Stus-List thanks for the info

[Rick Rohwer via CnC-List]

I printed it and will make sure it is on board.  Thanks for the information!

Rick
Paikea 37+
Bremerton, WA
> On Apr 19, 2019, at 8:31 AM, Dennis C. via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Everything you need, lubrication, cable tension, etc., is here:
> 
> https://edsonmarine.com/content/EB381SteeringGuide.pdf 
>  
> 
> Dennis C. 
> 
> On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 10:05 AM Allan Hester via CnC-List 
> mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> CNC Listers,
> 
> That is excellent advice for adjusting the quadrant cables. Very appreciated. 
> 
> A followup question:
> 
> What are the guidlines for lubricating the Edson pedestal and cables?
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> Al H.
> Pacific Ranger
> C 35 Mk3
> Vancouver, BC.
> 
> 
> From: CnC-List [cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
> ] on behalf of 
> cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com  
> [cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com ]
> Sent: April 19, 2019 2:29 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Subject: CnC-List Digest, Vol 159, Issue 85
> 
> Send CnC-List mailing list submissions to
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
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Re: Stus-List Split propeller coupling

[Nathan Post via CnC-List]

I installed something similar to that on my 34.  I ended up with the Buck 
Algonquin one instead cause that is what the shop had in stock, something like 
https://www.deepblueyachtsupply.com/split-marine-transmission-coupling-50401s1250?gclid=Cj0KCQjwhuvlBRCeARIsAM720Hq3qLvxJHYSic4AWJVJlO-IPKKMgdGfJr5HjDWzpnIgkkCipTVrGUgaAoyfEALw_wcB
 Since it isn’t split all the way it still has to be fit and faced and I still 
had to tap it onto the end of the shaft during instal which wasn’t easy.   
Probably was easier than without and I like that the bolt heads are less likely 
to strip compared to the square things in the old coupler. Hoping you are right 
that it will come
off easier when the time comes (had to cut the old one off the shaft).   Sub 
ideal solution if you ask me that it isn’t fully split into two parts but I 
guess it is too hard to ensure it is centered to prevent vibration of they do 
that.  Also not clear to me why they don’t make these out of stainless - 
obviously cost but still. I probably should have painted the outside before 
installing it but I was under too much pressure to get the boat out of the yard 
it was in at the time so I just threw it in and we went.

- -
Nathan Post
S/V Wisper
C 34

> On Apr 20, 2019, at 3:37 PM, Steve Thomas via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Anyone have any experience using a split propeller coupling? 
> Looks like a neat solution to the jamming problems associated with the 
> traditional couplings. 
> Might also be less likely to work loose when recently assembled.  
> 
> This is what I am looking at: 
> 
> https://www.generalpropeller.com/inboard-shafts-and-couplings/RD-Split-Couplings/202-254
> 
> 
> Steve Thomas
> C MKIII
> C 
> 
> 
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> 
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Re: Stus-List Replacing a CnC 44 Rudder

[Gary Nylander via CnC-List]

A good buddy of mine rebuilt his Jeanneau rudder – it came out great! It is now 
a year old and just went back in the water for the season. I’ll try to get some 
pictures.

Gary

 

From: CnC-List  On Behalf Of Dan via CnC-List
Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2019 12:40 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Dan 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Replacing a CnC 44 Rudder

 

Thanks everyone,

I've looked into both Foss Foam and Competition Composites. Both options are 
landing well into the $5000 cdn range (including freight) which is way beyond 
my budget. Foss Foam doesn't have a C Rudder mold but can try to "match" 
something similar which scares me a little and it's roughliey $1200 US to get 
it to Canada. Competition has a very expensive high-tech process using CAD 
software and a milling machine which I'm sure is standard for any Americas Cup 
contender but drives the price as expected.

 

 

Has anyone tried to re-build their own rudder? - I've been told carving 15lb 
density rigid foam and encapuslating is the way to go - like this:

http://boatprojects.blogspot.com/2011/07/rudder-rebuild.html

 

Dan

 

 

On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 9:00 AM Rod Stright via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

I would suggest Competition Composites in Ontario excellent 
workmanship,Canadian 

Rod

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 18, 2019, at 4:38 PM, Dan via CnC-List   > wrote:
> 
> Has any C owners on the list replaced their rudder, and if so, where did 
> you have the work done? - The price is dramatically reduced if they have an 
> existing mold to work with.
> 
> Dan Cormier
> Breakaweigh
> C
> Halifax, NS
> ___
> 
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> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 


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Stus-List Split propeller coupling

[Steve Thomas via CnC-List]

Anyone have any experience using a split propeller coupling? 
Looks like a neat solution to the jamming problems associated with the 
traditional couplings. 
Might also be less likely to work loose when recently assembled.  

This is what I am looking at: 

https://www.generalpropeller.com/inboard-shafts-and-couplings/RD-Split-Couplings/202-254


Steve Thomas
C MKIII
C 


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Re: Stus-List Source for bronze

[Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List]

That’s it.  Thanks.  Didn’t realize the bronze piece continues below the deck 
surface.  So much for just turning it over.

Can’t wait to look at price sheet.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 20, 2019, at 1:12 PM, Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Page 10 in Edson’s Traditional Steering catalog.
> https://edsonmarine.com/content/Edson_T1.pdf
> 
> Assorted sizes available.
> Chuck Gilchrest 
> S/V Half Magic
> 35 Landfall
> Padanaram MA 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Apr 20, 2019, at 11:28 AM, Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I suppose I could, now that you mention it.
>>  
>> You’re about as clever as whoever engineered the contraption in the first 
>> place.
>>  
>> From: Dennis C. via CnC-List
>> Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2019 10:37 AM
>> To: CnClist
>> Cc: Dennis C.
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Source for bronze
>>  
>> Can you simply turn the existing bronze ring over?
>>  
>> Dennis C.
>>  
>>> On Sat, Apr 20, 2019 at 9:11 AM Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List 
>>>   wrote:
>>> Listers:
>>>  
>>> I am in need of a source for a small piece of bronze, which will likely 
>>> need to be fabricated.  On my 42, the top of the rudder post exits through 
>>> the coaming just aft of the cockpit.  There is a simple but ingenious 
>>> method of securing it.  There are two, small stainless steel wheels bolted 
>>> to the rudder post which roll on the surface when the rudder turns.  They 
>>> sit on a bronze ring that looks like a large washer that fits around the 
>>> rudder post and is screwed onto the deck.  The bronze ring serves as the 
>>> surface for the two wheels to roll on.  This contraption is housed in a 
>>> fiberglass cover that screws onto the top of the rudder post.  By removing 
>>> the cover, you can use the post for emergency steering, which, unlike a lot 
>>> of boats I’ve seen, is a reasonably convenient location for this.
>>>  
>>> Last year, unbeknownst to me (due to the fiberglass cover), a nut came 
>>> off the bolt holding the wheels in place, and one of the wheels nearly came 
>>> off.  Because the wheel was angled and not rolling flat, it started wearing 
>>> a groove into the bronze ring.  I would like to replace the bronze ring, 
>>> but cannot imagine this is an off-the-shelf item.  Does anyone know of a 
>>> source for bronze for this purpose.  Without measuring, my guess is that I 
>>> need a piece roughly 6” x 6” x 3/16” thick (or thereabouts).
>>>  
>>> ___
>>> 
>>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
>>> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
>>> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> 
>>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
>>> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
>>> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
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>> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
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>> 
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>> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
>> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
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Re: Stus-List Replacing a CnC 44 Rudder

[Dan via CnC-List]

Thanks for all the input and advice - It's incredibly helpful to get
multiple approaches and info on the construction.
My rudder is very long. When we hauled out last year the tip of the rudder
was level with the bottom of the wing keel, so roughly 5-6 ft.
I'm still skeptical that the fins/wings are made of mild steel but like
anyting it will require a dissection and thorough inspection. If I find any
real corrosion (I'm sure I will) I will hire a welder and replace the fins
with 316 stainless ones.

I'm still heavily leaning towards the DIY approach (similar to what Graham
did) using rigid foam or a poured foam block and carving it down using the
original rudder shell as a template, then glassing or hiring a pro to glass
the whole thing for me, sealing the shaft, then barrier coat, bottom paint,
etc. for much less than the quotes I was given and still be a solid
dependable construction if I do everything right.

I do watch Sail Life on Youtube - Madz is doing an amazing job so far. I'm
not a fan of the clamshell method where building a mold is twice the work
and probably twice the cost, but I'm excited to see his results.

Thanks again!
Dan




On Sat, Apr 20, 2019 at 12:57 PM Bill Coleman via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> In the late 70’s early 80’s some C owners here were lengthening their
> rudders, there is a fellow here who interned at C in the early 70’s who
> designed the modified rudders.  I did two modifications using the existing
> shafts, and one from scratch, but not the fiberglass. The ribs were 11
> Gauge SS in the shape of the rudder, and a 1” X 1/8” strap wrapped around
> that, and welded to the shape, making like a T section. I then layed it
> flat on some cardboard and poured foam over it, and they just sanded it
> down to the ribs using a long sandpapered 2X4.  And then someone fiber
> glassed them.
>
> My boat was owned by an older fellow at the time, and he sent it with the
> local designers sketch to Bruckmans, and they did the rudder.
>
> Fast forward 10 years, and I own the boat for a year and haul the boat in
> the fall with half the rudders fiberglass missing .  I brought it back to
> the shop and made a 14 gauge SS rudder, 30 or 40 pounds lighter, and still
> bone dry today.
>
> So, there are many options.
>
>
>
> Bill Coleman
>
> C 39 Erie, PA
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Dan
> via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Saturday, April 20, 2019 12:40 AM
> *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> *Cc:* Dan
> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List Replacing a CnC 44 Rudder
>
>
>
> Thanks everyone,
>
> I've looked into both Foss Foam and Competition Composites. Both options
> are landing well into the $5000 cdn range (including freight) which is way
> beyond my budget. Foss Foam doesn't have a C Rudder mold but can try to
> "match" something similar which scares me a little and it's roughliey $1200
> US to get it to Canada. Competition has a very expensive high-tech process
> using CAD software and a milling machine which I'm sure is standard for any
> Americas Cup contender but drives the price as expected.
>
>
>
> Has anyone tried to re-build their own rudder? - I've been told carving
> 15lb density rigid foam and encapuslating is the way to go - like this:
>
> http://boatprojects.blogspot.com/2011/07/rudder-rebuild.html
>
>
>
> Dan
>
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 9:00 AM Rod Stright via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> I would suggest Competition Composites in Ontario excellent
> workmanship,Canadian 
>
> Rod
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Apr 18, 2019, at 4:38 PM, Dan via CnC-List 
> wrote:
> >
> > Has any C owners on the list replaced their rudder, and if so, where
> did you have the work done? - The price is dramatically reduced if they
> have an existing mold to work with.
> >
> > Dan Cormier
> > Breakaweigh
> > C
> > Halifax, NS
> > ___
> >
> > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> >
>
>
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>
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Re: Stus-List Recommended diesel filters

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

Many of us suggest a 30 micron for the primary and a 10 micron for the
secondary.

Dennis C.

On Sat, Apr 20, 2019 at 11:37 AM Shawn Wright via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> I noticed the C 35-2 with VW diesel that I am planning to purchase has a
> Sierra 18-7846 marine fuel filter, which is listed as a 21 micron
> fuel/water separating filter for gasoline. There is also a Racor filter,
> but I have not inspected it yet.
>
> Is this 21 micron filter ok to use as a primary? It seems that all the
> diesel filters listed at WM are 10 micron, so does this mean everyone uses
> a cheaper 21 micron gasoline filter as primary? I would prefer to have one
> with a visible water separator, and maybe a drain as well, but this is just
> from my automotive diesel experience, maybe marine is different?
>
>
> https://www.westmarine.com/buy/sierra--18-7846-omc-fuel-filter-21-micron--381139
>
> --
> Shawn Wright
> shawngwri...@gmail.com
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
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>
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Re: Stus-List Source for bronze

[Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List]

Page 10 in Edson’s Traditional Steering catalog.
https://edsonmarine.com/content/Edson_T1.pdf

Assorted sizes available.
Chuck Gilchrest 
S/V Half Magic
35 Landfall
Padanaram MA 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 20, 2019, at 11:28 AM, Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> I suppose I could, now that you mention it.
>  
> You’re about as clever as whoever engineered the contraption in the first 
> place.
>  
> From: Dennis C. via CnC-List
> Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2019 10:37 AM
> To: CnClist
> Cc: Dennis C.
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Source for bronze
>  
> Can you simply turn the existing bronze ring over?
>  
> Dennis C.
>  
>> On Sat, Apr 20, 2019 at 9:11 AM Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List 
>>  wrote:
>> Listers:
>>  
>> I am in need of a source for a small piece of bronze, which will likely 
>> need to be fabricated.  On my 42, the top of the rudderpost exits 
>> through the coaming just aft of the cockpit.  There is a simple but 
>> ingenious method of securing it.  There are two, small stainless steel 
>> wheels bolted to the rudder post which roll on the surface when the rudder 
>> turns.  They sit on a bronze ring that looks like a large washer that fits 
>> around the rudder post and is screwed onto the deck.  The bronze ring serves 
>> as the surface for the two wheels to roll on.  This contraption is housed in 
>> a fiberglass cover that screws onto the top ofthe rudder post.  By 
>> removing the cover, you can use the post for emergency steering, which, 
>> unlike a lot of boats I’ve seen, is a reasonably convenient location for 
>> this.
>>  
>> Last year, unbeknownst to me (due to the fiberglass cover), a nut came 
>> off the bolt holding the wheels in place, and one of the wheels nearly came 
>> off.  Because the wheel was angled and not rolling flat, it started wearing 
>> a groove into the bronze ring.  I would like to replace the bronze ring, but 
>> cannot imagine this is an off-the-shelf item.  Does anyone know of a source 
>> for bronze for this purpose.  Without measuring, my guess is that I need a 
>> piece roughly 6” x 6” x 3/16” thick (or thereabouts).
>>  
>> ___
>> 
>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
>> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
>> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
>> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
>> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>> 
> 
> ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> ___
> 
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> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
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Re: Stus-List Source for bronze

[Paul Fountain via CnC-List]

Try South Shore – I have sourced the derlin ring that the rudder of our 33-II 
slides on there.

From: CnC-List  On Behalf Of Matthew L. Wolford 
via CnC-List
Sent: April 20, 2019 10:11 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Matthew L. Wolford 
Subject: Stus-List Source for bronze

Listers:

I am in need of a source for a small piece of bronze, which will likely 
need to be fabricated.  On my 42, the top of the rudder post exits through the 
coaming just aft of the cockpit.  There is a simple but ingenious method of 
securing it.  There are two, small stainless steel wheels bolted to the rudder 
post which roll on the surface when the rudder turns.  They sit on a bronze 
ring that looks like a large washer that fits around the rudder post and is 
screwed onto the deck.  The bronze ring serves as the surface for the two 
wheels to roll on.  This contraption is housed in a fiberglass cover that 
screws onto the top of the rudder post.  By removing the cover, you can use the 
post for emergency steering, which, unlike a lot of boats I’ve seen, is a 
reasonably convenient location for this.

Last year, unbeknownst to me (due to the fiberglass cover), a nut came off 
the bolt holding the wheels in place, and one of the wheels nearly came off.  
Because the wheel was angled and not rolling flat, it started wearing a groove 
into the bronze ring.  I would like to replace the bronze ring, but cannot 
imagine this is an off-the-shelf item.  Does anyone know of a source for bronze 
for this purpose.  Without measuring, my guess is that I need a piece roughly 
6” x 6” x 3/16” thick (or thereabouts).

___

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Stus-List Recommended diesel filters

[Shawn Wright via CnC-List]

I noticed the C 35-2 with VW diesel that I am planning to purchase has a
Sierra 18-7846 marine fuel filter, which is listed as a 21 micron
fuel/water separating filter for gasoline. There is also a Racor filter,
but I have not inspected it yet.

Is this 21 micron filter ok to use as a primary? It seems that all the
diesel filters listed at WM are 10 micron, so does this mean everyone uses
a cheaper 21 micron gasoline filter as primary? I would prefer to have one
with a visible water separator, and maybe a drain as well, but this is just
from my automotive diesel experience, maybe marine is different?

https://www.westmarine.com/buy/sierra--18-7846-omc-fuel-filter-21-micron--381139

-- 
Shawn Wright
shawngwri...@gmail.com
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Re: Stus-List 35 Mk2 sea trial tomorrow - newbie advice needed

[Shawn Wright via CnC-List]

Hi Neil,

Thanks for the info! This reminded me that I have a copy of a purchase
agreement form given to me my a broker, so I am now adapting that to my
needs. We have several realtors in the family, so I am quite familiar with
the real estate forms, which are very similar. I plan to present the offer
after our sea trial, along with a deposit cheque and will get the buyer to
sign it once we settle on the dates and subjects (which may change of
course).

The sun is out, and it's looking like a great day for a sail (sale!), and
it's also our anniversary, so I can't think of a better way to celebrate! :)



On Sat, Apr 20, 2019 at 6:52 AM Neil Andersen via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Just a point of clarification, I don’t think I was as clear as I could
> have been.
>
> There is a difference between acceptance of offer by the seller and
> acceptance of vessel.  Receiving multiple offers is reasonable until an
> offer is accepted.  Once the offer is accepted by the seller, any
> subsequent offers should only be accepted as a backup.
>
> Neil
>
> Neil Andersen
> 20691 Jamieson Rd
> Rock Hall, MD 21661
>
> --
> *From:* Neil Andersen 
> *Sent:* Saturday, April 20, 2019 8:04 AM
> *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com; cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> *Cc:* WILLIAM WALKER
> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List 35 Mk2 sea trial tomorrow - newbie advice needed
>
> I had to weigh in again.  I’m a broker.  We use the YBAA standard contract
> which is buyer friendly.  Until the buyer signs an acceptance, they are not
> committed.  The offer is accompanied by a 10% refundable deposit.  Before
> the vessel is accepted, the seller can entertain other offers, but is is
> only ethical for the seller to allow the others to meet/beat.  We would not
> share offer valuations.
>
> Going through a broker provides some safety as they can hold funds in an
> escrow account and handle the distribution and settlement.
>
> Regardless of how much a boat costs, like with any real estate, it
> involves two strangers typically.
>
> If I can help a fellow C’er, drop my a private email.
>
> Neil Andersen
> 1982 C 32, FoxFire
> Rock Hall,MD
>
> Neil Andersen
> 20691 Jamieson Rd
> Rock Hall, MD 21661
>
> --
> *From:* CnC-List  on behalf of WILLIAM
> WALKER via CnC-List 
> *Sent:* Friday, April 19, 2019 9:02 PM
> *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> *Cc:* WILLIAM WALKER
> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List 35 Mk2 sea trial tomorrow - newbie advice needed
>
>
> It's probably the lawyer in me, but 1. don't give cash, 2. don't give a
> post dated check...he needs to show some trust in you, and 3. don't trust
> him not to peddle your offer.  period.  a contract is a contract.
> The deal is with you or there is no deal.  sorry, but I have seen a 1000
> go bad.
> Bill Walker
> CnC 36
>
> Bill Walker
>
>
> --
> On Friday, April 19, 2019 Shawn Wright via CnC-List 
> wrote:
>
> I have told the seller already that I have $10K in cash (from the last
> deal that went south) ready to hand him, and the rest by cheque. I will
> give him a deposit and signed offer tomorrow after the sea trial. Is 10% a
> typical deposit? I will probably give him a cheque, post-dated to the date
> of the haulout, which is when we expect to complete, unless he wants cash.
>
> He has already stated that he wouldn't tell the other buyer the price, but
> would just tell him that sorry, he has accepted a written offer. It seems
> to contradict his earlier comment where he said he'd give the other guy the
> chance to make an offer, but I think he now has serious doubts about the
> other guy actually completing. We are prepared to complete as soon as I can
> be satisfied with an inspection, sea trial, and finally a haulout
> inspection (which is scheduled for 2 weeks from now).
>
> I'm trying hard to remain emotionally neutral (lots of practice at this!)
> and be prepared to walk if something serious comes up, or adjust the price
> accordingly, but I don't expect that to happen, aside from the deck issue
> around the chainplates. This is one area where a proper survey might pay
> for itself, if the surveyor could place a dollar figure on the repair, but
> surveyors are booking a month out right now. I will still keep trying
> though, since I will need one to renew insurance in a year anyway. (the
> insurance company has already agreed to reinsure for new owner based on 4
> year old survey).
>
> I guess it's possible that something during the sea trial goes wrong also,
> but the boat is well equipped and said to sail so well, so this seems
> unlikely.
>
> Fingers crossed!
>
> On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 2:47 PM Bill Coleman via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Like they say, money talks and bullshit walks –
>
> Eg, whomever has a deposit on the boat is first in line, in anything I
> have ever dealt with.
>
>
>
> Bill Coleman
>
> C 39 Erie, PA
>
>
>
> Honestly, I would not let the seller peddle your offer to the other
> 

Re: Stus-List Replacing a CnC 44 Rudder

[Bill Coleman via CnC-List]

In the late 70’s early 80’s some C owners here were lengthening their 
rudders, there is a fellow here who interned at C in the early 70’s who 
designed the modified rudders.  I did two modifications using the existing 
shafts, and one from scratch, but not the fiberglass. The ribs were 11 Gauge SS 
in the shape of the rudder, and a 1” X 1/8” strap wrapped around that, and 
welded to the shape, making like a T section. I then layed it flat on some 
cardboard and poured foam over it, and they just sanded it down to the ribs 
using a long sandpapered 2X4.  And then someone fiber glassed them.  

My boat was owned by an older fellow at the time, and he sent it with the local 
designers sketch to Bruckmans, and they did the rudder. 

Fast forward 10 years, and I own the boat for a year and haul the boat in the 
fall with half the rudders fiberglass missing .  I brought it back to the shop 
and made a 14 gauge SS rudder, 30 or 40 pounds lighter, and still bone dry 
today.

So, there are many options.  

 

Bill Coleman

C 39 Erie, PA

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dan via 
CnC-List
Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2019 12:40 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Dan
Subject: Re: Stus-List Replacing a CnC 44 Rudder

 

Thanks everyone,

I've looked into both Foss Foam and Competition Composites. Both options are 
landing well into the $5000 cdn range (including freight) which is way beyond 
my budget. Foss Foam doesn't have a C Rudder mold but can try to "match" 
something similar which scares me a little and it's roughliey $1200 US to get 
it to Canada. Competition has a very expensive high-tech process using CAD 
software and a milling machine which I'm sure is standard for any Americas Cup 
contender but drives the price as expected.

 

Has anyone tried to re-build their own rudder? - I've been told carving 15lb 
density rigid foam and encapuslating is the way to go - like this:

http://boatprojects.blogspot.com/2011/07/rudder-rebuild.html

 

Dan

 

 

On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 9:00 AM Rod Stright via CnC-List 
 wrote:

I would suggest Competition Composites in Ontario excellent 
workmanship,Canadian 

Rod

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 18, 2019, at 4:38 PM, Dan via CnC-List  wrote:
> 
> Has any C owners on the list replaced their rudder, and if so, where did 
> you have the work done? - The price is dramatically reduced if they have an 
> existing mold to work with.
> 
> Dan Cormier
> Breakaweigh
> C
> Halifax, NS
> ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 


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Re: Stus-List Replacing a CnC 44 Rudder

[Robert Boyer via CnC-List]

Mild steel structure inside the rudder is BAD!

Bob Boyer
s/v Rainy Days
C Landfall 38 (Hull # 230)
(Presently traveling north on ICW)
blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
email: dainyr...@icloud.com

> On Apr 20, 2019, at 9:10 AM, Daniel Cormier via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Thanks Rob,
> It sounds unbelievable but I was told by the last fibreglass man to have 
> worked on my rudder that the fins/grid structure inside my rudder (original) 
> are made from MILD STEEL and welded to the stainless steel post. Where many 
> of us have wet rudders, this is obviously very very bad. I’ll send an email 
> to the list when I have the rudder open to verify this. Part of the current 
> plan is to cut these away and replace with 316 stainless fins.
> 
> Dan
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Apr 20, 2019, at 7:36 AM, Robert Boyer  wrote:
>> 
>> The metal grid structure inside the rudder is very important. On our C’s 
>> this structure is made from stainless steel plates that are welded to the 
>> stainless steel rudder shaft.  Tartan 37’s are known to have a problem with 
>> their carbon steel internal rudder plates that were welded to the stainless 
>> steel rudder shaft—the carbon steel internal structure would corrode (from 
>> inadvertent water exposure) allowing the shaft to rotate inside the rudder.  
>> 
>> Bob
>> 
>> Bob Boyer
>> s/v Rainy Days
>> C Landfall 38 (Hull # 230)
>> (Presently traveling north on ICW)
>> blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
>> email: dainyr...@icloud.com
>> 
>>> On Apr 20, 2019, at 12:39 AM, Dan via CnC-List  
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Thanks everyone,
>>> I've looked into both Foss Foam and Competition Composites. Both options 
>>> are landing well into the $5000 cdn range (including freight) which is way 
>>> beyond my budget. Foss Foam doesn't have a C Rudder mold but can try to 
>>> "match" something similar which scares me a little and it's roughliey $1200 
>>> US to get it to Canada. Competition has a very expensive high-tech process 
>>> using CAD software and a milling machine which I'm sure is standard for any 
>>> Americas Cup contender but drives the price as expected.
>>> 
>>> Has anyone tried to re-build their own rudder? - I've been told carving 
>>> 15lb density rigid foam and encapuslating is the way to go - like this:
>>> http://boatprojects.blogspot.com/2011/07/rudder-rebuild.html
>>> 
>>> Dan
>>> 
>>> 
 On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 9:00 AM Rod Stright via CnC-List 
  wrote:
 I would suggest Competition Composites in Ontario excellent 
 workmanship,Canadian 
 
 Rod
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 > On Apr 18, 2019, at 4:38 PM, Dan via CnC-List  
 > wrote:
 > 
 > Has any C owners on the list replaced their rudder, and if so, where 
 > did you have the work done? - The price is dramatically reduced if they 
 > have an existing mold to work with.
 > 
 > Dan Cormier
 > Breakaweigh
 > C
 > Halifax, NS
 > ___
 > 
 > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each 
 > and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - 
 > use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
 > 
 
 
 ___
 
 Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each 
 and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - 
 use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
 
>>> ___
>>> 
>>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
>>> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
>>> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>> 
> ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
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Re: Stus-List Leaks and ceiling panels

[ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List]

I replaced my panels with FRP (fiberglass reinforced plastic) from Home
Depot. Easy to cut with a saber saw using blades with fine teeth. I used 1"
Velcro to hold the panels in place. Liquid Nails adhesive works well, even
over adhesive, from the old Velcro, that I couldn't get off.

The water intrusion might be from hardware mounted on the cabin top. Try
rebedding all the hardware

Alan Bergen
35 Mk III Thirsty
Rose City YC
Portland, OR

On Sat, Apr 20, 2019 at 3:26 AM Adam Hayden via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hello Listers
>
> We have pretty major water intrusion coming in on the port side by the
> bulkhead in the salon of our C 36. The water is gathering on the edge of
> the fibreglass headliner and running into the storage cupboards.  I have
> rebedded the chain plates and handrails.  The stanchions are too far
> outboard.  Any suggestions?
>
> Also this has been discussed before.  Has anyone replaced ceiling panels
> and used velcro to hold them in?  What was the best material? I have
> thought of those fibreglass panels found at home depot but seems pretty
> messy to cut.
>
> Adam
>
>
>
> Get Outlook for Android
> 
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.paypal.me_stumurray=DwICAg=clK7kQUTWtAVEOVIgvi0NU5BOUHhpN0H8p7CSfnc_gI=9w3G7Cf8YfQnrjmtuNxwDJYr3JMv9f1pAfgAJ9xXYQQ=djjQUfz3EId5ksWnTjNmd7GPfxUudA_A6H0hYiEKits=owO99fN_3YYosORgwH0D5TbWdWCn9yiQzeT_2p1ADC8=
>
>
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Re: Stus-List Source for bronze

[Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List]

I suppose I could, now that you mention it.

You’re about as clever as whoever engineered the contraption in the first place.

From: Dennis C. via CnC-List 
Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2019 10:37 AM
To: CnClist 
Cc: Dennis C. 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Source for bronze

Can you simply turn the existing bronze ring over? 

Dennis C.

On Sat, Apr 20, 2019 at 9:11 AM Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List 
 wrote:

  Listers:

  I am in need of a source for a small piece of bronze, which will likely 
need to be fabricated.  On my 42, the top of the rudder post exits through the 
coaming just aft of the cockpit.  There is a simple but ingenious method of 
securing it.  There are two, small stainless steel wheels bolted to the rudder 
post which roll on the surface when the rudder turns.  They sit on a bronze 
ring that looks like a large washer that fits around the rudder post and is 
screwed onto the deck.  The bronze ring serves as the surface for the two 
wheels to roll on.  This contraption is housed in a fiberglass cover that 
screws onto the top of the rudder post.  By removing the cover, you can use the 
post for emergency steering, which, unlike a lot of boats I’ve seen, is a 
reasonably convenient location for this.

  Last year, unbeknownst to me (due to the fiberglass cover), a nut came 
off the bolt holding the wheels in place, and one of the wheels nearly came 
off.  Because the wheel was angled and not rolling flat, it started wearing a 
groove into the bronze ring.  I would like to replace the bronze ring, but 
cannot imagine this is an off-the-shelf item.  Does anyone know of a source for 
bronze for this purpose.  Without measuring, my guess is that I need a piece 
roughly 6” x 6” x 3/16” thick (or thereabouts).

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every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
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Re: Stus-List Replacing a CnC 44 Rudder

[G Collins via CnC-List]

I rebuilt mine from a bare post up, (got someone else to do the welding but did 
all the rest).  Pics sent to Dan.

Graham Collins
Secret Plans
C 35-III #11

On 2019-04-20 1:39 a.m., Dan via CnC-List wrote:
Thanks everyone,
I've looked into both Foss Foam and Competition Composites. Both options are 
landing well into the $5000 cdn range (including freight) which is way beyond 
my budget. Foss Foam doesn't have a C Rudder mold but can try to "match" 
something similar which scares me a little and it's roughliey $1200 US to get 
it to Canada. Competition has a very expensive high-tech process using CAD 
software and a milling machine which I'm sure is standard for any Americas Cup 
contender but drives the price as expected.

Has anyone tried to re-build their own rudder? - I've been told carving 15lb 
density rigid foam and encapuslating is the way to go - like this:
http://boatprojects.blogspot.com/2011/07/rudder-rebuild.html

Dan


On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 9:00 AM Rod Stright via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
I would suggest Competition Composites in Ontario excellent 
workmanship,Canadian 

Rod

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 18, 2019, at 4:38 PM, Dan via CnC-List 
> mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>
> Has any C owners on the list replaced their rudder, and if so, where did 
> you have the work done? - The price is dramatically reduced if they have an 
> existing mold to work with.
>
> Dan Cormier
> Breakaweigh
> C
> Halifax, NS
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>


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to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray


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Re: Stus-List Source for bronze

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

Can you simply turn the existing bronze ring over?

Dennis C.

On Sat, Apr 20, 2019 at 9:11 AM Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Listers:
>
> I am in need of a source for a small piece of bronze, which will
> likely need to be fabricated.  On my 42, the top of the rudder post exits
> through the coaming just aft of the cockpit.  There is a simple but
> ingenious method of securing it.  There are two, small stainless steel
> wheels bolted to the rudder post which roll on the surface when the rudder
> turns.  They sit on a bronze ring that looks like a large washer that fits
> around the rudder post and is screwed onto the deck.  The bronze ring
> serves as the surface for the two wheels to roll on.  This contraption is
> housed in a fiberglass cover that screws onto the top of the rudder post.
> By removing the cover, you can use the post for emergency steering, which,
> unlike a lot of boats I’ve seen, is a reasonably convenient location for
> this.
>
> Last year, unbeknownst to me (due to the fiberglass cover), a nut came
> off the bolt holding the wheels in place, and one of the wheels nearly came
> off.  Because the wheel was angled and not rolling flat, it started wearing
> a groove into the bronze ring.  I would like to replace the bronze ring,
> but cannot imagine this is an off-the-shelf item.  Does anyone know of a
> source for bronze for this purpose.  Without measuring, my guess is that I
> need a piece roughly 6” x 6” x 3/16” thick (or thereabouts).
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
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Re: Stus-List Source for bronze

[Ken Heaton via CnC-List]

I imagine a machine shop could rebuild the missing bronze through bronze
welding using something like a silicon bronze tig rod and then machine the
top flat again?

Or check with Edson Marine?  They may have something?

Ken H,



On Sat, 20 Apr 2019 at 11:11, Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Listers:
>
> I am in need of a source for a small piece of bronze, which will
> likely need to be fabricated.  On my 42, the top of the rudder post exits
> through the coaming just aft of the cockpit.  There is a simple but
> ingenious method of securing it.  There are two, small stainless steel
> wheels bolted to the rudder post which roll on the surface when the rudder
> turns.  They sit on a bronze ring that looks like a large washer that fits
> around the rudder post and is screwed onto the deck.  The bronze ring
> serves as the surface for the two wheels to roll on.  This contraption is
> housed in a fiberglass cover that screws onto the top of the rudder post.
> By removing the cover, you can use the post for emergency steering, which,
> unlike a lot of boats I’ve seen, is a reasonably convenient location for
> this.
>
> Last year, unbeknownst to me (due to the fiberglass cover), a nut came
> off the bolt holding the wheels in place, and one of the wheels nearly came
> off.  Because the wheel was angled and not rolling flat, it started wearing
> a groove into the bronze ring.  I would like to replace the bronze ring,
> but cannot imagine this is an off-the-shelf item.  Does anyone know of a
> source for bronze for this purpose.  Without measuring, my guess is that I
> need a piece roughly 6” x 6” x 3/16” thick (or thereabouts).
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
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Stus-List Leaks and ceiling panels

[Len Mitchell via CnC-List]

Adam, our 1981 36 had a tiny amount of water traveling from the opening port in 
the head but it could be from any fitting nearby on your port side. It’s a 
difficult place to diagnose a leak. It would travel down the bottom of the 
bulkhead in the recess moulded for the bulkhead. Took me a long time to 
pinpoint the problem but I ended up using a water hose and lightly spraying the 
deck to simulate rain checking each deck fitting starting with the chainplates. 
Our ceiling panels were not an issue. Have you looked at automotive vinyl to 
recover the pieces, if I remember correctly that’s what mine looked like. Len

Sent from my iPad
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Stus-List Source for bronze

[Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List]

Listers:

I am in need of a source for a small piece of bronze, which will likely 
need to be fabricated.  On my 42, the top of the rudder post exits through the 
coaming just aft of the cockpit.  There is a simple but ingenious method of 
securing it.  There are two, small stainless steel wheels bolted to the rudder 
post which roll on the surface when the rudder turns.  They sit on a bronze 
ring that looks like a large washer that fits around the rudder post and is 
screwed onto the deck.  The bronze ring serves as the surface for the two 
wheels to roll on.  This contraption is housed in a fiberglass cover that 
screws onto the top of the rudder post.  By removing the cover, you can use the 
post for emergency steering, which, unlike a lot of boats I’ve seen, is a 
reasonably convenient location for this.

Last year, unbeknownst to me (due to the fiberglass cover), a nut came off 
the bolt holding the wheels in place, and one of the wheels nearly came off.  
Because the wheel was angled and not rolling flat, it started wearing a groove 
into the bronze ring.  I would like to replace the bronze ring, but cannot 
imagine this is an off-the-shelf item.  Does anyone know of a source for bronze 
for this purpose.  Without measuring, my guess is that I need a piece roughly 
6” x 6” x 3/16” thick (or thereabouts).

___

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every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
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Re: Stus-List Replacing a CnC 44 Rudder

[Dr. Mark Bodnar via CnC-List]

  
  
I've not rebuilt a rudder - but I've seen on one youtube.
Not sure if you're familiar with Sail Life channel - Mads is
  rebuilding a boat and does a mold of his existing rudder before. 
  He makes it look manageable.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IjN9Sgm2qs
Mark



-
Dr. Mark Bodnar, BSc, DC, FCCPOR(C)
  Chiropractic Rehabilitation Specialist
Bedford Chiropractic  www.BedfordChiro.ca
-

There is no cure for birth and death save to enjoy the interval.
  - George Santayana
On 2019-04-20 1:39 a.m., Dan via
  CnC-List wrote:


  
  

  
Thanks everyone,
  I've looked into both Foss Foam and Competition
Composites. Both options are landing well into the $5000
cdn range (including freight) which is way beyond my
budget. Foss Foam doesn't have a C Rudder mold
but can try to "match" something similar which scares me
a little and it's roughliey $1200 US to get it to
Canada. Competition has a very expensive high-tech
process using CAD software and a milling machine which
I'm sure is standard for any Americas Cup contender but
drives the price as expected.
  
  
  Has anyone tried to re-build their own rudder? - I've
been told carving 15lb density rigid foam and
encapuslating is the way to go - like this:
  http://boatprojects.blogspot.com/2011/07/rudder-rebuild.html
  
  
  Dan
  
  

  

  
  
  
On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 9:00
  AM Rod Stright via CnC-List  wrote:

I
  would suggest Competition Composites in Ontario excellent
  workmanship,Canadian 
  
  Rod
  
  Sent from my iPhone
  
  > On Apr 18, 2019, at 4:38 PM, Dan via CnC-List  wrote:
  > 
  > Has any C owners on the list replaced their
  rudder, and if so, where did you have the work done? - The
  price is dramatically reduced if they have an existing mold to
  work with.
  > 
  > Dan Cormier
  > Breakaweigh
  > C
  > Halifax, NS
  > ___
  > 
  > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your
  contributions.  Each and every one is greatly appreciated.  If
  you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution
  --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
  > 
  
  
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  contributions.  Each and every one is greatly appreciated.  If
  you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution
  --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
  

  
  
  
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Re: Stus-List 35 Mk2 sea trial tomorrow - newbie advice needed

[Neil Andersen via CnC-List]

Just a point of clarification, I don’t think I was as clear as I could have 
been.

There is a difference between acceptance of offer by the seller and acceptance 
of vessel.  Receiving multiple offers is reasonable until an offer is accepted. 
 Once the offer is accepted by the seller, any subsequent offers should only be 
accepted as a backup.

Neil

Neil Andersen
20691 Jamieson Rd
Rock Hall, MD 21661


From: Neil Andersen 
Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2019 8:04 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com; cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: WILLIAM WALKER
Subject: Re: Stus-List 35 Mk2 sea trial tomorrow - newbie advice needed

I had to weigh in again.  I’m a broker.  We use the YBAA standard contract 
which is buyer friendly.  Until the buyer signs an acceptance, they are not 
committed.  The offer is accompanied by a 10% refundable deposit.  Before the 
vessel is accepted, the seller can entertain other offers, but is is only 
ethical for the seller to allow the others to meet/beat.  We would not share 
offer valuations.

Going through a broker provides some safety as they can hold funds in an escrow 
account and handle the distribution and settlement.

Regardless of how much a boat costs, like with any real estate, it involves two 
strangers typically.

If I can help a fellow C’er, drop my a private email.

Neil Andersen
1982 C 32, FoxFire
Rock Hall,MD

Neil Andersen
20691 Jamieson Rd
Rock Hall, MD 21661


From: CnC-List  on behalf of WILLIAM WALKER via 
CnC-List 
Sent: Friday, April 19, 2019 9:02 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: WILLIAM WALKER
Subject: Re: Stus-List 35 Mk2 sea trial tomorrow - newbie advice needed


It's probably the lawyer in me, but 1. don't give cash, 2. don't give a post 
dated check...he needs to show some trust in you, and 3. don't trust him not to 
peddle your offer.  period.  a contract is a contract.
The deal is with you or there is no deal.  sorry, but I have seen a 1000 go bad.
Bill Walker
CnC 36


Bill Walker



On Friday, April 19, 2019 Shawn Wright via CnC-List  
wrote:

I have told the seller already that I have $10K in cash (from the last deal 
that went south) ready to hand him, and the rest by cheque. I will give him a 
deposit and signed offer tomorrow after the sea trial. Is 10% a typical 
deposit? I will probably give him a cheque, post-dated to the date of the 
haulout, which is when we expect to complete, unless he wants cash.

He has already stated that he wouldn't tell the other buyer the price, but 
would just tell him that sorry, he has accepted a written offer. It seems to 
contradict his earlier comment where he said he'd give the other guy the chance 
to make an offer, but I think he now has serious doubts about the other guy 
actually completing. We are prepared to complete as soon as I can be satisfied 
with an inspection, sea trial, and finally a haulout inspection (which is 
scheduled for 2 weeks from now).

I'm trying hard to remain emotionally neutral (lots of practice at this!) and 
be prepared to walk if something serious comes up, or adjust the price 
accordingly, but I don't expect that to happen, aside from the deck issue 
around the chainplates. This is one area where a proper survey might pay for 
itself, if the surveyor could place a dollar figure on the repair, but 
surveyors are booking a month out right now. I will still keep trying though, 
since I will need one to renew insurance in a year anyway. (the insurance 
company has already agreed to reinsure for new owner based on 4 year old 
survey).

I guess it's possible that something during the sea trial goes wrong also, but 
the boat is well equipped and said to sail so well, so this seems unlikely.

Fingers crossed!

On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 2:47 PM Bill Coleman via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:

Like they say, money talks and bullshit walks –

Eg, whomever has a deposit on the boat is first in line, in anything I have 
ever dealt with.



Bill Coleman

C 39 Erie, PA



Honestly, I would not let the seller peddle your offer to the other buyer.  
Tell seller if he accepts your offer you expect to hold him to it.  If he feels 
he needs to give other buyer a last shot, he should say to him, sign a contract 
or I am moving on to next in line...

Bill Walker



On Friday, April 19, 2019 Gary Russell via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:

Hi Shawn,

 The 35 Mk II is a fantastic boat (I owned one), but purchasing without a 
survey is quite risky.  You seem to understand that, so I won't belabor the 
point.



 Dennis is right (usually is), the tabbing of the forward bulkhead can be 
an issue, but is not particularly difficult or expensive to fix.  Mine was 
broken, but I fixed it myself and never had any more problems.  I would be more 
concerned about the balsa coring in the deck.  Without the proper tools 
(moisture meter), I don't know how you are 

Re: Stus-List Leaks and ceiling panels

[Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List]

Adam:

I re-did the ceiling panels on my 34, which I suspect were very similar to 
your 36.  I used the old panels, which were thin ply covered with a headliner 
material.  I removed the old headliner material (it was stapled on as I 
recall)), cleaned up the panels, applied West System to the interior side of 
the panel, recovered them with new headliner, and put them back in place.  At 
first I used “regular” velcro (the fuzzy stuff), but the adhesive was not up to 
the task.  I then used the thicker 3M “velcro” (or whatever it’s called) that 
is clear plastic with large interlocking pieces.  It’s the same stuff that’s 
provided to mount an EZ Pass transducer to a car windshield.  It not only held 
the panels, but I did not need to apply it all around the panel edge.  I found 
I could use smaller pieces more sparingly.

I keep a roll of that 3M stuff on my boat.  It comes in handy for all sorts 
of things.

From: Adam Hayden via CnC-List 
Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2019 6:26 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Adam Hayden 
Subject: Stus-List Leaks and ceiling panels

Hello Listers


We have pretty major water intrusion coming in on the port side by the bulkhead 
in the salon of our C 36. The water is gathering on the edge of the 
fibreglass headliner and running into the storage cupboards.  I have rebedded 
the chain plates and handrails.  The stanchions are too far outboard.  Any 
suggestions?


Also this has been discussed before.  Has anyone replaced ceiling panels and 
used velcro to hold them in?  What was the best material? I have thought of 
those fibreglass panels found at home depot but seems pretty messy to cut.  


Adam




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Re: Stus-List Replacing a CnC 44 Rudder

[Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List]

Dan:

I’ve reported on this before so I apologize for boring everybody.

I had high moisture readings in the rudder on my 42 when I bought the boat. 
 We did not open it up to inspect the metal (stainless vs. regular), so I can’t 
comment about this issue.  In my case, we drilled a number of holes in a 
pattern on one side of the rudder, through the core, until the bit hit glass on 
the other side.  We then made a “coffin/oven” out of plywood to house the 
rudder over the winter, and heated the inside to 200 degrees or thereabouts.  
After baking the rudder for a few months, we tested it with the moisture meter 
and, voila, it was dry.  We then filled the holes with West System, and covered 
the rudder with numerous layers of Interprotect before painting.  So far, so 
good.

Matt
C 42 Custom   

From: Dan via CnC-List 
Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2019 12:39 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Dan 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Replacing a CnC 44 Rudder

Thanks everyone, 
I've looked into both Foss Foam and Competition Composites. Both options are 
landing well into the $5000 cdn range (including freight) which is way beyond 
my budget. Foss Foam doesn't have a C Rudder mold but can try to "match" 
something similar which scares me a little and it's roughliey $1200 US to get 
it to Canada. Competition has a very expensive high-tech process using CAD 
software and a milling machine which I'm sure is standard for any Americas Cup 
contender but drives the price as expected.

Has anyone tried to re-build their own rudder? - I've been told carving 15lb 
density rigid foam and encapuslating is the way to go - like this:
http://boatprojects.blogspot.com/2011/07/rudder-rebuild.html

Dan


On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 9:00 AM Rod Stright via CnC-List 
 wrote:

  I would suggest Competition Composites in Ontario excellent 
workmanship,Canadian 

  Rod

  Sent from my iPhone

  > On Apr 18, 2019, at 4:38 PM, Dan via CnC-List  wrote:
  > 
  > Has any C owners on the list replaced their rudder, and if so, where 
did you have the work done? - The price is dramatically reduced if they have an 
existing mold to work with.
  > 
  > Dan Cormier
  > Breakaweigh
  > C
  > Halifax, NS
  > ___
  > 
  > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
  > 


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Re: Stus-List Replacing a CnC 44 Rudder

[Ken Heaton via CnC-List]

By 1990 they were shown in the construction drawing as 3' x 1/16" stainless
steel straps welded to a stainless steel rudder post, according to this:
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-GXI7YFjZL8c/WZoTeVoH5wI/AAABmME/SwETqRlQXgsaotrBTiRb75X0xlBNQ_oXACLcBGAs/s1600/Rudder%2BDesign%2B%2526%2BHull%2BLaminate%2BSchedules%2B-%2B1990.jpg

Ken H.

On Sat, 20 Apr 2019 at 10:11, Daniel Cormier via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Thanks Rob,
> It sounds unbelievable but I was told by the last fibreglass man to have
> worked on my rudder that the fins/grid structure inside my rudder
> (original) are made from MILD STEEL and welded to the stainless steel post.
> Where many of us have wet rudders, this is obviously very very bad. I’ll
> send an email to the list when I have the rudder open to verify this. Part
> of the current plan is to cut these away and replace with 316 stainless
> fins.
>
> Dan
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Apr 20, 2019, at 7:36 AM, Robert Boyer  wrote:
>
> The metal grid structure inside the rudder is very important. On our C’s
> this structure is made from stainless steel plates that are welded to the
> stainless steel rudder shaft.  Tartan 37’s are known to have a problem with
> their carbon steel internal rudder plates that were welded to the stainless
> steel rudder shaft—the carbon steel internal structure would corrode (from
> inadvertent water exposure) allowing the shaft to rotate inside the rudder.
>
>
> Bob
>
> Bob Boyer
> s/v Rainy Days
> C Landfall 38 (Hull # 230)
> (Presently traveling north on ICW)
> blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
> email: dainyr...@icloud.com
>
> On Apr 20, 2019, at 12:39 AM, Dan via CnC-List 
> wrote:
>
> Thanks everyone,
> I've looked into both Foss Foam and Competition Composites. Both options
> are landing well into the $5000 cdn range (including freight) which is way
> beyond my budget. Foss Foam doesn't have a C Rudder mold but can try to
> "match" something similar which scares me a little and it's roughliey $1200
> US to get it to Canada. Competition has a very expensive high-tech process
> using CAD software and a milling machine which I'm sure is standard for any
> Americas Cup contender but drives the price as expected.
>
> Has anyone tried to re-build their own rudder? - I've been told carving
> 15lb density rigid foam and encapuslating is the way to go - like this:
> http://boatprojects.blogspot.com/2011/07/rudder-rebuild.html
>
> Dan
>
>
> On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 9:00 AM Rod Stright via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>> I would suggest Competition Composites in Ontario excellent
>> workmanship,Canadian 
>>
>> Rod
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> > On Apr 18, 2019, at 4:38 PM, Dan via CnC-List 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > Has any C owners on the list replaced their rudder, and if so,
>> where did you have the work done? - The price is dramatically reduced if
>> they have an existing mold to work with.
>> >
>> > Dan Cormier
>> > Breakaweigh
>> > C
>> > Halifax, NS
>> > ___
>> >
>> > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
>> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
>> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>> >
>>
>>
>> ___
>>
>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
>> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
>> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>
>> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
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Re: Stus-List Leaks and ceiling panels

[bwhitmore via CnC-List]

Could the problem be from leaking grab rails or fixed ports where the water is 
getting behind the head liner and running down?  I would suspect the grab rails 
before anything else.Just a thought,Sent from Samsung tablet.
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Re: Stus-List Leaks and ceiling panels

[bwhitmore via CnC-List]

Hello all,Just FYI, most larger cities will have a plastics distributor who 
will sell retail.  When I needed 1/2" bronze plexiglass for our sliding and 
fixed hatch (the slider is now done but I haven't done the fixed hatch yet), I 
was able to order it and get it locally.  I paid sales tax, but avoided the 
shipping.You might want to check into that before ordering from McMaster 
Carr.Just a thought,Bruce WhitmoreC 37/40+ "Astralis"Sent from Samsung tablet.
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Re: Stus-List Replacing a CnC 44 Rudder

[Daniel Cormier via CnC-List]

Thanks Rob,
It sounds unbelievable but I was told by the last fibreglass man to have worked 
on my rudder that the fins/grid structure inside my rudder (original) are made 
from MILD STEEL and welded to the stainless steel post. Where many of us have 
wet rudders, this is obviously very very bad. I’ll send an email to the list 
when I have the rudder open to verify this. Part of the current plan is to cut 
these away and replace with 316 stainless fins.

Dan

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 20, 2019, at 7:36 AM, Robert Boyer  wrote:
> 
> The metal grid structure inside the rudder is very important. On our C’s 
> this structure is made from stainless steel plates that are welded to the 
> stainless steel rudder shaft.  Tartan 37’s are known to have a problem with 
> their carbon steel internal rudder plates that were welded to the stainless 
> steel rudder shaft—the carbon steel internal structure would corrode (from 
> inadvertent water exposure) allowing the shaft to rotate inside the rudder. 
> 
> Bob
> 
> Bob Boyer
> s/v Rainy Days
> C Landfall 38 (Hull # 230)
> (Presently traveling north on ICW)
> blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
> email: dainyr...@icloud.com
> 
>> On Apr 20, 2019, at 12:39 AM, Dan via CnC-List  wrote:
>> 
>> Thanks everyone,
>> I've looked into both Foss Foam and Competition Composites. Both options are 
>> landing well into the $5000 cdn range (including freight) which is way 
>> beyond my budget. Foss Foam doesn't have a C Rudder mold but can try to 
>> "match" something similar which scares me a little and it's roughliey $1200 
>> US to get it to Canada. Competition has a very expensive high-tech process 
>> using CAD software and a milling machine which I'm sure is standard for any 
>> Americas Cup contender but drives the price as expected.
>> 
>> Has anyone tried to re-build their own rudder? - I've been told carving 15lb 
>> density rigid foam and encapuslating is the way to go - like this:
>> http://boatprojects.blogspot.com/2011/07/rudder-rebuild.html
>> 
>> Dan
>> 
>> 
>>> On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 9:00 AM Rod Stright via CnC-List 
>>>  wrote:
>>> I would suggest Competition Composites in Ontario excellent 
>>> workmanship,Canadian 
>>> 
>>> Rod
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> > On Apr 18, 2019, at 4:38 PM, Dan via CnC-List  
>>> > wrote:
>>> > 
>>> > Has any C owners on the list replaced their rudder, and if so, where 
>>> > did you have the work done? - The price is dramatically reduced if they 
>>> > have an existing mold to work with.
>>> > 
>>> > Dan Cormier
>>> > Breakaweigh
>>> > C
>>> > Halifax, NS
>>> > ___
>>> > 
>>> > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each 
>>> > and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - 
>>> > use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>> > 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> 
>>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
>>> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
>>> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
>> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
>> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>> 
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Re: Stus-List 35 Mk2 sea trial tomorrow - newbie advice needed

[Neil Andersen via CnC-List]

I had to weigh in again.  I’m a broker.  We use the YBAA standard contract 
which is buyer friendly.  Until the buyer signs an acceptance, they are not 
committed.  The offer is accompanied by a 10% refundable deposit.  Before the 
vessel is accepted, the seller can entertain other offers, but is is only 
ethical for the seller to allow the others to meet/beat.  We would not share 
offer valuations.

Going through a broker provides some safety as they can hold funds in an escrow 
account and handle the distribution and settlement.

Regardless of how much a boat costs, like with any real estate, it involves two 
strangers typically.

If I can help a fellow C’er, drop my a private email.

Neil Andersen
1982 C 32, FoxFire
Rock Hall,MD

Neil Andersen
20691 Jamieson Rd
Rock Hall, MD 21661


From: CnC-List  on behalf of WILLIAM WALKER via 
CnC-List 
Sent: Friday, April 19, 2019 9:02 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: WILLIAM WALKER
Subject: Re: Stus-List 35 Mk2 sea trial tomorrow - newbie advice needed


It's probably the lawyer in me, but 1. don't give cash, 2. don't give a post 
dated check...he needs to show some trust in you, and 3. don't trust him not to 
peddle your offer.  period.  a contract is a contract.
The deal is with you or there is no deal.  sorry, but I have seen a 1000 go bad.
Bill Walker
CnC 36


Bill Walker



On Friday, April 19, 2019 Shawn Wright via CnC-List  
wrote:

I have told the seller already that I have $10K in cash (from the last deal 
that went south) ready to hand him, and the rest by cheque. I will give him a 
deposit and signed offer tomorrow after the sea trial. Is 10% a typical 
deposit? I will probably give him a cheque, post-dated to the date of the 
haulout, which is when we expect to complete, unless he wants cash.

He has already stated that he wouldn't tell the other buyer the price, but 
would just tell him that sorry, he has accepted a written offer. It seems to 
contradict his earlier comment where he said he'd give the other guy the chance 
to make an offer, but I think he now has serious doubts about the other guy 
actually completing. We are prepared to complete as soon as I can be satisfied 
with an inspection, sea trial, and finally a haulout inspection (which is 
scheduled for 2 weeks from now).

I'm trying hard to remain emotionally neutral (lots of practice at this!) and 
be prepared to walk if something serious comes up, or adjust the price 
accordingly, but I don't expect that to happen, aside from the deck issue 
around the chainplates. This is one area where a proper survey might pay for 
itself, if the surveyor could place a dollar figure on the repair, but 
surveyors are booking a month out right now. I will still keep trying though, 
since I will need one to renew insurance in a year anyway. (the insurance 
company has already agreed to reinsure for new owner based on 4 year old 
survey).

I guess it's possible that something during the sea trial goes wrong also, but 
the boat is well equipped and said to sail so well, so this seems unlikely.

Fingers crossed!

On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 2:47 PM Bill Coleman via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:

Like they say, money talks and bullshit walks –

Eg, whomever has a deposit on the boat is first in line, in anything I have 
ever dealt with.



Bill Coleman

C 39 Erie, PA



Honestly, I would not let the seller peddle your offer to the other buyer.  
Tell seller if he accepts your offer you expect to hold him to it.  If he feels 
he needs to give other buyer a last shot, he should say to him, sign a contract 
or I am moving on to next in line...

Bill Walker



On Friday, April 19, 2019 Gary Russell via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:

Hi Shawn,

 The 35 Mk II is a fantastic boat (I owned one), but purchasing without a 
survey is quite risky.  You seem to understand that, so I won't belabor the 
point.



 Dennis is right (usually is), the tabbing of the forward bulkhead can be 
an issue, but is not particularly difficult or expensive to fix.  Mine was 
broken, but I fixed it myself and never had any more problems.  I would be more 
concerned about the balsa coring in the deck.  Without the proper tools 
(moisture meter), I don't know how you are going to check for that.  You can 
tap on the deck with the handle of a screwdriver, listening for the softer 
sound, but without experience, I'm not sure how successful you will be.  Do you 
have access to the mechanical inspection?  Replacing the engine or transmission 
for whatever reason can be very expensive.  Should at least do an oil analysis 
of the engine and transmission as well as a compression check of the engine.  
Are you experienced enough to evaluate the condition of the sails.  Even if 
they don't have rips or holes in them, it doesn't mean they are not all bagged 
out and useless.  A decent main sail might cost you 

Re: Stus-List Leaks and ceiling panels

[Neil Andersen via CnC-List]

To help locate were the water is coming from we used the washable magic marker 
like you get for kids and ran it along under the deck/hull joint.  The marker 
line “runs” in areas where water goes.   I imagine you can use the approach 
anywhere you suspect a problem.

We ran our “line” in the cabinets high enough that you didn’t see it unless you 
looked.  Make sure you use the wide markers, it makes it easier to see.

Neil Andersen
1982 C 32, FoxFire
Rock Hall, MD

Neil Andersen
20691 Jamieson Rd
Rock Hall, MD 21661


From: CnC-List  on behalf of Adam Hayden via 
CnC-List 
Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2019 6:26 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Adam Hayden
Subject: Stus-List Leaks and ceiling panels

Hello Listers

We have pretty major water intrusion coming in on the port side by the bulkhead 
in the salon of our C 36. The water is gathering on the edge of the 
fibreglass headliner and running into the storage cupboards.  I have rebedded 
the chain plates and handrails.  The stanchions are too far outboard.  Any 
suggestions?

Also this has been discussed before.  Has anyone replaced ceiling panels and 
used velcro to hold them in?  What was the best material? I have thought of 
those fibreglass panels found at home depot but seems pretty messy to cut.

Adam



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Re: Stus-List Leaks and ceiling panels

[Nathan Post via CnC-List]

Hi Adam,

I replaced my ceiling panels with 3/16 starboard.  Tho fiberglass wall panels 
from Home Depot are very flimsy so I was concerned they would rattle or sag 
over time if I didn’t laminate them to something else. Starboard was easy to 
cut on my table saw and round the corners with a router or hand plane.  I used 
the old panels as a template. Starboard is a bit heavier than the original 
plywood but it isn’t that big a difference.  I Screwed them back in with flat 
head sheet metal screws and stainless steel decorative washers.  Reasonably 
happy with the result and should be maintenance free.  Get the starboard from 
McMastercarr they have the 3/16 and it is - lot cheaper than the boat places 
generally. Since shipping was a lot for a big sheet I did the larger panels in 
two pieces out of 2x4 foot stock if I remember correctly.  The white panels 
help to brighten the interior a lot.

Not sure what to tell you on the leaks - I am having similar problems with 
water getting in above the port bulkhead (and elsewhere) and haven’t solved it 
yet either.  Wondering if it might be coming in around the mast collar plate. 
Need to investigate further at some point. 

- -
Nathan Post
S/V Wisper C
Lynn MA, USA

> On Apr 20, 2019, at 6:26 AM, Adam Hayden via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Hello Listers
> 
> We have pretty major water intrusion coming in on the port side by the 
> bulkhead in the salon of our C 36. The water is gathering on the edge of 
> the fibreglass headliner and running into the storage cupboards.  I have 
> rebedded the chain plates and handrails.  The stanchions are too far 
> outboard.  Any suggestions?
> 
> Also this has been discussed before.  Has anyone replaced ceiling panels and 
> used velcro to hold them in?  What was the best material? I have thought of 
> those fibreglass panels found at home depot but seems pretty messy to cut.  
> 
> Adam
> 
> 
> 
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Re: Stus-List Leaks and ceiling panels

[james via CnC-List]

Adam,

I replaced my ceiling panels with new ones cut from "Foamed PVC Board". 
The only trouble I had was that the old adhesive from the original 
velcro was impossible to remove and the new velcro didn't stick to it 
very well. My solution was to use 2" velcro.


James

"Delaney" 1976 C 38

Oriental, NC

On 4/20/2019 6:26 AM, Adam Hayden via CnC-List wrote:

Hello Listers

We have pretty major water intrusion coming in on the port side by the 
bulkhead in the salon of our C 36. The water is gathering on the 
edge of the fibreglass headliner and running into the storage 
cupboards.  I have rebedded the chain plates and handrails.  The 
stanchions are too far outboard.  Any suggestions?


Also this has been discussed before.  Has anyone replaced ceiling 
panels and used velcro to hold them in?  What was the best material? I 
have thought of those fibreglass panels found at home depot but seems 
pretty messy to cut.


Adam



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Re: Stus-List Replacing a CnC 44 Rudder

[Robert Boyer via CnC-List]

The metal grid structure inside the rudder is very important. On our C’s this 
structure is made from stainless steel plates that are welded to the stainless 
steel rudder shaft.  Tartan 37’s are known to have a problem with their carbon 
steel internal rudder plates that were welded to the stainless steel rudder 
shaft—the carbon steel internal structure would corrode (from inadvertent water 
exposure) allowing the shaft to rotate inside the rudder.  

Bob

Bob Boyer
s/v Rainy Days
C Landfall 38 (Hull # 230)
(Presently traveling north on ICW)
blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
email: dainyr...@icloud.com

> On Apr 20, 2019, at 12:39 AM, Dan via CnC-List  wrote:
> 
> Thanks everyone,
> I've looked into both Foss Foam and Competition Composites. Both options are 
> landing well into the $5000 cdn range (including freight) which is way beyond 
> my budget. Foss Foam doesn't have a C Rudder mold but can try to "match" 
> something similar which scares me a little and it's roughliey $1200 US to get 
> it to Canada. Competition has a very expensive high-tech process using CAD 
> software and a milling machine which I'm sure is standard for any Americas 
> Cup contender but drives the price as expected.
> 
> Has anyone tried to re-build their own rudder? - I've been told carving 15lb 
> density rigid foam and encapuslating is the way to go - like this:
> http://boatprojects.blogspot.com/2011/07/rudder-rebuild.html
> 
> Dan
> 
> 
>> On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 9:00 AM Rod Stright via CnC-List 
>>  wrote:
>> I would suggest Competition Composites in Ontario excellent 
>> workmanship,Canadian 
>> 
>> Rod
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> > On Apr 18, 2019, at 4:38 PM, Dan via CnC-List  
>> > wrote:
>> > 
>> > Has any C owners on the list replaced their rudder, and if so, where 
>> > did you have the work done? - The price is dramatically reduced if they 
>> > have an existing mold to work with.
>> > 
>> > Dan Cormier
>> > Breakaweigh
>> > C
>> > Halifax, NS
>> > ___
>> > 
>> > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each 
>> > and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - 
>> > use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>> > 
>> 
>> 
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>> 
>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
>> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
>> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>> 
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> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
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every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
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Stus-List Leaks and ceiling panels

[Adam Hayden via CnC-List]

Hello Listers

We have pretty major water intrusion coming in on the port side by the bulkhead 
in the salon of our C 36. The water is gathering on the edge of the 
fibreglass headliner and running into the storage cupboards.  I have rebedded 
the chain plates and handrails.  The stanchions are too far outboard.  Any 
suggestions?

Also this has been discussed before.  Has anyone replaced ceiling panels and 
used velcro to hold them in?  What was the best material? I have thought of 
those fibreglass panels found at home depot but seems pretty messy to cut.

Adam



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Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray