On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 1:39 PM, Charlie Coleman <[email protected]> wrote:
> But for entertainment value it is almost laughable to watch him croon about > But anyway, as one of the "non-lazy" American (U.S.) developers - someone > who actually evaluates a technology and lets the customer know all the > ramifications of using it - in most cases grabbing the low-wage foreign > worker does not pan out. In my experience I've dealt with (or been in close > proximity to) about 12 of these folks. At this time, I know of only 2 of > them that are still with the same job/employer. And basically, those that > are gone left behind work that had to be re-written. You see, the low > wagers will jump ship immediately when just a slightly higher wage offer is > made. As for the low code quality, I don't blame it on their work ethic - > it's more akin to communication skills. ----------------------- I have spoken with at least 6 PMs about these former failed outsourced projects. #1 problem is Communication. #2 Requirements, understanding the IMPLICATIONS #3 Freshers who were bright and only stuck around for a short while. #4 Con artists who said they delivered and couldn't. Communication is the biggest problem on both sides of the workforce. We take for granted what is said and they focus on an aspect of the conversation. We spoke about it as no big deal and went into details, then another item that was very important and glanced over it. The PMs were never involved in checking the work requests going back to India and got crap in return. Requirements and testing expectations were not examined beforehand. Employee turnover you cannot fix if you are a lowballer in rates to get business. Then there are companies that never delivered anything. > I also don't fault them for this - > English is not their primary language - I can only imagine how I'd > misconstrue complex requirement statements if presented to me in a foreign > language. As to general work ethic, of the "foreign" folks that I dealt > with, I'd say perhaps half of them were "lazy button-clickers." They didn't > really understand what they were supposed to do and they would not put out > extra effort to dig into things to find out. I'd say that percentage is > roughly the same for the American workers I've dealt with. Perhaps one > reason some people think they work harder than U.S. counterparts might be > because they have to work a lot harder to just get the same basic > understanding that a U.S. worker already has of the project. <shrug> -------------------- Many of the to programmers I know in Memphis came to the local U to get their Masters. I do not know how they got visa extensions and were able to become citizens but every one has completed the cycle or will in 2010. They didn't understand how in the USA everyone took the weekend off and restarted on Monday. They would continue to work till the current task was completed if it meant late on Fri. and then coming in on Sat they did it. > My info is by no means exhaustive - I don't deal with a lot of companies > that hire a lot of foreign labor. I do know a few people that do (some > neighbors that take lots of trips overseas). When I talk to those guys, > they say the set up was a mistake. It ended up costing a lot more than what > they had projected with using an American (aka U.S.) work force. Granted > the folks I talk to are Americans so I'm sure some bias is there. But, > overall, it's the usual "story" - the short-term focus of most US > businesses ends up causing long-term problems. ---------------------------- One of my Barbecue team mates was a winner with an India outsource project. he use to be very high in FedEx IT. he says that on two projects he saved about 40 million dollars. He now works with Kroger as IT R&D director, or something like that, and he is about to open up a 400 mill dollar change to their bottom line with respect to opening up to the public the ability to buy odd items from Kroger. These use to be sent back to the vendor and now you can buy them instead. the vendors didn't credit back to Kroger what was expected and the $$ was written off. I do not know where this was written, but I can find out. I think it was in Cinci where they are based. Anyway if you think you are going to save a lot of $$$$ you had better be investigating a lot closer to determine if you are going to get what you think you are. Many of these PMs that I know just took it for granted the lip service they were fed instead of digging into the beast early on. -- Stephen Russell Sr. Production Systems Programmer SQL Server DBA Web and Winform Development Independent Contractor Memphis TN 901.246-0159 _______________________________________________ Post Messages to: [email protected] Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[email protected] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
