Well done, Edwina.  S

*@stephencrose <https://twitter.com/stephencrose>*


On Mon, Jun 9, 2014 at 8:46 AM, Edwina Taborsky <[email protected]> wrote:

> I think that it was a naive and ignorant article and as such, because it
> was written out of ignorance, not worthy of 'total despair'!
>
> I think that the author is unaware of the difference between a tribal and
> a civic society. The former, and China fits in here, operates within the
> network and ties of kinship obligations. The latter, which the West moved
> into centuries ago, operates, legally at least, by rejecting the privileges
> or lack of kinship bonds and focusing instead as per the Magna Carta and
> Declaration of Independence, on human equality.
>
> This has nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with 'pragmatism'. It's pure
> tribalism; you claim the surgeon, for example, as a member of your clan by
> your financial tribute to his skill; his accepting the tribute shows that
> he accepts the patient into 'his tribe'.  Both become members of the same
> family clan. Nothing, nothing, to do with pragmatism, which would be
> viewed, I think, as unethical because pragmatism shows no respect for 'the
> clan', for 'the family obligations'.
>
> Absolutely nothing to do with the notion of 'god' as the author tries to
> claim: "By contrast American ethics (and foreign policy) is still too
> religious in its perspective, and even our democratic traditions are
> asserted with dogmatic gusto. As it's been pointed out many times, someone
> who thinks he has God on his side is capable of almost anything."
>
> Then, another aspect is missing. The Chinese, for the most part, are still
> deeply superstitious and, in a way, quite nominalistic! The words you use
> are considered important in effecting the result; that's not pragmatism;
> that's superstition and suggests, if I may say, a lack of Thirdness!!!. The
> colours you use, the sounds, the location of a house or window....all have
> 'power' to make things happen.
>
> And another aspect - corruption. You don't get anything done in China
> without that red envelope. That's not merely in the hospitals - and in this
> communist socialist nation you pay for your medical care - but to get a
> bureaucratic result - a form, a registration, a visa, a...you must take the
> Boss Man out to dinner and hand over that red envelope. Corruption can't be
> redefined as pragmatism.
>
> Edwina
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jon Awbrey" <[email protected]>
> To: "Phyllis Chiasson" <[email protected]>
> Cc: "peirce-l@list iupui. edu" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Monday, June 09, 2014 8:00 AM
> Subject: [PEIRCE-L] Re: NYTimes : From China, With Pragmatism
>
>
>
>  Yes, thankfully  few of them saved me from total despair.
>>
>> Jon
>>
>> http://inquiryintoinquiry.com
>>
>> On Jun 9, 2014, at 1:05 AM, Phyllis Chiasson <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>  Did you read the comments following the piece?
>>>
>>> Jon Awbrey <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> good grief, what tripe ...
>>>>
>>>
>>
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