On 05/08/2019 06:22, raymond.hettin...@gmail.com wrote: I have read through (most) of the thread, and visited the issue referenced. > We should revisit what we want to do (if anything) about invalid escape > sequences. IMHO - revisit is okay, generally - but that was actually done a long time ago. Now it is, to me, just another example of "Python" being indecisive. > > For Python 3.8, the DeprecationWarning was converted to a SyntaxWarning which > is visible by default. The intention is to make it a SyntaxError in Python > 3.9. Sounds like this has been discussed in depth - and decided. > > This once seemed like a reasonable and innocuous idea to me; however, I've > been using the 3.8 beta heavily for a month and no longer think it is a good > idea. The warning crops up frequently, often due to third-party packages > (such as docutils and bottle) that users can't easily do anything about. And > during live demos and student workshops, it is especially distracting.
Because it is not innocuous? My experience with developers (you mention
3rd party) - is that they are lazy. If something is not up there, "in
the face", they will always have a reason to say - tomorrow. Or,
perhaps, since this has been a silent issue (and they are too lazy to
read "What's new" they do not even know. The "head buried in the sand"
sort of thing.
As to demo's and workshops - YOU know this - so use it as an example to
explain how Python development works and DEPENDS on 3rd party developers
paying attention. Yes,I am sure you are concerned about speeding
adoption of Python3.latest-is-greatest, but that is not the world.
For example, RHEL8 is (coming) out. iirc, they way it comes out it what
they intend to support for 10 years - so changes are it will be Python
3.7 (at best) for several years. I have a system with Centos(-7) and
it's default python is python2
[root@t430 ~]# python3
bash: python3: command not found...
Similar command is: 'python'
[root@t430 ~]# python
Python 2.7.5 (default, Jun 20 2019, 20:27:34)
...
> I now think our cure is worse than the disease. If code currently has a
> non-raw string with '\latex', do we really need Python to yelp about it (for
> 3.8) or reject it entirely (for 3.9)? If someone can't remember exactly
> which special characters need to be escaped, do we really need to stop them
> in their tracks during a data analysis session? Do we really need to reject
> ASCII art in docstrings: ` \-------> special case'?
Simply put - yes, reject. You decided. There is a solution - perhaps
boring to implement - but as is mentioned - there are 'linters', so an
automated approach is likely possible. If not today, someone will write
a module.
> IIRC, the original problem to be solved was false positives rather than false
> negatives: filename = '..\training\new_memo.doc'. The warnings and errors
> don't do (and likely can't do) anything about this.
For "filenames" you could, perhaps, make an exception in the calls that
use them. e.g., when they are hard-coded in something such as
open("..\training\new_memo.doc"). iirc, Windows can (and does) use
forward-slash for file names for system calls like open. The "shell"
command.exe does not, because it uses "/" the way posix shells use "-"
(as in /h and -h for the "option" h).
>
> If Python 3.8 goes out as-is, we may be punching our users in the nose and
> getting almost no gain from it. ISTM this is a job best left for linters.
> For a very long time, Python has been accepting the likes of 'more \latex
> markup' and has been silently converting it to 'more \\latex markup'. I now
> think it should remain that way. This issue in the 3.8 beta releases has
> been an almost daily annoyance for me and my customers. Depending on how you
> use Python, this may not affect you or it may arise multiple times per day.
IMHO - Python will not be punching anyone. Python will be delivering "a
promise", being decisive, being clear. Not following through only
creates insecurity - will they ever do it? Nah - no guts (these are
3rd-party developers chatting). Users are your friend. If they really
want Python3.8+ and they get lots of warning messages - THEY will
complain - and be heard - in ways CPython never will (or was).
Again - revisit is fine - and I hope my 2 cents helps you stay the course!
Michael
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