[backstage] BBC TWO Programme timings
A small question. There are a number of occasions where the schedule on channels is NEVER as published! A good example the 10pm-10:30pm slot on BBC TWO. Programmes in this slot actually start never earlier than 10:02pm and usually end at 10:32pm, with Newsnight starting at 10:33pm. The schedule is shown in the newspapers, on the BBC site, and (most importantly) fed to EPG (ie, Sky's and the one used by Windows Media Center) always says 10pm-10:30pm for whatever programme is on. Obviously the late start is because people often watch the news headlines on BBC ONE and then turn over to 'TWO for some entertainment, thus the delayed start. Also, the junction between the end of the regional news on BBC ONE matches the start of Newsnight, which also makes sense. I can understand for humans using the EPG, 10pm-10:30pm is good enough, but if you PVR anything (Sky+, Freeview Playback, WMC) in this slot you get an overrun from the previous programme and miss the end. Can something be done with the source data to fix this?
Re: [backstage] RTMP stream URL resolving script
I can't find formal standards for RTMP and FLV, did I miss them somewhere? Tried RFC/IETF and ISO, neither have anything. We have covered this before (multiple times I think). RTMP is a proprietary protocol. It was reverse-engineered in late 2006 (I think). Adobe have not released a specification. FLV can be either a proprietary format (which has been documented, more info: http://www.adobe.com/licensing/developer/fileformat/faq/) or a wrapper around H.264+HE-AAC. Also would it be possible to get the stream in a sensible format? If you ever want iPlayer on a mobile use a viable format. For reference Android (Google's Mobile Platform) supports MPEG4 and H.264. How about a stream in one of those formats? Again, I think it's been mentioned before about suitable streaming servers. Can you suggest one? Phil - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
RE: [backstage] RTMP stream URL resolving script
As it happens I've come across an open source flash streaming server called Red5 - just starting to have a look at it, but it seems quite good. Anyone have any more experience with this? Stephen Stewart -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Phil Wilson Sent: 22 January 2008 15:41 To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk Subject: Re: [backstage] RTMP stream URL resolving script Again, I think it's been mentioned before about suitable streaming servers. Can you suggest one? Phil - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] RTMP stream URL resolving script
On 22/01/2008, Phil Wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Also would it be possible to get the stream in a sensible format? If you ever want iPlayer on a mobile use a viable format. For reference Android (Google's Mobile Platform) supports MPEG4 and H.264. How about a stream in one of those formats? Again, I think it's been mentioned before about suitable streaming servers. Can you suggest one? Because Gnash's Cygnal supports all codecs, even ones not in the Adobe server, it can support codecs that are more suited to mobile devices, where power consumption reduction is a priority, that are less processor intensive. -- Regards, Dave - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] RTMP stream URL resolving script
On 22/01/2008, Stephen Stewart-CARDIFF [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As it happens I've come across an open source flash streaming server called Red5 - just starting to have a look at it, but it seems quite good. Did you also look at Cygnal, the Gnash server part? :-) http://packages.debian.org/sid/gnash-cygnal -- Regards, Dave - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
RE: [backstage] RTMP stream URL resolving script
Oh and I think Mr Forrester may have been a tad dishonest (possibly unintentionally) when claiming RTMP and FLV where just like PDF and that anyone can create readers for them. PDF is an ISO standard! I can't find formal standards for RTMP and FLV, did I miss them somewhere? Tried RFC/IETF and ISO, neither have anything. I meant before PDF become a ISO standard, and I didn't mean to compare them as standards but rather proprietary standards which got turned into standards. Of course it was all unintentional :( Sorry for the upset this might have caused :( Ian Forrester This e-mail is: [x] private; [] ask first; [] bloggable Senior Producer, BBC Backstage BC5 C3, Media Village, 201 Wood Lane, London W12 7TP email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] work: +44 (0)2080083965 mob: +44 (0)7711913293 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andy Sent: 22 January 2008 14:02 To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk Subject: Re: [backstage] RTMP stream URL resolving script On 21/01/2008, Iain Wallace [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Back to RTMP. I was looking at the documentation and some of the code for RTMP with a view to maybe porting it into this script. It's really quite nasty! If only there was a nice simple document. Unfortunately it all appears to be reverse engineered. And thus there are parts that are clear guess work (or just plain not defined. Like the randomish data used near the beginning of the handshake). At the risk of going wildly of topic. Is there anywhere that describes all this business with remote procedure calls? Does this mean an RTMP client needs to have a full interpreter for some programming language and isn't allowing unauthenticated remote entities to make function calls on your system a bad idea. I can think of lots of unfriendly function calls one would not want people to make. Any extensions to this script from me are likely going to be calls to apps importing the rtmp.c written for Gnash. PHP calls to a C library? (Sorry been a very long time since I did PHP, many years, ah the good old days ) I was trying to write a little something in Java to basically determine what programs where available, what versions where available and some details about them. Ran into one massive problem. Well 2, one I have more important commitments that come first, and 2: How does one obtain a list of whats on iPlayer without spidering the entire A to Z each time? Is there something one can put in the filter URL parameter that says only programs added since X? Or a way of listing more than 6 entries at a time? Oh and I think Mr Forrester may have been a tad dishonest (possibly unintentionally) when claiming RTMP and FLV where just like PDF and that anyone can create readers for them. PDF is an ISO standard! I can't find formal standards for RTMP and FLV, did I miss them somewhere? Tried RFC/IETF and ISO, neither have anything. Also would it be possible to get the stream in a sensible format? If you ever want iPlayer on a mobile use a viable format. For reference Android (Google's Mobile Platform) supports MPEG4 and H.264. How about a stream in one of those formats? The biggest problem with getting iPlayer on exotic devices is the BBC lack of public documentation and no simple way of finding out things that should be documented fully somewhere. As an example here is some questions I had after only a few hours work on some Java code: The versions listed on the HTML page have a date. What timezone is this meant to be in? Am I correct in thinking the month is 0 indexed? And that the order is: Year, Month, Day_Of_Month, Hour, Minutes, Seconds With Hour being expressed using the 24 hour clock? And how precisely is Midnight represented? And which elements are optional in the XML files? Which elements can be repeated? What are the different values of the id field in the element error returned when a stream is invalid? What do these values mean and when do they occur? What are the acceptable characters in the PID? What are the acceptable characters in the Token field? How precisely does the filter argument in the URL for the iPlayer A to Z actually work? It appears to be some kind of query language, what are the names of fields and operators? Some of those would have been answered by the XML Schemes. So if you really are interested in exotic platforms, then maybe telling people what they need to know would help! Andy -- Computers are like air conditioners. Both stop working, if you open windows. -- Adam Heath - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive:
RE: [backstage] RTMP stream URL resolving script
Andy, Any chance you could stop with the accusations of dishonesty? I think Ian's general demeanour and hard work for backstage deserve a little more respect than being accused of being (even unintentionally) dishonest without good reason. I don't get the impression that you mean to be quite so combative and aggressive, but it kind of sours the atmosphere around here. How about assuming a misunderstanding the next time and only accusing people of lying if there is good reason to believe they are trying to mislead you? d. Deirdre Harvey :: Web Producer :: BBC Newsline :: Newsroom :: BBC Broadcasting House :: Ormeau Avenue :: Belfast BT2 8HQ :: ph. 02890 338264 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ian Forrester Sent: 22 January 2008 18:34 To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk Subject: RE: [backstage] RTMP stream URL resolving script Oh and I think Mr Forrester may have been a tad dishonest (possibly unintentionally) when claiming RTMP and FLV where just like PDF and that anyone can create readers for them. PDF is an ISO standard! I can't find formal standards for RTMP and FLV, did I miss them somewhere? Tried RFC/IETF and ISO, neither have anything. I meant before PDF become a ISO standard, and I didn't mean to compare them as standards but rather proprietary standards which got turned into standards. Of course it was all unintentional :( Sorry for the upset this might have caused :( Ian Forrester This e-mail is: [x] private; [] ask first; [] bloggable Senior Producer, BBC Backstage BC5 C3, Media Village, 201 Wood Lane, London W12 7TP email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] work: +44 (0)2080083965 mob: +44 (0)7711913293 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andy Sent: 22 January 2008 14:02 To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk Subject: Re: [backstage] RTMP stream URL resolving script On 21/01/2008, Iain Wallace [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Back to RTMP. I was looking at the documentation and some of the code for RTMP with a view to maybe porting it into this script. It's really quite nasty! If only there was a nice simple document. Unfortunately it all appears to be reverse engineered. And thus there are parts that are clear guess work (or just plain not defined. Like the randomish data used near the beginning of the handshake). At the risk of going wildly of topic. Is there anywhere that describes all this business with remote procedure calls? Does this mean an RTMP client needs to have a full interpreter for some programming language and isn't allowing unauthenticated remote entities to make function calls on your system a bad idea. I can think of lots of unfriendly function calls one would not want people to make. Any extensions to this script from me are likely going to be calls to apps importing the rtmp.c written for Gnash. PHP calls to a C library? (Sorry been a very long time since I did PHP, many years, ah the good old days ) I was trying to write a little something in Java to basically determine what programs where available, what versions where available and some details about them. Ran into one massive problem. Well 2, one I have more important commitments that come first, and 2: How does one obtain a list of whats on iPlayer without spidering the entire A to Z each time? Is there something one can put in the filter URL parameter that says only programs added since X? Or a way of listing more than 6 entries at a time? Oh and I think Mr Forrester may have been a tad dishonest (possibly unintentionally) when claiming RTMP and FLV where just like PDF and that anyone can create readers for them. PDF is an ISO standard! I can't find formal standards for RTMP and FLV, did I miss them somewhere? Tried RFC/IETF and ISO, neither have anything. Also would it be possible to get the stream in a sensible format? If you ever want iPlayer on a mobile use a viable format. For reference Android (Google's Mobile Platform) supports MPEG4 and H.264. How about a stream in one of those formats? The biggest problem with getting iPlayer on exotic devices is the BBC lack of public documentation and no simple way of finding out things that should be documented fully somewhere. As an example here is some questions I had after only a few hours work on some Java code: The versions listed on the HTML page have a date. What timezone is this meant to be in? Am I correct in thinking the month is 0 indexed? And that the order is: Year, Month, Day_Of_Month, Hour, Minutes, Seconds With Hour being expressed using the 24 hour clock? And how precisely is Midnight represented? And which elements are optional in the XML files? Which elements can be repeated? What are the different values of the id field in the element error returned when a stream is invalid? What do these values
Re: [backstage] Transcript for Backstage Accessibility podcast
http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/news/archives/2007/12/podcast_accessi.html http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/news/archives/2007/12/podcast_accessi_1.html Ian, congratulations, and my aplogies, if I became overbearing or worse... best wishes Jonathan Chetwynd Accessibility Consultant on Media Literacy and the Internet On 21 Jan 2008, at 17:58, Ian Forrester wrote: Hi All, I've finally got the transcript for the backstage podcast. Its currently lives here - http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/news/archives/ 2007/12/podcast_accessi_1.html I have also added the previous podcast to the main feed, so you should automatically get the podcast, if your subscribed to this feed - http://bbcbackstage.blip.tv/rss Enjoy and I'm sorry it took so long... Ian Forrester This e-mail is: [x] private; [] ask first; [] bloggable Senior Producer, BBC Backstage BC5 C3, Media Village, 201 Wood Lane, London W12 7TP email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] work: +44 (0)2080083965 mob: +44 (0)7711913293 - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/ mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail- archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] Transcript for Backstage Accessibility podcast
As I've said previously, transcribing is a long, tedious and generally thankless task, yet is so well worth it -- often years down the road, when you can easily find what was said with just a remembered keyword or phrase. It's true that one would always like to have expressed oneself better, but in my experience that's the case for absolutely everyone, so if anything it encourages one to think before speaking :-) So thanks Ian, it's a great contribution. Sean On Jan 22, 2008 10:34 PM, ~:'' ありがとうございました。 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/news/archives/2007/12/podcast_accessi.html http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/news/archives/2007/12/podcast_accessi_1.html Ian, congratulations, and my aplogies, if I became overbearing or worse... best wishes Jonathan Chetwynd Accessibility Consultant on Media Literacy and the Internet On 21 Jan 2008, at 17:58, Ian Forrester wrote: Hi All, I've finally got the transcript for the backstage podcast. Its currently lives here - http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/news/archives/ 2007/12/podcast_accessi_1.html I have also added the previous podcast to the main feed, so you should automatically get the podcast, if your subscribed to this feed - http://bbcbackstage.blip.tv/rss Enjoy and I'm sorry it took so long... Ian Forrester This e-mail is: [x] private; [] ask first; [] bloggable Senior Producer, BBC Backstage BC5 C3, Media Village, 201 Wood Lane, London W12 7TP email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] work: +44 (0)2080083965 mob: +44 (0)7711913293 - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/ mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail- archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
