Re: [WSG] OT on list
On 5/29/07, Hassan Schroeder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jamie Collins wrote: If you read what i said properly you will understand what i said. If you read the original posting properly... :-) Wouldn't that make the point and topic of this e-mail off topic? Do you see the part that says'When Web Standards Are Involved'? I didnt mention photoshop anywere, i said when Web Standards are Involved. To quote the OP: now for second semester, will be using photo shop, to manipulate 2 and 3 d objects. now, is there any way to do this accessibly with jaws? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] Just a quick test to see if it will let me post
-- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Leopard mail and standards
On Oct 22, 2007, at 10:27 AM, Keryx Web wrote: When Outlook 2007 came out it incurred upon itself the righteous wrath of all standardistas thanks to the stupid decision to use Word as its HTML/CSS rendering engine. In a few days Mac OS X Leopard will be out with much touted templates for the mail app. Here is my question: Are these made with standards, accessibility and separation of concerns in mind? Lars Gunther Hi Lars, Quoted from: HTTP://www.apple.com/macosx/features/mail.html: Sincerely yours. Mail for Leopard features more than 30 professionally designed stationery templates that make a virtual keepsake out of every email you send. From invitations to birthday greetings, stationery templates feature coordinated layouts, fonts, colors, and drag-and-drop photo placement from your iPhoto library — everything to help you get your point across. You can even create personalized templates. Messages created with stationery in Mail use standard HTML that can be read by popular webmail services and email programs on both Mac computers and PCs. Until it's actually released I'm not sure that anyone will be willing to say anything more then that since the people who know are under NDA's... But it's only 4 days and 7 hours until the release :) -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Web Standards In Colleges and Universities
I'm not a university... Just a poor schmuck trying to stay afloat in the world of web design/coding but a website like what you are talking about would be very very helpful. I would be willing to help in any way I could (Without charge unless you took up too much of my family time :)) But otherwise if a website like that launches I would be a frequent visitor and telling my friends about it :) On Oct 22, 2007, at 2:45 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At least in Universities (colleges - as in the English colleges, not the American term, may be different) my experience is that lecturers have a research area, which is why they are still in academia. Teaching is just a necessary evil they have to go through, especially if it is not related to their research interest. Then when it comes to web technologies, they are often further removed from even the subject of the lecture and relegated to html is easy, go teach yourself or it is just the technology to print out the stuff that your server side code (that is the important part you get marked on) generates. At least that is my experience wen doing a computer science degree, and masters, when we were doing anything that required displaying the data in a web browser instead of in a desktop application. Things like Swing in Java would get taught properly as it is fairly complex. HTML wouldn't as it is perceived to be easy stuff that even designers can do. Of course as we all know, a little knowledge can do a lot of harm. I don't have experience from courses that actually suppose to teach from a web design client point of view, instead of the server side. Now, in some ways it is hard to blame lecturers for not knowing and keeping up to date on everything, and they often do have to teach a wide amount of topics. The client side world alone has a huge amount of technologies. I think we as big(ish) companies in the field (I'm talking about Opera here, and companies like Yahoo!, Google et al) could do more to reach out to universities, colleges and schools to say that we are big employers in the industry and we require a certain level in x topics for your students to be employable, without a lot of extra training on our part. It would probably be a big plus for them to be producing students employable by desirable companies. The problem is that there are far too many universities (never mind colleges and schools) to reach out to and go do a presentation to the students on campus. I wouldn't want to do the elitist thing and only go to the best schools either. I've always thought of doing something like a web standards curriculum pack, either in printed or online form, that we put together as a suggested curriculum for universities to give to students to either work from if their course is web design, or as a reference point if they are doing server side stuff and they are told to go away and learn themselves. t will be much easier for students as they will have all the information in one place and wont be swayed by bad quality articles online, and will be good for lecturers as it takes the leg work out of staying up to date. Opera has its new dev.opera.com site, where we are adding content, but don't have much that is suitable for that yet. If it is an idea that is of interest we could go away and compile the seminal articles on the web that designers should read, and get permission from the authors to distribute it, and update them if needed. It'll be a lot of work, but it will probably be worth it if universities are interested. David -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Opera files antitrust against MS: standards one part
On Dec 14, 2007, at 12:09 PM, Genesis One And One wrote: I want another OS that works like Windoze but is better than Windoze. I wish Mozilla would develop one. Their products are already consumer friendly etc. Imagine a FFOS. I would imagine M$ poor customer support and glitchy software would warp forward. I'd imagine it would become superior. Because that's what a serious competitive market does to companies that want to compete and win. Ummm... There already is... www.apple.com No virus's, no spyware, no adware, the stability of unix at the core, and the GUI of an easy to use interface. They also have great customer service both on the phone, and in person... I've dealt with both. As Confucius says... Our greatest glory is not in never falling, but in rising everytime we do. Which is what apple does :) Just my 2¢ +/- for inflation :) -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Mary-Anne Nayler is out of the office. [SEC=No Protective Marking Present]
Somewhat... But the Post Office will get it there! :) On Dec 21, 2007, at 2:33 AM, Joe Ortenzi wrote: I tried sending an email to Web Site but got an address not valid error! ;-) Is that like sending a letter to North Pole ? Joe On Dec 21 2007, at 04:37, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I will be out of the office starting 21/12/2007 and will not return until 07/01/2008. I will respond to your message when I return. For anything urgent, please email Web Site. NOTICE - This message is intended only for the use of the addressee named above and may contain privileged and confidential information. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that you must not disseminate, copy or take any action based upon it. If you received this message in error please notify Medicare Australia immediately. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifically states them to be the views of Medicare Australia. *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** Joe Ortenzi [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.joiz.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Developing for Mac Browsers
On Jan 13, 2008, at 12:51 AM, Peter Mount wrote: Hi I'm tossing up whether to buy a Mac or to save my money and buy a new PC and just have Linux and Windows on it. I've read that Safari for Windows will help Web Developers without a Mac be able to develop for that. Is there a difference between Mac versions of browsers like Firefox and Safari or can I safely develop in non Mac versions and expect my web sites to behave the same on the Mac? Currently my main OS is Kubuntu but I'll soon be trialling Red Hat Desktop 5 Multi OS. Thanks I'm just going to echo alot of what people have already said... With a Intel Mac you can run, Windows, OS X, and Unix (FreeBSD specifically I believe) which is what the OS X operating system runs on-top/in- conjunction with. There's also no need to anti-virus software/malware detectors etc. etc. etc. on the mac unless you have installed windows and are using it for more then just checking your pages. If all your own browsing/email is done on the mac side I believe you are safe. Also, one thing I haven't seen in this thread, is the fact that in a few years when you look at updating the Mac you could possibly get a decent amount for it. There was an article written I believe this past spring/summer that suggested buying a Mac ended up being much cheaper when compared to a equivalent windows computer including resale value. Sorry no time right now to search it out. Anyway... Just my 2¢ :) Been a Mac user all my life so please do take that into consideration but I'll stand behind my claims :) -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Definition List appropriate for FAQ?
On Jan 17, 2008, at 10:01 AM, Christian Snodgrass wrote: Hello, I've been trying to decide which is more semantically correct for an FAQ, either 2 paragraph (one for the question, one for the answer), a single paragraph (with spans for formating), or a definition list. I think the definition list is probably the most appropriate, but at the same time you can't really call an FAQ a list of definitions, so I'm not really sure. What are your thoughts on this? Thanks. When I setup my FAQ's for my website, I put them in ordered lists... But I didn't know much about semantics at that point, but to me it still seems to fit good :) -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Re: Why code and no web pag
Also... when you do an include you need to quote it: include ../ crf_header.php; On Feb 3, 2008, at 12:45 AM, Christian Snodgrass wrote: This isn't really the place to discuss this as it has nothing to do with web standards, but it is because you can't have an include using an absolute path, they must all be relative. http://www.example.com/page.php is absolute. /page.php is relative. Hayden's Harness Attachment wrote: Solved the problem. However, why does; include ../crf_header.php; Will work and; include http://www.choroideremia.org/crf_header.php; Will not? Angus MacKinnon Infoforce Services http:ééwww.infoforce-services.com It is impossible to rightly govern the world without God and the Bible. George Washington *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- Christian Snodgrass Azure Ronin Web Design http://www.arwebdesign.net/ http://www.arwebdesign.net Phone: 859.816.7955 *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] strong element being more semantical and accessible for required field
On Feb 25, 2008, at 3:34 PM, tee wrote: I have this question about strong element being more semantical and accessible for required field in the web form and like to hear your opinion. I came to the conclusion after conducting my little user testing - it first started with an intention of spam and error monitoring over the form script I use, I then learned that despite the indication that asterisk is marked as required field, many people who took time to submit the forms on clients' sites still missed the *. Because I use no JS validation for the form, I decided to bold the required field using strong element for two new sites. It seems working as the bold texts caught people attention and I received no errors email notification on missing to enter requried fields. The result also gave me a though on how screen readers treat the strong element and that it's indeed more accessible and semantically correct. Working on a site, and thanks to Matt Fellows and his futher assistance, I implemented his JS form validation script to the web form. Using asterik to indicate the required field no longer is an issue with JS validation, however I decided to stick with the strong element. Much work had put into it to modify the code and css, but client came back to me to want the '*' over the strong because it's a conventional practice. Really want to stick with the strong element for the reason above, however I am also doubting my conclusion that it's more accessible for screen readers as I never tested on one. Before I try to convince client the strong element is better approach, I would love to hear your opinion. I can't speak for screen readers since I've never used one my self... But would there be any reason you couldn't do both and please the client and the screen reader(assuming it does help them)? a simple strong* First Name/strong Just something I thought of :) -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424-9337 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Browser Text Resizing and the Ill Effects It May Cause
Hi Kevin, Personally, I have my sites set to scale the text/pictures up/down based on what the user chooses to do. The way I figure it, if they need to put the font down to 8 Point type... That's there choice. I make all my sites liquid for that reason, everything just fits together as best as it can depending on browser size, screen resolution, user preference, etc. etc. etc. Just my 2¢ :) On Mar 3, 2008, at 1:04 PM, Erickson, Kevin (DOE) wrote: Hello, I am trying to realize the weight of users being able to increase and/or decrease the text size in their browser and the ill effects it has on the design and usability of our sites. Is this something other designers are concerned about and have found solutions? Are we responsible if the user distorts the normal viewing of our site? How far do we go to cover this? Thank you, Kevin Erickson *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424-9337 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Browser Text Resizing and the Ill Effects It May Cause
yes I do.. You can do the same thing with pictures it's really a cool effect, and helps maintain the ratio of the entire page pretty well.. I have a demo up (Currently using php to process the size of the image) if anyone wants to look: HTTP://www.raoset.com/dev/global7/ On Mar 3, 2008, at 1:40 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You mean em's instead of pixels right? --- Original Message --- From:Jason Pruim [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent:Mon 3/3/08 1:28 pm To:wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subj:Re: [WSG] Browser Text Resizing and the Ill Effects It May Cause Hi Kevin, Personally, I have my sites set to scale the text/pictures up/down based on what the user chooses to do. The way I figure it, if they need to put the font down to 8 Point type... That's there choice. I make all my sites liquid for that reason, everything just fits together as best as it can depending on browser size, screen resolution, user preference, etc. etc. etc. Just my 2¢ :) On Mar 3, 2008, at 1:04 PM, Erickson, Kevin (DOE) wrote: Hello, I am trying to realize the weight of users being able to increase and/or decrease the text size in their browser and the ill effects it has on the design and usability of our sites. Is this something other designers are concerned about and have found solutions? Are we responsible if the user distorts the normal viewing of our site? How far do we go to cover this? Thank you, Kevin Erickson *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424-9337 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424-9337 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Browser Text Resizing and the Ill Effects It May Cause
Hi Mike, On Mar 3, 2008, at 3:07 PM, Mike at Green-Beast.com wrote: Hi Jason, yes I do.. You can do the same thing with pictures it's really a cool effect, and helps maintain the ratio of the entire page pretty well.. I have a demo up (Currently using php to process the size of the image) if anyone wants to look: HTTP://www.raoset.com/dev/global7/ I don't mean to pick, but is it really a good tradeoff to have download an 895kb image just so it can be enlarged with the text. It seems like everyone (including your bandwidth resources) will take a big hit just so the image can grow. That image was used as a proof of concept image. I will reduce the size of the image for the final project if it moves forward :) But that is a very good point, to let people know that if you scale images, you do need to have a little bit larger images or they will look very pixilated very quickly. -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424-9337 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Dreamweaver CS3
On Apr 4, 2008, at 7:19 AM, James Jeffery wrote: I've been thinking about buying the new version of Photoshop and Illustrator, as i just purchased a new dual core iMac. Currently i use BBEdit but im thinking about switching to Dreamweaver as i might aswell purchase the creative suite. Is the new dreamweaver any good for us developers? This may not seem related to web standards but i feel it does because back when i used dreamweaver - it was the days when it bloated out your code and caused friction for many developers. I used dreamweaver for a little bit until my development turned more towards programming in PHP, I didn't like how dreamweaver showed the PHP (If at all actually...) so now I use XCode which is part of the developer tools for Macs and is free. It has syntax highlighting for just about every kind of language out there and works great for me. -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424-9337 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Dreamweaver8
On Apr 7, 2008, at 7:39 AM, Adam Martin wrote: as does zend studio :) XCode as well for all of you on a Mac :) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] one thing I miss about dreamweaver is that you can do a 'search all' and get a list of all instances of the thing you are searching for rather than cycling through a 'find...find...find...' list. So far it's the only program I've used that does that and I really notice not having it. My favourite general-purpose text editor is UltraEdit, which does what you describe: returns a list of files containg your search string, and the entire line(s) that contain that string. It's not a web-specific tool, but does beat everything else I have tried to date. Regards, Mike *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424-9337 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] PHP Standards
Hey Ian, Sorry for coming in late in this thread, but I would like to recommend the php.net site and their mailing lists as well. I am a subscriber to a few of their lists and am just learning the language, but the people who post to the php-general list are some of the most knowledgeable people I have run across. There are a few of the core programmers that post to that list as well. I would highly recommend joining, and watching the list for a few days. Or jump right in and start working on a project. The most simple form of which is a simple Hello world! script. Do something like this: ?PHP $hi = Hello; $earth = World; $time = time(); $currentTime = date(H:i:s M-d-y, $time); echo $hi $earth! it is $currentTime; ? Just something that you could play with :) On May 20, 2008, at 5:35 AM, Ian Chamberlain wrote: Thanks for all the tips folks, very useful. In response to Michael, I have just escaped the large corporate, global enterprise world that seems to fund much of the IT work done and in my experience most such organisations are only just now waking up to the concept and benefits of open source. My ex-organisation for example tended to code either in ASP or .NET for small / medium scale or some flavour of Java for portals and heavy transaction stuff so I had no experience or libraries of PHP. Upon my excape, pausing only to don my hopelessly optimistic hat I went looking for a PHP site; something similar to the sites we all use that show how semantic mark-up should be used; or how good quality CSS can make site look good. Even poor old JavaScript thanks to gentlemen ( I use the word carelessly) like Jeremy Keith are busy helping our communities to play nicely with the DOM; which left just the back-end. The problem is that right now unless we have one or two clearly signposted places where people can learn to do the right thing, young new programmers or even old f***s like me will get what help they can from the net and libraries, as I am sure you may have noticed such sites, books and courses are not always of the highest quality. Ian (Freelancing with a grin - ex Head Of Web Strategy BT Global Services) - Original Message - From: Michael Horowitz [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2008 4:02 AM Subject: Re: [WSG] PHP Standards I am guessing that PHP is much like JavaScript in that a lot of what is floating about is either poor or pooh the result of all the good programmes stending their time on ASP or J2EE Why woul you think the good programmers spend their time and ASP or J2EE? Michael Horowitz Your Computer Consultant http://yourcomputerconsultant.com 561-394-9079 Designer wrote: I think that it's basically your responsibility Ian, in that there are many sources of snippets available and if you use them you just validate the generated code and put right what is wrong in the php. Then, you check for best practice too . . . Bob Ian Chamberlain wrote: Fingers crossed this is not too far off topic; being a newby to PHP; any clues where I can find how-to's, snippets, libraries or even application suites built from PHP that are built to a good minimum standard please. I am guessing that PHP is much like JavaScript in that a lot of what is floating about is either poor or pooh the result of all the good programmes stending their time on ASP or J2EE. Thanks Ian *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 3251 132nd ave Holland, MI, 49424-9337 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join
Re: [WSG] Shopping cart - who does what
On Aug 13, 2008, at 1:34 AM, Lynette Smith wrote: Have always avoided doing sites that needed a shopping cart but a new client will need one. I would appreciate some advice. Do the free ones (such as ZenCart and OsCommerce) do an adequate job or would I be better off advising my client to go for a paid one. I have a colleague who does custom-designed ones and I would be looking at about a minimum of $500. The second question is who does what? Once I have the cart (either a downloaded free one or a custom one) and it is uploaded to the website, who inputs the products etc? I imagine the client would need to be shown how to do this? What is the usual procedure? Thanks. Hi Lyn, Don't have much to offer, but just wanted to let you know I looked into a custom cart awhile back for a job that never went through, but the cart was going to cost around $500 by the time it was ready. So while it seems like alot of money, it's probably a decent deal. Just my 2¢ :) -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 11287 James St Holland, MI 49424 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Acceptable autoplay of music
On Aug 15, 2008, at 10:14 AM, James Leslie wrote: Hi, This is a more best practices question than strictly standards, but I *think* it is on-topic, apologies if not and please mail me off- list if you feel that is more appropriate. I have a band for a client who are requesting that on the homepage loading a music player starts automatically. Do people think this is acceptable for a bands website or would you think that you should always get the user to initiate playback? For me it would depend... If it's a classical orchestra and I open it in my office, I won't get in trouble.. BUT if it's a death metal group playing one of their hardest songs, I would get into a little bit of trouble at my office. If you do have it start automatically, I would make sure that it's very obvious/easy to stop it as quickly as possible. Also... I don't know how it would effect screen readers? I don't know much about them, but don't they basically just run on top of your browser? For a non-sighted user having music randomly start playing could be a very bad thing... Just my 2¢ -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 11287 James St Holland, MI 49424 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] Question about accessibility
Good Morning everyone! I have a client that wants me to write his navigation mostly as a picture and then use image maps to get to the actual links. I am wondering, how would I go about convincing my client that this isn't the best way to do it? I personally think that some nice text links, styled properly with CSS would look just as good if not better then image maps. Oh, and to put it into context, it's a picture rating site so I don't know that Blind users are going to be too much of a concern for him since they can't see what the main part of the site is for. Any info I could get about this would be wonderful! Thanks everyone! -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 11287 James St Holland, MI 49424 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Question about accessibility
Honestly, I think he just wants a very specific look... He also thinks it looks neater then using plain txt I'll talk to him about it and let him know about the possible down falls with the whole thing... After I read up on image maps that is :) I'm assuming they rely on some sort of client side script? But I haven't googled yet so feel free to ignore the question :) On Aug 27, 2008, at 10:41 AM, Rick Faircloth wrote: You're right about a client like that being a pain in the rear. I had a client who wanted customers to contact them via email, but didn't want to use a contact form and didn't want them to just use a link to email from the website. He was dead-set against forms even though they were the answer. He was so hard to work with, I eventually cut him loose. (Glad I got 50% of the cost up front! :o) I imagine this image-map client was just after a certain look and had been told by someone that an image map was the answer and wasn't open to other solutions which are better and provide the same results. Rick -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 9:45 AM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] Question about accessibility Hi Rick, If any client were to tell me how to code their website I would probably tell them to go elsewhere. The client is more than likely going to be a pain throughout the project and then also when making payment. Obviously this is within reason - design aspects - of course they decide. When it comes to the coding, the client most certainly does not know best! If they want it to be of a high quality and well optimised then I will make it using the best of my abilities. There's no reason that they should specify how it is coded, unless they're a developer and they need it formatted in a specific way. This must not be a normal customer anyway if they know about image maps. I'm interested to know why they requested it in the first place.. Quoting Rick Faircloth [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Darren... I find your comment, I would most certainly not allow the use of an image map, interesting. What would you do, as is Jason's situation, if your client demands it? You can always turn down the work, but would you simply because a client wants to do something that you don't like? Rick -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 7:39 AM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Question about accessibility Hi Jason, I would most certainly not allow the use of an image map. They are only useful for defining polygon or circular areas on maps (or similar) as links. They are not good for a sites primary navigation. For navigation that is consisting of an image I would create an unordered list: ul id=nav li class=img1link1/li li class=img2link1/li li class=img3link1/li /ul Set the main img background on ul#nav to go behind all the links then set the individual link graphics on each list item anchor - li.img? a Make the anchors display:block and you can then define height and width of the link. Then when images are turned off you are still left with a fully accessible menu. Darren Lovelock Munkyonline.co.uk Quoting Jason Pruim [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Good Morning everyone! I have a client that wants me to write his navigation mostly as a picture and then use image maps to get to the actual links. I am wondering, how would I go about convincing my client that this isn't the best way to do it? I personally think that some nice text links, styled properly with CSS would look just as good if not better then image maps. Oh, and to put it into context, it's a picture rating site so I don't know that Blind users are going to be too much of a concern for him since they can't see what the main part of the site is for. Any info I could get about this would be wonderful! Thanks everyone! *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.6.9/1637 - Release Date: 8/27/2008 7:01 AM *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help
Re: [WSG] Incorporating Terms and Cons in signup page
On Sep 30, 2008, at 9:15 AM, John Unsworth wrote: Hi WSG, I'm wondering about the best method to incorporate in a signup form a Terms and Conditions agreement, which being so long will be bought to the page externally. Or if it's thought best, maybe not! On a previous occasion I went forward using the object tag. The advantage to my mind is that, my document (that may change in future) is separate to the form and for those who don't have a browser capable of using the object tag, can see alternative text to link to the separately hosted TC page. But it's been put to me at work, there might be a way to house the document in a div, give the div a fixed size and make it scrollable. Alternatively I could use a textarea element, although I'm given to understand it would need to be outside the form so as not include it in the 'Signup' event when the submit button is clicked. However to satisfy the designer, who follows that the convention is that the form is visually seen before the last submit button, I'd use CSS to position it - but that doesn't sound very semantic to me? Putting it on another page, that you would link to, read, then return to the form to agree to has been rejected for the sanctity of the concept of a single page signup document. I hope I've been clear, and I guess I'm interested in anything similar to this in best practice, accessibility and standards. Cheers for just being there folks, John Unsworth Hi John, I haven't ever needed to write this before, but I have seen a decent sized scroll box at the bottom of a form with a check box to confirm they have read it and agree to it. All the ones I have seen are above the final submit button, but I'm not sure if they are truly inside the form or not. Depending on how you are submitting the form, and how big of a file the TC page is, you COULD submit it and just ignore it... But depending on the load of the server it might take a little bit longer to process the form. Just something to think about :) -- Jason Pruim Raoset Inc. Technology Manager MQC Specialist 11287 James St Holland, MI 49424 www.raoset.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Failed A Job :(
On Jan 30, 2009, at 12:43 AM, William Donovan wrote: Hang on, did I miss something or is this completely OT (off topic). Bible's, Gutenberg, print type faces... Web Standards...? Nahhh It's all about type faces that are easier to read on the web and understanding why some are better then others :) -- Jason Pruim japr...@raoset.com 616.399.2355 *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org ***
