2016-10-30 12:00 GMT+01:00 Tudor Girba <[email protected]>: > Hi, > > > On Oct 30, 2016, at 11:55 AM, Nicolai Hess <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > > > > > 2016-10-30 11:52 GMT+01:00 Nicolai Hess <[email protected]>: > > > > > > 2016-10-30 11:41 GMT+01:00 Tudor Girba <[email protected]>: > > Hi, > > > > I actually think there is no disagreement in this discussion :). > > > > I am not sure about that. > > > > > > I see it similarly to how Dale described it, but perhaps I am wrong. It > seems to me that: > > - Guille and Stef are talking about Core, they refer to the smallest > image that can be useful for a developer and that is being built out of the > tiny kernel. Indeed, Mocks do not belong there. Specifically, as FileSystem > does belong in this image, we should not make FileSystem testing depend on > Mocks. > > - Denis is talking about the typical distribution that we now name the > Pharo image. Mocks might actually belong in this one quite nicely. > > > > > > Denis wants to have a Mock-Framework to be used for SUnit, and if we > have Kernel and Kernel-Tests in the bootstrap image, the Mocks-Framework > has to be in it too, no ? > > > > From a practical point of view, it is not a good option to add new > things for Pharo 6. We have decided that Pharo 6 is closed for new features. > > > > Feature freeze? Really, since when? > > > > Does it means any changes (I am working on) for keymapping and style > settings has to be moved to Pharo 7? > > > > There was an email sent by Esteban recently in the thread: > Notes about Pharo 6 release and new process for Pharo 7 >
Oh, I thought it was only about a "VM feature freeze", for having a stable version to work towards 64 bits VM. That is unfortunate, I have some other things I am working on and thought I would have time until february, as in the prior relaese cycles. > > I think that things like your work on keymapping should still make it in > this release. > > Cheers, > Doru > > > > However, once we have the new process in place for Pharo 7, we can > reconsider our options. The new process should precisely make it easier and > safer to play with new things for the official distribution that has > several convenience libraries inside. > > > > @Guille, Stef: Does this reflect what you think? > > @Denis: Is this reasonable for you? > > > > Cheers, > > Doru > > > > > > > > > On Oct 30, 2016, at 9:33 AM, stepharo <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > Denis > > > > > > We are working since 4 years now to get > > > > > > - have a small kernel + tests > > > > > > - be able to load nicely configurations > > > > > > We should not add something else than Sunit for tests of the small > kernels tests. > > > > > > Now people can use whatever they want to test their system but for the > core > > > > > > we are really picky because loading on single package may add far too > many dependencies. > > > > > > and it means > > > > > > - more time to load > > > > > > - more time to debug > > > > > > - more time to just understand what did not work during the > bootstrap. > > > > > > So our goal is to shrink the minimal core and not to extend it. So we > will add mock by hand if we need them. > > > > > > I agree with Guillermo. Far too much pain. > > > > > > Stef > > > > > > Le 28/10/16 à 18:51, Denis Kudriashov a écrit : > > >> We always said that smalltalk is the best for TDD. > > >> But we not have mocks by default in Pharo while mocks is fundamental > part of TDD. > > >> So no kernel tests could benefit from them. > > >> And more important TDD is design process and without mocks we can't > apply it to kernel with full power. > > >> What you think to integrate Mocketry in Pharo 6? > > >> It has comments and documentation (PharoInProgress, Help), advanced > features and it is very competitive to any modern mock libraries. > > >> > > >> Best regards, > > >> Denis > > > > > > > > > > -- > > www.tudorgirba.com > > www.feenk.com > > > > "Value is always contextual." > > -- > www.tudorgirba.com > www.feenk.com > > "Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be > done." > > >
