Apple-Crop: wanted: Bean sprayer hitch
I have a (very) old Bean 500g high pressure sprayer with a broken clevis - I want to find a new (used) piece so I can use the sprayer for some hand gunning this spring - anybody got one of these mouldering in the fence row somewhere? - or who can direct me to the sprayer salvage yard? - the piece I need is the clevis that the hitch pin fits thru - this clevis is attached to the sprayer with a large bolt to the rest of the (rotating) hitch assembly - I'll be happy to send a picture if that would help anyone - thanks David Doud - northcentral Indiana - still very much winter here - snow and ice and more coming -
Apple-Crop: organophosphates
monday morning reading - it's going to be a long fall talking to people about this "Led by Maryse Bouchard in Montreal, researchers based at the University of Montreal and Harvard University examined the potential relationship between ADHD and exposure to certain toxic pesticides called organophosphates" http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1989564,00.html? xid=rss- topstories&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A +time%2Ftopstories+%28TIME%3A+Top+Stories%29&utm_content=Google+Reader David Doud grower - Indiana
Apple-Crop: ...and causes you to be fat too!
the current lead story on Yahoo - http://shine.yahoo.com/event/ loveyourbody/why-you-cant-lose-those-last-10-pounds-1964849/ "...See, an apple a day may have kept the doctor away 250 years ago when Benjamin Franklin included the phrase in his almanac. But if that apple comes loaded with obesity-promoting chemicals — nine of the ten most commonly used pesticides are obesogens, and apples are one of the most pesticide-laden foods out there — then Ben’s advice is way out of date" I look forward to market saturday - David Doud - grower - indiana
Re: Apple-Crop: ...and causes you to be fat too!
but...but...butit SOUNDS all scientificy!! - On Jul 23, 2010, at 8:47 PM, Kathleen Leahy wrote: Obesogens??? Seriously?? On 7/23/2010 9:47 AM, David Doud wrote: the current lead story on Yahoo - http://shine.yahoo.com/event/ loveyourbody/why-you-cant-lose-those-last-10-pounds-1964849/ "...See, an apple a day may have kept the doctor away 250 years ago when Benjamin Franklin included the phrase in his almanac. But if that apple comes loaded with obesity-promoting chemicals — nine of the ten most commonly used pesticides are obesogens, and apples are one of the most pesticide-laden foods out there — then Ben’s advice is way out of date" I look forward to market saturday - David Doud - grower - indiana -- Kathleen Leahy Polaris Orchard Management Colrain, MA 01340 polarisipm.com Polaris IPM Newsletter for New England Orchards
Re: Apple-Crop: Fast moving rot upon ripening - Southern apples
Plant Pathologist Jana Beckerman has just posted about summer rots in this week's 'Facts for Fancy Fruit' - http://www.hort.purdue.edu/fff/FFF10/FFF10-09.pdf you might want to peruse that, I believe it contains the information you seek - David Doud large scale 'hobby gardener' (at least some days) according to business definitions offered on apple-crop On Aug 20, 2010, at 3:06 PM, Dave and Janice Green wrote: > http://hemingwaysouthcarolina.com/apple/southernapple.html
Re: [apple-crop] Vertical Scaffold Spacing
It has been my experience that two scaffolds may originate at near the same height without choking the central leader - three originating at the same height will devigorate the leader eventually - the longer the tree lives, the more difference it makes - D On Feb 27, 2011, at 7:10 AM, Randy Steffens Jr wrote: > How much vertical distance do you generally employ to separate primary > scaffold branches on semi-dwarf Apple trees trained to central leader? > Various university publications don't agree on spacing. Cornell extension > publication 112 (written 1972) says at least 8 inches vertically between each > branch is necessary, and that less space can cause the central leader to > loose dominance. But more recent publications from other universities such as > Univ. of NC and Univ. of VA imply it's fine if they all emerge from > practically the same level. Is the Cornell publication old advice, or is the > spacing really not that big a deal? What are the spacings you use for common > rootstocks like M106 or G11? Is there any compelling reason to move towards > adopting Cornell's "textbook" approach in our orchards? > > Randy Steffens Jr > Shepard's Valley Orchards > MIddle Tennessee > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Training goal as it relates to initial planting
Rye - your picture shows a system that is highly regimented - excessively so for fruit production - if you want to do it to admire and enjoy, go ahead - be aware that many of these highly manipulated systems use Golden Delicious or some other variety with an agreeable growth habit - try to do that with Northern Spy or somesuch and you will experience frustration - otherwise, give yourself plenty of room and work with the tree - much better for fruit production - D On Feb 19, 2011, at 2:16 PM, ducn...@aol.com wrote: > > Hello, newbie here. > > I am planting a small high density orchard. I have bareroots on order on m9 > nic-29. Due to arrive in the next week or three. I'm planting with 6 foot > in-row spacing and looking to maintain a tree height of about 7-9 feet on 4 > (or 5 if they look like they want to grow to 9 feet) wire trellises for a > hedgegrow with the main branches latticed similar to this photo: > > http://resources.cas.psu.edu/TFPG/apple_trellis/images/slide33.gif > > Two ways I can think to accomplish this: > > 1) after planting, cut the scion to about 22 inches (from ground level) and > train two leaders to grow 45 degrees North and South respectively. > 2) initially plant trees at a 45 degree angle, leaning to the North, training > a low shoot to grow 45 degrees to the South. > > I lean towards option 1) but being a newbie I'm hesitant to cut them so > short. However, that's what it looks like was done in the photo. Can a newly > planted bareroot handle being cut to 22 inches? Also they will be in grow > tubes to protect from the critters. Just wanted to mention that if it > matters that only about 3 inches of wood will get a full day's sun initially. > > Thank you so much for your consideration. > > Rye Hefley > Future Farmer's Market Vendor > Private orchard in So. Cal. > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] apples- not propaganda
"I want info about apples," then contribute something - for the record, I'm fine with the discussion going on - happy to see activity - D grower-indiana On Mar 14, 2011, at 5:10 PM, Dennis Brackman wrote: > I want info about apples, not political chatter - please remove me from your > e-mail list. > > tgith > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] definitions question: first, second, third cover
I tend to agree the term 'cover' is becoming archaic in regards to modern fruit growing - I did look thru some historical references I have handy and in the 1936 Michigan spray calendar the 'first cover' is applied 10 days after petal-fall, with the 'second cover' applied 10 days after the first cover - 'third cover' is then two weeks after that, and 'fourth cover' two weeks after third - the calendar then refers to a 'summer generation' spray, "exact time to be determined each year, usually about Aug 1" with the possibility of one or two more sprays after that "at two week intervals" the 1945 'Spraying Program' extension bulletin from Ohio State breaks the sprays down into 5 periods - Dormant, Pre-Bloom, Calyx Cup, First Cover, and Second Brood or Fourth Cover - under the 'First Cover' period the program lists the first cover spray as 'ten days after petal fall', second cover as 'three weeks after petal fall' and 'third cover' as two weeks after second cover with a note "Watch spray service recommendations for need of an additional cover spray against the first brood of codling moth" if should be noted that backbone materials of these programs were sulfer and lead arsenate - anymore I believe the spraying frequency is more decided by monitoring and complicated by such concepts as Alternate Row Center spraying and such - David Doud grower, IN On Apr 11, 2011, at 3:19 PM, Rye wrote: > Hello all, > > I'm looking over pesticide information and I see a lot of references to first > cover, second cover and third cover and also references to first cover spray, > second cover spray and third cover spray. All references seem to expect the > reader to know what that is. Searching the web I found one reference that > said second cover is 4-6 weeks after petal fall. Another reference seemed to > refer to the number of wet days to get to second cover and that didn't make > any sense to me at all. > > I guess I'm really unclear on what "cover" means in this context. What does > the term refer to? What is being covered at these stages and/or what is > doing the covering? Or what observation do you make and say "ah! we are > reached second cover today!" (same question for first and third.) > > Also, what is the relationship between "second cover" and "second cover > spray"? (same question for first and third) I think I would understand once > I understand what second cover is, but my general confusion on the topic > leaves me with little confidence in that. > > I have found references for definitions of some stages such as green tip, > pre-pink, pink. But these "cover" stages elude me. > > Thanks for sharing your expertise! > > Rye Hefley > Future Farmers Marketer > So. Cal. > > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] spectrum instruments
Is anyone else on this list using Spectrum instruments to monitor weather and model disease? - I've had a 'Watchdog' for several years now, and yesterday had an anomaly, with complete disagreement and inconsistencies between the three scab models - The software uses models from Cornell, Washington State, and Mills (MI) - I'm used to Cornell being very conservative and WA being the opposite - this event, Cornell indicated 'infected', WA 'none', and Mills 'heavy' - I've never modeled an event with Mills being 'heavy' and WA 'none' - circumstances were such that we were cruising along in the lower 40'sF monday and then an overnight rain till 7AM tues morning - a two hour dry period, followed by a rain, followed by the violent front (no damage here, but tremendous light show) - while that front was moving thru, temperatures rose above 50*F for about 6 hours, peaking at 56*, before declining back to the lower 40's again - to add to the mystery, if I model tuesday, from the two hour dry thru the end of the event, I get the 'infected', 'none', 'heavy' analysis from the program - if I run the model from the start of the rainy event monday so to include the rainy monday night/early tues thru the end of the event wednesday morning, the Mills model indicates 'light' infection (Cornell indicates 'infected', WA 'none) - as a practical matter, at our stage of development, these temperatures, and specific schedule of the wet periods, I normally wouldn't worry much about scab infection - but seeing that 'heavy' infection indicated from the Mills model is disconcerting - dunno - any thoughts? thanks, David Doud grower, IN ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] spectrum instruments
a commercial orchard because there are > relatively few of them. Mills and Al Jones therefore used 9 hr as the minimal > wetting period at optimum temperatures to account for the fact that their > data suggested it would require an extra three hours to accumulate an > economically significant dose of ascospore as compared to conidia. (Some of my plant pathology colleagues my wish to quibble with these broad generalizations because I've skipped a lot of details and also done some "reading between the lines." Nevertheless, I think my general conclusions in comparing the two models are valid.) > The Cornell model also provides only a yes/no response to infection, > whereas the original Mills table and the Jones version of the Mills table > still provides gradations of light, moderate, or heavy infection based on > duration of the wetting periods at various temperatures. Again, because > ascospores are relatively limited in number in most orchards, it makes sense > to parse out the severity of infection for ascospores whereas just the > minimal wetting/temperature requirements are enough to trigger conidial > infections if conidia are present because conidia are either present in large > numbers or not at all. > By having information on light-moderate-heavy infection, one can adjust > one's on-site risk factors based on other details of the specific orchard > situation. For example, in a clean orchard with trees just at green tip, I > would ignore the "light" Mills period and begin to worry only after > triggering at least a "moderate" Mill's period because there are so few > spores at green tip that the marginal conditions for a light infection period > will be unlikely to result in noticeable scab. However, even in a clean > orchard, I would NOT ignore a light Mills period when trees are at tight > cluster or pink. > I hope others will chime in on what differences may be incorporated > into the Washington model. > >> Is anyone else on this list using Spectrum instruments to monitor weather >> and model disease? - I've had a 'Watchdog' for several years now, and >> yesterday had an anomaly, with complete disagreement and inconsistencies >> between the three scab models - >> >> The software uses models from Cornell, Washington State, and Mills (MI) - >> I'm used to Cornell being very conservative and WA being the opposite - this >> event, Cornell indicated 'infected', WA 'none', and Mills 'heavy' - I've >> never modeled an event with Mills being 'heavy' and WA 'none' - >> >> circumstances were such that we were cruising along in the lower 40'sF >> monday and then an overnight rain till 7AM tues morning - a two hour dry >> period, followed by a rain, followed by the violent front (no damage here, >> but tremendous light show) - while that front was moving thru, temperatures >> rose above 50*F for about 6 hours, peaking at 56*, before declining back to >> the lower 40's again - >> >> to add to the mystery, if I model tuesday, from the two hour dry thru the >> end of the event, I get the 'infected', 'none', 'heavy' analysis from the >> program - if I run the model from the start of the rainy event monday so to >> include the rainy monday night/early tues thru the end of the event >> wednesday morning, the Mills model indicates 'light' infection (Cornell >> indicates 'infected', WA 'none) - >> >> as a practical matter, at our stage of development, these temperatures, and >> specific schedule of the wet periods, I normally wouldn't worry much about >> scab infection - but seeing that 'heavy' infection indicated from the Mills >> model is disconcerting - >> >> dunno - any thoughts? >> >> thanks, >> David Doud >> grower, IN >> ___ >> apple-crop mailing list >> apple-crop@virtualorchard.net >> http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > > -- > ** Dave > Rosenberger > Professor of Plant Pathology Office: 845-691-7231 > Cornell University's Hudson Valley LabFax:845-691-2719 > P.O. Box 727, Highland, NY 12528 Cell: 845-594-3060 > http://www.nysaes.cornell.edu/pp/faculty/rosenberger/ > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] spectrum instruments and infection models in general
lease mechanism may be by-passed. >>> The Cornell model was based on lab trials that showed ascospores can >>> infect in the same relatively short periods that Bill Mills had initially >>> described for secondary infections. Thus, the Cornell model will trigger >>> 'infected' before the Mill's MI model. Although NY has adopted the 'Cornell >>> model' because it is technically more correct, I still prefer the modified >>> Mill's table that was developed by Jones (although I do believe in >>> discounting night-time wetting, especially early in the season). >>> Bill Mills developed his scab model by actually looking at what >>> happened to trees outdoors. As a result, his model and the modified Mill's >>> table from Al Jones actually represent an integration of minimum infection >>> conditions AND spore numbers. Conidia are always produced in much greater >>> quantities than ascospores under conditions in commercial orchards. Thus, >>> with conidia, large quantities arrive and infect leaves within 6 hr at >>> optimum temperatures. If you artificially put large quantities of >>> ascospores on leaves, you also get infections within 6 hr at optimum >>> temperatures. In reality, however, it takes some time for an economically >>> significant dose of ascospores to arrive on leaves in a commercial orchard >>> because there are relatively few of them. Mills and Al Jones therefore used >>> 9 hr as the minimal wetting period at optimum temperatures to account for >>> the fact that their data suggested it would require an extra three hours to >>> accumulate an economically significant >> dose of ascospore as compared to conidia. (Some of my plant pathology >> colleagues my wish to quibble with these broad generalizations because I've >> skipped a lot of details and also done some "reading between the lines." >> Nevertheless, I think my general conclusions in comparing the two models are >> valid.) >>> The Cornell model also provides only a yes/no response to infection, >>> whereas the original Mills table and the Jones version of the Mills table >>> still provides gradations of light, moderate, or heavy infection based on >>> duration of the wetting periods at various temperatures. Again, because >>> ascospores are relatively limited in number in most orchards, it makes >>> sense to parse out the severity of infection for ascospores whereas just >>> the minimal wetting/temperature requirements are enough to trigger conidial >>> infections if conidia are present because conidia are either present in >>> large numbers or not at all. >>> By having information on light-moderate-heavy infection, one can adjust >>> one's on-site risk factors based on other details of the specific orchard >>> situation. For example, in a clean orchard with trees just at green tip, I >>> would ignore the "light" Mills period and begin to worry only after >>> triggering at least a "moderate" Mill's period because there are so few >>> spores at green tip that the marginal conditions for a light infection >>> period will be unlikely to result in noticeable scab. However, even in a >>> clean orchard, I would NOT ignore a light Mills period when trees are at >>> tight cluster or pink. >>> I hope others will chime in on what differences may be incorporated >>> into the Washington model. >>> >>>> Is anyone else on this list using Spectrum instruments to monitor weather >>>> and model disease? - I've had a 'Watchdog' for several years now, and >>>> yesterday had an anomaly, with complete disagreement and inconsistencies >>>> between the three scab models - >>>> >>>> The software uses models from Cornell, Washington State, and Mills (MI) - >>>> I'm used to Cornell being very conservative and WA being the opposite - >>>> this event, Cornell indicated 'infected', WA 'none', and Mills 'heavy' - >>>> I've never modeled an event with Mills being 'heavy' and WA 'none' - >>>> >>>> circumstances were such that we were cruising along in the lower 40'sF >>>> monday and then an overnight rain till 7AM tues morning - a two hour dry >>>> period, followed by a rain, followed by the violent front (no damage here, >>>> but tremendous light show) - while that f
Re: [apple-crop] spectrum instruments
ent results, but I've never taken the time to > compare the 2 within Specware. "Single sine" is another option within the > program, but you have to leave the disease models, change DD settings, then > recalculate disease models. > > Cynthia Turski at Specmeters can provide more info on how their models are > programmed. Granted, the company could use an entomologist or pomologist on > staff, and their products are a bit pricey, but flying with instruments is > always better than flying without. > > > > At 09:22 4/21/2011, you wrote: >> Is anyone else on this list using Spectrum instruments to monitor weather >> and model disease? - I've had a 'Watchdog' for several years now, and >> yesterday had an anomaly, with complete disagreement and inconsistencies >> between the three scab models - >> >> The software uses models from Cornell, Washington State, and Mills (MI) - >> I'm used to Cornell being very conservative and WA being the opposite - this >> event, Cornell indicated 'infected', WA 'none', and Mills 'heavy' - I've >> never modeled an event with Mills being 'heavy' and WA 'none' - >> >> circumstances were such that we were cruising along in the lower 40'sF >> monday and then an overnight rain till 7AM tues morning - a two hour dry >> period, followed by a rain, followed by the violent front (no damage here, >> but tremendous light show) - while that front was moving thru, temperatures >> rose above 50*F for about 6 hours, peaking at 56*, before declining back to >> the lower 40's again - >> >> to add to the mystery, if I model tuesday, from the two hour dry thru the >> end of the event, I get the 'infected', 'none', 'heavy' analysis from the >> program - if I run the model from the start of the rainy event monday so to >> include the rainy monday night/early tues thru the end of the event >> wednesday morning, the Mills model indicates 'light' infection (Cornell >> indicates 'infected', WA 'none) - >> >> as a practical matter, at our stage of development, these temperatures, and >> specific schedule of the wet periods, I normally wouldn't worry much about >> scab infection - but seeing that 'heavy' infection indicated from the Mills >> model is disconcerting - >> >> dunno - any thoughts? >> >> thanks, >> David Doud >> grower, IN >> ___ >> apple-crop mailing list >> apple-crop@virtualorchard.net >> http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > Brian Heatherington > Beech Creek Farms and Orchards > Tallapoosa, GA > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Regrowth stage questions
Rye - this is my opinion/experience on which others might disagree - 'regrowth' to me is initiated late in the season - september or so - that is generally undesirable since terminal bud set is unlikely before freezing temperatures which then results in that late initiated growth being mostly winter killed, etc - the situation might be different in your climate - at this point in the growing season, the more the merrier - the trees seek to maintain a balance between roots and shoots - but they tend not to grow both at the same time - so it's not unusual for newly planted trees to cease shoot growth, grow some roots, and then resume shoot growth - aphids are easily controlled, I'd encourage you to grow canopy - this is where apples come from - so the axial buds breaking are fine and desirable as this is where fruiting spurs originate - the more photosynthetic surface you have the better - at this point I wouldn't remove anything except shoots with poor crotch angles let the trees lead you - I know at this point there is little to do in the orchard, but that will change soon enough - D On Jun 15, 2011, at 1:04 PM, Rye wrote: > Hi All, > > I am training most of my trees on a wire trellis in the oblique palmette > form. Since I just planted these trees this year I am working on the central > leader and bottom scaffolds. Some of the trees continue to extend these > three shoots. Many others had stopped growing for a while and started > growing again. Based on photos and drawings on the internet I surmise that > is what is called "regrowth". > > I have read that regrowth should be discouraged to help suppress aphids > (which I do see of the Green Apple variety). The references I saw said > nothing about whether suppressing regrowth was a mature orchard practice vs > new orchard... so I'm sort of in the dark and looking for guidance. > > My goal is always to maintain a healthy orchard, but also to maximize leader > and scaffold development. So, my main questions are: Does "regrowth" > continue to develop the shoot or does it just become a terminal? Also, there > are new leaf buds popping up from the leaf axils on some trees. Will those > develop into lateral growth? On the one hand, I would want to remove them > when possible to keep energy directed to extending the main shoots. But on > the other hand, should I keep some near the tip to train into the leader if > the regrowth doesn't continue to extend? Or if a well positioned lateral > becomes more vigorous than the original leader? > > I could just let all the new growth continue for a while and see what it > does, but I have a feeling when the summer heat comes growth will cease and > would want to eliminate all unproductive growth as soon as possible to > maximize the training goal for as long as I can. Since the trees are still > small, managing the aphids on regrowth is doable so the priority is growth. > > Should I remove all the new leaf buds except regrowth at the tip of the > leader? Or keep some near the tip for possible training into a new leader? > > I hope I made sense in describing the situation. > > Thanks, > > Rye Hefley > Future Farmers Marketer > So. Cal. > > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] a bit of positive press
from Yahoo - http://shine.yahoo.com/channel/health/5-foods-that-keep-you-thin-2507875/ apples at the top of the list - D ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] apples on prairie home companion
apples were a major subject in the 'news from lake wobegon' segment - makes me wonder if Garrison Keillor has visited Doug Shefelbine - you can access audio here - http://prairiehome.publicradio.org/programs/2012/09/15/ nice to have something positive to report - David Doud grower (frozen out this year) Indiana ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] apples on prairie home companion
just remember to keep it quiet about the piles of easy money to be made growing fruit, particularly HC - twice the price, half the pack-out - D On Sep 16, 2012, at 8:12 PM, Jon Clements wrote: > Or Dave Bedford/U. of Minnesota? Until I listened longer… > > :-) > > After this, and this: > http://boston.cbslocal.com/2012/09/11/gardening-with-gutner-apple-picking-tips/, > seems to me if you went to the bank with a NPV spreadsheet and asked > for a loan to plant a few (or more?) acres of retail tall-spindle > Honeycrisp, they would write you a check (and then some?) on the spot! > What am I missing as I slave away at my civil service job…??? > > :-) > > On Sun, Sep 16, 2012 at 5:11 PM, David Doud wrote: >> apples were a major subject in the 'news from lake wobegon' segment - makes >> me wonder if Garrison Keillor has visited Doug Shefelbine - >> >> you can access audio here - >> http://prairiehome.publicradio.org/programs/2012/09/15/ >> >> nice to have something positive to report - >> >> David Doud >> grower (frozen out this year) >> Indiana >> ___ >> apple-crop mailing list >> apple-crop@virtualorchard.net >> http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > > > -- > JMCEXTMAN > Jon Clements > cleme...@umext.umass.edu > aka 'Mr Liberty' > aka 'Mr Honeycrisp' > IM mrhoneycrisp > 413.478.7219 > IFTA Boston 2013, February 23-29, 2013, ifruittree.org > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] apple anti-cancer research
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23511050 Chinese study - "Oligosaccharide from apple induces apoptosis and cell cycle arrest in HT29 human colon cancer cells." If I read the abstract correctly, this was published last month - Dunno - it would be nice if someone knowledgable could review this - If it were the opposite association, I bet there would be banner headlines... David Doud Grower, Indiana 1/4" green, wet - nice to have a real spring this year - ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] Thiram WP or WDG
Thiram is listed in the spray schedule, but I have been unable to find anyone that supplies the WP or WDG (Granuflo) formulation - does anyone know a supplier that has it? thanks - David Doud grower, IN ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] Thiram WP or WDG
Thiram is listed in the spray schedule, but I have been unable to find anyone that supplies the WP or WDG (Granuflo) formulation - does anyone know a supplier that has it? thanks - David Doud grower, IN ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] apple anti-cancer research
rmal gut epithelial cells. If > the agent of interest kills tumor cells but must be used at 100-10,000 times > higher doses to kill normal cells, then you may have something, but 98% of > these studies don't do this simple but essential control. A great deal of > confusion results when this control is lacking. > > There are several widely used and potent chemotherapy agents that have been > used for decades and are still actively used today. These agents were > originally derived from plant sources and include colchicine and colcemid > (from crocus), taxol (from yew), vinblastine and vincristine (from > periwinkle) and podophyllotoxin for etoposide (from mayapple). So it is > quite reasonable to expect that there will be other phytochemicals that are > yet to be discovered which will be highly effective in preventing tumor > development or in killing tumor cells. Studies like this one using apple > oligosaccharide however, are not at all convincing no matter what we may wish > for...but I haven't seen the full paper just the abstract. > > Rob Walter, PhD > Research Scientist, Retired > Stroger Hospital of Cook County > Rush University Medical School. > > > > On Tue, Apr 16, 2013 at 7:53 PM, David Doud wrote: > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23511050 > > Chinese study - "Oligosaccharide from apple induces apoptosis and cell cycle > arrest in HT29 human colon cancer cells." > > If I read the abstract correctly, this was published last month - > > Dunno - it would be nice if someone knowledgable could review this - > > If it were the opposite association, I bet there would be banner headlines... > > David Doud > Grower, Indiana > 1/4" green, wet - nice to have a real spring this year - > > > > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] apple anti-cancer research
Phil: Your daughter might be interested how this originated - on a forum, a friend, who buys into a lot of sketchy material, posted this link to a 'popular' website http://naturalsociety.com/apple-extract-kills-cancer-cells-outperforms-chemo-drugs/ - so - I'm guessing many more people will see the claim "Study: Apple Extract Kills Cancer Cells, Outperforms Common Chemo Drugs" than will be exposed to any critique such as Robert Walter posted for us - bogus is bogus, and altho this would, on the surface, seem to be positive for apples, it's cheating and not a prosperous way to promote ourselves David Doud grower IN thunderstorms, rain and floods, tornado watch, gonna be a while before I get anything else planted - and wondering how effective that COCS applied last sunday at 1/4" green is today... On Apr 18, 2013, at 9:46 AM, Phil Glaize wrote: > David and Robert, > Your discussion has been interesting. I am forwarding your information to > my daughter who is a student at Oregon Health and Science University. She is > getting her degree in Dietetics and Nutrition and is insatiable when it comes > to learning. Thanks for posting on apple-crop. > Phil Glaize > Virginia grower…. heading into bloom > > From: apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net > [mailto:apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net] On Behalf Of David Doud > Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2013 9:07 PM > To: Apple-crop discussion list > Subject: Re: [apple-crop] apple anti-cancer research > > > > > On Apr 17, 2013, at 2:04 PM, robjwal...@gmail.com wrote: > > > David: > > Thanks for the PDF. As I had thought, the only cell type studied was HT29, a > human colon cancer cell line. No other tumor cell types or, more > importantly, normal cell types were studied here. Proper experimental > controls were not done, so the results cannot be generalized beyond the > obvious findings...the apple extract used can kill one type of tumor cell in > tissue culture, but so can a thousand other things. > > Also, there did not appear to be any vehicle controls used. The preparation > of the apple extract is given in great detail, but the final product is dried > powder. This powder had to be dissolved and sterilized before adding it to > cultured cells, but the solvent used as the vehicle for this is not stated as > far as I can tell, and it is never tested by itself to see if the vehicle > alone has any toxic effects on the cells. Often DMSO is used as a vehicle > for difficult to solubilize compounds and even diluted DMSO can injure or > kill cells depending on the dose and time of exposure. There are 'control' > groups mentioned here and there in the paper, but a control group of cells > that simply has nothing added to it (no apple extract, no FU, no vehicle) is > not the same as a vehicle control. Because the study was performed in > considerable detail, one would hope that vehicle controls were performed, but > this must be stated explicitly in the paper or else it cannot be assumed. > > Interestingly, the authors cite another paper (reference 11) where they > showed "that oral administration of LMWAP effectively protected > ICR mice against CRC" (LMWAP is a mixture of polysaccharides isolated from > apples; CRC is colorectal carcinoma). > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22429028 > > Again, this paper is not in my library's PDF collection, but if they are > referring to the ICR mice that I am familiar with > (http://www.taconic.com/wmspage.cfm?parm1=758), it is impossible to > demonstrate this effect in that mouse. The ICR mouse is just a regular white > mouse with an intact immune system. This experiment cannot be done in such a > mouse because it requires a mouse with a defective immune system that will > permit human colon carcinoma cells to grow unimpeded. > > And so it goes... > > Robert Walter > > > > On Apr 16, 2013, at 11:32 PM, robjwal...@gmail.com wrote: > > > This journal is kind of obscure and I can't get this article from my > university library, but would be interested in seeing it in its entirety. If > someone could get it to me as a PDF, I'd appreciate it. Cancer > chemopreventatives, carcinogenesis, and cell culture happen to be among my > specialties. Based on the abstract, I'll make a few comments. Of late, the > Chinese have made a great effort in the area of chemopreventatives probably > due to their long cutural history of traditional or herbal medicine. Many > studies like the one in question have been published over the past 10-15 > years using cultured human tumor cells treated with this or that naturally > occurring agent includ
Re: [apple-crop] native pollinators
indeed - the dandelions are empty - few bumblebees - I have a half dozen hives of honeybees on the property, managed by mediocre bee keeper, but they are flying - I have about 20 acres of tree fruit and have always considered the native pollinators to be adequate to the job, this year may be different - on the other hand, I don't know that I want a complete pollination job this year - I have been vacillating for the last 36 hours whether to call in some more honeybees - my current thinking is that I'll just ride what I have and count on it being enough - I'm in north central Indiana - D On May 2, 2013, at 1:06 PM, Frank Carlson wrote: > David: > I forgot where you are located. Here in Harvard, MA, we have just been > commenting on the lack of wild bees as we are about to open on McIntosh. > There also are less bumble bees visible . > Frank Carlson > > Franklyn W. Carlson, Pres. > Carlson Orchards, Inc. > 115 Oak Hill Road > P.O.Box 359 > Harvard, MA. 01451 > 617-968-4180 cell > 978-456-3916 office > > > > -Original Message- > From: apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net > [mailto:apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net] On Behalf Of David Doud > Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 11:02 AM > To: Apple-Crop > Subject: [apple-crop] native pollinators > > Another casualty of last year's freak weather is the population of native > pollinators - my asian pears entered full bloom over the last 48 hours - > other years they are surrounded by a cloud of several species of solitary > pollinators, this year that activity is roughly 10% of what I am accustomed > to observing - > > The first apple bloom opened yesterday - 72 hours ago at tight cluster I > considered the amount of bloom as 'full' but not particularly remarkable, > now bloom has seemingly spontaneously generated to an amount that I cannot > remember observing in the past - it's going to be spectacular, but has upped > my anxiety about the potential 'big crop of little green apples' - hope > thinners are effective > > > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] native pollinators
After making the observation that native pollinator numbers were greatly reduced, I made an immediate assumption that it was tied to the adverse growing season last year - an early start (pollinators were plentiful and at normal levels during bloom last March, full bloom is going to be at least 35 days later this year than last) followed by two hard freezes - I have to think 23*F would just outright kill a lot of insects (at least the good ones) - followed by lack of nectar because of the devastated tree flowers and other blooming vegetation - followed by a drought that left us pretty brown for much of the summer - lots of wildlife starved to death last year - I agree with Mo that insect (and wildlife) populations are cyclic, but in this case there have to be at least 20 species of pollinators affected - I am a little surprised at the widespread nature of the observation - David On May 2, 2013, at 8:00 PM, Jon Clements wrote: > Interesting, I was just observing full bloom sweet cherry yesterday afternoon > and made a mental note that native bee/pollinator activity seemed to be > light. There are no honeybees brought into the orchard yet, we wait for > apples. Normally, they (the native pollinators) are really swarming the sweet > cherries because they are the only thing in bloom at the time. Today activity > seemed lacking again. It's been very dry here, is there any possibility there > is a lack of nectar? That might not explain David's observation in Indiana > though? Seems to be a theme here, but maybe Mo is right -- just plain natural > (i.e. chaotic) population swings? > > Anyway, who needs bees? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bsl7sILSGoU > > > On Thu, May 2, 2013 at 11:01 AM, David Doud wrote: > Another casualty of last year's freak weather is the population of native > pollinators - my asian pears entered full bloom over the last 48 hours - > other years they are surrounded by a cloud of several species of solitary > pollinators, this year that activity is roughly 10% of what I am accustomed > to observing - > > The first apple bloom opened yesterday - 72 hours ago at tight cluster I > considered the amount of bloom as 'full' but not particularly remarkable, now > bloom has seemingly spontaneously generated to an amount that I cannot > remember observing in the past - it's going to be spectacular, but has upped > my anxiety about the potential 'big crop of little green apples' - hope > thinners are effective > > > > > David Doud > grower IN > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > > > > -- > Jon Clements > aka 'Mr Honeycrisp' > UMass Cold Spring Orchard > 393 Sabin St. > Belchertown, MA 01007 > 413-478-7219 > umassfruit.com > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] native pollinators
Jon, I don't think your leaf blower improves the ambiance of the idyllic orchard in bloom D On May 2, 2013, at 8:00 PM, Jon Clements wrote: > Interesting, I was just observing full bloom sweet cherry yesterday afternoon > and made a mental note that native bee/pollinator activity seemed to be > light. There are no honeybees brought into the orchard yet, we wait for > apples. Normally, they (the native pollinators) are really swarming the sweet > cherries because they are the only thing in bloom at the time. Today activity > seemed lacking again. It's been very dry here, is there any possibility there > is a lack of nectar? That might not explain David's observation in Indiana > though? Seems to be a theme here, but maybe Mo is right -- just plain natural > (i.e. chaotic) population swings? > > Anyway, who needs bees? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bsl7sILSGoU > > > On Thu, May 2, 2013 at 11:01 AM, David Doud wrote: > Another casualty of last year's freak weather is the population of native > pollinators - my asian pears entered full bloom over the last 48 hours - > other years they are surrounded by a cloud of several species of solitary > pollinators, this year that activity is roughly 10% of what I am accustomed > to observing - > > The first apple bloom opened yesterday - 72 hours ago at tight cluster I > considered the amount of bloom as 'full' but not particularly remarkable, now > bloom has seemingly spontaneously generated to an amount that I cannot > remember observing in the past - it's going to be spectacular, but has upped > my anxiety about the potential 'big crop of little green apples' - hope > thinners are effective > > > > > David Doud > grower IN > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > > > > -- > Jon Clements > aka 'Mr Honeycrisp' > UMass Cold Spring Orchard > 393 Sabin St. > Belchertown, MA 01007 > 413-478-7219 > umassfruit.com > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] NYT story on GMO oranges
Arctic Apples are discussed, and Herb Aldwinckle rates a paragraph - a well written piece, worth the read - http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/28/science/a-race-to-save-the-orange-by-altering-its-dna.html?&_r=0 David Doud grower, IN Redhaven peaches this week - Pristine, Williams Pride and Earligold apples - the sales season begins - (the peaches are a lot easier sell than the apples...) ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Batlow Cider Apple Harvest
You can taste the bass!! D On Sep 17, 2013, at 10:59 AM, Kevin Hauser wrote: > Aussies setting the standard for cider apple harvesting. > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYdA-7MmqyI > > Kevin Hauser > Kuffel Creek Apple Nursery > Riverside, CA > Kampala, Uganda > > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Apple bins
" I don't think that the foul odors in apple storages have any impact on fruit quality." My observations are contrary to this - I buy/evaluate grocery store apples regularly, and find that off flavor that I believe comes from nasty storages to be the most common quality deficiency. Customers are getting apples stored in cardboard in bad air, not a way to drive consumption. I find this across the spectrum of food stores, from high end to discount. I'd agree that apples lose some of the taint as they set in fresh air, but is this something we want/need/expect the consumer to do? If I were a big time marketer, I'd see an opportunity to sell high end 'clean-air certified' or somesuch fruit David On Sep 20, 2013, at 11:03 AM, David A. Rosenberger wrote: > We did some work in 2000 comparing spore loads (Penicillium species, the most > common of which causes blue mold) on wooden bins and plastic bins. Both sets > of bins had been used for a number of seasons, and both came from the same > apple storage operation. We pulled them out of their empty bin piles in July > and made no attempt to sanitize them before running them through an overhead > bin drencher and then evaluating spore load by dilution plating of the > drencher water. Some of the bins (both wooden and plastic) still had remnants > of decayed fruit stuck on the bin floors. > > One would assume that plastic bins, which appear relatively smooth compared > to wooden bins, would harbor far less inoculum. In fact, we washed off > roughly 2.2 billion Penicillium spores per bin from wooden bins and about 483 > million spores per bin from the plastic bins. Thus, plastic bins may appear > cleaner, but they can still harbor huge numbers of decay spores and other > organisms. We also made an attempt to sanitize both kinds of bins using a > quaternary ammonium sanitizer. Although we lowered spore numbers a bit with > the sanitizer, we failed to really clean up either wooden or plastic bins in > that trial in 2000. In retrospect, I realized that part of the failure in > using the sanitizer was that our sanitizer solution was made using well water > (presumably 55 F) and the contact time at that low temp was too short to get > a good kill. Nevertheless, that work showed that sanitizing plastic bins is > not much easier than sanitizing wooden bins. (Not all Penicillium species > cause fruit decay, and we did not determine how many of the spores recovered > from bins were the primary decay pathogen, P. expansum. Nevertheless, the > conclusions about "cleanliness of bins still holds.) > > One of my gripes about the plastic bins is that most of them have an > open-celled grid-work of reinforcing plastic on the underside of the bin > floor. This reinforcing grid adds a tremendous amount of surface area for > harboring dirt and spores and makes the undersides of the bins difficult to > clean apart from using a high-pressure washer that directs the water flow to > the undersides of the bins. > > Although plastic bins are not necessarily "clean" or easier to sanitize, I am > still a proponent of using plastic bins. They stack better, support stack > loads more reliably, and result in less bruising/scuffing of fruit that are > in contact with the sides of the bin. One packinghouse operator told me that > after they switched to plastic bins, they were amazed at how the switch had > reduced their cullage for scuffing/bruising and that the reduced cullage over > several years would go a long way toward helping to pay for the bins. > > Another area that no one has explored involves the foul "storage odors" that > sometimes occur in apple storage rooms where wooden bins are used. Old > wooden bins are full of basidiomycete wood decay fungi, and some of those > fungi produce rather nasty odors. The wine industry struggled with off odors > the came from fungi that were sometimes present in the corks (which are > really just processed tree bark) until they learned to sanitize the corks by > microwaving (or to avoid the problem by switching to synthetics). I don't > think that the foul odors in apple storages have any impact on fruit quality. > Although some of those off odors are evident on fruit eaten immediately > after they are removed from the storage room, my perception is that any off > odors that penetrate into the apple skin disappear quickly after the fruit > are removed from storage, washed and packed. Nevertheless, if we are storing > FOOD, it seems logical that the storage rooms should smell like apples, not > like rotting wood. And speaking of perceptions, while plastic bins may not > be free of fungal spores, they definitely LOOK cleaner and in today's world, > it seems increasingly true that "perception is reality." > > > On Sep 20, 2013, at 9:43 AM, "Kushad, Mosbah M" wrote: > >> Hi Leslie: I am interested in their sanitation, ease of staking and >> storage, cost ef
Re: [apple-crop] Paraquat
I have used it for that purpose - generally works acceptably well, repeated application keeps the suckers burned down and devigorated, but I have noticed increased phytophthora incidence that I attribute to the practice - David Doud grower - Indiana On Oct 8, 2013, at 12:52 PM, Hugh Thomas wrote: > Anyone have any experience using paraquat for sucker control? > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] ethylene
So - help me understand the differences in ethylene physiology in different apples - I am familiar with textbook graphs and the climateric respiration pattern that is a generalized explanation for maturity/senescence in apples, but there are apples that don't seem to fit that pattern, specifically GoldRush and HoneyCrisp, where ethylene production/concentrations do not seem to spike, but seem to 'peak' at a low level of 1-5ppm rather than spiking to 10's to 100's of parts per million - GoldRush and HoneyCrisp are also associated with maintaining firm, crisp flesh quality over a long storage life (at least the fraction of HC that don't bitter pit or soft rot or decline from any of the several other maladies to which it is subject) - is the low ethylene synthesis the explanation for this? If HoneyCrisp is exposed to high concentrations of ethylene does it then soften and age like a 'normal' apple? Or is there something else going on? MCP binds to ethylene receptor sites and so prevents ethylene from having its normal effect on respiration and maturation - does the treated fruit still exhibit the climateric peak in ethylene generation? But the ethylene is unable then to have its effect because of the blocked sites? From what I have gathered, MCP is applied at some point after significant ethylene production has initiated, but likely before production has peaked. Thanks for any input, feel free to correct any misconceptions on my part, I won't take anything personally - David Doud grower, Indiana -15F last week ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] "Monsanto Is Going Organic" and "How to Engineer a Better (Not Arctic) Apple"
Thanks for the links - I saw the NPR story early on, but it's quite a treat to read the comments that weren't there initially - The Monsanto story is well done and thought provoking (the comments there are very entertaining also)- "Monsanto computer models can actually predict inheritance patterns, meaning they can tell which desired traits will successfully be passed on In the real world, the odds of stacking 20 different characteristics into a single plant are one in 2 trillion. In nature, it can take a millennium. Monsanto can do it in just a few years." I've heard rumors of this technique being utilized in apple breeding - David - -14F last night - On Jan 29, 2014, at 4:00 PM, Jon Clements wrote: > I just ran across both these (I'm a long-time Wired subscriber, it's in print > too), thought you would be interested. Jon > > http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2014/01/new-monsanto-vegetables/ > > http://www.npr.org/blogs/thesalt/2013/10/08/230552146/sweet-tart-crunchy-how-to-engineer-a-better-apple > -- > Jon Clements > aka 'Mr Honeycrisp' > UMass Cold Spring Orchard > 393 Sabin St. > Belchertown, MA 01007 > 413-478-7219 > umassfruit.com > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] honeycrisp prices
" how did anyone find a Honeycrisp that doesn't taste good?" Unfortunately, it's not that hard - We were visiting our son in San Diego in October 2012 (no fruit here, might as well take a trip) and visited Whole Foods, actually caught an upper level produce employee and chatted - he really wanted to turn me onto HoneyCrisp, there was a big display of 4" ones - insipid - and not that good of texture either - On to Trader Joe's, big display of nasty green 2.25-2.75" HoneyCrisp, obviously off overcropped trees - wish I would have taken pictures, but I was on vacation... The ones in the local stores recently have been respectable @ $2.49 to $2.99/pound It's hard to grow good ones - twice the price but half the pack-out - a real temptation to lower standards - HoneyCrisp has generated apple excitement like none other in the last 30 years and has reset the bar - it is the new standard by which other varieties are measured and the traditional varieties don't measure up - Jonagored may compete in its week, but there's no comparison a couple weeks later - David On Jan 29, 2014, at 8:05 PM, Shoemaker, William H wrote: > Now the question is, how did anyone find a Honeycrisp that doesn't taste > good? Is it the variety? Is it how its grown? Is it postharvest handling? Is > it all the above? In our markets around Chicago it is really difficult to > find high quality apples of any variety from Washington. They look beautiful, > but lack flavor. I think Washington growers produce great apples. They don't > show up here. I've had excellent Honeycrisp from local orchards in northern > Illinois. In southern IL, they aren't as good. We get Fuji from MI in our > local Aldi that are cheap and outstanding to eat. I think local Red Delicious > are just delicious. But then, everyone knows, Red Delicious is a terrible > apple. Why do we have so much acreage of this apple?!! > > Bill > William H. Shoemaker > Retired fruit and vegetable horticulturist > University of Illinois > wshoe...@illinois.edu > > The problem is, poorly grown HC are just not good tasting apples. They need a > cold winter, heavy thinning to avoid over cropping, calcium sprays every 4-6 > days and careful handling. /// > > > On Wed, Jan 29, 2014 at 2:59 PM, Steven Bibula wrote: > In Hannaford (a major regional supermarket) today, all apples were 99 cents > per pound, except some smallish, mediocre-looking honeycrisp at $2.49 per > pound. How long can an apple coast in the premium price range on little more > than the name? > > Steven Bibula > Plowshares Community Farm > 236 Sebago Lake Road > Gorham ME 04038 > 207.239.0442 > www.plowsharesmaine.com > > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] ethylene
Thank you Jon and Harrison - I had received a private response to my question with links to two articles which I post here for anyone else that might be following along - neither are as technical as the attached paper. http://www.nyshs.org/pdf/fq/2000-Volume-8/Vol-8-No-3/MCP-Facts,-Speculation,-and-How-Could-it-Affect-the-New-York-Apple-Industry.pdf http://www.chemistry-blog.com/2011/10/12/fruit-ripening-how-does-it-work/ After repeated readings and a bit of thought, here is my current take home. 1. Ethylene is not the sole regulator of ripening in apples, but would be considered the largest single regulator. 2. Ethylene switches on several different genes controlling various aspects of ripening apples. Ethylene activated genes may produce enzymes which break chemical bonds associated with cell walls, leading to the cell wall loss of integrity and on to softening fruit. Etc. 3. Low internal ethylene production/concentration in certain varieties of apple is not the determining factor of long keeping, crispy flesh - ethylene receptor sites in a fruit are saturated at relatively low levels of ethylene, maybe as low as 10 ppm while the internal ethylene concentrations in common varieties are in the 100's of ppm. 4. Low ethylene generation in certain varieties may be correlated/associated with a physiology that is less sensitive to the effects of ethylene generally (few or mutated ethylene triggered genes?) 5. There is a lot unknown... Please feel free to challenge my interpretation - it's oversimplified I know, and some of it may just be wrong. I need to read thru the Harb paper several more times to do it justice, tho I feel like I'm getting a bit deeper understanding with each reading. I also note that we (as fruit growers, researchers, consumers) are up against the limitations of language as we discuss fruit quality - "firm" is not a scientific term - HoneyCrisp is not 'firm' in comparison to Arkansas Black- Mitch Lynd uses the word 'crispy' to describe HoneyCrisp - Red Delicious can be 'crisp', but is never 'crispy' - Miller at OSU has demonstrated that there is a physiological difference between Red Delicious (and the other common varieties) and HoneyCrisp in the way the fruit's flesh cleaves during chewing - Red Delicious et. al. break apart between cells, with cells remaining more or less intact, while in HoneyCrisp (and a few others) the cells break open (explosively crisp!), releasing the cell contents and providing the much sought after crunch. Reading the current active thread about 'HoneyCrisp prices' demonstrates how difficult it is for language to precisely describe aspects of quality. "...reflect the failure of traditional pressure testers to adequately measure crispness rather than firmness." Harp et.al. (the attached paper) - "There is no mechanical test that can sort out what people like." Miller, Ohio presentation 1/19/14 regards David Doud grower, IN On Jan 30, 2014, at 4:29 PM, Jon Clements wrote: > -- Forwarded message -- > From: "Wright, Harrison" > To: "Nichols, Doug" , > "apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net" > > Cc: "DeLong, John" > Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2014 20:47:52 + > Subject: RE: [apple-crop] ethylene > Hello Doug, I will add my two cents and attempt to answer David's questions, > for what it is worth. > > There is quite a range in the amount of ethylene that different apple > cultivars produce; in general though, they all have a similar signature: > immature fruit have little ethylene, sudden ethylene synthesis spurs > maturation and then this synthesis fades as the fruit begins to senesce. > > I think there likely is a trend between low ethylene fruit generally holding > firmness and high ethylene fruit going soft. Other examples could be Gala > fruit have low ethylene and stay firm and Macs and Cortland have high > ethylene and go soft. Whether this is cause and effect or a matter of > correlation, I am not sure; my hunch is it is complex and more the latter. > > It is an interesting question as to whether if you exposed a Honeycrisp apple > to high ethylene whether it too would go soft. My guess is you might have a > modest effect (same way that you can add a ripe banana to other green > climacteric fruit to more quickly ripen them), but it will not turn the > Honeycrisp into, say, a Mac because there are many other variables. > > I attached a recent paper comparing Honeycrisp to Macs. They found many > differences between the two besides just the peak climacteric ethylene > levels. ACC (the precursor to ethylene) was much higher in Honeycrisp than > Mac, suggesting there might be a limiting step there. When the two cultivars > w
Re: [apple-crop] Frost protection via overhead sprinklers made mattersworse?
slice some incipient fruit thru the equator with your thumbnail or a knife - healthy fruit will have pearlescent ovules - damage will show up as brown tissue - David Doud voice of experience On Feb 2, 2014, at 4:12 PM, Rye Hefley wrote: > > > Thanks Con, > > The spacing is one 360 degee nozzlee between each tree so each tree is hit > from both sides. > > The ice is gone now and the flowers are still fragrant. The petals are a bit > translucent. Stems are still green but may be too early to tell anything. > > Yeah I worry about the off hour. I guess wait and see. > > Again thanks. > > Rye > > -- > On Sun, Feb 2, 2014 10:11 AM PST Con.Traas wrote: > >> Hello Rye, >> I am not very expert in this, as I don't use the system, so hopefully >> somebody else can add more. Regarding the ice and icicles, these would not >> necessarily mean you had a problem, as long as there was a coating of >> unfrozen water on them at all times. This would prevent the ice from >> dropping below freezing point. The fact that the water turned off could be a >> problem though, as then there would have been no more unfrozen water, and >> the ice (and buds encased therein) would drop to the ambient temperature. >> 4gph sprinklers might not be adequate I suspect, or would not protect >> against a more severe frost (it depends too on how close they are spaced). >> When I looked into getting frost-protection irrigation for my orchards, the >> water use would have been many times (perhaps 6 or 8 times from memory) what >> I would have needed for soil mositure deficit irrigation only. I am afriad >> that I can't shed light on what a good rate would be, but I bet someone else >> here can. >> The good news is I would be very surprised if your trees were damaged by the >> ice. >> Con Traas >> Ireland >> >> >> >> From: apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net on behalf of Rye Hefley >> Sent: Sun 02/02/2014 17:01 >> To: apple-crop@virtualorchard.net >> Subject: [apple-crop] Frost protection via overhead sprinklers made >> mattersworse? >> >> >> >> Hello, >> >> So last night there was a forecast for 29° for early this morning. Frost >> NOT in the forecast. >> >> So I decided the forecast could change to frost while I was sleeping or the >> forecasters could miss it so I scheduled the sprinklers. This was my first >> attempt at frost protection as this is the first producing year for the >> orchard. >> >> First concern: I set the time too short and the sprinklers turned off at >> 6:30 (worst possible time). Don't ask me what I was thinking when came up >> with the duration, though I have degree in math, I don't have one in >> arithmetic. So it was off for an hour before I discovered it and turned it >> back on. >> >> Second concern: using 4 gallon/hour micro sprinklers that produce a thick >> mist, when I went out there at 7:30 the trees (flowers, leaves, wood, set >> fruit) were encased in 1/4" ice and icicles. >> >> So I think maybe the 4GPH nozzles deliver too little water for frost >> protection and just made it worse. Also being off for the worse possible >> hour made it "worser" still. >> >> What would be your assessment on the damage I did this year? (Fortunately >> only one variety that I care much about. The others haven't bloomed yet so >> no water on those.) Will the trees survive the ice? Will the fruit that >> already set be OK? Kiss the flowers goodbye? Will the new buds make it? >> >> If 4GPH is not sufficient, in the future what would be a better delivery >> rate. (Assuming I could avoid the arithmetic error from now on.) >> >> Thanks for your insights. >> >> Rye Hefley >> So Cal >> ___ >> apple-crop mailing list >> apple-crop@virtualorchard.net >> http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop >> >> > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] 21st century apple peeling
follow this link to a .gif file - where I found it, it was considered cute, but I can see some real application for small time processors - http://i.imgur.com/r0hbM9I.gif David Doud Indiana 3/31/12 = full bloom 3/31/14 = not to silver tip yet ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] fresh fruit health benefits
someone needs to make a nice poster from this - http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/03/140331194030.htm "Eating seven or more portions of fruit and vegetables a day reduces your risk of death at any point in time by 42 percent compared to eating less than one portion, reports a new study. This is the first study to link fruit and vegetable consumption with all-cause, cancer and heart disease deaths in a nationally-representative population, the first to quantify health benefits per-portion, and the first to identify the types of fruit and vegetable with the most benefit." ""We all know that eating fruit and vegetables is healthy, but the size of the effect is staggering," says Dr Oyinlola Oyebode of UCL's Department of Epidemiology & Public Health, lead author of the study. "The clear message here is that the more fruit and vegetables you eat, the less likely you are to die at any age. Vegetables have a larger effect than fruit, but fruit still makes a real difference. If you're happy to snack on carrots or other vegetables, then that is a great choice but if you fancy something sweeter, a banana or any fruit will also do you good." " David Doud grower, IN ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] apple as art
I don't know quite what to make of this 'New Yorker' article - http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/elements/2014/05/object-of-interest-the-twice-forbidden-fruit.html - I think some things were lost/confused in the relating and retelling of the story. "He (Joe Davis) plans to use synthetic biology to insert a DNA-encoded version of Wikipedia into the apple and create a living, literal tree of knowledge..." Anybody know what the "four thousand year old strain of apple" might be? Nice picture of Cox Orange Pippin at the top... David Doud grower, IN - petal fall - ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Narrow Tall Spindle Layout
not an expert here, but it's my understanding in a spindle system the space between trees in the row is determined by what renewal pruning will fill and that much over 3' between trees in most situations would require permanent woody architecture to keep the space filled, which brings about several horticultural challenges - then the space between rows versus the height of the trees becomes a calculation to maximize yield - in a you-pick situation I'd suggest that maximum yield would be a secondary consideration to logistics - that wider rows and shorter trees for convenience and safety would override a certain percentage of maximum theoretical yield - I shudder to consider what strategies the public might employ to harvest that beautiful apple just out of their reach... if my understanding is incorrect, feel free to challenge - David On Jul 3, 2014, at 11:21 AM, Matt Pellerin wrote: > Thanks for the responses. I was thinking of going to a 10 x 3 orchard > growing Honeycrisp on M26 and Macoun on Bud 9. I think the 10 x 3 spacing > puts the tree height at 8.5' which will work pretty well for pick-your-own. > On this kind of spacing, will I still be within the Tall Spindle category? > Will I have to make adjustments in my pruning methodology or will the typical > tall spindle pruning and training recommendations work? > > Thanks, > Matt > > > On Thu, Jul 3, 2014 at 8:26 AM, wrote: > I concur with Dennis' evaluation of Dr. Robinson's videos; this system has > forced even stubborn high-chill varieties to transition from vegetative > mode to fruiting mode in hot climates and the tropics. > > I wanted to address Matthew's desire to keep the trees around 6' tall. > This sounds like it would take a very dwarfing rootstock like M27; do any > of our growers have experience training these as tall spindle? > > Kevin Hauser > Kuffel Creek Apple Nursery > Riverside, California > Nakifuma, Uganda > > On Thu, 3 Jul 2014 00:23:19 -0500, > wrote: > > matthew, > > > > We have been growing tall spindle in northern Illinois in a > pick-your-own > > orchard for around 5 or 6 years now. The system has been improving over > > the years and currently the newer spacing being recommended by Dr. > Terence > > Robinson > > from Cornell is around 12' x 3'. I highly recommend watching the videos > > at YouTube he did at the Winter Apple School in Henderson County, NC > found > > at http://youtu.be/gJF4wLgXnK8 > > > > After viewing this video and others on the BRCC TV - The Educational > > Channel on YouTube covering the Tall Spindle System, we will be making > the > > recommended changes to our current system of 14' x 4'. > > > > Hope this helps. > > > > Dennis Norton > > IPM Specialist/Certified Nurseryman > > Royal Oak Farm Orchard > > 15908 Hebron Rd. > > Harvard, IL 60033-9357 > > Office (815) 648-4467 > > Mobile (815) 228-2174 > > Fax (609) 228-2174 > > http://www.royaloakfarmorchard.com > > http://www.royaloakfarmorchard.blogspot.com > > - Original Message - > > From: Matt Pellerin > > To: apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > > Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2014 2:55 PM > > Subject: [apple-crop] Narrow Tall Spindle Layout > > > > > > I am a grower in central Maine that operates a pick-your-own orchard. > I > > will be planting a tall spindle orchard next year. I would like to > plant > > the rows as narrow as possible in combination with shorter trees so > the > > customers can reach more of the fruit. My orchard tractor is 54" > wide. > > How narrow can I plant my tall spindle orchard with this equipment? > > Also, what would be the appropriate tree height at the narrow row > > spacing? > > > > > > Thanks, > > -- > > > > Matthew Pellerin > > Agricultural Manager > > Treworgy Family Orchards > > 3876 Union St > > Levant, ME 04456 > > > > www.treworgyorchards.com > > > > 207-884-8354 > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > ___ > > apple-crop mailing list > > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > > > -- > Matthew Pellerin > Agricultural Manager > Treworgy Family Orchards > 3876 Union St > Levant, ME 04456 > www.treworgyorchards.com > 207-884-8354 > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] "Inglorious fruits and vegetables"
This link is to a 2.5 minute video from France (mostly in English) about a campaign to sell less than perfect fruit and vegetables - the EU has made 2014 the 'European year against food waste' - interesting marketing - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2nSECWq_PE&feature=youtu.be David Doud grower, Indiana ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Fireblight in Nova Scotia
A sad story - I had the worst fireblight last year I've ever experienced, a helpless feeling - mercifully it's pretty well faded away this season - I think cutting (during the growing season) makes it worse - Be sure to read the comments to the story - they tell another tale... David Doud grower - Indiana On Jul 29, 2014, at 10:05 PM, George Greene wrote: > Hi All; > > There has been an outbreak of fireblight in Nova Scotia following Hurricane > Arthur. > > See: > http://www.herald.ns.ca/novascotia/1225952-arthur-unleashes-fire-blight-in-nova-scotia-apple-orchards > > Be well, George Greene > > Sent from our iMac > > "We do not have a government of the majority. We have a government of the > majority who participate." Thomas Jefferson > > When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. When the government > fears the people, there is liberty. >~~Thomas Jefferson > > George and Pat Greene > 68 Willow Lane > Wiscasset, ME 04578 > > > > > > > > > > > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] Polish apples
A BBC story about Russia banning the import of Polish apples and the social media response - "On Wednesday, Russia announced a ban on some fruit and vegetable imports - including apples - from Poland "for sanitary reasons". Polish food producers say the ban is politically motivated as a response to EU sanctions, a claim Russia denies. In response, Poles have been showing their support for local farmers by campaigning on social media. It started on Twitter when the journalist Grzegorz Nawacki shared an image of himself eating an apple and used the hashtag #jedzjabłka, which means "eat apples"" http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-28590589 David Doud grower, Indiana___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Planting density for Asian pears
I sent this reply yesterday with a couple of pictures attached but it has not appeared yet, maybe Jon could check the apple-crop 'junk' folder? - here is the text without the pictures - I've been growing asian pears for 20+ years now, but not in a high density situation - my planting is about 12' X 16' with open center trees - it has worked very well actually, the trees are readily maintained so that 95% of the fruit is accessed from the ground - I find the main difficulty in growing asian pears is thinning - it's all hand work so it's important to make it as easy as possible - 12' tall trees make it difficult - In the situation you describe I'd be considering removing every other tree, or maybe 2 out of 3 trees, so to be able to shorten and broaden the fruiting volume - Another consideration is variety selection - I had a row of Shinko and took them out - the flavor/sugar of that variety was markedly inferior to others of that season (Korean Giant/Olympic) at my location - Talking to my asian customers, these pears are used more for cooking than for fresh eating in pacific cultures - The best resource I have for asian pears is 'Guide Book of Nashi Production in Japan' by Kanichi Yaneyama/translated by Shinji Kawai and published by the Oregon Asian Pear Council in 1989 - I don't know about current availability - 75 pages with detailed discussion of pruning/thinning/management by variety with diagrams and pictures - David Doud grower, Indiana On Aug 1, 2014, at 10:12 AM, Weinzierl, Richard A wrote: > A new grower bought an Asian pear orchard that was planted a few years ago > north of Peoria, IL. Except for pollenizers, it’s all ‘Shinko’, and > apparently its resistance to fireblight is very good – I saw only one or two > infections in hundreds of trees. > > They have planted trees at very high density (4 feet in-row by 12 feet > between rows); the trees are at least 12 feet tall. Is anyone familiar > high-density production of Asian pears? And if so, do you have any pruning > recommendations? It’s obvious the density and prior pruning practices will > not work together. > > The fact sheets and similar references that I’ve seen suggest much lower tree > densities (218 to 242 trees per acre). > > Any general thoughts on managing the trees at high density … and what > spacing would you recommend for the additional plantings they intend to make? > > Rick Weinzierl > > Professor and Extension Entomologist > IL SARE PDP Coordinator > Department of Crop Sciences, University of Illinois > S-334 Turner Hall, 1102 S. Goodwin Avenue > Urbana, IL 61801 > 217-244-2126 > > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Thank you "Mister Liberty"!
I heard at market today that Liberty was Patrick Henry's favorite apple and that his remarks at the second Virginia Convention are widely misunderstood - D On Oct 5, 2014, at 5:12 PM, Jon Clements wrote: > Couldn't agree with you more Claude, that's why they call me 'Mr Liberty!' > > http://www.virtualorchard.net/mrliberty/default.html > > I will say, however, I have fruited 'Modi' for the first time this year. It > is a Liberty X Gala cross from Italy, and clubbed over there, where it is > being touted as "Eco-Friendly" and having a low-carbon footprint compared to > other apple varieties. Interesting: http://www.modiapple.com/en-UK/. In North > America, International New Varieties Network/C&O Nursery has the production > and marketing rights to Modi. It is a quite good apple based on my limited > experience... > > Jon > > Jon > > On Sun, Oct 5, 2014 at 12:12 PM, Claude Jolicoeur wrote: > Yesterday, I was picking my Liberty apples and had a good thought for Jon > Clements, as I really think this is a great apple! > > This year is a light crop year for almost all my varieties, some setting > nothing and others at 10 to 25% of a normal crop. Nevertheless, my Liberties > managed to yield an almost normal crop. Great job. > > It is also a very easy tree to train and grow, easily manageable, that yields > a high percentage of first grade apples even when in a no-spray orchard or > yard. > > As of apple quality, when grown here in Quebec, it might not be the best, but > I find it better than many others and certainly is among the 10 best that > grow here in zone 4. It is also very good for cider making - again maybe not > the best, and it needs to be blended to balance its acidity, but better than > many others. And additionally, it makes very good ice cider! > > Some people say it produces too many small apples - true. You just have to > make cider with them. Plus, small apples have more flavor. > > All in all, one of the greatest apples to grow here, either for a backyard > owner, a small hobby orchardist, a cider maker, or someone who doesn't like > or want to spray. > > So, again, thank you "Mister Liberty" for making this apple available to us! > > > Claude Jolicoeur > > Author, The New Cider Maker's Handbook > http://www.cjoliprsf.ca/ > http://www.chelseagreen.com/bookstore/item/the_new_cider_makers_handbook/ > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > > > -- > Jon Clements > aka 'Mr Honeycrisp' > UMass Cold Spring Orchard > 393 Sabin St. > Belchertown, MA 01007 > 413-478-7219 > umassfruit.com > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] Poetry and reality
Here's a pleasant read from the New York Times on apples - http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/23/garden/apple-picking-season-is-here-dont-you-want-more-than-a-macintosh.html?emc=eta1&_r=0# And a bit of reality ranting from a market gardener - http://www.mcsweeneys.net/articles/a-small-scale-organic-farmer-wants-you-to-know-a-few-things#.VEhNmsa04Pw.twitter - warning: a bit of profanity in the essay, but anyone who sells direct can relate, I'd wager - David Doud grower - Indiana hope to wrap up harvest by this weekend - ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Sizing cold storage
Nick, that's an excellent reply from Ernest that articulates many of the considerations - Without knowing more of your business plan (retail? wholesale? 60 day harvest window? 3 varieties or 30 varieties? etc) it's impossible to make specific recommendations - I worked for my family's orchard for several years, a retail operation that grows many varieties, somewhat larger than your acreage - I'll add a consideration from that perspective - Have multiple rooms - A small room attached to the sales area with two doors, one from the back, one into the sales - both doors sized for a pallet jack - for a few weeks at the start of the season it may be big enough - A room common to the others where fruit comes in and can be staged for grading/sales/processing/cider - this can be run at 50*, Honeycrisp and Mutsu and similar varieties can be tempered there, hot fruit from the daily picking/fruit for short term sales can reside there overnight and have the field heat removed - apples from/to the grading and packing area can be staged - The cold room(s) held at 33* or whatever desired temperature - it's hard to make this/these big enough to never wish it were bigger, but determine some figure for the maximum number of boxes you expect to have full and the maximum number of varieties at any one time and calculate the footprint and then double it - Do not ask me how a 30 acre orchard can afford such a facility - I do not know - David Doud I built a new 14' x15' X 9' walk-in off the sales floor this season and I like it very much... On Oct 31, 2014, at 7:53 AM, rollinsorcha...@gmail.com wrote: > Nick, > > The size of a storage will depend on a lot of factors. > > 1). How long is your harvest period? The apples that we picked in August are > sold long before we pick the last of the apples in October. > > 2). How long do your varieties keep. If you grow something highly in demand > you might ask a higher price and have to store them until people want them. > That may be November some years and it may be March other years. > > 3) How close is your alternative when your storage is full? I work with > another orchard 15 miles away to store some excess fruit when I have a > bumper crop. > > 4)How much do you expect to sell in a month? Conventional wisdom is that you > have six to eight weeks to sell the apples once you break open a CA storage > room. > > 5) Do you plan on using Smartfresh? You can have a small room where you > smartfresh a few days harvest before moving it to the main storage room, or > depending on the variety you can size a room for a week's harvest and > smartfresh it all together. > > 6). Are you planning on growing any varieties with special chilling > requirements. Honeycrisp require several days at 50 degrees before putting > them in a colder room. > > > I am afraid I didn't give you answers so much as more questions to ask > yourself. Our storage capacity is 75% of our maximum yield and it gets > pretty tight this time of year, but is sufficient 7 out of 10 years. I would > suggest that you have a plan to add more storage capacity if the need arises > than go whole hog at first. > > > > Ernest Rollins > Owner > Rollins Orchards, Garland, Maine, USA > A Family Farm since 1821 > rollinsorcha...@gmail.com > www.RollinsOrchards.com > > > > > --Original Message-- > From: Nick Lucking > Sender: apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net > To: Apple-Crop virtual orchard > ReplyTo: Apple-Crop virtual orchard > Subject: [apple-crop] Sizing cold storage > Sent: Oct 26, 2014 11:20 PM > > Does anyone have any good guides on how large a cold storage facility > should be on your orchard? For example if one was to grow 15,000 bu. > how much should you have capacity for storing, 50%, 75%? I can't > really find much info on this. > > Cheers, > > Nick Lucking > Cannon Valley Orchard > Cannon Falls, MN > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > > Ernest Rollins > Rollins Orchards > Garland, Maine > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] 'Real' Apple Store
A delightful short article and a half-dozen pictures from London - "...London's Borough Market, one of the oldest markets in the U.K., is marking its 1,000th anniversary this year. (Yes, it's been around for a millennium.) As part of the celebrations, it treated shoppers to a delightful concept—creating a "Real Apple Store" for the weekend that was a clever copy of Apple's iconic retail establishments. Actual apples were displayed on lucite pedestals just like an iPhone or iPad would be, but instead of technical specs, the signs showed each apple's unique flavor notes and history. Take a look below at some more photos of this great little shop. It remains unclear whether the apples themselves were marked up to 500 percent of their actual value" http://www.adweek.com/adfreak/apple-store-london-looks-just-regular-apple-store-except-it-sells-real-apples-161468 David Doud IN___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] New MAIA website
The Midwest Apple Improvement Association went online with an expanded website yesterday - there's more information on the organization/products and links to previous years newsletters and a link to a Powerpoint presentation that contains 'all' the information on EverCrisp - http://www.midwestapple.com/ The EverCrisp apple website remains online also - http://www.evercrispapple.com/ David Doud grower, IN ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] 'Real' Apple Store
Well, I guess it could apply to either - 'actual value' is a rather nebulous qualifier, open to debate and like so many things, it all depends on your point of view - or maybe 'let them eat their phone' D On Nov 20, 2014, at 9:26 AM, Jon Clements wrote: > Dave, regarding your last comment, were you referring to Apple Computer > products or Honeycrisp apples??? > > :-) > > On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 9:11 AM, David Doud wrote: > A delightful short article and a half-dozen pictures from London - > > "...London's Borough Market, one of the oldest markets in the U.K., is > marking its 1,000th anniversary this year. (Yes, it's been around for a > millennium.) As part of the celebrations, it treated shoppers to a delightful > concept—creating a "Real Apple Store" for the weekend that was a clever copy > of Apple's iconic retail establishments. > Actual apples were displayed on lucite pedestals just like an iPhone or iPad > would be, but instead of technical specs, the signs showed each apple's > unique flavor notes and history. > Take a look below at some more photos of this great little shop. It remains > unclear whether the apples themselves were marked up to 500 percent of their > actual value" > > http://www.adweek.com/adfreak/apple-store-london-looks-just-regular-apple-store-except-it-sells-real-apples-161468 > > David Doud > IN > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > > > > -- > Jon Clements > aka 'Mr Honeycrisp' > UMass Cold Spring Orchard > 393 Sabin St. > Belchertown, MA 01007 > 413-478-7219 > umassfruit.com > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] How to excise malus seeds
I'm wondering why your success rate is so low for non-manipulated seeds - my usual regime involves leaving the seeds in the apples (if they keep reasonably well) thru the winter (this serves as stratification), cut them out in early spring (often a percentage of them are germinating by then), clorox rinse, then either store on damp paper towels in a baggie in the fridge or plant into plug trays immediately - my general experience is ~90% germination and maybe 80% make it to the field - You might want to review your stratification techniques - you might save a lot of work - David On Jan 5, 2015, at 11:27 AM, lee elliott wrote: > Anyone know an easy way to excise malus seeds, in my efforts to breed next > generations of my Honey Crisp crosses I always have about half of my > collected seeds are excised (split) and embryo are easy to remove. > (germination rate of embryos removed from seed coat are much higher, close to > 90% while unexcised seeds is about 15%) The best way so far is to soak the > seed(after statification) and drag the seed gently accross a piece of > sandpaper, rubbing the side of the seed where the hilum is located, then > prying it apart with fingernails. this a very slow tedious procedure and may > even contaminate the embryo. With hundreds of seed to excise and poor > eyesight this is a most daunting task. I have googled this but nothing comes > up, any ideas? Lee Elliott, Cider Hill Nursery, Winchester, Illinois > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] How to excise malus seeds
I was out working and had a thought - find a junior or senior high school girl with good eyesight and fingernails and pay her to follow your successful regime - I applaud your dedication, that's a lot of work - D On Jan 5, 2015, at 11:27 AM, lee elliott wrote: > Anyone know an easy way to excise malus seeds, in my efforts to breed next > generations of my Honey Crisp crosses I always have about half of my > collected seeds are excised (split) and embryo are easy to remove. > (germination rate of embryos removed from seed coat are much higher, close to > 90% while unexcised seeds is about 15%) The best way so far is to soak the > seed(after statification) and drag the seed gently accross a piece of > sandpaper, rubbing the side of the seed where the hilum is located, then > prying it apart with fingernails. this a very slow tedious procedure and may > even contaminate the embryo. With hundreds of seed to excise and poor > eyesight this is a most daunting task. I have googled this but nothing comes > up, any ideas? Lee Elliott, Cider Hill Nursery, Winchester, Illinois > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] German cultivars?
We're looking for the apple cultivars 'Realka', 'Regia', 'Reka', 'Releta', and 'Remura' - all bred at Dresden-Pillnitz Germany - I'm uncertain whether they exist in the US, but thought this would be the group to ask - I don't see them listed at Geneva - read about them (and others) here: http://www.inhort.pl/files/journal_pdf/journal_2004spec2/full2004-3Aspec.pdf if you're interested - Thanks - David Doud grower - IN ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] German cultivars?
thanks Robert - I'll contact you next week after your event is over - David On Jan 28, 2015, at 10:39 PM, Rob Crassweller wrote: > David, > > I have an extensive collection of them. I am at Mid Atlantic Fruit & > Vegetable conference and do not have access to my laptop list. I also have > some of the CATS trees and the Golden Sunshine series from Czech Republic > > Rob > > Sent from my iPad > >> On Jan 28, 2015, at 5:31 PM, David Doud wrote: >> >> We're looking for the apple cultivars 'Realka', 'Regia', 'Reka', >> 'Releta', and 'Remura' - all bred at Dresden-Pillnitz Germany - I'm >> uncertain whether they exist in the US, but thought this would be the group >> to ask - I don't see them listed at Geneva - read about them (and others) >> here: >> http://www.inhort.pl/files/journal_pdf/journal_2004spec2/full2004-3Aspec.pdf >> if you're interested - >> Thanks - >> David Doud >> grower - IN >> >> >> ___ >> apple-crop mailing list >> apple-crop@virtualorchard.net >> http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] German cultivars?
Thanks Jon - I had forgotten about appletesters, altho none of these varieties seem to be indexed there - 'Realka' and 'Releika' are two separate varieties out of the German program - 'Re..' = 'resistance' - they are looking at 5 different diseases, scab among them, and they have several Vf selections, Releika being one of them - We are looking for the Vr scab resistance gene in a modern type apple - the five cultivars listed are Vr containing - we have the technology now to be able to screen and get the Vf and Vr stacked, tho it will likely take at least 2 generations to get a commercial quality apple with both. David On Jan 28, 2015, at 9:51 PM, Jon Clements wrote: > Hi David, I have (supposedly) these: Rezista Gala-like--- (Releika cultivar), > Rezista Jon-like--- (Resi cultivar); Rezista Gold-like--- (Goldstar > cultivar); Rezista Rome-like--- (Rajka cultivar). They were planted around > 2003-04 I think so they may pre-date the ones you are looking for? I believe > Matt Moser of Moser Fruit Tree Sales (http://www.forfruittrees.com/) got them > for me. Nothing really special about them, but they are not terrible either. > Looking at their names, however, there is resemblance to the ones you ask > for: Realka = Releika? Resi is listed in the table in the publication. So, I > am not sure those names I have above are correct? I would need descriptions. > Rob Crassweller at PSU might have more information about the breeding program > and these cultivars. If you want to go to appletesters.net and login as > Guest, use the Find menu to search for the above cultivars. If you want to > see the pictures, replace the "fruit.umext.umass.edu" in the Picture URL with > "fruitadvisor.info" (i.e., > http://fruit.umext.umass.edu/images/2009apples/rezistagoldstar101609ma.jpg > becomes > http://fruitadvisor.info/images/2009apples/rezistagoldstar101609ma.jpg). Hope > that helps. > > Jon > > On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 4:13 PM, David Doud wrote: > We're looking for the apple cultivars'Realka', 'Regia', 'Reka', 'Releta', > and 'Remura' - all bred at Dresden-Pillnitz Germany - I'm uncertain whether > they exist in the US, but thought this would be the group to ask - I don't > see them listed at Geneva - read about them (and others) here: > http://www.inhort.pl/files/journal_pdf/journal_2004spec2/full2004-3Aspec.pdf > if you're interested - > Thanks - > David Doud > grower - IN > > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > > > -- > Jon Clements > aka 'Mr Honeycrisp' > UMass Cold Spring Orchard > 393 Sabin St. > Belchertown, MA 01007 > 413-478-7219 > umassfruit.com > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] arctic apples
Well, I have been to two social events since the GMO 'Arctic apples' have been in the news - and that is what people want to talk to me about - and pretty much only that... How are you all handling this? My personal opinions aside, I don't want to 'carry water' for these guys - they aren't going to let me grow them even if I wanted to and I don't feel inclined to spend my time and credibility providing them cover and fighting their marketing struggle for them - This is going to be a frequently reoccurring issue this season - I've got an event to go to this afternoon and I am dreading this aspect of it - David Doud grower, IN below 0*F, way behind on pruning ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] arctic apples
t;> I like your comment David, and I agree. I don't want to "carry water" >> for >>> them anyway. All of these companies pay big money for the best lawyers >> and >>> lobbyists. They need to help defending their actions. I take the >> position >>> when pressed by folks who are not familiar with genetic engineering that >>> I'm comfortable with the technique, but that I'm not sure I'm >> comfortable >>> with how its being employed. I'd like to see more caution and more >> effort >>> to give the public real answers to their questions about these products >> and >>> about the way these techniques are used. I think they companies which >>> employ GMOs don't feel they need to be accountable for the products they >>> are putting into the marketplace. Every direct-market growers knows that >>> they face accountability, like it or not, and must reconcile with it in >>> some way. And while these companies do to, like it or not, I don't think >>> they are being fair to the consumer in the marketplace by failing to >> make >>> more effort to address their questi >>> ons about their products. So I tell those folks who ask that I can't >>> defend the products, not because I think they are unsafe, but because I >>> don't agree with the way they are being introduced into the market. >>> >>> Bill >>> William H. Shoemaker >>> Retired fruit and vegetable horticulturist >>> University of Illinois >>> wshoe...@illinois.edu >>> >>> >>> From: apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net >>> [apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net] on behalf of David Doud >>> [david_d...@me.com] >>> Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 8:53 AM >>> To: Apple-Crop >>> Subject: [apple-crop] arctic apples >>> >>> Well, I have been to two social events since the GMO 'Arctic apples' >> have >>> been in the news - and that is what people want to talk to me about - >> and >>> pretty much only that... >>> >>> How are you all handling this? My personal opinions aside, I don't want >> to >>> 'carry water' for these guys - they aren't going to let me grow them >> even >>> if I wanted to and I don't feel inclined to spend my time and >> credibility >>> providing them cover and fighting their marketing struggle for them - >>> >>> This is going to be a frequently reoccurring issue this season - I've >> got >>> an event to go to this afternoon and I am dreading this aspect of it - >>> >>> David Doud >>> grower, IN >>> below 0*F, way behind on pruning >>> >>> ___ >>> apple-crop mailing list >>> apple-crop@virtualorchard.net >>> http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop >>> ___ >>> apple-crop mailing list >>> apple-crop@virtualorchard.net >>> http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop >> ___ >> apple-crop mailing list >> apple-crop@virtualorchard.net >> http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] arctic apples
We have returned from attendance at our event and mercifully Arctic apples did not come up - likely because of the stimulating program that was enjoyed by a room full of scientists - David R., you state and ask "I certainly would NOT attempt to relay the concepts in my last post to the average consumer while attempting to sell them apples. What would be the point?.." - I see the point being respect for my customers - they have concerns and they are insulted and discouraged by paternalistic attitudes of those who would talk down to them - they have questions and I am (for better or worse) the expert because I grow apples and stand on the opposite side of the table from them every week (everyday, actually) - I am willing to do my best to explain the methods I use and measures I take to get my apples on that table - it gets complicated and takes lots of time, but I'll keep after it as long as there is communication and understanding - I don't want to, and am trying to plan how I will not, spend my time answering questions about Arctic apples - the people that stand to profit need to deal with this - the conundrum is doing this without adding to irrational anti-science sentiment and without disrespecting my customers. David Doud On Feb 26, 2015, at 6:50 PM, David A. Rosenberger wrote: > I can appreciate your frustration, David, and your “easy answer” gave me a > good chuckle. I certainly would NOT attempt to relay the concepts in my last > post to the average consumer while attempting to sell them apples. What > would be the point? Most consumers arrive with very pre-concieved ideas > about GMOs and I don’t think that the point of sale is the best time to > attempt re-education (if that is even remotely possible). I suspect that the > best approach is to be non-commital, and perhaps to note that none of the > apples currently available for sale are GMOs. > > When non-ag folks ask me about GMOs, I usually tell them that, as with any > technology, GMOs bring exciting new possibilities but also pose dangers that > need to be carefully regulated. I am not particularly excited about the > advantages of Arctic Apples, although it will be interesting to see if they > eventually play a role in expanding the shelf life of sliced apples. > > On the other hand, if I encountered a loud-mouthed GMO-phobe preaching the > evils of GMOs at a party, I probably would point out to them that their > opinions may be forcing less fortunate folks around the world into difficult > subsistence life styles that could be, at least to some extent, remedied via > GMO technology. Since any discussion of GMOs can generate heated arguments, > it may be best if none of you ever invite me to your parties! > >> On Feb 26, 2015, at 11:42 AM, David Doud wrote: >> >> Well argued David - now will you attend my markets with me and repeat that >> to every third customer? If I spend my time making these points will Arctic >> apples reimburse me? Will Arctic apples let me grow their material in return >> for 'carrying their water'? >> >> This dialog is being forced on me, the front line representative - I resent >> it - I particularly resent being expected to defend it on the basis of >> cosmetic issues that were/are addressable by conventional breeding - >> >> You know what the short easy answer is for me and people in my position? "My >> opinion is GMO apples will give you cancer and cause your kids to be >> autistic. Here - let's have a taste of what I am offering, no GMO >> herethat bag is $7, thanks very much" - >> >> It's tempting - >> D >> >> >> >> >> On Feb 26, 2015, at 11:07 AM, David A. Rosenberger wrote: >> >>> Thank you, Kevin, for your comments on how GMOs are needed in many >>> countries to ensure a reliable food supply. At our national plant >>> pathology meetings last summer, we heard a keynote speaker, a female >>> scientist from South Africa, address that same issue. In fact, she pointed >>> out that glyphosate-resistant crops provided female emancipation on many >>> small farms because it was the women who were expected to provide the >>> family food supply from small gardens, and before glyphosate resistant >>> crops became available they had to spend incredible amounts of time >>> hand-hoeing crops in the heat of summer. She also mentioned how >>> incorporating disease resistance into cassava via genetic modification >>> could drastically improve food stability. >>> >>> After listening to her impassioned presentation, I pretty much decided that >>> the anti-GMO f
[apple-crop] Arctic Apples again -
Sorry to beat this, but I think it's in our interest to stay informed - if the powers that be want me to give it a rest, I will - I copy and paste an email that went out to subscribers to Well.org - it was forwarded to me - I am unfamiliar with this organization and a peek at their website doesn't impress and the website itself doesn't have any content about Arctic Apples - I've been made aware of at least one other organization promoting anti-Arctic Apple sentiment - http://www.foe.org/projects/food-and-technology/genetic-engineering/no-gmo-apples I investigated the claim that "McDonald's and Gerber..." and it's not as presented - they have 'no plans' because there is no product available to buy, but they have not rejected and Gerber specifically admits and defends using GMO products - Looks like battle lines are being drawn and strategies arctic-ulated - David Doud peach leaf curl spray this week - 2012 on this date was apple full bloom - not at silver tip yet this year, but soon - You're hearing from us because you subscribed via Well.org. Last year, we released the Origins documentary for free to over 700,000 people across the world. If you want to unsubscribe, click here. On Friday the 13th, the USDA approved the unnecessary, unlabeled, and poorly tested GMO apple. It was an unlucky day indeed for the apple growers, food companies, and people like us who want to protect our families from GMO foods. But it’s not all bad news. Thanks to pressure from thousands of people like you, McDonald’s and Gerber -- two of the biggest purchasers of apples -- have already confirmed that they have no plans to sell GMO apples. Their commitments will help keep this risky product off the market. Now, we need to get other fast food companies to join them. If we can get the top 10 fast food companies, including Burger King, Wendy’s, Subway and Dunkin' Donuts, to commit to not sell the GMO apple, we may be able to prevent it from ending up on our plates! Tell these fast food restaurants to say NO to GMO apples! The apple in question – known as the “Arctic Apple®” -- was designed for purely cosmetic purposes. It was genetically engineered to not turn brown when cut. Of course, browning in apples can be prevented naturally by applying lemon juice or another source of vitamin C -- making this risky apple completely unnecessary. What’s more, without natural browning, apples may look fresh when they are actually decaying. In fact, scientists believe apples’ natural browning enzyme may help fight diseases and pests. In other words, if farmers grow these new apples, they may have to increase their pesticide use. And since they won’t be labeled, we won’t even know if the apples we’re buying are pesticide-doused GMOs! The evidence is clear: this experiment is all risk, no reward. Fast food restaurants have no excuse -- they must say NO to GMO apples! Tell fast food companies that their customers don’t want GMO apples! Like other GMOs, this apple won’t be labeled and didn’t undergo independent safety testing -- the USDA relied on the company’s own assessment that it is safe for human consumption. Worse yet, this GMO apple was genetically engineered via a new, virtually untested experimental technique called RNA interference -- which many scientists are concerned may have unintended negative impacts on human health and the environment. So who stands to benefit from the GMO apple? Not consumers. Definitely not apple growers, who have been opposing this apple all along. The only benefits will go to Okanagan Specialty Fruit -- the biotech company that produces the Arctic Apple®. Now that the USDA has approved the apple, it could end up in everything from school lunches to fast food, kids’ meals and grocery produce aisles. The risks to our health, our environment and apple farmers across the U.S. could be enormous. Fast food restaurants are increasingly trying to provide healthier options and are among the biggest potential buyers of these GMO apples -- so if we can stop them from buying the Arctic Apple®, we can send a strong signal that there is no market for it. It’s not too late to keep GMO apples off our plates -- tell fast food restaurants to say no to this rotten idea. Sincerely, Pedram Shojai, OMD COPYRIGHT © 2015 VITAL ORIGINS, LLC/WELL.ORG. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. THE INFORMATION INWELL.ORG IS FOR EDUCATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY AND SHOULD NOT BE CONSTRUED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. READERS ARE ADVISED TO CONSULT A QUALIFIED PROFESSIONAL ABOUT ANY ISSUE REGARDING THEIR HEALTH AND WELL-BEING. Unsubscribe Vital Origins, LLC 13 Orchard #108 Lake Forest, CA 92630 United States ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] non-GMO non-browning apples
If anyone has a need for an apple that doesn't brown, I'd be happy to send a stick or three of 'Sweet Emma', a chance seedling from grandfathers farm - white flesh that doesn't ever even hint of turning brown even while it dries to a crisp - a little flattened, red, 2.75", ripe early Oct, mild sweet crisp like a RD would dream of being - vigorous tree, early blooming, very scab susceptible, doesn't fill bins like Melrose or Mutsu, loses quality in six weeks (would probably respond well to 'Smart-Fresh') - I sell quite a few between Oct 5 and Thanksgiving - No charge - no obligation - David Doud ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] crop prospects
Take heart, Art - snowball bloom thin more easily due to natural competition between blooms - Golden Delicious is a problem as are varieties like Earligold and Liberty and to a lesser extent Gala and some of the oddballs - We had a snowball bloom and 80* temperatures during bloom (our full bloom was about 10-12 days ago) - our native pollinators are back to about 40% after their collapse of 2012, but are recovering - the best beekeeper in Indiana has two apiaries within 1/2 mile of me so honeybee activity was good along with daily quality working weather - Right in the middle, pretty much 'full bloom day', we had a wet night, wet all day, and another wet night with temps in the 60's and 70's - huge scab and fireblight period - still a little early to see any breakdown of control measures, I've got my fingers crossed - immediate post bloom was warm with rapid development/sizing of fruitlets and then it turned less pleasant with high winds and and the last three days have been highs in the 50's and 60's - I placed the pump and set up the irrigation in the strawberries yesterday just in case it would get frosty, but we had high overcast roll in yesterday evening and thus no long cold wet night was necessary - temperatures are suppose to rise now and I'm contemplating whether today (mid 60's) or tomorrow (80*) is the main day for thinning sprays - there's 30% chances of storms predicted for friday night/saturday morning - this morning I need to get the alternator back on the sprayer... anyway - the 'well behaved' annual cropping varieties have/are shedding the huge bloom and I am going to aggressively attack the biennial bearers and I am going to try to defruit half the trees of some of the problem varieties - I'd rather have short crops every year rather than boom and bust production - I wish you luck, would appreciate reciprocation - David On May 12, 2015, at 12:41 PM, Arthur Kelly wrote: > I don't know about the rest of you but if we get any kind of pollination > weather the crop will be very heavy and difficult to thin. The potential > bloom at this point is scary. We are at pink except for cracking some king > flowers on Zestar, Paulared, Gingergold etc. > > -- > Art Kelly > Kelly Orchards > Acton, ME > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] NPR 'The Miracle Apple'
On 'Planet Money' today - Jacob Goldstein and Dan Charles spend 15 minutes on the state of the apple industry and the Honeycrisp story - listen here: http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2015/05/27/410085320/episode-627-the-miracle-apple David Doud grower - Indiana this crop looks really nice right now - ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] NPR 'The Miracle Apple'
Here's Richard Lehnert's 2012 Good Fruit Grower article on the story of Honeycrisp - http://www.goodfruit.com/last-bite-the-honeycrisp-explosion/ A different perspective, but not inconsistent with the NPR story as far as I can tell - All hail the unknown tomcat parent of Honeycrisp... D On May 30, 2015, at 7:50 AM, Jon Clements wrote: > How does it differ Bill? I thought the Planet Money report was well done. > > Jon > > On Thu, May 28, 2015 at 6:10 PM, Fleming, William wrote: > Not quite the same story that Goodfruit Grower told a few months ago. > > Bill Fleming > Montana State University > Western Ag Research Center > 580 Quast Lane > Corvallis, MT 59828 > 406-961-3025 > Cell- 406-529-2409 > > -Original Message- > From: apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net > [mailto:apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net] On Behalf Of David Doud > Sent: Thursday, May 28, 2015 10:04 AM > To: Apple-Crop > Subject: [apple-crop] NPR 'The Miracle Apple' > > On 'Planet Money' today - Jacob Goldstein and Dan Charles spend 15 minutes on > the state of the apple industry and the Honeycrisp story - > > listen here: > http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2015/05/27/410085320/episode-627-the-miracle-apple > > David Doud > grower - Indiana > this crop looks really nice right now - > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > > > -- > Jon Clements > aka 'Mr Honeycrisp' > UMass Cold Spring Orchard > 393 Sabin St. > Belchertown, MA 01007 > 413-478-7219 > umassfruit.com > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] Assail rainfast?
A four day old application of Assail at 8oz - 1.5" of rain last night followed by .5" tonight (along with 1 minute of hail) - would this application retain its effectiveness or should I think of it in the same fashion that I would consider an application of Imidan under the same situation? - in other words, I'd consider Imidan to be effectively gone after 2" of rain but Assail has systemic action that is possibly not as affected by rain? I'm mainly worried about codling moth, but it's time for leafhoppers to show up too. I'd like to wait a week before the next application - David Doud grower Indiana - ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Assail rainfast?
> > Thanks all - Dr Wise's bulletin pretty well confirms my gut feeling even tho > I held out a bit of hope otherwise - > > Now to decide what to do when there is a strawberry patch to run mornings and > evenings and afternoon thunderstorms in the forecast for the next several > days... > > David > > > > > On Jun 8, 2015, at 10:19 PM, Peter Werts wrote: > >> Hi David, >> >> Check out this article that John Wise, MSU, posted on June 10th, 2014. >> >> http://msue.anr.msu.edu/news/rainfast_characteristics_of_insecticides_on_fru >> it_for_2014 >> >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> Peter >> >> >> = >> Peter Werts >> Project Manager >> Specialty Crops >> IPM Institute of North America, Inc. >> 1020 Regent St. >> Madison WI 53715 >> Office: 608 232-1410 >> Cell: 612 518-0319 >> Fax: 608 232-1440 >> pwe...@ipminstitute.org >> www.ipminstitute.org >> >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net >> [mailto:apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net] On Behalf Of David Doud >> Sent: Monday, June 8, 2015 7:58 PM >> To: Apple-Crop >> Subject: [apple-crop] Assail rainfast? >> >> A four day old application of Assail at 8oz - 1.5" of rain last night >> followed by .5" tonight (along with 1 minute of hail) - would this >> application retain its effectiveness or should I think of it in the same >> fashion that I would consider an application of Imidan under the same >> situation? - in other words, I'd consider Imidan to be effectively gone >> after 2" of rain but Assail has systemic action that is possibly not as >> affected by rain? I'm mainly worried about codling moth, but it's time for >> leafhoppers to show up too. I'd like to wait a week before the next >> application - David Doud grower Indiana - >> >> >> ___ >> apple-crop mailing list >> apple-crop@virtualorchard.net >> http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop >> > ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] MAIA newsletter
After a four year hiatus, the Midwest Apple Improvement Association has published a newsletter - electronic version is available here: http://midwestapple.com/_PDF/_Newsletters/2015newsletter.pdf Check out the colored box on page three and consider whether your operation/organization should be involved. Previous newsletters and other information is available here: http://midwestapple.com/index.php MAIA membership is open - If there are questions, I'd be happy to try to answer them. David Doud grower - IN ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] CA storage incident - UK
The manager of a fruit-packing operation has been found guilty of the manslaughter of two workers he asked to select apples from a low-oxygen storage unit without using breathing apparatus... http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/jun/19/manager-guilty-manslaughter-apple-storage David Doud - IN 9" of rain in the last 5 days - ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] Keepsake
I need a box of Keepsake apples - a large USPS flat rate box would be fine - I'll pay $$ or trade someone a box of assorted MAIA advanced selections - Unrelated, but here's your picture of the week, taken at a Korean food market - http://imgur.com/89YPWul David Doud - grower IN finished the first picking of Honeycrisp on Friday - I am struck anew by how obsolete the standard varieties have become - ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] Red-fleshed apple promotion...
...in the Guardian - http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2015/oct/04/gardens-truth-about-apples-james-wong#comments Published in the UK, a pretty fluffy piece, but makes negative health claims about common apples - do check out the comments which, by US standards, are generally thoughtful and one makes the point that the study's results don't support the writer's contention - others articulate common misconceptions we deal with regularly - David Doud - grower, Indiana real nice here as we head into the home stretch of harvest - ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] MAIA newsletter
An autumn 2015 edition of the Midwest Apple Improvement Association newsletter has been published and is available online at http://midwestapple.com/_PDF/_Newsletters/MAIA_Autumn2015Newsletter.pdf <http://midwestapple.com/_PDF/_Newsletters/MAIA_Autumn2015Newsletter.pdf> 6000 consumer evaluations were carried out this past fall with standard varieties and MAIA elite selections - direct marketers should find the report interesting reading - David Doud - grower, IN I cannot remember a year with warmer late fall/early winter weather ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] MAIA newsletter
Evan, we’ve had our doubters over the years and maybe some of them were “experts” (more than 50 miles from home?) - I do want the record to be clear that the professionals: other breeders, extension personal, university horticultural staff, and the like have to a person been helpful and encouraging - if they had their doubts they communicated them in a positive manner to help the process along - nanos gigantum humerus insidentes - we stand on the shoulders of giants - I hope you have great success with your EverCrisp planting David > On Dec 17, 2015, at 10:05 AM, Evan B. Milburn wrote: > > I remember when you guys started the "experts" laughed and said it couldn't > be done. How wrong!! Our first thousand are going in 2016 after our few trees > in our test block told us to get on the ball! This apple can withstand the > Maryland heat and humidity certainly much better than HC. > > Looking for more, plus will test anything else being developed. Mo is right > on about the first newsletter. what a great job! > >Evan Milburn > wwwmilburnorchards.com > > > On Thursday, December 17, 2015 7:32 AM, maurice tougas > wrote: > > > Fabulous inaugural issue David! I look forward to the opportunity to work > with you guys in the future. > > Mo Tougas > Tougas Family Farm,LLC > Northborough,MA 01532 > > On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 11:16 PM, David Doud <mailto:david_d...@me.com>> wrote: > An autumn 2015 edition of the Midwest Apple Improvement Association > newsletter has been published and is available online at > http://midwestapple.com/_PDF/_Newsletters/MAIA_Autumn2015Newsletter.pdf > <http://midwestapple.com/_PDF/_Newsletters/MAIA_Autumn2015Newsletter.pdf> > > 6000 consumer evaluations were carried out this past fall with standard > varieties and MAIA elite selections - direct marketers should find the report > interesting reading - > > David Doud - grower, IN > I cannot remember a year with warmer late fall/early winter weather > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net <mailto:apple-crop@virtualorchard.net> > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > <http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop> > > > > > -- > Maurice Tougas > Tougas Family Farm > Northborough,MA 01532 > 508-450-0844 > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net <mailto:apple-crop@virtualorchard.net> > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > <http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop> > > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] Midwest Apple Improvement
"A historic joint venture agreement has been signed by the Midwest Apple Improvement Association (MAIA) and the International Pome Fruit Alliance (IPA) for the development of the apple variety MAIA1 under the trademark EverCrisp…” Find the rest of the announcement in the attachment - DRAFT v2 media release JV IPA MAIA.docx Description: MS-Word 2007 document David Doud - grower, Indiana - hope to see many of you at IFTA next week - ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] Special apple deliver -
for your entertainment - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=klPJZ_hR0hI&feature=youtu.be David Doud, Indiana - still pruning... ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Liquid Lime Sulfur?
LLS was out of favor here before I started spraying, but I do have some references and dad used to talk about it - from 1944 ‘Spray Chemicals’ - “The disadvantages are that liquid lime-sulfur is very disagreeable to use owing to its causticity. Also this causticity is blamed for subsequent foliage dwarfing, injury, loss of foliage, reduction in rate of photosynthesis, and fruit russeting of apples…Young tender tissue contains abundant oxygen, and these polysulfides immediately satisfy themselves by taking the oxygen supply from the leaf tissue. As a result, normal leaf functions are temporarily disrupted and desiccation of marginal cells, or "burning” takes place. The leaves take on a “crinkled” appearance and rarely develop normally. This reaction also offers an explanation for sulfur russeting during the pre-pink, pink, and petal fall stage of fruit formation…” there is varietal variation in regard to susceptibility to LLS injury - In your situation, I would be very conservative using LLS until the foliage has a chance to dry and harden - at least one good sunny day of well above freezing temps and no more freezing temperatures forecast - but whadda I know? I’m in about the same situation as you - sitting here at 1/2” green, a couple of long wetting periods and 3”+ of rain at mostly cold temps but enough 50*+ hours to cause concern - two nights, one 24*, one 23* earlier this week and two more forecast for saturday morning and sunday morning - the orchard is soaked and soggy and there is still pruning brush in the way some places - not to mention high winds for the last 4 days - and 30mph gusts today - I’m not going to worry too much - after we get out of this weather pattern and I can get thru the plantings I’ll get a protectant on and scout carefully after symptoms have time to develop - I’ve conserved chemicals like Syllit, Topsin-M, Rally, and the like and feel like if I need to I can knock out an infection if one develops - Dad used to talk about the year they got scab started at green tip and the frustrating season long fight afterwards - it was before I was born and I don’t recall specifically which year he mentioned, but it was a big deal - I think we have some better options today to deal with that situation - at least I hope so - Good luck - David > On Apr 7, 2016, at 12:56 PM, David Kollas wrote: > > > Does anyone have enough experience with liquid lime sulfur to comment > on it as an emergency > choice for application before rains have stopped during the current long > infection period? It is listed as > having 72-96 hours back-action in the New England Tree Fruits Management > Guide. > In my particular situation, Half-Inch Green stage tissues were exposed > many hours during two of > the previous three nights to 18-20 degrees F, and are probably extra > sensitive to captan penetration > and phytotoxicity. > > David Kollas > Kollas Orchard > Connecticut > > ___ > apple-crop mailing list > apple-crop@virtualorchard.net > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
[apple-crop] tree thefts
Via twitter and Christina Herrick at AFG (twitter handle = @HerrickAFG)- http://www.growingproduce.com/fruits/apples-pears/apple-growers-rocked-with-new-planting-thefts/ “Growers deal with all sorts of challenges throughout the growing season – but a few Ohio growers are facing a new challenge, one that was unexpected. A group of temporary laborers performing spring pruning at several Ohio orchards are believed to have stolen more than 200 newly-planted trees…" Used to be a stick or two, now it’s whole trees… If anyone is interested, EverCrisp(tm) does do twitter at @EverCrispApple - David Doud grower, Indiana - 2 good pollination days followed by 2.5 weeks of cold wet weather that continues - ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
