Re: [css-d] Pragmatic look at our CSS future - ripped from: TheCSSOverlords
Erika Meyer wrote: James Leslie wrote: I'd like to hear from one of these IT people who have held back our entire industry, and wasted everyone's money for so much time now. Exactly how long are you going to leave it before migrating this c...@ppy IE6-only application you've forced on everyone? Another month? A year? A decade? Are you ever going to let the rest of us move on? --- I was recently employed by a company that primarily ran IE6; a place that blocked employees from installing/upgrading their own software. The IT supervisor in meetings, (due to a new CMS) was telling people Firefox is now our recommended browser. I said to her, You say that Firefox is the recommended browser, but a lot of people don't have access to that browser, and most are still only running IE6. Who is in charge of making software upgrades? I am, she replied. So is there any particular reason IE6 is still the only browser on people's machines? No really, she replied. So there's one voice for you. Here's another voice for you (the System Architect for my employer, the final authority when it comes to what software is allowed to run on corporate systems) when informed by some on the web team that they needed to be able to test websites in Firefox: Firefox may only be used for testing. _You will have problems browsing websites with it._ Another reason for sticking with only one standard web browser: many corporations reduce their help desk load and costs by only supporting one version of any piece of software. For example, the many that used to have Word and Wordperfect but have forced everyone to use Word. If they have strong business reasons requiring the use of IE6, why should they add to their desktop support costs by putting another browser on the desktop? I saw a study somewhere (I think Google did it? or someone else?) that analyzed actual web pages for use of CSS, HTML, etc. The old, non-cutting edge stuff like tables for layout is by far still the most common way of doing things ... -- David gn...@hawaii.rr.com authenticity, honesty, community __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Pragmatic look at our CSS future - ripped from: TheCSSOverlords
I work with major blue-chip companies in the UK, and can say that well over 90% of our clients would not accept an unsupported IE6. IE6 currently has roughly 20% of the market share of the browser market, which is around 4-5 times as much as Safari and Opera combined, and only just shy of Firefox's market share. Our clients DO compare sites next to each other in different browsers, and want as similar an experience as possible for people regardless of which browser they use. I happen to think that as web designers/developers we have a responsibility to ensure that our sites are as viewable as possible to as wide an audience as possible. The fact that 1 in 5 users are using an inferior browser that we have to work hard to bring up to speed, is often no more their fault than our own. J __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Pragmatic look at our CSS future - ripped from: TheCSSOverlords
From: Ingo Chao When clients are comparing the similarity of user experience, they DO look at performance issues in IE too, I assume. So what does it costs to make the page look really equal? To be honest the cost to us is very small in terms of time, and therefore financially. We make microsites which may have a bearing on the complexity, but I normally find that an hour or 2 spent sorting out IE bugs is fine now (it used to be a lot more but experience is a great benefit in spotting various bugs and dealing with them quickly!). The main 'cost' is that we use very little CSS3, substantially less than I would for personal projects __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Pragmatic look at our CSS future - ripped from: TheCSSOverlords
But I did not say let us drop support for IE6. And the page should of course stay viewable and usable. The market share of IE6 will not sink under 1% soon, and even if, 1% paying users are still a lot, so statistics about marketshare are currently pointless: you simply cannot ignore IE. When clients are comparing the similarity of user experience, they DO look at performance issues in IE too, I assume. So what does it costs to make the page look really equal? Ingo __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Pragmatic look at our CSS future - ripped from: TheCSSOverlords
I'd like to hear from one of these IT people who have held back our entire industry, and wasted everyone's money for so much time now. Exactly how long are you going to leave it before migrating this c...@ppy IE6-only application you've forced on everyone? Another month? A year? A decade? Are you ever going to let the rest of us move on? Just a guess, but I suspect that these people won't frequent this list :-) __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Pragmatic look at our CSS future - ripped from: TheCSSOverlords
James Leslie wrote: I'd like to hear from one of these IT people who have held back our entire industry, and wasted everyone's money for so much time now. Exactly how long are you going to leave it before migrating this c...@ppy IE6-only application you've forced on everyone? Another month? A year? A decade? Are you ever going to let the rest of us move on? --- I was recently employed by a company that primarily ran IE6; a place that blocked employees from installing/upgrading their own software. The IT supervisor in meetings, (due to a new CMS) was telling people Firefox is now our recommended browser. I said to her, You say that Firefox is the recommended browser, but a lot of people don't have access to that browser, and most are still only running IE6. Who is in charge of making software upgrades? I am, she replied. So is there any particular reason IE6 is still the only browser on people's machines? No really, she replied. So there's one voice for you. Erika __ css-discuss [cs...@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
