Peter, your initial argument was that few humans live where fossilisation takes place. I argue that many of our artifacts are deposited in places that do favour fossilisation. And I would say that shipwrecks in particular are prone to fossilisation because of the amount of detritus that rains down on them. Many wrecks will be covered in oxygen free mud long before they have had time to rot or rust, and then will have reasonable probability of reaching the fossil record. From echo sounding in eg. the Black Sea, we know that human artefacts are already preserved that way in the form of drowned settlements. In the Scandinavian countries, there are still untouched bronze-age burial mounds that do contain wooden ships preserved in peat, along with weaponry, jewelry and tools. In Denmark, nearly perfect specimens of stone-age people have been unearthed from marshlands which, incidentally, would also be likely candidates for future fossilisation.
In short, I think you're overly pessimistic. The abundance of our species across the face of this planet is so extensive that fossilisation of enough artefacts to make a mark in history is more likely than not. Another matter is that future geologists will find sliver-thin strata in the sediments that are nearly saturated with non-natural chemical contaminants such as dioxins or moderately soluble mercury salts. And if they're lucky they'll stumble upon some very unlikely deposits of highly concentrated plutonium in concrete. That should be a good puzzle for them <g>, but I think you know what I mean. Jostein 2009/1/19 Peter Alling <[email protected]>: > In a few million years the pyramids will be weathered to less than hillocks; > iron, even stainless steel, will oxidize to dust; micro-organisms will have > eaten rubber and plastic; glass will have been smoothed to pebbles; little > recognizable as an artifact will remain. For example not too long ago, it > seems that a couple of Ford Truck sparkplugs from the 1920's were initially > misidentified as "geoids". The earth's crust is very active, and the > biosphere even more so. > > > -----Original Message----- >>From: Bob Sullivan <[email protected]> >>Sent: Jan 19, 2009 6:55 AM >>To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List <[email protected]> >>Subject: Re: PESO - attempt at B/W conversion >> >>Jostein, >>Our garbage dumps will be a treasure trove for future records of our >>existance. >>Regards, Bob S. >> >>On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 4:03 AM, AlunFoto <[email protected]> wrote: >>> While human bodies stand little chance of fossilising, many of our >>> cultural artefacts do. Structures such as pyramids, concrete, cast >>> iron, shipwrecks in mud, etc, etc. We started out pondering whether a >>> civilisation could have existed before the emergence of humans. I >>> would argue that any such civilisation would have been discovered by >>> fossilised remains of their artefacts. It is of course possible to >>> imagine an intelligent species not building anything to support their >>> existence, but that defies the definition of civilisation, doesn't it. >>> >>> On an eerie sidenote, I suspect human civilisation's largest >>> contribution to a future fossil record will be fossilised garbage... >>> :-( >>> >>> Jostein >>> >>> 2009/1/19 Luiz Felipe <[email protected]>: >>>> Peter, I saw "Stan" (a T-Rex fossil) at Disney's Animal Kingdom and the >>>> folks at the exibition told me how few specimens existed. It's a very >>>> difficult puzzle indeed. >>>> >>>> There are lots of unexplained artifacts from pre-historic ages that suggest >>>> mankind did have a former civilization that vanished in some global >>>> catastrophe, leaving scattered groups with tales of destruction by flood >>>> and >>>> fire. We usually regard our achievements as important, but if mankind >>>> disappeared the next tenants would have little to remember us. >>>> >>>> LF >>>> >>>> Peter Alling escreveu: >>>>> >>>>> On a serious note, most people don't realize how little of the fossil >>>>> record actually exists. I think the entire T-Rex species is known from >>>>> fewer than 100 individuals with only a half a dozen considered "nearly >>>>> complete", representing several hundred thousand years of the species' >>>>> existence. The amount of time that hominids an entire group of mammalian >>>>> species have been on earth is less time than the existence of that one >>>>> species of dinosaur was. If the same amount of time elapsed between the >>>>> rise of a new intelligent creature and our demise, as between us and the >>>>> dinosaurs, I doubt enough would exist of our works to show that we were >>>>> tool >>>>> users. In fact though there are an awful lot of us, I doubt there would >>>>> be >>>>> many surviving fossils, as most of us live in areas not conducive to >>>>> fossil >>>>> formation. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> From: AlunFoto <[email protected]> >>>>>> Sent: Jan 17, 2009 3:45 PM >>>>>> To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List <[email protected]> >>>>>> Subject: Re: PESO - attempt at B/W conversion >>>>>> >>>>>> 2009/1/17 Peter Alling <[email protected]>: >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If birds are related to dinosaurs maybe they did. >>>>>>> Not much would be left of our civilization after a few million years. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> True enough. But since there are fossilised remains of early hominids >>>>>> like Lucy, then one has to wonder how a previous civilisation of >>>>>> another species could have come and gone without as much as a trace in >>>>>> the fossil record. >>>>>> >>>>>> Unless, of course, the fossil record is a hoax planted by the previous >>>>>> civilisation. >>>>>> >>>>>> No, wait! That doesn't hold with the fact that Noah's flood caused all >>>>>> the fossils. >>>>>> >>>>>> <g, d & r> >>>>>> Jostein >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ >>>>>> http://alunfoto.blogspot.com >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>>>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >>>>>> follow the directions. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>>>> [email protected] >>>>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >>>>> follow the directions. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Luiz Felipe >>>> luiz.felipe at techmit.com.br >>>> http://techmit.com.br/luizfelipe/ >>>> >>>> -- >>>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>>> [email protected] >>>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >>>> follow the directions. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ >>> http://alunfoto.blogspot.com >>> >>> -- >>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>> [email protected] >>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >>> follow the directions. >>> >> >>-- >>PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>[email protected] >>http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow >>the directions. > > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > [email protected] > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow > the directions. > -- http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ http://alunfoto.blogspot.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List [email protected] http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
