On Wed, Sep 09, 2026 at 03:12:26PM -0400, Andrew Dunstan wrote:
> On 2026-09-09 We 1:34 PM, Tom Lane wrote:
> > Noah Misch<[email protected]> writes:
> > > I want to clarify one thing before you spend much time on fixes.  I don't 
> > > see
> > > "fixes" addressing this thread as a whole, unless you plan to dispute the
> > > premise that the feature needs a redesign.  In other words, I think the 
> > > thread
> > > outcome should be one of these:
> > > - My review erred in determining that the feature needs a redesign.  The
> > >    design is sound and should proceed, possibly with some fixes.
> > > - Revert the feature.
> > FWIW, I agree with Noah's point that having two independent
> > implementations of SQL reverse compilation is not really a place
> > we want to be: it will be a major PITA for future development.
> > 
> > Unfortunately, I see no practical way to have pg_dump share code with
> > the backend for most of this stuff; not least because pg_dump has to
> > support dumping from old backends that won't have any such feature.
> > So we either swallow that duplication or decide that we're never
> > going to support this in the backend.  Neither choice is palatable,
> > but I don't think I want to be forced into the duplicative approach
> > when we've not explored other alternatives (such as refactoring
> > pg_dump to expose its internal logic in some way).
> > 
> >                     
> 
> 
> I first raised the idea of these functions on the mailing list in July 2025,
> although the idea was much older. [1] Among other things, you (Tom) said
> [2]:
> 
>    Insisting that this feature support pg_dump is a good way
>    of making sure that nothing useful will emerge at all.
> 
> Concrete patches began to appear around October and November 2025. I don't 
> recall anyone coming along and saying "No, we don't want to do that." After 
> they were committed there were various comments on the way they were done, 
> and I addressed them.  Now, months later, we are more or less told that this 
> whole enterprise has been misguided from the start. Is it any wonder that 
> people often find the process of contributing to Postgres discouraging? And 
> that would include people who have been working on more important members of 
> this set for release 20, particularly the one that most people want, namely 
> pg_get_table_ddl() that Akshay has been working on. I don't feel badly for 
> myself, but I do feel badly for the contributors.

Going forward, feel free to add me to the To: line of a mailing list post and
explicitly ask me for my guess about the project's overall prognosis, likely
ways of failing, etc.  My guess may be brief and/or wrong, but I'll provide
one.

When it's four months after feature freeze and I find non-subtle, unreported
defects in the feature, the development process wasn't adequate for the
subject matter.  To be transparent, observing this outcome changed my view of
code duplication.  Duplication was always a smell, but it seemed like a
plausible compromise tactic in 2025.  Now I find the duplication gave wrong
code too much place to hide.

> I believe reverting now almost certainly means this proposal or anything like 
> it is probably dead for the foreseeable future.

I'm prepared to accept that outcome.


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