Don't get me wrong I understand how this can be offensive and/or frustrating for both sides; but I if you just be patient and work through the communication barrier more problems will be solved. Ok, now I am done...
On Fri, Oct 19, 2018 at 2:51 PM Tyler Veinot <[email protected]> wrote: > I suggest the solution of if you are having trouble understanding someone > do to a language barrier just say so and/or ask for help. The people here, > for the most part, are friendly and understanding. I cannot imagine someone > not clarifying a communication, or parts there of, for someone like me, who > only speaks a single language. I use google translate very often to > translate plugin directions and documentation, and if that doesn't work I > can ask the list for help. > That is how I see it anyway > > > On Fri, Oct 19, 2018 at 2:06 PM Alex M <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Nicolas, >> >> I think you raise a valid points, and that the end of the day we need to >> be as welcoming as possible to the entire community. As a reminder for >> some https://www.osgeo.org/code_of_conduct/ >> >> The question is how do we best address the issue? The list of alternate >> language lists is good but not a complete solution. We should absolutely >> offer those when responding to a non-english post, and perhaps an >> explanation that English is the most common language on the list because >> it's comprehended by the most subscribers, so it is most likely to get >> you the most help. A lot of assumptions in that. >> >> As a native English speaker, I actually do attempt to figure out the >> posts in other languages I have some familiarity with, and try to reply >> with a poorly translated response & the english response, along with a >> link to a language specific list if I know one as an alternative. >> >> Sounds like we do need to fix the website to better direct people to >> other language lists if they prefer. >> >> Any else have suggestions on how to improve this? >> >> Thanks, >> Alex >> >> >> On 10/19/18 08:54, Nicolas Cadieux wrote: >> > Hi Jürgen, >> > >> > You are not offended because you have probably never been repeatedly >> > told not to speak German in Germany. For people who do not live in a >> > country where this is often the case, I understand they cannot relate to >> > what I am stating. My rant is culturally - country specific and >> > perhaps, not appropriate for this forum. I acknowledge this but I am >> > tying to make people aware of a situation that can really tick people >> off. >> > >> > I understand this list is primarily used by people who understand >> > english and that this facilitates communication. I usually publish in >> > English, or write on this list in English for this very same reason. I >> > agree that pointing people to language specific list can help those who >> > have a poor understanding, or no understanding of English. I have done >> > that in the past and have also translated messages from French or >> > Spanish to English when I see unilingual posts, even when I don't know >> > the answers to the questions. This way they can still get helped and >> > others can benefit from the post as you point out. Unfortunately, the >> > other lists that I have visited are not as dynamic as this one... but >> > that's another story. >> > >> > You don't get my last point because, in your case (and in the case of >> > most developers) you have _chosen_ to communicate in English for all the >> > good reasons and are not regularly mocked at when using your mother >> > language in public. You are not from a country where you are expected >> > to speak in English and to make that effort while anglophones (in my >> > case) are not making any efforts to communicate with you in French. >> > While this is thankfully changing in Canada as more and more anglophones >> > learn French and make the efforts (and are actually starting to realize >> > the importance of learning more than just one language), this is not the >> > case in other countries like the US where Spanish speaking people are >> > often the target of outright racism and regularly told "this is an >> > English speaking country". >> > >> > I too appreciate the use of English in this list, specially when the >> > writer is German, Austrian or from Iceland because Google translation >> > just does not cut it when talking in technical terms. I am simply >> > stating that this is a courtesy to be appreciated and not to be taken >> > for granted. While Europeans regularly speak many languages, this is a >> > richness not appreciated in many parts of North America. >> > >> > Yours truly, >> > >> > Nicolas Cadieux >> > >> > >> > On 2018-10-19 10:22 AM, Jürgen E. Fischer wrote: >> >> Hi Nicolas, >> >> >> >> On Fri, 19. Oct 2018 at 09:07:36 -0400, Nicolas Cadieux wrote: >> >>> This is a public rant. I find it extremely offensive to read >> >>> comments like >> >>> “this is the English list” to people who write to this list in any >> other >> >>> language than English. >> >> I don't. This is the main user list and it's in English - because >> >> that's the >> >> language everyone here understands - if you don't understand English, >> >> there's >> >> not much point subscribing in the first place. >> >> >> >> Using a language other than that excludes the majority of the >> >> subscribers from >> >> benefiting from what is being said and from contributing to the >> >> discussion. >> >> >> >> And I don't find a response that clarifies this and also points to a >> >> better >> >> suited list offensive either. Maybe even with a English translation >> >> if the >> >> original posting seems relevant to all. >> > >> >>> If you disagree, please note that the QGIS site refers to this list >> >>> as the >> >>> “The MAIN list for user questions: used for discussion of QGIS in >> >>> general, as >> >>> well as specific questions regarding its installation and use.” The >> >>> MAIN >> >>> list... not the ENGLISH list. This message is also repeated in other >> >>> languages as can be seen here. >> >>> https://www.qgis.org/fr/site/getinvolved/mailinglists.html# >> >>> https://www.qgis.org/es/site/getinvolved/mailinglists.html# >> >> Hm, that might be a translation issue. We used to point to local >> >> lists there >> >> (eg. [email protected] for German) - but that's apparently >> >> meanwhile gone.If you are still offended, please keep in mind that >> >> QGIS is primarily, to my >> >> knowledge, a European effort made by people who have German, >> >> Austrio-German, >> >> Spanish, French, Italian and other as their first language and that >> >> they are >> >> developing in English, their second, third or forth language. You >> >> should be >> >> grateful for their efforts to reach out the international community in >> a >> >> language spoken a cross the world. >> >> I don't get that point. Developer's post in English here. >> >> Developer's - at >> >> least I do - also prefer others to post in English here. And if >> somebody >> >> posted in German, I'd probably point the person off-list to the above >> >> list. >> >> >> >> >> >> Jürgen >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Qgis-user mailing list >> [email protected] >> List info: https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/qgis-user >> Unsubscribe: https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/qgis-user > >
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