On Sat, 18 Mar 2006 12:23:32 -0800, Stuart Jansen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
Finally, I'm glad you brought up Python. Certain things about Python rub
me the wrong way, but at least it's an example of what Java should have
been. Python code is just as easy (easier!) to maintain than Java. The
Python community cares about good design, just like the Java community.
In my opinion, there are two major facets of any programming language:
1) The syntax and features of the language itself, e.g. procedural vs.
functional, typing strategies, etc.
2) The libraries and third-party features that surround the language
I place "community" in with #2, because really, the only reason you should
care about what other people are doing with a language (whether they "care
about good design" and so forth) is how it reflects on #2.
Python is a language that mediocre programmers can use without doing too
much damage. But Python manages to do it without strapping developers
into a straight jacket or brainwashing them into think XML is a hammer
and everything is a nail. The Python community understand the value of
simple solutions.
These seem to be arguments that fall squarely into the #2 facet. I mean,
there's nothing inherent about the Java language that makes XML a
highly-desirable tool. Python has XML parsers too.
Anyway, where I'm going with this is:
a) I see #1 as being a matter of taste. Some people like the taste of
certain types and certain syntax more than others.
b) If the #1 features of the language match your personal tastes, but #2
is full of idiots (PHP) or over-used XML (Java), it seems to me that there
may be some good opportunities for change. I think PHP is changing in the
right direction, although there's so much baggage there that it may not be
worth it. Java, on the other hand, I think has some great potential for
change, and I think Java 5 is a great example of some of that change. For
example, annotations are getting rid of a lot of the XML baggage that has
been around for a long time.
Here's a great example of how Java is being pushed by languages such as
Python and Ruby into a more flexible world, keeping both the emphasis on
design and the basic Java syntax and features (#1), while changing a lot
of the negative parts of #2.
https://trails.dev.java.net/files/documents/2296/13104/trails_withnarration.mov
~ Ross
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