Yes, Rivendells are about the design -- versatility, lugs, geometry, ride. 
All the builders are good, but, of course, a Nobilette frame is going to be 
better than, say, some of the Taiwan made frames. I have a Taiwan made 
frame, and even though it is nicer than 90% of the other bikes out there, 
there are a few brazing/finish flaws. Maybe the newer Taiwan frames are 
better? In any case, my Rambouillet is noticeably crisper looking. 

Grant mentioned that the Clem is their best selling model, so clearly he 
was smart to go in that direction. All the design changes could be 
wonderful, for most people, they are just not my preferences. 

I have never cared about any cachet or mystique Rivendell may have. I buy 
from them because I like their philosophy and how their bikes look and 
ride. 

On Sunday, January 19, 2020 at 2:20:45 PM UTC-8, aeroperf wrote:
>
>
> And this thread has brought up a whole Sackville sack of questions that 
> I’d love to see discussed by Riv folks.
> This is not really the thread for it, but I’ll throw some out.
>
> Eric’s comments about Rene Herse.
> The Rivendell bikes are Riv designs whether MIT, made by Waterford, or 
> made by Mark Nobilette.  So “Rivendells” are the design, not the shop?  Joe 
> Smith could build it and you’re still getting a Riv?
>
> tc and S’s comments about favorite Riv models.  Again, it appears to be 
> the design.  Then add a number of the comments from the Long Wheel Base 
> thread.  Specifically, changes to the design seem to put people off.  So - 
> only some changes?  
>
> But in his interviews and books, Grant freely speaks of going the way 
> others don’t.  And we buy into that.  I’ve ridden an XO-1 and wouldn’t buy 
> one, but it is certainly a classic design like we’re discussing here.  I, 
> for one, am glad that the design has evolved.
>
> Then there’s the aesthetic, the cachet, and the philosophy of Rivendell.  
> If they are having financial worries as alluded to, well, it doesn’t matter 
> how many folks compliment a Legolas or how well it rides if Riv can’t make 
> a profit building these types of bikes.
>
> Will the “Legolas Mystique” apply to all lugged Riv bikes in the future?  
> Will Riv become mostly Clem Hs and Roadinis, leaving lugs to the customs?
>
> Another thread for another day.  But I would buy that Fuchsia custom, 
> above, to hang on my wall as art.  What a gorgeous bike.
>  
>

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