Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
Dave, You should take a look @ OBD and/or Railo. I know that such a migration is easier said than done on a live server and often fraught with peril. But then again going from V.5 to 6 required a fairly significant amount of code changes. But, if you don't want to learn PHP, there *are* viable free alternatives to Adobe CF. Especially if you can live with out running the the latest and greatest Adobe version. I have been very pleased with Railo and have migrated several apps to Railo and it was relatively painless. I am not sure about sandboxing apps and security concerns in a shared hosting environment (that has not come up yet) but alurium (http://alurium.com/) has been offering Railo in a shared hosting environment so it can be done. G! On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 3:24 PM, David Long d...@northgoods.com wrote: You're right, we don't have to upgrade and we haven't. What may happen if it should become a problem is I'll have to move my files away from our shared server to another hosting provider. The most traumatic part of that is loss of the readily available support from the other designers in our group and, worst of all, loss of personal access to the CF Administrator. After doing some shopping, I've found none of them are anxious to let me add my own DBs and Scheduled tasks or check logs, whatever. So I'll just keep on with CF5 and hoping nothing goes wrong. Dave -Original Message- From: Dave Watts [mailto:dwa...@figleaf.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2009 1:58 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released There are currently three of us hosting a total of about 120 sites that use CF5. (We have sites that don't use CF and I don't actually administer the CF server except to add ODBC data sources and an occasional scheduled task.) It just isn't practical for us to spend $8,000 every other year on a new version of CF. Why would you have to spend $8000 every other year? You haven't upgraded in years. You could upgrade once, and then hold off for several more years. Should we find it necessary to use new tech to satisfy our clients, our only affordable option will be php. The thought of having to learn new code makes me grumpy, hence the complaint. Well, paying $8000 might seem like a lot, but if you value your time it's not that much. I could make a lot more than that in the amount of time it would take to convert 120 sites from CF to PHP. But anyway, do these 120 sites need Enterprise functionality? Maybe you can get away with the much cheaper Standard version. But now, again, I don't really understand your complaint. If you don't have to upgrade to new technology, you can keep on keeping on. If you do, it's going to cost you something - either time or money or both. That has nothing to do with the frequency of Adobe's releases. Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software http://www.figleaf.com/ Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta, Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location. Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information! ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326993 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
Thanks, Gerald. I'll take a look at it. -Original Message- From: Gerald Guido [mailto:gerald.gu...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2009 8:44 AM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released Dave, You should take a look @ OBD and/or Railo. I know that such a migration is easier said than done on a live server and often fraught with peril. But then again going from V.5 to 6 required a fairly significant amount of code changes. But, if you don't want to learn PHP, there *are* viable free alternatives to Adobe CF. Especially if you can live with out running the the latest and greatest Adobe version. I have been very pleased with Railo and have migrated several apps to Railo and it was relatively painless. I am not sure about sandboxing apps and security concerns in a shared hosting environment (that has not come up yet) but alurium (http://alurium.com/) has been offering Railo in a shared hosting environment so it can be done. G! On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 3:24 PM, David Long d...@northgoods.com wrote: You're right, we don't have to upgrade and we haven't. What may happen if it should become a problem is I'll have to move my files away from our shared server to another hosting provider. The most traumatic part of that is loss of the readily available support from the other designers in our group and, worst of all, loss of personal access to the CF Administrator. After doing some shopping, I've found none of them are anxious to let me add my own DBs and Scheduled tasks or check logs, whatever. So I'll just keep on with CF5 and hoping nothing goes wrong. Dave -Original Message- From: Dave Watts [mailto:dwa...@figleaf.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2009 1:58 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released There are currently three of us hosting a total of about 120 sites that use CF5. (We have sites that don't use CF and I don't actually administer the CF server except to add ODBC data sources and an occasional scheduled task.) It just isn't practical for us to spend $8,000 every other year on a new version of CF. Why would you have to spend $8000 every other year? You haven't upgraded in years. You could upgrade once, and then hold off for several more years. Should we find it necessary to use new tech to satisfy our clients, our only affordable option will be php. The thought of having to learn new code makes me grumpy, hence the complaint. Well, paying $8000 might seem like a lot, but if you value your time it's not that much. I could make a lot more than that in the amount of time it would take to convert 120 sites from CF to PHP. But anyway, do these 120 sites need Enterprise functionality? Maybe you can get away with the much cheaper Standard version. But now, again, I don't really understand your complaint. If you don't have to upgrade to new technology, you can keep on keeping on. If you do, it's going to cost you something - either time or money or both. That has nothing to do with the frequency of Adobe's releases. Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software http://www.figleaf.com/ Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta, Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location. Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information! ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326995 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
There are currently three of us hosting a total of about 120 sites that use CF5. (We have sites that don't use CF and I don't actually administer the CF server except to add ODBC data sources and an occasional scheduled task.) It just isn't practical for us to spend $8,000 every other year on a new version of CF. Should we find it necessary to use new tech to satisfy our clients, our only affordable option will be php. The thought of having to learn new code makes me grumpy, hence the complaint. Dave Does it really? If you're running those sites on CF 5, then moving them over to Open BlueDragon or Railo running on JBoss and Apache, makes a lot of sense for an upgrade. You get the massive speed increase, and you do not have to pay for cost of CF Enterprise. I don't think there is anything in CF5 that is not in either of the two OSS CF engines. Or rather if there are, then most likely its not in the current version of Adobe CF either. So in general you do have a good case for upgrading from a server that's almost 10 years old to something more recent. regards, larry ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326999 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
I'm surprised On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 6:24 AM, David Long d...@northgoods.com wrote: [snip] After doing some shopping, I've found none of them are anxious to let me add my own DBs and Scheduled tasks or check logs, whatever. So I'll just keep on with CF5 and hoping nothing goes wrong. Dave [/snip] I'm surprised you found this. Few hosting providers will let you have access to the CF Administrator on a shared server, but nearly all of them give you the functionality if you want it. For example, we have functionality to let users create their own MySQL, MSSql or Access databases and DSNs if they want, scheduled tasks can be created by developers without needing the CFAdministrator, as can Verity collections.Nearly all shared hosting puts the logs into the user's own web space so you can read them however you like, and CF allows you to create your own logs any time you want as well. Even mappings can be added and deleted by developers without need for access to the CFAdministrator (provided they're unique) So yes it's true you can't get at the CF Administrator if you're sharing (if you have a VPS you can have full console access so that's different) but you can get the functionality you need. -- Cheers Mike Kear Windsor, NSW, Australia Adobe Certified Advanced ColdFusion Developer AFP Webworks http://afpwebworks.com ColdFusion, PHP, ASP, ASP.NET hosting from AUD$15/month ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:327016 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 2:22 PM, Larry Lyons larrycly...@gmail.com wrote: There are currently three of us hosting a total of about 120 sites that use CF5. (We have sites that don't use CF and I don't actually administer the CF server except to add ODBC data sources and an occasional scheduled task.) It just isn't practical for us to spend $8,000 every other year on a new version of CF. Should we find it necessary to use new tech to satisfy our clients, our only affordable option will be php. The thought of having to learn new code makes me grumpy, hence the complaint. Dave Does it really? If you're running those sites on CF 5, then moving them over to Open BlueDragon or Railo running on JBoss and Apache, makes a lot of sense for an upgrade. You get the massive speed increase, and you do not have to pay for cost of CF Enterprise. I don't think there is anything in CF5 that is not in either of the two OSS CF engines. Or rather if there are, then most likely its not in the current version of Adobe CF either. So in general you do have a good case for upgrading from a server that's almost 10 years old to something more recent. regards, larry I won't argue moving sites isn't a pain! Had to do a mass move once, it's a team effort and takes a few days at best with other requests coming in if you only got a few people. but 120 sites @ 10 bucks a month is $1,200.month, seems like you can afford something newer, and this means you can in turn learn new tricks, there is something still unique about using a new tag. And with cf5 wow, you have a lot of tags to catch up on. I'm sure before long you'd be using new tags before long. Think of it as training expense -- cfml language studies ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:327018 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
In the real world, no one (outside Adobe, perhaps) cares whether you upgrade or not. Maybe your spoon is in the wrong orifice? Why are you posting childish insults like this on a public mailing list? It adds nothing to the conversation and serves absolutely no purpose other than to be a prick. Best Regards, Emmit On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 8:58 PM, Dave Watts dwa...@figleaf.com wrote: Spit out the silver spoons--you're talking to someone who lives in the real world. My upgrades are paid for out of my design earnings. Unless an upgrade is going to earn money for me, it's a downgrade. In the real world, no one (outside Adobe, perhaps) cares whether you upgrade or not. Maybe your spoon is in the wrong orifice? Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software http://www.figleaf.com/ Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta, Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location. Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information! ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326953 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
Why are you posting childish insults like this on a public mailing list? It adds nothing to the conversation and serves absolutely no purpose other than to be a prick. I thought that my response appropriately matched the statement to which I responded. I do, however, reserve the right to be a prick. Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software http://www.figleaf.com/ Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta, Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location. Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information! ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326962 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
I felt that the original message, regarding the silver spoons and the uselessness of upgrades, was rather trollish. The intent of this thread was to tell people that might want to upgrade that a new release is available. Many people in the community have been anxiously awaiting said upgrade. Those who do not care about the upgrade can happily go along their way on whatever version they wish but there is no cause to go pissing on people that are interested. Dave responded in a similar fashion to point out the inanity of the offending comment. Perhaps he could have replied in a different fashion but given his long track record of providing stellar help to the CF community, I don't think that his post is really the time for a personal call out. Cheers, Judah On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 6:08 AM, Emmit Larson emmit.lar...@gmail.com wrote: In the real world, no one (outside Adobe, perhaps) cares whether you upgrade or not. Maybe your spoon is in the wrong orifice? Why are you posting childish insults like this on a public mailing list? It adds nothing to the conversation and serves absolutely no purpose other than to be a prick. Best Regards, Emmit On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 8:58 PM, Dave Watts dwa...@figleaf.com wrote: Spit out the silver spoons--you're talking to someone who lives in the real world. My upgrades are paid for out of my design earnings. Unless an upgrade is going to earn money for me, it's a downgrade. In the real world, no one (outside Adobe, perhaps) cares whether you upgrade or not. Maybe your spoon is in the wrong orifice? Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software http://www.figleaf.com/ Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta, Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location. Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information! ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326963 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
It's my fault. I started it with a sarcastic and inappropriate metaphor and Dave (the other Dave) responded in kind. I deserved it. However, that doesn't change my ire at the exclusionist rates Adobe is asking for their too-frequent upgrades. It gives the impression they are trying to eliminate those of us who work independently on our own nickel. I'm not a troll, just a low-end user expressing my opinion. Please accept my apology for the unnecessary slur about silver spoons. I'll shut up now. Dave -Original Message- From: Judah McAuley [mailto:ju...@wiredotter.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2009 11:13 AM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released I felt that the original message, regarding the silver spoons and the uselessness of upgrades, was rather trollish. The intent of this thread was to tell people that might want to upgrade that a new release is available. Many people in the community have been anxiously awaiting said upgrade. Those who do not care about the upgrade can happily go along their way on whatever version they wish but there is no cause to go pissing on people that are interested. Dave responded in a similar fashion to point out the inanity of the offending comment. Perhaps he could have replied in a different fashion but given his long track record of providing stellar help to the CF community, I don't think that his post is really the time for a personal call out. Cheers, Judah On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 6:08 AM, Emmit Larson emmit.lar...@gmail.com wrote: In the real world, no one (outside Adobe, perhaps) cares whether you upgrade or not. Maybe your spoon is in the wrong orifice? Why are you posting childish insults like this on a public mailing list? It adds nothing to the conversation and serves absolutely no purpose other than to be a prick. Best Regards, Emmit On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 8:58 PM, Dave Watts dwa...@figleaf.com wrote: Spit out the silver spoons--you're talking to someone who lives in the real world. My upgrades are paid for out of my design earnings. Unless an upgrade is going to earn money for me, it's a downgrade. In the real world, no one (outside Adobe, perhaps) cares whether you upgrade or not. Maybe your spoon is in the wrong orifice? Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software http://www.figleaf.com/ Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta, Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location. Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information! ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326968 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
David Long wrote: It's my fault. I started it with a sarcastic and inappropriate metaphor and Dave (the other Dave) responded in kind. I deserved it. However, that doesn't change my ire at the exclusionist rates Adobe is asking for their too-frequent upgrades. It gives the impression they are trying to eliminate those of us who work independently on our own nickel. I'm not a troll, just a low-end user expressing my opinion. Please accept my apology for the unnecessary slur about silver spoons. I'll shut up now. Dave But you don't have to pay for x.1 upgrades if you have bought the X version? If you are not counting the .1 upgrades, and upgrade cycle of approximately 3 years does not seem that frequent, at least for me. I also presume you are hosting your own public web server, because everybody knows that the developer versions are free for development, so if you don't host the server, there is nothing that needs to be paid. ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326970 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
However, that doesn't change my ire at the exclusionist rates Adobe is asking for their too-frequent upgrades. It gives the impression they are trying to eliminate those of us who work independently on our own nickel. I'm not a troll, just a low-end user expressing my opinion. Well, that, I can sympathize with. But you don't need to upgrade just because something is available. For any kind of upgrade, you should see whether it's worth your while. And Adobe's not trying to eliminate anyone - they're just trying to keep themselves in business. They need to make money, and that's how software vendors make money - not by selling the same product unchanged, or by making bug fixes to existing products. That said, CF upgrades have generally been well worth the money. There are lots of new features that can make a big difference in how you build applications. If you can spend less time building the same functionality, that's money in your pocket. But if you're hosting your clients' websites, and they're not clamoring for an upgrade, then you certainly don't have to buy one if you decide the features aren't worth the cost. Please accept my apology for the unnecessary slur about silver spoons. Apology accepted, and offered in return. Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software http://www.figleaf.com/ Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta, Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location. Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information! ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326971 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
There are currently three of us hosting a total of about 120 sites that use CF5. (We have sites that don't use CF and I don't actually administer the CF server except to add ODBC data sources and an occasional scheduled task.) It just isn't practical for us to spend $8,000 every other year on a new version of CF. Should we find it necessary to use new tech to satisfy our clients, our only affordable option will be php. The thought of having to learn new code makes me grumpy, hence the complaint. Dave -Original Message- From: Ian Skinner [mailto:h...@ilsweb.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2009 1:16 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released David Long wrote: It's my fault. I started it with a sarcastic and inappropriate metaphor and Dave (the other Dave) responded in kind. I deserved it. However, that doesn't change my ire at the exclusionist rates Adobe is asking for their too-frequent upgrades. It gives the impression they are trying to eliminate those of us who work independently on our own nickel. I'm not a troll, just a low-end user expressing my opinion. Please accept my apology for the unnecessary slur about silver spoons. I'll shut up now. Dave But you don't have to pay for x.1 upgrades if you have bought the X version? If you are not counting the .1 upgrades, and upgrade cycle of approximately 3 years does not seem that frequent, at least for me. I also presume you are hosting your own public web server, because everybody knows that the developer versions are free for development, so if you don't host the server, there is nothing that needs to be paid. ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326973 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
I think your information is slightly wrong. Upgrading enterprise doesn't cost 8000 a time - more like 3750. Still a lot of money depending on your situation, but much more affordable. But do you need the enterprise functionality? CF Standard is available as an upgrade for 649. How quickly will you make back that spend in built in features, speed of development etc.? We don't have an Enterprise license because we have never needed one. If we do, then we'll deal with that. But standard has a hack of a lot of functionality out of the box. -Original Message- From: David Long [mailto:d...@northgoods.com] Sent: 06 October 2009 19:48 To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released There are currently three of us hosting a total of about 120 sites that use CF5. (We have sites that don't use CF and I don't actually administer the CF server except to add ODBC data sources and an occasional scheduled task.) It just isn't practical for us to spend $8,000 every other year on a new version of CF. Should we find it necessary to use new tech to satisfy our clients, our only affordable option will be php. The thought of having to learn new code makes me grumpy, hence the complaint. Dave -Original Message- From: Ian Skinner [mailto:h...@ilsweb.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2009 1:16 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released David Long wrote: It's my fault. I started it with a sarcastic and inappropriate metaphor and Dave (the other Dave) responded in kind. I deserved it. However, that doesn't change my ire at the exclusionist rates Adobe is asking for their too-frequent upgrades. It gives the impression they are trying to eliminate those of us who work independently on our own nickel. I'm not a troll, just a low-end user expressing my opinion. Please accept my apology for the unnecessary slur about silver spoons. I'll shut up now. Dave But you don't have to pay for x.1 upgrades if you have bought the X version? If you are not counting the .1 upgrades, and upgrade cycle of approximately 3 years does not seem that frequent, at least for me. I also presume you are hosting your own public web server, because everybody knows that the developer versions are free for development, so if you don't host the server, there is nothing that needs to be paid. ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326974 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
There are currently three of us hosting a total of about 120 sites that use CF5. (We have sites that don't use CF and I don't actually administer the CF server except to add ODBC data sources and an occasional scheduled task.) It just isn't practical for us to spend $8,000 every other year on a new version of CF. Why would you have to spend $8000 every other year? You haven't upgraded in years. You could upgrade once, and then hold off for several more years. Should we find it necessary to use new tech to satisfy our clients, our only affordable option will be php. The thought of having to learn new code makes me grumpy, hence the complaint. Well, paying $8000 might seem like a lot, but if you value your time it's not that much. I could make a lot more than that in the amount of time it would take to convert 120 sites from CF to PHP. But anyway, do these 120 sites need Enterprise functionality? Maybe you can get away with the much cheaper Standard version. But now, again, I don't really understand your complaint. If you don't have to upgrade to new technology, you can keep on keeping on. If you do, it's going to cost you something - either time or money or both. That has nothing to do with the frequency of Adobe's releases. Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software http://www.figleaf.com/ Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta, Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location. Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information! ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326975 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
David Long wrote: There are currently three of us hosting a total of about 120 sites that use CF5. (We have sites that don't use CF and I don't actually administer the CF server except to add ODBC data sources and an occasional scheduled task.) It just isn't practical for us to spend $8,000 every other year on a new version of CF. Should we find it necessary to use new tech to satisfy our clients, our only affordable option will be php. The thought of having to learn new code makes me grumpy, hence the complaint. Dave As Will said you are quoting new purchase prices, not upgrade prices. You are also quoting Enterprise prices when you may very well only need Standard. That being said you are also overlooking the other CFML engines that are now available such as Blue Dragon and Railio. Of course I presume those alternatives will take longer to support what CF9 features they plan to incorporate. Thus saying PHP is the *only* affordable option is a bit of hyperbole. ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326976 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
You're right, we don't have to upgrade and we haven't. What may happen if it should become a problem is I'll have to move my files away from our shared server to another hosting provider. The most traumatic part of that is loss of the readily available support from the other designers in our group and, worst of all, loss of personal access to the CF Administrator. After doing some shopping, I've found none of them are anxious to let me add my own DBs and Scheduled tasks or check logs, whatever. So I'll just keep on with CF5 and hoping nothing goes wrong. Dave -Original Message- From: Dave Watts [mailto:dwa...@figleaf.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2009 1:58 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released There are currently three of us hosting a total of about 120 sites that use CF5. (We have sites that don't use CF and I don't actually administer the CF server except to add ODBC data sources and an occasional scheduled task.) It just isn't practical for us to spend $8,000 every other year on a new version of CF. Why would you have to spend $8000 every other year? You haven't upgraded in years. You could upgrade once, and then hold off for several more years. Should we find it necessary to use new tech to satisfy our clients, our only affordable option will be php. The thought of having to learn new code makes me grumpy, hence the complaint. Well, paying $8000 might seem like a lot, but if you value your time it's not that much. I could make a lot more than that in the amount of time it would take to convert 120 sites from CF to PHP. But anyway, do these 120 sites need Enterprise functionality? Maybe you can get away with the much cheaper Standard version. But now, again, I don't really understand your complaint. If you don't have to upgrade to new technology, you can keep on keeping on. If you do, it's going to cost you something - either time or money or both. That has nothing to do with the frequency of Adobe's releases. Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software http://www.figleaf.com/ Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta, Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location. Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information! ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326977 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
Have you looked at some of the VPS solutions? Some of them are quite economical, and give you access to all of those things. On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 2:24 PM, David Long wrote: After doing some shopping, I've found none of them are anxious to let me add my own DBs and Scheduled tasks or check logs, whatever. ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326978 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
Seems like this right here would be a good forum to ask for recommendations of hosts? You might be pleasantly surprised! -Original Message- From: David Long [mailto:d...@northgoods.com] Sent: 06 October 2009 20:24 To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released You're right, we don't have to upgrade and we haven't. What may happen if it should become a problem is I'll have to move my files away from our shared server to another hosting provider. The most traumatic part of that is loss of the readily available support from the other designers in our group and, worst of all, loss of personal access to the CF Administrator. After doing some shopping, I've found none of them are anxious to let me add my own DBs and Scheduled tasks or check logs, whatever. So I'll just keep on with CF5 and hoping nothing goes wrong. Dave -Original Message- From: Dave Watts [mailto:dwa...@figleaf.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2009 1:58 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released There are currently three of us hosting a total of about 120 sites that use CF5. (We have sites that don't use CF and I don't actually administer the CF server except to add ODBC data sources and an occasional scheduled task.) It just isn't practical for us to spend $8,000 every other year on a new version of CF. Why would you have to spend $8000 every other year? You haven't upgraded in years. You could upgrade once, and then hold off for several more years. Should we find it necessary to use new tech to satisfy our clients, our only affordable option will be php. The thought of having to learn new code makes me grumpy, hence the complaint. Well, paying $8000 might seem like a lot, but if you value your time it's not that much. I could make a lot more than that in the amount of time it would take to convert 120 sites from CF to PHP. But anyway, do these 120 sites need Enterprise functionality? Maybe you can get away with the much cheaper Standard version. But now, again, I don't really understand your complaint. If you don't have to upgrade to new technology, you can keep on keeping on. If you do, it's going to cost you something - either time or money or both. That has nothing to do with the frequency of Adobe's releases. Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software http://www.figleaf.com/ Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta, Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location. Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information! ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326980 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
It's even cheaper with software maintenance. We simply keep up our maintenance and get the latest version automatically whenever it comes out. Regardless, the cost of CF Enterprise is peanuts compared to other enterprise software. Ask someone what a full scale Oracle platform costs, but make sure you're sitting down first. mxAjax / CFAjax docs and other useful articles: http://www.bifrost.com.au/blog/ 2009/10/7 Ian Skinner h...@ilsweb.com: David Long wrote: There are currently three of us hosting a total of about 120 sites that use CF5. (We have sites that don't use CF and I don't actually administer the CF server except to add ODBC data sources and an occasional scheduled task.) It just isn't practical for us to spend $8,000 every other year on a new version of CF. Should we find it necessary to use new tech to satisfy our clients, our only affordable option will be php. The thought of having to learn new code makes me grumpy, hence the complaint. Dave As Will said you are quoting new purchase prices, not upgrade prices. You are also quoting Enterprise prices when you may very well only need Standard. That being said you are also overlooking the other CFML engines that are now available such as Blue Dragon and Railio. Of course I presume those alternatives will take longer to support what CF9 features they plan to incorporate. Thus saying PHP is the *only* affordable option is a bit of hyperbole. ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326992 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
Heard it on the grape vine... Go gitcha some. Excellent news! (Though now I have visions of dancing raisins stuck in my head...) -Leigh ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326909 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
If I jumped at every new software version, I would feel like I had adopted child, no, an orphanage full of children. I'd be buying them food and clothes and by the time I begin to learn their names, their all gone and a new batch has moved in and I'd have to start learning all over again. Of course my money would be flowing into their pockets right on without interruption. What a racket. Dave -Original Message- From: Gerald Guido [mailto:gerald.gu...@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 1:55 PM To: cf-talk Subject: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released Heard it on the grape vine... Go gitcha some. http://www.adobe.com/products/coldfusion/ http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/coldfusionbuilder/ G! -- Gerald Guido http://www.myinternetisbroken.com To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. -- Thomas A. Edison ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326914 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
CF8 was released over 2 years ago. I'd hope you'd know your child's name after two and a bit years! :) Incidentally, the price for cf9 is the same as the pricing for cf8, less in the UK. Will -Original Message- From: David Long [mailto:d...@northgoods.com] Sent: 05 October 2009 20:48 To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released If I jumped at every new software version, I would feel like I had adopted child, no, an orphanage full of children. I'd be buying them food and clothes and by the time I begin to learn their names, their all gone and a new batch has moved in and I'd have to start learning all over again. Of course my money would be flowing into their pockets right on without interruption. What a racket. Dave -Original Message- From: Gerald Guido [mailto:gerald.gu...@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 1:55 PM To: cf-talk Subject: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released Heard it on the grape vine... Go gitcha some. http://www.adobe.com/products/coldfusion/ http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/coldfusionbuilder/ G! -- Gerald Guido http://www.myinternetisbroken.com To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. -- Thomas A. Edison ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326917 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
In seven years they've had five releases. They're worse than Microsoft. -Original Message- From: Will Swain [mailto:w...@hothorse.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 2:51 PM To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released CF8 was released over 2 years ago. I'd hope you'd know your child's name after two and a bit years! :) Incidentally, the price for cf9 is the same as the pricing for cf8, less in the UK. Will -Original Message- From: David Long [mailto:d...@northgoods.com] Sent: 05 October 2009 20:48 To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released If I jumped at every new software version, I would feel like I had adopted child, no, an orphanage full of children. I'd be buying them food and clothes and by the time I begin to learn their names, their all gone and a new batch has moved in and I'd have to start learning all over again. Of course my money would be flowing into their pockets right on without interruption. What a racket. Dave -Original Message- From: Gerald Guido [mailto:gerald.gu...@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 1:55 PM To: cf-talk Subject: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released Heard it on the grape vine... Go gitcha some. http://www.adobe.com/products/coldfusion/ http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/coldfusionbuilder/ G! -- Gerald Guido http://www.myinternetisbroken.com To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. -- Thomas A. Edison ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326918 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
Five? They've had 6, 7, 8 and now 9 in that time. And surely Apple are the masters at releasing frequently? -Original Message- From: David Long [mailto:d...@northgoods.com] Sent: 05 October 2009 21:47 To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released In seven years they've had five releases. They're worse than Microsoft. -Original Message- From: Will Swain [mailto:w...@hothorse.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 2:51 PM To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released CF8 was released over 2 years ago. I'd hope you'd know your child's name after two and a bit years! :) Incidentally, the price for cf9 is the same as the pricing for cf8, less in the UK. Will -Original Message- From: David Long [mailto:d...@northgoods.com] Sent: 05 October 2009 20:48 To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released If I jumped at every new software version, I would feel like I had adopted child, no, an orphanage full of children. I'd be buying them food and clothes and by the time I begin to learn their names, their all gone and a new batch has moved in and I'd have to start learning all over again. Of course my money would be flowing into their pockets right on without interruption. What a racket. Dave -Original Message- From: Gerald Guido [mailto:gerald.gu...@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 1:55 PM To: cf-talk Subject: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released Heard it on the grape vine... Go gitcha some. http://www.adobe.com/products/coldfusion/ http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/coldfusionbuilder/ G! -- Gerald Guido http://www.myinternetisbroken.com To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. -- Thomas A. Edison ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326919 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
And to be fair, 6 and 7 were Macromedia I think. -Original Message- From: Will Swain [mailto:w...@hothorse.com] Sent: 05 October 2009 21:51 To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released Five? They've had 6, 7, 8 and now 9 in that time. And surely Apple are the masters at releasing frequently? ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326920 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
In seven years they've had five releases. They're worse than Microsoft. I've been working with CF for over ten years. I started on CF 4, which was out when I began. Those number just don't add up for me. Robert B. Harrison Director of Interactive Services Austin Williams 125 Kennedy Drive, Suite 100 Hauppauge NY 11788 P : 631.231.6600 Ext. 119 F : 631.434.7022 http://www.austin-williams.com Great advertising can't be either/or. It must be . Plug in to our blog: AW Unplugged http://www.austin-williams.com/unplugged __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 4482 (20091005) __ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326921 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
6 was released while CF was still managed by Macromedia. Can't blame Adobe for that one. It is illogical to compare the release cycle of CF to that of Windows. The evolution of the web is progressing much faster then the evolution of the desktop. Even if that wasn't the case, they're two entirely different products - it makes sense that they would have different release cycles. Warm regards, Jordan Michaels Vivio Technologies http://www.viviotech.net/ Open BlueDragon Steering Committee Adobe Solution Provider Will Swain wrote: Five? They've had 6, 7, 8 and now 9 in that time. And surely Apple are the masters at releasing frequently? -Original Message- From: David Long [mailto:d...@northgoods.com] Sent: 05 October 2009 21:47 To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released In seven years they've had five releases. They're worse than Microsoft. -Original Message- From: Will Swain [mailto:w...@hothorse.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 2:51 PM To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released CF8 was released over 2 years ago. I'd hope you'd know your child's name after two and a bit years! :) Incidentally, the price for cf9 is the same as the pricing for cf8, less in the UK. Will -Original Message- From: David Long [mailto:d...@northgoods.com] Sent: 05 October 2009 20:48 To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released If I jumped at every new software version, I would feel like I had adopted child, no, an orphanage full of children. I'd be buying them food and clothes and by the time I begin to learn their names, their all gone and a new batch has moved in and I'd have to start learning all over again. Of course my money would be flowing into their pockets right on without interruption. What a racket. Dave -Original Message- From: Gerald Guido [mailto:gerald.gu...@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 1:55 PM To: cf-talk Subject: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released Heard it on the grape vine... Go gitcha some. http://www.adobe.com/products/coldfusion/ http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/coldfusionbuilder/ G! ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326922 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
I assume he's including the .0.1 releases too. Which is cheating really. -Original Message- From: Robert Harrison [mailto:rob...@austin-williams.com] Sent: 05 October 2009 22:00 To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released In seven years they've had five releases. They're worse than Microsoft. I've been working with CF for over ten years. I started on CF 4, which was out when I began. Those number just don't add up for me. Robert B. Harrison Director of Interactive Services Austin Williams 125 Kennedy Drive, Suite 100 Hauppauge NY 11788 P : 631.231.6600 Ext. 119 F : 631.434.7022 http://www.austin-williams.com Great advertising can't be either/or. It must be . Plug in to our blog: AW Unplugged http://www.austin-williams.com/unplugged __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 4482 (20091005) __ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326923 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
For some odd reason I look forward to each new release. But that is just me. FWIIW From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ColdFusion * 1995 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 1.0 * 1996 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 1.5 * 1996 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 2.0 * 1997-Jun : Allaire Cold Fusion version 3.0 * 1998-Jan : Allaire Cold Fusion version 3.1 * 1998-Nov : Allaire ColdFusion version 4.0 (space eliminated between Cold and Fusion to make it ColdFusion) * 1999-Nov : Allaire ColdFusion version 4.5 * 2001-Jun : Macromedia ColdFusion version 5.0 * 2002-May : Macromedia ColdFusion MX version 6.0 (build 6,0,0,48097), Updater 1 (build 6,0,0,52311), Updater 2 (build 6,0,0,55693), Updater 3 (build 6,0,0,58500) * 2003-Jul : Macromedia ColdFusion MX version 6.1 (build 6,1,0,63958), Updater 1 (build 6,1,0,83762) * 2005 : Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 (build 7,0,0,91690), 7.0.1 (build 7,0,1,116466), 7.0.2 (build 7,0,2,142559) * 2007-Jul-30 : Adobe ColdFusion 8 (build 8,0,0,176276) * 2008-Apr-04 : Adobe ColdFusion 8.0.1 (build 8,0,1,195765) On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 5:12 PM, Will Swain w...@hothorse.com wrote: I assume he's including the .0.1 releases too. Which is cheating really. ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326929 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
Nope - not just you. 8 and now 9 especially have had some great new features that make it well worth while. And if you buy with a subscription, you get the upgrades over 2(?) years free. W -Original Message- From: Gerald Guido [mailto:gerald.gu...@gmail.com] Sent: 05 October 2009 22:49 To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released For some odd reason I look forward to each new release. But that is just me. FWIIW From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ColdFusion * 1995 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 1.0 * 1996 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 1.5 * 1996 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 2.0 * 1997-Jun : Allaire Cold Fusion version 3.0 * 1998-Jan : Allaire Cold Fusion version 3.1 * 1998-Nov : Allaire ColdFusion version 4.0 (space eliminated between Cold and Fusion to make it ColdFusion) * 1999-Nov : Allaire ColdFusion version 4.5 * 2001-Jun : Macromedia ColdFusion version 5.0 * 2002-May : Macromedia ColdFusion MX version 6.0 (build 6,0,0,48097), Updater 1 (build 6,0,0,52311), Updater 2 (build 6,0,0,55693), Updater 3 (build 6,0,0,58500) * 2003-Jul : Macromedia ColdFusion MX version 6.1 (build 6,1,0,63958), Updater 1 (build 6,1,0,83762) * 2005 : Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 (build 7,0,0,91690), 7.0.1 (build 7,0,1,116466), 7.0.2 (build 7,0,2,142559) * 2007-Jul-30 : Adobe ColdFusion 8 (build 8,0,0,176276) * 2008-Apr-04 : Adobe ColdFusion 8.0.1 (build 8,0,1,195765) ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326931 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
Spit out the silver spoons--you're talking to someone who lives in the real world. My upgrades are paid for out of my design earnings. Unless an upgrade is going to earn money for me, it's a downgrade. Dave -Original Message- From: Will Swain [mailto:w...@hothorse.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 4:51 PM To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released Nope - not just you. 8 and now 9 especially have had some great new features that make it well worth while. And if you buy with a subscription, you get the upgrades over 2(?) years free. W -Original Message- From: Gerald Guido [mailto:gerald.gu...@gmail.com] Sent: 05 October 2009 22:49 To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released For some odd reason I look forward to each new release. But that is just me. FWIIW From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ColdFusion * 1995 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 1.0 * 1996 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 1.5 * 1996 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 2.0 * 1997-Jun : Allaire Cold Fusion version 3.0 * 1998-Jan : Allaire Cold Fusion version 3.1 * 1998-Nov : Allaire ColdFusion version 4.0 (space eliminated between Cold and Fusion to make it ColdFusion) * 1999-Nov : Allaire ColdFusion version 4.5 * 2001-Jun : Macromedia ColdFusion version 5.0 * 2002-May : Macromedia ColdFusion MX version 6.0 (build 6,0,0,48097), Updater 1 (build 6,0,0,52311), Updater 2 (build 6,0,0,55693), Updater 3 (build 6,0,0,58500) * 2003-Jul : Macromedia ColdFusion MX version 6.1 (build 6,1,0,63958), Updater 1 (build 6,1,0,83762) * 2005 : Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 (build 7,0,0,91690), 7.0.1 (build 7,0,1,116466), 7.0.2 (build 7,0,2,142559) * 2007-Jul-30 : Adobe ColdFusion 8 (build 8,0,0,176276) * 2008-Apr-04 : Adobe ColdFusion 8.0.1 (build 8,0,1,195765) ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326936 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
No silver spoons here. Both cf8 and cf9 have introduced features that should make you more productive as a developer - which keeps your clients happy and makes you more money. So I've found anyway. w -Original Message- From: David Long [mailto:d...@northgoods.com] Sent: 06 October 2009 00:22 To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released Spit out the silver spoons--you're talking to someone who lives in the real world. My upgrades are paid for out of my design earnings. Unless an upgrade is going to earn money for me, it's a downgrade. Dave -Original Message- From: Will Swain [mailto:w...@hothorse.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 4:51 PM To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released Nope - not just you. 8 and now 9 especially have had some great new features that make it well worth while. And if you buy with a subscription, you get the upgrades over 2(?) years free. W -Original Message- From: Gerald Guido [mailto:gerald.gu...@gmail.com] Sent: 05 October 2009 22:49 To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released For some odd reason I look forward to each new release. But that is just me. FWIIW From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ColdFusion * 1995 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 1.0 * 1996 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 1.5 * 1996 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 2.0 * 1997-Jun : Allaire Cold Fusion version 3.0 * 1998-Jan : Allaire Cold Fusion version 3.1 * 1998-Nov : Allaire ColdFusion version 4.0 (space eliminated between Cold and Fusion to make it ColdFusion) * 1999-Nov : Allaire ColdFusion version 4.5 * 2001-Jun : Macromedia ColdFusion version 5.0 * 2002-May : Macromedia ColdFusion MX version 6.0 (build 6,0,0,48097), Updater 1 (build 6,0,0,52311), Updater 2 (build 6,0,0,55693), Updater 3 (build 6,0,0,58500) * 2003-Jul : Macromedia ColdFusion MX version 6.1 (build 6,1,0,63958), Updater 1 (build 6,1,0,83762) * 2005 : Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 (build 7,0,0,91690), 7.0.1 (build 7,0,1,116466), 7.0.2 (build 7,0,2,142559) * 2007-Jul-30 : Adobe ColdFusion 8 (build 8,0,0,176276) * 2008-Apr-04 : Adobe ColdFusion 8.0.1 (build 8,0,1,195765) ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326937 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
In seven years they've had five releases. That is the nature of the beast. It is the same for everything web related. Technology moves at a blisteringly fast pace on the internet and some people welcome that sort of release schedule. Resting on ones laurels is the kiss of death in this business. You snooze you lose is not an idle phrase, it is a way of life. In my opinion, the stewards of CF dropped the ball big time and did not move _fast enough_ between versions 5 through 8 and as a result CF was eclipsed by ROR, LAMP, .NET and other stacks. Best Regards, Emmit On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 4:46 PM, David Long d...@northgoods.com wrote: In seven years they've had five releases. They're worse than Microsoft. -Original Message- From: Will Swain [mailto:w...@hothorse.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 2:51 PM To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released CF8 was released over 2 years ago. I'd hope you'd know your child's name after two and a bit years! :) Incidentally, the price for cf9 is the same as the pricing for cf8, less in the UK. Will -Original Message- From: David Long [mailto:d...@northgoods.com] Sent: 05 October 2009 20:48 To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released If I jumped at every new software version, I would feel like I had adopted child, no, an orphanage full of children. I'd be buying them food and clothes and by the time I begin to learn their names, their all gone and a new batch has moved in and I'd have to start learning all over again. Of course my money would be flowing into their pockets right on without interruption. What a racket. Dave -Original Message- From: Gerald Guido [mailto:gerald.gu...@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 1:55 PM To: cf-talk Subject: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released Heard it on the grape vine... Go gitcha some. http://www.adobe.com/products/coldfusion/ http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/coldfusionbuilder/ G! -- Gerald Guido http://www.myinternetisbroken.com To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. -- Thomas A. Edison ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326939 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
Hey more power to you if you get the job done with an older version. I am fortunate enough to work in an environment where we are progesive enough to need the new features like caching, speed increases, Excel integration, server monitoring, and multithreading support. Adam On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 7:22 PM, David Long d...@northgoods.com wrote: Spit out the silver spoons--you're talking to someone who lives in the real world. My upgrades are paid for out of my design earnings. Unless an upgrade is going to earn money for me, it's a downgrade. Dave -Original Message- From: Will Swain [mailto:w...@hothorse.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 4:51 PM To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released Nope - not just you. 8 and now 9 especially have had some great new features that make it well worth while. And if you buy with a subscription, you get the upgrades over 2(?) years free. W -Original Message- From: Gerald Guido [mailto:gerald.gu...@gmail.com] Sent: 05 October 2009 22:49 To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released For some odd reason I look forward to each new release. But that is just me. FWIIW From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ColdFusion * 1995 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 1.0 * 1996 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 1.5 * 1996 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 2.0 * 1997-Jun : Allaire Cold Fusion version 3.0 * 1998-Jan : Allaire Cold Fusion version 3.1 * 1998-Nov : Allaire ColdFusion version 4.0 (space eliminated between Cold and Fusion to make it ColdFusion) * 1999-Nov : Allaire ColdFusion version 4.5 * 2001-Jun : Macromedia ColdFusion version 5.0 * 2002-May : Macromedia ColdFusion MX version 6.0 (build 6,0,0,48097), Updater 1 (build 6,0,0,52311), Updater 2 (build 6,0,0,55693), Updater 3 (build 6,0,0,58500) * 2003-Jul : Macromedia ColdFusion MX version 6.1 (build 6,1,0,63958), Updater 1 (build 6,1,0,83762) * 2005 : Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 (build 7,0,0,91690), 7.0.1 (build 7,0,1,116466), 7.0.2 (build 7,0,2,142559) * 2007-Jul-30 : Adobe ColdFusion 8 (build 8,0,0,176276) * 2008-Apr-04 : Adobe ColdFusion 8.0.1 (build 8,0,1,195765) ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326940 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
Hey more power to you if you get the job done with an older version In the same breath, you can also use OBD or Railo. Both are mature CF run times. I really like Railo a lot. It supports most all of Adobe CF 8's core language and/or features with (a lot, but not all of) the Ajaxy features being the most notable exceptions. It has a few warts (as does Adobe CF for that matter) but it is maturing rapidly thanx to community contributions. G!! On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 8:24 PM, Adam Haskell a.hask...@gmail.com wrote: Hey more power to you if you get the job done with an older version. I am fortunate enough to work in an environment where we are progesive enough to need the new features like caching, speed increases, Excel integration, server monitoring, and multithreading support. Adam On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 7:22 PM, David Long d...@northgoods.com wrote: Spit out the silver spoons--you're talking to someone who lives in the real world. My upgrades are paid for out of my design earnings. Unless an upgrade is going to earn money for me, it's a downgrade. Dave -Original Message- From: Will Swain [mailto:w...@hothorse.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 4:51 PM To: cf-talk Subject: RE: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released Nope - not just you. 8 and now 9 especially have had some great new features that make it well worth while. And if you buy with a subscription, you get the upgrades over 2(?) years free. W -Original Message- From: Gerald Guido [mailto:gerald.gu...@gmail.com] Sent: 05 October 2009 22:49 To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released For some odd reason I look forward to each new release. But that is just me. FWIIW From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ColdFusion * 1995 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 1.0 * 1996 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 1.5 * 1996 : Allaire Cold Fusion version 2.0 * 1997-Jun : Allaire Cold Fusion version 3.0 * 1998-Jan : Allaire Cold Fusion version 3.1 * 1998-Nov : Allaire ColdFusion version 4.0 (space eliminated between Cold and Fusion to make it ColdFusion) * 1999-Nov : Allaire ColdFusion version 4.5 * 2001-Jun : Macromedia ColdFusion version 5.0 * 2002-May : Macromedia ColdFusion MX version 6.0 (build 6,0,0,48097), Updater 1 (build 6,0,0,52311), Updater 2 (build 6,0,0,55693), Updater 3 (build 6,0,0,58500) * 2003-Jul : Macromedia ColdFusion MX version 6.1 (build 6,1,0,63958), Updater 1 (build 6,1,0,83762) * 2005 : Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 (build 7,0,0,91690), 7.0.1 (build 7,0,1,116466), 7.0.2 (build 7,0,2,142559) * 2007-Jul-30 : Adobe ColdFusion 8 (build 8,0,0,176276) * 2008-Apr-04 : Adobe ColdFusion 8.0.1 (build 8,0,1,195765) ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326941 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CF 9 and CF Builder Beta 2 released
Spit out the silver spoons--you're talking to someone who lives in the real world. My upgrades are paid for out of my design earnings. Unless an upgrade is going to earn money for me, it's a downgrade. In the real world, no one (outside Adobe, perhaps) cares whether you upgrade or not. Maybe your spoon is in the wrong orifice? Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software http://www.figleaf.com/ Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta, Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location. Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information! ~| Want to reach the ColdFusion community with something they want? Let them know on the House of Fusion mailing lists Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:326943 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
