>Dear cde Mavela Thanx for stating your position clearly. I am impressed by your response as it speaks diectly to the issues raised. I am now certain that we are reading from the same hym book,we are all driven by the love of the party and the masses of our people. I am now certain that we have a common objective,the devil is the strategy. Lets discuss the strategy henceforth.
Yours in socialist revolution. cde Kwame Ndebele PAYCO Secretary General Dear cde Ndebele > > Thank you for understanding me on PAYCO related issues[?]. Responding to > your > question "I know where you stand where PAYCO is concerned,but what is your > stance on Mphahlele and the so called PACyl"? I am in a deep view that > *"the > unilateral decision on name changing was uncalled for and leaves more to > be > desired"*. His Hourabe style of governing is like a tasteless sugar[?]. > Broader consultation has to be the name of the game[?]. I so wish he can > resign as PAC President for the sake of progress and for saving himself > against hummilation. > > We as members, we found ourselves having to defend maladministration of > our > current leadership in public while secretively we know the truth[?]. I've > lost six foot soldiers to COPE and they cited all the irregularities in > our > party as the fundamental reasons to leave, what a shame. > > PACyl is fashionable and is not rational in addressing our problems; and > therefore should not be entertained by you guyz since you are the sole > custordian of our youth structure. > > Noble Son, any effort to discourage these name changing should be done in > a > pollite manner but if sturborness is the key from those who change names, > then we will fight tooth and nail battle[?] to unseat them. > > Have a Mavela's Day. > > Izwe Lethu > > "Agitator" Mavela[?] > > On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 8:27 AM, <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> Greetings cde Mavela, >> >> I have given myself time to study and comprehend your contributions in >> this group and have responded precisely to points you have raised >> without >> insulting or undermining you. I have on the same breath raised my >> disappointments with your attitute and style of debate. I always try my >> level best to play the ball not the man,hence I always single out issues >> I >> disagree with and deal with them in an exhaustive manner. Having said >> so,but I believe we need to be frank with other even if we risk being >> misrepresented as being insultive,as party members we are like a family >> now, we should point to each other unacceptable behaviour to avoid >> embarrasment. >> >> I am glad to learn that you are also not happy with the status quo in >> the >> party and you despise personality cult,I hope many who heroworship >> Mphahlele and Skwatsha would take leaf from you. I was also over the >> moon >> to realise that you are not anti-PAYCO or PAC. I have realised that we >> differ on the strategy and tacticts to redefine and save the PAC from >> anarchist. I just wish you can realise soon that Mphahlele is at the >> core >> of problems in the PAC,the sooner you come to terms with that reality >> the >> better. >> >> With due respect son of the soil, I have not seen any contribution that >> is >> insultive or embarrassing targeted to you. The comrades who have >> responded >> to you have expressed shock at the level of Hatred you have shown >> towards >> PAYCO and poor analysis of developments in the party. This is what I >> term >> robust debate. I know where you stand where PAYCO is concerned,but what >> is >> your stance on Mphahlele and the so called PACyl? >> >> Robust debate needs to be robust and not dirty hence I will discourage >> insults,especially to the other comrade. What makes a person a great >> debater is not how good you can insult the other party,but how you can >> pursue your point of view based on convincing facts to an extent that >> the >> person and those listening are persuaded to accept your point of view as >> factual. >> >> Your contributions continue to be appreciated and welcomed. >> >> Kwame Ndebele >> PAYCO Secretary General >> Visit.www.mayihlome.wordpress.com >> >> >> > >> Just read all my communique and you'll get my point. I am sorry for not >> > insulting you Sons of the Soil because I was not grown up by street >> > rappers >> > [?]. Mna I only want *PAC *to be free from personal scandals and >> political >> > gymnastics. I want to see *PAC* being a true vanguard of Azanian >> Masses . >> > I >> > will again say this without fear of being insulted *"I am for PAC not >> > Letlapa[?];** and I want to see PAC out of this problem which is been >> > hindering it from progress for sometime".* >> > >> > For the benefit of those who find fun in insulting me[?], continue as >> you >> > wish. >> > >> > I Pause >> > *"Agitator" Mavela*[?] >> > >> > On Tue, Jun 23, 2009 at 11:55 AM, patra sindane <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> > >> >> MA'Afrika! >> >> >> >> I have serious problems with Cde Mavela's level of understanding let >> >> alone >> >> of debating. >> >> >> >> You see comrades, this list should be taken very serious as we can >> not >> >> afford to send people to expensive political classes. What is the >> point >> >> of >> >> struggling for free quality education while comrades like Mavela >> misuse >> >> the >> >> one we are offering now? >> >> >> >> Son of the soil,Azania will punish you for your ignorency. My appeal >> to >> >> comrades is that let us continue contributing to this list positively >> >> and >> >> hope that one day he will wake up and smell the coffee! >> >> >> >> Izwe Lethu! >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Tue, Jun 23, 2009 at 11:36 AM, Mavela Mavela <[email protected]> >> >> wrote: >> >> >> >>> Greetings Fellow Africanist. >> >>> >> >>> I still maintain that we should try to salvage the PAC. Whatever you >> >>> say >> >>> is what I shared previously. Unfortunately people thinks that I am >> >>> against >> >>> Payco but one wonders why because I am totaly against our movement >> >>> state of >> >>> affair. I am for PAC. As for membership card issue, I think is been >> >>> exhausted. >> >>> >> >>> For Tsvangarai, I hope you were watching the news yesterday and have >> >>> listen to his statement as PM to Brown. >> >>> >> >>> I pause >> >>> *"Agitator" Mavela* >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 10:25 PM, sello mafrika Tladi >> >>> <[email protected]>wrote: >> >>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >> >>>> From: Jabu Makhanya <[email protected]> >> >>>> Date: Jun 22, 2009 1:52 PM >> >>>> Subject: Fw: mavela >> >>>> To: [email protected] >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> ----- Forwarded Message ---- >> >>>> *From:* Jabu Makhanya <[email protected]> >> >>>> *To:* [email protected] >> >>>> *Sent:* Monday, June 22, 2009 1:47:40 PM >> >>>> *Subject:* mavela >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> I'm not a member of PAYCO but I support their effort of rescuing >> the >> >>>> already sunk PAC. What I have noticed about your articles is that >> you >> >>>> seem >> >>>> to have a negative attitude towards PAYCO leadership and by that, >> you >> >>>> just >> >>>> wasting their precious time forgetting that they're not being paid >> for >> >>>> for >> >>>> embarking on a mission to save the PAC. What I have also realised >> from >> >>>> you >> >>>> is that you think you're a lover of PAC more than anybody else.Your >> >>>> arguments do not help salvage the PAC. The reverse gear you are >> >>>> talking >> >>>> about is nobody else but yourself. >> >>>> >> >>>> Being an ordinary member of the PAC myself, my hope is pinned in >> PAYCO >> >>>> as >> >>>> the only structure which can save the PAC. Talking with the PAC >> >>>> leadership >> >>>> is unfortunately an outdated approach because attempts to make >> Letlapa >> >>>> understand meaning of talks have failed in many occasions. For your >> >>>> own >> >>>> sake, Letlapa is currently not interested in any talks which will >> >>>> affect him >> >>>> and his cronies. I will encourage you to engage Letlapa about >> talks >> >>>> you are >> >>>> talking about and if he accepts, I will gladly request you to >> invite >> >>>> us to >> >>>> those talks. >> >>>> >> >>>> My branch has written several letters advising him about many >> issues >> >>>> about his leadership and he ignored us and the result is what you >> can >> >>>> observe today in the PAC provided you ability to observe if not >> you're >> >>>> unfortunate and I'll advise you to be patient and learn more >> >>>> particulary >> >>>> from PAYCO leadership. Furthermore, leaders come and go therefore >> we >> >>>> cannot >> >>>> compromise the future of the PAC at the expense of an individual. >> >>>> Letlapa >> >>>> is a messenger of the PAC memebers and not of his cronies. If you >> fail >> >>>> to >> >>>> adopt this principle, you cannot lead the PAC with dignity and >> you're >> >>>> doomed >> >>>> into a failure. >> >>>> >> >>>> To correct you, Morgan Tsangerai did not join the government of >> >>>> national >> >>>> unity to save Zimbabwe, Tsangerai did not in the first place >> supported >> >>>> the >> >>>> government of national unity. Tsangerai is a brainchild of Britain >> >>>> and >> >>>> America to distabilse Zanu-PF in a bid to recolonise Zimbabwe. >> >>>> Tsangerai >> >>>> was calling for sanctions against his own country, Zimbabwe because >> he >> >>>> knew >> >>>> that hungry Zimbwabeans wiil rebel against Zan-PF. Again.I'll will >> >>>> humbly >> >>>> request you to learn more about international affairs. >> >>>> >> >>>> If you are not prepared to appreciate what PAYCO leadership is >> trying >> >>>> to >> >>>> do, you have a right to shut up and remain a stooge of Letlapa. >> >>>> Lastly, you >> >>>> must know that any dogmatic mentality cannot withstand a >> revolutionary >> >>>> and >> >>>> visionary approach. >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> Jabu >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Patrick "Patra" Sindane >> >> Radical Youth Network (RYN) >> >> South Africa >> >> Strategy & Politics >> >> Mobile: 073 052 7005 >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> > > >> > >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------- >> South Africas premier free email service - www.webmail.co.za >> ------------------------------------------------------------------ >> For super low premiums, click here http://home.webmail.co.za/dd.pwm >> >> >> > >> > > > > ------------------------------------------- South Africas premier free email service - www.webmail.co.za ------------------------------------------------------------------ For super low premiums, click here http://home.webmail.co.za/dd.pwm --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ Groups "Pan Africanist Youth Congress of Azania" group. 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