Stus-List Re: adding tracks to deck

[CHARLES SCHEAFFER via CnC-List]

Hey Ron,
3M Heavy Duty clear Shipping Tape; Walmart, CVS, most anywhere.  Clean surface 
first with a solvent like acetone, let dry before applying tape.  Works great.  
If the hole is bigger than 3/4", apply a second piece like a cross.  When you 
remove the tape, the hole will be flush and smooth.  

I use West Epoxy and 404 high density filler cause it's offwhite and stronger 
than the others.

Chuck Scheaffer Resolute 1989 34R, near Annapolis

> On 02/16/2021 9:46 PM Martin DeYoung via CnC-List  
> wrote:
>  
>  
> 
> Ron,  as part of Calypso’s way too long restoration project we have 
> filled over 250 deck holes with different viscosities of epoxy.
> 
>  
> 
> In short we found most tapes to provide poor sealing of the hole allowing 
> lower viscosity epoxy to drip/ooze out.  Early on in our learning process I 
> had lots of epoxy in my hair.
> 
>  
> 
> -Use a thick (high viscosity) 5 minute epoxy to seal the bottom of the 
> hole.  Works great but you will need to watch for bubbles forming in the hole.
> 
> -Use a wide packing tape on smooth surfaces.  Has worked well with epoxy 
> made thick with Cabosil and other fillers, both high and low density.  We 
> used ground glass fibers for holes that would not be used again.  For holes 
> that needed small repairs and sealing prior to being re-used we would pick a 
> West Systems low density filler like 407 or 410.  For particularly structural 
> hole repairs we cut round pieces of glass cloth to help fill the holes.
> 
> -use a small piece of mylar or similar “slippery” film and a quick drying 
> masking compound.  I got our mylar and masking compound from electrical 
> manufacturing sources back when I was involved with that industry.  If you 
> are interested I will look up the manufacturer of the masking compound.
> 
>  
> 
> For blind holes, thicken epoxy can be forced up with the same squeeze 
> tube used by cake decorators.  Get the thicker film type.  A quick hack is to 
> use a zip-lock bag and cut out the corner.
> 
>  
> 
> To avoid boring those listers not excited about mixing epoxy, let me know 
> if you want to dig deeper into the topic of the epoxy hole filling arts 
> offline.
> 
>  
> 
> Martin DeYoung
> 
> Calypso
> 
> 1971 C 43
> 
> Now Seattle
> 
> Soon Port Ludlow (after 2 months in the Port Townsend yard for paint)
> 
>  
> 
> From: Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Sent: Tuesday, February 16, 2021 3:26 PM
> To: Matthew via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Ronald B. Frerker mailto:rbfrer...@yahoo.com
> Subject: Stus-List Re: adding tracks to deck
> 
>  
> 
> Do you do anything special to keep the epoxy in place until you can put 
> some tape under the glob?
> 
> Ron
> 
> Wild Cheri
> 
> C 30-1
> 
> STL
> 
>  
> 
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help 
> with the costs involved. If you want to show your support to the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray Thanks - Stu
> 
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

[John and Maryann Read via CnC-List]

Our OEM Yanmar is 3GM30 now 39 years old.  24 HP.  35 amp alternator.  Kanzaki 
tranny with 2.61 reduction swinging martec 2 blade folding prop.  Runs like a 
champ, smooth and quiet.  Power is just right and enough for headwinds and seas 
 There are several on ebay

 

If changing engine especially the brand be sure to account for changes to 
engine beds so it properly aligns as well as electric cables, throttle and 
shift cables, exhaust muffler and piping etc etc etc

 

Best of luck

 

John and Maryann

Legacy III

1982 C 34

Noank, CT

 

 

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: adding tracks to deck

[Martin DeYoung via CnC-List]

Ron,  as part of Calypso’s way too long restoration project we have filled over 
250 deck holes with different viscosities of epoxy.

In short we found most tapes to provide poor sealing of the hole allowing lower 
viscosity epoxy to drip/ooze out.  Early on in our learning process I had lots 
of epoxy in my hair.

-Use a thick (high viscosity) 5 minute epoxy to seal the bottom of the hole.  
Works great but you will need to watch for bubbles forming in the hole.
-Use a wide packing tape on smooth surfaces.  Has worked well with epoxy made 
thick with Cabosil and other fillers, both high and low density.  We used 
ground glass fibers for holes that would not be used again.  For holes that 
needed small repairs and sealing prior to being re-used we would pick a West 
Systems low density filler like 407 or 410.  For particularly structural hole 
repairs we cut round pieces of glass cloth to help fill the holes.
-use a small piece of mylar or similar “slippery” film and a quick drying 
masking compound.  I got our mylar and masking compound from electrical 
manufacturing sources back when I was involved with that industry.  If you are 
interested I will look up the manufacturer of the masking compound.

For blind holes, thicken epoxy can be forced up with the same squeeze tube used 
by cake decorators.  Get the thicker film type.  A quick hack is to use a 
zip-lock bag and cut out the corner.

To avoid boring those listers not excited about mixing epoxy, let me know if 
you want to dig deeper into the topic of the epoxy hole filling arts offline.

Martin DeYoung
Calypso
1971 C 43
Now Seattle
Soon Port Ludlow (after 2 months in the Port Townsend yard for paint)

From: Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, February 16, 2021 3:26 PM
To: Matthew via CnC-List
Cc: Ronald B. Frerker
Subject: Stus-List Re: adding tracks to deck

Do you do anything special to keep the epoxy in place until you can put some 
tape under the glob?
Ron
Wild Cheri
C 30-1
STL

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Broken rod rigging attachment for babystay deck at keel - 37/40+

[John and Maryann Read via CnC-List]

Our 34 halyards are attached to the casting on the deck surrounding the mast.  
Inside, the casting has two stainless tangs that attach to the mast which 
serves two purposes:   1) offset the upward pull of the halyards and 2) prevent 
the deck from springing upward as the mast shrouds are tightened and try to 
decrease the beam of the boat.

 

As for the rod holding the baby stay I seem to recall a prior similar issue on 
this list.  The fitting was similar to a lag bolt and screwed into the 
fiberglass and into the keel.  Remember the only thing preventing the mast from 
inverting (which is a disaster) or pumping (which impacts sail shape)  is the 
baby stay.  Some do not use it but I believe it to be an essential part of the 
mast structure taking the place of forward and aft lower shrouds.  Just look up 
your mast without a baby stay when going to windward in any sort of seaway.

 

My 2 cents American

 

John and Maryann

Legacy III

1982 C 34

Noank, CT

 

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Broken rod rigging attachment for babystay deck at keel - 37/40+

[pete.shelquist--- via CnC-List]

Bruce – 

I think you’re on the right track on how the rod is attached to your hull.  
Ideally, there is a plate that a new rod can easily be attached to, but you may 
need to grind down and install all new.   I’ve never looked at mine to give you 
a clear answer.   There should also be a turnbuckle to tune up the tension on 
the rod (before you tension the rig).  I have two rods holding down each end of 
the track that my babystay attaches to.  

 

Without the rod support, I wouldn’t attach the babystay.  It is structural and, 
in that scenario, the deck is now only supported at the partners and you risk 
lifting/stressing the deck in front of the mast.  Let the mast pump, it’s the 
lesser of two evils.  

 

On Lake Superior we get short, steep waves.  When it’s lumpy my mast (which is 
a tree trunk) still pumps a ton and I crank on the baby stay as tight as it’ll 
go.   

 

Hope that helps. 

Pete

 

 

 

On Tue, Feb 16, 2021 at 6:58 PM Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

Ahh...   Of course.  

 

I had not thought of that.  

 

Have any of you had to do this repair, and do you know how the rod is connected 
to the keel stub?

 

As a bit of background, the 1/4" stainless rod rig material is attached to the 
underside of the deck with a 1/4" x 1.5" x 3" stainless plate with two 3/8" 
stainless screws/bolts.   I am presuming a similar stainless plate was 
fiberglassed in place at the keel.  As of now, I can't really see it, but I 
will be able to get to it.  I am thinking I can grind it down a bit to get to 
clean fiberglass, get a replacement 1/2" threaded rod, tap a hole into a 
replacement stainless plate and get a welder additionally weld the rod in place 
so it doesn't move (untwist).  From there, fiberglass it in place. 

 

I can then use the existing rod and under-deck attachment.

 

Am I missing something?

 

Is there any particular trick to the fiberglassing?  How many layers of cloth 
would you use?

 

Thanks!!!

 

Bruce Whitmore
1994 C 37/40+
"Astralis"
Madeira Beach, FL
(847) 404-5092

 

On Tue, Feb 16, 2021, 2:47 PM Joel Aronson via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

Bruce,

 

If you have turning blocks attached to the deck I would be careful, as the rod 
counteracts the upward force of the halyards.  If they are attached to the 
mast, I would think you are OK.

 

Joel

 


 

 



-- 

 

 

Chuck Saur

517 490-5926 Cell

 

 

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Broken rod rigging attachment for babystay deck at keel - 37/40+

[Edd Schillay via CnC-List]

Bruce,

I believe the rod is a connection from the baby stay track to the keel.  If 
your baby stay is disconnected (as mine is), I don’t think there is any force 
on that rod. 

I’ve never experienced any pumping and I’ve sailed the Enterprise is all kinds 
of conditions. 

I think you can sail without it - as long as you disconnect the baby stay from 
the track. 

But I could be wrong. Another possibility is that you should total the boat and 
buy another, one that is about 70 miles south of you :-). 

All the best, 

Edd

———-
Edd M. Schillay
Captain of the “Starship Enterprise”
C 37+ | Sail No.: NCC-1701-B
Venice Yacht Club | Venice Island, FL
———-
914.774.9767   | Mobile
———-
Sent via iPhone 11 Pro
iPhone. iTypos. iApologize


On Feb 16, 2021, at 7:55 PM, Chuck Saur via CnC-List  
wrote:


Hello Bruce!  I was told the baby stay’s primary function was to mitigate mast 
pumping in a seaway and/or from harmonics. Secondary function to assist mast 
bend. I know C skippers who don’t use it. I believe mine has a padeye bolted 
or screwed into the sump and a turnbuckle to adjust. Not structural...only to 
anchor the track if used. 

On Tue, Feb 16, 2021 at 7:08 PM Joel Aronson via CnC-List 
 wrote:
> Guessing the plate is bolted in and the glass over it is not structural.  
> 
> On Tue, Feb 16, 2021 at 6:58 PM Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
>> Ahh...   Of course.  
>> 
>> I had not thought of that.  
>> 
>> Have any of you had to do this repair, and do you know how the rod is 
>> connected to the keel stub?
>> 
>> As a bit of background, the 1/4" stainless rod rig material is attached to 
>> the underside of the deck with a 1/4" x 1.5" x 3" stainless plate with two 
>> 3/8" stainless screws/bolts.   I am presuming a similar stainless plate was 
>> fiberglassed in place at the keel.  As of now, I can't really see it, but I 
>> will be able to get to it.  I am thinking I can grind it down a bit to get 
>> to clean fiberglass, get a replacement 1/2" threaded rod, tap a hole into a 
>> replacement stainless plate and get a welder additionally weld the rod in 
>> place so it doesn't move (untwist).  From there, fiberglass it in place. 
>> 
>> I can then use the existing rod and under-deck attachment.
>> 
>> Am I missing something?
>> 
>> Is there any particular trick to the fiberglassing?  How many layers of 
>> cloth would you use?
>> 
>> Thanks!!!
>> 
>> Bruce Whitmore
>> 1994 C 37/40+
>> "Astralis"
>> Madeira Beach, FL
>> (847) 404-5092
>> 
>> On Tue, Feb 16, 2021, 2:47 PM Joel Aronson via CnC-List 
>>  wrote:
>>> Bruce,
>>> 
>>> If you have turning blocks attached to the deck I would be careful, as the 
>>> rod counteracts the upward force of the halyards.  If they are attached to 
>>> the mast, I would think you are OK.
>>> 
>>> Joel
>>> 
>>> 
-- 


Chuck Saur

517 490-5926 Cell



 

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - StuThanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Broken rod rigging attachment for babystay deck at keel - 37/40+

[Chuck Saur via CnC-List]

Hello Bruce!  I was told the baby stay’s primary function was to mitigate
mast pumping in a seaway and/or from harmonics. Secondary function to
assist mast bend. I know C skippers who don’t use it. I believe mine has
a padeye bolted or screwed into the sump and a turnbuckle to adjust. Not
structural...only to anchor the track if used.

On Tue, Feb 16, 2021 at 7:08 PM Joel Aronson via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Guessing the plate is bolted in and the glass over it is not structural.
>
> On Tue, Feb 16, 2021 at 6:58 PM Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>> Ahh...   Of course.
>>
>> I had not thought of that.
>>
>> Have any of you had to do this repair, and do you know how the rod is
>> connected to the keel stub?
>>
>> As a bit of background, the 1/4" stainless rod rig material is attached
>> to the underside of the deck with a 1/4" x 1.5" x 3" stainless plate with
>> two 3/8" stainless screws/bolts.   I am presuming a similar stainless plate
>> was fiberglassed in place at the keel.  As of now, I can't really see it,
>> but I will be able to get to it.  I am thinking I can grind it down a bit
>> to get to clean fiberglass, get a replacement 1/2" threaded rod, tap a hole
>> into a replacement stainless plate and get a welder additionally weld the
>> rod in place so it doesn't move (untwist).  From there, fiberglass it in
>> place.
>>
>> I can then use the existing rod and under-deck attachment.
>>
>> Am I missing something?
>>
>> Is there any particular trick to the fiberglassing?  How many layers of
>> cloth would you use?
>>
>> Thanks!!!
>>
>> Bruce Whitmore
>> 1994 C 37/40+
>> "Astralis"
>> Madeira Beach, FL
>> (847) 404-5092
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 16, 2021, 2:47 PM Joel Aronson via CnC-List <
>> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Bruce,
>>>
>>> If you have turning blocks attached to the deck I would be careful, as
>>> the rod counteracts the upward force of the halyards.  If they are attached
>>> to the mast, I would think you are OK.
>>>
>>> Joel
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>> --


*Chuck Saur*

517 490-5926 Cell
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Broken rod rigging attachment for babystay deck at keel - 37/40+

[cenelson via CnC-List]

In benign conditions, I would forgetaboutit! My 36XL had a baby stay which 
besides being a PITA for tacking was mostly unnecessary for my rig, whose 3 
spreaders are not swept aft. For my masthead rig, it’s primary purpose was to 
reduce/eliminate mast pumping in a seaway since my mast is not a ‘tree-trunk’.
I removed it (and the baby stay track) and for my NC Sound and river racing 
never looked back.
Charlie Nelson1995 C 36 XL/kcbWater Phantom
PS: The interior rod is still attached to my CB trunk/Keel but I can’t 
determine how without removing my new cabin sole—hopefully another lister knows 
how it is attached. up my new sole. . 

Sent from the all new Aol app for iOS


On Tuesday, February 16, 2021, 2:34 PM, Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List 
 wrote:

Hello all,
I have a 1994 37/40+, which of course has rod rigging.  We were out sailing 
yesterday, and I had put on some babystay and backstay tension, but not a 
tremendous amount.
When I got back to the dock, I found, down in the cabin that the rod that is 
just forward of the mast broke loose from the keel trunk.  This is a 6 ft. 
length of rigging that runs from the underside of the deck to the keel trunk to 
reinforce the deck at the aft end of the babystay track.  
The attachment at the keel failed due to rust, but I can't really tell 
completely how it attached.  There is a threaded rod that goes between to keel 
trunk and the turnbuckle for adjustment.  It seems as though it may have been 
threaded rod welded on to a stainless steel plate that was glassed in place on 
the top of the trunk.  It was the threaded rod that failed where it exited the 
fiberglass.
Has anyone else had this fail?  
Do you know how the threaded rod was attached?
How did you fix it?
Finally, presuming I'm not putting on a lot of babystay tension, can I still 
sail the boat in benign conditions until I can get it fixed?
Thanks!
Bruce Whitmore
1994 C 37/40+
"Astralis"
Madeira Beach, FL
(847) 404-5092Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to 
help with the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - 
use PayPal to send contribution --  https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - 
Stu


Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Broken rod rigging attachment for babystay deck at keel - 37/40+

[Joel Aronson via CnC-List]

Guessing the plate is bolted in and the glass over it is not structural.

On Tue, Feb 16, 2021 at 6:58 PM Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Ahh...   Of course.
>
> I had not thought of that.
>
> Have any of you had to do this repair, and do you know how the rod is
> connected to the keel stub?
>
> As a bit of background, the 1/4" stainless rod rig material is attached to
> the underside of the deck with a 1/4" x 1.5" x 3" stainless plate with two
> 3/8" stainless screws/bolts.   I am presuming a similar stainless plate was
> fiberglassed in place at the keel.  As of now, I can't really see it, but I
> will be able to get to it.  I am thinking I can grind it down a bit to get
> to clean fiberglass, get a replacement 1/2" threaded rod, tap a hole into a
> replacement stainless plate and get a welder additionally weld the rod in
> place so it doesn't move (untwist).  From there, fiberglass it in place.
>
> I can then use the existing rod and under-deck attachment.
>
> Am I missing something?
>
> Is there any particular trick to the fiberglassing?  How many layers of
> cloth would you use?
>
> Thanks!!!
>
> Bruce Whitmore
> 1994 C 37/40+
> "Astralis"
> Madeira Beach, FL
> (847) 404-5092
>
> On Tue, Feb 16, 2021, 2:47 PM Joel Aronson via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>> Bruce,
>>
>> If you have turning blocks attached to the deck I would be careful, as
>> the rod counteracts the upward force of the halyards.  If they are attached
>> to the mast, I would think you are OK.
>>
>> Joel
>>
>>
>> 
>>  Virus-free.
>> www.avg.com
>> 
>> <#m_270904234532917239_m_6637486383092924218_m_-8953886778624034987_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 16, 2021 at 2:34 PM Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List <
>> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hello all,
>>>
>>> I have a 1994 37/40+, which of course has rod rigging.  We were out
>>> sailing yesterday, and I had put on some babystay and backstay tension, but
>>> not a tremendous amount.
>>>
>>> When I got back to the dock, I found, down in the cabin that the rod
>>> that is just forward of the mast broke loose from the keel trunk.  This is
>>> a 6 ft. length of rigging that runs from the underside of the deck to the
>>> keel trunk to reinforce the deck at the aft end of the babystay track.
>>>
>>> The attachment at the keel failed due to rust, but I can't really tell
>>> completely how it attached.  There is a threaded rod that goes between to
>>> keel trunk and the turnbuckle for adjustment.  It seems as though it may
>>> have been threaded rod welded on to a stainless steel plate that was
>>> glassed in place on the top of the trunk.  It was the threaded rod that
>>> failed where it exited the fiberglass.
>>>
>>> Has anyone else had this fail?
>>>
>>> Do you know how the threaded rod was attached?
>>>
>>> How did you fix it?
>>>
>>> Finally, presuming I'm not putting on a lot of babystay tension, can I
>>> still sail the boat in benign conditions until I can get it fixed?
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>>
>>> Bruce Whitmore
>>> 1994 C 37/40+
>>> "Astralis"
>>> Madeira Beach, FL
>>> (847) 404-5092
>>> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help
>>> with the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list -
>>> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>> Thanks - Stu
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Joel
>>
>> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help
>> with the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list -
>> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>> Thanks - Stu
>
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks
> - Stu

-- 
Joel
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Broken rod rigging attachment for babystay deck at keel - 37/40+

[Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List]

Ahh...   Of course.

I had not thought of that.

Have any of you had to do this repair, and do you know how the rod is
connected to the keel stub?

As a bit of background, the 1/4" stainless rod rig material is attached to
the underside of the deck with a 1/4" x 1.5" x 3" stainless plate with two
3/8" stainless screws/bolts.   I am presuming a similar stainless plate was
fiberglassed in place at the keel.  As of now, I can't really see it, but I
will be able to get to it.  I am thinking I can grind it down a bit to get
to clean fiberglass, get a replacement 1/2" threaded rod, tap a hole into a
replacement stainless plate and get a welder additionally weld the rod in
place so it doesn't move (untwist).  From there, fiberglass it in place.

I can then use the existing rod and under-deck attachment.

Am I missing something?

Is there any particular trick to the fiberglassing?  How many layers of
cloth would you use?

Thanks!!!

Bruce Whitmore
1994 C 37/40+
"Astralis"
Madeira Beach, FL
(847) 404-5092

On Tue, Feb 16, 2021, 2:47 PM Joel Aronson via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Bruce,
>
> If you have turning blocks attached to the deck I would be careful, as the
> rod counteracts the upward force of the halyards.  If they are attached to
> the mast, I would think you are OK.
>
> Joel
>
>
> 
>  Virus-free.
> www.avg.com
> 
> <#m_6637486383092924218_m_-8953886778624034987_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
>
> On Tue, Feb 16, 2021 at 2:34 PM Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>> Hello all,
>>
>> I have a 1994 37/40+, which of course has rod rigging.  We were out
>> sailing yesterday, and I had put on some babystay and backstay tension, but
>> not a tremendous amount.
>>
>> When I got back to the dock, I found, down in the cabin that the rod that
>> is just forward of the mast broke loose from the keel trunk.  This is a 6
>> ft. length of rigging that runs from the underside of the deck to the keel
>> trunk to reinforce the deck at the aft end of the babystay track.
>>
>> The attachment at the keel failed due to rust, but I can't really tell
>> completely how it attached.  There is a threaded rod that goes between to
>> keel trunk and the turnbuckle for adjustment.  It seems as though it may
>> have been threaded rod welded on to a stainless steel plate that was
>> glassed in place on the top of the trunk.  It was the threaded rod that
>> failed where it exited the fiberglass.
>>
>> Has anyone else had this fail?
>>
>> Do you know how the threaded rod was attached?
>>
>> How did you fix it?
>>
>> Finally, presuming I'm not putting on a lot of babystay tension, can I
>> still sail the boat in benign conditions until I can get it fixed?
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Bruce Whitmore
>> 1994 C 37/40+
>> "Astralis"
>> Madeira Beach, FL
>> (847) 404-5092
>> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help
>> with the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list -
>> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>> Thanks - Stu
>
>
>
> --
> Joel
>
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks
> - Stu
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: adding tracks to deck

[Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List]

 Do you do anything special to keep the epoxy in place until you can put some 
tape under the glob?RonWild CheriC 30-1STL

On Sunday, January 24, 2021, 01:31:10 PM CST, Matthew via CnC-List 
 wrote:  
 
 
Regarding Dennis’ comment about overbored holes being hidden by the track, a 
trick I like to use is to drill up from underneath and stop when the bit 
encounters the underside of the deck.  The result is that the hole on the deck 
surface stays the same size.  In addition, you know precisely where to place 
the deck fitting and drill the new hole.
  Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

[David Risch via CnC-List]

The additional cost of more HP will be small compared to install collateral 
items.   I repowered with a Beta and they are great engines and great people.   
I assume you will upgrade the alternator.  Bigger alternator means HP drag.   
Ask Beta for advice.   Me?  At least 30.  In my 40, now at 33 hp, I would do at 
least 45.  When you need it...you will really need it


Sent from my Android. Please forgive typos. Thank you.


From: Joel Delamirande via CnC-List 
Sent: Tuesday, February 16, 2021 3:31:18 PM
To: Stus-List 
Cc: Joel Delamirande 
Subject: Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

Can u put a 35-40 hp

On Tue, Feb 16, 2021 at 3:20 PM Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:

If you want to battle headwinds and seas I would use more than the 20 HP 
engine. Depending on your budget and space the 25 or 30 would both be good 
choices.

The 34 I used to sail on had a 2 cylinder Yanmar that was 18 HP (I think) and 
shook the entire boat. It was by no means overpowered. 3 cylinders =  less 
vibration and more power.



Joe

Coquina

C 35 MK I

4 cylinders

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
  Thanks - Stu
--
Joel Delamirande
[https://drive.google.com/uc?id=0Bzdvlj_zFQR9UUZyRjFCM0FGejZXeGd5WFVnVTZRb0Y0Q1lZ=download]
www.jdroofing.ca

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Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

[Joel Delamirande via CnC-List]

Can u put a 35-40 hp

On Tue, Feb 16, 2021 at 3:20 PM Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> If you want to battle headwinds and seas I would use more than the 20 HP
> engine. Depending on your budget and space the 25 or 30 would both be good
> choices.
>
> The 34 I used to sail on had a 2 cylinder Yanmar that was 18 HP (I think)
> and shook the entire boat. It was by no means overpowered. 3 cylinders =
> less vibration and more power.
>
>
>
> Joe
>
> Coquina
>
> C 35 MK I
>
> 4 cylinders
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks
> - Stu

-- 
Joel Delamirande
*www.jdroofing.ca *
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

Sort of kind of.
I have an Atomic 4 and it is rated at 30 HP at *3600* RPM. The only boats 
getting close to 3600 RPM are either planing hulls or have a reduction gear, 
which most of them do not.
Mine is direct drive and maxes out at about 2400-2500 RPM. It is about a 22-25 
HP engine in most applications. Running under power next to a 34 with the 18 HP 
diesel I was definitely faster, but I am pretty sure a 25 HP diesel with a 
reduction gear would beat an Atomic 4 in a race.

Joe
Coquina

From: Matthew [mailto:wolf...@erie.net]
Sent: Tuesday, February 16, 2021 3:24 PM
To: 'Stus-List' 
Cc: Della Barba, Joe 
Subject: [EXTERNAL] RE: Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

As I recall the A4 on my sistership was rated about 30 HP.

From: Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
Sent: Tuesday, February 16, 2021 3:21 PM
To: Stus-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
Cc: Della Barba, Joe mailto:joe.della.ba...@ssa.gov>>
Subject: Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

If you want to battle headwinds and seas I would use more than the 20 HP 
engine. Depending on your budget and space the 25 or 30 would both be good 
choices.
The 34 I used to sail on had a 2 cylinder Yanmar that was 18 HP (I think) and 
shook the entire boat. It was by no means overpowered. 3 cylinders =  less 
vibration and more power.

Joe
Coquina
C 35 MK I
4 cylinders
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

[Matthew via CnC-List]

As I recall the A4 on my sistership was rated about 30 HP.

 

From: Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List  
Sent: Tuesday, February 16, 2021 3:21 PM
To: Stus-List 
Cc: Della Barba, Joe 
Subject: Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

 

If you want to battle headwinds and seas I would use more than the 20 HP 
engine. Depending on your budget and space the 25 or 30 would both be good 
choices.

The 34 I used to sail on had a 2 cylinder Yanmar that was 18 HP (I think) and 
shook the entire boat. It was by no means overpowered. 3 cylinders =  less 
vibration and more power.

 

Joe

Coquina 

C 35 MK I

4 cylinders 

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

If you want to battle headwinds and seas I would use more than the 20 HP 
engine. Depending on your budget and space the 25 or 30 would both be good 
choices.
The 34 I used to sail on had a 2 cylinder Yanmar that was 18 HP (I think) and 
shook the entire boat. It was by no means overpowered. 3 cylinders =  less 
vibration and more power.

Joe
Coquina
C 35 MK I
4 cylinders
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

[Joel Aronson via CnC-List]

FWIW, the 35/3 came with the 3GM30F.  Another foot, another cylinder?

Joel


Virus-free.
www.avg.com

<#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>

On Tue, Feb 16, 2021 at 2:48 PM Edward Levert via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> My C 34 was reported by a prior owner with a Yanmar 2GM30F. Seems to be
> plenty of hp.
>
> Ed Levert
> C 34 Briar Patch
> New Orleans
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 16, 2021, at 1:27 PM, Paul Fountain via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> 
>
> WE put a 25 hp Beta in our 33-II when we did her – been great lots of
> power. Also went with a Flex-o-fold 2 blade prop, if I needed more push id
> upgrade the prop to a 3 blade flex-o-fold.
>
>
>
> *From:* Jeremy Ralph via CnC-List 
> *Sent:* February 16, 2021 2:08 PM
> *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> *Cc:* Jeremy Ralph 
> *Subject:* Stus-List C 34 re-power HP
>
>
>
> Hello,
>
> I have a 1978 C 34 with original Yanmar 2QM20.  Looking at Betas and
> wondering what horsepower to go with if I were to repower.  I've heard of
> people with 20, 25, 30HP in these boats.  We're in the Salish Sea off of
> Vancouver Island and often need to battle wind, waves and current.
>
> Thanks
>
>   Jeremy
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks
> - Stu
>
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks
> - Stu



-- 
Joel
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

[Edward Levert via CnC-List]

My C 34 was reported by a prior owner with a Yanmar 2GM30F. Seems to be 
plenty of hp.

Ed Levert
C 34 Briar Patch
New Orleans

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 16, 2021, at 1:27 PM, Paul Fountain via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> WE put a 25 hp Beta in our 33-II when we did her – been great lots of power. 
> Also went with a Flex-o-fold 2 blade prop, if I needed more push id upgrade 
> the prop to a 3 blade flex-o-fold.
>  
> From: Jeremy Ralph via CnC-List  
> Sent: February 16, 2021 2:08 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Jeremy Ralph 
> Subject: Stus-List C 34 re-power HP
>  
> Hello,
> I have a 1978 C 34 with original Yanmar 2QM20.  Looking at Betas and 
> wondering what horsepower to go with if I were to repower.  I've heard of 
> people with 20, 25, 30HP in these boats.  We're in the Salish Sea off of 
> Vancouver Island and often need to battle wind, waves and current.
> Thanks
>   Jeremy
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with 
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Broken rod rigging attachment for babystay deck at keel - 37/40+

[Joel Aronson via CnC-List]

Bruce,

If you have turning blocks attached to the deck I would be careful, as the
rod counteracts the upward force of the halyards.  If they are attached to
the mast, I would think you are OK.

Joel


Virus-free.
www.avg.com

<#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>

On Tue, Feb 16, 2021 at 2:34 PM Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hello all,
>
> I have a 1994 37/40+, which of course has rod rigging.  We were out
> sailing yesterday, and I had put on some babystay and backstay tension, but
> not a tremendous amount.
>
> When I got back to the dock, I found, down in the cabin that the rod that
> is just forward of the mast broke loose from the keel trunk.  This is a 6
> ft. length of rigging that runs from the underside of the deck to the keel
> trunk to reinforce the deck at the aft end of the babystay track.
>
> The attachment at the keel failed due to rust, but I can't really tell
> completely how it attached.  There is a threaded rod that goes between to
> keel trunk and the turnbuckle for adjustment.  It seems as though it may
> have been threaded rod welded on to a stainless steel plate that was
> glassed in place on the top of the trunk.  It was the threaded rod that
> failed where it exited the fiberglass.
>
> Has anyone else had this fail?
>
> Do you know how the threaded rod was attached?
>
> How did you fix it?
>
> Finally, presuming I'm not putting on a lot of babystay tension, can I
> still sail the boat in benign conditions until I can get it fixed?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Bruce Whitmore
> 1994 C 37/40+
> "Astralis"
> Madeira Beach, FL
> (847) 404-5092
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks
> - Stu



-- 
Joel
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

[ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List]

My boat is powered with a 3gm (20hp). Under normal conditions, it's
sufficient. When fighting heavy air and rough ses, I wish I had 30hp.
Don't get caught underpowered.

Alan Bergen
35 Mk III Thirsty
Rose City YC
Portland, OR



On Tue, Feb 16, 2021 at 11:08 AM Jeremy Ralph via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hello,
> I have a 1978 C 34 with original Yanmar 2QM20.  Looking at Betas and
> wondering what horsepower to go with if I were to repower.  I've heard of
> people with 20, 25, 30HP in these boats.  We're in the Salish Sea off of
> Vancouver Island and often need to battle wind, waves and current.
> Thanks
>   Jeremy
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use
> PayPal to send contribution --
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.paypal.me/stumurray__;!!LIr3w8kk_Xxm!65Pu67V2hU0MLbZ_ScVU-N9o-9N-hloYvL5kS4AY3I7RMt2hCt504VSqiv6QH8RgWNo$
>  Thanks - Stu
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Broken rod rigging attachment for babystay deck at keel - 37/40+

[Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List]

Hello all,

I have a 1994 37/40+, which of course has rod rigging.  We were out sailing
yesterday, and I had put on some babystay and backstay tension, but not a
tremendous amount.

When I got back to the dock, I found, down in the cabin that the rod that
is just forward of the mast broke loose from the keel trunk.  This is a 6
ft. length of rigging that runs from the underside of the deck to the keel
trunk to reinforce the deck at the aft end of the babystay track.

The attachment at the keel failed due to rust, but I can't really tell
completely how it attached.  There is a threaded rod that goes between to
keel trunk and the turnbuckle for adjustment.  It seems as though it may
have been threaded rod welded on to a stainless steel plate that was
glassed in place on the top of the trunk.  It was the threaded rod that
failed where it exited the fiberglass.

Has anyone else had this fail?

Do you know how the threaded rod was attached?

How did you fix it?

Finally, presuming I'm not putting on a lot of babystay tension, can I
still sail the boat in benign conditions until I can get it fixed?

Thanks!

Bruce Whitmore
1994 C 37/40+
"Astralis"
Madeira Beach, FL
(847) 404-5092
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

[Dean McNeill via CnC-List]

My new-to-me 1980 C 34 was re-powered in 2009 with a Yanmar 30hp…. seems like 
a good amount of power to me.

Dean
Halifax NS
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

[Paul Fountain via CnC-List]

WE put a 25 hp Beta in our 33-II when we did her – been great lots of power. 
Also went with a Flex-o-fold 2 blade prop, if I needed more push id upgrade the 
prop to a 3 blade flex-o-fold.

From: Jeremy Ralph via CnC-List 
Sent: February 16, 2021 2:08 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Jeremy Ralph 
Subject: Stus-List C 34 re-power HP

Hello,
I have a 1978 C 34 with original Yanmar 2QM20.  Looking at Betas and 
wondering what horsepower to go with if I were to repower.  I've heard of 
people with 20, 25, 30HP in these boats.  We're in the Salish Sea off of 
Vancouver Island and often need to battle wind, waves and current.
Thanks
  Jeremy
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

[svrebeccaleah via CnC-List]

I would go with the largest 30 to 35 hp. You may not always need the extra 
power, but it is a lifesaver when you do. Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device
 Original message From: Jeremy Ralph via CnC-List 
 Date: 2/16/21  14:08  (GMT-05:00) To: 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Jeremy Ralph  Subject: 
Stus-List C 34 re-power HP Hello,I have a 1978 C 34 with original Yanmar 
2QM20.  Looking at Betas and wondering what horsepower to go with if I were to 
repower.  I've heard of people with 20, 25, 30HP in these boats.  We're in the 
Salish Sea off of Vancouver Island and often need to battle wind, waves and 
current.Thanks  Jeremy
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: C 34 re-power HP

[Gary Nylander via CnC-List]

Get something with at least 25 hp and three cylinders – you and I both know 
about vibration. 

 

Gary 2QM15.

 

From: Jeremy Ralph via CnC-List  
Sent: Tuesday, February 16, 2021 2:08 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Jeremy Ralph 
Subject: Stus-List C 34 re-power HP

 

Hello,

I have a 1978 C 34 with original Yanmar 2QM20.  Looking at Betas and 
wondering what horsepower to go with if I were to repower.  I've heard of 
people with 20, 25, 30HP in these boats.  We're in the Salish Sea off of 
Vancouver Island and often need to battle wind, waves and current.

Thanks

  Jeremy

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List C 34 re-power HP

[Jeremy Ralph via CnC-List]

Hello,
I have a 1978 C 34 with original Yanmar 2QM20.  Looking at Betas and
wondering what horsepower to go with if I were to repower.  I've heard of
people with 20, 25, 30HP in these boats.  We're in the Salish Sea off of
Vancouver Island and often need to battle wind, waves and current.
Thanks
  Jeremy
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Anyone need a Racor vacuum gauge

[svrebeccaleah via CnC-List]

Hi JoeI would love one. DougSent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device
 Original message From: Ourtime via CnC-List 
 Date: 2/15/21  13:22  (GMT-05:00) To: 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Ourtime  Subject: Stus-List Re: 
Anyone need a Racor vacuum gauge 
If it's still available, I'd like to give it a good home.



-Original Message-
From: Joe Della Barba via CnC-List 
To: 'Stus-List' 
Cc: j...@dellabarba.com
Sent: Mon, Feb 15, 2021 12:28 pm
Subject: Stus-List Anyone need a Racor vacuum gauge







This is for a fuel filter to see if it is clogged. It has the nice color-coded 
scale.

$20 to Stu and it’s yours 

  


  

Joe Della Barba

Coquina C 35 MK I

Kent Island MD USA

  

  



Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Panel rewiring

[Doug Mountjoy via CnC-List]

Adam,
You can do it either way. Using a buss bar, a terminal strip (which will
require jumpers between circuits), or you could use a fuse block. The later
will protect each individual circuit.
https://www.amazon.com/Blue-Sea-Systems-Blade-6-Circuit/dp/B000MMC7Q6/ref=asc_df_B000MMC7Q6/?tag=bingshoppinga-20=df0===oe=mpla-4584070138300722=1

I rewired my boat last winter, and in doing so replaced any wire that I
messed with. I used a combination of terminal blocks, buss bars and fuse
blocks.
Enjoy
Doug

On Mon, Feb 15, 2021, 15:24 Adam Hayden via CnC-List 
wrote:

> Hello folks.
>
> As one of my many winter projects I have decided to rewire the 12 volt
> panel and add pigtails to make it easier to remove the panels by creating a
> hinged panel. I plan to run the pig tails to a terminal block.  My question
> is how to distribute the positive leads from  the leads to the various
> interior lighting wires.  I have about 4-6  different  wires from different
> areas of the  boat.  Would you suggest a terminal block with jumpers or a
> bus bar?
>
> Any other suggestions would be appreciated.
>
> Adam
> C 36
>
> Sent from my Bell Samsung device over Canada’s largest network.
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks
> - Stu
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu