skipp025 wrote: >>"ka1uag" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>Hey Skipp >>You obviously didn't read the original >>post..The guy has 2 repeaters and only >>space for ONE antenna.. > > > Sure I did, but I was also replying to > other posts about the subject. > > >> Yes i indeed agree 2 antenna combiners >>are the way to go. > > > Not two combiners, one close spaced spec tx > combiner and one receiver distribution system > are the selected wine for this evenings meal. >
would you like some fava beans with that? =cP > >>But it does not help this guy out... > > > But it does supply him with some information > about the single antenna combiner system. > I for one don't see how two repeaters in the same band can be combined onto one antenna, tx and rx, without so MUCH loss that neither one is really usable. Intermod, desense, spurs, will all be that much harder to get rid of. Not to mention that it'll cost thousands of bucks. It will ALWAYS be better to put up another antenna, or go to another site. > >>As for freq.I use txrx stuff for this exact >>app comercially and we often only have khz >>of tx spacing. > > > I'm right there with you, also have the coffee > mug and tee shirt. > > >>The reason we only use tx/rx is because >>it works everytime as engineered, is >>expandable without retuning the whole >>system.. > > > TxRX does make nice hardware, I have some of > it in my close spaced combiner systems that > I designed. Bought the bottles on Ebay cheap. > There seem to be enough people in this group > to talk a sincere tx-combiner project into > operation (from scratch). > > I'm also very partial to Decibel and Telewave. > > >>PS i'm wondering why their is a need for >>2 ham repeaters at one location on the >>same band anyway.. > > > "Need" is subjective. Much of it is ego, small > weenie syndrome, empire building, fun, hate, > social skills (or lake there-of), technical > prowess... the list goes on and on. > How about the fact that if a ham repeater is truly supposed to be for emergency communications, if it's tied up all day with meaningless babble, it's not available when it's needed? And let's also not forget that the more time it's up with that babble, the sooner it will fail? Yes, it needs to be used enough that users are familiar with it's operation, and generally how talk into a mic, but ya gotta hit a balance. > >>Seems like an aweful waste of spectrum. > Actually, at least my opinion, a repeater that runs all day with babble about nothing is more of a waste of spectrum than one that's quiet and ready to go when it's needed. > > Not really, one typical converstation fills > the available resource. I can't stay long to > hear someone talk about their surgery before > I'm hitting the channel button. > Likewise, I hear folks complain that there isn't enough activity on their repeater-I listen to the same repeater and frequently have to turn it off because it's too busy. > >>I know at most of the sites I'm at commercially >>and hammily, floor space and tower space are >>at a premium. > > > Not the general rule anymore. Companies like > American Tower have seen fit to empty their > vaults by being horible Land-Lords, especially > unfriendly to a lot of longtime resident hams. > Also many paging companies have pulled some of their networks off the air, especially VHF and UHF, so most sites I go to (about 90-100) have the same or less stuff in the building. > >>Here is an example to think about.. >>There are two local clubs in this area. >>Each has a 2 meter repeater at >>one comercial tower site. > > > Hopefully not paying AT's high rate... :-) > > >>The clubs dont associate very much.. > > > Nothing new about that. Members of one group > hate the members of the other and a few travel > back and forth between the repeaters. One > unstable member jams quite a bit. Same story > in most locations, only the players change. > > >>Club A has had their repeater there for >>many years. Its just their "backup" >>repeater and has seldom use .Their main >>repeater is on another mountain which >>essentially has the same coverage... >>Club B has a repeater at the same site >>as club A's backup..Club B's repeater is >>heavily used on a daily basis..BUT a new >>leasing company is now the tower owner >>and has decided to replace tower and is >>re assesing tower space and new leases... > > > Happens every day, life never seems to be > fair to everyone. > > >>He now finds out he has a lot of freebies >>at the site and isn't too thrilled... > > > Anyone who doesn't have a dialog with their > site owner/manager is nuts and probably > deserves what they get when discovered > as a freebie. The last "freebie" I saw > caused horible problems for the site owner > who is very friendly to hams. You should always have SOMETHING down in writing at a site. And having your group set up as non-profit with the state and the IRS helps A LOT! > > >>He says either one of you go or start >>paying 300+ dollars a month for 2 spaces > > > That's cheap compared to what AT asks. There > seems to be no rhyme or reason in the rate > for site rental. > Yeah-1000 per base, plus several hundred per antenna, is not unusual. There's a lot of variations in the way it's billed, but for one base and one antenna, 1000-1500 is not out of the ordinary. > >>....Who goes..Or who pays? > > > The guy paying the original rent, honestly > stays. > > The newbie pays x-dollars by honestly making > a deal or says goodbye. First one should get dibs normally yes, but there are exceptions... > > Both clubs should talk about a basic combiner > system and a common cabinet if they know what's > good for them. > > >>This really happens ..It happened here >>and could happen to you.. > > > I see it everyday, but it will not happen > to me, because I'm straight up with the > site owner/operators right out of the > starting gate. Many site owners will trade > work for money off the rent, provided you > lay the ground work, ie emergency service, > search and rescue plus OES operations being > the function of your box, or it should be. Offering to mow the lawn or plow the snow works for many. > > A little grip and grin never hurt when it > comes to staying friendly with the site > owner/managers. > > >>So maybe instead of cluttering the >>airwave with useless and hardly >>used repeaters maybe we should work >>together to put better and proper >>equip on the air. > > > Get off the decafe... it ain't gonna happen. > Metro and high density areas are all about > 10 gazillion repeaters, most of them sit idle. > This really isn't about cluttering the airwaves > with too many repeaters is it? It's about having repeaters available and working properly when they are needed. > > Proper equipment is whole different subject. > > >>And then learn to share them more with others >>instead of using them for your own agenda... >>One good working ,properly built and maintained >>repeater is worth much more than 10 useless >>pieces of junk that are just taking up valuable >>spectrum.... >>Just something to think about.... >>Dave I agree that useless repeaters are a waste. There are several around here that either have crappy range for thier profile, unreliable (on again off again), tied up all day with useless chatter (sometimes between base stations who could/should be talking simplex), or at the other end, aren't even actually on the air, and haven't been for years, but still send in the paperwork and claim they are. > > > We can appreciate your wishfull thinking, but > it won't ever fly as you would hope. > > People are always "different animals". Your > results will probably vary. > > cheers dave > > Skipp -- Jim -------- "The higher you are, the harder it is to pump." -Cleveland Mayor Jane Cambell, after the big black-out of 2003 Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
