As for Karen, well...I think she should be booted from the list, and I don't
think implying that she is a white supremicist is inappropriate given the
comments she comes out with. The KKK is not just a group of Americans
running around in the middle of the night draped in white sheets, they exist
here in Australia and i think their beliefs are actually held, perhaps to a
lesser extent, but essentially the same ideas, by quite a few Australians.
>Have you ever heard of defamation?
>I think you should give me an example of what I have said which implies
>so greatly that I am a white supremicist.
>My god, with such unsubstantiated and false accusations as such, no
>wonder things get so out of control. And if you are going to treat
>everyone like that, then this cause will go nowhere.
>Stop being so 'prejudiced' against me because I certainly have NOT come
>out thrashing saying "I hate black people, kill them all". That to me is a
>disgusting white supremicist. Their attitude is one of violence and rage.
>When have I been violent or full of rage to you? Oh that's right, I don't
>even know you! So how would you even know?
>You think you know me but I think you should perhaps 'clean your brush'
>and stop tarnishing me with it.
>As for the violence, ask Charlie Perkins, he seems keen on starting some.
>Now if that is not an embarrassment to society. A real grown-up way of
>handling things.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Eleanor Brand
Sent: Wednesday, 5 April 2000 2:04 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [recoznet2] I don't think so, Graham.
Graham,
I don't agree with your arguments at all. I don't see the point in looking
at the semantics of the debate, and using them to justify or at least soften
the liberal government's position. Perhaps there wasn't an entire generation
of children stolen from their families, but generations upon generations of
Aboriginal people were effected by the systematic removal of Aboriginal
children. I don't think you could possibly put any sort of percentage on
what happened, and I don't think you can say that Herron was correct,
semantically, logically, statistically or in any other way.
But if you want to talk about semantics, I think calling Herron's statement
a 'blunder' is about as offensive and inappropriate as calling the history
of genocide in this country (and yes, it was genocide and I will continue to
call it genocide) a 'blemish' on Australia's 'proud history'(Howard's
interpretation of events).
I do agree that the process of reconciliation is harder for Indigenous
Australians, because they have to forgive us, and I think largely the steps
towards reconciliation so far, including the draft statement of
reconciliation, have been more about white Australia feeling warm and fuzzy
than tackling the real issues - bringing the true history of Australia to
the forefront of the collective consciouness of Australian people,
understanding exactly what has happened, what is continuing to happen, and
that we're are all intrinsically connected to the racist ideological
framework which exists today in Australian society and it is up to each and
every one of us to challenge it.
I think it is outrageous to suggest that Indigenous Australians should get
up and forgive Herron, Newman and Howard for their continued ignorance,
offensiveness and blatant racism, when Howard not only refuses to say sorry
for what has happened so far, but actually continues to try to justify it.
Why on earth SHOULD Indigenous Australia forgive them? Do you REALLY think
that's going to aid the process of bringing white and black Australia
together?
I think such a move would do nothing but hinder reconciliation in the true
sense. The 'ordinary Australians' you speak of need to know that the stolen
generations DID happen, and there is probably not one Indigenous person
whose life has not been touched by it. Reconciliation will not happen if
'ordinary Australians' continue to think that only a few children were
taken, it was in their best interest and it's not really that big a deal.
Reconciliation in the true sense will NOT be warm and fuzzy. I don't think
it is just a case of "I'm sorry" "aw that's ok, I forgive you".
And although I do think Charlie could have phrased what he was essentially
saying better, I say good on him! And good on any Australian, black or
white, who is going to take the time during the olympics to get out there in
the public eye and say what the liberals are doing and saying will not be
forgiven, and in fact it will NOT BE TOLERATED. Yes, direct action can be
alienating, confronting and intimidating to 'ordinary Australians'. But
perhaps if more Australians understood and acknowledged what has happened
over the last 200 years, and what is continuing to happen, then more
Australians would take a stand against it and join the fight against racism
in Australia.
And why on earth is likening the genocide of Indigenous Australians to the
holocaust 'unhelpful'? I find it hard to believe that the idea of social
darwinism and the belief that some humans are superior to others have been
'put paid to' by liberal democracy. I am quite sure, in fact, that there is
still a wide spread sentiment of white supremacy. And I personally don't see
a history which involves food supplies and water holes being poisoned, a
history which involves babies being buried up to their necks in the sand and
having their heads kicked off, of whole communities of black women being
raped as a history in which people's 'physical lives were being preserved'.
Killings were state sanctioned, industrially efficient, they were
calculated, widespread, deliberate and genocidal.
Yes, talking about that stuff is threatening, it's shocking, it's heart
breaking in fact. But it's the truth, and as far as I'm concerned,
reconciliation has not happened in a society which chooses to ignore and
deny that such atrocities happened.
As for Karen, well...I think she should be booted from the list, and I don't
think implying that she is a white supremicist is inappropriate given the
comments she comes out with. The KKK is not just a group of Americans
running around in the middle of the night draped in white sheets, they exist
here in Australia and i think their beliefs are actually held, perhaps to a
lesser extent, but essentially the same ideas, by quite a few Australians.
Lastly, I know that we're basically on the same side Graham, we're both
concerned about the future of reconciliation, and about ending racism. I
just think it's really important to be critical of this conception of
reconciliation as a process where white Australia doesn't really progress in
terms of the racist ideology we're indoctrinated with and that each of us
harbours in our psyches, but rather black Australians forgive us for it and
we just try and move on. We can't possibly move on without being challenged.
And we have to challenge ourselves and each other - it's shouldn't just be
up to Charlie Perkins and the rest of Indigenous Australia.
Eleanor
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