Re: Renaming the "QA Hackathon"?

[David Golden]

Perl Toolchain Summit
On Apr 9, 2016 10:28 AM, "David Cantrell"  wrote:

> I think the word you're looking for is symposium. Although I think
> hackathon is just fine.
>
> --
> David Cantrell
>
> This electrogram was despatched by wireless field telegraph. I would
> therefore ask that the recipient be so kind as to excuse any failures of
> courtesy or linguistic inelegance as an unfortunate side-effect of the
> technology.
>
> > On 9 Apr 2016, at 15:11, James E Keenan  wrote:
> >
> >> On 04/09/2016 09:06 AM, Neil Bowers wrote:
> >> I’ve added a topic to the wiki page for “topics for discussion” at the
> QAH:
> >>
> > [snip]
> >> There’s a well-established definition for “hackathon” these days, and
> the QAH is not one of those. As a result when talking to potential
> sponsors, we have to be careful to define what the event is, how it works,
> and the attitude towards the output(s). I’ve had plenty of discussions
> explaining “no, not that kind of hackathon”.
> >>
> >> Ie people who aren’t already familiar with the QAH hear “4-day …
> hackathon” and think something along the lines of:
> >>
> >> So you’re going to get together and lash things up in a frenzy, in
> teams competing against each other.
> >>
> >
> > I concede that the predominant use of the term "hackathon" these days is
> a highly competitive event where teams compete against one another under
> time pressure.  That's true both within private companies and in cases
> where, say, a government body open-sources its data and seeks new "apps".
> >
> > Once again, Perl is different -- and that's not a difference that we
> should relinquish.  I count my participation in the Chicago hackathon Andy
> and Pete organized in November 2006 as my entry point into real
> collaboration with other members of the Perl community.  All the hackathons
> that I have participated in since then -- including at least four which I
> have organized[1] -- have emphasized collaboration and contributions to the
> Perl ecosphere rather than competition.  None have awarded prizes.
> >
> > The Perl QA Hackathon is, admittedly, somewhat unique among Perl
> hackathons in that it is an admittedly elite event where funds are raised
> to bring together Perl experts from around the world to work in a more
> focused way and to develop consensus around proposals for the evolution of
> the Perl infrastructure.  For that, you need, some serious funds, probably
> in at least five figures.
> >
> > Of the hackathons I myself have organized, only one needed donations in
> any form other than the venue, and in that case the donor had a budget for
> open-source contributions which had to be spent.  We would have been more
> than happy with just the venue, but the extra contributions did enable us
> to provide transportation costs for five people from outside our area to
> serve as hackathon mentors.
> >
> > I think the larger question of "How do we raise money for Perl events
> even when they don't conform to larger corporate or societal expectations?"
> is a good one, and I thank Neil for kicking off the discussion.  But I
> share Kent's skepticism about alternative names as an easy answer to that
> question.
> >
> > Thank you very much.
> > Jim Keenan
> >
> > [1] My earlier thoughts on hackathons:
> >
> > "How to Get the Most Out of a Hackathon":
> > http://thenceforward.net/perl/yapc/YAPC-NA-2007/houslight/index.html
> >
> > "Let's Have a Distributed Perl Hackathon":
> >
> http://blogs.perl.org/users/kid51/2012/10/lets-have-a-distributed-perl-hackathon.html
> >
> > "New York Perl Hackathon A Success":
> >
> http://blogs.perl.org/users/kid51/2013/03/new-york-perl-hackathon-a-success.html
> >
>
>

Re: Renaming the "QA Hackathon"?

[Kent Fredric]

On 10 April 2016 at 03:45, David Golden  wrote:
> Perl Toolchain Summit


Because "Toolchain" is not really a word that necessarily makes sense
outside Perl, you can use "Infrastructure" or even "Critical
Infrastructure" in its stead.  ( I personally like Critical, its a
very spicy word, and accurately reflects the propensity of this sphere
of things to either go pear shaped or steal your SAN Cookies )

Also, depending on how many words you want to spend, throwing "Annual"
in there might help give some context to how frequently these things
happen.

The narrative you want to be carrying in your words is:

"Every year, we get all our brightest in one place and discuss and
work on the most pressing and important problems that affect the the
broadest number of concerns in the Perl+CPAN ecosystem"

-- 
Kent

KENTNL - https://metacpan.org/author/KENTNL

Re: Renaming the "QA Hackathon"?

[Karen Etheridge]

When I saw this thread title I thought it was going to be discussing the
"QA" part of it, and I thought "yeah, right on!".. I totally agree with
Neil's points about what we do not being a "hackathon" though.

..And I also like the idea of changing the QA bit to Infrastructure.

Perl Infrastructure  gets a vote from me.


On Sat, Apr 9, 2016 at 8:50 AM, Kent Fredric  wrote:

> On 10 April 2016 at 03:45, David Golden  wrote:
> > Perl Toolchain Summit
>
>
> Because "Toolchain" is not really a word that necessarily makes sense
> outside Perl, you can use "Infrastructure" or even "Critical
> Infrastructure" in its stead.  ( I personally like Critical, its a
> very spicy word, and accurately reflects the propensity of this sphere
> of things to either go pear shaped or steal your SAN Cookies )
>
> Also, depending on how many words you want to spend, throwing "Annual"
> in there might help give some context to how frequently these things
> happen.
>
> The narrative you want to be carrying in your words is:
>
> "Every year, we get all our brightest in one place and discuss and
> work on the most pressing and important problems that affect the the
> broadest number of concerns in the Perl+CPAN ecosystem"
>
> --
> Kent
>
> KENTNL - https://metacpan.org/author/KENTNL
>

Re: Renaming the "QA Hackathon"?

[Sawyer X]

Merging the suggestions I saw so far:

Perl Annual Critical Infrastructure Summit.

A mouthful, and not a fun acronym.

On Sat, Apr 9, 2016 at 6:16 PM, Karen Etheridge  wrote:
> When I saw this thread title I thought it was going to be discussing the
> "QA" part of it, and I thought "yeah, right on!".. I totally agree with
> Neil's points about what we do not being a "hackathon" though.
>
> ..And I also like the idea of changing the QA bit to Infrastructure.
>
> Perl Infrastructure  gets a vote from me.
>
>
> On Sat, Apr 9, 2016 at 8:50 AM, Kent Fredric  wrote:
>>
>> On 10 April 2016 at 03:45, David Golden  wrote:
>> > Perl Toolchain Summit
>>
>>
>> Because "Toolchain" is not really a word that necessarily makes sense
>> outside Perl, you can use "Infrastructure" or even "Critical
>> Infrastructure" in its stead.  ( I personally like Critical, its a
>> very spicy word, and accurately reflects the propensity of this sphere
>> of things to either go pear shaped or steal your SAN Cookies )
>>
>> Also, depending on how many words you want to spend, throwing "Annual"
>> in there might help give some context to how frequently these things
>> happen.
>>
>> The narrative you want to be carrying in your words is:
>>
>> "Every year, we get all our brightest in one place and discuss and
>> work on the most pressing and important problems that affect the the
>> broadest number of concerns in the Perl+CPAN ecosystem"
>>
>> --
>> Kent
>>
>> KENTNL - https://metacpan.org/author/KENTNL
>
>

Re: Renaming the "QA Hackathon"?

[David Cantrell]

I think the word you're looking for is symposium. Although I think hackathon is 
just fine.

-- 
David Cantrell

This electrogram was despatched by wireless field telegraph. I would therefore 
ask that the recipient be so kind as to excuse any failures of courtesy or 
linguistic inelegance as an unfortunate side-effect of the technology.

> On 9 Apr 2016, at 15:11, James E Keenan  wrote:
> 
>> On 04/09/2016 09:06 AM, Neil Bowers wrote:
>> I’ve added a topic to the wiki page for “topics for discussion” at the QAH:
>> 
> [snip]
>> There’s a well-established definition for “hackathon” these days, and the 
>> QAH is not one of those. As a result when talking to potential sponsors, we 
>> have to be careful to define what the event is, how it works, and the 
>> attitude towards the output(s). I’ve had plenty of discussions explaining 
>> “no, not that kind of hackathon”.
>> 
>> Ie people who aren’t already familiar with the QAH hear “4-day … hackathon” 
>> and think something along the lines of:
>> 
>> So you’re going to get together and lash things up in a frenzy, in teams 
>> competing against each other.
>> 
> 
> I concede that the predominant use of the term "hackathon" these days is a 
> highly competitive event where teams compete against one another under time 
> pressure.  That's true both within private companies and in cases where, say, 
> a government body open-sources its data and seeks new "apps".
> 
> Once again, Perl is different -- and that's not a difference that we should 
> relinquish.  I count my participation in the Chicago hackathon Andy and Pete 
> organized in November 2006 as my entry point into real collaboration with 
> other members of the Perl community.  All the hackathons that I have 
> participated in since then -- including at least four which I have 
> organized[1] -- have emphasized collaboration and contributions to the Perl 
> ecosphere rather than competition.  None have awarded prizes.
> 
> The Perl QA Hackathon is, admittedly, somewhat unique among Perl hackathons 
> in that it is an admittedly elite event where funds are raised to bring 
> together Perl experts from around the world to work in a more focused way and 
> to develop consensus around proposals for the evolution of the Perl 
> infrastructure.  For that, you need, some serious funds, probably in at least 
> five figures.
> 
> Of the hackathons I myself have organized, only one needed donations in any 
> form other than the venue, and in that case the donor had a budget for 
> open-source contributions which had to be spent.  We would have been more 
> than happy with just the venue, but the extra contributions did enable us to 
> provide transportation costs for five people from outside our area to serve 
> as hackathon mentors.
> 
> I think the larger question of "How do we raise money for Perl events even 
> when they don't conform to larger corporate or societal expectations?" is a 
> good one, and I thank Neil for kicking off the discussion.  But I share 
> Kent's skepticism about alternative names as an easy answer to that question.
> 
> Thank you very much.
> Jim Keenan
> 
> [1] My earlier thoughts on hackathons:
> 
> "How to Get the Most Out of a Hackathon":
> http://thenceforward.net/perl/yapc/YAPC-NA-2007/houslight/index.html
> 
> "Let's Have a Distributed Perl Hackathon":
> http://blogs.perl.org/users/kid51/2012/10/lets-have-a-distributed-perl-hackathon.html
> 
> "New York Perl Hackathon A Success":
> http://blogs.perl.org/users/kid51/2013/03/new-york-perl-hackathon-a-success.html
> 

Renaming the "QA Hackathon"?

[Neil Bowers]

I’ve added a topic to the wiki page for “topics for discussion” at the QAH:

Should we rename this event?

Eg to “Perl QA Workshop”, or something like that.

There’s a well-established definition for “hackathon” these days, and the QAH 
is not one of those. As a result when talking to potential sponsors, we have to 
be careful to define what the event is, how it works, and the attitude towards 
the output(s). I’ve had plenty of discussions explaining “no, not that kind of 
hackathon”.

Ie people who aren’t already familiar with the QAH hear “4-day … hackathon” and 
think something along the lines of:

So you’re going to get together and lash things up in a frenzy, in teams 
competing against each other.

Uh, no.

Producing the number of sponsors we have requires contacting an awful lot more 
companies and organisations, and I wonder how many of them skim it and think:

So they want some money to get together for a hackathon?

We don’t support hackathons.

And then don’t bother replying. Or just reply with a “no”, which obviously we 
have to respect.

On the flip side, it’s an established name, which is being held for the 9th 
time this year.

I’m not saying “we must change the name!", but think we should consider it.

Neil

Re: Renaming the "QA Hackathon"?

[Kent Fredric]

On 10 April 2016 at 04:49, Sawyer X  wrote:
> Perl Annual Critical Infrastructure Summit.


Perl Infrastructural Engineering Summit.

PIES.  :D


Summit of Perl Infrastructural Critical Engineering.

SPICE.

Hth.

-- 
Kent

KENTNL - https://metacpan.org/author/KENTNL