Ernie : Since the 911 suicide / homicide attackers were all motivated by Islam why should there be a mosque anywhere near Ground Zero ? Even within 10 miles of Ground Zero ? Since many provisions of Shariah law, based directly on the "infallible word of Allah," are the exact opposite of American law, and since Shariah is intrinsic to all forms of orthodox Islam, why should there be ANY mosques anywhere in the USA ? In other words, intrinsically / objectively, not just by way of metaphor or insult, Islam is a criminal religion by American standards. For a Muslim to swear allegiance to the United States and become a citizen, he or she is taking an oath to the effect that he or she renounces Islam. This ought to be made explicit. A choice must be made, US citizenship OR Islam. No-one should be deported for being an Arab or Pakistani or Iranian, etc, but all believing Muslims should be kicked out for the simple reason that what the Qur'an teaches promotes violation of American law and of the rights we regard as sacred. Worse, again and again, Muslims do, in fact, carry out Shariah law commands and commit felony crimes on American soil all the while with the view that they have done nothing wrong. Exactly why are we supposed to tolerate this nonsense ? So that the feelings of Muslims won't get hurt ? To hell with that, hurting their feelings is not even relevant when violation of American law is at stake. Very easy to understand. No beating around the bush about Muslims who don't really pay that much attention to what their religion actually teaches because the issue is, indeed, what their religion actually teaches. Whether or not they are 100% observant is irrelevant, just as membership in a subversive organization condemns someone even if he or she isn't all that much of a true believer in Communism or Nazism or anything else. Islam is a form of Fascism, that is the bottom line. Muslims should be treated accordingly. Again, the usual caveats for some forms of Sufism, etc, but that should be understood. The exceptions should not obscure what is most important. BTW, I am more than willing to debate any Muslim about anything I say about Islam. I have heard waaaay too many half-baked "debates" where the critic doesn't know diddle about Islam and concedes point after point completely needlessly.What that does is to muddy the waters for everyone who may listen to a debate and result in half-baked conclusions. Which is one more result of religious illiteracy and of schooling where, when Islam is taught, the approach is blatantly dishonest and intended to make it seem as if Islam is just like Presbyterianism. Actually it is much more just like Nazism, although a few scholars say a better comparison is to Bolshevism. These are the cold hard facts. Billy ================================================================ In a message dated 8/2/2010 11:58:53 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [email protected] writes:
Hi Billy, On Aug 2, 2010, at 11:50 AM, [email protected]_ (mailto:[email protected]) wrote: "Ultimately this is not a question of rights, but a question of what is right," the ADL said in a statement. "In our judgment, building an Islamic center in the shadow of the World Trade Center will cause some victims more pain - unnecessarily - and that is not right." It is a complex issue, and the ADL seems to have a measured response. But the language used to describe the geography varies from blatantly false to (as in this case) aggressively suggestive. _A Street-Level View of the "Ground Zero Mosque"_ (http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2010/08/street-level-view-of-ground-zero-mosque.html) _http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2010/07/polls-reporting-on-ground-zero-mosqu e.html_ (http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2010/07/polls-reporting-on-ground-zero-mosque.html) There's pretty much no way that you're going to be able to see a 12-story building located two blocks behind a 16-story building that occupies the entire block, with another ~14-story building wedged in between. I also walked the entire northern permiter of the WTC site -- there's nowhere that you'd get even a passing glimpse of the mosque. And I walked the stretch of Park Place where Cordoba House would be located -- it's a fairly incoherent and downtrodden block that you'd have no particular reason to visit, unless you were going there specifically to see Cordoba House, nor is it one that you'd happen upon unintentionally. Is there a case against building a mosque anywhere near the World Trade Center? Absolutely. But I want to see that case made based on the bare facts, not misleading scare tactics. To me, being a radical centrist means taking pains to be extremely accurate in all our facts, not glossing over those that make us look worse or our our opponents look better. -- Ernie P. -- Centroids: The Center of the Radical Centrist Community <[email protected]> Google Group: _http://groups.google.com/group/RadicalCentrism_ (http://groups.google.com/group/RadicalCentrism) Radical Centrism website and blog: _http://RadicalCentrism.org_ (http://radicalcentrism.org/) -- Centroids: The Center of the Radical Centrist Community <[email protected]> Google Group: http://groups.google.com/group/RadicalCentrism Radical Centrism website and blog: http://RadicalCentrism.org
