Re: [AFMUG] My solution

[fiberrun]

Just as an FYI, there are some nonexpensive fusion splicers out there.

Chinese models (AI-8/AI-9) for under a grand on Amazon. Less on 
eBay/Aliexpress. I got one. It works. There's apparently an add-on for splice 
on connectors.
Smaller handheld models from Jilong (a grand) and Easysplicer (bit over a 
grand, V groove, Swedish manufacturer). Both support splice on connectors.

FOA mini "review" on the Easysplicer: https://www.thefoa.org/foanl-5-16.html

Any of those should work for terminating drops. Personally I prefer fusion 
splicing over mechanical splices.

Jared

> Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2020
> From: "Chuck McCown" 
> To: af@af.afmug.com
> Subject: [AFMUG] My solution
>
> I think I will switch to a mechanical.  Too cumbersome to haul out an 
> expensive fusion splicer.
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone--
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>

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Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device

[Ryan Ray]

We have customers using Circle with a Calix 844e and 804 mesh and it works
fine.


On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 8:24 PM James Howard  wrote:

> I’ve got one connected at home with an Amplifi mesh.  I could see people
> blaming their ISP for stuff not working if they set the default settings to
> restrict a lot of stuff.  I set ours to block facebook and some other stuff
> for anybody who connects to the wifi but isn’t assigned to a profile.  I
> haven’t had any problems with it causing any signal issues though.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 3:59 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device
>
>
>
> H, does that work seamlessly, or could it cause problems people blame
> on their Internet?  And would it play nice with a range extender or mesh
> system?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Darin Steffl
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 1:07 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device
>
>
>
> ARP spoofing. It's not inline at all. If possible, it should be hardwired
> to the router instead of wifi for best performance.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020, 12:51 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
> routerlimits had something similar, never got to investigate much before
> bark bought them
>
> i figured it either did dns or spoofing of something
>
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 12:43 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> Customer has a Circle device on their WiFi network which apparently is a
> parental control device.
>
>
>
> How does this work if it’s just another device on the WiFi?  It seems like
> it would have to either be inline with the path to the Internet, or somehow
> take over DNS.  Or is it doing something intrusive on the WiFi?
>
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> To: ja...@litewire.net
> 
>
> From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com
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[AFMUG] coordinated power - licensed link

[Steve Jones]

So when I see the following, I use the "coordinated" power from this
section to set maximum ATPC power, 26 in this case

   Nominal Coordinated Maximum
Power (dBm) 15.026.0   29.0
Received Level (dBm)   -42.4  -31.4  -28.4
EIRP (dBm) 63.7 63.7


But the Adaptive modulation sheet shows coordinated power all the way up to
29


Am I missing out on 3dBm I could be using during fade?
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Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device

[James Howard]

I’ve got one connected at home with an Amplifi mesh.  I could see people 
blaming their ISP for stuff not working if they set the default settings to 
restrict a lot of stuff.  I set ours to block facebook and some other stuff for 
anybody who connects to the wifi but isn’t assigned to a profile.  I haven’t 
had any problems with it causing any signal issues though.

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 3:59 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device

H, does that work seamlessly, or could it cause problems people blame on 
their Internet?  And would it play nice with a range extender or mesh system?

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Darin Steffl
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 1:07 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device

ARP spoofing. It's not inline at all. If possible, it should be hardwired to 
the router instead of wifi for best performance.

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020, 12:51 PM Steve Jones 
mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>> wrote:
routerlimits had something similar, never got to investigate much before bark 
bought them
i figured it either did dns or spoofing of something

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 12:43 PM Ken Hohhof 
mailto:af...@kwisp.com>> wrote:
Customer has a Circle device on their WiFi network which apparently is a 
parental control device.

How does this work if it’s just another device on the WiFi?  It seems like it 
would have to either be inline with the path to the Internet, or somehow take 
over DNS.  Or is it doing something intrusive on the WiFi?
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Re: [AFMUG] My solution

[Bill Prince]

  
  
Because you have a dirty mind Ken. I blame Chuck too; he just
  writes pornographic stuff.



bp

On 9/9/2020 8:06 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:


  
  
  
  
Why does that sound dirty?
 

  
From: AF
   On Behalf Of Chuck
  McCown
  Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 10:05 PM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
  
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] My solution
  

 
My flat slack
  is in the hand hole.

  Sent from my iPhone


  


  
On Sep 9,
  2020, at 8:22 PM, Chris Fabien 
  wrote:
  


  


  Sorry I meant slack of the outside
flat drop intact, takes about a 12" square box to be
able to make it coil in there. 

 

  
On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 9:17 PM
  Chuck McCown 
  wrote:
  
  

  This
has slack storage and a splice holder.
  
Sent from my iPhone
  
  

  
  

  On
Sep 9, 2020, at 6:36 PM, Chris Fabien 
wrote:

  
  

  
  
We had way more field
  failures with AFL Fastconnects than after we
  switched to spliced pigtails. We use a little
  larger NID that allows for some slack storage
  and has a splice holder. Tii 506F. 

  Chris


   

  
   
  

  On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at
8:13 PM Chuck McCown 
wrote:


  I think I will switch to
a mechanical.  Too cumbersome to haul out an
expensive fusion splicer.



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Re: [AFMUG] My solution

[Ken Hohhof]

Why does that sound dirty?

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 10:05 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] My solution

 

My flat slack is in the hand hole.

Sent from my iPhone





On Sep 9, 2020, at 8:22 PM, Chris Fabien mailto:ch...@lakenetmi.com> > wrote:



Sorry I meant slack of the outside flat drop intact, takes about a 12" square 
box to be able to make it coil in there. 

 

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 9:17 PM Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com> > wrote:

This has slack storage and a splice holder.

Sent from my iPhone





On Sep 9, 2020, at 6:36 PM, Chris Fabien mailto:ch...@lakenetmi.com> > wrote:



We had way more field failures with AFL Fastconnects than after we switched to 
spliced pigtails. We use a little larger NID that allows for some slack storage 
and has a splice holder. Tii 506F. 

Chris

 

 

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 8:13 PM Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com> > wrote:

I think I will switch to a mechanical.  Too cumbersome to haul out an expensive 
fusion splicer.



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Re: [AFMUG] My solution

[Chuck McCown]

My flat slack is in the hand hole.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 9, 2020, at 8:22 PM, Chris Fabien  wrote:
> 
> 
> Sorry I meant slack of the outside flat drop intact, takes about a 12" square 
> box to be able to make it coil in there. 
> 
>> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 9:17 PM Chuck McCown  wrote:
>> This has slack storage and a splice holder.
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
 On Sep 9, 2020, at 6:36 PM, Chris Fabien  wrote:
 
>>> 
>>> We had way more field failures with AFL Fastconnects than after we switched 
>>> to spliced pigtails. We use a little larger NID that allows for some slack 
>>> storage and has a splice holder. Tii 506F. 
>>> Chris
>>> 
>>> 
 On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 8:13 PM Chuck McCown  wrote:
 I think I will switch to a mechanical.  Too cumbersome to haul out an 
 expensive fusion splicer.
 
 
 
 Sent from my iPhone-- 
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>> -- 
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Jay Fuller turns 50 today?

[CBB - Jay Fuller]

Thanks Bill!

  - Original Message - 
  From: Bill Prince 
  To: af@af.afmug.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 11:20 AM
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Jay Fuller turns 50 today?


  See? I thought that birdie was wrong!

  Happy birthday anyway Jay!




bp
On 9/9/2020 9:12 AM, CBB - Jay Fuller wrote:


Thanks for the assumptionsit's 43.
I did ask my wife if i could stop having birthdays.
she said that would be very badno.
so, here's to more!

thanks everyone.

it's been a crazy rockin' and rolling time at our company lately.
We've been awarded 3 state grants to help deploy fiber.
Also we've been participating in a CARES act program to deploy broadband 
using our existing service.
We've taken like 300 orders in 2 days.

I was supposed to take off this week for my birthday.
Instead it has been postponed by two weeks.
:)


  - Original Message - 
  From: Jay Weekley 
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 8, 2020 2:25 PM
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Jay Fuller turns 50 today?


  I think it's higher than that.

  Mike Hammett wrote:
  > 50?! Holy cow, that's old!
  >
  >
  >
  >
  > ;-)
  >
  >
  >
  > Yes, I know many, many of you are much older. I jab equally.  :-)
  >
  >
  >
  > -
  > Mike Hammett
  > Intelligent Computing Solutions 
  > 

  > Midwest Internet Exchange 
  > 

  > The Brothers WISP 
  > 
  >
  >
  > 
  > 
  > *From: *"Bill Prince" 
  > *To: *"AFMUG" 
  > *Sent: *Tuesday, September 8, 2020 1:16:09 PM
  > *Subject: *[AFMUG] OT: Jay Fuller turns 50 today?
  >
  >
  > A birdie told me that today is Jay Fuller's 50th birthday. The birdie is
  > just a birdie, so don't blame me if I'm wrong.
  >
  >
  >
  > -- 
  > bp
  > 
  >
  >
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  >
  >

  -- 
  *Jay Weekley*
  *Cyber Broadband
  *

  -- 
  This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
  https://www.avg.com


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Re: [AFMUG] My solution

[Chris Fabien]

Sorry I meant slack of the outside flat drop intact, takes about a 12"
square box to be able to make it coil in there.

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 9:17 PM Chuck McCown  wrote:

> This has slack storage and a splice holder.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Sep 9, 2020, at 6:36 PM, Chris Fabien  wrote:
>
> 
> We had way more field failures with AFL Fastconnects than after we
> switched to spliced pigtails. We use a little larger NID that allows for
> some slack storage and has a splice holder. Tii 506F.
> Chris
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 8:13 PM Chuck McCown  wrote:
>
>> I think I will switch to a mechanical.  Too cumbersome to haul out an
>> expensive fusion splicer.
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone--
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
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Re: [AFMUG] Need a "Chuck" version of this

[Adam Moffett]

My observation is that the body of the thing is going to be too big to 
plug into some devices.


I think at a minimum they need to elongate the male end so it'll give 
clearance to adjacent plugs or any protrusions on the device it's 
plugged into.  I'd second the motion for an external ground screw.  If 
you had to install two of them on adjacent ports then it'd be better off 
as a dongle than a self contained unit like that.


but in general yeah I suppose a self contained surge suppressor 
isn't a crazy idea.



On 9/9/2020 12:47 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

TVS, so it may not work well with cambium.
And you have to make sure that the jack is the shielded grounded 
variety or this will do nothing.
Moreover, it is best to route the surge away from the equipment, not 
depend on the equipment to ground the surge.
I have tried these little TVS chips they use for these things.  They 
do work.  I am more of a believer that you want gas tube protection 
now-a-days.

*From:* can...@believewireless.net
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 10:42 AM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
*Subject:* [AFMUG] Need a "Chuck" version of this
Saw this recently posted on FB. I like the concept but would prefer an 
external ground point.
I'd be curious to see Chuck test these. I don't think he could fit all 
of his electrical goodness

into a connector this small.
https://www.amazon.com/WatchfulEyE-WTH-SG-RJ45-S-Ethernet-Protector/dp/B07H5PWWQ1


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Re: [AFMUG] My solution

[Chuck McCown]

This has slack storage and a splice holder.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 9, 2020, at 6:36 PM, Chris Fabien  wrote:
> 
> 
> We had way more field failures with AFL Fastconnects than after we switched 
> to spliced pigtails. We use a little larger NID that allows for some slack 
> storage and has a splice holder. Tii 506F. 
> Chris
> 
> 
>> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 8:13 PM Chuck McCown  wrote:
>> I think I will switch to a mechanical.  Too cumbersome to haul out an 
>> expensive fusion splicer.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone-- 
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Re: [AFMUG] My solution

[Chris Fabien]

We had way more field failures with AFL Fastconnects than after we switched
to spliced pigtails. We use a little larger NID that allows for some slack
storage and has a splice holder. Tii 506F.
Chris


On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 8:13 PM Chuck McCown  wrote:

> I think I will switch to a mechanical.  Too cumbersome to haul out an
> expensive fusion splicer.
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone--
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Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy day

[Ken Hohhof]

Ouch, the Spanglish is making my head spin.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Jaime Solorza
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:18 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy day

 

Enchiladas, tacos de carne asada y flautas with beans , rice and salsas..

 

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020, 1:48 PM Cameron Crum mailto:cc...@murcevilo.com> > wrote:

Whoo Hooo! You should have some mexican food to celebrate.

 

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 2:46 PM mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com> > 
wrote:

First revenue customer is up and running today on my new fiber company.  Only 
took about 2 years longer than anticipated...

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Re: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school

[Chris Fabien]

Mark,
I am NOT at all an e-rate expert, we have only ever bid on one project.
But, I believe there is a requirement that the school can only get funding
for special construction (your option 1) if they were unable to purchase
the services they need on a monthly service basis.

I think you may want to present an option 4. Build 4 new miles of your
fiber that you own, and sell them the services they need, whether that is a
dark fiber lease, or a lit transport circuit or a Metro WAN or whatever
they want.

You may want to find an expert to assist. If you have a good relationship
with the school they can shape the RFP to help you in the bidding. For
example the scoring criteria can be set up various ways. Price has to be
the most heavily weighted item but you can for example set up: Lowest Price
30%, Has an office in Myakka City 25%, Local tech can respond within 30
minutes 25%, Owners Name is Mark, 20%.  Exaggerating but you get the idea.

Chris


On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 5:51 PM Mark - Myakka Technologies 
wrote:

> Chris,
>
> #2 maybe the only way we bid.  I know they want #1, but I think we can
> come in with a low enough bid that #2 would be the best option.  Still do
> some research on the usac site to see the best way to do this.  I have had
> quotes of $50 - $80 per strand per mile per month for some of the dark
> fiber we have looked at in the past.  Currently we only sell dark fiber to
> one customer and we are charging them 37.50/mile/month
>
>
> --
> Best regards,
> Markmailto:m...@mailmt.com 
>
> Myakka Technologies, Inc.
> www.Myakka.com
>
> --
>
> Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 5:02:11 PM, you wrote:
>
>
> If you have the strands available #2 is the money maker.
>
> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 3:50 PM  wrote:
>
> There is also fabric innerduct which you can use to sub-duct an occupied
> duct. However, in a 1.25" duct it will be a *really* tight squeeze.
>
>
> Jared
>
> > Sent: Wednesday, September 09
> > From: ch...@wbmfg.com
> > To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school
> >
> > You can put micro duct in regular duct, but not if it is occupied.
> Perhaps
> > someone can do it.  I can't.
> > I hate any form of overblowing/double stuffing.
> >
> > I would not do it unless I got a piece of the recurring action.
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Mark - Myakka Technologies
> > Sent: Wednesday, September 9
> > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> > Subject: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school
> >
> > We  may  have  an  opportunity  to  bid  on a fiber project to a rural
> > elementary  school  in our footprint.  RFP has not been published yet,
> > so we have had only high level talks about this.
> >
> > We can do this 3 ways.
> >
> > 1.  A  completely new build out for the school.  Their own fiber, ducts,
> > handholes,  etc.   About  16  miles  of  state  road  so  DOT  will be
> > involved.
> >
> > 2.  About 4 miles new build on a state road which will get them to our
> > footprint.  We then lease them the other 12 miles on our fiber.
> >
> > 3.  About  4 miles new build on a state road to our footprint, then we
> > attempt  to  pull  their  fiber  through our duct for the remaining 12
> > miles.
> >
> >
> > Option  #1  is going to be the most time consuming and most expensive.
> > But  they  are  only out of pocket 20%.  E-Rate will pick up the other
> > 80%.   Advantages  to  them,  they own everything.  Disadvantage, they
> > have  to maintain everything.  No real advantage to us,  Just takes us
> > away  from  doing what we do.  Maybe we can get a maintenance contract
> > from them for fiber cuts, etc.  But I doubt it.
> >
> > Option  #2  quickest cleanest way to go.  Bang out a 4 mile run and be
> > done  with  it.  Disadvantages to them, reoccurring charges.  Not sure
> > if dark fiber is covered under e-rate.
> >
> > Option   #3  try to squeeze their fiber into our current duct.  We use
> > 1.25" duct and I think our current fiber is .75", so it would be tight
> > depending on count.  Is there a way to sub-duct existing duct?  I know
> > I  saw  some  high  count low diameter dense fiber at one of the WISPA
> > shows.
> >
> > Opinions?
> >
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mark  mailto:m...@mailmt.com
> >
> > Myakka Technologies, Inc.
> > www.Myakka.com
> >
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
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Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy day

[Jaime Solorza]

Enchiladas, tacos de carne asada y flautas with beans , rice and salsas..

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020, 1:48 PM Cameron Crum  wrote:

> Whoo Hooo! You should have some mexican food to celebrate.
>
> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 2:46 PM  wrote:
>
>> First revenue customer is up and running today on my new fiber company.
>> Only took about 2 years longer than anticipated...
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device

[Ken Hohhof]

Thanks Chris, thanks Darin.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Chris Fabien
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 4:15 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device

 

They use ARP spoofing and can definitely cause problems. We tested one and they 
were not compatible with the SmartRG SR400 routers we use. Their support was no 
help whatsoever either. 

 

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 4:59 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

H, does that work seamlessly, or could it cause problems people blame on 
their Internet?  And would it play nice with a range extender or mesh system?

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Darin Steffl
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 1:07 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device

 

ARP spoofing. It's not inline at all. If possible, it should be hardwired to 
the router instead of wifi for best performance. 

 

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020, 12:51 PM Steve Jones mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> > wrote:

routerlimits had something similar, never got to investigate much before bark 
bought them

i figured it either did dns or spoofing of something

 

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 12:43 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

Customer has a Circle device on their WiFi network which apparently is a 
parental control device.

 

How does this work if it’s just another device on the WiFi?  It seems like it 
would have to either be inline with the path to the Internet, or somehow take 
over DNS.  Or is it doing something intrusive on the WiFi?

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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[Adam Moffett]

The 900mhz 450i works about as good as you could hope for.

Regardless of product I'd plan capacity around 5mhz or 7mhz channels.  
You can theoretically do a 4 sector cluster with 10mhz channels and back 
to back re-use if there's nobody else on the band.  Or you can do a 
single sector at 20mhz with the same stipulation.  With 5mhz or 7mhz 
channels you some agility to pick the cleanest part of the band.


We do some real damage with 900mhz, but it comes with a price.  I think 
Ken hit on most of the points already, but you'll spend more time 
finding the right spot for an antenna and your service calls will be 
more frequent.



On 9/9/2020 12:19 PM, David Coudron wrote:


Hi folks,

Thanks for the feedback, this was what we were looking for.   It looks 
like the TVWS is a non-starter, but we should take another  look at 
900 MHz.   We are fortunate in that the areas are typically grouped 
very narrowly in one direction.  We figured we could cover the area 
with a 10 degree sector if we could find one that narrow. We’ll see 
what we can find for 900 MHz equipment out there.


Thanks,

David Coudron

*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Ken Hohhof
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 10:43 AM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

Oops, 26 MHz, not 28.  902-928.

*From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> 
*On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof

*Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:50 AM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' >

*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

I keep hearing about Microsoft and its Airband initiative.  I have no 
idea why Microsoft thinks that TVWS has merit or what technology they 
bring to the party, but I guess you could investigate it.  I have to 
agree with the others, it was never very attractive, and gets less so 
as time passes and people want to do video streaming and Zoom meetings 
and download 100 GB games over the Internet, and as other technologies 
advance.


I would also ask, what if Starlink actually works, and is months away 
from general availability.  It may not be a threat to WISPs in general 
(or maybe it is), but it would seem to solve this particular problem.  
And what if Starlink succeeds in getting RDOF or CAF subsidy money? 
Wouldn’t you just be lighting hundred dollar bills on fire?


As far as 900 MHz, we stopped using it. The reason wasn’t so much RTK 
(a lot of which is moving to 450 MHz anyway), but smartgrid and 
smartmeters.  If the power company or other utilities put in 900 MHz 
smartmeters, kiss 900 MHz goodbye for broadband.  The other problem 
was that it was always more art than science, sometimes it wouldn’t 
work and the reasons wouldn’t be clear.  It’s touch to plan or 
troubleshoot when, by definition, you don’t have clear line of sight.  
There’s also the issue of other WISPs in 900 MHz, but it sounds like 
you wouldn’t have this issue.


But the Cambium 450 900 MHz stuff does work, and even though you only 
have 28 MHz total to work with, you can use a wide enough channel to 
get decent speeds.  We still have one AP in service with a handful of 
customers on it.  I would steer clear of 900 MHz omni antennas 
though.  If you can’t justify sectors, just don’t do it.


*From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> 
*On Behalf Of *Bill Prince

*Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:28 AM
*To:* af@af.afmug.com 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

If they are in a cluster, this could possibly be a viable option.

bp


On 9/9/2020 7:25 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com  wrote:

Get them to contribute to the cost of a tower in their area.

*From:*David Coudron

*Sent:*Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:52 AM

*To:*AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group

*Subject:*[AFMUG] TV White Space

We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem
coverage areas.   The typical scenario is a handful of customers
that are 5-10 miles from a decent tower structure, but really want
service.   We have usually either passed on providing coverage, or
messed around with relaying from other customers or some other
messy scenario.   We are looking for a workable non-los solution
for these few spots.   We don’t need to get dozens of folks on a
tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it needs to be
stable enough it is better than the relays and other messy
solutions we have come up with.   We keep looking at 900 MHz, but
it looks like Cambium is the only one left in this game, and we
are pretty worried about noise as we are in the middle of farm
country and the RTK stuff is pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had
enough experience with TV white space to develop an opinion on its
ability to be used in this situation?   There only seems to be two
vendors in this space, Redline and Carlson, but maybe there are
others we are missing.   We are looking for a solution that would
cover customers 

Re: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school

[Mark - Myakka Technologies]

Title: Re: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school


Chris,

#2 maybe the only way we bid.  I know they want #1, but I think we can come in with a low enough bid that #2 would be the best option.  Still do some research on the usac site to see the best way to do this.  I have had quotes of $50 - $80 per strand per mile per month for some of the dark fiber we have looked at in the past.  Currently we only sell dark fiber to one customer and we are charging them 37.50/mile/month


--
Best regards,
 Mark                            mailto:m...@mailmt.com

Myakka Technologies, Inc.
www.Myakka.com

--

Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 5:02:11 PM, you wrote:





If you have the strands available #2 is the money maker. 

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 3:50 PM  wrote:




There is also fabric innerduct which you can use to sub-duct an occupied duct. However, in a 1.25" duct it will be a *really* tight squeeze.


Jared

> Sent: Wednesday, September 09
> From: ch...@wbmfg.com
> To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school
>
> You can put micro duct in regular duct, but not if it is occupied.  Perhaps
> someone can do it.  I can't.
> I hate any form of overblowing/double stuffing.
>
> I would not do it unless I got a piece of the recurring action.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Mark - Myakka Technologies
> Sent: Wednesday, September 9
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> Subject: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school
>
> We  may  have  an  opportunity  to  bid  on a fiber project to a rural
> elementary  school  in our footprint.  RFP has not been published yet,
> so we have had only high level talks about this.
>
> We can do this 3 ways.
>
> 1.  A  completely new build out for the school.  Their own fiber, ducts,
> handholes,  etc.   About  16  miles  of  state  road  so  DOT  will be
> involved.
>
> 2.  About 4 miles new build on a state road which will get them to our
> footprint.  We then lease them the other 12 miles on our fiber.
>
> 3.  About  4 miles new build on a state road to our footprint, then we
> attempt  to  pull  their  fiber  through our duct for the remaining 12
> miles.
>
>
> Option  #1  is going to be the most time consuming and most expensive.
> But  they  are  only out of pocket 20%.  E-Rate will pick up the other
> 80%.   Advantages  to  them,  they own everything.  Disadvantage, they
> have  to maintain everything.  No real advantage to us,  Just takes us
> away  from  doing what we do.  Maybe we can get a maintenance contract
> from them for fiber cuts, etc.  But I doubt it.
>
> Option  #2  quickest cleanest way to go.  Bang out a 4 mile run and be
> done  with  it.  Disadvantages to them, reoccurring charges.  Not sure
> if dark fiber is covered under e-rate.
>
> Option   #3  try to squeeze their fiber into our current duct.  We use
> 1.25" duct and I think our current fiber is .75", so it would be tight
> depending on count.  Is there a way to sub-duct existing duct?  I know
> I  saw  some  high  count low diameter dense fiber at one of the WISPA
> shows.
>
> Opinions?
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Thanks,
> Mark                          mailto:m...@mailmt.com
>
> Myakka Technologies, Inc.
> www.Myakka.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>

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Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device

[Chris Fabien]

They use ARP spoofing and can definitely cause problems. We tested one and
they were not compatible with the SmartRG SR400 routers we use. Their
support was no help whatsoever either.

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 4:59 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> H, does that work seamlessly, or could it cause problems people blame
> on their Internet?  And would it play nice with a range extender or mesh
> system?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Darin Steffl
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 1:07 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device
>
>
>
> ARP spoofing. It's not inline at all. If possible, it should be hardwired
> to the router instead of wifi for best performance.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020, 12:51 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
> routerlimits had something similar, never got to investigate much before
> bark bought them
>
> i figured it either did dns or spoofing of something
>
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 12:43 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> Customer has a Circle device on their WiFi network which apparently is a
> parental control device.
>
>
>
> How does this work if it’s just another device on the WiFi?  It seems like
> it would have to either be inline with the path to the Internet, or somehow
> take over DNS.  Or is it doing something intrusive on the WiFi?
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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> AF@af.afmug.com
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school

[Chris Fabien]

If you have the strands available #2 is the money maker.

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 3:50 PM  wrote:

> There is also fabric innerduct which you can use to sub-duct an occupied
> duct. However, in a 1.25" duct it will be a *really* tight squeeze.
>
>
> Jared
>
> > Sent: Wednesday, September 09
> > From: ch...@wbmfg.com
> > To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school
> >
> > You can put micro duct in regular duct, but not if it is occupied.
> Perhaps
> > someone can do it.  I can't.
> > I hate any form of overblowing/double stuffing.
> >
> > I would not do it unless I got a piece of the recurring action.
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Mark - Myakka Technologies
> > Sent: Wednesday, September 9
> > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> > Subject: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school
> >
> > We  may  have  an  opportunity  to  bid  on a fiber project to a rural
> > elementary  school  in our footprint.  RFP has not been published yet,
> > so we have had only high level talks about this.
> >
> > We can do this 3 ways.
> >
> > 1.  A  completely new build out for the school.  Their own fiber, ducts,
> > handholes,  etc.   About  16  miles  of  state  road  so  DOT  will be
> > involved.
> >
> > 2.  About 4 miles new build on a state road which will get them to our
> > footprint.  We then lease them the other 12 miles on our fiber.
> >
> > 3.  About  4 miles new build on a state road to our footprint, then we
> > attempt  to  pull  their  fiber  through our duct for the remaining 12
> > miles.
> >
> >
> > Option  #1  is going to be the most time consuming and most expensive.
> > But  they  are  only out of pocket 20%.  E-Rate will pick up the other
> > 80%.   Advantages  to  them,  they own everything.  Disadvantage, they
> > have  to maintain everything.  No real advantage to us,  Just takes us
> > away  from  doing what we do.  Maybe we can get a maintenance contract
> > from them for fiber cuts, etc.  But I doubt it.
> >
> > Option  #2  quickest cleanest way to go.  Bang out a 4 mile run and be
> > done  with  it.  Disadvantages to them, reoccurring charges.  Not sure
> > if dark fiber is covered under e-rate.
> >
> > Option   #3  try to squeeze their fiber into our current duct.  We use
> > 1.25" duct and I think our current fiber is .75", so it would be tight
> > depending on count.  Is there a way to sub-duct existing duct?  I know
> > I  saw  some  high  count low diameter dense fiber at one of the WISPA
> > shows.
> >
> > Opinions?
> >
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mark  mailto:m...@mailmt.com
> >
> > Myakka Technologies, Inc.
> > www.Myakka.com
> >
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device

[Ken Hohhof]

H, does that work seamlessly, or could it cause problems people blame on 
their Internet?  And would it play nice with a range extender or mesh system?

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Darin Steffl
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 1:07 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device

 

ARP spoofing. It's not inline at all. If possible, it should be hardwired to 
the router instead of wifi for best performance. 

 

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020, 12:51 PM Steve Jones mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> > wrote:

routerlimits had something similar, never got to investigate much before bark 
bought them

i figured it either did dns or spoofing of something

 

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 12:43 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

Customer has a Circle device on their WiFi network which apparently is a 
parental control device.

 

How does this work if it’s just another device on the WiFi?  It seems like it 
would have to either be inline with the path to the Internet, or somehow take 
over DNS.  Or is it doing something intrusive on the WiFi?

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Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy day

[chuck]

Well, first bill will go out Oct 1.  The first payment will be something to 
celebrate.  

From: Cameron Crum 
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 1:47 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy day

Whoo Hooo! You should have some mexican food to celebrate.

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 2:46 PM  wrote:

  First revenue customer is up and running today on my new fiber company.  Only 
took about 2 years longer than anticipated...
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Re: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school

[fiberrun]

There is also fabric innerduct which you can use to sub-duct an occupied duct. 
However, in a 1.25" duct it will be a *really* tight squeeze.


Jared

> Sent: Wednesday, September 09
> From: ch...@wbmfg.com
> To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school
>
> You can put micro duct in regular duct, but not if it is occupied.  Perhaps
> someone can do it.  I can't.
> I hate any form of overblowing/double stuffing.
>
> I would not do it unless I got a piece of the recurring action.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Mark - Myakka Technologies
> Sent: Wednesday, September 9
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> Subject: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school
>
> We  may  have  an  opportunity  to  bid  on a fiber project to a rural
> elementary  school  in our footprint.  RFP has not been published yet,
> so we have had only high level talks about this.
>
> We can do this 3 ways.
>
> 1.  A  completely new build out for the school.  Their own fiber, ducts,
> handholes,  etc.   About  16  miles  of  state  road  so  DOT  will be
> involved.
>
> 2.  About 4 miles new build on a state road which will get them to our
> footprint.  We then lease them the other 12 miles on our fiber.
>
> 3.  About  4 miles new build on a state road to our footprint, then we
> attempt  to  pull  their  fiber  through our duct for the remaining 12
> miles.
>
>
> Option  #1  is going to be the most time consuming and most expensive.
> But  they  are  only out of pocket 20%.  E-Rate will pick up the other
> 80%.   Advantages  to  them,  they own everything.  Disadvantage, they
> have  to maintain everything.  No real advantage to us,  Just takes us
> away  from  doing what we do.  Maybe we can get a maintenance contract
> from them for fiber cuts, etc.  But I doubt it.
>
> Option  #2  quickest cleanest way to go.  Bang out a 4 mile run and be
> done  with  it.  Disadvantages to them, reoccurring charges.  Not sure
> if dark fiber is covered under e-rate.
>
> Option   #3  try to squeeze their fiber into our current duct.  We use
> 1.25" duct and I think our current fiber is .75", so it would be tight
> depending on count.  Is there a way to sub-duct existing duct?  I know
> I  saw  some  high  count low diameter dense fiber at one of the WISPA
> shows.
>
> Opinions?
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Thanks,
> Mark  mailto:m...@mailmt.com
>
> Myakka Technologies, Inc.
> www.Myakka.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
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> AF@af.afmug.com
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>

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Re: [AFMUG] OT Happy day

[Cameron Crum]

Whoo Hooo! You should have some mexican food to celebrate.

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 2:46 PM  wrote:

> First revenue customer is up and running today on my new fiber company.
> Only took about 2 years longer than anticipated...
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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[AFMUG] OT Happy day

[chuck]

First revenue customer is up and running today on my new fiber company.  Only 
took about 2 years longer than anticipated...-- 
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Re: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school

[Steve Jones]

option one may open the door to their bandwidth. we looked at something
similar, charge a discounted customer build, we own the fiber/duct, their
discounted build cost offset a substantial amount of isp build cost. they
get a 2 strand lease for x year 1$/year.
Everybody but the boss is on board

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 2:24 PM Mark - Myakka Technologies 
wrote:

> We  may  have  an  opportunity  to  bid  on a fiber project to a rural
> elementary  school  in our footprint.  RFP has not been published yet,
> so we have had only high level talks about this.
>
> We can do this 3 ways.
>
> 1.  A  completely new build out for the school.  Their own fiber, ducts,
> handholes,  etc.   About  16  miles  of  state  road  so  DOT  will be
> involved.
>
> 2.  About 4 miles new build on a state road which will get them to our
> footprint.  We then lease them the other 12 miles on our fiber.
>
> 3.  About  4 miles new build on a state road to our footprint, then we
> attempt  to  pull  their  fiber  through our duct for the remaining 12
> miles.
>
>
> Option  #1  is going to be the most time consuming and most expensive.
> But  they  are  only out of pocket 20%.  E-Rate will pick up the other
> 80%.   Advantages  to  them,  they own everything.  Disadvantage, they
> have  to maintain everything.  No real advantage to us,  Just takes us
> away  from  doing what we do.  Maybe we can get a maintenance contract
> from them for fiber cuts, etc.  But I doubt it.
>
> Option  #2  quickest cleanest way to go.  Bang out a 4 mile run and be
> done  with  it.  Disadvantages to them, reoccurring charges.  Not sure
> if dark fiber is covered under e-rate.
>
> Option   #3  try to squeeze their fiber into our current duct.  We use
> 1.25" duct and I think our current fiber is .75", so it would be tight
> depending on count.  Is there a way to sub-duct existing duct?  I know
> I  saw  some  high  count low diameter dense fiber at one of the WISPA
> shows.
>
> Opinions?
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Thanks,
>  Mark  mailto:m...@mailmt.com
>
> Myakka Technologies, Inc.
> www.Myakka.com
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school

[chuck]

You can put micro duct in regular duct, but not if it is occupied.  Perhaps 
someone can do it.  I can't.

I hate any form of overblowing/double stuffing.

I would not do it unless I got a piece of the recurring action.

-Original Message- 
From: Mark - Myakka Technologies

Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 1:23 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: [AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school

We  may  have  an  opportunity  to  bid  on a fiber project to a rural
elementary  school  in our footprint.  RFP has not been published yet,
so we have had only high level talks about this.

We can do this 3 ways.

1.  A  completely new build out for the school.  Their own fiber, ducts,
handholes,  etc.   About  16  miles  of  state  road  so  DOT  will be
involved.

2.  About 4 miles new build on a state road which will get them to our
footprint.  We then lease them the other 12 miles on our fiber.

3.  About  4 miles new build on a state road to our footprint, then we
attempt  to  pull  their  fiber  through our duct for the remaining 12
miles.


Option  #1  is going to be the most time consuming and most expensive.
But  they  are  only out of pocket 20%.  E-Rate will pick up the other
80%.   Advantages  to  them,  they own everything.  Disadvantage, they
have  to maintain everything.  No real advantage to us,  Just takes us
away  from  doing what we do.  Maybe we can get a maintenance contract
from them for fiber cuts, etc.  But I doubt it.

Option  #2  quickest cleanest way to go.  Bang out a 4 mile run and be
done  with  it.  Disadvantages to them, reoccurring charges.  Not sure
if dark fiber is covered under e-rate.

Option   #3  try to squeeze their fiber into our current duct.  We use
1.25" duct and I think our current fiber is .75", so it would be tight
depending on count.  Is there a way to sub-duct existing duct?  I know
I  saw  some  high  count low diameter dense fiber at one of the WISPA
shows.

Opinions?


Thanks







--

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Mark  mailto:m...@mailmt.com

Myakka Technologies, Inc.
www.Myakka.com


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[AFMUG] Possible Fiber project for school

[Mark - Myakka Technologies]

We  may  have  an  opportunity  to  bid  on a fiber project to a rural
elementary  school  in our footprint.  RFP has not been published yet,
so we have had only high level talks about this.

We can do this 3 ways.

1.  A  completely new build out for the school.  Their own fiber, ducts,
handholes,  etc.   About  16  miles  of  state  road  so  DOT  will be
involved.

2.  About 4 miles new build on a state road which will get them to our
footprint.  We then lease them the other 12 miles on our fiber.

3.  About  4 miles new build on a state road to our footprint, then we
attempt  to  pull  their  fiber  through our duct for the remaining 12
miles.


Option  #1  is going to be the most time consuming and most expensive.
But  they  are  only out of pocket 20%.  E-Rate will pick up the other
80%.   Advantages  to  them,  they own everything.  Disadvantage, they
have  to maintain everything.  No real advantage to us,  Just takes us
away  from  doing what we do.  Maybe we can get a maintenance contract
from them for fiber cuts, etc.  But I doubt it.

Option  #2  quickest cleanest way to go.  Bang out a 4 mile run and be
done  with  it.  Disadvantages to them, reoccurring charges.  Not sure
if dark fiber is covered under e-rate.

Option   #3  try to squeeze their fiber into our current duct.  We use
1.25" duct and I think our current fiber is .75", so it would be tight
depending on count.  Is there a way to sub-duct existing duct?  I know
I  saw  some  high  count low diameter dense fiber at one of the WISPA
shows.

Opinions?


Thanks







--

Thanks,
 Mark  mailto:m...@mailmt.com

Myakka Technologies, Inc.
www.Myakka.com


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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[Steve Jones]

i thought there was gonna be a fight.


but OP should talk to redline, they talk a mean game, if half what the
sales guys tell you is true and you have the dough, it will be like moses
parted the red sea (or trees in this case) directly to your customers.

Theres an Ericson WISP contact that floats around WISP talk. Ive seen some
white paper on their cellular geat that do crazy throughputs over water and
through dirt. I dont know how much that tech scales down into their WISP
offerings.



On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 1:59 PM Josh Baird  wrote:

> I read your first sentence and thought you were arguing that TVWS was not
> actually a shit-show!
>
> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 10:11 AM Lewis Bergman 
> wrote:
>
>> Josh,
>> I have to take issue with your assertion that TVWS has been a shit show
>> for at least 10 years. I think it has been a complete shit show ever since
>> they came up with the idea, maybe 20 to 25 years ago. Technically you are
>> correct it is at least 10 years. But it has never risen to the level of
>> being anything less than a complete mess. It has always had such promise,
>> and never lived up to any of it.
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 9:03 AM Josh Baird  wrote:
>>
>>> In my opinion, TVWS has been a complete shit-show for the past 10 years,
>>> and I would be hesitant to throw any money at it.
>>>
>>> Someone feel free to change my mind.  :)
>>>
>>> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 9:53 AM David Coudron <
>>> david.coud...@advantenon.com> wrote:
>>>
 We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage
 areas.   The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles
 from a decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually
 either passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from
 other customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a
 workable non-los solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get
 dozens of folks on a tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it
 needs to be stable enough it is better than the relays and other messy
 solutions we have come up with.   We keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks
 like Cambium is the only one left in this game, and we are pretty worried
 about noise as we are in the middle of farm country and the RTK stuff is
 pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough experience with TV white space to
 develop an opinion on its ability to be used in this situation?   There
 only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline and Carlson, but maybe
 there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a solution that would
 cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate plans of 20-25
 Mbps.   Is this possible?



 Regards,



 David Coudron
 --
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Lewis Bergman
>> 325-439-0533 Cell
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>>
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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[Josh Baird]

I read your first sentence and thought you were arguing that TVWS was not
actually a shit-show!

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 10:11 AM Lewis Bergman 
wrote:

> Josh,
> I have to take issue with your assertion that TVWS has been a shit show
> for at least 10 years. I think it has been a complete shit show ever since
> they came up with the idea, maybe 20 to 25 years ago. Technically you are
> correct it is at least 10 years. But it has never risen to the level of
> being anything less than a complete mess. It has always had such promise,
> and never lived up to any of it.
>
> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 9:03 AM Josh Baird  wrote:
>
>> In my opinion, TVWS has been a complete shit-show for the past 10 years,
>> and I would be hesitant to throw any money at it.
>>
>> Someone feel free to change my mind.  :)
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 9:53 AM David Coudron <
>> david.coud...@advantenon.com> wrote:
>>
>>> We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage
>>> areas.   The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles
>>> from a decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually
>>> either passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from
>>> other customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a
>>> workable non-los solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get
>>> dozens of folks on a tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it
>>> needs to be stable enough it is better than the relays and other messy
>>> solutions we have come up with.   We keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks
>>> like Cambium is the only one left in this game, and we are pretty worried
>>> about noise as we are in the middle of farm country and the RTK stuff is
>>> pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough experience with TV white space to
>>> develop an opinion on its ability to be used in this situation?   There
>>> only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline and Carlson, but maybe
>>> there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a solution that would
>>> cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate plans of 20-25
>>> Mbps.   Is this possible?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> David Coudron
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
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>>
>
>
> --
> Lewis Bergman
> 325-439-0533 Cell
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Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device

[Darin Steffl]

ARP spoofing. It's not inline at all. If possible, it should be hardwired
to the router instead of wifi for best performance.

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020, 12:51 PM Steve Jones  wrote:

> routerlimits had something similar, never got to investigate much before
> bark bought them
> i figured it either did dns or spoofing of something
>
> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 12:43 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
>> Customer has a Circle device on their WiFi network which apparently is a
>> parental control device.
>>
>>
>>
>> How does this work if it’s just another device on the WiFi?  It seems
>> like it would have to either be inline with the path to the Internet, or
>> somehow take over DNS.  Or is it doing something intrusive on the WiFi?
>> --
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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[chuck]

It really isn’t compared to a light weight Rohn.  As long as guys are not 
needed.  

From: Sean Heskett 
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 11:13 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

find out who installs poles for the telephone/power company and have them 
install a 60-70' pole (might need to guy it but they can do that too) at the 
customer's site.  no need to pour concrete etc. and it should be a lot less 
expensive than having the customer build a tower. 

i think whisper or someone makes a drone that can do site surveys so you know 
the pole will work.  

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 10:23 AM David Coudron  
wrote:

  We looked at this, and it still may be something we need to consider.   I am 
afraid that LOS sensitive frequencies still wouldn’t reach some of them that 
are less than 1 mile away due to trees.   A good alternative might be to have 
them put up 60-70 ft antenna structures.   That would help with the trees on 
their property and close by.   



  Regards,



  David Coudron

  From: AF  On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
  Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:25 AM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space



  Get them to contribute to the cost of a tower in their area.  



  From: David Coudron 

  Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:52 AM

  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

  Subject: [AFMUG] TV White Space



  We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage areas.  
 The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles from a 
decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually either 
passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from other 
customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a workable non-los 
solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get dozens of folks on a 
tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it needs to be stable enough it 
is better than the relays and other messy solutions we have come up with.   We 
keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks like Cambium is the only one left in this 
game, and we are pretty worried about noise as we are in the middle of farm 
country and the RTK stuff is pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough 
experience with TV white space to develop an opinion on its ability to be used 
in this situation?   There only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline 
and Carlson, but maybe there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a 
solution that would cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate 
plans of 20-25 Mbps.   Is this possible?



  Regards,



  David Coudron


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[AFMUG] WiFi / Mesh WiFi for small city / municipality

[Lincs_Chel]

Hi;

Anyone did a small city WiFi / WiFi Mesh project for a small town / 
city.   To provide free WiFi zones for the public for the city.


Any products or WiFi controllers researched or used?

Lincoln


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Re: [AFMUG] Circle parental control device

[Steve Jones]

routerlimits had something similar, never got to investigate much before
bark bought them
i figured it either did dns or spoofing of something

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 12:43 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> Customer has a Circle device on their WiFi network which apparently is a
> parental control device.
>
>
>
> How does this work if it’s just another device on the WiFi?  It seems like
> it would have to either be inline with the path to the Internet, or somehow
> take over DNS.  Or is it doing something intrusive on the WiFi?
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[AFMUG] Circle parental control device

[Ken Hohhof]

Customer has a Circle device on their WiFi network which apparently is a
parental control device.

 

How does this work if it's just another device on the WiFi?  It seems like
it would have to either be inline with the path to the Internet, or somehow
take over DNS.  Or is it doing something intrusive on the WiFi?

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[AFMUG] ***SPAM*** RE: ***SPAM*** Re: [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

[David Coudron]

Funny you should mention the positive tests issue.   Buddy of mine owns a 
roofing company.   General contractor says all subs have to have their people 
tested or they can’t be on site.   Buddy sends three of his guys down to the 
testing site to get tested.   They check in, give them the names, phone 
numbers, etc. and sit down to wait to get tested.   After 30 minutes they ask 
how long this is going to take.   Nurse says 4-5 hours before they will be able 
to be tested.  They say, the heck with it, we aren’t waiting that long and go 
back to work.   All three get a letter 2 days later saying they have tested 
positive.They thought it was pretty funny.   My buddy didn’t because he was 
supposed to show the general proof of testing and he sure as heck didn’t want 
to show the general a false positive letter.


From: AF  On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 12:07 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] ***SPAM*** Re: [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

lol, two of the nurses here that were exposed filled out their testing 
paperwork at the site, they got called back into work before they could get 
swabbed. they received their positive results a couple days later... on the 
tests they didnt take. the positive tests arent all that reliable either my 
friend.

My guess is that site had a bad order design and wasnt matching samples to 
names. they did recently change their registration process.

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 10:32 AM Robert Andrews 
mailto:i...@avantwireless.com>> wrote:
I was educated on the reliability of negative results.   Good friend,
well connected, friends with the Dr. in charge of Nevada testing.

While a positive result is very reliable, the negatives are very much
not so.   AT THE BEST, when an infected is in optimal test time, 5-8
days into the infecting the current test is only 85% accurate.   Outside
of that time range it falls each day on either side to 46% or worse!.

  Get an antibody test if it's after 12 days from the infection.  They
are much more accurate with rates in the 99% range positive/negative.

  Here in Nevada they hand out a sheet that says "If you have symptoms
isolate for 14 days regardless of results" nobody really reads that sheet.

On 09/09/2020 08:00 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> We had one employee, all the symptoms.  Got a test, got results back  in
> about 4 hours $100  Not positive.  I was astounded they turned it around
> that fast.
> *From:* Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 8:58 AM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world
>
> Yeah, it’s like the colleges that invite all the kids on campus then
> after a week send them back home all over the country when (surprise,
> surprise) they get a bunch of positive tests.  Fauci is trying to tell
> them at that point they’re doing the worst thing, once they’re on
> campus, keep them there, maybe isolate the sick ones.  But don’t send
> them back home to spread the virus.
>
> *From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> *On 
> Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 8, 2020 11:23 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world
>
> so, the wife ended up not catching it, a couple nurses did. in the last
> couple weeks shes had 2 more exposures from the same nonsense. we arent
> going into lockdown every time anymore, just notifying everybody and
> wearing masks for two weeks even though they dont do anything (purely an
> issue of criminal liability).
>
> Last saturday my piece of shit brother in law dropped his kid off to us,
> didnt bother to mention to us that he (the brother) had been sick for a
> couple days and lost his sense of taste. we went to a family gathering
> with the nephew. the brothers gf test came back postive on sunday
> (another thing he didnt mention. so of course everybody at the family
> function went on lock down. the nephew had only been at his dads since
> friday and was never around the gf. he hadnt been exposed long enough to
> spread it, the likelyhood of contact contamination of clothing is near
> zero. But we reported to everybody who was there, my cousins kids
> couldnt go back to school til the boy had a negative test, etc.
>
> the three year old came back negative, everybody was good.
>
> The brother in law tested positive on monday.
>
> no big deal
>
> til he tells my wife hes having a covid party, him, his gf, and a few of
> their friends who are positive. Not a huge deal, except they have my 3
> year old nephew there, who WAS negative.
>
> This is the nonsense that makes this ting and issue, people willfully
> putting others at risk and doing unneccessarily risky things (ill
> guarantee some in this group have been at the bar in the last week).
> Theyre all on public health 10 day quarantines, but out in public
> 

Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[Sean Heskett]

find out who installs poles for the telephone/power company and have them
install a 60-70' pole (might need to guy it but they can do that too) at
the customer's site.  no need to pour concrete etc. and it should be a lot
less expensive than having the customer build a tower.

i think whisper or someone makes a drone that can do site surveys so you
know the pole will work.

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 10:23 AM David Coudron 
wrote:

> We looked at this, and it still may be something we need to consider.   I
> am afraid that LOS sensitive frequencies still wouldn’t reach some of them
> that are less than 1 mile away due to trees.   A good alternative might be
> to have them put up 60-70 ft antenna structures.   That would help with the
> trees on their property and close by.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> David Coudron
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * ch...@wbmfg.com
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:25 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space
>
>
>
> Get them to contribute to the cost of a tower in their area.
>
>
>
> *From:* David Coudron
>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:52 AM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] TV White Space
>
>
>
> We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage
> areas.   The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles
> from a decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually
> either passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from
> other customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a
> workable non-los solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get
> dozens of folks on a tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it
> needs to be stable enough it is better than the relays and other messy
> solutions we have come up with.   We keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks
> like Cambium is the only one left in this game, and we are pretty worried
> about noise as we are in the middle of farm country and the RTK stuff is
> pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough experience with TV white space to
> develop an opinion on its ability to be used in this situation?   There
> only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline and Carlson, but maybe
> there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a solution that would
> cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate plans of 20-25
> Mbps.   Is this possible?
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> David Coudron
> --
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] ***SPAM*** Re: [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

[chuck]

My room is concrete.  All 6 sides. 

From: can...@believewireless.net 
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 10:53 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] ***SPAM*** Re: [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

I hope the rest of the room is surrounded in metal. Otherwise, you could just 
punch through the drywall and enter.

On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 11:04 AM Lewis Bergman  wrote:

  A friend of mine just put this in his new house. I think you need a few. 



  On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 8:55 AM Chuck McCown  wrote:

I actually do have what you could call a bunker.  That is what my neighbors 
call it.  Underground room off a tunnel that connects my house basement with my 
garage lower level.  Like to find a fancy old bank vault door for it.  I told 
my kids that when I croak they will find it stuffed floor to ceiling with 
toilet paper.  


Sent from my iPhone


  On Aug 7, 2020, at 6:45 AM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:


   
  If the weather stayed like it’s been this week, you could just put a 
comfy chair out on the lawn for her.



  My neighbors got some sort of tentlike gazebo thing.  It’s probably just 
a gazebo, but I’ve wondered if it’s a quarantine hut in case one of them gets 
infected.



  Chuck could quarantine in his Vienna Sausage bunker.





  From: AF  On Behalf Of Steve Jones
  Sent: Friday, August 7, 2020 12:06 AM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: [SPAM] Re: [AFMUG] COVID Exposure and the real world



  You geeks are pretty smart.

  I was thinking, there's nothing stopping me from making her room and our 
upstairs bathroom negative pressure rooms with some 6 inch duct and duct fans 
in a plywood and styrofoam cutout in the window. If I put a hepa furnace filter 
on and a baffle it should keep any heat and bugs out of the house. May help 
keep our upstairs cooler blowing heat out and drawing cool air up from 
downstairs. Laying the duct to the floor should cause down draft and get any 
potential airborne bugs out of the air.

  I'm thinking if I run humidifiers it should give any covid creatures 
something weighty to attach to.

  My 15 year old opted to go stay with my neice because I gave him and the 
12 year old girl the current known political statistics and let them define 
their own risk tolerance. If wife doesnt get symptomatic I'm letting him go 
through with his baptism Sunday since he wont be exposed when she would become 
contagious. But then again, church is the only place it spreads.

  The girl opted to stay

  The two littles dont have brain pan capacity to decide, since neither of 
them talk yet.

  The fat baby is still on boob juice and CDC and who political 
recommendations are to continue breast feeding but for mom to wear a mask... 
odd to see common sense prevail from either of those places.

  Probably making a poor choice somewhere in all this but when you're 
offered the option of a shit sandwich or a turd burger, the outcomes wont be 
all that different.



  Boss was pretty cool, we are on the same page as far as risk exposure and 
mitigation at work. This wont be her last exposure at work, though I hope it's 
the last high risk one. And if she does test positive, then we dont have to 
worry about them anymore. If I catch it and dont croak out then we are riding 
on the golden ticket. We are both smokers and apparently this particular 
disease that's a good thing since the vascular impact is mitigated by our 
constant constriction, no covid toe for us.



  Looked like a hypochondriac at the store stocking up on vitamins for 3 
age ranges and normal cold/flu meds for 3 age ranges. Learning a ton about 
vitamin D, C, potassium and Zinc tolerances. This sucks because something in 
multivitamins cause me to get tinitus so the ringing will start here in a 
couple days. But at least we will walk away in the habit of adjuncting with 
vitamins. Probably something we should have been doing all along.



  I'm guessing if I werent treating this like any disaster mitigation at 
work I'd be freaking out like the wife. Hopefully I dont get to the point I 
have it handled and have time to sit and think. Might result in a bit of a 
brain bubble.



  Going to find out shortly just how accurate the "experts" are. Should be 
an interesting week. According to CNN, since we are a right leaning household, 
we are all going to die because of our guns.



  On Thu, Aug 6, 2020, 11:34 PM Steve Jones  
wrote:

This guy is a definite initial false negative. It technically wasn't an 
initial rule out, it was a confirmation test, that's why the doc immediately 
ordered second test. Since my initial post there's been a lot of policy 
activity at the facility. A lot of staff exposure occurred.



On Thu, Aug 6, 2020, 4:56 PM Matt Hoppes 
 wrote:

  Keep in mind that that could be a false positive as well there are a 
lot of both false negatives 

Re: [AFMUG] ***SPAM*** Re: [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

[Steve Jones]

lol, two of the nurses here that were exposed filled out their testing
paperwork at the site, they got called back into work before they could get
swabbed. they received their positive results a couple days later... on the
tests they didnt take. the positive tests arent all that reliable either my
friend.

My guess is that site had a bad order design and wasnt matching samples to
names. they did recently change their registration process.

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 10:32 AM Robert Andrews 
wrote:

> I was educated on the reliability of negative results.   Good friend,
> well connected, friends with the Dr. in charge of Nevada testing.
>
> While a positive result is very reliable, the negatives are very much
> not so.   AT THE BEST, when an infected is in optimal test time, 5-8
> days into the infecting the current test is only 85% accurate.   Outside
> of that time range it falls each day on either side to 46% or worse!.
>
>   Get an antibody test if it's after 12 days from the infection.  They
> are much more accurate with rates in the 99% range positive/negative.
>
>   Here in Nevada they hand out a sheet that says "If you have symptoms
> isolate for 14 days regardless of results" nobody really reads that sheet.
>
> On 09/09/2020 08:00 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> > We had one employee, all the symptoms.  Got a test, got results back  in
> > about 4 hours $100  Not positive.  I was astounded they turned it around
> > that fast.
> > *From:* Ken Hohhof
> > *Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 8:58 AM
> > *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
> > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world
> >
> > Yeah, it’s like the colleges that invite all the kids on campus then
> > after a week send them back home all over the country when (surprise,
> > surprise) they get a bunch of positive tests.  Fauci is trying to tell
> > them at that point they’re doing the worst thing, once they’re on
> > campus, keep them there, maybe isolate the sick ones.  But don’t send
> > them back home to spread the virus.
> >
> > *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> > *Sent:* Tuesday, September 8, 2020 11:23 PM
> > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world
> >
> > so, the wife ended up not catching it, a couple nurses did. in the last
> > couple weeks shes had 2 more exposures from the same nonsense. we arent
> > going into lockdown every time anymore, just notifying everybody and
> > wearing masks for two weeks even though they dont do anything (purely an
> > issue of criminal liability).
> >
> > Last saturday my piece of shit brother in law dropped his kid off to us,
> > didnt bother to mention to us that he (the brother) had been sick for a
> > couple days and lost his sense of taste. we went to a family gathering
> > with the nephew. the brothers gf test came back postive on sunday
> > (another thing he didnt mention. so of course everybody at the family
> > function went on lock down. the nephew had only been at his dads since
> > friday and was never around the gf. he hadnt been exposed long enough to
> > spread it, the likelyhood of contact contamination of clothing is near
> > zero. But we reported to everybody who was there, my cousins kids
> > couldnt go back to school til the boy had a negative test, etc.
> >
> > the three year old came back negative, everybody was good.
> >
> > The brother in law tested positive on monday.
> >
> > no big deal
> >
> > til he tells my wife hes having a covid party, him, his gf, and a few of
> > their friends who are positive. Not a huge deal, except they have my 3
> > year old nephew there, who WAS negative.
> >
> > This is the nonsense that makes this ting and issue, people willfully
> > putting others at risk and doing unneccessarily risky things (ill
> > guarantee some in this group have been at the bar in the last week).
> > Theyre all on public health 10 day quarantines, but out in public
> > fucking around, (FYI, these fuckwits arent even the Trump supporting
> > rednecks everybody is probably envisioning, theyre literal BLM activists
> > who have been indoctrinating my brother in law)
> >
> > this doesnt have to be this way
> >
> > just venting, cause the alternative is dropping this here magazine in
> > the well and heading over for a discussion resulting in a few more covid
> > deaths. Debating on going full karen and calling DCFS
> >
> > On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 1:45 PM James Howard  wrote:
> >
> > That’s actually our intention with our basement garage.  We’ve been
> > telling the kids we plan to put a basketball hoop down there.  We’ve
> > just never succeeded in getting out all the stuff that ended up down
> > there when we moved in.
> >
> > *From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Seth
> Mattinen
> > *Sent:* Friday, August 7, 2020 12:07 PM
> > *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world
> 

[AFMUG] ***SPAM*** Re: [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

[can...@believewireless.net]

I hope the rest of the room is surrounded in metal. Otherwise, you could
just punch through the drywall and enter.

On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 11:04 AM Lewis Bergman 
wrote:

> A friend of mine just put this in his new house. I think you need a few.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 8:55 AM Chuck McCown  wrote:
>
>> I actually do have what you could call a bunker.  That is what my
>> neighbors call it.  Underground room off a tunnel that connects my house
>> basement with my garage lower level.  Like to find a fancy old bank vault
>> door for it.  I told my kids that when I croak they will find it stuffed
>> floor to ceiling with toilet paper.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Aug 7, 2020, at 6:45 AM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>> If the weather stayed like it’s been this week, you could just put a
>> comfy chair out on the lawn for her.
>>
>>
>>
>> My neighbors got some sort of tentlike gazebo thing.  It’s probably just
>> a gazebo, but I’ve wondered if it’s a quarantine hut in case one of them
>> gets infected.
>>
>>
>>
>> Chuck could quarantine in his Vienna Sausage bunker.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
>> *Sent:* Friday, August 7, 2020 12:06 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* [SPAM] Re: [AFMUG] COVID Exposure and the real world
>>
>>
>>
>> You geeks are pretty smart.
>>
>> I was thinking, there's nothing stopping me from making her room and our
>> upstairs bathroom negative pressure rooms with some 6 inch duct and duct
>> fans in a plywood and styrofoam cutout in the window. If I put a hepa
>> furnace filter on and a baffle it should keep any heat and bugs out of the
>> house. May help keep our upstairs cooler blowing heat out and drawing cool
>> air up from downstairs. Laying the duct to the floor should cause down
>> draft and get any potential airborne bugs out of the air.
>>
>> I'm thinking if I run humidifiers it should give any covid creatures
>> something weighty to attach to.
>>
>> My 15 year old opted to go stay with my neice because I gave him and the
>> 12 year old girl the current known political statistics and let them define
>> their own risk tolerance. If wife doesnt get symptomatic I'm letting him go
>> through with his baptism Sunday since he wont be exposed when she would
>> become contagious. But then again, church is the only place it spreads.
>>
>> The girl opted to stay
>>
>>  The two littles dont have brain pan capacity to decide, since neither of
>> them talk yet.
>>
>> The fat baby is still on boob juice and CDC and who political
>> recommendations are to continue breast feeding but for mom to wear a
>> mask... odd to see common sense prevail from either of those places.
>>
>> Probably making a poor choice somewhere in all this but when you're
>> offered the option of a shit sandwich or a turd burger, the outcomes wont
>> be all that different.
>>
>>
>>
>> Boss was pretty cool, we are on the same page as far as risk exposure and
>> mitigation at work. This wont be her last exposure at work, though I hope
>> it's the last high risk one. And if she does test positive, then we dont
>> have to worry about them anymore. If I catch it and dont croak out then we
>> are riding on the golden ticket. We are both smokers and apparently this
>> particular disease that's a good thing since the vascular impact is
>> mitigated by our constant constriction, no covid toe for us.
>>
>>
>>
>> Looked like a hypochondriac at the store stocking up on vitamins for 3
>> age ranges and normal cold/flu meds for 3 age ranges. Learning a ton about
>> vitamin D, C, potassium and Zinc tolerances. This sucks because something
>> in multivitamins cause me to get tinitus so the ringing will start here in
>> a couple days. But at least we will walk away in the habit of adjuncting
>> with vitamins. Probably something we should have been doing all along.
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm guessing if I werent treating this like any disaster mitigation at
>> work I'd be freaking out like the wife. Hopefully I dont get to the point I
>> have it handled and have time to sit and think. Might result in a bit of a
>> brain bubble.
>>
>>
>>
>> Going to find out shortly just how accurate the "experts" are. Should be
>> an interesting week. According to CNN, since we are a right leaning
>> household, we are all going to die because of our guns.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 6, 2020, 11:34 PM Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>>
>> This guy is a definite initial false negative. It technically wasn't an
>> initial rule out, it was a confirmation test, that's why the doc
>> immediately ordered second test. Since my initial post there's been a lot
>> of policy activity at the facility. A lot of staff exposure occurred.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 6, 2020, 4:56 PM Matt Hoppes <
>> mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net> wrote:
>>
>> Keep in mind that that could be a false positive as well there are a lot
>> of both false negatives and false positives on the test. Unless they
>> perform several more tests you will never 

Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[Bill Prince]

  
  
Around here, we call that the midnight chainsaw blight.


bp

On 9/9/2020 9:44 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com
  wrote:


  
  
  
  
  

  Chain saws.
  

   
  
From: David Coudron 
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 10:22 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users
Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space
  

 
  
  

  We looked at this, and it still may
be something we need to consider.   I am afraid that LOS
sensitive frequencies still wouldn’t reach some of them
that are less than 1 mile away due to trees.   A good
alternative might be to have them put up 60-70 ft
antenna structures.   That would help with the trees on
their property and close by.   
   
  Regards,
   
  David Coudron
  

  From: AF
 On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:25 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

  
   
  

  
Get them to contribute to the cost
of a tower in their area.  
  
  

  
 
  
  

  From: David Coudron 


  Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:52
  AM


  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 


  Subject: [AFMUG] TV White Space

  


   

  
  
We
have a couple of areas in our network that
remain problem coverage areas.   The typical
scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10
miles from a decent tower structure, but really
want service.   We have usually either passed on
providing coverage, or messed around with
relaying from other customers or some other
messy scenario.   We are looking for a workable
non-los solution for these few spots.   We don’t
need to get dozens of folks on a tower, and a
higher than normal cost is OK, but it needs to
be stable enough it is better than the relays
and other messy solutions we have come up
with.   We keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks
like Cambium is the only one left in this game,
and we are pretty worried about noise as we are
in the middle of farm country and the RTK stuff
is pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough
experience with TV white space to develop an
opinion on its ability to be used in this
situation?   There only seems to be two vendors
in this space, Redline and Carlson, but maybe
there are others we are missing.   We are
looking for a solution that would cover
customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with
rate plans of 20-25 Mbps.   Is this possible?
 
Regards,
 
David
Coudron


  
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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[Ken Hohhof]

Everything is 5-6 times as big at 900 MHz, and a 10 degree sector is probably 
not realistic.  You would probably have to use a client antenna and get maybe 
35-40 degrees and the sidelobes and F/B ratio would not be great.  Also 
remember that EIRP in this band is strictly limited, I think to 36 dBm, you are 
not supposed to use antenna gain to exceed this.  You can use it to increase 
rcv signal and avoid off-axis interference though.

 

Probably just figure on using a sector in the 65-120 degree range.

 

Back in the single pol days you could maybe have used a Paraflector.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of David Coudron
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 11:20 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

Hi folks,

 

Thanks for the feedback, this was what we were looking for.   It looks like the 
TVWS is a non-starter, but we should take another  look at 900 MHz.   We are 
fortunate in that the areas are typically grouped very narrowly in one 
direction.  We figured we could cover the area with a 10 degree sector if we 
could find one that narrow.   We’ll see what we can find for 900 MHz equipment 
out there.

 

Thanks,

 

David Coudron

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 10:43 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

Oops, 26 MHz, not 28.  902-928.

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:50 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

I keep hearing about Microsoft and its Airband initiative.  I have no idea why 
Microsoft thinks that TVWS has merit or what technology they bring to the 
party, but I guess you could investigate it.  I have to agree with the others, 
it was never very attractive, and gets less so as time passes and people want 
to do video streaming and Zoom meetings and download 100 GB games over the 
Internet, and as other technologies advance.

 

I would also ask, what if Starlink actually works, and is months away from 
general availability.  It may not be a threat to WISPs in general (or maybe it 
is), but it would seem to solve this particular problem.  And what if Starlink 
succeeds in getting RDOF or CAF subsidy money?  Wouldn’t you just be lighting 
hundred dollar bills on fire?

 

As far as 900 MHz, we stopped using it.  The reason wasn’t so much RTK (a lot 
of which is moving to 450 MHz anyway), but smartgrid and smartmeters.  If the 
power company or other utilities put in 900 MHz smartmeters, kiss 900 MHz 
goodbye for broadband.  The other problem was that it was always more art than 
science, sometimes it wouldn’t work and the reasons wouldn’t be clear.  It’s 
touch to plan or troubleshoot when, by definition, you don’t have clear line of 
sight.  There’s also the issue of other WISPs in 900 MHz, but it sounds like 
you wouldn’t have this issue.

 

But the Cambium 450 900 MHz stuff does work, and even though you only have 28 
MHz total to work with, you can use a wide enough channel to get decent speeds. 
 We still have one AP in service with a handful of customers on it.  I would 
steer clear of 900 MHz omni antennas though.  If you can’t justify sectors, 
just don’t do it.

 

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Bill Prince
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:28 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com  
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

If they are in a cluster, this could possibly be a viable option.

 

bp


On 9/9/2020 7:25 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com   wrote:

Get them to contribute to the cost of a tower in their area.  

 

From: David Coudron 

Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:52 AM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage areas.   
The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles from a 
decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually either 
passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from other 
customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a workable non-los 
solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get dozens of folks on a 
tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it needs to be stable enough it 
is better than the relays and other messy solutions we have come up with.   We 
keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks like Cambium is the only one left in this 
game, and we are pretty worried about noise as we are in the middle of farm 
country and the RTK stuff is pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough 
experience with TV white space to develop an opinion on its ability to be used 
in this situation?   There only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline 
and Carlson, but maybe there are others we are missing.  

Re: [AFMUG] Need a "Chuck" version of this

[chuck]

TVS, so it may not work well with cambium.  

And you have to make sure that the jack is the shielded grounded variety or 
this will do nothing.
Moreover, it is best to route the surge away from the equipment, not depend on 
the equipment to ground the surge.  

I have tried these little TVS chips they use for these things.  They do work.  
I am more of a believer that you want gas tube protection now-a-days.  

From: can...@believewireless.net 
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 10:42 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] Need a "Chuck" version of this

Saw this recently posted on FB. I like the concept but would prefer an external 
ground point.
I'd be curious to see Chuck test these. I don't think he could fit all of his 
electrical goodness
into a connector this small.

https://www.amazon.com/WatchfulEyE-WTH-SG-RJ45-S-Ethernet-Protector/dp/B07H5PWWQ1




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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[Lewis Bergman]

Make sure your utility or water company does not use unlicensed 900 in your
area if you decide to go this route. You won't interfere with them but
their high power small bandwidth bursting will destroy everything you try
to do.

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 11:20 AM David Coudron 
wrote:

> Hi folks,
>
>
>
> Thanks for the feedback, this was what we were looking for.   It looks
> like the TVWS is a non-starter, but we should take another  look at 900
> MHz.   We are fortunate in that the areas are typically grouped very
> narrowly in one direction.  We figured we could cover the area with a 10
> degree sector if we could find one that narrow.   We’ll see what we can
> find for 900 MHz equipment out there.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
>
> David Coudron
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 10:43 AM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space
>
>
>
> Oops, 26 MHz, not 28.  902-928.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:50 AM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space
>
>
>
> I keep hearing about Microsoft and its Airband initiative.  I have no idea
> why Microsoft thinks that TVWS has merit or what technology they bring to
> the party, but I guess you could investigate it.  I have to agree with the
> others, it was never very attractive, and gets less so as time passes and
> people want to do video streaming and Zoom meetings and download 100 GB
> games over the Internet, and as other technologies advance.
>
>
>
> I would also ask, what if Starlink actually works, and is months away from
> general availability.  It may not be a threat to WISPs in general (or maybe
> it is), but it would seem to solve this particular problem.  And what if
> Starlink succeeds in getting RDOF or CAF subsidy money?  Wouldn’t you just
> be lighting hundred dollar bills on fire?
>
>
>
> As far as 900 MHz, we stopped using it.  The reason wasn’t so much RTK (a
> lot of which is moving to 450 MHz anyway), but smartgrid and smartmeters.
> If the power company or other utilities put in 900 MHz smartmeters, kiss
> 900 MHz goodbye for broadband.  The other problem was that it was always
> more art than science, sometimes it wouldn’t work and the reasons wouldn’t
> be clear.  It’s touch to plan or troubleshoot when, by definition, you
> don’t have clear line of sight.  There’s also the issue of other WISPs in
> 900 MHz, but it sounds like you wouldn’t have this issue.
>
>
>
> But the Cambium 450 900 MHz stuff does work, and even though you only have
> 28 MHz total to work with, you can use a wide enough channel to get decent
> speeds.  We still have one AP in service with a handful of customers on
> it.  I would steer clear of 900 MHz omni antennas though.  If you can’t
> justify sectors, just don’t do it.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Bill Prince
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:28 AM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space
>
>
>
> If they are in a cluster, this could possibly be a viable option.
>
>
>
> bp
>
> 
>
> On 9/9/2020 7:25 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>
> Get them to contribute to the cost of a tower in their area.
>
>
>
> *From:* David Coudron
>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:52 AM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] TV White Space
>
>
>
> We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage
> areas.   The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles
> from a decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually
> either passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from
> other customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a
> workable non-los solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get
> dozens of folks on a tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it
> needs to be stable enough it is better than the relays and other messy
> solutions we have come up with.   We keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks
> like Cambium is the only one left in this game, and we are pretty worried
> about noise as we are in the middle of farm country and the RTK stuff is
> pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough experience with TV white space to
> develop an opinion on its ability to be used in this situation?   There
> only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline and Carlson, but maybe
> there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a solution that would
> cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate plans of 20-25
> Mbps.   Is this possible?
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> David Coudron
> --
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>


-- 
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325-439-0533 Cell
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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[chuck]

Chain saws.

From: David Coudron 
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 10:22 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

We looked at this, and it still may be something we need to consider.   I am 
afraid that LOS sensitive frequencies still wouldn’t reach some of them that 
are less than 1 mile away due to trees.   A good alternative might be to have 
them put up 60-70 ft antenna structures.   That would help with the trees on 
their property and close by.   

 

Regards,

 

David Coudron

From: AF  On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:25 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

Get them to contribute to the cost of a tower in their area.  

 

From: David Coudron 

Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:52 AM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage areas.   
The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles from a 
decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually either 
passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from other 
customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a workable non-los 
solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get dozens of folks on a 
tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it needs to be stable enough it 
is better than the relays and other messy solutions we have come up with.   We 
keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks like Cambium is the only one left in this 
game, and we are pretty worried about noise as we are in the middle of farm 
country and the RTK stuff is pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough 
experience with TV white space to develop an opinion on its ability to be used 
in this situation?   There only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline 
and Carlson, but maybe there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a 
solution that would cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate 
plans of 20-25 Mbps.   Is this possible?

 

Regards,

 

David Coudron




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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[chuck]

Towers are cheap.  

From: David Coudron 
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 10:19 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

Hi folks,

 

Thanks for the feedback, this was what we were looking for.   It looks like the 
TVWS is a non-starter, but we should take another  look at 900 MHz.   We are 
fortunate in that the areas are typically grouped very narrowly in one 
direction.  We figured we could cover the area with a 10 degree sector if we 
could find one that narrow.   We’ll see what we can find for 900 MHz equipment 
out there.

 

Thanks,

 

David Coudron

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 10:43 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

Oops, 26 MHz, not 28.  902-928.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:50 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

I keep hearing about Microsoft and its Airband initiative.  I have no idea why 
Microsoft thinks that TVWS has merit or what technology they bring to the 
party, but I guess you could investigate it.  I have to agree with the others, 
it was never very attractive, and gets less so as time passes and people want 
to do video streaming and Zoom meetings and download 100 GB games over the 
Internet, and as other technologies advance.

 

I would also ask, what if Starlink actually works, and is months away from 
general availability.  It may not be a threat to WISPs in general (or maybe it 
is), but it would seem to solve this particular problem.  And what if Starlink 
succeeds in getting RDOF or CAF subsidy money?  Wouldn’t you just be lighting 
hundred dollar bills on fire?

 

As far as 900 MHz, we stopped using it.  The reason wasn’t so much RTK (a lot 
of which is moving to 450 MHz anyway), but smartgrid and smartmeters.  If the 
power company or other utilities put in 900 MHz smartmeters, kiss 900 MHz 
goodbye for broadband.  The other problem was that it was always more art than 
science, sometimes it wouldn’t work and the reasons wouldn’t be clear.  It’s 
touch to plan or troubleshoot when, by definition, you don’t have clear line of 
sight.  There’s also the issue of other WISPs in 900 MHz, but it sounds like 
you wouldn’t have this issue.

 

But the Cambium 450 900 MHz stuff does work, and even though you only have 28 
MHz total to work with, you can use a wide enough channel to get decent speeds. 
 We still have one AP in service with a handful of customers on it.  I would 
steer clear of 900 MHz omni antennas though.  If you can’t justify sectors, 
just don’t do it.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Bill Prince
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:28 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

If they are in a cluster, this could possibly be a viable option.

 

bpOn 9/9/2020 7:25 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

  Get them to contribute to the cost of a tower in their area.  

   

  From: David Coudron 

  Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:52 AM

  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

  Subject: [AFMUG] TV White Space

   

  We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage areas.  
 The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles from a 
decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually either 
passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from other 
customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a workable non-los 
solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get dozens of folks on a 
tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it needs to be stable enough it 
is better than the relays and other messy solutions we have come up with.   We 
keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks like Cambium is the only one left in this 
game, and we are pretty worried about noise as we are in the middle of farm 
country and the RTK stuff is pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough 
experience with TV white space to develop an opinion on its ability to be used 
in this situation?   There only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline 
and Carlson, but maybe there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a 
solution that would cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate 
plans of 20-25 Mbps.   Is this possible?

   

  Regards,

   

  David Coudron


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[AFMUG] Need a "Chuck" version of this

[can...@believewireless.net]

Saw this recently posted on FB. I like the concept but would prefer an
external ground point.
I'd be curious to see Chuck test these. I don't think he could fit all of
his electrical goodness
into a connector this small.

https://www.amazon.com/WatchfulEyE-WTH-SG-RJ45-S-Ethernet-Protector/dp/B07H5PWWQ1
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Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

[Steve Jones]

theyre doing the 15 minute rapid test at a few sites around here.

You arent supposed to be getting charged for the tests, unless you do some
sort of self insuring, in which case most people just dont give any info
other than contact info so nobody gets charged
with the wife guaranteed to be exposes every week or so, we are just going
to test if a symptom appears or if we are planning on going somewhere

This hospital amazes me, the doctors are all telling them they need to do
their rapid test on all admissions, but they dont want to have to carry the
testing supplies for that capacity. we dont have a shortage of tests in any
way shape or form now, its a point where facilities are just hedging bets
they will only infect a small percentage of staff and patients. its
irritating to know theres rapid tests sitting idle all across the country
because hospital administrators are idiots.


On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 10:01 AM  wrote:

> We had one employee, all the symptoms.  Got a test, got results back  in
> about 4 hours $100  Not positive.  I was astounded they turned it around
> that fast.
>
> *From:* Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 8:58 AM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world
>
>
> Yeah, it’s like the colleges that invite all the kids on campus then after
> a week send them back home all over the country when (surprise, surprise)
> they get a bunch of positive tests.  Fauci is trying to tell them at that
> point they’re doing the worst thing, once they’re on campus, keep them
> there, maybe isolate the sick ones.  But don’t send them back home to
> spread the virus.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 8, 2020 11:23 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world
>
>
>
> so, the wife ended up not catching it, a couple nurses did. in the last
> couple weeks shes had 2 more exposures from the same nonsense. we arent
> going into lockdown every time anymore, just notifying everybody and
> wearing masks for two weeks even though they dont do anything (purely an
> issue of criminal liability).
>
>
>
> Last saturday my piece of shit brother in law dropped his kid off to us,
> didnt bother to mention to us that he (the brother) had been sick for a
> couple days and lost his sense of taste. we went to a family gathering with
> the nephew. the brothers gf test came back postive on sunday (another thing
> he didnt mention. so of course everybody at the family function went on
> lock down. the nephew had only been at his dads since friday and was never
> around the gf. he hadnt been exposed long enough to spread it, the
> likelyhood of contact contamination of clothing is near zero. But we
> reported to everybody who was there, my cousins kids couldnt go back to
> school til the boy had a negative test, etc.
>
>
>
> the three year old came back negative, everybody was good.
>
>
>
> The brother in law tested positive on monday.
>
>
>
> no big deal
>
>
>
> til he tells my wife hes having a covid party, him, his gf, and a few of
> their friends who are positive. Not a huge deal, except they have my 3 year
> old nephew there, who WAS negative.
>
>
>
> This is the nonsense that makes this ting and issue, people willfully
> putting others at risk and doing unneccessarily risky things (ill guarantee
> some in this group have been at the bar in the last week). Theyre all on
> public health 10 day quarantines, but out in public fucking around, (FYI,
> these fuckwits arent even the Trump supporting rednecks everybody is
> probably envisioning, theyre literal BLM activists who have been
> indoctrinating my brother in law)
>
>
>
> this doesnt have to be this way
>
>
>
> just venting, cause the alternative is dropping this here magazine in the
> well and heading over for a discussion resulting in a few more covid
> deaths. Debating on going full karen and calling DCFS
>
>
>
> On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 1:45 PM James Howard  wrote:
>
> That’s actually our intention with our basement garage.  We’ve been
> telling the kids we plan to put a basketball hoop down there.  We’ve just
> never succeeded in getting out all the stuff that ended up down there when
> we moved in.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Seth Mattinen
> *Sent:* Friday, August 7, 2020 12:07 PM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world
>
>
>
> On 8/7/20 09:54, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> > I was going to add an apartment to a second story but decided to leave
> > that off.  We have an obscene amount of house.
>
>
> I want to use it as a place where the kids can GTFO to and not be in the
> main house making a mess. Previous owners used it as a gym.
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> --
>
> *Total Control Panel*

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Cobra Kai

[Ken Hohhof]

I saw a newspaper article about sports anime.  Pushing just beyond what's
humanly possible in real life, without suspending laws of physics like
gravity.

-Original Message-
From: AF  On Behalf Of Jay Weekley
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 10:54 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Cobra Kai

My thoughts too. I'm sure I'm not the only person that was wondering where
the pads and mouth guards were.  But, I'm enjoying it otherwise if only to
relive the 80's.

Adam Moffett wrote:
> I was wondering where they put teenagers into full contact karate 
> tournaments.  Surely not in the USA, land of the lawsuit.
>
> On 9/8/2020 6:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
>> The karate is pretty bad and it seems like students are going from 
>> white belts to black and back again.
>>
>> Steve Jones wrote:
>>> I watched episode one out of nostalgia, figured it would be a lame 
>>> reboot, we ended up watching both seasons, my daughter even put down 
>>> her phone. Turns out danielsan is a real dickhead. I do take issue 
>>> with black belts being obtained in a couple months, Thats kind of 
>>> insulting to people who worked their way up. I never progressed past 
>>> the white. I dont think I got past stance. i like the mix of footage 
>>> from the original movie, didnt realize it had gotten up to 4 movies 
>>> plus the one with will smiths kid,
>>>
>>> Seeing things through others eyes i think is mor understandable to 
>>> older generations. I always thought I was bullied in high school, 
>>> but as i got older and ran into people who were on my peripheral in 
>>> HS they tell me they were afraid of me because i bullied people.
>>> looking back I see how it could be taken that way, my bullying was 
>>> with words and little violence, but it appears that lasts a whole 
>>> lot longer.
>>>
>>> Will be really cool if this bursts a resurgence in interest in 
>>> martial arts, not UFC. I dont think karen will let her kid be kicked 
>>> though.
>>>
>>> I had a baseball coach that turned nice kids into assholes so i 
>>> could see a contact sport coach/sensei having more impact.
>>>
>>> Cant wait for season 3
>>>
>>> On Tue, Sep 8, 2020 at 3:52 PM Adam Moffett >> > wrote:
>>>
>>> I got through season 1 of Cobra Kai on Neflix over the long
>>> weekend.  I expected a corny reboot of an 80's franchise...but
>>> it's quite a bit smarter than that.
>>>
>>> Likes:
>>>
>>> Reviewing the Karate Kid story through the eyes of the
>>> antagonist.  Danny Larusso was certainly not blameless in that
>>> story.  The other guy's perspective is worth considering.
>>>
>>> The role reversals.  Johnny Lawrence was the typical teen movie
>>> antagonist in Karate Kid.  A selfish, affluent jock. Danny Laruso
>>> was the poor, nice guy, underdog.  The series starts with Danny as
>>> the afluent, selfish, jerk and Johnny as a poor//underdog. Except
>>> really I think we see that everyone is capable of being both the
>>> nice guy and the jerk.  Episode by episode each of them plays
>>> protagonist and antagonist in turn.
>>>
>>> Maybe a spoiler, but the "Cobra Kai" style of no nonsense, no
>>> quitting, no being a pussy, no being afraid is shown to elevate
>>> some nerdy kids into being able to stand up for themselves. By
>>> the end of the season some of them have turned it up to 11 and
>>> gone all the way to being bullies themselves.  I like these
>>> perspective shifts. Sometimes we're each the bully or the bullied,
>>> and I think that's worth being reminded of.
>>>
>>>
>>> Dislikes:
>>>
>>> I'm not a sociologist or anything, but I question whether the mean
>>> drill sergeant karate teacher can really turn nice kids into
>>> assholes and the nice guy teacher can turn a delinquent into a
>>> nice guy in the course of a few months.
>>>
>>> Some melodrama.  Like over the top soap-opera situations. That
>>> stuff makes me cringe and shake my head as I ponder the odds of it
>>> ever happening.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -- AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com 
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>

--
*Jay Weekley*
*Cyber Broadband
*

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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[David Coudron]

We looked at this, and it still may be something we need to consider.   I am 
afraid that LOS sensitive frequencies still wouldn’t reach some of them that 
are less than 1 mile away due to trees.   A good alternative might be to have 
them put up 60-70 ft antenna structures.   That would help with the trees on 
their property and close by.

Regards,

David Coudron
From: AF  On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:25 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

Get them to contribute to the cost of a tower in their area.

From: David Coudron
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:52 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: [AFMUG] TV White Space

We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage areas.   
The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles from a 
decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually either 
passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from other 
customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a workable non-los 
solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get dozens of folks on a 
tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it needs to be stable enough it 
is better than the relays and other messy solutions we have come up with.   We 
keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks like Cambium is the only one left in this 
game, and we are pretty worried about noise as we are in the middle of farm 
country and the RTK stuff is pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough 
experience with TV white space to develop an opinion on its ability to be used 
in this situation?   There only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline 
and Carlson, but maybe there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a 
solution that would cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate 
plans of 20-25 Mbps.   Is this possible?

Regards,

David Coudron

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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Jay Fuller turns 50 today?

[Bill Prince]

  
  
See? I thought that birdie was wrong!
Happy birthday anyway Jay!


bp

On 9/9/2020 9:12 AM, CBB - Jay Fuller
  wrote:


  
  
  
   
  Thanks for the assumptionsit's 43.
  I did ask my wife if i could stop having birthdays.
  she said that would be very badno.
  so, here's to more!
   
  thanks everyone.
   
  it's been a crazy rockin' and rolling time
  at our company lately.
  We've been awarded 3 state grants to help
  deploy fiber.
  Also we've been participating in a CARES
  act program to deploy broadband using our existing service.
  We've taken like 300 orders in 2 days.
   
  I was supposed to take off this week for
  my birthday.
  Instead it has been postponed by two
  weeks.
  :)
   
   
  
- Original Message - 
From: Jay Weekley 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group

Sent: Tuesday, September 8,
  2020 2:25 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT:
  Jay Fuller turns 50 today?


I think it's higher than that.

Mike Hammett wrote:
> 50?! Holy cow, that's old!
>
>
>
>
> ;-)
>
>
>
> Yes, I know many, many of you are much older. I jab
equally.  :-)
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> >
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> >
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
>

> *From: *"Bill Prince" 
> *To: *"AFMUG" 
> *Sent: *Tuesday, September 8, 2020 1:16:09 PM
> *Subject: *[AFMUG] OT: Jay Fuller turns 50 today?
>
>
> A birdie told me that today is Jay Fuller's 50th birthday.
The birdie is
> just a birdie, so don't blame me if I'm wrong.
>
>
>
> -- 
> bp
> 
>
>
> -- 
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>

-- 
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*Cyber Broadband
*

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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[David Coudron]

Hi folks,

Thanks for the feedback, this was what we were looking for.   It looks like the 
TVWS is a non-starter, but we should take another  look at 900 MHz.   We are 
fortunate in that the areas are typically grouped very narrowly in one 
direction.  We figured we could cover the area with a 10 degree sector if we 
could find one that narrow.   We’ll see what we can find for 900 MHz equipment 
out there.

Thanks,

David Coudron

From: AF  On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 10:43 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

Oops, 26 MHz, not 28.  902-928.

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:50 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

I keep hearing about Microsoft and its Airband initiative.  I have no idea why 
Microsoft thinks that TVWS has merit or what technology they bring to the 
party, but I guess you could investigate it.  I have to agree with the others, 
it was never very attractive, and gets less so as time passes and people want 
to do video streaming and Zoom meetings and download 100 GB games over the 
Internet, and as other technologies advance.

I would also ask, what if Starlink actually works, and is months away from 
general availability.  It may not be a threat to WISPs in general (or maybe it 
is), but it would seem to solve this particular problem.  And what if Starlink 
succeeds in getting RDOF or CAF subsidy money?  Wouldn’t you just be lighting 
hundred dollar bills on fire?

As far as 900 MHz, we stopped using it.  The reason wasn’t so much RTK (a lot 
of which is moving to 450 MHz anyway), but smartgrid and smartmeters.  If the 
power company or other utilities put in 900 MHz smartmeters, kiss 900 MHz 
goodbye for broadband.  The other problem was that it was always more art than 
science, sometimes it wouldn’t work and the reasons wouldn’t be clear.  It’s 
touch to plan or troubleshoot when, by definition, you don’t have clear line of 
sight.  There’s also the issue of other WISPs in 900 MHz, but it sounds like 
you wouldn’t have this issue.

But the Cambium 450 900 MHz stuff does work, and even though you only have 28 
MHz total to work with, you can use a wide enough channel to get decent speeds. 
 We still have one AP in service with a handful of customers on it.  I would 
steer clear of 900 MHz omni antennas though.  If you can’t justify sectors, 
just don’t do it.


From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Bill Prince
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:28 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space


If they are in a cluster, this could possibly be a viable option.



bp


On 9/9/2020 7:25 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
Get them to contribute to the cost of a tower in their area.

From: David Coudron
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:52 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: [AFMUG] TV White Space

We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage areas.   
The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles from a 
decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually either 
passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from other 
customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a workable non-los 
solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get dozens of folks on a 
tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it needs to be stable enough it 
is better than the relays and other messy solutions we have come up with.   We 
keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks like Cambium is the only one left in this 
game, and we are pretty worried about noise as we are in the middle of farm 
country and the RTK stuff is pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough 
experience with TV white space to develop an opinion on its ability to be used 
in this situation?   There only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline 
and Carlson, but maybe there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a 
solution that would cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate 
plans of 20-25 Mbps.   Is this possible?

Regards,

David Coudron

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[AFMUG] ***SPAM*** Re: ***SPAM*** Re: [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

[Robert Andrews]

My friend said that you have the kind of turn around that is necessary 
for these tests to do _any_ good.  So at least if there is a positive it 
can be acted on immediately.


On 09/09/2020 08:49 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

Nasal.  Actually he described it as a brain swab.

-Original Message- From: Robert Andrews
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:33 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] ***SPAM*** Re: [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real 
world


Which test did he take?  Nasal swap, throat swap, blood?

On 09/09/2020 08:00 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
We had one employee, all the symptoms.  Got a test, got results back  
in about 4 hours $100  Not positive.  I was astounded they turned it 
around that fast.

*From:* Ken Hohhof
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 8:58 AM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

Yeah, it’s like the colleges that invite all the kids on campus then 
after a week send them back home all over the country when (surprise, 
surprise) they get a bunch of positive tests.  Fauci is trying to tell 
them at that point they’re doing the worst thing, once they’re on 
campus, keep them there, maybe isolate the sick ones.  But don’t send 
them back home to spread the virus.


*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
*Sent:* Tuesday, September 8, 2020 11:23 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

so, the wife ended up not catching it, a couple nurses did. in the 
last couple weeks shes had 2 more exposures from the same nonsense. we 
arent going into lockdown every time anymore, just notifying everybody 
and wearing masks for two weeks even though they dont do anything 
(purely an issue of criminal liability).


Last saturday my piece of shit brother in law dropped his kid off to 
us, didnt bother to mention to us that he (the brother) had been sick 
for a couple days and lost his sense of taste. we went to a family 
gathering with the nephew. the brothers gf test came back postive on 
sunday (another thing he didnt mention. so of course everybody at the 
family function went on lock down. the nephew had only been at his 
dads since friday and was never around the gf. he hadnt been exposed 
long enough to spread it, the likelyhood of contact contamination of 
clothing is near zero. But we reported to everybody who was there, my 
cousins kids couldnt go back to school til the boy had a negative 
test, etc.


the three year old came back negative, everybody was good.

The brother in law tested positive on monday.

no big deal

til he tells my wife hes having a covid party, him, his gf, and a few 
of their friends who are positive. Not a huge deal, except they have 
my 3 year old nephew there, who WAS negative.


This is the nonsense that makes this ting and issue, people willfully 
putting others at risk and doing unneccessarily risky things (ill 
guarantee some in this group have been at the bar in the last week). 
Theyre all on public health 10 day quarantines, but out in public 
fucking around, (FYI, these fuckwits arent even the Trump supporting 
rednecks everybody is probably envisioning, theyre literal BLM 
activists who have been indoctrinating my brother in law)


this doesnt have to be this way

just venting, cause the alternative is dropping this here magazine in 
the well and heading over for a discussion resulting in a few more 
covid deaths. Debating on going full karen and calling DCFS


On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 1:45 PM James Howard  wrote:

That’s actually our intention with our basement garage.  We’ve been
telling the kids we plan to put a basketball hoop down there.  We’ve
just never succeeded in getting out all the stuff that ended up down
there when we moved in.

*From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Seth 
Mattinen

*Sent:* Friday, August 7, 2020 12:07 PM
*To:* af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

On 8/7/20 09:54, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
 > I was going to add an apartment to a second story but decided to
leave
 > that off.  We have an obscene amount of house.


I want to use it as a place where the kids can GTFO to and not be in
the
main house making a mess. Previous owners used it as a gym.

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http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com





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Login 

To: ja...@litewire.net

 



From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com


/You received this message because the domain afmug.com
 is on your allow list./

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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Jay Fuller turns 50 today?

[CBB - Jay Fuller]

Thanks for the assumptionsit's 43.
I did ask my wife if i could stop having birthdays.
she said that would be very badno.
so, here's to more!

thanks everyone.

it's been a crazy rockin' and rolling time at our company lately.
We've been awarded 3 state grants to help deploy fiber.
Also we've been participating in a CARES act program to deploy broadband using 
our existing service.
We've taken like 300 orders in 2 days.

I was supposed to take off this week for my birthday.
Instead it has been postponed by two weeks.
:)


  - Original Message - 
  From: Jay Weekley 
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 8, 2020 2:25 PM
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Jay Fuller turns 50 today?


  I think it's higher than that.

  Mike Hammett wrote:
  > 50?! Holy cow, that's old!
  >
  >
  >
  >
  > ;-)
  >
  >
  >
  > Yes, I know many, many of you are much older. I jab equally.  :-)
  >
  >
  >
  > -
  > Mike Hammett
  > Intelligent Computing Solutions 
  > 

  > Midwest Internet Exchange 
  > 

  > The Brothers WISP 
  > 
  >
  >
  > 
  > 
  > *From: *"Bill Prince" 
  > *To: *"AFMUG" 
  > *Sent: *Tuesday, September 8, 2020 1:16:09 PM
  > *Subject: *[AFMUG] OT: Jay Fuller turns 50 today?
  >
  >
  > A birdie told me that today is Jay Fuller's 50th birthday. The birdie is
  > just a birdie, so don't blame me if I'm wrong.
  >
  >
  >
  > -- 
  > bp
  > 
  >
  >
  > -- 
  > AF mailing list
  > AF@af.afmug.com
  > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
  >
  >
  >

  -- 
  *Jay Weekley*
  *Cyber Broadband
  *

  -- 
  This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
  https://www.avg.com


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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Cobra Kai

[Jay Weekley]

My thoughts too. I'm sure I'm not the only person that was wondering 
where the pads and mouth guards were.  But, I'm enjoying it otherwise if 
only to relive the 80's.


Adam Moffett wrote:
I was wondering where they put teenagers into full contact karate 
tournaments.  Surely not in the USA, land of the lawsuit.


On 9/8/2020 6:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
The karate is pretty bad and it seems like students are going from 
white belts to black and back again.


Steve Jones wrote:
I watched episode one out of nostalgia, figured it would be a lame 
reboot, we ended up watching both seasons, my daughter even put down 
her phone. Turns out danielsan is a real dickhead. I do take issue 
with black belts being obtained in a couple months, Thats kind of 
insulting to people who worked their way up. I never progressed past 
the white. I dont think I got past stance. i like the mix of footage 
from the original movie, didnt realize it had gotten up to 4 movies 
plus the one with will smiths kid,


Seeing things through others eyes i think is mor understandable to 
older generations. I always thought I was bullied in high school, 
but as i got older and ran into people who were on my peripheral in 
HS they tell me they were afraid of me because i bullied people. 
looking back I see how it could be taken that way, my bullying was 
with words and little violence, but it appears that lasts a whole 
lot longer.


Will be really cool if this bursts a resurgence in interest in 
martial arts, not UFC. I dont think karen will let her kid be kicked 
though.


I had a baseball coach that turned nice kids into assholes so i 
could see a contact sport coach/sensei having more impact.


Cant wait for season 3

On Tue, Sep 8, 2020 at 3:52 PM Adam Moffett > wrote:


I got through season 1 of Cobra Kai on Neflix over the long
weekend.  I expected a corny reboot of an 80's franchise...but
it's quite a bit smarter than that.

Likes:

Reviewing the Karate Kid story through the eyes of the
antagonist.  Danny Larusso was certainly not blameless in that
story.  The other guy's perspective is worth considering.

The role reversals.  Johnny Lawrence was the typical teen movie
antagonist in Karate Kid.  A selfish, affluent jock. Danny Laruso
was the poor, nice guy, underdog.  The series starts with Danny as
the afluent, selfish, jerk and Johnny as a poor//underdog. Except
really I think we see that everyone is capable of being both the
nice guy and the jerk.  Episode by episode each of them plays
protagonist and antagonist in turn.

Maybe a spoiler, but the "Cobra Kai" style of no nonsense, no
quitting, no being a pussy, no being afraid is shown to elevate
some nerdy kids into being able to stand up for themselves. By
the end of the season some of them have turned it up to 11 and
gone all the way to being bullies themselves.  I like these
perspective shifts. Sometimes we're each the bully or the bullied,
and I think that's worth being reminded of.


Dislikes:

I'm not a sociologist or anything, but I question whether the mean
drill sergeant karate teacher can really turn nice kids into
assholes and the nice guy teacher can turn a delinquent into a
nice guy in the course of a few months.

Some melodrama.  Like over the top soap-opera situations. That
stuff makes me cringe and shake my head as I ponder the odds of it
ever happening.



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--
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*Cyber Broadband
*

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Re: [AFMUG] ***SPAM*** Re: [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

[chuck]

Nasal.  Actually he described it as a brain swab.

-Original Message- 
From: Robert Andrews

Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:33 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] ***SPAM*** Re: [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

Which test did he take?  Nasal swap, throat swap, blood?

On 09/09/2020 08:00 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
We had one employee, all the symptoms.  Got a test, got results back  in 
about 4 hours $100  Not positive.  I was astounded they turned it around 
that fast.

*From:* Ken Hohhof
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 8:58 AM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

Yeah, it’s like the colleges that invite all the kids on campus then after 
a week send them back home all over the country when (surprise, surprise) 
they get a bunch of positive tests.  Fauci is trying to tell them at that 
point they’re doing the worst thing, once they’re on campus, keep them 
there, maybe isolate the sick ones.  But don’t send them back home to 
spread the virus.


*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
*Sent:* Tuesday, September 8, 2020 11:23 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

so, the wife ended up not catching it, a couple nurses did. in the last 
couple weeks shes had 2 more exposures from the same nonsense. we arent 
going into lockdown every time anymore, just notifying everybody and 
wearing masks for two weeks even though they dont do anything (purely an 
issue of criminal liability).


Last saturday my piece of shit brother in law dropped his kid off to us, 
didnt bother to mention to us that he (the brother) had been sick for a 
couple days and lost his sense of taste. we went to a family gathering 
with the nephew. the brothers gf test came back postive on sunday (another 
thing he didnt mention. so of course everybody at the family function went 
on lock down. the nephew had only been at his dads since friday and was 
never around the gf. he hadnt been exposed long enough to spread it, the 
likelyhood of contact contamination of clothing is near zero. But we 
reported to everybody who was there, my cousins kids couldnt go back to 
school til the boy had a negative test, etc.


the three year old came back negative, everybody was good.

The brother in law tested positive on monday.

no big deal

til he tells my wife hes having a covid party, him, his gf, and a few of 
their friends who are positive. Not a huge deal, except they have my 3 
year old nephew there, who WAS negative.


This is the nonsense that makes this ting and issue, people willfully 
putting others at risk and doing unneccessarily risky things (ill 
guarantee some in this group have been at the bar in the last week). 
Theyre all on public health 10 day quarantines, but out in public fucking 
around, (FYI, these fuckwits arent even the Trump supporting rednecks 
everybody is probably envisioning, theyre literal BLM activists who have 
been indoctrinating my brother in law)


this doesnt have to be this way

just venting, cause the alternative is dropping this here magazine in the 
well and heading over for a discussion resulting in a few more covid 
deaths. Debating on going full karen and calling DCFS


On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 1:45 PM James Howard  wrote:

That’s actually our intention with our basement garage.  We’ve been
telling the kids we plan to put a basketball hoop down there.  We’ve
just never succeeded in getting out all the stuff that ended up down
there when we moved in.

*From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Seth 
Mattinen

*Sent:* Friday, August 7, 2020 12:07 PM
*To:* af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

On 8/7/20 09:54, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
 > I was going to add an apartment to a second story but decided to
leave
 > that off.  We have an obscene amount of house.


I want to use it as a place where the kids can GTFO to and not be in
the
main house making a mess. Previous owners used it as a gym.

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To: ja...@litewire.net



From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com


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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Caldo de res , arroz y chile verde

[Jay Weekley]

Is there any roasting or boiling of the tomatillos?

Jaime Solorza wrote:

Tomatillo

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020, 9:31 AM Jay Weekley > wrote:


Green tomatoes or tomatillos?

Jaime Solorza wrote:
> Here you go Jaycut the head off 6-9 fresh jalapenos, hot leave
> everything inside, mild - clean out inside..
> Place the jalapenos in blender with some water, and small piece of
> garlic, salt and two small green tomatoes without a stem.
Blend...and
> pour in bowl
> Goes well with just about anything...I add small piece of muenster
> cheese to it sometimes...you can add avocado as well for different
> taste and or red tomatoes...
> Enjoy
>
> On Tue, Sep 8, 2020, 12:14 PM Jay Weekley
mailto:par...@cyberbroadband.net>
> >> wrote:
>
> Is there a recipe for the chili sauce?
>
> Jaime Solorza wrote:
> > Nope..same
> >
> > On Sun, Sep 6, 2020, 9:13 PM Steve Jones
> mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>
>
> > 
>  >
> > Is mexican muenster different than deli muenster and is it
> smoked?
> > I like it with a dry smoked rind, I'm not sure if you're
> supposed
> > to eat the rind though
> >
> > On Sun, Sep 6, 2020, 4:26 PM Jaime Solorza
> > mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com>
> >
> 
>  >
> > Marty cooked this up todaythe green chile
sauce was
> > hot...the meat was super tender... yum
yum...added some
> > muenster cheese, flour tortillas and bubbly... I have
> gained 6
> > lbs since eye operation
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com 
>

> >>
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com 
>

> >>
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> *Jay Weekley*
> *Cyber Broadband
> *
>
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> https://www.avg.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com  >
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>

-- 
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*Cyber Broadband
*

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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[Ken Hohhof]

Oops, 26 MHz, not 28.  902-928.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:50 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

I keep hearing about Microsoft and its Airband initiative.  I have no idea why 
Microsoft thinks that TVWS has merit or what technology they bring to the 
party, but I guess you could investigate it.  I have to agree with the others, 
it was never very attractive, and gets less so as time passes and people want 
to do video streaming and Zoom meetings and download 100 GB games over the 
Internet, and as other technologies advance.

 

I would also ask, what if Starlink actually works, and is months away from 
general availability.  It may not be a threat to WISPs in general (or maybe it 
is), but it would seem to solve this particular problem.  And what if Starlink 
succeeds in getting RDOF or CAF subsidy money?  Wouldn’t you just be lighting 
hundred dollar bills on fire?

 

As far as 900 MHz, we stopped using it.  The reason wasn’t so much RTK (a lot 
of which is moving to 450 MHz anyway), but smartgrid and smartmeters.  If the 
power company or other utilities put in 900 MHz smartmeters, kiss 900 MHz 
goodbye for broadband.  The other problem was that it was always more art than 
science, sometimes it wouldn’t work and the reasons wouldn’t be clear.  It’s 
touch to plan or troubleshoot when, by definition, you don’t have clear line of 
sight.  There’s also the issue of other WISPs in 900 MHz, but it sounds like 
you wouldn’t have this issue.

 

But the Cambium 450 900 MHz stuff does work, and even though you only have 28 
MHz total to work with, you can use a wide enough channel to get decent speeds. 
 We still have one AP in service with a handful of customers on it.  I would 
steer clear of 900 MHz omni antennas though.  If you can’t justify sectors, 
just don’t do it.

 

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Bill Prince
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:28 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com  
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

If they are in a cluster, this could possibly be a viable option.

 

bp


On 9/9/2020 7:25 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com   wrote:

Get them to contribute to the cost of a tower in their area.  

 

From: David Coudron 

Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:52 AM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage areas.   
The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles from a 
decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually either 
passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from other 
customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a workable non-los 
solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get dozens of folks on a 
tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it needs to be stable enough it 
is better than the relays and other messy solutions we have come up with.   We 
keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks like Cambium is the only one left in this 
game, and we are pretty worried about noise as we are in the middle of farm 
country and the RTK stuff is pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough 
experience with TV white space to develop an opinion on its ability to be used 
in this situation?   There only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline 
and Carlson, but maybe there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a 
solution that would cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate 
plans of 20-25 Mbps.   Is this possible?

 

Regards,

 

David Coudron


  _  


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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Caldo de res , arroz y chile verde

[Jaime Solorza]

Tomatillo

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020, 9:31 AM Jay Weekley  wrote:

> Green tomatoes or tomatillos?
>
> Jaime Solorza wrote:
> > Here you go Jaycut the head off 6-9 fresh jalapenos, hot leave
> > everything inside, mild - clean out inside..
> > Place the jalapenos in blender with some water, and small piece of
> > garlic, salt and two small green tomatoes without a stem. Blend...and
> > pour in bowl
> > Goes well with just about anything...I add small piece of muenster
> > cheese to it sometimes...you can add avocado as well for different
> > taste and or red tomatoes...
> > Enjoy
> >
> > On Tue, Sep 8, 2020, 12:14 PM Jay Weekley  > > wrote:
> >
> > Is there a recipe for the chili sauce?
> >
> > Jaime Solorza wrote:
> > > Nope..same
> > >
> > > On Sun, Sep 6, 2020, 9:13 PM Steve Jones
> > mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>
> > >  > >> wrote:
> > >
> > > Is mexican muenster different than deli muenster and is it
> > smoked?
> > > I like it with a dry smoked rind, I'm not sure if you're
> > supposed
> > > to eat the rind though
> > >
> > > On Sun, Sep 6, 2020, 4:26 PM Jaime Solorza
> > >  > 
> >  > >> wrote:
> > >
> > > Marty cooked this up todaythe green chile sauce was
> > > hot...the meat was super tender... yum yum...added some
> > > muenster cheese, flour tortillas and bubbly... I have
> > gained 6
> > > lbs since eye operation
> > > --
> > > AF mailing list
> > > AF@af.afmug.com   > >
> > > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
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> > >
> > >
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> > --
> > *Jay Weekley*
> > *Cyber Broadband
> > *
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[AFMUG] ***SPAM*** Re: [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

[Robert Andrews]

Which test did he take?  Nasal swap, throat swap, blood?

On 09/09/2020 08:00 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
We had one employee, all the symptoms.  Got a test, got results back  in 
about 4 hours $100  Not positive.  I was astounded they turned it around 
that fast.

*From:* Ken Hohhof
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 8:58 AM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

Yeah, it’s like the colleges that invite all the kids on campus then 
after a week send them back home all over the country when (surprise, 
surprise) they get a bunch of positive tests.  Fauci is trying to tell 
them at that point they’re doing the worst thing, once they’re on 
campus, keep them there, maybe isolate the sick ones.  But don’t send 
them back home to spread the virus.


*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
*Sent:* Tuesday, September 8, 2020 11:23 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

so, the wife ended up not catching it, a couple nurses did. in the last 
couple weeks shes had 2 more exposures from the same nonsense. we arent 
going into lockdown every time anymore, just notifying everybody and 
wearing masks for two weeks even though they dont do anything (purely an 
issue of criminal liability).


Last saturday my piece of shit brother in law dropped his kid off to us, 
didnt bother to mention to us that he (the brother) had been sick for a 
couple days and lost his sense of taste. we went to a family gathering 
with the nephew. the brothers gf test came back postive on sunday 
(another thing he didnt mention. so of course everybody at the family 
function went on lock down. the nephew had only been at his dads since 
friday and was never around the gf. he hadnt been exposed long enough to 
spread it, the likelyhood of contact contamination of clothing is near 
zero. But we reported to everybody who was there, my cousins kids 
couldnt go back to school til the boy had a negative test, etc.


the three year old came back negative, everybody was good.

The brother in law tested positive on monday.

no big deal

til he tells my wife hes having a covid party, him, his gf, and a few of 
their friends who are positive. Not a huge deal, except they have my 3 
year old nephew there, who WAS negative.


This is the nonsense that makes this ting and issue, people willfully 
putting others at risk and doing unneccessarily risky things (ill 
guarantee some in this group have been at the bar in the last week). 
Theyre all on public health 10 day quarantines, but out in public 
fucking around, (FYI, these fuckwits arent even the Trump supporting 
rednecks everybody is probably envisioning, theyre literal BLM activists 
who have been indoctrinating my brother in law)


this doesnt have to be this way

just venting, cause the alternative is dropping this here magazine in 
the well and heading over for a discussion resulting in a few more covid 
deaths. Debating on going full karen and calling DCFS


On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 1:45 PM James Howard  wrote:

That’s actually our intention with our basement garage.  We’ve been
telling the kids we plan to put a basketball hoop down there.  We’ve
just never succeeded in getting out all the stuff that ended up down
there when we moved in.

*From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Seth Mattinen
*Sent:* Friday, August 7, 2020 12:07 PM
*To:* af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

On 8/7/20 09:54, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
 > I was going to add an apartment to a second story but decided to
leave
 > that off.  We have an obscene amount of house.


I want to use it as a place where the kids can GTFO to and not be in
the
main house making a mess. Previous owners used it as a gym.

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To: ja...@litewire.net



From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com



/You received this message because the domain afmug.com
 is on your allow list./

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[AFMUG] ***SPAM*** Re: [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

[Robert Andrews]

I was educated on the reliability of negative results.   Good friend, 
well connected, friends with the Dr. in charge of Nevada testing.


While a positive result is very reliable, the negatives are very much 
not so.   AT THE BEST, when an infected is in optimal test time, 5-8 
days into the infecting the current test is only 85% accurate.   Outside 
of that time range it falls each day on either side to 46% or worse!.


 Get an antibody test if it's after 12 days from the infection.  They 
are much more accurate with rates in the 99% range positive/negative.


 Here in Nevada they hand out a sheet that says "If you have symptoms 
isolate for 14 days regardless of results" nobody really reads that sheet.


On 09/09/2020 08:00 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
We had one employee, all the symptoms.  Got a test, got results back  in 
about 4 hours $100  Not positive.  I was astounded they turned it around 
that fast.

*From:* Ken Hohhof
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 9, 2020 8:58 AM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

Yeah, it’s like the colleges that invite all the kids on campus then 
after a week send them back home all over the country when (surprise, 
surprise) they get a bunch of positive tests.  Fauci is trying to tell 
them at that point they’re doing the worst thing, once they’re on 
campus, keep them there, maybe isolate the sick ones.  But don’t send 
them back home to spread the virus.


*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
*Sent:* Tuesday, September 8, 2020 11:23 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

so, the wife ended up not catching it, a couple nurses did. in the last 
couple weeks shes had 2 more exposures from the same nonsense. we arent 
going into lockdown every time anymore, just notifying everybody and 
wearing masks for two weeks even though they dont do anything (purely an 
issue of criminal liability).


Last saturday my piece of shit brother in law dropped his kid off to us, 
didnt bother to mention to us that he (the brother) had been sick for a 
couple days and lost his sense of taste. we went to a family gathering 
with the nephew. the brothers gf test came back postive on sunday 
(another thing he didnt mention. so of course everybody at the family 
function went on lock down. the nephew had only been at his dads since 
friday and was never around the gf. he hadnt been exposed long enough to 
spread it, the likelyhood of contact contamination of clothing is near 
zero. But we reported to everybody who was there, my cousins kids 
couldnt go back to school til the boy had a negative test, etc.


the three year old came back negative, everybody was good.

The brother in law tested positive on monday.

no big deal

til he tells my wife hes having a covid party, him, his gf, and a few of 
their friends who are positive. Not a huge deal, except they have my 3 
year old nephew there, who WAS negative.


This is the nonsense that makes this ting and issue, people willfully 
putting others at risk and doing unneccessarily risky things (ill 
guarantee some in this group have been at the bar in the last week). 
Theyre all on public health 10 day quarantines, but out in public 
fucking around, (FYI, these fuckwits arent even the Trump supporting 
rednecks everybody is probably envisioning, theyre literal BLM activists 
who have been indoctrinating my brother in law)


this doesnt have to be this way

just venting, cause the alternative is dropping this here magazine in 
the well and heading over for a discussion resulting in a few more covid 
deaths. Debating on going full karen and calling DCFS


On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 1:45 PM James Howard  wrote:

That’s actually our intention with our basement garage.  We’ve been
telling the kids we plan to put a basketball hoop down there.  We’ve
just never succeeded in getting out all the stuff that ended up down
there when we moved in.

*From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Seth Mattinen
*Sent:* Friday, August 7, 2020 12:07 PM
*To:* af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

On 8/7/20 09:54, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
 > I was going to add an apartment to a second story but decided to
leave
 > that off.  We have an obscene amount of house.


I want to use it as a place where the kids can GTFO to and not be in
the
main house making a mess. Previous owners used it as a gym.

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To: ja...@litewire.net



From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com

 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Caldo de res , arroz y chile verde

[Jay Weekley]

Green tomatoes or tomatillos?

Jaime Solorza wrote:
Here you go Jaycut the head off 6-9 fresh jalapenos, hot leave 
everything inside, mild - clean out inside..
Place the jalapenos in blender with some water, and small piece of 
garlic, salt and two small green tomatoes without a stem. Blend...and 
pour in bowl
Goes well with just about anything...I add small piece of muenster 
cheese to it sometimes...you can add avocado as well for different 
taste and or red tomatoes...

Enjoy

On Tue, Sep 8, 2020, 12:14 PM Jay Weekley > wrote:


Is there a recipe for the chili sauce?

Jaime Solorza wrote:
> Nope..same
>
> On Sun, Sep 6, 2020, 9:13 PM Steve Jones
mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
>
> Is mexican muenster different than deli muenster and is it
smoked?
> I like it with a dry smoked rind, I'm not sure if you're
supposed
> to eat the rind though
>
> On Sun, Sep 6, 2020, 4:26 PM Jaime Solorza
> mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>
> Marty cooked this up todaythe green chile sauce was
> hot...the meat was super tender... yum yum...added some
> muenster cheese, flour tortillas and bubbly... I have
gained 6
> lbs since eye operation
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com  >
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com  >
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>

-- 
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*Cyber Broadband
*

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Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

[chuck]

We had one employee, all the symptoms.  Got a test, got results back  in about 
4 hours $100  Not positive.  I was astounded they turned it around that fast.  

From: Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 8:58 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

Yeah, it’s like the colleges that invite all the kids on campus then after a 
week send them back home all over the country when (surprise, surprise) they 
get a bunch of positive tests.  Fauci is trying to tell them at that point 
they’re doing the worst thing, once they’re on campus, keep them there, maybe 
isolate the sick ones.  But don’t send them back home to spread the virus.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Tuesday, September 8, 2020 11:23 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

 

so, the wife ended up not catching it, a couple nurses did. in the last couple 
weeks shes had 2 more exposures from the same nonsense. we arent going into 
lockdown every time anymore, just notifying everybody and wearing masks for two 
weeks even though they dont do anything (purely an issue of criminal liability).

 

Last saturday my piece of shit brother in law dropped his kid off to us, didnt 
bother to mention to us that he (the brother) had been sick for a couple days 
and lost his sense of taste. we went to a family gathering with the nephew. the 
brothers gf test came back postive on sunday (another thing he didnt mention. 
so of course everybody at the family function went on lock down. the nephew had 
only been at his dads since friday and was never around the gf. he hadnt been 
exposed long enough to spread it, the likelyhood of contact contamination of 
clothing is near zero. But we reported to everybody who was there, my cousins 
kids couldnt go back to school til the boy had a negative test, etc. 

 

the three year old came back negative, everybody was good. 

 

The brother in law tested positive on monday.

 

no big deal

 

til he tells my wife hes having a covid party, him, his gf, and a few of their 
friends who are positive. Not a huge deal, except they have my 3 year old 
nephew there, who WAS negative.

 

This is the nonsense that makes this ting and issue, people willfully putting 
others at risk and doing unneccessarily risky things (ill guarantee some in 
this group have been at the bar in the last week). Theyre all on public health 
10 day quarantines, but out in public fucking around, (FYI, these fuckwits 
arent even the Trump supporting rednecks everybody is probably envisioning, 
theyre literal BLM activists who have been indoctrinating my brother in law)

 

this doesnt have to be this way

 

just venting, cause the alternative is dropping this here magazine in the well 
and heading over for a discussion resulting in a few more covid deaths. 
Debating on going full karen and calling DCFS

 

On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 1:45 PM James Howard  wrote:

  That’s actually our intention with our basement garage.  We’ve been telling 
the kids we plan to put a basketball hoop down there.  We’ve just never 
succeeded in getting out all the stuff that ended up down there when we moved 
in.

   

  From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Seth Mattinen
  Sent: Friday, August 7, 2020 12:07 PM
  To: af@af.afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

   

  On 8/7/20 09:54, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
  > I was going to add an apartment to a second story but decided to leave 
  > that off.  We have an obscene amount of house.


  I want to use it as a place where the kids can GTFO to and not be in the 
  main house making a mess. Previous owners used it as a gym.

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To: ja...@litewire.net
   
From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com
   
  
 
   
  You received this message because the domain afmug.com is on your 
allow list.
 
   

   

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Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

[Ken Hohhof]

Yeah, it’s like the colleges that invite all the kids on campus then after a 
week send them back home all over the country when (surprise, surprise) they 
get a bunch of positive tests.  Fauci is trying to tell them at that point 
they’re doing the worst thing, once they’re on campus, keep them there, maybe 
isolate the sick ones.  But don’t send them back home to spread the virus.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Tuesday, September 8, 2020 11:23 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

 

so, the wife ended up not catching it, a couple nurses did. in the last couple 
weeks shes had 2 more exposures from the same nonsense. we arent going into 
lockdown every time anymore, just notifying everybody and wearing masks for two 
weeks even though they dont do anything (purely an issue of criminal liability).

 

Last saturday my piece of shit brother in law dropped his kid off to us, didnt 
bother to mention to us that he (the brother) had been sick for a couple days 
and lost his sense of taste. we went to a family gathering with the nephew. the 
brothers gf test came back postive on sunday (another thing he didnt mention. 
so of course everybody at the family function went on lock down. the nephew had 
only been at his dads since friday and was never around the gf. he hadnt been 
exposed long enough to spread it, the likelyhood of contact contamination of 
clothing is near zero. But we reported to everybody who was there, my cousins 
kids couldnt go back to school til the boy had a negative test, etc. 

 

the three year old came back negative, everybody was good. 

 

The brother in law tested positive on monday.

 

no big deal

 

til he tells my wife hes having a covid party, him, his gf, and a few of their 
friends who are positive. Not a huge deal, except they have my 3 year old 
nephew there, who WAS negative.

 

This is the nonsense that makes this ting and issue, people willfully putting 
others at risk and doing unneccessarily risky things (ill guarantee some in 
this group have been at the bar in the last week). Theyre all on public health 
10 day quarantines, but out in public fucking around, (FYI, these fuckwits 
arent even the Trump supporting rednecks everybody is probably envisioning, 
theyre literal BLM activists who have been indoctrinating my brother in law)

 

this doesnt have to be this way

 

just venting, cause the alternative is dropping this here magazine in the well 
and heading over for a discussion resulting in a few more covid deaths. 
Debating on going full karen and calling DCFS

 

On Fri, Aug 7, 2020 at 1:45 PM James Howard mailto:ja...@litewire.net> > wrote:

That’s actually our intention with our basement garage.  We’ve been telling the 
kids we plan to put a basketball hoop down there.  We’ve just never succeeded 
in getting out all the stuff that ended up down there when we moved in.

 

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com  ] On 
Behalf Of Seth Mattinen
Sent: Friday, August 7, 2020 12:07 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com  
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [SPAM] Re: COVID Exposure and the real world

 

On 8/7/20 09:54, ch...@wbmfg.com   wrote:
> I was going to add an apartment to a second story but decided to leave 
> that off.  We have an obscene amount of house.


I want to use it as a place where the kids can GTFO to and not be in the 
main house making a mess. Previous owners used it as a gym.

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From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com  




You received this message because the domain afmug.com   is 
on your allow list.

 

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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[Ken Hohhof]

I keep hearing about Microsoft and its Airband initiative.  I have no idea why 
Microsoft thinks that TVWS has merit or what technology they bring to the 
party, but I guess you could investigate it.  I have to agree with the others, 
it was never very attractive, and gets less so as time passes and people want 
to do video streaming and Zoom meetings and download 100 GB games over the 
Internet, and as other technologies advance.

 

I would also ask, what if Starlink actually works, and is months away from 
general availability.  It may not be a threat to WISPs in general (or maybe it 
is), but it would seem to solve this particular problem.  And what if Starlink 
succeeds in getting RDOF or CAF subsidy money?  Wouldn’t you just be lighting 
hundred dollar bills on fire?

 

As far as 900 MHz, we stopped using it.  The reason wasn’t so much RTK (a lot 
of which is moving to 450 MHz anyway), but smartgrid and smartmeters.  If the 
power company or other utilities put in 900 MHz smartmeters, kiss 900 MHz 
goodbye for broadband.  The other problem was that it was always more art than 
science, sometimes it wouldn’t work and the reasons wouldn’t be clear.  It’s 
touch to plan or troubleshoot when, by definition, you don’t have clear line of 
sight.  There’s also the issue of other WISPs in 900 MHz, but it sounds like 
you wouldn’t have this issue.

 

But the Cambium 450 900 MHz stuff does work, and even though you only have 28 
MHz total to work with, you can use a wide enough channel to get decent speeds. 
 We still have one AP in service with a handful of customers on it.  I would 
steer clear of 900 MHz omni antennas though.  If you can’t justify sectors, 
just don’t do it.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Bill Prince
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 9:28 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

If they are in a cluster, this could possibly be a viable option.

 

bp


On 9/9/2020 7:25 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com   wrote:

Get them to contribute to the cost of a tower in their area.  

 

From: David Coudron 

Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:52 AM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: [AFMUG] TV White Space

 

We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage areas.   
The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles from a 
decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually either 
passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from other 
customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a workable non-los 
solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get dozens of folks on a 
tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it needs to be stable enough it 
is better than the relays and other messy solutions we have come up with.   We 
keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks like Cambium is the only one left in this 
game, and we are pretty worried about noise as we are in the middle of farm 
country and the RTK stuff is pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough 
experience with TV white space to develop an opinion on its ability to be used 
in this situation?   There only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline 
and Carlson, but maybe there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a 
solution that would cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate 
plans of 20-25 Mbps.   Is this possible?

 

Regards,

 

David Coudron


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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[Bill Prince]

  
  
If they are in a cluster, this could possibly be a viable option.


bp

On 9/9/2020 7:25 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com
  wrote:


  
  
  
  

  Get them to contribute to the cost of a tower in their
area.  
  

   
  
From: David Coudron 
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:52 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users
Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] TV White Space
  

 
  
  

  We have a couple of areas in our
network that remain problem coverage areas.   The
typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10
miles from a decent tower structure, but really want
service.   We have usually either passed on providing
coverage, or messed around with relaying from other
customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking
for a workable non-los solution for these few spots.  
We don’t need to get dozens of folks on a tower, and a
higher than normal cost is OK, but it needs to be stable
enough it is better than the relays and other messy
solutions we have come up with.   We keep looking at 900
MHz, but it looks like Cambium is the only one left in
this game, and we are pretty worried about noise as we
are in the middle of farm country and the RTK stuff is
pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough experience
with TV white space to develop an opinion on its ability
to be used in this situation?   There only seems to be
two vendors in this space, Redline and Carlson, but
maybe there are others we are missing.   We are looking
for a solution that would cover customers 5-7 miles in
non-los situations with rate plans of 20-25 Mbps.   Is
this possible?
   
  Regards,
   
  David Coudron




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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[chuck]

Get them to contribute to the cost of a tower in their area.  

From: David Coudron 
Sent: Wednesday, September 9, 2020 7:52 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] TV White Space

We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage areas.   
The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles from a 
decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually either 
passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from other 
customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a workable non-los 
solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get dozens of folks on a 
tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it needs to be stable enough it 
is better than the relays and other messy solutions we have come up with.   We 
keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks like Cambium is the only one left in this 
game, and we are pretty worried about noise as we are in the middle of farm 
country and the RTK stuff is pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough 
experience with TV white space to develop an opinion on its ability to be used 
in this situation?   There only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline 
and Carlson, but maybe there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a 
solution that would cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate 
plans of 20-25 Mbps.   Is this possible?

 

Regards,

 

David Coudron




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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[Bill Prince]

  
  
TVWS is in an untenable situation. One the one hand, what's left
  of the spectrum keeps getting chipped away by cellular companies
  buying up bits and pieces of it, second hand the rules almost
  certify that you won't have adjacent channels, third hand the
  equipment (so far) has been under performing and over  pricing,
  and fourth hand the measly 6 MHz channels require some LTE+ kind
  of technology to squeeze out any decent bandwidth. 

My conclusion is that you're best off by not wasting any brain
  cycles on it.


bp

On 9/9/2020 7:02 AM, Josh Baird wrote:


  
  In my opinion, TVWS has been a complete shit-show
for the past 10 years, and I would be hesitant to throw any
money at it.


Someone feel free to change my mind.  :)
  
  
  
On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 9:53 AM
  David Coudron 
  wrote:


  

  We have a couple of areas in our
network that remain problem coverage areas.   The
typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10
miles from a decent tower structure, but really want
service.   We have usually either passed on providing
coverage, or messed around with relaying from other
customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking
for a workable non-los solution for these few spots.  
We don’t need to get dozens of folks on a tower, and a
higher than normal cost is OK, but it needs to be stable
enough it is better than the relays and other messy
solutions we have come up with.   We keep looking at 900
MHz, but it looks like Cambium is the only one left in
this game, and we are pretty worried about noise as we
are in the middle of farm country and the RTK stuff is
pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough experience
with TV white space to develop an opinion on its ability
to be used in this situation?   There only seems to be
two vendors in this space, Redline and Carlson, but
maybe there are others we are missing.   We are looking
for a solution that would cover customers 5-7 miles in
non-los situations with rate plans of 20-25 Mbps.   Is
this possible?
   
  Regards,
   
  David Coudron

  
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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[Lewis Bergman]

Josh,
I have to take issue with your assertion that TVWS has been a shit show for
at least 10 years. I think it has been a complete shit show ever since they
came up with the idea, maybe 20 to 25 years ago. Technically you are
correct it is at least 10 years. But it has never risen to the level of
being anything less than a complete mess. It has always had such promise,
and never lived up to any of it.

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 9:03 AM Josh Baird  wrote:

> In my opinion, TVWS has been a complete shit-show for the past 10 years,
> and I would be hesitant to throw any money at it.
>
> Someone feel free to change my mind.  :)
>
> On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 9:53 AM David Coudron 
> wrote:
>
>> We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage
>> areas.   The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles
>> from a decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually
>> either passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from
>> other customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a
>> workable non-los solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get
>> dozens of folks on a tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it
>> needs to be stable enough it is better than the relays and other messy
>> solutions we have come up with.   We keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks
>> like Cambium is the only one left in this game, and we are pretty worried
>> about noise as we are in the middle of farm country and the RTK stuff is
>> pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough experience with TV white space to
>> develop an opinion on its ability to be used in this situation?   There
>> only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline and Carlson, but maybe
>> there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a solution that would
>> cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate plans of 20-25
>> Mbps.   Is this possible?
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>>
>>
>> David Coudron
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>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
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> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>


-- 
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325-439-0533 Cell
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Jay Fuller turns 50 today?

[dave]

Hey
I resemble that remark LOL!


On 9/8/20 1:18 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:

50?! Holy cow, that's old!




;-)



Yes, I know many, many of you are much older. I jab equally.  :-)



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 





*From: *"Bill Prince" 
*To: *"AFMUG" 
*Sent: *Tuesday, September 8, 2020 1:16:09 PM
*Subject: *[AFMUG] OT: Jay Fuller turns 50 today?


A birdie told me that today is Jay Fuller's 50th birthday. The birdie is
just a birdie, so don't blame me if I'm wrong.



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Re: [AFMUG] TV White Space

[Josh Baird]

In my opinion, TVWS has been a complete shit-show for the past 10 years,
and I would be hesitant to throw any money at it.

Someone feel free to change my mind.  :)

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 9:53 AM David Coudron 
wrote:

> We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage
> areas.   The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles
> from a decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually
> either passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from
> other customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a
> workable non-los solution for these few spots.   We don’t need to get
> dozens of folks on a tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it
> needs to be stable enough it is better than the relays and other messy
> solutions we have come up with.   We keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks
> like Cambium is the only one left in this game, and we are pretty worried
> about noise as we are in the middle of farm country and the RTK stuff is
> pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough experience with TV white space to
> develop an opinion on its ability to be used in this situation?   There
> only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline and Carlson, but maybe
> there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a solution that would
> cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate plans of 20-25
> Mbps.   Is this possible?
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> David Coudron
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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[AFMUG] TV White Space

[David Coudron]

We have a couple of areas in our network that remain problem coverage areas.   
The typical scenario is a handful of customers that are 5-10 miles from a 
decent tower structure, but really want service.   We have usually either 
passed on providing coverage, or messed around with relaying from other 
customers or some other messy scenario.   We are looking for a workable non-los 
solution for these few spots.   We don't need to get dozens of folks on a 
tower, and a higher than normal cost is OK, but it needs to be stable enough it 
is better than the relays and other messy solutions we have come up with.   We 
keep looking at 900 MHz, but it looks like Cambium is the only one left in this 
game, and we are pretty worried about noise as we are in the middle of farm 
country and the RTK stuff is pretty prevalent.   Has anyone had enough 
experience with TV white space to develop an opinion on its ability to be used 
in this situation?   There only seems to be two vendors in this space, Redline 
and Carlson, but maybe there are others we are missing.   We are looking for a 
solution that would cover customers 5-7 miles in non-los situations with rate 
plans of 20-25 Mbps.   Is this possible?

Regards,

David Coudron
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Jay Fuller turns 50 today?

[Chuck McCown]

Your odometer just rolled over 100

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 8, 2020, at 7:19 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:
> 
> Well.. we still love you.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Sep 8, 2020, at 6:25 PM, SmarterBroadband  wrote:
>> 
>> I had my Beatles Song Birthday last week.
>> 
>> ☹
>> 
>> Adam
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Bill Prince
>> Sent: Tuesday, September 8, 2020 11:16 AM
>> To: AFMUG 
>> Subject: [AFMUG] OT: Jay Fuller turns 50 today?
>> 
>> 
>> A birdie told me that today is Jay Fuller's 50th birthday. The birdie is 
>> just a birdie, so don't blame me if I'm wrong.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> bp
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
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>> 
>> 
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Cobra Kai

[Adam Moffett]

I was wondering where they put teenagers into full contact karate 
tournaments.  Surely not in the USA, land of the lawsuit.


On 9/8/2020 6:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
The karate is pretty bad and it seems like students are going from 
white belts to black and back again.


Steve Jones wrote:
I watched episode one out of nostalgia, figured it would be a lame 
reboot, we ended up watching both seasons, my daughter even put down 
her phone. Turns out danielsan is a real dickhead. I do take issue 
with black belts being obtained in a couple months, Thats kind of 
insulting to people who worked their way up. I never progressed past 
the white. I dont think I got past stance. i like the mix of footage 
from the original movie, didnt realize it had gotten up to 4 movies 
plus the one with will smiths kid,


Seeing things through others eyes i think is mor understandable to 
older generations. I always thought I was bullied in high school, but 
as i got older and ran into people who were on my peripheral in HS 
they tell me they were afraid of me because i bullied people. looking 
back I see how it could be taken that way, my bullying was with words 
and little violence, but it appears that lasts a whole lot longer.


Will be really cool if this bursts a resurgence in interest in 
martial arts, not UFC. I dont think karen will let her kid be kicked 
though.


I had a baseball coach that turned nice kids into assholes so i could 
see a contact sport coach/sensei having more impact.


Cant wait for season 3

On Tue, Sep 8, 2020 at 3:52 PM Adam Moffett > wrote:


    I got through season 1 of Cobra Kai on Neflix over the long
    weekend.  I expected a corny reboot of an 80's franchise...but
    it's quite a bit smarter than that.

    Likes:

    Reviewing the Karate Kid story through the eyes of the
    antagonist.  Danny Larusso was certainly not blameless in that
    story.  The other guy's perspective is worth considering.

    The role reversals.  Johnny Lawrence was the typical teen movie
    antagonist in Karate Kid.  A selfish, affluent jock.  Danny Laruso
    was the poor, nice guy, underdog.  The series starts with Danny as
    the afluent, selfish, jerk and Johnny as a poor//underdog. Except
    really I think we see that everyone is capable of being both the
    nice guy and the jerk.  Episode by episode each of them plays
    protagonist and antagonist in turn.

    Maybe a spoiler, but the "Cobra Kai" style of no nonsense, no
    quitting, no being a pussy, no being afraid is shown to elevate
    some nerdy kids into being able to stand up for themselves. By
    the end of the season some of them have turned it up to 11 and
    gone all the way to being bullies themselves.  I like these
    perspective shifts. Sometimes we're each the bully or the bullied,
    and I think that's worth being reminded of.


    Dislikes:

    I'm not a sociologist or anything, but I question whether the mean
    drill sergeant karate teacher can really turn nice kids into
    assholes and the nice guy teacher can turn a delinquent into a
    nice guy in the course of a few months.

    Some melodrama.  Like over the top soap-opera situations. That
    stuff makes me cringe and shake my head as I ponder the odds of it
    ever happening.



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Re: [AFMUG] New IPs

[Chuck McCown]

No, I thankfully am around the end of a mountain that blocked the worse of it.  
My crew building google fiber got shut down but it gave me a good excuse to do 
some work on my own network.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 8, 2020, at 8:39 PM, TJ Trout  wrote:
> 
> 
> Chuck did you have any damage from the wind storm?
> 
>> On Tue, Sep 8, 2020, 7:06 PM Steve Jones  wrote:
>> Waiting List Status Report
>> Recent and Upcoming Waiting List Distribution
>> The last distribution was completed Monday, 13 July 2020. The next 
>> distribution will occur on or about Thursday, 24 September 2020.
>> 
>>> On Tue, Sep 8, 2020 at 9:03 PM Steve Jones  
>>> wrote:
>>> these are the two i used. the internet service example one i kind of wish 
>>> we had used for subnet documentation originally
>>> 
 On Tue, Sep 8, 2020 at 9:01 PM Steve Jones  
 wrote:
 https://www.arin.net/resources/guide/request/documentation/
 
> On Tue, Sep 8, 2020 at 11:03 AM  wrote:
> I haven’t found the template yet. 
>  
> From: Steve Jones
> Sent: Monday, September 7, 2020 12:07 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New IPs
>  
> Theres a template you download. If I could figure it out, youllnhave no 
> issue. It's pretty straight forward and you can be as liberal as you want 
> on your projected use.
>  
> On Mon, Sep 7, 2020, 11:33 AM  wrote:
>> Not sure what to tell them.  I have my own fiber network.  2 customers.  
>> Just getting started.  Hope to have 10 customers by the end of the month 
>> and maybe 25 by the end of the year.
>>  
>> I am using some NOC services of another company.  I am paying them per 
>> customer.  Kinda a white label thing.  Once I grow  to a certain point 
>> it will make financial sense to do it all myself. 
>>  
>> So, I want them for my own company, but I want them to live in another 
>> interconnected company. 
>> I don’t have my own ASN yet. 
>>  
>> From: Mark Radabaugh
>> Sent: Monday, September 7, 2020 9:15 AM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New IPs
>>  
>> Or for IPv4 you might want this page: 
>> https://www.arin.net/resources/guide/ipv4/request/
>>  
>> You didn’t say if you are buying from others or asking ARIN for 
>> addresses.   Either way you have to get it approved by ARIN - so don’t 
>> skip that part or it will delay being able to purchase IPv4 (if that’s 
>> the way you are going).
>>  
>> Mark
>> 
>>> On Sep 7, 2020, at 10:54 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:
>>>  
>>> I have never done this before personally.  Where do I start?
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On Sep 7, 2020, at 7:26 AM, Josh Luthman  
 wrote:
 
 
 It's really easy if you just submit some data saying you have the 
 customers that need those IPs.  The ARIN folk are really cool and 
 smart.
  
 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373
  
  
> On Sat, Sep 5, 2020 at 5:53 PM  wrote:
> I can wait...
> Never personally applied before. Guess I am going to have to learn 
> that 
> process.
> Can I get a block and then assign it to another company for them to 
> use?
> 
> -Original Message- 
> From: Matt Hoppes
> Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 2:29 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Chuck McCown
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New IPs
> 
> $0... ARIN is finding them if you can wait a month or two.
> 
> Otherwise we just purchased one for $5,000.
> 
> On 9/5/20 3:30 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
> > What is a c block going for these days?
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> > 
> 
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 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
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>> 
>>  
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Re: [AFMUG] New IPs

[Chuck McCown]

Thanks

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 8, 2020, at 8:02 PM, Steve Jones  wrote:
> 
> 
> https://www.arin.net/resources/guide/request/documentation/
> 
>> On Tue, Sep 8, 2020 at 11:03 AM  wrote:
>> I haven’t found the template yet. 
>>  
>> From: Steve Jones
>> Sent: Monday, September 7, 2020 12:07 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New IPs
>>  
>> Theres a template you download. If I could figure it out, youllnhave no 
>> issue. It's pretty straight forward and you can be as liberal as you want on 
>> your projected use.
>>  
>> On Mon, Sep 7, 2020, 11:33 AM  wrote:
>>> Not sure what to tell them.  I have my own fiber network.  2 customers.  
>>> Just getting started.  Hope to have 10 customers by the end of the month 
>>> and maybe 25 by the end of the year.
>>>  
>>> I am using some NOC services of another company.  I am paying them per 
>>> customer.  Kinda a white label thing.  Once I grow  to a certain point it 
>>> will make financial sense to do it all myself. 
>>>  
>>> So, I want them for my own company, but I want them to live in another 
>>> interconnected company. 
>>> I don’t have my own ASN yet. 
>>>  
>>> From: Mark Radabaugh
>>> Sent: Monday, September 7, 2020 9:15 AM
>>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New IPs
>>>  
>>> Or for IPv4 you might want this page: 
>>> https://www.arin.net/resources/guide/ipv4/request/
>>>  
>>> You didn’t say if you are buying from others or asking ARIN for addresses.  
>>>  Either way you have to get it approved by ARIN - so don’t skip that part 
>>> or it will delay being able to purchase IPv4 (if that’s the way you are 
>>> going).
>>>  
>>> Mark
>>> 
 On Sep 7, 2020, at 10:54 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:
  
 I have never done this before personally.  Where do I start?
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
> On Sep 7, 2020, at 7:26 AM, Josh Luthman  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> It's really easy if you just submit some data saying you have the 
> customers that need those IPs.  The ARIN folk are really cool and smart.
>  
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>  
>  
>> On Sat, Sep 5, 2020 at 5:53 PM  wrote:
>> I can wait...
>> Never personally applied before. Guess I am going to have to learn that 
>> process.
>> Can I get a block and then assign it to another company for them to use?
>> 
>> -Original Message- 
>> From: Matt Hoppes
>> Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 2:29 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Chuck McCown
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New IPs
>> 
>> $0... ARIN is finding them if you can wait a month or two.
>> 
>> Otherwise we just purchased one for $5,000.
>> 
>> On 9/5/20 3:30 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>> > What is a c block going for these days?
>> >
>> > Sent from my iPhone
>> > 
>> 
>> -- 
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 AF mailing list
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>>> 
>>>  
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