[backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
Title: backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition Dear all, I'm writing to let you know that the inaugural backstage.bbc.co.uk competition hasnt gone as well as I had hoped. In fact, at the time of sending this we havent received any entries at all. backstage.bbc.co.uk is very much about the BBC experimenting with new ways of engaging with its expert user base, and clearly this specific exercise hasnt worked. backstage.bbc.co.uk also strives to be a publicly open and transparent project, which is why I am writing to communicate this to you all. Moving forward, Ive been trying to think about why this has happened and my guess is that it comes to one of two possibilities: * The TV schedule data we provided over-complicated and in an alien format that was difficult to parse, or * The idea of developing around a BBC-led theme, even for a prize, isnt an approach that is of interest to the backstage.bbc.co.uk community. Im keen to gather whether either/both of these reasons are the case, or maybe theres something else Ive completely missed? All of your thoughts and views are very subject are very much appreciated, so Id be really grateful if you could let me know what you think either publicly on this mailing list or privately (ben.metcalfe [at] bbc.co.uk). I dont want to pre-empt your views on this, so I will get back to you with some more thoughts and action points on my part, once I am able to gauge where we stand (and thus what we need to do differently next time). Many thanks Ben Metcalfe Project Lead, backstage.bbc.co.uk
RE: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
Title: backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition Hi, Point 1 is probably most pertinent for me! I'd have preferred a simple XML list like: channel programme titleHow to start your own country/title starttime2130/starttime endtime2200/endtime length30/length /programme /channel must like bleb.org :-) Also - it's not the most enticing theme. TV schedules have been done before really. If you perhaps gave a goal - for example a project that gradually learns what TV somebody likes and suggests programmes that are on - with perhaps a view to having the project a permanent feature of the BBC web site, I'm sure there would be more interest. Personally, I didn't work on an entry because I was busy with other things! I assumed that such a wide subject like TV guides would have attracted too many people! By the way - I kind of like that suggesting programmes thingy - I might try and make it! :D David From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ben MetcalfeSent: 01 September 2005 2:39To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.ukSubject: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competitionImportance: High Dear all, I'm writing to let you know that the inaugural backstage.bbc.co.uk competition hasnt gone as well as I had hoped. In fact, at the time of sending this we havent received any entries at all. backstage.bbc.co.uk is very much about the BBC experimenting with new ways of engaging with its expert user base, and clearly this specific exercise hasnt worked. backstage.bbc.co.uk also strives to be a publicly open and transparent project, which is why I am writing to communicate this to you all. Moving forward, Ive been trying to think about why this has happened and my guess is that it comes to one of two possibilities: * The TV schedule data we provided over-complicated and in an alien format that was difficult to parse, or * The idea of developing around a BBC-led theme, even for a prize, isnt an approach that is of interest to the backstage.bbc.co.uk community. Im keen to gather whether either/both of these reasons are the case, or maybe theres something else Ive completely missed? All of your thoughts and views are very subject are very much appreciated, so Id be really grateful if you could let me know what you think either publicly on this mailing list or privately (ben.metcalfe [at] bbc.co.uk). I dont want to pre-empt your views on this, so I will get back to you with some more thoughts and action points on my part, once I am able to gauge where we stand (and thus what we need to do differently next time). Many thanks Ben Metcalfe Project Lead, backstage.bbc.co.uk --No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.17/84 - Release Date: 29/08/05 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.17/84 - Release Date: 29/08/05
Re: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
Except that with the Java API, the TV-Anytime files are fairly easy to parse... Perhaps they'll be a flood of entries next week? David Tattersall wrote: Hi, Point 1 is probably most pertinent for me! I'd have preferred a simple XML list like: channel programme titleHow to start your own country/title starttime2130/starttime endtime2200/endtime length30/length /programme /channel must like bleb.org :-) Also - it's not the most enticing theme. TV schedules have been done before really. If you perhaps gave a goal - for example a project that gradually learns what TV somebody likes and suggests programmes that are on - with perhaps a view to having the project a permanent feature of the BBC web site, I'm sure there would be more interest. Personally, I didn't work on an entry because I was busy with other things! I assumed that such a wide subject like TV guides would have attracted too many people! By the way - I kind of like that suggesting programmes thingy - I might try and make it! :D David *From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of *Ben Metcalfe *Sent:* 01 September 2005 2:39 *To:* backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk *Subject:* [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition *Importance:* High Dear all, I'm writing to let you know that the inaugural backstage.bbc.co.uk competition hasn’t gone as well as I had hoped. In fact, at the time of sending this we haven’t received any entries at all. backstage.bbc.co.uk is very much about the BBC experimenting with new ways of engaging with it’s expert user base, and clearly this specific exercise hasn’t worked. backstage.bbc.co.uk also strives to be a publicly open and transparent project, which is why I am writing to communicate this to you all. Moving forward, I’ve been trying to think about why this has happened – and my guess is that it comes to one of two possibilities: * The TV schedule data we provided over-complicated and in an alien format that was difficult to parse, or * The idea of developing around a BBC-led theme, even for a prize, isn’t an approach that is of interest to the backstage.bbc.co.uk community. I’m keen to gather whether either/both of these reasons are the case, or maybe there’s something else I’ve completely missed? All of your thoughts and views are very subject are very much appreciated, so I’d be really grateful if you could let me know what you think – either publicly on this mailing list or privately (ben.metcalfe [at] bbc.co.uk). I don’t want to pre-empt your views on this, so I will get back to you with some more thoughts and action points on my part, once I am able to gauge where we stand (and thus what we need to do differently next time). Many thanks Ben Metcalfe Project Lead, backstage.bbc.co.uk -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.17/84 - Release Date: 29/08/05 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.17/84 - Release Date: 29/08/05 - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
(Note to self: enter competition.) In my case, the problem is three-fold: * The TV schedule data we provided over-complicated and in an alien format that was difficult to parse, That's the first problem. Parsing through two files, one containing program descriptions and the other containing times, raised the amount of work required from quick PHP parser to database and complex parser. * The idea of developing around a BBC-led theme, even for a prize, isn’t an approach that is of interest to the backstage.bbc.co.uk community. I don't mind developing around a BBC theme -- it's a great plan to spur ideas -- but the trouble for me is that there aren't that many cool themes that you can do around TV listings. The final stumbling block was that I figured that loads of other people would have entered, since the prize is large, and thus it probably wasn't worth my time if I couldn't think of an absolutely killer app. However, I may do now I know there isn't that much competition. Of course, if other people also think that, then there will be competition, so it's not worth my time entering. Of course, if other people think that... -- Tom - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
On Thu, Sep 01, 2005 at 02:57:34PM +0100, David Tattersall wrote: Also - it's not the most enticing theme. TV schedules have been done before really. If you perhaps gave a goal - for example a project that gradually learns what TV somebody likes and suggests programmes that are on - with perhaps a view to having the project a permanent feature of the BBC web site, I'm sure there would be more interest. Agreed. It has been done before and quite well. The format put me off also. Personally, I didn't work on an entry because I was busy with other things! I assumed that such a wide subject like TV guides would have attracted too many people! Likewise! I would have loved to submit something but with work, other projects and it being summer I was kinda busy. Maybe over the cold winter months we'd all be more productive :) Olly Jackson -- http://cyber-junky.co.ukhttp://www.googlesightseeing.com - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
I think as is the case with many people it all comes down to time unfortunately.As someone else mentioned, I assumed you would be inundated with really cool stuff and that my offering of a couple of weekends here and there just wouldn't be up to scratch. I guess I'll have to rethink.I also agree with David Tattersal about perhaps giving a slightly more exciting brief. --Chris Gilbert07966 077 486[EMAIL PROTECTED] On 1 Sep 2005, at 14:39, Ben Metcalfe wrote: Dear all, I'm writing to let you know that the inaugural backstage.bbc.co.uk competition hasn’t gone as well as I had hoped. In fact, at the time of sending this we haven’t received any entries at all.backstage.bbc.co.uk is very much about the BBC experimenting with new ways of engaging with it’s expert user base, and clearly this specific exercise hasn’t worked. backstage.bbc.co.uk also strives to be a publicly open and transparent project, which is why I am writing to communicate this to you all.Moving forward, I’ve been trying to think about why this has happened – and my guess is that it comes to one of two possibilities:* The TV schedule data we provided over-complicated and in an alien format that was difficult to parse, or * The idea of developing around a BBC-led theme, even for a prize, isn’t an approach that is of interest to the backstage.bbc.co.uk community.I’m keen to gather whether either/both of these reasons are the case, or maybe there’s something else I’ve completely missed?All of your thoughts and views are very subject are very much appreciated, so I’d be really grateful if you could let me know what you think – either publicly on this mailing list or privately (ben.metcalfe [at] bbc.co.uk).I don’t want to pre-empt your views on this, so I will get back to you with some more thoughts and action points on my part, once I am able to gauge where we stand (and thus what we need to do differently next time).Many thanks Ben Metcalfe Project Lead, backstage.bbc.co.uk
Re: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
Ben, I'm concerned at the hype around the use and provision of text, and the failure to engage users of other media, by releasing under published copyright (commons type) restrictions as advertised by the BBC. Even with text the BBC seemed to be trying to be pretty restrictive on copyright, whilst letting google forward whatever. You might consider that hype was too strong but --- Build what you want using BBC content --- seems to me to mean a LOT more than in fact it does in this instance. The BBC should be and I imagine is considering what happened to music and film in recent years where assets are repurposed. Well this project didn't live up to even a small part of that hype. I believe the TV schedule concept isn't that exciting, but just might be with access to sound, picture and motion files, perhaps an online mixing console? there are excellent versions online that work with fixed files jellify BBC content XML is requisite imho, but not sufficient, give us the tools! x: On 1 Sep 2005, at 14:39, Ben Metcalfe wrote: Dear all, I'm writing to let you know that the inaugural backstage.bbc.co.uk competition hasn’t gone as well as I had hoped. In fact, at the time of sending this we haven’t received any entries at all. backstage.bbc.co.uk is very much about the BBC experimenting with new ways of engaging with it’s expert user base, and clearly this specific exercise hasn’t worked. backstage.bbc.co.uk also strives to be a publicly open and transparent project, which is why I am writing to communicate this to you all. Moving forward, I’ve been trying to think about why this has happened – and my guess is that it comes to one of two possibilities: * The TV schedule data we provided over-complicated and in an alien format that was difficult to parse, or * The idea of developing around a BBC-led theme, even for a prize, isn’t an approach that is of interest to the backstage.bbc.co.uk community. I’m keen to gather whether either/both of these reasons are the case, or maybe there’s something else I’ve completely missed? All of your thoughts and views are very subject are very much appreciated, so I’d be really grateful if you could let me know what you think – either publicly on this mailing list or privately (ben.metcalfe [at] bbc.co.uk). I don’t want to pre-empt your views on this, so I will get back to you with some more thoughts and action points on my part, once I am able to gauge where we stand (and thus what we need to do differently next time). Many thanks Ben Metcalfe Project Lead, backstage.bbc.co.uk Jonathan Chetwynd Accessibility Consultant on Learning Disabilities and the Internet 29 Crimsworth Road SW8 4RJ 020 7978 1764 - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
I was hoping to enter; indeed, I got about 1/3 of the way through my project but sheer lack of time and expertise has got in the way. The main problem was parsing the XML. I'd developed the beginnings of the interface, and I was about to approach parsing the XML. Unfortunately, I ended up writing the application in Python which is not quite my forte (ie: I practically knew none of it when I began). The difficulty of parsing the XML was really what was holding me back - that's why I asked if anyone had developed a TV-anytime parser for Python. Anyhow, I may as well blow open what I was working on because the deadline's passed: an AIM chatbot that you could talk to in natural language eg (what's on bbc1 or bbc2 between 2030 and 2230). The bit I've done is most of the language-parsing and creating the userid (the bot is called whatsonthebbc). The bit I haven't done is parsing the XML. It's not even really the XML that was tricky - my XPath syntax is competent, and that's all I'd need; it's just handling the gzip'd file, decompressing to a temp directory, and joining the dots between three seperate files for each channel. I can see the advantages of TV-Anytime, no doubt, but the file-handling was just getting a little beyond me. Still, if anyone's developed a TV-Anytime parser in Python, that'd ease the cogs. Also, as I said, the main constraint was time - not the length of the deadline, but merely my summer being busier than I thought. Still, I've discovered that I rather like Python as a result. t. Quoting Ben Metcalfe [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Dear all, I'm writing to let you know that the inaugural backstage.bbc.co.uk competition hasn't gone as well as I had hoped. In fact, at the time of sending this we haven't received any entries at all. backstage.bbc.co.uk is very much about the BBC experimenting with new ways of engaging with it's expert user base, and clearly this specific exercise hasn't worked. backstage.bbc.co.uk also strives to be a publicly open and transparent project, which is why I am writing to communicate this to you all. Moving forward, I've been trying to think about why this has happened - and my guess is that it comes to one of two possibilities: * The TV schedule data we provided over-complicated and in an alien format that was difficult to parse, or * The idea of developing around a BBC-led theme, even for a prize, isn't an approach that is of interest to the backstage.bbc.co.uk community. I'm keen to gather whether either/both of these reasons are the case, or maybe there's something else I've completely missed? All of your thoughts and views are very subject are very much appreciated, so I'd be really grateful if you could let me know what you think - either publicly on this mailing list or privately (ben.metcalfe [at] bbc.co.uk). I don't want to pre-empt your views on this, so I will get back to you with some more thoughts and action points on my part, once I am able to gauge where we stand (and thus what we need to do differently next time). Many thanks Ben Metcalfe Project Lead, backstage.bbc.co.uk - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] Historical listings..
one for the mix - just imagine of the bbc back catalogue was opened upyou could relive all sorts of events as if in real time ;-) http://www.jisc.ac.uk/index.cfm?name=television_research_news_310805 Thanks for that Tony.. I've had a couple of chats recently with the Radio Times team about their astonishing archive. (82 years!) and this is a really useful pointer. I've also contacted the Bournemouth project as a result. Jem Stone BBC Backstage team - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
On 9/1/05, Jonathan Chetwynd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe the TV schedule concept isn't that exciting, but just mightbe with access to sound, picture and motion files, perhaps an onlinemixing console? there are excellent versions online that work withfixed files jellify BBC content XML is requisite imho, but not sufficient, give us the tools!delurking I agree. For me schedules are virtually redundant now anyways. Tvradio devoted torrent-tracker sites make very effective time shifting devices. Besides I find myself using mainstream tv radio for entertainment, news information less and less. Chris
Re: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
It does seem like a lot of people have had a lack of time. Personally I didn't find it too hard to parse the listings, although it could have been easier with a simpler format. I think I have made it clear that developing something around a BBC led theme isn't really a problem for me :) I have actually got a "prototype", although it isn't finished enough to really be submitted just now. Should be done by the deadline though. I have already got the tv listings on a web page, easily scrollable, etc. Hopefully it will be great by the weekend. Duncan Ben Metcalfe wrote: backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition Dear all, I'm writing to let you know that the inaugural backstage.bbc.co.uk competition hasnt gone as well as I had hoped. In fact, at the time of sending this we havent received any entries at all. backstage.bbc.co.uk is very much about the BBC experimenting with new ways of engaging with its expert user base, and clearly this specific exercise hasnt worked. backstage.bbc.co.uk also strives to be a publicly open and transparent project, which is why I am writing to communicate this to you all. Moving forward, Ive been trying to think about why this has happened and my guess is that it comes to one of two possibilities: * The TV schedule data we provided over-complicated and in an alien format that was difficult to parse, or * The idea of developing around a BBC-led theme, even for a prize, isnt an approach that is of interest to the backstage.bbc.co.uk community. Im keen to gather whether either/both of these reasons are the case, or maybe theres something else Ive completely missed? All of your thoughts and views are very subject are very much appreciated, so Id be really grateful if you could let me know what you think either publicly on this mailing list or privately (ben.metcalfe [at] bbc.co.uk). I dont want to pre-empt your views on this, so I will get back to you with some more thoughts and action points on my part, once I am able to gauge where we stand (and thus what we need to do differently next time). Many thanks Ben Metcalfe Project Lead, backstage.bbc.co.uk
Re: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
I'm writing to let you know that the inaugural backstage.bbc.co.uk competition hasn’t gone as well as I had hoped. In fact, at the time of sending this we haven’t received any entries at all. Ouch! Much as others have said, time is a factor. A number of the forums/websites that I use tend to go very quiet over this time of year as everyone is on holiday or out getting fresh air (strange people) ;-) * The TV schedule data we provided over-complicated and in an alien format that was difficult to parse, or Alien, yes, complicated, yes BUT please don't let that stop you! We need much much more raw data from sites such as the BBC, perhaps writing a simple parser on the TV-Anytime feeds into a straight XML feed would have solved that. People could then choose between how much data/complexity they wanted. Right now I would much rather see too much data than too little! * The idea of developing around a BBC-led theme, even for a prize, isn’t an approach that is of interest to the backstage.bbc.co.uk community. This was one of the factors for me. It was BBC only :-\ I know you can't really do anything about this but if I were to develop a TV schedule app then I would at least want to have the 5 terrestrial channels and not just the BBC ones :-\ TV schedule data for all the common channels are on the net elsewhere and I would probably use them :-\ I’m keen to gather whether either/both of these reasons are the case, or maybe there’s something else I’ve completely missed? The Non-profit tag also hit with me. I toyed with partnering up the TV listings with Amazon data give if you liked that then try this type links but that may link to Amazon products that you could buy and I would be making money! So what's in it for me to write this app?? I also wasn't sure if this data would be staying around as there are warnings all over the place about the feeds only being around for three months. I have written some modules for CMS systems so that Joe Bloggs user can easily embed data into their website and thought about using the BBC feeds to allow people to add TV listings to their sites. As the feeds include URL's for the programme site on bbc.co.uk I thought this would be great for you to pull in hits to your site. In the end I didn't write these modules because I didn't know if the data would be staying around and while it would have pulled lots of links to the BBC site I didn't think the coding would have been fancy/clever enough to win any prizes :-) I hope that helped answer your questions :-) Dan - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
I'd like to just add another voice to the call for XML feeds. It's much easier to parse with the abundance of libraries. Also, off-topic, but any chance of the Weather feed (XML aussi) being added? The GNOME-UK team would like to use it. Stephen Ben Metcalfe said: * The TV schedule data we provided over-complicated and in an alien format that was difficult to parse, or * The idea of developing around a BBC-led theme, even for a prize, isn't an approach that is of interest to the backstage.bbc.co.uk community. - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
[backstage] UPDATE backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule Competition
Following on from feedback received so far (on list and off list), I've got some updates for you all... **Timing** Holidays, enjoying the sun, etc -- it sounds like many of you have just not had an opportunity to get round to working on your ideas. Therefore we are going to extend the competition by 4 weeks to Monday 3rd October 2005. **Complexity of the TV-Anytime format** A number of people have voiced their concern that the data format is too complicated, although interestingly some have said they have welcomed it's complexity because it means detailed data sets. There is an open source Java parser for TV-Anytime (http://www.bbc.co.uk/opensource/projects/tv_anytime_api/) but I'm aware many of you are not building your prototypes in Java. With this in mind, I'd like to extend the competition to include any other third-party UK TV listings data you would like to use in your prototype, not just our BBC TV-Anytime feed. **Competition scope** A number of people have expressed a view that they felt this was a 'tired' area to look at, and that creating a new EPG or similar listings output wasn't exciting. I'd like to reiterate that we are interested in seeing absolutely **any** ideas you have about new ways of presenting, communicating and promoting TV programme information to users. We're just as aware as you that the value of the traditional TV schedule is rapidly decreasing in an ever more on demand world - and part of the his competition is to begin to think about how individual programme information can be presented and promoted in a schedulelessenvironment. I'd like to take the opportunity to reiterate just some of the areas of innovation you might want to look at: (as mentioned in my Open Tech presentation http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/07/backstagebbccou.html) Combine schedules with web services * Such as del.icio.us, technorati, etc * Open up each programme to external annotation Focus on genres * Such as all films, comedies, etc * Signed or subtitled programming * Vertical searching by genre Introduce a social element to a schedule or channel * Bookmark programmes * Rating/voting * Collaborative filtering Alert, client-push, etc * SMS * Email broadcasts * Desktop reminders Integrate the data with existing BBC feeds or external sources * Such as IMDB * Wikipedia * Google Video, Yahoo Video Create new ways of tagging programmes * Align with existing tagged web-based content As you can see, we are not really looking for new takes on the classic EPG grid layout! We genuinely are interested in seeing **any** and **all** ideas you have on how TV programme information can be better presented and communicated to our audience in the future! Especially in an on demand, scheduleless environment. So to confirm: you've now got until Monday 3rd October 2005, you can use any TV listings source you like and we are interested in any ideas you have - not just EPGs. Finally, we'd be happy to send the winner a desktop computer of same value instead of a rackmount server, if that's what they want (we'll ask the winner). And don't forget we've also still a couple of USB MP3 players for two runners up. Good luck with your entries Ben - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
yeah i would probably have got off my arse and learned what a crid wasif the prize had been a top of the line g4 with cinema display. On 02/09/05, Luke Dicken [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As far as the prize goes, a rackable server again limits your target audience - perhaps something more mainstream would bring in more people who aren't techs-by-profession? Off the top of my head a top-of-the-line desktop (or equivalent value) would be of wider use. Of course, thats just my opinion, I could be wrong. Luke -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ben Metcalfe Sent: 01 September 2005 14:39 To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk Subject: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition Importance: High Dear all, I'm writing to let you know that the inaugural backstage.bbc.co.uk competition hasn't gone as well as I had hoped. In fact, at the time of sending this we haven't received any entries at all. backstage.bbc.co.uk is very much about the BBC experimenting with new ways of en! gaging with it's expert user base, and clearly this specific exercise hasn't worked. backstage.bbc.co.uk also strives to be a publicly open and transparent project, which is why I am writing to communicate this to you all. Moving forward, I've been trying to think about why this has happened – and my guess is that it comes to one of two possibilities: * The TV schedule data we provided over-complicated and in an alien format that was difficult to parse, or * The idea of developing around a BBC-led theme, even for a prize, isn't an approach that is of interest to the backstage.bbc.co.uk community. I'm keen to gather whether either/both of these reasons are the case, or maybe there's something else I've completely missed? All of your thoughts and views are very subject are very much appreciated, so I'd be really grateful if you could let me know what you think – either publicly on this mailing list or privately (ben.metcalfe [at] bbc.co.uk). I ! don't want to pre-empt your views on this, so I will get back to you w ith some more thoughts and action points on my part, once I am able to gauge where we stand (and thus what we need to do differently next time). Many thanks Ben Metcalfe Project Lead, backstage.bbc.co.uk -- ***Commit random acts of literacy! Read Release at http://www.bookcrossing.com/friend/jameso - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
yeah i would probably have got off my arse and learned what a crid wasif the prize had been a top of the line g4 with cinema display. I don't get out of bed for anything less than a G5 Dual Processor Cinema Screen Display -- Chris Gilbert 07966 077 486 [EMAIL PROTECTED] On 1 Sep 2005, at 17:23, James Ockenden wrote: yeah i would probably have got off my arse and learned what a crid wasif the prize had been a top of the line g4 with cinema display. On 02/09/05, Luke Dicken [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As far as the prize goes, a rackable server again limits your target audience - perhaps something more mainstream would bring in more people who aren't techs-by-profession? Off the top of my head a top-of-the-line desktop (or equivalent value) would be of wider use. Of course, thats just my opinion, I could be wrong. Luke -Original Message- From: owner- backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ben Metcalfe Sent: 01 September 2005 14:39 To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk Subject: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition Importance: High Dear all, I'm writing to let you know that the inaugural backstage.bbc.co.uk competition hasn't gone as well as I had hoped. In fact, at the time of sending this we haven't received any entries at all. backstage.bbc.co.uk is very much about the BBC experimenting with new ways of en! gaging with it's expert user base, and clearly this specific exercise hasn't worked. backstage.bbc.co.uk also strives to be a publicly open and transparent project, which is why I am writing to communicate this to you all. Moving forward, I've been trying to think about why this has happened – and my guess is that it comes to one of two possibilities: * The TV schedule data we provided over-complicated and in an alien format that was difficult to parse, or * The idea of developing around a BBC-led theme, even for a prize, isn't an approach that is of interest to the backstage.bbc.co.uk community. I'm keen to gather whether either/both of these reasons are the case, or maybe there's something else I've completely missed? All of your thoughts and views are very subject are very much appreciated, so I'd be really grateful if you could let me know what you think – either publicly on this mailing list or privately (ben.metcalfe [at] bbc.co.uk). I ! don't want to pre-empt your views on this, so I will get back to you w ith some more thoughts and action points on my part, once I am able to gauge where we stand (and thus what we need to do differently next time). Many thanks Ben Metcalfe Project Lead, backstage.bbc.co.uk -- ***Commit random acts of literacy! Read Release at http:// www.bookcrossing.com/friend/jameso - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/ mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail- archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
RE: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition
Hi Steve, Weather.com has a good XML feed that provides forecasts for up to 5 days in advance. I think they're pretty OK about usage (the usuals - display their logo, non commercial etc). I've used it in the past and I have to say it's a dream to use! David -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Stephen Tomlinson Sent: 01 September 2005 4:59 To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk Subject: Re: [backstage] backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule competition Importance: High I'd like to just add another voice to the call for XML feeds. It's much easier to parse with the abundance of libraries. Also, off-topic, but any chance of the Weather feed (XML aussi) being added? The GNOME-UK team would like to use it. Stephen Ben Metcalfe said: * The TV schedule data we provided over-complicated and in an alien format that was difficult to parse, or * The idea of developing around a BBC-led theme, even for a prize, isn't an approach that is of interest to the backstage.bbc.co.uk community. - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.17/84 - Release Date: 29/08/05 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.17/84 - Release Date: 29/08/05 - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] UPDATE backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule Competition
On Thu, 1 Sep 2005, Ben Metcalfe wrote:
There is an open source Java parser for TV-Anytime
(http://www.bbc.co.uk/opensource/projects/tv_anytime_api/) but I'm aware
many of you are not building your prototypes in Java.
Its probably worth pointing out that CPAN also has a TV::Anytime set of
modules for Perl. Handy for those of us that are Perl hackers and don't
do Java!
After reading all the stuff in the last few postings, I wondered just how
tricky TV Anytime format is to process if you can grok Perl and have this
module loaded. So after a few minutes with `perl -MCPAN -e shell` doing
an install TV::Anytime and loading all the dependencies, I had Perl
setup and ready to go. What to do? For a simple test I simply strung
together some of the TV::Anytime perldoc examples with a quick bit of code
to let me search through this weeks TV::Anytime listings for TV programs
that have keywords matching my two major hobbies.
I've attached the resulting Perl code to this email, along with a sample
output. Its lacking comments, user interfaces or indeed any useful
(though I did consider a cronjob to get the TVAnytime data at the start of
the week and then email me the matching list), but at least it shows what
is possible with a minimal amount of Perl hacking.
Its not big and its not clever but then the whole thing from the first
what's this TV Anytime format look like anyway? thought to writing this
email took just over two hours. I doubt Ben Metcalfe and the chaps at BBC
Backstage will allow this as an entry in the comp (and it wasn't intended
as one, though I'll take the prize if the rest of you can't get your arses
into gear! ;-) ) but folk can feel free to take it, expand it, mull it
over, hack it and generally do what you want with it.
TV Anytime might be a pain in the bum if you're writing a parser from
scratch. So don't - use one someone has already written! A big round of
applause is due to Leon Brocard for creating TV::Anytime - it does what it
says on the tin and makes things really easy. So get to it folks...
Jim'll#!/usr/bin/perl
use strict;
use TV::Anytime;
my $tv = TV::Anytime-new(20050901/);
my @searchterms = ('railway', 'computer');
print Program Synopsis Keyword Search\n;
print \nLooking for keywords: ;
my $conj = ;
foreach my $searchterm (@searchterms) {
print $conj . $searchterm;
$conj = , ;
}
print \n\n;
# Find out what services are available
my @services = $tv-services_television;
foreach my $service (@services) {
print Channel . $service-name;
my @genres = $service-genres;
my $shown_genre = 0;
foreach my $genre (@genres) {
next if($genre-name ne ContentCS);
if(!$shown_genre) {
print (;
$shown_genre = 1;
} else {
print , ;
}
print $genre-value;
}
if($shown_genre) {
print );
}
print \n;
my @programmes = $service-programs;
my $matched = 0;
foreach my $program (@programmes) {
my @hits;
foreach my $searchterm (@searchterms) {
if($program-synopsis =~ /$searchterm/i) {
push @hits, $searchterm;
}
}
next if($#hits 0);
$matched++;
print $program-title . matched for ;
my $conj = ;
foreach my $hit (@hits) {
print $conj.$hit;
$conj = , ;
}
print .\n;
print. $program-synopsis . \n;
foreach my $event ($program-events) {
print
. $event-start-datetime . -
. $event-stop-datetime . (
. $event-duration-minutes . mins)\n;
}
my @prog_genres = $program-genres;
}
if(!$matched) {
print \tChannel has no matches\n;
}
}
Program Synopsis Keyword Search
Looking for keywords: railway, computer
Channel BBC One
Neighbours matched for computer.
Left on the Scrapheap: Crazed David attempts to harm Paul. Max is shocked by
Kayla's desperation. Penny uses creative measures to replace Bree's broken
computer. [AD]
2005-09-06T12:40:00 - 2005-09-06T13:05:00 (25 mins)
2005-09-06T16:35:00 - 2005-09-06T17:00:00 (25 mins)
Channel BBC Two
Hack the Planet matched for computer.
Open University. [M206] Meet the hackers who wrote a program capable of
hijacking 100 million computers and the multinationals intent on stopping them.
[S]
2005-09-04T01:30:00 - 2005-09-04T02:00:00 (30 mins)
Eureka TV matched for computer.
CBBC. Fearne uses a new computer to spot Kate in a crowd of fake Kates, plus
how to make your breakfast cereal perform at home. [S]
2005-09-08T07:00:00 - 2005-09-08T07:15:00 (15 mins)
Tetris: From Russia With Love matched for computer.
The tale of an outwardly simple computer block-building game being turned
into a global phenomena. [S]
2005-09-08T22:20:00 - 2005-09-08T23:20:00 (0 mins)
Channel BBC News 24 (News)
Channel has no matches
Channel BBC Three
Channel has no matches
Channel BBC Four
Channel has no matches
Channel CBBC
Re: [backstage] UPDATE backstage.bbc.co.uk TV Schedule Competition
TV Anytime might be a pain in the bum if you're writing a parser from scratch. So don't - use one someone has already written! I assume you haven't tried doing it in PHP then :) I coded my own XML parser in PHP a while ago (just as a challenge), and that works fairly well to put the stuff in a database. An extra month to make a prototype ... Just when I start being busy. Should still have some time to add more to what I have just now at least. Duncan J.P.Knight wrote: On Thu, 1 Sep 2005, Ben Metcalfe wrote: There is an open source Java parser for TV-Anytime (http://www.bbc.co.uk/opensource/projects/tv_anytime_api/) but I'm aware many of you are not building your prototypes in Java. Its probably worth pointing out that CPAN also has a TV::Anytime set of modules for Perl. Handy for those of us that are Perl hackers and don't do Java! After reading all the stuff in the last few postings, I wondered just how tricky TV Anytime format is to process if you can grok Perl and have this module loaded. So after a few minutes with `perl -MCPAN -e shell` doing an install TV::Anytime and loading all the dependencies, I had Perl setup and ready to go. What to do? For a simple test I simply strung together some of the TV::Anytime perldoc examples with a quick bit of code to let me search through this weeks TV::Anytime listings for TV programs that have keywords matching my two major hobbies. I've attached the resulting Perl code to this email, along with a sample output. Its lacking comments, user interfaces or indeed any useful (though I did consider a cronjob to get the TVAnytime data at the start of the week and then email me the matching list), but at least it shows what is possible with a minimal amount of Perl hacking. Its not big and its not clever but then the whole thing from the first what's this TV Anytime format look like anyway? thought to writing this email took just over two hours. I doubt Ben Metcalfe and the chaps at BBC Backstage will allow this as an entry in the comp (and it wasn't intended as one, though I'll take the prize if the rest of you can't get your arses into gear! ;-) ) but folk can feel free to take it, expand it, mull it over, hack it and generally do what you want with it. TV Anytime might be a pain in the bum if you're writing a parser from scratch. So don't - use one someone has already written! A big round of applause is due to Leon Brocard for creating TV::Anytime - it does what it says on the tin and makes things really easy. So get to it folks... Jim'll - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
