date:20170325

Sometimes I just listen to them until they hang up.  Sometimes I whistle morse 
code CW.  
Sometimes I hang up and call them back.  

From: Mike Hammett 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:32 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Random Voicemails

Here's one of them:  https://youtu.be/5gGewoVUbvg

-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions

Midwest Internet Exchange

The Brothers WISP

From: "Mike Hammett" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 6:26:44 PM
Subject: [AFMUG] Random Voicemails

Have any of you been getting butt-dialed voicemails from phone numbers you 
don't recognize? Only one out of the seven I've gotten the past week was from 
my general area, otherwise Florida, Oklahoma, Canada, Massachusetts, etc. 
They've been almost 30 minute voicemails of just random shit. They've all been 
to my business phone number. I've got...  3 hours 29 minutes and 48 seconds of 
just random background noises.

-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions

Midwest Internet Exchange

The Brothers WISP

Re: [AFMUG] Random Voicemails

2017-03-25 Thread Jaime Solorza

On Mar 25, 2017 7:32 PM, "Mike Hammett"  wrote:

> Here's one of them:  https://youtu.be/5gGewoVUbvg
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Mike Hammett" 
> *To: *af@afmug.com
> *Sent: *Saturday, March 25, 2017 6:26:44 PM
> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Random Voicemails
>
> Have any of you been getting butt-dialed voicemails from phone numbers you
> don't recognize? Only one out of the seven I've gotten the past week was
> from my general area, otherwise Florida, Oklahoma, Canada, Massachusetts,
> etc. They've been almost 30 minute voicemails of just random shit. They've
> all been to my business phone number. I've got...  3 hours 29 minutes and
> 48 seconds of just random background noises.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Random Voicemails

Here's one of them: https://youtu.be/5gGewoVUbvg 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Mike Hammett"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 6:26:44 PM 
Subject: [AFMUG] Random Voicemails 


Have any of you been getting butt-dialed voicemails from phone numbers you 
don't recognize? Only one out of the seven I've gotten the past week was from 
my general area, otherwise Florida, Oklahoma, Canada, Massachusetts, etc. 
They've been almost 30 minute voicemails of just random shit. They've all been 
to my business phone number. I've got... 3 hours 29 minutes and 48 seconds of 
just random background noises. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP

Re: [AFMUG] Random Voicemails

Yeah, but those are intentional calls, I assume. Something there. Not 
butt-dials. I could hear birds chirping, some unintelligible conversation, 
vehicles, etc. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Chuck McCown"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:01:03 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Random Voicemails 




I get robocalls on my cell phone all the time. 




From: Mike Hammett 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:26 PM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: [AFMUG] Random Voicemails 


Have any of you been getting butt-dialed voicemails from phone numbers you 
don't recognize? Only one out of the seven I've gotten the past week was from 
my general area, otherwise Florida, Oklahoma, Canada, Massachusetts, etc. 
They've been almost 30 minute voicemails of just random shit. They've all been 
to my business phone number. I've got... 3 hours 29 minutes and 48 seconds of 
just random background noises. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP

Re: [AFMUG] Random Voicemails

I get robocalls on my cell phone all the time.  

From: Mike Hammett 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:26 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: [AFMUG] Random Voicemails

Have any of you been getting butt-dialed voicemails from phone numbers you 
don't recognize? Only one out of the seven I've gotten the past week was from 
my general area, otherwise Florida, Oklahoma, Canada, Massachusetts, etc. 
They've been almost 30 minute voicemails of just random shit. They've all been 
to my business phone number. I've got...  3 hours 29 minutes and 48 seconds of 
just random background noises.

-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions

Midwest Internet Exchange

The Brothers WISP

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Peddling my bike as fast as I can go.  I think it will be a no case product.  
Two shielded RJ45s, PCB.  8 LEDS.  4 on one side of the fuses, 4 on the other 
so you can see if any of the fuses have blown.  Bare PCB design.  Perhaps 
painted with the LEDS showing through the paint.  I think I can fit it all in a 
2 inch PCB.  Short shielded CAT5 jumper.  

From: Mitch Koep 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 3:14 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Look forward to getting some when your

ready

Mitch

On 03/25/2017 09:20 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

  That is exactly what it is.  Universal for all POE products.  

  From: Faisal Imtiaz 
  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:16 AM
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  >>  The external in line fuse product is ready for prototyping.  

  Let us know how this goes, if the test are successful, I would suggest making 
an 'external in-line fuse', which would make for a quick retrofit for existing 
modules out there .

  Thanks.

  Faisal Imtiaz
  Snappy Internet & Telecom
  7266 SW 48 Street
  Miami, FL 33155
  Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

  Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net

--

From: "Chuck McCown" mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 9:38:12 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

I would not put any surge protection on Netonix period, top or bottom.  If 
it is POE and powered by a passive source you run a risk of smoking it with any 
surge suppressor. 

I have two devices designed, one is an ancillary fuse to put inline with 
Netonix.  The second is adding fusing to my surge protectors if I can fit it 
in.  The external in line fuse product is ready for prototyping. 

From: David Coudron
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

We are also very interested in this topic.   We will be building out 10 new 
towers in the next few months, and will be making the change to Netonix 
switches (we had previously used a different type of switch).  I the past we 
had put Transtector surge protectors on the tower top and in the cabinet on the 
ground.   From what you are saying in thread, we should not plan on surge 
protectors in the cabinet, but what is the recommended change for the tower 
top, if any?   

Thanks,  

David Coudron

david.coud...@advantenon.com |  Mobile: 612-991-7474

Advantenon, Inc.   

i...@advantenon.com |  3500 Vicksburg Lane N, Suite 315, Plymouth, MN 55447 
|  www.advantenon.com |  Phone: 800-704-4720 |  Local: 612-454-1545 

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, you 
run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not protect 
itself against shorts.

From: Josh Baird 

Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge protectors 
before connecting to Netonix.

On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

  Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, irrespective 
of manufacturer.  

  From: can...@believewireless.net 

  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM

  To: af@afmug.com 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are 
connected to Netonix?

  On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...

Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

From: Bill Prince 

Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge 
suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping from 
something else that had been on the cable, and completely forgot that it was 
going through that surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

bp On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

  OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt Hoppes 
said.  You short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet transformer.  

  I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect 
and shut down in an over current situation.  They do have poly fuses which are 
slow to react and may protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts 
will indeed harm the port feeding the transformer.  

  So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive POE a 
plain

[AFMUG] Random Voicemails

Have any of you been getting butt-dialed voicemails from phone numbers you 
don't recognize? Only one out of the seven I've gotten the past week was from 
my general area, otherwise Florida, Oklahoma, Canada, Massachusetts, etc. 
They've been almost 30 minute voicemails of just random shit. They've all been 
to my business phone number. I've got... 3 hours 29 minutes and 48 seconds of 
just random background noises. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Look forward to getting some when your

ready

Mitch

On 03/25/2017 09:20 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

That is exactly what it is. Universal for all POE products.
*From:* Faisal Imtiaz
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:16 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
The external in line fuse product is ready for prototyping.
Let us know how this goes, if the test are successful, I would suggest
making an 'external in-line fuse', which would make for a quick
retrofit for existing modules out there .

Thanks.
Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet & Telecom
7266 SW 48 Street
Miami, FL 33155
Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net

*From: *"Chuck McCown"
*To: *af@afmug.com
*Sent: *Saturday, March 25, 2017 9:38:12 AM
*Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

I would not put any surge protection on Netonix period, top or
bottom. If it is POE and powered by a passive source you run a
risk of smoking it with any surge suppressor.
I have two devices designed, one is an ancillary fuse to put
inline with Netonix. The second is adding fusing to my surge
protectors if I can fit it in. The external in line fuse product
is ready for prototyping.
*From:* David Coudron
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

We are also very interested in this topic. We will be building
out 10 new towers in the next few months, and will be making the
change to Netonix switches (we had previously used a different
type of switch). I the past we had put Transtector surge
protectors on the tower top and in the cabinet on the ground. From
what you are saying in thread, we should not plan on surge
protectors in the cabinet, but what is the recommended change for
the tower top, if any?

Thanks,

*David Coudron*

david.coud...@advantenon.com|*Mobile: *612-991-7474

*Advantenon, Inc.

*cid:image001.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image002.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image003.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image004.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0

i...@advantenon.com|3500 Vicksburg Lane N, Suite 315, Plymouth, MN

55447|www.advantenon.com|*Phone:*800-704-4720|*Local:
*612-454-1545

*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to
ground, you run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.
It will not protect itself against shorts.

*From:*Josh Baird

*Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

What exactly is the reason? We always run through your surge
protectors before connecting to Netonix.

On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix,
irrespective of manufacturer.

*From:*can...@believewireless.net

*Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors
that are connected to Netonix?

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown
wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...

Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

*From:*Bill Prince

*Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium
surge suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix.
We were swapping from something else that had been on the
cable, and completely forgot that it was going through
that surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

OK, had an exchange with Netonix today. It is just
as Matt Hoppes said. You short out their POE and it
will blow the Ethernet transformer.

I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that
could detect and shut down in an over current
situation. They do have poly fuses which are slow to
react and may protect it from a very brief short, but
longer shorts will indeed harm the port feeding the

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

I made a post about it and you've got people going on and on about unrelated 
things. Active vs. passive PoE. That's nothing to do with this. 

I'm sure other PoE switches have these deficiencies as well. Do we know which 
ones? 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "George Skorup"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 3:58:46 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix 

I've never lost one of Chuck's suppressors to lightning/surges. The 5 or so 
that I have has all been because of the cable leaking water down into 
GIGE(-POE)-APCs at the bottom. 

Had one last week. Of course, had to be the only non-gel tape cable running up 
the tower. I see the ethernet link suddenly start flapping. Bounce the MikroTik 
port. Nope. Log into the SiteMonitor, the SyncInjector port shows it's using 
about 400mA. Seems normal, but wait, the other sectors aren't consuming that 
much. I knew right then and there what it was. I get to the site and it's 
sizzling, rj45 all burnt up, but the radio is still powered up and 
transmitting, just no ethernet link. SyncInjector port didn't trip, obviously 
because the fixed 2A limit wasn't reached. Lost nothing other than the 
GigE-APC. Stripped the cable, put a new Rj45 on it without the jacket in the 
plug, tied it to the rack post, put a coupler and a patch cable in place of the 
APC, plugged it all back in and left. Not even any ethernet errors with the 
water in the cable. 

AFAIK, CMMs and LMG CTMs have always had port protection. Dumb POE injection 
without over-current protection.. been there, done that. In-line suppressors or 
not, many radios these days are coming with surge suppression built in, like 
450 APs. Methinks it's a fundamental design issues that Mr. Netonix should 
revise. 


On 3/25/2017 8:35 AM, Adam Moffett wrote: 



There are other reasons a cable could short: water ingress, accidental cut, 
faulty device. 


Changing your surge suppressor is a good idea, but I think PoE devices ought to 
include short circuit protection anyway. 




-- Original Message -- 
From: "Chuck McCown" < ch...@wbmfg.com > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: 3/25/2017 9:28:51 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix 







If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, you run 
the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer. It will not protect itself 
against shorts. 




From: Josh Baird 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix 


What exactly is the reason? We always run through your surge protectors before 
connecting to Netonix. 


On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 







Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, irrespective of 
manufacturer. 




From: can...@believewireless.net 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix 



So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are connected 
to Netonix? 


On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 






I am going to fix this little problem... 

Netonix will fix your port for something like $25 




From: Bill Prince 
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix 




Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge suppressor, and 
it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping from something else that 
had been on the cable, and completely forgot that it was going through that 
surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned. 
bp
 
On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote: 








OK, had an exchange with Netonix today. It is just as Matt Hoppes said. You 
short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet transformer. 

I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect and shut 
down in an over current situation. They do have poly fuses which are slow to 
react and may protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will indeed 
harm the port feeding the transformer. 

So, Netonix is not active POE. I would say that on passive POE a plain surge 
suppressor should not be used. I am working some “non plain” surge suppressors 
now ;-) Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to Matt for forcing 
me to learn something new. It was painful, but I can do painful things when I 
have to. 




From: Chuck McCown 
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix 




tnx 




From: Josh Luthman 
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix 


chris.sisler 
( A ) 

netlinx.net 





Josh Luthman 
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St 
Suite 1337 
Troy, OH 45373 

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Chuck McCown < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 






Anyone know the email for the guy

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

2017-03-25 Thread Stefan Englhardt

Repair cost is no factor. The outage and the immediate TODO is expensive. God 
sake we did not consider toughswitches …





Von: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] Im Auftrag von Jon Langeler
Gesendet: Samstag, 25. März 2017 22:02
An: af@afmug.com
Betreff: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix



Go look at the prices they charge for these. They are very reasonable. We've 
had hit and miss luck with Toughswitches. I'm thankful we have a 'real' switch 
to use now...

Jon Langeler

Michwave Technologies, Inc.




On Mar 25, 2017, at 10:31 AM, Mitch Koep  > wrote:

I would agree so why do we pay to fix or to add

additional equipment to modify?

I guess I will hold off from anymore Netonix.



Mitch

On 03/25/2017 09:27 AM, Mike Hammett wrote:

I would say yes.



-
Mike Hammett
  Intelligent Computing Solutions
   
  
  

  Midwest Internet Exchange
   
  

  The Brothers WISP
   






  _


From: "Mitch Koep"   
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 9:23:08 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Is this a design error that Netonix needs to correct?


> What is the lesser of two problems.  Leaving a lot of expensive stuff
> unprotected or risk replacing a Netonix switch?
>
> Chuck McCown wrote:
>> I would not put any surge protection on Netonix period, top or
>> bottom.  If it is POE and powered by a passive source you run a risk
>> of smoking it with any surge suppressor.
>> I have two devices designed, one is an ancillary fuse to put inline
>> with Netonix.  The second is adding fusing to my surge protectors if
>> I can fit it in.  The external in line fuse product is ready for
>> prototyping.
>> *From:* David Coudron
>> *Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
>> *To:* af@afmug.com 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
>> We are also very interested in this topic.   We will be building out
>> 10 new towers in the next few months, and will be making the change
>> to Netonix switches (we had previously used a different type of
>> switch).  I the past we had put Transtector surge protectors on the
>> tower top and in the cabinet on the ground. From what you are saying
>> in thread, we should not plan on surge protectors in the cabinet, but
>> what is the recommended change for the tower top, if any?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> *David Coudron*
>>
>> david.coud...@advantenon.com|*Mobile 
>>  : *612-991-7474
>>
>> *Advantenon, Inc.
>> *cid:image001.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0 
>>  
>> cid:image002.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0
>>   
>> cid:image003.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0 
>>  
>> cid:image004.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0 
>>  
>>
>> i...@advantenon.com|3500   Vicksburg Lane 
>> N, Suite 315, Plymouth, MN
>> 55447|www.advantenon.com   
>>  
>> |*Phone:*800-704-4720|*Local:
>> *612-454-1545
>>
>> *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
>> *Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
>> *To:* af@afmug.com 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
>> If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground,
>> you run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not
>> protect itself against shorts.
>>
>> *From:*Josh Baird
>>
>> *Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM
>>
>> *To:*af@afmug.com 
>>
>> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
>> What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge
>> protectors before connecting to Netonix.
>>
>>
>> On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown   
>>  wrote:
>>
>> Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix,
>> irrespective of manufacturer.
>>
>> *From:*can...@believewireless.net 
>>
>> *Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM
>>
>> *To:*af@afmug.com 
>>
>> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
>> So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that
>> are connected to Netonix?
>>
>> On

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix


+100

been here too


On 03/25/2017 03:58 PM, George Skorup wrote:
I've never lost one of Chuck's suppressors to lightning/surges. The 5 
or so that I have has all been because of the cable leaking water down 
into GIGE(-POE)-APCs at the bottom.


Had one last week. Of course, had to be the only non-gel tape cable 
running up the tower. I see the ethernet link suddenly start flapping. 
Bounce the MikroTik port. Nope. Log into the SiteMonitor, the 
SyncInjector port shows it's using about 400mA. Seems normal, but 
wait, the other sectors aren't consuming that much. I knew right then 
and there what it was. I get to the site and it's sizzling, rj45 all 
burnt up, but the radio is still powered up and transmitting, just no 
ethernet link. SyncInjector port didn't trip, obviously because the 
fixed 2A limit wasn't reached. Lost nothing other than the GigE-APC. 
Stripped the cable, put a new Rj45 on it without the jacket in the 
plug, tied it to the rack post, put a coupler and a patch cable in 
place of the APC, plugged it all back in and left. Not even any 
ethernet errors with the water in the cable.


AFAIK, CMMs and LMG CTMs have always had port protection. Dumb POE 
injection without over-current protection.. been there, done that. 
In-line suppressors or not, many radios these days are coming with 
surge suppression built in, like 450 APs. Methinks it's a fundamental 
design issues that Mr. Netonix should revise.


On 3/25/2017 8:35 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:
There are other reasons a cable could short: water ingress, 
accidental cut, faulty device.


Changing your surge suppressor is a good idea, but I think PoE 
devices ought to include short circuit protection anyway.



-- Original Message --
From: "Chuck McCown" >
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: 3/25/2017 9:28:51 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, 
you run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will 
not protect itself against shorts.

*From:* Josh Baird
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge 
protectors before connecting to Netonix.


On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, 
irrespective of manufacturer.

*From:* can...@believewireless.net
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are 
connected to Netonix?

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...
Netonix will fix your port for something like $25
*From:* Bill Prince
*Sent:* Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge
suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were
swapping from something else that had been on the cable, and
completely forgot that it was going through that surge
suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

bp


On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt
Hoppes said. You short out their POE and it will blow the
Ethernet transformer.
I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could
detect and shut down in an over current situation. They do
have poly fuses which are slow to react and may protect it
from a very brief short, but longer shorts will indeed harm
the port feeding the transformer.
So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive
POE a plain surge suppressor should not be used.  I am working
some “non plain” surge suppressors now ;-) Stay tuned to
this bat channel and a big thanks to Matt for forcing me to
learn something new.  It was painful, but I can do painful
things when I have to.
*From:* Chuck McCown
*Sent:* Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Netonix
tnx
*From:* Josh Luthman
*Sent:* Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Netonix
chris.sisler
( A )
netlinx.net 
Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373
On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Chuck McCown
 wrote:

Anyone know the email for the guy that runs Netonix?







--
Mitch Koep

A Better Wireless
218-851-8689 cell

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

2017-03-25 Thread Jon Langeler

That sounds nice of you :-)

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


> On Mar 24, 2017, at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:
> 
> I am going to fix this little problem...
>  
> Netonix will fix your port for something like $25
>  
> From: Bill Prince
> Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>  
> Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge suppressor, 
> and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping from something else 
> that had been on the cable, and completely forgot that it was going through 
> that surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned.
> 
> bp
> 
> 
>> On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>> OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt Hoppes said.  
>> You short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet transformer. 
>>  
>> I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect and shut 
>> down in an over current situation.  They do have poly fuses which are slow 
>> to react and may protect it from a very brief short, but longershorts 
>> will indeed harm the port feeding the transformer. 
>>  
>> So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive POE a plain 
>> surge suppressor should not be used.  I am working some “non plain” surge 
>> suppressors now ;-)  Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to 
>> Matt for forcing me to learn something new.  It was painful, but I can do 
>> painful things when I have to. 
>>  
>> From: Chuck McCown
>> Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix
>>  
>> tnx
>>  
>> From: Josh Luthman
>> Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix
>>  
>> chris.sisler
>> ( A )
>> netlinx.net
>>  
>>  
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>  
>>> On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:
>>> Anyone know the email for the guy that runs Netonix?
>

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

2017-03-25 Thread Jon Langeler

Go look at the prices they charge for these. They are very reasonable. We've 
had hit and miss luck with Toughswitches. I'm thankful we have a 'real' switch 
to use now...

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


> On Mar 25, 2017, at 10:31 AM, Mitch Koep  wrote:
> 
> I would agree so why do we pay to fix or to add
> 
> additional equipment to modify?
> 
> I guess I will hold off from anymore Netonix.
> 
> 
> Mitch
> 
>> On 03/25/2017 09:27 AM, Mike Hammett wrote:
>> I would say yes.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions
>> 
>> Midwest Internet Exchange
>> 
>> The Brothers WISP
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: "Mitch Koep" 
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 9:23:08 AM
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>> 
>> Is this a design error that Netonix needs to correct?
>> 
>> 
>> > What is the lesser of two problems.  Leaving a lot of expensive stuff 
>> > unprotected or risk replacing a Netonix switch?
>> >
>> > Chuck McCown wrote:
>> >> I would not put any surge protection on Netonix period, top or 
>> >> bottom.  If it is POE and powered by a passive source you run a risk 
>> >> of smoking it with any surge suppressor.
>> >> I have two devices designed, one is an ancillary fuse to put inline 
>> >> with Netonix.  The second is adding fusing to my surge protectors if 
>> >> I can fit it in.  The external in line fuse product is ready for 
>> >> prototyping.
>> >> *From:* David Coudron
>> >> *Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
>> >> *To:* af@afmug.com
>> >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>> >>
>> >> We are also very interested in this topic.   We will be building out 
>> >> 10 new towers in the next few months, and will be making the change 
>> >> to Netonix switches (we had previously used a different type of 
>> >> switch).  I the past we had put Transtector surge protectors on the 
>> >> tower top and in the cabinet on the ground. From what you are saying 
>> >> in thread, we should not plan on surge protectors in the cabinet, but 
>> >> what is the recommended change for the tower top, if any?
>> >>
>> >> Thanks,
>> >>
>> >> *David Coudron*
>> >>
>> >> david.coud...@advantenon.com|*Mobile: *612-991-7474
>> >>
>> >> *Advantenon, Inc. 
>> >> *cid:image001.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image002.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image003.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image004.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0
>> >>
>> >> i...@advantenon.com|3500 Vicksburg Lane N, Suite 315, Plymouth, MN 
>> >> 55447|www.advantenon.com|*Phone:*800-704-4720|*Local:
>> >>  
>> >> *612-454-1545
>> >>
>> >> *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
>> >> *Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
>> >> *To:* af@afmug.com
>> >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>> >>
>> >> If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, 
>> >> you run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not 
>> >> protect itself against shorts.
>> >>
>> >> *From:*Josh Baird
>> >>
>> >> *Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM
>> >>
>> >> *To:*af@afmug.com
>> >>
>> >> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>> >>
>> >> What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge 
>> >> protectors before connecting to Netonix.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix,
>> >> irrespective of manufacturer.
>> >>
>> >> *From:*can...@believewireless.net
>> >>
>> >> *Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM
>> >>
>> >> *To:*af@afmug.com
>> >>
>> >> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>> >>
>> >> So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that
>> >> are connected to Netonix?
>> >>
>> >> On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown 
>> >> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> I am going to fix this little problem...
>> >>
>> >> Netonix will fix your port for something like $25
>> >>
>> >> *From:*Bill Prince
>> >>
>> >> *Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM
>> >>
>> >> *To:*af@afmug.com
>> >>
>> >> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>> >>
>> >> Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium
>> >> surge suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We
>> >> were swapping from something else that had been on the cable,
>> >> and completely forgot that it was going through that surge
>> >> suppressor. Hard lesson learned.
>> >>
>> >> bp
>> >>
>> >> 
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>> >>
>> >> OK, had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as
>> >> Matt Hoppes said. You short out their POE and it will blow
>> >>

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

2017-03-25 Thread George Skorup

I've never lost one of Chuck's suppressors to lightning/surges. The 5 or 
so that I have has all been because of the cable leaking water down into 
GIGE(-POE)-APCs at the bottom.


Had one last week. Of course, had to be the only non-gel tape cable 
running up the tower. I see the ethernet link suddenly start flapping. 
Bounce the MikroTik port. Nope. Log into the SiteMonitor, the 
SyncInjector port shows it's using about 400mA. Seems normal, but wait, 
the other sectors aren't consuming that much. I knew right then and 
there what it was. I get to the site and it's sizzling, rj45 all burnt 
up, but the radio is still powered up and transmitting, just no ethernet 
link. SyncInjector port didn't trip, obviously because the fixed 2A 
limit wasn't reached. Lost nothing other than the GigE-APC. Stripped the 
cable, put a new Rj45 on it without the jacket in the plug, tied it to 
the rack post, put a coupler and a patch cable in place of the APC, 
plugged it all back in and left. Not even any ethernet errors with the 
water in the cable.


AFAIK, CMMs and LMG CTMs have always had port protection. Dumb POE 
injection without over-current protection.. been there, done that. 
In-line suppressors or not, many radios these days are coming with surge 
suppression built in, like 450 APs. Methinks it's a fundamental design 
issues that Mr. Netonix should revise.


On 3/25/2017 8:35 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:
There are other reasons a cable could short: water ingress, accidental 
cut, faulty device.


Changing your surge suppressor is a good idea, but I think PoE devices 
ought to include short circuit protection anyway.



-- Original Message --
From: "Chuck McCown" >
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: 3/25/2017 9:28:51 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, 
you run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not 
protect itself against shorts.

*From:* Josh Baird
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge 
protectors before connecting to Netonix.


On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, 
irrespective of manufacturer.

*From:* can...@believewireless.net
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are 
connected to Netonix?

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...
Netonix will fix your port for something like $25
*From:* Bill Prince
*Sent:* Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge
suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were
swapping from something else that had been on the cable, and
completely forgot that it was going through that surge
suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

bp


On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt
Hoppes said. You short out their POE and it will blow the
Ethernet transformer.
I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could
detect and shut down in an over current situation. They do have
poly fuses which are slow to react and may protect it from a
very brief short, but longer shorts will indeed harm the port
feeding the transformer.
So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive POE
a plain surge suppressor should not be used.  I am working some
“non plain” surge suppressors now ;-) Stay tuned to this
bat channel and a big thanks to Matt for forcing me to learn
something new.  It was painful, but I can do painful things
when I have to.
*From:* Chuck McCown
*Sent:* Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Netonix
tnx
*From:* Josh Luthman
*Sent:* Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Netonix
chris.sisler
( A )
netlinx.net 
Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373
On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Chuck McCown
 wrote:

Anyone know the email for the guy that runs Netonix?

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

No

From: Jeremy 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:28 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

So, we used to use Cisco DC switches and power everything with the 
GIGE-POE-APC.  On the sites that have been upgraded to Netonix switches, I 
still power them with the surge suppressor, and just use the Netonix as a 
switchso I am not using the POE of the Netonix.  On new sites we have been 
running straight NEtonix without the suppressors.  Are there any issues with 
using the suppressors with Netonix switches in the event that we are still 
powering them with the suppressors?

On Sat, Mar 25, 2017 at 8:16 AM, Jay Weekley  wrote:

  What is the lesser of two problems.  Leaving a lot of  expensive stuff 
unprotected or risk replacing a Netonix switch?

  Chuck McCown wrote:

I would not put any surge protection on Netonix period, top or bottom.  If 
it is POE and powered by a passive source you run a risk of smoking it with any 
surge suppressor.
I have two devices designed, one is an ancillary fuse to put inline with 
Netonix.  The second is adding fusing to my surge protectors if I can fit it 
in.  The external in line fuse product is ready for prototyping.
*From:* David Coudron
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

We are also very interested in this topic.   We will be building out 10 new 
towers in the next few months, and will be making the change to Netonix 
switches (we had previously used a different type of switch).  I the past we 
had put Transtector surge protectors on the tower top and in the cabinet on the 
ground.   From what you are saying in thread, we should not plan on surge 
protectors in the cabinet, but what is the recommended change for the tower 
top, if any?

Thanks,

*David Coudron*

david.coud...@advantenon.com|*Mobile: *612-991-7474

*Advantenon, Inc. 
*cid:image001.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image002.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image003.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image004.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0

i...@advantenon.com|3500 Vicksburg Lane N, Suite 315, Plymouth, MN 
55447|www.advantenon.com|*Phone:*800-704-4720|*Local:
 *612-454-1545

*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, you 
run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not protect 
itself against shorts.

*From:*Josh Baird

*Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge protectors 
before connecting to Netonix.

On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix,
irrespective of manufacturer.

*From:*can...@believewireless.net

*Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that
are connected to Netonix?

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown 
wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...

Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

*From:*Bill Prince

*Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium
surge suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We
were swapping from something else that had been on the cable,
and completely forgot that it was going through that surge
suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

bp

On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

OK, had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as
Matt Hoppes said. You short out their POE and it will blow
the Ethernet transformer.

I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that
could detect and shut down in an over current situation.
They do have poly fuses which are slow to react and may
protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will
indeed harm the port feeding the transformer.

So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on
passive POE a plain surge suppressor should not be used.
 I am working some

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix


I would agree so why do we pay to fix or to add

additional equipment to modify?

I guess I will hold off from anymore Netonix.


Mitch

On 03/25/2017 09:27 AM, Mike Hammett wrote:

I would say yes.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 





*From: *"Mitch Koep" 
*To: *af@afmug.com
*Sent: *Saturday, March 25, 2017 9:23:08 AM
*Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Is this a design error that Netonix needs to correct?


> What is the lesser of two problems.  Leaving a lot of expensive stuff
> unprotected or risk replacing a Netonix switch?
>
> Chuck McCown wrote:
>> I would not put any surge protection on Netonix period, top or
>> bottom.  If it is POE and powered by a passive source you run a risk
>> of smoking it with any surge suppressor.
>> I have two devices designed, one is an ancillary fuse to put inline
>> with Netonix.  The second is adding fusing to my surge protectors if
>> I can fit it in.  The external in line fuse product is ready for
>> prototyping.
>> *From:* David Coudron
>> *Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
>> *To:* af@afmug.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
>> We are also very interested in this topic.   We will be building out
>> 10 new towers in the next few months, and will be making the change
>> to Netonix switches (we had previously used a different type of
>> switch).  I the past we had put Transtector surge protectors on the
>> tower top and in the cabinet on the ground. From what you are saying
>> in thread, we should not plan on surge protectors in the cabinet, but
>> what is the recommended change for the tower top, if any?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> *David Coudron*
>>
>> david.coud...@advantenon.com|*Mobile: *612-991-7474
>>
>> *Advantenon, Inc.
>> 
*cid:image001.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image002.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image003.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image004.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0

>>
>> i...@advantenon.com|3500 Vicksburg Lane N, Suite 315, Plymouth, MN
>> 
55447|www.advantenon.com|*Phone:*800-704-4720|*Local: 


>> *612-454-1545
>>
>> *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
>> *Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
>> *To:* af@afmug.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
>> If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground,
>> you run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not
>> protect itself against shorts.
>>
>> *From:*Josh Baird
>>
>> *Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM
>>
>> *To:*af@afmug.com
>>
>> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
>> What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge
>> protectors before connecting to Netonix.
>>
>>
>> On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:
>>
>> Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix,
>> irrespective of manufacturer.
>>
>> *From:*can...@believewireless.net
>>
>> *Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM
>>
>> *To:*af@afmug.com
>>
>> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
>> So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that
>> are connected to Netonix?
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown 
>> wrote:
>>
>> I am going to fix this little problem...
>>
>> Netonix will fix your port for something like $25
>>
>> *From:*Bill Prince
>>
>> *Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM
>>
>> *To:*af@afmug.com
>>
>> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
>> Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium
>> surge suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We
>> were swapping from something else that had been on the cable,
>> and completely forgot that it was going through that surge
>> suppressor. Hard lesson learned.
>>
>> bp
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>> On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>>
>> OK, had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as
>> Matt Hoppes said. You short out their POE and it will blow
>> the Ethernet transformer.
>>
>> I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that
>>

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

2017-03-25 Thread Jeremy

So, we used to use Cisco DC switches and power everything with the
GIGE-POE-APC.  On the sites that have been upgraded to Netonix switches, I
still power them with the surge suppressor, and just use the Netonix as a
switchso I am not using the POE of the Netonix.  On new sites we have
been running straight NEtonix without the suppressors.  Are there any
issues with using the suppressors with Netonix switches in the event that
we are still powering them with the suppressors?

On Sat, Mar 25, 2017 at 8:16 AM, Jay Weekley 
wrote:

> What is the lesser of two problems.  Leaving a lot of  expensive stuff
> unprotected or risk replacing a Netonix switch?
>
> Chuck McCown wrote:
>
>> I would not put any surge protection on Netonix period, top or bottom.
>> If it is POE and powered by a passive source you run a risk of smoking it
>> with any surge suppressor.
>> I have two devices designed, one is an ancillary fuse to put inline with
>> Netonix.  The second is adding fusing to my surge protectors if I can fit
>> it in.  The external in line fuse product is ready for prototyping.
>> *From:* David Coudron
>> *Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
>> *To:* af@afmug.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
>> We are also very interested in this topic.   We will be building out 10
>> new towers in the next few months, and will be making the change to Netonix
>> switches (we had previously used a different type of switch).  I the past
>> we had put Transtector surge protectors on the tower top and in the cabinet
>> on the ground.   From what you are saying in thread, we should not plan on
>> surge protectors in the cabinet, but what is the recommended change for the
>> tower top, if any?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> *David Coudron*
>>
>> david.coud...@advantenon.com|*Mobile: *612-991-7474
>>
>> *Advantenon, Inc. *cid:image001.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0<
>> http://www.linkedin.com/company/Advantenon>cid:image00
>> 2.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0
>> cid:image003.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0> >cid:image004.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0
>>
>> i...@advantenon.com|3500 Vicksburg Lane N, Suite 315, Plymouth, MN 55447|
>> www.advantenon.com|*Phone:*800-704-4720|*Local:
>> *612-454-1545
>>
>> *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
>> *Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
>> *To:* af@afmug.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
>> If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, you
>> run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not protect
>> itself against shorts.
>>
>> *From:*Josh Baird
>>
>> *Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM
>>
>> *To:*af@afmug.com
>>
>> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
>> What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge protectors
>> before connecting to Netonix.
>>
>>
>> On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:
>>
>> Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix,
>> irrespective of manufacturer.
>>
>> *From:*can...@believewireless.net
>>
>> *Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM
>>
>> *To:*af@afmug.com
>>
>> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
>> So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that
>> are connected to Netonix?
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown 
>> wrote:
>>
>> I am going to fix this little problem...
>>
>> Netonix will fix your port for something like $25
>>
>> *From:*Bill Prince
>>
>> *Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM
>>
>> *To:*af@afmug.com
>>
>> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>
>> Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium
>> surge suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We
>> were swapping from something else that had been on the cable,
>> and completely forgot that it was going through that surge
>> suppressor. Hard lesson learned.
>>
>> bp
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>> On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>>
>> OK, had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as
>> Matt Hoppes said. You short out their POE and it will blow
>> the Ethernet transformer.
>>
>> I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that
>> could detect and shut down in an over current situation.
>> They do have poly fuses which are slow to react and may
>> protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will
>> indeed harm the port feeding the transformer.
>>
>> So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on
>> passive POE a plain surge suppressor should not be used.
>>I am working some “non plain” surge suppressors now
>> ;-) Stay tuned to

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

I would say yes. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Mitch Koep"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 9:23:08 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix 

Is this a design error that Netonix needs to correct? 


> What is the lesser of two problems. Leaving a lot of expensive stuff 
> unprotected or risk replacing a Netonix switch? 
> 
> Chuck McCown wrote: 
>> I would not put any surge protection on Netonix period, top or 
>> bottom. If it is POE and powered by a passive source you run a risk 
>> of smoking it with any surge suppressor. 
>> I have two devices designed, one is an ancillary fuse to put inline 
>> with Netonix. The second is adding fusing to my surge protectors if 
>> I can fit it in. The external in line fuse product is ready for 
>> prototyping. 
>> *From:* David Coudron 
>> *Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM 
>> *To:* af@afmug.com 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix 
>> 
>> We are also very interested in this topic. We will be building out 
>> 10 new towers in the next few months, and will be making the change 
>> to Netonix switches (we had previously used a different type of 
>> switch). I the past we had put Transtector surge protectors on the 
>> tower top and in the cabinet on the ground. From what you are saying 
>> in thread, we should not plan on surge protectors in the cabinet, but 
>> what is the recommended change for the tower top, if any? 
>> 
>> Thanks, 
>> 
>> *David Coudron* 
>> 
>> david.coud...@advantenon.com|*Mobile: *612-991-7474 
>> 
>> *Advantenon, Inc. 
>> *cid:image001.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image002.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image003.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image004.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0
>>  
>> 
>> i...@advantenon.com|3500 Vicksburg Lane N, Suite 315, Plymouth, MN 
>> 55447|www.advantenon.com|*Phone:*800-704-4720|*Local:
>>  
>> *612-454-1545 
>> 
>> *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown 
>> *Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM 
>> *To:* af@afmug.com 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix 
>> 
>> If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, 
>> you run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer. It will not 
>> protect itself against shorts. 
>> 
>> *From:*Josh Baird 
>> 
>> *Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM 
>> 
>> *To:*af@afmug.com 
>> 
>> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix 
>> 
>> What exactly is the reason? We always run through your surge 
>> protectors before connecting to Netonix. 
>> 
>> 
>> On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote: 
>> 
>> Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, 
>> irrespective of manufacturer. 
>> 
>> *From:*can...@believewireless.net 
>> 
>> *Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM 
>> 
>> *To:*af@afmug.com 
>> 
>> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix 
>> 
>> So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that 
>> are connected to Netonix? 
>> 
>> On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  
>> wrote: 
>> 
>> I am going to fix this little problem... 
>> 
>> Netonix will fix your port for something like $25 
>> 
>> *From:*Bill Prince 
>> 
>> *Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM 
>> 
>> *To:*af@afmug.com 
>> 
>> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix 
>> 
>> Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium 
>> surge suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We 
>> were swapping from something else that had been on the cable, 
>> and completely forgot that it was going through that surge 
>> suppressor. Hard lesson learned. 
>> 
>> bp 
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote: 
>> 
>> OK, had an exchange with Netonix today. It is just as 
>> Matt Hoppes said. You short out their POE and it will blow 
>> the Ethernet transformer. 
>> 
>> I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that 
>> could detect and shut down in an over current situation. 
>> They do have poly fuses which are slow to react and may 
>> protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will 
>> indeed harm the port feeding the transformer. 
>> 
>> So, Netonix is not active POE. I would say that on 
>> passive POE a plain surge suppressor should not be used. 
>> I am working some “non plain” surge suppressors now 
>> ;-) Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to 
>> Matt for forcing me to learn something new. It was 
>> painful, but I can do painful things when I have to. 
>> 
>> *From:*Chuck McCown 
>> 
>> *Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM 
>> 
>> *To:*af@afmug.com 
>> 
>> *Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Netonix 
>> 
>> tnx 
>> 
>> *From:*Josh Luthman 
>> 
>> *Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM 
>> 
>> *To:*af@afmug.com 
>> 
>>

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Is this a design error that Netonix needs to correct?

What is the lesser of two problems. Leaving a lot of expensive stuff
unprotected or risk replacing a Netonix switch?

Chuck McCown wrote:
I would not put any surge protection on Netonix period, top or
bottom. If it is POE and powered by a passive source you run a risk
of smoking it with any surge suppressor.
I have two devices designed, one is an ancillary fuse to put inline
with Netonix. The second is adding fusing to my surge protectors if
I can fit it in. The external in line fuse product is ready for
prototyping.

*From:* David Coudron
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

We are also very interested in this topic. We will be building out
10 new towers in the next few months, and will be making the change
to Netonix switches (we had previously used a different type of
switch). I the past we had put Transtector surge protectors on the
tower top and in the cabinet on the ground. From what you are saying
in thread, we should not plan on surge protectors in the cabinet, but
what is the recommended change for the tower top, if any?

Thanks,

*David Coudron*

david.coud...@advantenon.com|*Mobile: *612-991-7474

*Advantenon, Inc.
*cid:image001.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image002.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image003.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image004.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0

i...@advantenon.com|3500 Vicksburg Lane N, Suite 315, Plymouth, MN
55447|www.advantenon.com|*Phone:*800-704-4720|*Local:
*612-454-1545

*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground,
you run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer. It will not
protect itself against shorts.

*From:*Josh Baird

*Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

What exactly is the reason? We always run through your surge
protectors before connecting to Netonix.

On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix,
irrespective of manufacturer.

*From:*can...@believewireless.net

*Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that
are connected to Netonix?

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown
wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...

Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

*From:*Bill Prince

*Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium
surge suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We
were swapping from something else that had been on the cable,
and completely forgot that it was going through that surge
suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

OK, had an exchange with Netonix today. It is just as
Matt Hoppes said. You short out their POE and it will blow
the Ethernet transformer.

I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that
could detect and shut down in an over current situation.
They do have poly fuses which are slow to react and may
protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will
indeed harm the port feeding the transformer.

So, Netonix is not active POE. I would say that on
passive POE a plain surge suppressor should not be used.
I am working some “non plain” surge suppressors now

;-) Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to
Matt for forcing me to learn something new. It was
painful, but I can do painful things when I have to.

*From:*Chuck McCown

*Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

tnx

*From:*Josh Luthman

*Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

chris.sisler

( A )

netlinx.net

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Netonix will fix blown ports for $25.

-Original Message- 
From: Jay Weekley

Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:16 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

What is the lesser of two problems.  Leaving a lot of  expensive stuff
unprotected or risk replacing a Netonix switch?

Chuck McCown wrote:
I would not put any surge protection on Netonix period, top or bottom.  If 
it is POE and powered by a passive source you run a risk of smoking it 
with any surge suppressor.
I have two devices designed, one is an ancillary fuse to put inline with 
Netonix.  The second is adding fusing to my surge protectors if I can fit 
it in.  The external in line fuse product is ready for prototyping.

*From:* David Coudron
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

We are also very interested in this topic.   We will be building out 10 
new towers in the next few months, and will be making the change to 
Netonix switches (we had previously used a different type of switch).  I 
the past we had put Transtector surge protectors on the tower top and in 
the cabinet on the ground.   From what you are saying in thread, we should 
not plan on surge protectors in the cabinet, but what is the recommended 
change for the tower top, if any?

Thanks,

*David Coudron*

david.coud...@advantenon.com|*Mobile: *612-991-7474

*Advantenon, Inc. 
*cid:image001.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image002.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image003.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image004.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0

i...@advantenon.com|3500 Vicksburg Lane N, Suite 315, Plymouth, MN 
55447|www.advantenon.com|*Phone:*800-704-4720|*Local: 
*612-454-1545

*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, you 
run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not protect 
itself against shorts.

*From:*Josh Baird

*Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge protectors 
before connecting to Netonix.

On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix,
irrespective of manufacturer.

*From:*can...@believewireless.net

*Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that
are connected to Netonix?

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown 
wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...

Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

*From:*Bill Prince

*Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium
surge suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We
were swapping from something else that had been on the cable,
and completely forgot that it was going through that surge
suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

bp

On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

OK, had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as
Matt Hoppes said. You short out their POE and it will blow
the Ethernet transformer.

I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that
could detect and shut down in an over current situation.
They do have poly fuses which are slow to react and may
protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will
indeed harm the port feeding the transformer.

So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on
passive POE a plain surge suppressor should not be used. I am 
working some “non plain” surge suppressors now

;-) Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to
Matt for forcing me to learn something new.  It was
painful, but I can do painful things when I have to.

*From:*Chuck McCown

*Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

tnx

*From:*Josh Luthman

*Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

chris.sisler

( A )

netlinx.net 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

That is exactly what it is.  Universal for all POE products.  

From: Faisal Imtiaz 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:16 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

>>  The external in line fuse product is ready for prototyping.  

Let us know how this goes, if the test are successful, I would suggest making 
an 'external in-line fuse', which would make for a quick retrofit for existing 
modules out there .

Thanks.

Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet & Telecom
7266 SW 48 Street
Miami, FL 33155
Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net

  From: "Chuck McCown" 
  To: af@afmug.com
  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 9:38:12 AM
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  I would not put any surge protection on Netonix period, top or bottom.  If it 
is POE and powered by a passive source you run a risk of smoking it with any 
surge suppressor. 

  I have two devices designed, one is an ancillary fuse to put inline with 
Netonix.  The second is adding fusing to my surge protectors if I can fit it 
in.  The external in line fuse product is ready for prototyping. 

  From: David Coudron
  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
  To: af@afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  We are also very interested in this topic.   We will be building out 10 new 
towers in the next few months, and will be making the change to Netonix 
switches (we had previously used a different type of switch).  I the past we 
had put Transtector surge protectors on the tower top and in the cabinet on the 
ground.   From what you are saying in thread, we should not plan on surge 
protectors in the cabinet, but what is the recommended change for the tower 
top, if any?   

  Thanks,  

  David Coudron

  david.coud...@advantenon.com |  Mobile: 612-991-7474

  Advantenon, Inc.   

  i...@advantenon.com |  3500 Vicksburg Lane N, Suite 315, Plymouth, MN 55447 | 
 www.advantenon.com |  Phone: 800-704-4720 |  Local: 612-454-1545 

  From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
  To: af@afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, you run 
the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not protect itself 
against shorts.

  From: Josh Baird 

  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM

  To: af@afmug.com 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge protectors 
before connecting to Netonix.

  On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, irrespective of 
manufacturer.  

From: can...@believewireless.net 

Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are 
connected to Netonix?

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

  I am going to fix this little problem...

  Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

  From: Bill Prince 

  Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM

  To: af@afmug.com 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge 
suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping from 
something else that had been on the cable, and completely forgot that it was 
going through that surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

bp On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt Hoppes 
said.  You short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet transformer.  

I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect and 
shut down in an over current situation.  They do have poly fuses which are slow 
to react and may protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will 
indeed harm the port feeding the transformer.  

So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive POE a plain 
surge suppressor should not be used.  I am working some “non plain” surge 
suppressors now ;-)  Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to 
Matt for forcing me to learn something new.  It was painful, but I can do 
painful things when I have to.  

From: Chuck McCown 

Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

tnx

From: Josh Luthman 

Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

chris.sisler 

( A )

netlinx.net

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct:

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

2017-03-25 Thread Jay Weekley

What is the lesser of two problems. Leaving a lot of expensive stuff
unprotected or risk replacing a Netonix switch?

Chuck McCown wrote:
I would not put any surge protection on Netonix period, top or
bottom. If it is POE and powered by a passive source you run a risk
of smoking it with any surge suppressor.
I have two devices designed, one is an ancillary fuse to put inline
with Netonix. The second is adding fusing to my surge protectors if I
can fit it in. The external in line fuse product is ready for
prototyping.

*From:* David Coudron
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

We are also very interested in this topic. We will be building out
10 new towers in the next few months, and will be making the change to
Netonix switches (we had previously used a different type of switch).
I the past we had put Transtector surge protectors on the tower top
and in the cabinet on the ground. From what you are saying in
thread, we should not plan on surge protectors in the cabinet, but
what is the recommended change for the tower top, if any?

Thanks,

*David Coudron*

david.coud...@advantenon.com|*Mobile: *612-991-7474

*Advantenon, Inc.
*cid:image001.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image002.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image003.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0cid:image004.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0

i...@advantenon.com|3500 Vicksburg Lane N, Suite 315, Plymouth, MN
55447|www.advantenon.com|*Phone:*800-704-4720|*Local:
*612-454-1545

*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
*Sent:* Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground,
you run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer. It will not
protect itself against shorts.

*From:*Josh Baird

*Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

What exactly is the reason? We always run through your surge
protectors before connecting to Netonix.

On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix,
irrespective of manufacturer.

*From:*can...@believewireless.net

*Sent:*Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that
are connected to Netonix?

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown
wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...

Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

*From:*Bill Prince

*Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium
surge suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We
were swapping from something else that had been on the cable,
and completely forgot that it was going through that surge
suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

OK, had an exchange with Netonix today. It is just as
Matt Hoppes said. You short out their POE and it will blow
the Ethernet transformer.

I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that
could detect and shut down in an over current situation.
They do have poly fuses which are slow to react and may
protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will
indeed harm the port feeding the transformer.

So, Netonix is not active POE. I would say that on
passive POE a plain surge suppressor should not be used.
I am working some “non plain” surge suppressors now

;-) Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to
Matt for forcing me to learn something new. It was
painful, but I can do painful things when I have to.

*From:*Chuck McCown

*Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

tnx

*From:*Josh Luthman

*Sent:*Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM

*To:*af@afmug.com

*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

chris.sisler

( A )

netlinx.net

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Mar 24,

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

2017-03-25 Thread Faisal Imtiaz

>> 
The external in line fuse product is ready for prototyping. 
Let us know how this goes, if the test are successful, I would suggest making 
an 'external in-line fuse', which would make for a quick retrofit for existing 
modules out there . 

Thanks. 

Faisal Imtiaz 
Snappy Internet & Telecom 
7266 SW 48 Street 
Miami, FL 33155 
Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net 

> From: "Chuck McCown" 
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 9:38:12 AM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

> I would not put any surge protection on Netonix period, top or bottom. If it 
> is
> POE and powered by a passive source you run a risk of smoking it with any 
> surge
> suppressor.
> I have two devices designed, one is an ancillary fuse to put inline with
> Netonix. The second is adding fusing to my surge protectors if I can fit it 
> in.
> The external in line fuse product is ready for prototyping.
> From: David Coudron
> Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

> We are also very interested in this topic. We will be building out 10 new 
> towers
> in the next few months, and will be making the change to Netonix switches (we
> had previously used a different type of switch). I the past we had put
> Transtector surge protectors on the tower top and in the cabinet on the 
> ground.
> From what you are saying in thread, we should not plan on surge protectors in
> the cabinet, but what is the recommended change for the tower top, if any?

> Thanks,

> David Coudron

> david.coud...@advantenon.com | Mobile: 612-991-7474

> Advantenon, Inc.

> i...@advantenon.com | 3500 Vicksburg Lane N , Suite 315 , Plymouth, MN 55447 |
> www.advantenon.com | Phone: 800-704-4720 | Local: 612-454-1545

> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
> Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

> If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, you run 
> the
> risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer. It will not protect itself 
> against
> shorts.

> From: Josh Baird

> Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM

> To: af@afmug.com

> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

> What exactly is the reason? We always run through your surge protectors before
> connecting to Netonix.

> On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote:

>> Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, irrespective of
>> manufacturer.

>> From: can...@believewireless.net

>> Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM

>> To: af@afmug.com

>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

>> So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are 
>> connected to
>> Netonix?

>> On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote:
>>> I am going to fix this little problem...

>>> Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

>>> From: Bill Prince

>>> Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM

>>> To: af@afmug.com

>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

>>> Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge suppressor, 
>>> and
>>> it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping from something else 
>>> that
>>> had been on the cable, and completely forgot that it was going through that
>>> surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned.
>>> bp
>>> 

>>> On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

 OK, had an exchange with Netonix today. It is just as Matt Hoppes said. You
 short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet transformer.

 I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect and 
 shut
 down in an over current situation. They do have poly fuses which are slow 
 to
 react and may protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will 
 indeed
 harm the port feeding the transformer.

 So, Netonix is not active POE. I would say that on passive POE a plain 
 surge
 suppressor should not be used. I am working some “non plain” surge 
 suppressors
 now ;-) Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to Matt for 
 forcing
 me to learn something new. It was painful, but I can do painful things 
 when I
 have to.

 From: Chuck McCown

 Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM

 To: af@afmug.com

 Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

 tnx

 From: Josh Luthman

 Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM

 To: af@afmug.com

 Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

 chris.sisler

 ( A )

 netlinx.net

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Chuck McCown < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote:
> Anyone know the email for the guy that runs Netonix?

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Netonix is a fantastic product.  Give me a few weeks and we will have a fix for 
this.  

From: Stefan Englhardt 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:56 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

We are a fan of Netonix but had some events which convince us to not connect 
all Devices to Netonix.

We had AC Power supply failing. We had a defective Arfiber 5x powered by 
Netonix 24V. This took down the whole 24V chain of this Netonix switch and 
causes the switch to reboot. We had some fuse blows at sites this did not 
happen before using normal poe power supplies. This happened without lightning 
event. Chris says this is poor grounding. We see Netonix changed something to 
resist better with „poor grounding“.

So we might use separate Switches for backhauls or just go back and connect 
backhauls with poe injectors directly to the tower router. I do not like when a 
single bad cable is able to take down the whole site.

We’ll see what Mikrotik does. They will do some announcements end of this 
month. I see their new POE devices are gigabit and power 24 or 48 if you feed 
them with the appropriate voltage. If they do a capable tower router with poe 
we might need no switch at all …

Von: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] Im Auftrag von David Coudron
Gesendet: Samstag, 25. März 2017 14:35
An: af@afmug.com
Betreff: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

We are also very interested in this topic.   We will be building out 10 new 
towers in the next few months, and will be making the change to Netonix 
switches (we had previously used a different type of switch).  I the past we 
had put Transtector surge protectors on the tower top and in the cabinet on the 
ground.   From what you are saying in thread, we should not plan on surge 
protectors in the cabinet, but what is the recommended change for the tower 
top, if any?   

Thanks,  

David Coudron

david.coud...@advantenon.com |  Mobile: 612-991-7474

Advantenon, Inc.   

i...@advantenon.com |  3500 Vicksburg Lane N, Suite 315, Plymouth, MN 55447 |  
www.advantenon.com |  Phone: 800-704-4720 |  Local: 612-454-1545 

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, you run 
the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not protect itself 
against shorts.

From: Josh Baird 

Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge protectors before 
connecting to Netonix.

On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

  Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, irrespective of 
manufacturer.  

  From: can...@believewireless.net 

  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM

  To: af@afmug.com 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are connected 
to Netonix?

  On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...

Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

From: Bill Prince 

Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge suppressor, 
and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping from something else 
that had been on the cable, and completely forgot that it was going through 
that surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

bp On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

  OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt Hoppes said. 
 You short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet transformer.  

  I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect and 
shut down in an over current situation.  They do have poly fuses which are slow 
to react and may protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will 
indeed harm the port feeding the transformer.  

  So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive POE a plain 
surge suppressor should not be used.  I am working some “non plain” surge 
suppressors now ;-)  Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to 
Matt for forcing me to learn something new.  It was painful, but I can do 
painful things when I have to.  

  From: Chuck McCown 

  Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM

  To: af@afmug.com 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

  tnx

  From: Josh Luthman 

  Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM

  To: af@afmug.com 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

  chris.sisler 

  ( A )

  netlinx.net

  Josh Luthman
  Office:

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

2017-03-25 Thread Stefan Englhardt

We are a fan of Netonix but had some events which convince us to not connect 
all Devices to Netonix.

We had AC Power supply failing. We had a defective Arfiber 5x powered by 
Netonix 24V. This took down the whole 24V chain of this Netonix switch and 
causes the switch to reboot. We had some fuse blows at sites this did not 
happen before using normal poe power supplies. This happened without lightning 
event. Chris says this is poor grounding. We see Netonix changed something to 
resist better with „poor grounding“.

So we might use separate Switches for backhauls or just go back and connect 
backhauls with poe injectors directly to the tower router. I do not like when a 
single bad cable is able to take down the whole site.



We’ll see what Mikrotik does. They will do some announcements end of this 
month. I see their new POE devices are gigabit and power 24 or 48 if you feed 
them with the appropriate voltage. If they do a capable tower router with poe 
we might need no switch at all …



Von: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] Im Auftrag von David Coudron
Gesendet: Samstag, 25. März 2017 14:35
An: af@afmug.com
Betreff: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix



We are also very interested in this topic.   We will be building out 10 new 
towers in the next few months, and will be making the change to Netonix 
switches (we had previously used a different type of switch).  I the past we 
had put Transtector surge protectors on the tower top and in the cabinet on the 
ground.   From what you are saying in thread, we should not plan on surge 
protectors in the cabinet, but what is the recommended change for the tower 
top, if any?



Thanks,





David Coudron

  david.coud...@advantenon.com  |  Mobile: 
612-991-7474



Advantenon, Inc.  



  i...@advantenon.com  |  3500 Vicksburg Lane N, 
Suite 315, Plymouth, MN 55447  |    
www.advantenon.com  |  Phone: 800-704-4720  |  Local: 612-454-1545







From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix



If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, you run 
the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not protect itself 
against shorts.



From: Josh Baird

Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix



What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge protectors before 
connecting to Netonix.


On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  > wrote:

Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, irrespective of 
manufacturer.



From: can...@believewireless.net 

Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix



So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are connected 
to Netonix?



On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  > wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...



Netonix will fix your port for something like $25



From: Bill Prince

Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix



Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge suppressor, and 
it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping from something else that 
had been on the cable, and completely forgot that it was going through that 
surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

bp



On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt Hoppes said.  You 
short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet transformer.



I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect and shut 
down in an over current situation.  They do have poly fuses which are slow to 
react and may protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will indeed 
harm the port feeding the transformer.



So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive POE a plain surge 
suppressor should not be used.  I am working some “non plain” surge suppressors 
now ;-)  Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to Matt for 
forcing me to learn something new.  It was painful, but I can do painful things 
when I have to.



From: Chuck McCown

Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix



tnx



From: Josh Luthman

Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix



chris.sisler

( A )

netlinx.net

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Forrest monitors the port current and can interrupt the current fast enough to 
prevent damage.  Not sure about LMG.  

From: Adam Moffett 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:52 AM
To: af@afmug.com ; af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Oh boy.  What about LMG and Packetflux's resettable breakers? Not fast enough?

-- Original Message --
From: "Chuck McCown" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 3/25/2017 9:38:41 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  To be fast enough it will either have to be fuses or it will have to be 
expensive.  

  From: Adam Moffett 
  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  There are other reasons a cable could short: water ingress, accidental cut, 
faulty device.

  Changing your surge suppressor is a good idea, but I think PoE devices ought 
to include short circuit protection anyway.

  -- Original Message --
  From: "Chuck McCown" 
  To: af@afmug.com
  Sent: 3/25/2017 9:28:51 AM
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, you 
run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not protect 
itself against shorts.

From: Josh Baird 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge protectors 
before connecting to Netonix.

On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

  Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, irrespective 
of manufacturer.  

  From: can...@believewireless.net 
  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are 
connected to Netonix?

  On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...

Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

From: Bill Prince 
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge 
suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping from 
something else that had been on the cable, and completely forgot that it was 
going through that surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

bp

On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

  OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt Hoppes 
said.  You short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet transformer.  

  I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect 
and shut down in an over current situation.  They do have poly fuses which are 
slow to react and may protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts 
will indeed harm the port feeding the transformer.  

  So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive POE a 
plain surge suppressor should not be used.  I am working some “non plain” surge 
suppressors now ;-)  Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to 
Matt for forcing me to learn something new.  It was painful, but I can do 
painful things when I have to.  

  From: Chuck McCown 
  Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

  tnx

  From: Josh Luthman 
  Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

  chris.sisler 
  ( A )

  netlinx.net

  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373

  On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Chuck McCown  
wrote:

Anyone know the email for the guy that runs Netonix?

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

2017-03-25 Thread Adam Moffett

Oh boy.  What about LMG and Packetflux's resettable breakers? Not fast 
enough?

-- Original Message --
From: "Chuck McCown" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 3/25/2017 9:38:41 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

To be fast enough it will either have to be fuses or it will have to be 
expensive.

From:Adam Moffett
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

There are other reasons a cable could short: water ingress, accidental 
cut, faulty device.

Changing your surge suppressor is a good idea, but I think PoE devices 
ought to include short circuit protection anyway.

-- Original Message --
From: "Chuck McCown" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 3/25/2017 9:28:51 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, 
you run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not 
protect itself against shorts.

From:Josh Baird
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge 
protectors before connecting to Netonix.

On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, 
irrespective of manufacturer.

From:can...@believewireless.net
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are 
connected to Netonix?

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  
wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...

Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

From:Bill Prince
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge 
suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping 
from something else that had been on the cable, and completely 
forgot that it was going through that surge suppressor. Hard lesson 
learned.

bp 
On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt Hoppes 
said.  You short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet 
transformer.

I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect 
and shut down in an over current situation.  They do have poly 
fuses which are slow to react and may protect it from a very brief 
short, but longer shorts will indeed harm the port feeding the 
transformer.

So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive POE a 
plain surge suppressor should not be used.  I am working some “non 
plain” surge suppressors now ;-)  Stay tuned to this bat 
channel and a big thanks to Matt for forcing me to learn something 
new.  It was painful, but I can do painful things when I have to.

From:Chuck McCown
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

tnx

From:Josh Luthman
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

chris.sisler
( A )
netlinx.net

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Chuck McCown  
wrote:

Anyone know the email for the guy that runs Netonix?

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

To be fast enough it will either have to be fuses or it will have to be 
expensive.  

From: Adam Moffett 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

There are other reasons a cable could short: water ingress, accidental cut, 
faulty device.

Changing your surge suppressor is a good idea, but I think PoE devices ought to 
include short circuit protection anyway.

-- Original Message --
From: "Chuck McCown" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 3/25/2017 9:28:51 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, you run 
the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not protect itself 
against shorts.

  From: Josh Baird 
  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge protectors 
before connecting to Netonix.

  On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, irrespective of 
manufacturer.  

From: can...@believewireless.net 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are 
connected to Netonix?

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

  I am going to fix this little problem...

  Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

  From: Bill Prince 
  Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge 
suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping from 
something else that had been on the cable, and completely forgot that it was 
going through that surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

bp

On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt Hoppes 
said.  You short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet transformer.  

I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect and 
shut down in an over current situation.  They do have poly fuses which are slow 
to react and may protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will 
indeed harm the port feeding the transformer.  

So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive POE a plain 
surge suppressor should not be used.  I am working some “non plain” surge 
suppressors now ;-)  Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to 
Matt for forcing me to learn something new.  It was painful, but I can do 
painful things when I have to.  

From: Chuck McCown 
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

tnx

From: Josh Luthman 
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

chris.sisler 
( A )

netlinx.net

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

  Anyone know the email for the guy that runs Netonix?

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

I would not put any surge protection on Netonix period, top or bottom.  If it 
is POE and powered by a passive source you run a risk of smoking it with any 
surge suppressor.  

I have two devices designed, one is an ancillary fuse to put inline with 
Netonix.  The second is adding fusing to my surge protectors if I can fit it 
in.  The external in line fuse product is ready for prototyping.  

From: David Coudron 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:35 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

We are also very interested in this topic.   We will be building out 10 new 
towers in the next few months, and will be making the change to Netonix 
switches (we had previously used a different type of switch).  I the past we 
had put Transtector surge protectors on the tower top and in the cabinet on the 
ground.   From what you are saying in thread, we should not plan on surge 
protectors in the cabinet, but what is the recommended change for the tower 
top, if any?   

 

Thanks,  

 

 

David Coudron

david.coud...@advantenon.com |  Mobile: 612-991-7474

 

Advantenon, Inc.   

i...@advantenon.com |  3500 Vicksburg Lane N, Suite 315, Plymouth, MN 55447 |  
www.advantenon.com |  Phone: 800-704-4720 |  Local: 612-454-1545 

 



 

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

 

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, you run 
the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not protect itself 
against shorts.

 

From: Josh Baird 

Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

 

What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge protectors before 
connecting to Netonix.


On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

  Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, irrespective of 
manufacturer.  

   

  From: can...@believewireless.net 

  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM

  To: af@afmug.com 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

   

  So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are connected 
to Netonix?

   

  On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...

 

Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

 

From: Bill Prince 

Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

 

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge suppressor, 
and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping from something else 
that had been on the cable, and completely forgot that it was going through 
that surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

bp On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

  OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt Hoppes said. 
 You short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet transformer.  

   

  I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect and 
shut down in an over current situation.  They do have poly fuses which are slow 
to react and may protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will 
indeed harm the port feeding the transformer.  

   

  So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive POE a plain 
surge suppressor should not be used.  I am working some “non plain” surge 
suppressors now ;-)  Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to 
Matt for forcing me to learn something new.  It was painful, but I can do 
painful things when I have to.  

   

  From: Chuck McCown 

  Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM

  To: af@afmug.com 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

   

  tnx

   

  From: Josh Luthman 

  Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM

  To: af@afmug.com 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

   

  chris.sisler 

  ( A )

  netlinx.net

   

   

  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373

   

  On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

Anyone know the email for the guy that runs Netonix?

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

2017-03-25 Thread Adam Moffett

There are other reasons a cable could short: water ingress, accidental 
cut, faulty device.


Changing your surge suppressor is a good idea, but I think PoE devices 
ought to include short circuit protection anyway.



-- Original Message --
From: "Chuck McCown" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 3/25/2017 9:28:51 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, 
you run the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not 
protect itself against shorts.


From:Josh Baird
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge 
protectors before connecting to Netonix.


On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, 
irrespective of manufacturer.


From:can...@believewireless.net
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are 
connected to Netonix?


On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  
wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...

Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

From:Bill Prince
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge 
suppressor, and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping 
from something else that had been on the cable, and completely forgot 
that it was going through that surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned.


bp 
On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt Hoppes 
said.  You short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet 
transformer.


I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect 
and shut down in an over current situation.  They do have poly fuses 
which are slow to react and may protect it from a very brief short, 
but longer shorts will indeed harm the port feeding the transformer.


So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive POE a 
plain surge suppressor should not be used.  I am working some “non 
plain” surge suppressors now ;-)  Stay tuned to this bat channel 
and a big thanks to Matt for forcing me to learn something new.  It 
was painful, but I can do painful things when I have to.


From:Chuck McCown
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

tnx

From:Josh Luthman
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

chris.sisler
( A )
netlinx.net


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Chuck McCown  
wrote:

Anyone know the email for the guy that runs Netonix?

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

2017-03-25 Thread David Coudron

We are also very interested in this topic.   We will be building out 10 new 
towers in the next few months, and will be making the change to Netonix 
switches (we had previously used a different type of switch).  I the past we 
had put Transtector surge protectors on the tower top and in the cabinet on the 
ground.   From what you are saying in thread, we should not plan on surge 
protectors in the cabinet, but what is the recommended change for the tower 
top, if any?

Thanks,

David Coudron
david.coud...@advantenon.com  |  Mobile: 
612-991-7474

Advantenon, Inc. [cid:image001.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0] 

[cid:image002.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0]    
[cid:image003.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0]    
[cid:image004.png@01CEE562.60FF8FC0] 
i...@advantenon.com  |  3500 Vicksburg Lane N, 
Suite 315, Plymouth, MN 55447  |  
www.advantenon.com  |  Phone: 800-704-4720  |  
Local: 612-454-1545

[cid:image010.jpg@01D2A542.AB6A4A20]

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 8:29 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, you run 
the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not protect itself 
against shorts.

From: Josh Baird
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge protectors before 
connecting to Netonix.

On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown 
> wrote:
Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, irrespective of 
manufacturer.

From: can...@believewireless.net
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are connected 
to Netonix?

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown 
> wrote:
I am going to fix this little problem...

Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

From: Bill Prince
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge suppressor, and 
it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping from something else that 
had been on the cable, and completely forgot that it was going through that 
surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

bp

On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt Hoppes said.  You 
short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet transformer.

I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect and shut 
down in an over current situation.  They do have poly fuses which are slow to 
react and may protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will indeed 
harm the port feeding the transformer.

So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive POE a plain surge 
suppressor should not be used.  I am working some “non plain” surge suppressors 
now ;-)  Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to Matt for 
forcing me to learn something new.  It was painful, but I can do painful things 
when I have to.

From: Chuck McCown
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

tnx

From: Josh Luthman
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

chris.sisler
( A )
netlinx.net

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Chuck McCown 
> wrote:
Anyone know the email for the guy that runs Netonix?

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

If an impulse comes along and the surge suppressor clamps to ground, you run 
the risk of smoking the Netonix POE transformer.  It will not protect itself 
against shorts.

From: Josh Baird 
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 7:23 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge protectors before 
connecting to Netonix.

On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

  Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, irrespective of 
manufacturer.  

  From: can...@believewireless.net 
  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

  So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are connected 
to Netonix?

  On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

I am going to fix this little problem...

Netonix will fix your port for something like $25

From: Bill Prince 
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge suppressor, 
and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping from something else 
that had been on the cable, and completely forgot that it was going through 
that surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned.

bp

On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

  OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt Hoppes said. 
 You short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet transformer.  

  I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect and 
shut down in an over current situation.  They do have poly fuses which are slow 
to react and may protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts will 
indeed harm the port feeding the transformer.  

  So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive POE a plain 
surge suppressor should not be used.  I am working some “non plain” surge 
suppressors now ;-)  Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to 
Matt for forcing me to learn something new.  It was painful, but I can do 
painful things when I have to.  

  From: Chuck McCown 
  Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

  tnx

  From: Josh Luthman 
  Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix

  chris.sisler 
  ( A )

  netlinx.net

  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373

  On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

Anyone know the email for the guy that runs Netonix?

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix

2017-03-25 Thread Josh Baird

What exactly is the reason?  We always run through your surge protectors before 
connecting to Netonix.

> On Mar 25, 2017, at 9:15 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:
> 
> Bypass ALL surge suppressors that are connected to Netonix, irrespective of 
> manufacturer. 
>  
> From: can...@believewireless.net
> Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2017 5:41 AM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>  
> So we should now bypass all our APC-type surge suppressors that are connected 
> to Netonix?
>  
>> On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:26 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:
>> I am going to fix this little problem...
>>  
>> Netonix will fix your port for something like $25
>>  
>> From: Bill Prince
>> Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 8:56 PM
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix
>>  
>> Yeah. We accidentally hooked up an AF24 through a Cambium surge suppressor, 
>> and it fragged the port on the Netonix. We were swapping from something else 
>> that had been on the cable, and completely forgot that it was going through 
>> that surge suppressor. Hard lesson learned.
>> 
>> bp
>> 
>> 
>>> On 3/24/2017 1:27 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>>> OK,  had an exchange with Netonix today.  It is just as Matt Hoppes said.  
>>> You short out their POE and it will blow the Ethernet transformer. 
>>>  
>>> I really presumed they had circuitry like Forrest that could detect and 
>>> shut down in an over current situation.  They do have poly fuses which are 
>>> slow to react and may protect it from a very brief short, but longer shorts 
>>> will indeed harm the port feeding the transformer. 
>>>  
>>> So, Netonix is not active POE.  I would say that on passive POE a plain 
>>> surge suppressor should not be used.  I am working some “non plain” surge 
>>> suppressors now ;-)  Stay tuned to this bat channel and a big thanks to 
>>> Matt for forcing me to learn something new.  It was painful, but I can do 
>>> painful things when I have to. 
>>>  
>>> From: Chuck McCown
>>> Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 10:01 AM
>>> To: af@afmug.com
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix
>>>  
>>> tnx
>>>  
>>> From: Josh Luthman
>>> Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 9:47 AM
>>> To: af@afmug.com
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Netonix
>>>  
>>> chris.sisler
>>> ( A )
>>> netlinx.net
>>>  
>>>  
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>  
 On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:
 Anyone know the email for the guy that runs Netonix?
>>> 
>>>  
>> 
> 
>

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Netonix