episodes -the
others were fully breastfed and hopefully will be protected (three are now
past the age he presented). While I feel sadness every day at the life my
bright beautiful child must live as he struggles with drug side effects to
maintain his stability and wonder "was it the early formula?", I also
believe that the gentle, connected mothering he experienced has been a
great help in that I have been able to encourage him to "listen to your
body" and he does always come to me when he is becoming ill, and
he has never been violent or destructive (as many parents at
support groups I have attended report - this isnt a judgement on their
parenting, but I have heard some parents talk about their children as
"objects" (and I would 'bop" them if they spoke to me like this) ie
"my son is a scizophrenic" - really,this is a person who is living with a
horrendously frustrating illness, it is not "who he is")
As mothers, we do need to look at all the
wonderful things we are doing, and we need to encourage each other to do
this - I always try to acknowledge something tangible that each mother
is doing so this is believable to the woman herself (Not "empty" praise like
"You are a good mother" ).
As I have said in Parenting By Heart - "our
kids are not cakes, we can't at 18, say, 'oops I forgot the baking powder'
but, like cakes, it takes a whole bowlful of ingredients for them to "turn
out" - although nuturing choices like birth and breastfeeding are
significant to our own sense of self as mothers and to our children, it isnt
"just the birth" or "just the breast" , there are lots of influences as they
grow.
Pinky
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2004
9:22 PM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] was
formula, now HELP for b/f
as the placenta is throwing off hormones to
stop your milk coming in in pregnancy, when third stage is complete the
hormones disappear quickly, prolactin rises and your milk comes in. A bit
of placenta left can certainly still inhibit your milk coming in properly
and establishing. Anemia can also affect your supply - how was/is that.
Domperidol is far better drug than maxalon, find a gp/lc there are some
great ones around. Did your breasts grow in puberty, it is another
possibility that something in puberty inhibited growth of adequate
functioning breast tissue. There are a myriad or possibilities for
your supply baby growth issues. Certainly filling the baby up with abm can
cause major problems but it seems in spite of this you tried many things
that should have helped. Did you see a lc at the time? Also remember if it
doesn't work hasn't worked mothering is a compex thing and the emotional
growth of your children is paramount (as well as their nutritional
wellbeing).
A friend of mine supplemented her fourth
child after three screaming poor weight gaining babies who lived at the
breast for a year or cried, no in-between. After much heartache she
decided to comp her fourth (she would have paid dearly for bm if she could
have got a hold of some) and her baby thrived and was a happy baby
immensely enjoyed by her mother. I believe she had limited
functioning breast tissue and there is nothing you can do about that. I
think we get lost in the af vs bf debate and forget to help mothers enjoy
their babies and gain confidence in themselves as mothers women.
I have helped many women as a lc in private
practice but I have also counseled women who for reasons such as the drugs
they need to survive day to day (depression or migraine issues that do not
respond to drugs that are okay to use with bf) poor breast tissue,
significant breast refusal (as a lc If they ask to see me and the baby is
over 6weeks old it can be very difficult to get tham back onto the breast
so they often end up expressing and bottling)
It is so important to acknowledge the
importance of breastfeeding and breastmilk but it doesn't mean that those
who cannot bf for whatever reason love and nurture their babies any
less than those who bf. Many women I know also juggle the despair of not
giving their baby the 'best' the worry that causes and the shame they feel
bottling in front of bf women as well as their constant sense of failure
or inadequacy as mothers. This is a terrible thing and we should be
supporting these women and providing them with our nurturing skills to
enhance their sense of selves. bf success doesnt not mean a 'better'
mother.
We should also be fighting the unethical
marketing of infant baby milk, doctors who give out free samples or who
minimise the benefits of breastfeeding, poor hospital practices, the lack
of a breast milk banks etc etc...
Good luck Rita, find a lc to help you
identify where the problems are coming from so you can work out a plan of
action.
Belinda
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2004
9:25 AM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] was
formula, now HELP for b/f
Colleen,
May I please ask how the 'Eglonyl' helped, how long you remained on
this medication and what side effects if any that you experienced.
As I have previous difficulties as some have been previously
described, I have been given maxalon for one of them to no avail.
It was also suggested for me to use motilium but did not get to that
point.
I also have a question for you wonderful wise women. With
some information and background first.
With babe No. 4, throughout the pregnancy as with any pregnancy
being different, this one was as well and more noiticable was the
different way in which my breasts responded to the pregnancy. I
felt confident and secure that finally this time I would be successful
in breastfeeding my babe.
But alas, it again was not to be. I have a theory and would
love some feedback. With this babe, I was prescribed the maxalon
at a higher than normal dose for lactation assistance (4 q.i.d) - or so
I was 'told'. Babe started experiencing extremely low blood sugar levels
and despite my refusal, they supplemented him with would you believe
50MLS EVERY THREE HOURS, when gastric tube placed in gut for the next
feed, there was formula coming back up, HE WASN'T HUNGRY, but I
know that 50mls is certainly excessive.
The question relates to the fact that post birth I felt extremely
boggy in the uterus and felt as if I had retained products......... I
even passed what I still to this day KNOW was placental tissue (as a
student midwife, you certainly see a lot of clots etc. on pads
post-partum.......) I kept it and a 'midwife' looked at it,
flushed it and said 'no that is nothing, just a blood clot'. The
one thing I did NOT experience with this breastfeeding experience was
that of my milk 'coming in'. For 6 weeks I argued with M&CHN
and doctor that I had retained products and that I still had not
experienced my milk coming in and was 'ignored'. Three months
later with babe on formula, me still spotting bright PV loss, I saw my
gyno whom performed a D & C and lo and behold - PATH RESULT -
RETAINED PRODUCTS OF CONCEPTION......... (No way this could have been a
'miscarriage' or 'blighted ovum') as no sexual intercourse had occurred
post-natally.
What degree of impact do you wonderful women believe the retained
placental bits and pieces would have actually had on my breastfeeding
experience. Just to add to this, I had reason to see my gyno for
unrelated issue and asked him regarding the possiblity of retaining this
time around and explained the reason behind my question and his reply
was 'Totally nonsense, that would not have had any impact on your
breastfeeding what-so-ever??????????????????????????????' This
comment came from a very well known AND respected Obsetrician whom many
are aware......................... I must say that I am still in
shock from his comment.
Looking forward to your replies.
Thanx for putting up with my many posts regarding this issue.
Yours in Childbirth
Rita
Van Onselen Family <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
I couldnt feed my 2nd child on day 10 and was offered formula or
diluted
cows milk.I remember saying to the doctor that since I was
going to damage
the child in the long run I might as well get it
over and done with now and
"euthinase her" to say he was shocked
and all were appalled is not an
understatement but these tactics
helped and I was given Eglonyl and fed 2
babies for 2 years each
with a boost on this psychiatric drug .
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