Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
Here are links to A4 winterizing threads on the Moyer Marine forums; I read and bookmarked them last night: * http://www.moyermarine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=525 * http://www.moyermarine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6886 Cheers, Randy - Original Message - From: "Ken via CnC-List" To: "cnc-list" , "Neil Gallagher via CnC-List" Cc: kwalt...@speakeasy.net Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 3:24:10 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4 I have the Moyer FWC cooling system on my A4 which needs no winterization (as it and the block are filled with automotive type antifreeze). To winterize the seawater side of the FWC, seawater pump and wet exhaust I pull a hose off the seawater strainer, put it in a bucket of the pink stuff (non toxic RV/marine engine anti-freeze) and run about 3 gallons through until pink starts coming out the exhaust pipe. Prestone protects the freshwater side, pink stuff the seawater side. I also squirt some MMO in the combustion chambers through the spark plug holes to keep the rings/valves free during the winter and to dissolve any build up on them from the season. The Moyer site has a couple of write ups on winterizing in the forums area. Ken On Tue, 11 Oct 2016 16:41:30 -0400, Neil Gallagher via CnC-List wrote: When I first put fresh water cooling on my A4, I did drain the block and pump every year, but then it occurred to me that I was leaving the interior of the engine filled with air and moisture, not the best combination. Taking the side plate off in my case would be difficult. I now make sure my coolant has antifreeze (the automotive type) that protects down to minus whatever, and leave the block full. My thinking is that the coolant has a corrosion inhibitor in it, probably better for the engine. Am I missing something? Neil Gallagher Weatherly, 35-1 Glen Cove On 10/11/2016 1:16 PM, Dennis C. via CnC-List wrote: When I bought Touche' in 1999, it had an AT4. It had the drain plug extension. When I finally got it started, the drain plug extension leaked. As I recall, it was corroded at the threads at the cap. When I went to replace it, it fell apart. I think it's just a 1/8 or 1/4 pipe nipple. Just something to check and be aware of. Dennis C. On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 11:50 AM, Michael Brown via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com > wrote: I have the extension pipe installed between the distributor and the alternator belt. There is just a cap on the end that I remove to drain the block. It is easy. The two drain plugs on the block are simple to get to. The drain plug on the bottom of the water pump is a bit fiddly to start back in, mainly just an issue getting into the lazerette enough to reach it. I doubt it is a 5 minute job to do all four. Is it common to just drain the engine ( block ) and not fill it with antifreeze? Michael Brown Windburn C&C 30-1 From: "phorvati ." < phorv...@gmail.com > U have to drain the block. Side inspection plate will leak if you dont drain it. Its fragile as it is. It doesnt take too much freezing to develop leaks. Block drain plug is under distributor, just aft of side inspection plate. It's pita. Moyer sells extention to make this easy. ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated! ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated! ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated! ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated! ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
I agree draining may not be the best option. Touche's raw water cooled AT4 had been idle for years (at least 8-10 to my knowledge). When I pulled the side plates to clean the water chamber area around the cylinders, I discovered the sealing surface of the block around the side plates had thinned due to corrosion. The thinning was from the inside. My guess is the block was only partially filled which allowed oxygen to be present inside the water chamber area. I had to upsize a few of the side plate bolts. Eventually, the thinning caused leakage around the side plates. It got bad enough I repowered with a diesel. Keeping the cooling chamber full may prevent oxygen from causing corrosion. Dennis C. On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 3:41 PM, Neil Gallagher via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > When I first put fresh water cooling on my A4, I did drain the block and > pump every year, but then it occurred to me that I was leaving the interior > of the engine filled with air and moisture, not the best combination. > Taking the side plate off in my case would be difficult. I now make sure > my coolant has antifreeze (the automotive type) that protects down to minus > whatever, and leave the block full. My thinking is that the coolant has a > corrosion inhibitor in it, probably better for the engine. Am I missing > something? > > Neil Gallagher > Weatherly, 35-1 > Glen Cove > > > On 10/11/2016 1:16 PM, Dennis C. via CnC-List wrote: > > When I bought Touche' in 1999, it had an AT4. It had the drain plug > extension. When I finally got it started, the drain plug extension > leaked. As I recall, it was corroded at the threads at the cap. When I > went to replace it, it fell apart. I think it's just a 1/8 or 1/4 pipe > nipple. Just something to check and be aware of. > > Dennis C. > > On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 11:50 AM, Michael Brown via CnC-List < > cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > >> I have the extension pipe installed between the distributor and the >> alternator belt. There is just a cap on the end that I remove to drain >> the block. It is easy. The two drain plugs on the block are simple to get >> to. The drain plug on the bottom of the water pump is a bit fiddly to >> start back in, mainly just an issue getting into the lazerette enough >> to reach it. I doubt it is a 5 minute job to do all four. >> >> Is it common to just drain the engine ( block ) and not fill it with >> antifreeze? >> >> Michael Brown >> Windburn >> C&C 30-1 >> >> From: "phorvati ." >> >> U have to drain the block. Side inspection plate will leak if you dont >> drain it. Its fragile as it is. It doesnt take too much freezing to >> develop leaks. Block drain plug is under distributor, just aft of side >> inspection plate. It's pita. Moyer sells extention to make this easy. >> >> >> ___ >> >> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you >> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All >> Contributions are greatly appreciated! >> >> > > > ___ > > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like > what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions > are greatly appreciated! > > > > ___ > > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you > like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All > Contributions are greatly appreciated! > > ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
I have the Moyer FWC cooling system on my A4 which needs no winterization (as it and the block are filled with automotive type antifreeze). To winterize the seawater side of the FWC, seawater pump and wet exhaust I pull a hose off the seawater strainer, put it in a bucket of the pink stuff (non toxic RV/marine engine anti-freeze) and run about 3 gallons through until pink starts coming out the exhaust pipe. Prestone protects the freshwater side, pink stuff the seawater side. I also squirt some MMO in the combustion chambers through the spark plug holes to keep the rings/valves free during the winter and to dissolve any build up on them from the season. The Moyer site has a couple of write ups on winterizing in the forums area. Ken On Tue, 11 Oct 2016 16:41:30 -0400, Neil Gallagher via CnC-List wrote: When I first put fresh water cooling on my A4, I did drain the block and pump every year, but then it occurred to me that I was leaving the interior of the engine filled with air and moisture, not the best combination. Taking the side plate off in my case would be difficult. I now make sure my coolant has antifreeze (the automotive type) that protects down to minus whatever, and leave the block full. My thinking is that the coolant has a corrosion inhibitor in it, probably better for the engine. Am I missing something? Neil Gallagher Weatherly, 35-1 Glen Cove On 10/11/2016 1:16 PM, Dennis C. via CnC-List wrote: When I bought Touche' in 1999, it had an AT4. It had the drain plug extension. When I finally got it started, the drain plug extension leaked. As I recall, it was corroded at the threads at the cap. When I went to replace it, it fell apart. I think it's just a 1/8 or 1/4 pipe nipple. Just something to check and be aware of. Dennis C. On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 11:50 AM, Michael Brown via CnC-List wrote: I have the extension pipe installed between the distributor and the alternator belt. There is just a cap on the end that I remove to drain the block. It is easy. The two drain plugs on the block are simple to get to. The drain plug on the bottom of the water pump is a bit fiddly to start back in, mainly just an issue getting into the lazerette enough to reach it. I doubt it is a 5 minute job to do all four. Is it common to just drain the engine ( block ) and not fill it with antifreeze? Michael Brown Windburn C&C 30-1 From: "phorvati ." U have to drain the block. Side inspection plate will leak if you dont drain it. Its fragile as it is. It doesnt take too much freezing to develop leaks. Block drain plug is under distributor, just aft of side inspection plate. It's pita. Moyer sells extention to make this easy. ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated! ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated! - ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated! ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
When I first put fresh water cooling on my A4, I did drain the block and pump every year, but then it occurred to me that I was leaving the interior of the engine filled with air and moisture, not the best combination. Taking the side plate off in my case would be difficult. I now make sure my coolant has antifreeze (the automotive type) that protects down to minus whatever, and leave the block full. My thinking is that the coolant has a corrosion inhibitor in it, probably better for the engine. Am I missing something? Neil Gallagher Weatherly, 35-1 Glen Cove On 10/11/2016 1:16 PM, Dennis C. via CnC-List wrote: When I bought Touche' in 1999, it had an AT4. It had the drain plug extension. When I finally got it started, the drain plug extension leaked. As I recall, it was corroded at the threads at the cap. When I went to replace it, it fell apart. I think it's just a 1/8 or 1/4 pipe nipple. Just something to check and be aware of. Dennis C. On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 11:50 AM, Michael Brown via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote: I have the extension pipe installed between the distributor and the alternator belt. There is just a cap on the end that I remove to drain the block. It is easy. The two drain plugs on the block are simple to get to. The drain plug on the bottom of the water pump is a bit fiddly to start back in, mainly just an issue getting into the lazerette enough to reach it. I doubt it is a 5 minute job to do all four. Is it common to just drain the engine ( block ) and not fill it with antifreeze? Michael Brown Windburn C&C 30-1 From: "phorvati ." mailto:phorv...@gmail.com>> U have to drain the block. Side inspection plate will leak if you dont drain it. Its fragile as it is. It doesnt take too much freezing to develop leaks. Block drain plug is under distributor, just aft of side inspection plate. It's pita. Moyer sells extention to make this easy. ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated! ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated! ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
When I bought Touche' in 1999, it had an AT4. It had the drain plug extension. When I finally got it started, the drain plug extension leaked. As I recall, it was corroded at the threads at the cap. When I went to replace it, it fell apart. I think it's just a 1/8 or 1/4 pipe nipple. Just something to check and be aware of. Dennis C. On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 11:50 AM, Michael Brown via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > I have the extension pipe installed between the distributor and the > alternator belt. There is just a cap on the end that I remove to drain > the block. It is easy. The two drain plugs on the block are simple to get > to. The drain plug on the bottom of the water pump is a bit fiddly to > start back in, mainly just an issue getting into the lazerette enough > to reach it. I doubt it is a 5 minute job to do all four. > > Is it common to just drain the engine ( block ) and not fill it with > antifreeze? > > Michael Brown > Windburn > C&C 30-1 > > From: "phorvati ." > > U have to drain the block. Side inspection plate will leak if you dont > drain it. Its fragile as it is. It doesnt take too much freezing to > develop leaks. Block drain plug is under distributor, just aft of side > inspection plate. It's pita. Moyer sells extention to make this easy. > > > ___ > > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you > like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All > Contributions are greatly appreciated! > > ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
I have the extension pipe installed between the distributor and the alternator belt. There is just a cap on the end that I remove to drain the block. It is easy. The two drain plugs on the block are simple to get to. The drain plug on the bottom of the water pump is a bit fiddly to start back in, mainly just an issue getting into the lazerette enough to reach it. I doubt it is a 5 minute job to do all four. Is it common to just drain the engine ( block ) and not fill it with antifreeze? Michael Brown Windburn C&C 30-1 From: "phorvati ." U have to drain the block. Side inspection plate will leak if you dont drain it. Its fragile as it is. It doesnt take too much freezing to develop leaks. Block drain plug is under distributor, just aft of side inspection plate. It's pita. Moyer sells extention to make this easy. ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
Basically anyway you would get the glycol IN you can jerry rig a way to attach a shop vac. Or just use the sea-flush. I blow out my tap water lines and A/C lines too. And my shower pump/deck wash pump. I've also rigged up some fittings for my through hulls so that I can easily attach short section of hose/tygon with a garden hose fitting. See the picture, I can suck glycol, attach a shop-vac, flush with fresh water, or ram rod the through hull if it gets clogged. http://www.seaflush.com/sea-flush-1/ Josh Muckley S/V Sea Hawk 1989 C&C 37+ Solomons, MD On Oct 11, 2016 7:25 AM, "Kevin Deluzio via CnC-List" wrote: My first haul-out with a new-to-me 1980 C&C30 with an Atomic 4 as well. I like the idea of using the shop-vac to blow the water out. Do you connect that to the same location - at water intake hose disconnected from seacock ? Kevin *From: *Josh Muckley *Subject: **Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4* *Date: *October 10, 2016 at 10:27:53 PM EDT *To: *"C&C List" You can plumb in auxiliary suctions that will let you draw glycol straight out of the jug. If you haul the boat you can stuff a tygon hose up the through hull and beer bong the glycol into the engine. Or you can try the seaflush. I have one and it works, though it might be a bit over priced. I like using the shop vac to blow the water out. That may actually be sufficient. I am cautious though and carefully consider the possibility of stagnant loops of water. So, despite "blowing out" the engine, I also run glycol. The nice thing is that I don't have to worry as much about the water diluting the glycol. It takes way less glycol to provide freeze protection. http://www.seaflush.com/sea-flush-1/ Josh Muckley S/V Sea Hawk 1989 C&C 37+ Solomons, MD On Oct 10, 2016 9:50 PM, "RANDY via CnC-List" wrote: > My first haul-out with my 30-1 (purchased in January) is coming up in a > few weeks, sadly. The PO advised me to just run antifreeze through the > raw-water cooling system until it comes out the exhaust. My main question > is how to get the antifreeze into the raw water intake. I've seen a gadget > made from a toilet plunger with a garden hose plumbed into the rubber cone, > that can be held over the raw water intake with the other end of the hose > in a bucket of antifreeze. Any other recommended techniques? Any other > general tips on properly winterizing an A4? > > Thanks, > Randy > > > ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated! ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
U have to drain the block. Side inspection plate will leak if you dont drain it. Its fragile as it is. It doesnt take too much freezing to develop leaks. Block drain plug is under distributor, just aft of side inspection plate. It's pita. Moyer sells extention to make this easy. On Oct 11, 2016 12:12 PM, "Michael Brown via CnC-List" < cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > My atomic 4 is raw water cooled, I have drained the engine and water pump > using the drain plugs and not used any antifreeze. That has worked in > Toronto > for the last nine years. > > I did experiment with a thin tube and suction pump the first year to see > how much water > was left in the block. I doubt it was a rigorous test but there was not > much. > > Michael Brown > Windburn > C&C 30-1 > > ___ > > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you > like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All > Contributions are greatly appreciated! > > ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
My atomic 4 is raw water cooled, I have drained the engine and water pump using the drain plugs and not used any antifreeze. That has worked in Toronto for the last nine years. I did experiment with a thin tube and suction pump the first year to see how much water was left in the block. I doubt it was a rigorous test but there was not much. Michael Brown Windburn C&C 30-1 ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
This is how I do it with my diesel. Always on the hard. I warm up the engine first, using fresh water into that bucket. Marek From: Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 11:48 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Della Barba, Joe Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4 When my A4 was raw water cooled I did it like so: The water intake hose goes into a big 5 gallon bucket full of anti-freeze. I put a hose on the exhaust that does the same. The engine pumps the anti-freeze around and around and when it gets up to temp I shut it off and change the oil. This can be done in or out of the water. Joe Coquina C&C 35 MK I ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
Danny, Good point. I know the issue quite well (first hand experience; not from hard starting, but from actually winterising the engine). I don’t use the shopvac; I just run the engine and suck in 5 gal of antifreeze. But if you wanted to push the water out of the system, you have to connect after the pump. Probably the best would be to drain the muffler first, push the water out and drain it again? Marek From: Danny Haughey via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 10:54 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Danny Haughey Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4 Marek, the worry is back-filling through the exhaust. if the engine is not running there is a very real risk of water going in through the exhaust manifold because there is no pressure from the exhaust of the running engine pushing the water out. It is the same issue if you are having trouble starting the engine and you let the starter continue to turn everything for an extended time without the engine firing. It is a well documented issue on the Moyer Marine forums. The cooling pump itself is what pumps the water in during difficulty starting while turning the starter. Danny On 10/11/2016 10:42 AM, Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List wrote: You have to connect the shopvac _after_ the water pump. If your water pump is any good it will not allow anything to pass through it (when it Is not turning). And if it does, you have to change the impeller. Marek From: Kevin Deluzio via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 07:25 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Kevin Deluzio Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4 My first haul-out with a new-to-me 1980 C&C30 with an Atomic 4 as well. I like the idea of using the shop-vac to blow the water out. Do you connect that to the same location - at water intake hose disconnected from seacock ? Kevin From: Josh Muckley Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4 Date: October 10, 2016 at 10:27:53 PM EDT To: "C&C List" You can plumb in auxiliary suctions that will let you draw glycol straight out of the jug. If you haul the boat you can stuff a tygon hose up the through hull and beer bong the glycol into the engine. Or you can try the seaflush. I have one and it works, though it might be a bit over priced. I like using the shop vac to blow the water out. That may actually be sufficient. I am cautious though and carefully consider the possibility of stagnant loops of water. So, despite "blowing out" the engine, I also run glycol. The nice thing is that I don't have to worry as much about the water diluting the glycol. It takes way less glycol to provide freeze protection. http://www.seaflush.com/sea-flush-1/ Josh Muckley S/V Sea Hawk 1989 C&C 37+ Solomons, MD On Oct 10, 2016 9:50 PM, "RANDY via CnC-List" wrote: My first haul-out with my 30-1 (purchased in January) is coming up in a few weeks, sadly. The PO advised me to just run antifreeze through the raw-water cooling system until it comes out the exhaust. My main question is how to get the antifreeze into the raw water intake. I've seen a gadget made from a toilet plunger with a garden hose plumbed into the rubber cone, that can be held over the raw water intake with the other end of the hose in a bucket of antifreeze. Any other recommended techniques? Any other general tips on properly winterizing an A4? Thanks, Randy ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated! ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
When my A4 was raw water cooled I did it like so: The water intake hose goes into a big 5 gallon bucket full of anti-freeze. I put a hose on the exhaust that does the same. The engine pumps the anti-freeze around and around and when it gets up to temp I shut it off and change the oil. This can be done in or out of the water. Joe Coquina C&C 35 MK I From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Danny Haughey via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 10:50 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Danny Haughey Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4 Marek, the worry is back-filling through the exhaust. if the engine is not running there is a very real risk of water going in through the exhaust manifold because there is no pressure from the exhaust of the running engine pushing the water out. It is the same issue if you are having trouble starting the engine and you let the starter continue to turn everything for an extended time without the engine firing. It is a well documented issue on the Moyer Marine forums. The cooling pump itself is what pumps the water in during difficulty starting while turning the starter. Danny On 10/11/2016 10:42 AM, Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List wrote: You have to connect the shopvac _after_ the water pump. If your water pump is any good it will not allow anything to pass through it (when it Is not turning). And if it does, you have to change the impeller. Marek From: Kevin Deluzio via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 07:25 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Cc: Kevin Deluzio Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4 My first haul-out with a new-to-me 1980 C&C30 with an Atomic 4 as well. I like the idea of using the shop-vac to blow the water out. Do you connect that to the same location - at water intake hose disconnected from seacock ? Kevin From: Josh Muckley mailto:muckl...@gmail.com>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4 Date: October 10, 2016 at 10:27:53 PM EDT To: "C&C List" mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> You can plumb in auxiliary suctions that will let you draw glycol straight out of the jug. If you haul the boat you can stuff a tygon hose up the through hull and beer bong the glycol into the engine. Or you can try the seaflush. I have one and it works, though it might be a bit over priced. I like using the shop vac to blow the water out. That may actually be sufficient. I am cautious though and carefully consider the possibility of stagnant loops of water. So, despite "blowing out" the engine, I also run glycol. The nice thing is that I don't have to worry as much about the water diluting the glycol. It takes way less glycol to provide freeze protection. http://www.seaflush.com/sea-flush-1/ Josh Muckley S/V Sea Hawk 1989 C&C 37+ Solomons, MD On Oct 10, 2016 9:50 PM, "RANDY via CnC-List" mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote: My first haul-out with my 30-1 (purchased in January) is coming up in a few weeks, sadly. The PO advised me to just run antifreeze through the raw-water cooling system until it comes out the exhaust. My main question is how to get the antifreeze into the raw water intake. I've seen a gadget made from a toilet plunger with a garden hose plumbed into the rubber cone, that can be held over the raw water intake with the other end of the hose in a bucket of antifreeze. Any other recommended techniques? Any other general tips on properly winterizing an A4? Thanks, Randy ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated! ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
Marek, the worry is back-filling through the exhaust. if the engine is not running there is a very real risk of water going in through the exhaust manifold because there is no pressure from the exhaust of the running engine pushing the water out. It is the same issue if you are having trouble starting the engine and you let the starter continue to turn everything for an extended time without the engine firing. It is a well documented issue on the Moyer Marine forums. The cooling pump itself is what pumps the water in during difficulty starting while turning the starter. Danny On 10/11/2016 10:42 AM, Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List wrote: You have to connect the shopvac _after_ the water pump. If your water pump is any good it will not allow anything to pass through it (when it Is not turning). And if it does, you have to change the impeller. Marek *From:* Kevin Deluzio via CnC-List *Sent:* Tuesday, October 11, 2016 07:25 *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com *Cc:* Kevin Deluzio *Subject:* Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4 My first haul-out with a new-to-me 1980 C&C30 with an Atomic 4 as well. I like the idea of using the shop-vac to blow the water out. Do you connect that to the same location - at water intake hose disconnected from seacock ? Kevin *From:*Josh Muckley *Subject:**Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4* *Date:*October 10, 2016 at 10:27:53 PM EDT *To:*"C&C List" You can plumb in auxiliary suctions that will let you draw glycol straight out of the jug. If you haul the boat you can stuff a tygon hose up the through hull and beer bong the glycol into the engine. Or you can try the seaflush. I have one and it works, though it might be a bit over priced. I like using the shop vac to blow the water out. That may actually be sufficient. I am cautious though and carefully consider the possibility of stagnant loops of water. So, despite "blowing out" the engine, I also run glycol. The nice thing is that I don't have to worry as much about the water diluting the glycol. It takes way less glycol to provide freeze protection. http://www.seaflush.com/sea-flush-1/ Josh Muckley S/V Sea Hawk 1989 C&C 37+ Solomons, MD On Oct 10, 2016 9:50 PM, "RANDY via CnC-List" wrote: My first haul-out with my 30-1 (purchased in January) is coming up in a few weeks, sadly. The PO advised me to just run antifreeze through the raw-water cooling system until it comes out the exhaust. My main question is how to get the antifreeze into the raw water intake. I've seen a gadget made from a toilet plunger with a garden hose plumbed into the rubber cone, that can be held over the raw water intake with the other end of the hose in a bucket of antifreeze. Any other recommended techniques? Any other general tips on properly winterizing an A4? Thanks, Randy ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated! ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
You have to connect the shopvac _after_ the water pump. If your water pump is any good it will not allow anything to pass through it (when it Is not turning). And if it does, you have to change the impeller. Marek From: Kevin Deluzio via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 07:25 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Kevin Deluzio Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4 My first haul-out with a new-to-me 1980 C&C30 with an Atomic 4 as well. I like the idea of using the shop-vac to blow the water out. Do you connect that to the same location - at water intake hose disconnected from seacock ? Kevin From: Josh Muckley Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4 Date: October 10, 2016 at 10:27:53 PM EDT To: "C&C List" You can plumb in auxiliary suctions that will let you draw glycol straight out of the jug. If you haul the boat you can stuff a tygon hose up the through hull and beer bong the glycol into the engine. Or you can try the seaflush. I have one and it works, though it might be a bit over priced. I like using the shop vac to blow the water out. That may actually be sufficient. I am cautious though and carefully consider the possibility of stagnant loops of water. So, despite "blowing out" the engine, I also run glycol. The nice thing is that I don't have to worry as much about the water diluting the glycol. It takes way less glycol to provide freeze protection. http://www.seaflush.com/sea-flush-1/ Josh Muckley S/V Sea Hawk 1989 C&C 37+ Solomons, MD On Oct 10, 2016 9:50 PM, "RANDY via CnC-List" wrote: My first haul-out with my 30-1 (purchased in January) is coming up in a few weeks, sadly. The PO advised me to just run antifreeze through the raw-water cooling system until it comes out the exhaust. My main question is how to get the antifreeze into the raw water intake. I've seen a gadget made from a toilet plunger with a garden hose plumbed into the rubber cone, that can be held over the raw water intake with the other end of the hose in a bucket of antifreeze. Any other recommended techniques? Any other general tips on properly winterizing an A4? Thanks, Randy ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
I use stabilizer and don't bother running the carb dry. I don't know if I buy that bit of logic anyway because the bowl doesn't empty just because you run the carb "dry". There's still fuel in there, that's my layman's understanding, anyway. So I stick to the K.I.S.S principle and don't mess with running the fuel lines dry. Marvel Myster Oil in the spark plugs before winter is an excellent suggestion, I do that too - then I hand crank a few times to circulate the oil. So far I've never had any issues with the old A4. It gets new plugs, new ignition components and fresh oil more than regularly. Steve Suhana, C&C 32 Toronto On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 9:02 AM, Danny Haughey via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > When I had an A4, I would typically just pull the hose off the through > hull and stick it in a jug of glycol, start the engine and let it run until > I saw it at the exhaust.. I'd usually do another gallon after it started > coming out the exhaust. easy peasy! You DO NOT want to add pressure to > the intake side if you're still connected at the exhaust without the engine > running. You will push water into the engine. It is best to use the > engine's usual working condition to pull the glycol through. If you have a > thermostat, run the engine on fresh water until it warms up. You can just > run a hose into a bucket and suck the water through the same way you would > with the glycol. With a thermostat that will only take a few minutes. > > This is exactly the same way I do my current diesel engine. > > Moyer also suggests pulling the plugs and adding some marvel mystery oil > to each cylinder. He also recommends running some MMO in the gas. > > Remember to cut the gas valve and run the engine out of gas or fog it or > something so that gas isn't sitting in the bowl all winter. > > Danny > > On 10/11/2016 7:24 AM, Kevin Deluzio via CnC-List wrote: > > My first haul-out with a new-to-me 1980 C&C30 with an Atomic 4 as well. I > like the idea of using the shop-vac to blow the water out. Do you connect > that to the same location - at water intake hose disconnected from seacock ? > > Kevin > > > > > *From: *Josh Muckley > *Subject: **Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4* > *Date: *October 10, 2016 at 10:27:53 PM EDT > *To: *"C&C List" > > > You can plumb in auxiliary suctions that will let you draw glycol straight > out of the jug. If you haul the boat you can stuff a tygon hose up the > through hull and beer bong the glycol into the engine. Or you can try the > seaflush. I have one and it works, though it might be a bit over priced. > I like using the shop vac to blow the water out. That may actually be > sufficient. I am cautious though and carefully consider the possibility > of stagnant loops of water. So, despite "blowing out" the engine, I also > run glycol. The nice thing is that I don't have to worry as much about the > water diluting the glycol. It takes way less glycol to provide freeze > protection. > > http://www.seaflush.com/sea-flush-1/ > > Josh Muckley > S/V Sea Hawk > 1989 C&C 37+ > Solomons, MD > > On Oct 10, 2016 9:50 PM, "RANDY via CnC-List" > wrote: > >> My first haul-out with my 30-1 (purchased in January) is coming up in a >> few weeks, sadly. The PO advised me to just run antifreeze through the >> raw-water cooling system until it comes out the exhaust. My main question >> is how to get the antifreeze into the raw water intake. I've seen a gadget >> made from a toilet plunger with a garden hose plumbed into the rubber cone, >> that can be held over the raw water intake with the other end of the hose >> in a bucket of antifreeze. Any other recommended techniques? Any other >> general tips on properly winterizing an A4? >> >> Thanks, >> Randy >> >> >> > > > ___ > > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like > what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions > are greatly appreciated! > > > > ___ > > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you > like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All > Contributions are greatly appreciated! > > ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
When I had an A4, I would typically just pull the hose off the through hull and stick it in a jug of glycol, start the engine and let it run until I saw it at the exhaust.. I'd usually do another gallon after it started coming out the exhaust. easy peasy! You DO NOT want to add pressure to the intake side if you're still connected at the exhaust without the engine running. You will push water into the engine. It is best to use the engine's usual working condition to pull the glycol through. If you have a thermostat, run the engine on fresh water until it warms up. You can just run a hose into a bucket and suck the water through the same way you would with the glycol. With a thermostat that will only take a few minutes. This is exactly the same way I do my current diesel engine. Moyer also suggests pulling the plugs and adding some marvel mystery oil to each cylinder. He also recommends running some MMO in the gas. Remember to cut the gas valve and run the engine out of gas or fog it or something so that gas isn't sitting in the bowl all winter. Danny On 10/11/2016 7:24 AM, Kevin Deluzio via CnC-List wrote: My first haul-out with a new-to-me 1980 C&C30 with an Atomic 4 as well. I like the idea of using the shop-vac to blow the water out. Do you connect that to the same location - at water intake hose disconnected from seacock ? Kevin *From:*Josh Muckley mailto:muckl...@gmail.com>> *Subject:**Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4* *Date:*October 10, 2016 at 10:27:53 PM EDT *To:*"C&C List" mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> You can plumb in auxiliary suctions that will let you draw glycol straight out of the jug. If you haul the boat you can stuff a tygon hose up the through hull and beer bong the glycol into the engine. Or you can try the seaflush. I have one and it works, though it might be a bit over priced. I like using the shop vac to blow the water out. That may actually be sufficient. I am cautious though and carefully consider the possibility of stagnant loops of water. So, despite "blowing out" the engine, I also run glycol. The nice thing is that I don't have to worry as much about the water diluting the glycol. It takes way less glycol to provide freeze protection. http://www.seaflush.com/sea-flush-1/ Josh Muckley S/V Sea Hawk 1989 C&C 37+ Solomons, MD On Oct 10, 2016 9:50 PM, "RANDY via CnC-List" <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote: My first haul-out with my 30-1 (purchased in January) is coming up in a few weeks, sadly. The PO advised me to just run antifreeze through the raw-water cooling system until it comes out the exhaust. My main question is how to get the antifreeze into the raw water intake. I've seen a gadget made from a toilet plunger with a garden hose plumbed into the rubber cone, that can be held over the raw water intake with the other end of the hose in a bucket of antifreeze. Any other recommended techniques? Any other general tips on properly winterizing an A4? Thanks, Randy ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated! ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
My first haul-out with a new-to-me 1980 C&C30 with an Atomic 4 as well. I like the idea of using the shop-vac to blow the water out. Do you connect that to the same location - at water intake hose disconnected from seacock ? Kevin > From: Josh Muckley mailto:muckl...@gmail.com>> > Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4 > Date: October 10, 2016 at 10:27:53 PM EDT > To: "C&C List" mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> > > > You can plumb in auxiliary suctions that will let you draw glycol straight > out of the jug. If you haul the boat you can stuff a tygon hose up the > through hull and beer bong the glycol into the engine. Or you can try the > seaflush. I have one and it works, though it might be a bit over priced. I > like using the shop vac to blow the water out. That may actually be > sufficient. I am cautious though and carefully consider the possibility of > stagnant loops of water. So, despite "blowing out" the engine, I also run > glycol. The nice thing is that I don't have to worry as much about the water > diluting the glycol. It takes way less glycol to provide freeze protection. > > http://www.seaflush.com/sea-flush-1/ <http://www.seaflush.com/sea-flush-1/> > Josh Muckley > S/V Sea Hawk > 1989 C&C 37+ > Solomons, MD > > > On Oct 10, 2016 9:50 PM, "RANDY via CnC-List" <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote: > My first haul-out with my 30-1 (purchased in January) is coming up in a few > weeks, sadly. The PO advised me to just run antifreeze through the raw-water > cooling system until it comes out the exhaust. My main question is how to > get the antifreeze into the raw water intake. I've seen a gadget made from a > toilet plunger with a garden hose plumbed into the rubber cone, that can be > held over the raw water intake with the other end of the hose in a bucket of > antifreeze. Any other recommended techniques? Any other general tips on > properly winterizing an A4? > > Thanks, > Randy > > ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
Different engine, but the same procedure. I take the intake hose off the seacock and connect a length of hose (about 2 m (6-7 Ft)). This goes into a bucket (e.g. from home depot, 5 gal). I run a garden hose to it from a water supply. I fill the bucket with water and start the engine. This way you can run the engine as long as you want (e.g. until it warms up). You regulate the level of the water in the bucket by adjusting the throttle and the flow of water. When the engine is warm enough, I stop it. Now I replace the water with antifreeze. A few gallons should be enough. In my Perkins I use almost a full bucket (antifreeze is cheap, engine parts are not). When the AF is gone from the bucket, I stop the engine. My long hose is almost transparent so I can time it, so there is very little AF left in it. If you want to be sure, you can capture some of the AF coming out of the exhaust and check with a $15 refractometer. This method helps with changing the oil- the engine is warm. You can push the water out of the muffler with a shopvac half way through. Marek C270, “Legato” Ottawa, ON Sent from Mail<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows 10 From: RANDY via CnC-List<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Sent: October 10, 2016 21:50 To: cnc-list<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Cc: RANDY<mailto:randy.staff...@comcast.net> Subject: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4 My first haul-out with my 30-1 (purchased in January) is coming up in a few weeks, sadly. The PO advised me to just run antifreeze through the raw-water cooling system until it comes out the exhaust. My main question is how to get the antifreeze into the raw water intake. I've seen a gadget made from a toilet plunger with a garden hose plumbed into the rubber cone, that can be held over the raw water intake with the other end of the hose in a bucket of antifreeze. Any other recommended techniques? Any other general tips on properly winterizing an A4? Thanks, Randy ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
I just disconnect the intake hose from the seacock and stick it into a bottle of antifreeze. I'm running without thermostat however so it's simple. If you're new with the A4 a great resource is moyer marine. The forums there are really helpful. Steve Suhana, C&C 32 Toronto On Mon, Oct 10, 2016 at 9:49 PM, RANDY via CnC-List wrote: > My first haul-out with my 30-1 (purchased in January) is coming up in a > few weeks, sadly. The PO advised me to just run antifreeze through the > raw-water cooling system until it comes out the exhaust. My main question > is how to get the antifreeze into the raw water intake. I've seen a gadget > made from a toilet plunger with a garden hose plumbed into the rubber cone, > that can be held over the raw water intake with the other end of the hose > in a bucket of antifreeze. Any other recommended techniques? Any other > general tips on properly winterizing an A4? > > Thanks, > Randy > > ___ > > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you > like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All > Contributions are greatly appreciated! > > ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Re: Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
You can plumb in auxiliary suctions that will let you draw glycol straight out of the jug. If you haul the boat you can stuff a tygon hose up the through hull and beer bong the glycol into the engine. Or you can try the seaflush. I have one and it works, though it might be a bit over priced. I like using the shop vac to blow the water out. That may actually be sufficient. I am cautious though and carefully consider the possibility of stagnant loops of water. So, despite "blowing out" the engine, I also run glycol. The nice thing is that I don't have to worry as much about the water diluting the glycol. It takes way less glycol to provide freeze protection. http://www.seaflush.com/sea-flush-1/ Josh Muckley S/V Sea Hawk 1989 C&C 37+ Solomons, MD On Oct 10, 2016 9:50 PM, "RANDY via CnC-List" wrote: > My first haul-out with my 30-1 (purchased in January) is coming up in a > few weeks, sadly. The PO advised me to just run antifreeze through the > raw-water cooling system until it comes out the exhaust. My main question > is how to get the antifreeze into the raw water intake. I've seen a gadget > made from a toilet plunger with a garden hose plumbed into the rubber cone, > that can be held over the raw water intake with the other end of the hose > in a bucket of antifreeze. Any other recommended techniques? Any other > general tips on properly winterizing an A4? > > Thanks, > Randy > > ___ > > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you > like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All > Contributions are greatly appreciated! > > ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
Stus-List Winterizing an Atomic 4
My first haul-out with my 30-1 (purchased in January) is coming up in a few weeks, sadly. The PO advised me to just run antifreeze through the raw-water cooling system until it comes out the exhaust. My main question is how to get the antifreeze into the raw water intake. I've seen a gadget made from a toilet plunger with a garden hose plumbed into the rubber cone, that can be held over the raw water intake with the other end of the hose in a bucket of antifreeze. Any other recommended techniques? Any other general tips on properly winterizing an A4? Thanks, Randy ___ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
