Well considered as usual Bill. Another advantage of the hydraulic setup is not needing to order a tandem brake cable and hope it will make it all the way to the caliper. The cable works fine for me, but probably because I don't have a hydraulic setup to compare it to. Ignorance is bliss.
I've thought about a v-brake lever for my wife. She used to use the brake when she was uncomfortable with my speed, but she's gotten more comfortable with the way I drive and rarely used the brake. There have been a few times the stoker v-brake has been handy for scrubbing speed, and a v-brake lever would be better for that. The Suntour thumbie has fine clicks and wraps cable gradually (high mechanical advantage), so it's not a touchy "gonna lockup the wheel" situation. But the kicker is that we've ridden the bike loaded as much as not. Even with a kickstand, the loaded bike is a beast to balance and locking the wheel to park is a huge help. The thumbie is the best for setting the parking brake. Another advantage of the stoker v-brake lever is that it defaults to off, so there's no "Are you sure the brake is off?" question on the loaded tandem. -- Carl On December 12, 2020 5:36:52 AM PST, Bill Lindsay <tapebu...@gmail.com> wrote: >Carl at Tuolomne Bikes indicated his rear disc is a captain brake and >his >stoker gets to operate the rear rim brake. He says one of the reasons >is >to delay the wearing out of the sidewalls of the rear rim. > >I'm not super worried by the rim-wear part of it, but I think that >would be >a swank setup and it may be the move. I'm one of those who believes >hydraulic actuation is flat out superior to cable actuation, and in my >book >if you are going to bother to run disc brakes, it's kind of obvious to >me >that the desirable move is hydraulics. I think the longer a cable run >goes, the worse the brakes feel in your hands. Cable actuated front >brakes >feel fantastic, perfect, in the hand. Rear brakes on a single bike, a >good >mechanic can set them up to feel pretty OK, acceptable, and all that. >A >cable actuated rear tandem brake should be the worst feeling brake in >the >stable. Hydraulic actuation is the perfect solution to a really long >housing run, I think. The captain's right hand will feel as connected >to >the rear brake as their left is connected to the front. The stoker >will >have a nice short cable run for the rear rim brake. So, in summary >this >switch would put the captain in control of much "more" braking, would >radically improve the hand feel of the captain rear brake, and would >give >the stoker a very solid auxiliary brake to use only as needed, >relegating >any rear rim-heating and rim-wear to extreme situations. With a normal > >brake lever the stoker can use more of a 'pump' method than a 'drag' >method >so as to manage rim-heat build up. I love that idea. It's another >win-win-win. > >I've reminded myself that the HubbuHubbuH does in fact have >hydro-tubing >guides all the way up to the captain. I just need to check my roll of >hydro-tubing to make sure I have enough. Swapping the brake levers >between >captain and stoker would be a ~1 hour job. When my guest-stoker comes >over >we may take it out one day, then do the swap and take it out again the >next, and see what we think. > >Bill Lindsay >El Cerrito, CA > >On Wednesday, December 9, 2020 at 9:51:07 AM UTC-8 tuolumne bikes >wrote: > >> I switched mine so the (cable) disc is the main brake. If 650B rim >brake >> rims are going to go extinct, I don't see any point in wearing one >out, and >> the back of a tandem takes a lot of the braking load. I think you >could >> replace lots of discs and pads for the price of rebuilding the wheel. >The >> stoker has an XC thumbshifter controlling the v-brake which works >better >> than you might think for a drag brake and works great as a parking >brake. >> She almost never uses the drag brake. We haven't had problems with >> overheating the disc brake even with touring loads. >> >> I'm not big on disc brakes since rim brakes are so simple and meet my > >> needs. But I won't be building wheels for loaded tandem touring >myself so >> the replacement cost for wearing out the rim is significant. >> >> Carl >> >> On Wednesday, December 9, 2020 at 7:55:11 AM UTC-8 Patrick Cronin >wrote: >> >>> Bill, >>> >>> I'd be curious to hear your thoughts on how that hydraulic >lever/caliper >>> works as a tandem brake compared to a drag brake set up. My HHH has >a Paul >>> Klamper linked to a DuraAce bar-end shifter on the stoker's bosco >end. The >>> captain's controls are XTR V-brakes like yours. My stokers are used >to >>> actuating an Arai drum brake with a friction shifter, so my thinking >was >>> that setting up the HHH with a drag function, rather than with a >>> traditional lever, would be most similar. In practice, that has held >only >>> somewhat true because the efficiency of the Klamper is exponentially > >>> greater than a drum; my 4-year old delights in testing the friction >>> threshold of the rear tire using the Klamper, a feat the Arai drum >brake >>> could never accomplish even with herculean effort. The >Klamper/bar-end >>> set-up works like a dream on long descents because it can be set and >stay >>> on for minutes, if necessary, just like the old Arai drum. >>> >>> Do you prefer to have the stoker feather the rear disc brake rather >than >>> have the Captain feather using the V-brakes? How do you handle this >with >>> communication/commands? Generally, I go with, "brake on", "more", >"good", >>> and "brake off". The stoker brake then is only used for drag >applications, >>> never feathered or for short bursts. Thus, I have no experience >Captaining >>> with a Stoker who has a traditional brake lever. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Patrick >>> >>> On Tuesday, December 8, 2020 at 9:49:57 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote: >>> >>>> Tonight I finally got around to an upgrade that I'd been planning >for a >>>> long long time. I installed a hydraulic disc brake on the back of >my >>>> Rivendell HubbuHubbuH tandem. I'd been making do with XTR >V-brakes, but >>>> have had a few situations where I definitely wanted a bit more. >Now I have >>>> a reliable no-nonsense Shimano M447 hydro disc for the stoker to >actuate. >>>> Shimano hydro discs work absurdly well, are dead simple to work on, >cost >>>> practically nothing. It's a win win win. I also installed a >stoker bell. >>>> >>>> One of my favorite stokers is coming back from college for the >holidays, >>>> so the upgrades serve as a welcome back. >>>> >>>> Pics prove even big bikes can enjoy their time in the stand: >>>> >>>> Hydro brake lever | Flickr >>>> ><https://www.flickr.com/photos/45758191@N04/50697176221/in/datetaken/> >>>> Cheap Shimano Hydro Drag | A Shimano M447 hydro caliper give… | >Flickr >>>> ><https://www.flickr.com/photos/45758191@N04/50697263172/in/datetaken/> >>>> Stoker Bell | This mini Crane gives the stoker a friendly wa… | >Flickr >>>> ><https://www.flickr.com/photos/45758191@N04/50697176196/in/datetaken/> >>>> >>>> Bill Lindsay >>>> El Cerrito, CA >>>> >>> > >-- >You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the >Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/CV3W-UVjdjQ/unsubscribe. >To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to >rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >To view this discussion on the web visit >https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/0af436e8-623c-4332-bf5a-2fcfc7af3d55n%40googlegroups.com. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. 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