I would guess that all Shimano road brake levers are designed for side pull brakes, cant's are not given much influence. V Brakes were designed to stop mountain bikes with relatively low weight on steep descents. Cantis come out of the touring tradition and assume a heavy bike at more modest speeds. I suspect that Shimano levers simply pull too much cable to work well with cantis. I used Ultegra STI levers very successfully with Ultegra brakes, but when I put them on a bike with Shimano cantis, I all but ended up inside the back of a pickup truck. Probably not what OP, Rene, wanted to read. I think it would be interesting to start another thread and see what others experience has been. I might post the same question on the tan...@hobbes.usc.edu list and see what comes up there.
Tandems are another whole ball of ...bike. Our loaded Bilenky tandem approaches 430 lbs, so stopping it is a tricky business. Tandems do have one advantage when it comes to stopping. Since the rear wheel maintains much better road contact than a single, the rear brake is as effective as the front. Our Tandem has TRP levers, Neo -Retro brakes, and 9 speed bar ends. We are not daredevils so I may not put the same demand on brakes as other people. I have no hesitation letting our unloaded tandem roll downhill at 45 mph if I know the road and know there isn't a road & stop sign ahead. I would not do that with a fully loaded tandem and not just because of a brake problem A double bike, weighing 430 lbs would be pretty scary if it developed even a little shimmy. And this is where overheated rims becomes a concern. No rim brake will stop you if the rim overheats. I usually alternate between the front and rear brakes to give the rims a chance to cool. If I were coming down a long steep drop, e.g. White Face which is 3+ miles of 14%. I would come to a complete stop and let the rims cool well before things got out of control. If I had disk brake I would want it to be the 200mm version, but have zero experience with disk brakes, except on my cars, where they work great, but are almost as big as the wheel. As I told my car mechanic when the brake warning light came on, " Who needs brakes, they just slow you down!" Every time we head out on the tandem my sweetheart says, "Are the brakes on? " To which I respond, " No honey the bike wont go with the brakes on." Michael On Friday, August 26, 2016 at 5:05:16 PM UTC-4, Comotion001 wrote: > > Hey Michael, curious what brand tandem you own. I have a 2007 Commotion > Speedster with Avid 7 V brake on front and disk on rear. I changed the read > disk from BB7 to SPYRE. I also changed out the STI levers (terrible > braking) with bar end shifters and TRP brake levers. That certainly > improved the braking but still far from what I would call really good. I > use the tandem for loaded touring and coming down mountains can be > problematic. I've been researching better braking options but haven't come > across any yet. Thanks Bill > > On Friday, August 26, 2016 at 3:36:30 PM UTC-4, Michael Hechmer wrote: >> >> I have the neo retros on two singles and the tandem and have always had >> good performance from them. If you look at Paul's setup instructions they >> do not say to put the yoke as hi as possible. From memory they say >> something like 5". I am not a physicist but I believe the optimal force on >> the lever comes at 90 degrees. Obviously the angle changes as the arm >> moves upward so it is not possible to do this consistently (except with the >> Rodriguez Big Squeeze Brakes). Therefore lower profile brakes generally >> require lower hangers than hi profile ones. >> >> My, admittedly limited, personal experience has been that poor braking >> performance is more likely to come from a mismatch between the lever and >> the brake as it is the cable angle and the brake. Years ago I had SIS >> levers and Shimano low profile (550BR??) and the braking was scary. I >> switched to Tectro levers and the braking improvement was big. Then I >> switched to Paul's and the braking was terrific. >> >> What levers are you using? >> >> I would also strongly suggest you contact Paul's directly. I have always >> found them to be very helpful. >> >> Michael >> >> On Wednesday, August 24, 2016 at 8:31:51 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote: >>> >>> "Per my education, the Neo-Retro needs the cable yoke to be as high as >>> possible" >>> >>> You were educated incorrectly, or made the wrong conclusion from your >>> education. The Mechanical Advantage (MA) of wide profile cantilever brakes >>> like the Paul Neo-Retro is mathematically pretty FLAT as a function of yoke >>> height. It doesn't matter much how high you make the yoke with wide >>> profile cantilevers. Your description of not having enough power, and not >>> being able to stop the bike with the front brake means you have TOO LITTLE >>> Mechanical Advantage. Even though the MA of your front brake is >>> comparatively flat, the higher the yoke is, the less MA you have. If you >>> want to see how much more Mechanical Advantage is available to you, lower >>> the yoke height as low as you feel comfortable lowering it. >>> Mathematically, it won't make a huge of difference, but it will be more >>> Mechanical Advantage, and that might feel great to you. If you try it with >>> the yoke low, and still don't feel like you have enough power, then a >>> narrower profile brake like the Touring Cantilever, has far more range of >>> MA vs yoke height. >>> >>> Bill Lindsay >>> El Cerrito, CA >>> >>> >>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
