RE: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
On 21 October 2008 21:15, Gareth Davis wrote: > > As it happens we will have completed migrating our radio and > on-demand playout to an external CDN when the schedules > change at the end of BST, so this solves the infrastructure > problem. Once we have the minor detail of launching Persian > TV out of the way, we will be looking at making additional > formats and bitrates available - but in a way that does not > affect those that still need the narrowband Real/Windows offerings. > Just in case you were wondering about this, we have now started rolling out AAC+ across our on-demand offerings, the first bulletin to be changed over is on the BBC Brasil site that was relaunched yesterday: http://www.bbc.co.uk/portuguese/multimedia/2009/01/090128_radio_boletins deradio.shtml Over the coming months we will make all our on-demand, live streams and embedded clips available in AAC+ in addition to Real and Windows media. -- Gareth Davis | Production Systems Specialist World Service Future Media, Digital Delivery Team - Part of BBC Global News Division * http://www.bbcworldservice.com/ * 702NE Bush House, Strand, London, WC2B 4PH - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
RE: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
From: owner-backst...@lists.bbc.co.uk [mailto:owner-backst...@lists.bbc.co.uk] On Behalf Of Christopher Woods Sent: 10 December 2008 18:21 To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk Subject: RE: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc? Nice to see this... http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2008/dec/10/digital-radio-radio As long as they don't get rid of birdsong... There might be a small revolt if that happened Isn't that just a long running ad for Twitter? ;-) That's a chirp joke. Geez! :)
RE: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
Nice to see this... http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2008/dec/10/digital-radio-radio As long as they don't get rid of birdsong... There might be a small revolt if that happened Isn't that just a long running ad for Twitter? ;-) That's a chirp joke.
Re: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
2008/12/10 Christopher Woods <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Nice to see this... > http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2008/dec/10/digital-radio-radio > > > As long as they don't get rid of birdsong... There might be a small revolt > if that happened > Isn't that just a long running ad for Twitter? ;-) > -- Brian Butterworth follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/briantist web: http://www.ukfree.tv - independent digital television and switchover advice, since 2002
RE: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
Nice to see this... http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2008/dec/10/digital-radio-radio As long as they don't get rid of birdsong... There might be a small revolt if that happened
Re: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
Nice to see this... http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2008/dec/10/digital-radio-radio 2008/10/21 Brian Butterworth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 2008/10/21 Ant Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >> Having said that, and my earlier point about low bit rates actually >> being better for reaching the audiences they're tyring to get to, the >> higher bit rates do exist. If anyone in backstage would like to >> suggest something we could do with better quality streams at low cost >> (i.e. none!) then fire away! > > > > The UK audience's bitrate doesn't need to be the same as for other areas, > and there are lots of different services worldwide... > > *BUT* my DAB rescue plan: > > - BBC given 'national commercial multiplex 2' on five-year loan > - BBC doubles up all it's DAB TX sites to do this mux > - BBC emits DAB+ version of all services -> boost audio quality for all > services > - Restricted national commercial bandwidth drives up DAB slot values > - BBC promotes upgrade to DAB+ for all existing users! > - After five years, BBC moves it's national mux to DAB+, returns com mux 2. > - Com Mux 2 for new DAB+ services > - Then Com Mux 1 moves to DAB+ > > Then the BBC can promote the "true CD quality DAB+ get it now" service, > people have five years to upgrade all their DAB sets. > > >> >> >> a >> >> On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 10:39 AM, Brian Butterworth >> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> > 2008/10/21 Christopher Woods <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> >> >> >> This one's a late night, in-the-kitchen thought. I turned the radio on >> >> while >> >> I was making a cup of tea and of course, after R4 closedown the WS is >> >> simulcast. On FM, you get a wonderful, crisp stereo feed. On DAB, the >> WS >> >> feed is fine when listening to the Radio 4 simulcast, 128kbps stereo, >> but >> >> its own dedicated slot is naff: a 64kbps mono stream. On the web, it's >> >> even >> >> worse - only streamed at 32kbps WMA/RA. AsianNetwork is 64kbps mono on >> DAB >> >> - >> >> even 5Live has a better bitrate (80kbps mono). >> > >> > It is probably worth pointing out that the World Service, unlike all >> other >> > BBC services is paid for out of direct taxation. Thus the service has >> an >> > even more limited budget than License Fee services, it is down to the >> FCO >> > >> http://www.fco.gov.uk/en/about-the-fco/what-we-do/funding-programmes/public-diplomacy/world-service >> > >> >> >> >> While I'm not a big Asian Network listener, I do live in Brum so take a >> >> bit >> >> of an interest in Asian community goings on. However, I'd quite like to >> >> listen to the WS during the daytime, either via the web or via DAB - >> how >> >> come the bitrates haven't been upped for these stations on the web >> >> streams? >> >> They're dragging behind the other BBC radio stations' online streams. >> Are >> >> there any plans to ever up the bandwidth of these neglected stations, >> >> either >> >> on DAB, on the web or both? I'm under the impression that the maximum >> >> bitrate for the multiplex is 1184kbps useable. According to >> >> DigitalRadioTech >> >> [1], the pre2002 bitrates were significantly higher (which I remember), >> >> and >> >> I can understand the reasons for lowering the bitrates to fit in the >> newer >> >> channels. The web's a different matter entirely though. What's stopping >> >> the >> >> Beeb from upping the bitrates for all the online streams to the same >> >> bitrate? >> >> >> >> (and will the bitrates ever go above 128kbps? I'd love a 192kbps or >> >> 256kbps >> >> stream, particularly for... Well, all of the radio stations!) >> >> >> >> >> >> And also, as a final question - how come the iPlayer pages for *all* of >> >> the >> >> radio stations are currently reporting each one as being currently >> >> off-air? >> >> Have the boxes doing the encoding and streaming been taken offline for >> >> work >> >> overnight or something? If someone aboard the HMS Sceptre is browsing >> the >> >> Radio 4 iPlayer site and sees that it's currently offair, they might >> think >> >> Britain is under attack and launch some Tridents at the Soviets. >> Wouldn't >> >> *that* be an interesting one for Gordon Brown to try and explain! >> >> >> >> - >> >> Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, >> please >> >> visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. >> >> Unofficial list archive: >> >> http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > >> > Brian Butterworth >> > >> > http://www.ukfree.tv - independent digital television and switchover >> advice, >> > since 2002 >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> Ant Miller >> >> tel: 07709 265961 >> email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> - >> Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, >> please visit >> http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. >> Unofficial list archive: >> http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ >> > > > > -- > > Brian Butterworth > > follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/b
RE: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
Steve Jolly wrote: > > Brian Butterworth wrote: > > You could, perhaps, make high bitrate versions available to > platform > > providers, with a limited number of feeds for the likes of > LiveStation > > and Zattoo and the like. > > Intuitively, that strikes me as opening up *different* cans > of worms... > Other cans of worms are available as they say. This isn't as daft as it sounds. I thought one of the World Service radio stations was already on Livestation? Maybe I'm thinking of a different platform, or maybe it was for a limited period. Either way, we have a weekly reach of over 180 million listeners, when you add in the audience from the BBC World News channel it gives the Global News Division a weekly reach of well over a quarter of a billion people across all platforms. You don't get a reach like that by accident. We have a team of people who's job it is to do the necessary deals to extend our reach as far and wide as possible - whether just making the five minute bulletin available on a partner station or making an entire network available on an FM relay or emerging platform. Don't worry Brian, deals are being done all the time. But I'm sure you can understand that these products are not for public discussion here pre launch. -- Gareth Davis | Production Systems Specialist World Service Future Media, Digital Delivery Team Part of BBC Global News Division * http://www.bbcworldservice.com/ * 702NE Bush House, Strand, London, WC2B 4PH - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
2008/10/21 Steve Jolly <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Brian Butterworth wrote: > >> You could, perhaps, make high bitrate versions available to platform >> providers, with a limited number of feeds for the likes of LiveStation and >> Zattoo and the like. >> > > Intuitively, that strikes me as opening up *different* cans of worms... One worth opening, as: - the UK taxpayer pays for the service; - the purpose is to get as many people outside the UK listing to it. The more that do, the better the value for the UK taxpayer; - the BBC holds worldwide rights to the broadcast, that's why it is called what it is - it is actually very good! Would also be quite a good thing in terms of promotion, and if all and any IPTV or similar service wants to carry the programmes, any that come out on top will have been providing it from the outset. Free the World . Service. > > S > - > Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please > visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. > Unofficial list archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ > -- Brian Butterworth follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/briantist web: http://www.ukfree.tv - independent digital television and switchover advice, since 2002
Re: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
Brian Butterworth wrote: You could, perhaps, make high bitrate versions available to platform providers, with a limited number of feeds for the likes of LiveStation and Zattoo and the like. Intuitively, that strikes me as opening up *different* cans of worms... S - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
2008/10/21 Gareth Davis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Christopher Woods wrote: > > However, as the infrastructure is already there for UK > > streaming, with minimal extra expenditure required to provide > > this simulcast higher bitrate service, and with every UK > > taxpayer funding the WS in some small form, how come the > > Powers That Be have defined it as something not appropriate > > for the WS to rollout? > > > > The inappropriate argument may have held water four or five > > years ago, but is increasingly irrelevant these days. > > There are actually 2 problems here: > > The first is stupidly complicated, and I'm not sure I understand it all > fully. But it boils down to the fact that we cannot spend grant in aid > funds on a service targeted exclusively at the UK. A high bitrate stream > using the existing BBC infrastructure GeoIP locked to the UK would be > the wrong side of the rules, as we would have to pay BBC > Technology/Siemens grant in aid money to provide the UK exclusive > service. Even if the funding rules were not in place, I imagine there > would be objections on editorial grounds to restricting access to our > services. > > The second reason, is that the BBC Streaming Infrastructure was never > really designed for delivering high bitrate streams outside the UK if we > were to make them universally available. You could, perhaps, make high bitrate versions available to platform providers, with a limited number of feeds for the likes of LiveStation and Zattoo and the like. That would get them the BBC World Service in high quality and you would get your radio station distributed for free. If you make the feeds we could have a backstage competition to see who can get the highest listener to feed ratio? > The last few servers the BBC > had in New York were shut down a while back, so there are now no BBC > servers outside the UK. So to launch a global high bitrate service could > potentially have quality of service issues. This is actually the real > hurdle to increasing the bitrates, rather than anything else. > > As it happens we will have completed migrating our radio and on-demand > playout to an external CDN when the schedules change at the end of BST, > so this solves the infrastructure problem. Once we have the minor detail > of launching Persian TV out of the way, we will be looking at making > additional formats and bitrates available - but in a way that does not > affect those that still need the narrowband Real/Windows offerings. > > -- > Gareth Davis | Production Systems Specialist > World Service Future Media, Digital Delivery Team - Part of BBC Global > News Division > * http://www.bbcworldservice.com/ * 702NE Bush House, Strand, London, > WC2B 4PH > > - > Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please > visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. > Unofficial list archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ > -- Brian Butterworth follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/briantist web: http://www.ukfree.tv - independent digital television and switchover advice, since 2002
RE: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
Christopher Woods wrote: > However, as the infrastructure is already there for UK > streaming, with minimal extra expenditure required to provide > this simulcast higher bitrate service, and with every UK > taxpayer funding the WS in some small form, how come the > Powers That Be have defined it as something not appropriate > for the WS to rollout? > > The inappropriate argument may have held water four or five > years ago, but is increasingly irrelevant these days. There are actually 2 problems here: The first is stupidly complicated, and I'm not sure I understand it all fully. But it boils down to the fact that we cannot spend grant in aid funds on a service targeted exclusively at the UK. A high bitrate stream using the existing BBC infrastructure GeoIP locked to the UK would be the wrong side of the rules, as we would have to pay BBC Technology/Siemens grant in aid money to provide the UK exclusive service. Even if the funding rules were not in place, I imagine there would be objections on editorial grounds to restricting access to our services. The second reason, is that the BBC Streaming Infrastructure was never really designed for delivering high bitrate streams outside the UK if we were to make them universally available. The last few servers the BBC had in New York were shut down a while back, so there are now no BBC servers outside the UK. So to launch a global high bitrate service could potentially have quality of service issues. This is actually the real hurdle to increasing the bitrates, rather than anything else. As it happens we will have completed migrating our radio and on-demand playout to an external CDN when the schedules change at the end of BST, so this solves the infrastructure problem. Once we have the minor detail of launching Persian TV out of the way, we will be looking at making additional formats and bitrates available - but in a way that does not affect those that still need the narrowband Real/Windows offerings. -- Gareth Davis | Production Systems Specialist World Service Future Media, Digital Delivery Team - Part of BBC Global News Division * http://www.bbcworldservice.com/ * 702NE Bush House, Strand, London, WC2B 4PH - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
2008/10/21 Ant Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Having said that, and my earlier point about low bit rates actually > being better for reaching the audiences they're tyring to get to, the > higher bit rates do exist. If anyone in backstage would like to > suggest something we could do with better quality streams at low cost > (i.e. none!) then fire away! The UK audience's bitrate doesn't need to be the same as for other areas, and there are lots of different services worldwide... *BUT* my DAB rescue plan: - BBC given 'national commercial multiplex 2' on five-year loan - BBC doubles up all it's DAB TX sites to do this mux - BBC emits DAB+ version of all services -> boost audio quality for all services - Restricted national commercial bandwidth drives up DAB slot values - BBC promotes upgrade to DAB+ for all existing users! - After five years, BBC moves it's national mux to DAB+, returns com mux 2. - Com Mux 2 for new DAB+ services - Then Com Mux 1 moves to DAB+ Then the BBC can promote the "true CD quality DAB+ get it now" service, people have five years to upgrade all their DAB sets. > > > a > > On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 10:39 AM, Brian Butterworth > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > 2008/10/21 Christopher Woods <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >> > >> This one's a late night, in-the-kitchen thought. I turned the radio on > >> while > >> I was making a cup of tea and of course, after R4 closedown the WS is > >> simulcast. On FM, you get a wonderful, crisp stereo feed. On DAB, the WS > >> feed is fine when listening to the Radio 4 simulcast, 128kbps stereo, > but > >> its own dedicated slot is naff: a 64kbps mono stream. On the web, it's > >> even > >> worse - only streamed at 32kbps WMA/RA. AsianNetwork is 64kbps mono on > DAB > >> - > >> even 5Live has a better bitrate (80kbps mono). > > > > It is probably worth pointing out that the World Service, unlike all > other > > BBC services is paid for out of direct taxation. Thus the service has > an > > even more limited budget than License Fee services, it is down to the FCO > > > http://www.fco.gov.uk/en/about-the-fco/what-we-do/funding-programmes/public-diplomacy/world-service > > > >> > >> While I'm not a big Asian Network listener, I do live in Brum so take a > >> bit > >> of an interest in Asian community goings on. However, I'd quite like to > >> listen to the WS during the daytime, either via the web or via DAB - how > >> come the bitrates haven't been upped for these stations on the web > >> streams? > >> They're dragging behind the other BBC radio stations' online streams. > Are > >> there any plans to ever up the bandwidth of these neglected stations, > >> either > >> on DAB, on the web or both? I'm under the impression that the maximum > >> bitrate for the multiplex is 1184kbps useable. According to > >> DigitalRadioTech > >> [1], the pre2002 bitrates were significantly higher (which I remember), > >> and > >> I can understand the reasons for lowering the bitrates to fit in the > newer > >> channels. The web's a different matter entirely though. What's stopping > >> the > >> Beeb from upping the bitrates for all the online streams to the same > >> bitrate? > >> > >> (and will the bitrates ever go above 128kbps? I'd love a 192kbps or > >> 256kbps > >> stream, particularly for... Well, all of the radio stations!) > >> > >> > >> And also, as a final question - how come the iPlayer pages for *all* of > >> the > >> radio stations are currently reporting each one as being currently > >> off-air? > >> Have the boxes doing the encoding and streaming been taken offline for > >> work > >> overnight or something? If someone aboard the HMS Sceptre is browsing > the > >> Radio 4 iPlayer site and sees that it's currently offair, they might > think > >> Britain is under attack and launch some Tridents at the Soviets. > Wouldn't > >> *that* be an interesting one for Gordon Brown to try and explain! > >> > >> - > >> Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, > please > >> visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. > >> Unofficial list archive: > >> http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Brian Butterworth > > > > http://www.ukfree.tv - independent digital television and switchover > advice, > > since 2002 > > > > > > -- > Ant Miller > > tel: 07709 265961 > email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > - > Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please > visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. > Unofficial list archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ > -- Brian Butterworth follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/briantist web: http://www.ukfree.tv - independent digital television and switchover advice, since 2002
RE: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
> The web streams are something we are currently looking at, > there are a lot of things happening behind the scenes at the > moment. But you can expect some higher bitrates and new > formats in the coming months. As others have said, we are > funded differently to the rest of BBC Radio and have to offer > our service in a way that offers benefits to all our > audience, wherever they may be in the world. So the model of > using high bitrates restricted just to the UK (so mainly > peering traffic) is not something that is appropriate for us to do. Thanks for your reply Gareth, always appreciate a response from someone involved with the subject of discussion. However, as the infrastructure is already there for UK streaming, with minimal extra expenditure required to provide this simulcast higher bitrate service, and with every UK taxpayer funding the WS in some small form, how come the Powers That Be have defined it as something not appropriate for the WS to rollout? The inappropriate argument may have held water four or five years ago, but is increasingly irrelevant these days. (imvho of course, there are doubtless other factors weighing in on the decision but that is how I perceive it as a UK citizen from a plain ole consumer standpoint). Just seems odd more than anything else that where easy to do, the WS already has decent quality broadcast, and there's these big holes on other platforms where listening is like jumping back to the 90s and trying to squeeze every last baud out of your Hayes v.90 to stream that 32kbps station! :) - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
RE: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
Christopher Woods wrote: > This one's a late night, in-the-kitchen thought. I turned the > radio on while I was making a cup of tea and of course, after > R4 closedown the WS is simulcast. On FM, you get a wonderful, > crisp stereo feed. On DAB, the WS feed is fine when listening > to the Radio 4 simulcast, 128kbps stereo, but its own > dedicated slot is naff: a 64kbps mono stream. On the web, > it's even worse - only streamed at 32kbps WMA/RA. > AsianNetwork is 64kbps mono on DAB - even 5Live has a better > bitrate (80kbps mono). > I'm told some experiments were done a few years back on the DAB feed to point R4 and WS at the same pool for the duration of the simulcast. However it caused many models of DAB receiver around at the time to crash either when the services were merged, or separated. This resulted in lots of R4 people in BH cursing the World Service as they came into work the next morning to find their office DAB radios had locked up :) The web streams are something we are currently looking at, there are a lot of things happening behind the scenes at the moment. But you can expect some higher bitrates and new formats in the coming months. As others have said, we are funded differently to the rest of BBC Radio and have to offer our service in a way that offers benefits to all our audience, wherever they may be in the world. So the model of using high bitrates restricted just to the UK (so mainly peering traffic) is not something that is appropriate for us to do. -- Gareth Davis | Production Systems Specialist World Service Future Media, Digital Delivery Team - Part of BBC Global News Division * http://www.bbcworldservice.com/ * 702NE Bush House, Strand, London, WC2B 4PH - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
Having said that, and my earlier point about low bit rates actually being better for reaching the audiences they're tyring to get to, the higher bit rates do exist. If anyone in backstage would like to suggest something we could do with better quality streams at low cost (i.e. none!) then fire away! a On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 10:39 AM, Brian Butterworth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > 2008/10/21 Christopher Woods <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> >> This one's a late night, in-the-kitchen thought. I turned the radio on >> while >> I was making a cup of tea and of course, after R4 closedown the WS is >> simulcast. On FM, you get a wonderful, crisp stereo feed. On DAB, the WS >> feed is fine when listening to the Radio 4 simulcast, 128kbps stereo, but >> its own dedicated slot is naff: a 64kbps mono stream. On the web, it's >> even >> worse - only streamed at 32kbps WMA/RA. AsianNetwork is 64kbps mono on DAB >> - >> even 5Live has a better bitrate (80kbps mono). > > It is probably worth pointing out that the World Service, unlike all other > BBC services is paid for out of direct taxation. Thus the service has an > even more limited budget than License Fee services, it is down to the FCO > http://www.fco.gov.uk/en/about-the-fco/what-we-do/funding-programmes/public-diplomacy/world-service > >> >> While I'm not a big Asian Network listener, I do live in Brum so take a >> bit >> of an interest in Asian community goings on. However, I'd quite like to >> listen to the WS during the daytime, either via the web or via DAB - how >> come the bitrates haven't been upped for these stations on the web >> streams? >> They're dragging behind the other BBC radio stations' online streams. Are >> there any plans to ever up the bandwidth of these neglected stations, >> either >> on DAB, on the web or both? I'm under the impression that the maximum >> bitrate for the multiplex is 1184kbps useable. According to >> DigitalRadioTech >> [1], the pre2002 bitrates were significantly higher (which I remember), >> and >> I can understand the reasons for lowering the bitrates to fit in the newer >> channels. The web's a different matter entirely though. What's stopping >> the >> Beeb from upping the bitrates for all the online streams to the same >> bitrate? >> >> (and will the bitrates ever go above 128kbps? I'd love a 192kbps or >> 256kbps >> stream, particularly for... Well, all of the radio stations!) >> >> >> And also, as a final question - how come the iPlayer pages for *all* of >> the >> radio stations are currently reporting each one as being currently >> off-air? >> Have the boxes doing the encoding and streaming been taken offline for >> work >> overnight or something? If someone aboard the HMS Sceptre is browsing the >> Radio 4 iPlayer site and sees that it's currently offair, they might think >> Britain is under attack and launch some Tridents at the Soviets. Wouldn't >> *that* be an interesting one for Gordon Brown to try and explain! >> >> - >> Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please >> visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. >> Unofficial list archive: >> http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ > > > > -- > > Brian Butterworth > > http://www.ukfree.tv - independent digital television and switchover advice, > since 2002 > -- Ant Miller tel: 07709 265961 email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
2008/10/21 Christopher Woods <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > This one's a late night, in-the-kitchen thought. I turned the radio on > while > I was making a cup of tea and of course, after R4 closedown the WS is > simulcast. On FM, you get a wonderful, crisp stereo feed. On DAB, the WS > feed is fine when listening to the Radio 4 simulcast, 128kbps stereo, but > its own dedicated slot is naff: a 64kbps mono stream. On the web, it's even > worse - only streamed at 32kbps WMA/RA. AsianNetwork is 64kbps mono on DAB > - > even 5Live has a better bitrate (80kbps mono). It is probably worth pointing out that the World Service, unlike all other BBC services is paid for out of direct taxation. Thus the service has an even more limited budget than License Fee services, it is down to the FCO http://www.fco.gov.uk/en/about-the-fco/what-we-do/funding-programmes/public-diplomacy/world-service > > > While I'm not a big Asian Network listener, I do live in Brum so take a bit > of an interest in Asian community goings on. However, I'd quite like to > listen to the WS during the daytime, either via the web or via DAB - how > come the bitrates haven't been upped for these stations on the web streams? > They're dragging behind the other BBC radio stations' online streams. Are > there any plans to ever up the bandwidth of these neglected stations, > either > on DAB, on the web or both? I'm under the impression that the maximum > bitrate for the multiplex is 1184kbps useable. According to > DigitalRadioTech > [1], the pre2002 bitrates were significantly higher (which I remember), and > I can understand the reasons for lowering the bitrates to fit in the newer > channels. The web's a different matter entirely though. What's stopping the > Beeb from upping the bitrates for all the online streams to the same > bitrate? > > (and will the bitrates ever go above 128kbps? I'd love a 192kbps or 256kbps > stream, particularly for... Well, all of the radio stations!) > > > And also, as a final question - how come the iPlayer pages for *all* of the > radio stations are currently reporting each one as being currently off-air? > Have the boxes doing the encoding and streaming been taken offline for work > overnight or something? If someone aboard the HMS Sceptre is browsing the > Radio 4 iPlayer site and sees that it's currently offair, they might think > Britain is under attack and launch some Tridents at the Soviets. Wouldn't > *that* be an interesting one for Gordon Brown to try and explain! > > - > Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please > visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. > Unofficial list archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ > -- Brian Butterworth http://www.ukfree.tv - independent digital television and switchover advice, since 2002
Re: [backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
Pretty sure the bombers use AM radio to check for the ongoing existence of Broadcasting House, and Sceptre isn't a bomber (they're all V class boats). Re the WS bitrate, these are worth revisiting, but it's possible that the budget and hence the bitrate for WS is entirely seperately worked out, being as the audience and funding is seperate. Arguably a high bit rate would be counter productive for WS- the aim of the game is to reach a lot of people at the end of thin wires (or over wireless). A parallel hi bit rate service might well be a useful way to get the quality out there, but then that's a stack more cash to pay, and not really in line with the WS objectives. Personally, I feel the biggest problem for WS is figuring out which audiences to focus on- getting it wrong can be painful- the Thai service shut down three years ago, sonce when we've seen two military coups and border war flare up. Can't help wondering if anyone at Bush House is regreting handing out those redundancies. a On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 3:29 AM, Christopher Woods <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > This one's a late night, in-the-kitchen thought. I turned the radio on while > I was making a cup of tea and of course, after R4 closedown the WS is > simulcast. On FM, you get a wonderful, crisp stereo feed. On DAB, the WS > feed is fine when listening to the Radio 4 simulcast, 128kbps stereo, but > its own dedicated slot is naff: a 64kbps mono stream. On the web, it's even > worse - only streamed at 32kbps WMA/RA. AsianNetwork is 64kbps mono on DAB - > even 5Live has a better bitrate (80kbps mono). > > While I'm not a big Asian Network listener, I do live in Brum so take a bit > of an interest in Asian community goings on. However, I'd quite like to > listen to the WS during the daytime, either via the web or via DAB - how > come the bitrates haven't been upped for these stations on the web streams? > They're dragging behind the other BBC radio stations' online streams. Are > there any plans to ever up the bandwidth of these neglected stations, either > on DAB, on the web or both? I'm under the impression that the maximum > bitrate for the multiplex is 1184kbps useable. According to DigitalRadioTech > [1], the pre2002 bitrates were significantly higher (which I remember), and > I can understand the reasons for lowering the bitrates to fit in the newer > channels. The web's a different matter entirely though. What's stopping the > Beeb from upping the bitrates for all the online streams to the same > bitrate? > > (and will the bitrates ever go above 128kbps? I'd love a 192kbps or 256kbps > stream, particularly for... Well, all of the radio stations!) > > > And also, as a final question - how come the iPlayer pages for *all* of the > radio stations are currently reporting each one as being currently off-air? > Have the boxes doing the encoding and streaming been taken offline for work > overnight or something? If someone aboard the HMS Sceptre is browsing the > Radio 4 iPlayer site and sees that it's currently offair, they might think > Britain is under attack and launch some Tridents at the Soviets. Wouldn't > *that* be an interesting one for Gordon Brown to try and explain! > > - > Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please > visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. > Unofficial list archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ > -- Ant Miller tel: 07709 265961 email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
[backstage] Why the poor bitrates on World Service, Asian Network etc?
This one's a late night, in-the-kitchen thought. I turned the radio on while I was making a cup of tea and of course, after R4 closedown the WS is simulcast. On FM, you get a wonderful, crisp stereo feed. On DAB, the WS feed is fine when listening to the Radio 4 simulcast, 128kbps stereo, but its own dedicated slot is naff: a 64kbps mono stream. On the web, it's even worse - only streamed at 32kbps WMA/RA. AsianNetwork is 64kbps mono on DAB - even 5Live has a better bitrate (80kbps mono). While I'm not a big Asian Network listener, I do live in Brum so take a bit of an interest in Asian community goings on. However, I'd quite like to listen to the WS during the daytime, either via the web or via DAB - how come the bitrates haven't been upped for these stations on the web streams? They're dragging behind the other BBC radio stations' online streams. Are there any plans to ever up the bandwidth of these neglected stations, either on DAB, on the web or both? I'm under the impression that the maximum bitrate for the multiplex is 1184kbps useable. According to DigitalRadioTech [1], the pre2002 bitrates were significantly higher (which I remember), and I can understand the reasons for lowering the bitrates to fit in the newer channels. The web's a different matter entirely though. What's stopping the Beeb from upping the bitrates for all the online streams to the same bitrate? (and will the bitrates ever go above 128kbps? I'd love a 192kbps or 256kbps stream, particularly for... Well, all of the radio stations!) And also, as a final question - how come the iPlayer pages for *all* of the radio stations are currently reporting each one as being currently off-air? Have the boxes doing the encoding and streaming been taken offline for work overnight or something? If someone aboard the HMS Sceptre is browsing the Radio 4 iPlayer site and sees that it's currently offair, they might think Britain is under attack and launch some Tridents at the Soviets. Wouldn't *that* be an interesting one for Gordon Brown to try and explain! - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
