Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[jys]

On Sat, Nov 2, 2019, at 13:39, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
> * jys  [11-02-19 16:03]:
>>
> > Each module has a default ordering number, when a module is moved it gets a 
> > new number between the numbers of its new neighbors. You can see these in 
> > the XMP file as lines like
> > 
> >   darktable:iop_order="8.0"
> > 
> > Modules which have been moved from their default location are likely to 
> > have non-zero values after the decimal point.
> > 
> > You can use the -d ioporder switch when launching dt to see information 
> > about this happening.
> 
> and how to find the default/original ioporder and to restore it?

Other than moving back to a point in the history  stack before you moved 
anything, there's no one-click method for this yet, but I believe it's planned. 
If you're not sure about what you're doing, I'd suggest working on a duplicate. 
You can always copy-and-paste selected new module settings back to the original 
(which should keep new ordering as much as possible). In general, though, 
changes to default ordering should only be done for a very deliberate reason 
(and unlike unintentional scrolling of sliders, it's pretty much impossible to 
do this by accident).

One thing worth noting: currently, creating a style doesn't store any changes 
to ordering, so if you create a style from a history stack which includes 
re-ordered modules, it won't recreate the ordering when applied, so don't try 
to use styles (or presets, for that matter) to apply module re-ordering. 
Hopefully there will eventually be a way to do this, but for now only 
copy/paste will apply re-ordering from one history stack to another.

-- 
jys
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[RLCH]

+1 


Sent from my Asus mobile 


On 2 Nov 2019 20:40, Patrick Shanahan  wrote: 

* jys  [11-02-19 16:03]: 
> On Sat, Nov 2, 2019, at 08:40, Christian wrote: 
> 
> > Anyway, I'm happy that the pixlpipe is no longer fixed. 
> 
> I'm happy that the unfixed pipe is mostly not broken... big thanks to all the 
> devs who banged their heads against all the many little problems (because 
> that shouldn't be thankless work!). 
> 
> > BTW how is the order stored in the XMP? I guess for every 
> > module a +/- offset to the default order is stored? 
> 
> Each module has a default ordering number, when a module is moved it gets a 
> new number between the numbers of its new neighbors. You can see these in the 
> XMP file as lines like 
> 
>   darktable:iop_order="8.0" 
> 
> Modules which have been moved from their default location are likely to have 
> non-zero values after the decimal point. 
> 
> You can use the -d ioporder switch when launching dt to see information about 
> this happening. 

and how to find the default/original ioporder and to restore it? 

-- 
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Patrick Shanahan]

* jys  [11-02-19 16:03]:
> On Sat, Nov 2, 2019, at 08:40, Christian wrote:
> 
> > Anyway, I'm happy that the pixlpipe is no longer fixed.
> 
> I'm happy that the unfixed pipe is mostly not broken... big thanks to all the 
> devs who banged their heads against all the many little problems (because 
> that shouldn't be thankless work!).
> 
> > BTW how is the order stored in the XMP? I guess for every
> > module a +/- offset to the default order is stored?
> 
> Each module has a default ordering number, when a module is moved it gets a 
> new number between the numbers of its new neighbors. You can see these in the 
> XMP file as lines like
> 
>   darktable:iop_order="8.0"
> 
> Modules which have been moved from their default location are likely to have 
> non-zero values after the decimal point.
> 
> You can use the -d ioporder switch when launching dt to see information about 
> this happening.

and how to find the default/original ioporder and to restore it?

-- 
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[jys]

On Sat, Nov 2, 2019, at 08:40, Christian wrote:

> Anyway, I'm happy that the pixlpipe is no longer fixed.

I'm happy that the unfixed pipe is mostly not broken... big thanks to all the 
devs who banged their heads against all the many little problems (because that 
shouldn't be thankless work!).

> BTW how is the order stored in the XMP? I guess for every
> module a +/- offset to the default order is stored?

Each module has a default ordering number, when a module is moved it gets a new 
number between the numbers of its new neighbors. You can see these in the XMP 
file as lines like

  darktable:iop_order="8.0"

Modules which have been moved from their default location are likely to have 
non-zero values after the decimal point.

You can use the -d ioporder switch when launching dt to see information about 
this happening.

-- 
jys
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[jys]

On Sat, Nov 2, 2019, at 01:49, Christian wrote:
> 
> With the crop coming first, the gradient on the picture is depending
> on the cropping!
>
> For me, the gradient filter belongs to the biginning of
> the pipe like it is the case for hardware filters,

That does seem a little bit weird, I'm not sure if there's a reason for it 
being that way, other than the one discussed below...

> and crop/rotate should be applied at the end of
> the pipe.

Well... this is where the analogy between non-destructive editors and paint 
type software breaks down somewhat... if the cropping module as currently 
implemented was at the end of the pipe, it would have to be recomputed for 
every little edit you made... this could be quite a performance hit if you had 
rotation and "keystoning" stuff enabled... as well as the fact that you would 
be processing image areas that would later be thrown away (although I think 
this might happen already in some cases). There may be other reasons too 
(including having the early-pipe vignetting I described earlier auto-scale to 
the cropped image!).

I seem to remember seeing some discussion from some time ago about moving the 
rotation and perspective functions out of the cropping module, maybe combining 
them with the lens correction module and reducing the number of interpolation 
operations... not sure what happened with that idea, but now that the major 
reworking is in place, maybe some of this stuff will eventually be reconsidered 
within the new context.

-- 
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[jys]

On Fri, Nov 1, 2019, at 17:53, Heiko Bauke wrote:

> Pixel pipe ordering is similar to working with several layers and 
> blending nodes in Gimp or Photoshop.  Here the order of the layers 
> matters as well and every serious user is aware of this.

Good analogy. Maybe a concrete example from my own recent usage would also show 
some of the utility of this feature...

The default position of the vignetting module near the end of the pipe is good 
for "effects", ranging from "moody insta-filter" to an opaque, sharply defined 
oval framing of the image. It's *not* good for realistically simulating actual 
lens vignetting. However, if you move this module to an earlier position, just 
after the cropping module... suddenly it does a very good job of this. If you 
move it to just before the cropping module, it can even do a not-terrible job 
of *compensating* actual lens vignetting. I have infinitely more use for both 
of these functions than the "effect" ones, and always use this module moved 
from its default location.

>From the discussions I've seen, the new lut 3D module will probably need to be 
>freely movable relative to other modules in order to be useful, due to the 
>varied nature of the transforms that its intended to apply.

It's a very useful feature, it's not rocket science, but it does require some 
common sense and a basic understanding of processing order (the kind that most 
people who have used layer-oriented image editing software already have)... and 
there's absolutely no *requirement* to mess with it - the default ordering is 
still as good as it ever was (actually a little better, in fact).

That said, I personally don't think that making a user change a default 
preference or perform some other basic "yes I RTFM" operation before the 
feature is exposed would be a bad thing.

-- 
jys
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Heiko Bauke]

Hi,

Am 02.11.19 um 01:36 schrieb Patrick Shanahan:

* Pascal Obry  [11-01-19 16:30]:

Le vendredi 01 novembre 2019 à 14:56 -0400, Patrick Shanahan a écrit :

fwiw, I believe the pp order should remain static and *only* the visual
list should be changable.


Amusing! You are probably saying that just because you don't know why
the pp can be reordered.


I would say that guessing that the majority of dt users would not
understand reordering.  just the math is beyond most, the why even more
so.


it might be sometimes difficult to understand why a particular module 
needs to be applied at a specific position in the pixel pipe. 
Therefore, darktable comes up with a reasonable default order. 
Understanding that the order of the pixel pipe _does_ matter (and 
therefore reordering might be useful in some situations) should be easy, 
however.


Pixel pipe ordering is similar to working with several layers and 
blending nodes in Gimp or Photoshop.  Here the order of the layers 
matters as well and every serious user is aware of this.



Heiko


--
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Patrick Shanahan]

* Pascal Obry  [11-01-19 16:30]:
> Le vendredi 01 novembre 2019 à 14:56 -0400, Patrick Shanahan a écrit :
> > fwiw, I believe the pp order should remain static and *only* the visual
> > list should be changable.
> 
> Amusing! You are probably saying that just because you don't know why
> the pp can be reordered.

I would say that guessing that the majority of dt users would not
understand reordering.  just the math is beyond most, the why even more
so.

-- 
(paka)Patrick Shanahan   Plainfield, Indiana, USA  @ptilopteri
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Pascal Obry]

Le vendredi 01 novembre 2019 à 14:56 -0400, Patrick Shanahan a écrit :
> fwiw, I believe the pp order should remain static and *only* the visual
> list should be changable.

Amusing! You are probably saying that just because you don't know why
the pp can be reordered.

-- 
  Pascal Obry /  Magny Les Hameaux (78)

  The best way to travel is by means of imagination

  http://www.obry.net

  gpg --keyserver keys.gnupg.net --recv-key F949BD3B

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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Bernhard]

Patrick Shanahan schrieb am 01.11.19 um 19:56:

fwiw, I believe the pp order should remain static and*only*  the visual
list should be changable.  BUT, if it is determined that pp order may be
altered, it should ONLY alterable within parameters where the order makes
sense.

That's what I wanted to express ...

--

regards
Bernhard

https://www.bilddateien.de

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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Julian Rickards]

Agreed

On Fri, Nov 1, 2019 at 3:15 PM jys  wrote:

>
>
> On Fri, Nov 1, 2019, at 10:33, Julian Rickards wrote:
> > My wishes and comments are GUI-only and related only to the Favourites
> tab.
> >
> > There is another conversation tied into this one about re-ordering the
> > modules in the PP list (the Active tab I suspect because it lists the
> > modules used, and their PP order).
> >
> > I suppose that the two conversations should be split.
>
> Yes, these are completely different things, and it's important that they
> don't become confused in the minds of users. Hopefully the OP was aware of
> what they were doing, since they referenced a video where it was shown.
>
> --
> jys
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[jys]

On Fri, Nov 1, 2019, at 10:33, Julian Rickards wrote:
> My wishes and comments are GUI-only and related only to the Favourites tab.
> 
> There is another conversation tied into this one about re-ordering the 
> modules in the PP list (the Active tab I suspect because it lists the 
> modules used, and their PP order).
> 
> I suppose that the two conversations should be split. 

Yes, these are completely different things, and it's important that they don't 
become confused in the minds of users. Hopefully the OP was aware of what they 
were doing, since they referenced a video where it was shown.

-- 
jys
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Patrick Shanahan]

* Julian Rickards  [11-01-19 13:36]:
> My wishes and comments are GUI-only and related only to the Favourites tab.
> 
> There is another conversation tied into this one about re-ordering the
> modules in the PP list (the Active tab I suspect because it lists the
> modules used, and their PP order).
> 
> I suppose that the two conversations should be split. Mine (re-ordering in
> Favourites) is a feature request that happened after the closing of the
> features (I only proposed it because that is when I thought of it) and
> perhaps discussion about re-ordering Favourites modules should be shelved
> until 3.0 is out and feature requests can be considered again.
> 
> On Fri, Nov 1, 2019 at 1:12 PM Bernhard 
> wrote:
> 
> > Until now I did not feel the need to change pp since the explanation
> > given seemed valid to me and I was happy with the results.
> > When I occasionally saw discussion about GUI improvement and module
> > order I always thought this is GUI only - which indeed would be a big
> > improvement for me.
> > Now everything seems to be different?
> > In my view there is a risk that the normal user deteriotes the result
> > more than it would help him - just a thought.
> >
> > --
> >
> > regards
> > Bernhard
> >
> > https://www.bilddateien.de
> >
> >
> >
> > Julian Rickards schrieb am 01.11.19 um 16:11:
> > > In my opinion, re-ordering the modules in the favourites shouldn't be
> > > a problem with the pp order. In the same way that you may have written
> > > down, on paper, the modules you want to use, in the order you want to
> > > use them, re-ordering favourites in this way shouldn't be any
> > > different. However, I had recently proposed this as a feature request
> > > (but after the closure of the feature requests so I didn't expect it
> > > to be acted upon for 3.0) and it turns out that a couple of others had
> > > requested this before me (how long before me? I don't know).
> > >
> > > I don't want to make a big deal of this or start throwing flames back
> > > and forth, I just thought this might be useful.
> > >
> > > On Fri, Nov 1, 2019 at 11:03 AM David Vincent-Jones
> > > mailto:david...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> > >
> > > I think that I am relieved  maybe ... hopefully I did not
> > > disturb the pp  now I am confused ... I simply wanted to put
> > > the favorites in my logical processing order.
> > >
> > > David
> > >
> > > On 01.11.19 14:18, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
> > >> * Pascal Obry  
> > [11-01-19 08:01]:
> > >>> David,
> > >>>
> >  Shurely  changing the order of the modules located in the
> >  'favorites' tab does not change the individual modules position in
> >  the pixel-pipeline?  that would be unthinkable!
> > >>> Of course it does! Re-ordering the iop is not for fun, it really
> > does
> > >>> change the pixel-pipe order.
> > >> then cryptomilk's reference should be corrected:
> > >>See
> > >>
> > https://www.darktable.org/usermanual/en/darkroom_concepts.html#pixelpipe
> > >>
> > >> as it indicated a static pixelpipe, and really allows unknowing
> > users
> > >> ample opportunity to "shoot themselves in their collective feet".
> > >>
> > >> also once changed there doesn't appear any option ot restore the
> > original
> > >> order to the pixelpipe.  ???
> > >>
> > >> tks,
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >  ___
> > > darktable developer mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to
> > > darktable-dev+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
> > > 
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > ___
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> >
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> >
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I agree that only the viewable order should be adjustable and that the pp
remain static as applied.

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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Patrick Shanahan]

* Bernhard  [11-01-19 13:17]:
> Until now I did not feel the need to change pp since the explanation given
> seemed valid to me and I was happy with the results.
> When I occasionally saw discussion about GUI improvement and module order I
> always thought this is GUI only - which indeed would be a big improvement
> for me.
> Now everything seems to be different?
> In my view there is a risk that the normal user deteriotes the result more
> than it would help him - just a thought.
> 
> -- 
> 
> regards
> Bernhard
> 
> https://www.bilddateien.de
> 
> 
> 
> Julian Rickards schrieb am 01.11.19 um 16:11:
> > In my opinion, re-ordering the modules in the favourites shouldn't be a
> > problem with the pp order. In the same way that you may have written
> > down, on paper, the modules you want to use, in the order you want to
> > use them, re-ordering favourites in this way shouldn't be any different.
> > However, I had recently proposed this as a feature request (but after
> > the closure of the feature requests so I didn't expect it to be acted
> > upon for 3.0) and it turns out that a couple of others had requested
> > this before me (how long before me? I don't know).
> > 
> > I don't want to make a big deal of this or start throwing flames back
> > and forth, I just thought this might be useful.
> > 
> > On Fri, Nov 1, 2019 at 11:03 AM David Vincent-Jones  > > wrote:
> > 
> > I think that I am relieved  maybe ... hopefully I did not
> > disturb the pp  now I am confused ... I simply wanted to put
> > the favorites in my logical processing order.
> > 
> > David
> > 
> > On 01.11.19 14:18, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
> > > * Pascal Obry    [11-01-19 
> > > 08:01]:
> > > > David,
> > > > 
> > > > > Shurely  changing the order of the modules located in the
> > > > > 'favorites' tab does not change the individual modules position in
> > > > > the pixel-pipeline?  that would be unthinkable!
> > > > Of course it does! Re-ordering the iop is not for fun, it really 
> > > > does
> > > > change the pixel-pipe order.
> > > then cryptomilk's reference should be corrected:
> > >See
> > >
> > > https://www.darktable.org/usermanual/en/darkroom_concepts.html#pixelpipe
> > > 
> > > as it indicated a static pixelpipe, and really allows unknowing users
> > > ample opportunity to "shoot themselves in their collective feet".
> > > 
> > > also once changed there doesn't appear any option ot restore the 
> > > original
> > > order to the pixelpipe.  ???
> > > 
> > > tks,
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ___
> > darktable developer mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to
> > darktable-dev+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ___
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> > darktable-dev+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
> 
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fwiw, I believe the pp order should remain static and *only* the visual
list should be changable.  BUT, if it is determined that pp order may be
altered, it should ONLY alterable within parameters where the order makes
sense.

-- 
(paka)Patrick Shanahan   Plainfield, Indiana, USA  @ptilopteri
http://en.opensuse.orgopenSUSE Community Memberfacebook/ptilopteri
Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/piwigo   paka @ IRCnet freenode
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Julian Rickards]

My wishes and comments are GUI-only and related only to the Favourites tab.

There is another conversation tied into this one about re-ordering the
modules in the PP list (the Active tab I suspect because it lists the
modules used, and their PP order).

I suppose that the two conversations should be split. Mine (re-ordering in
Favourites) is a feature request that happened after the closing of the
features (I only proposed it because that is when I thought of it) and
perhaps discussion about re-ordering Favourites modules should be shelved
until 3.0 is out and feature requests can be considered again.

On Fri, Nov 1, 2019 at 1:12 PM Bernhard 
wrote:

> Until now I did not feel the need to change pp since the explanation
> given seemed valid to me and I was happy with the results.
> When I occasionally saw discussion about GUI improvement and module
> order I always thought this is GUI only - which indeed would be a big
> improvement for me.
> Now everything seems to be different?
> In my view there is a risk that the normal user deteriotes the result
> more than it would help him - just a thought.
>
> --
>
> regards
> Bernhard
>
> https://www.bilddateien.de
>
>
>
> Julian Rickards schrieb am 01.11.19 um 16:11:
> > In my opinion, re-ordering the modules in the favourites shouldn't be
> > a problem with the pp order. In the same way that you may have written
> > down, on paper, the modules you want to use, in the order you want to
> > use them, re-ordering favourites in this way shouldn't be any
> > different. However, I had recently proposed this as a feature request
> > (but after the closure of the feature requests so I didn't expect it
> > to be acted upon for 3.0) and it turns out that a couple of others had
> > requested this before me (how long before me? I don't know).
> >
> > I don't want to make a big deal of this or start throwing flames back
> > and forth, I just thought this might be useful.
> >
> > On Fri, Nov 1, 2019 at 11:03 AM David Vincent-Jones
> > mailto:david...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > I think that I am relieved  maybe ... hopefully I did not
> > disturb the pp  now I am confused ... I simply wanted to put
> > the favorites in my logical processing order.
> >
> > David
> >
> > On 01.11.19 14:18, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
> >> * Pascal Obry  
> [11-01-19 08:01]:
> >>> David,
> >>>
>  Shurely  changing the order of the modules located in the
>  'favorites' tab does not change the individual modules position in
>  the pixel-pipeline?  that would be unthinkable!
> >>> Of course it does! Re-ordering the iop is not for fun, it really
> does
> >>> change the pixel-pipe order.
> >> then cryptomilk's reference should be corrected:
> >>See
> >>
> https://www.darktable.org/usermanual/en/darkroom_concepts.html#pixelpipe
> >>
> >> as it indicated a static pixelpipe, and really allows unknowing
> users
> >> ample opportunity to "shoot themselves in their collective feet".
> >>
> >> also once changed there doesn't appear any option ot restore the
> original
> >> order to the pixelpipe.  ???
> >>
> >> tks,
> >
> >
> >
>  ___
> > darktable developer mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to
> > darktable-dev+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
> > 
> >
> >
> >
> ___
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>
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Bernhard]

Until now I did not feel the need to change pp since the explanation 
given seemed valid to me and I was happy with the results.
When I occasionally saw discussion about GUI improvement and module 
order I always thought this is GUI only - which indeed would be a big 
improvement for me.

Now everything seems to be different?
In my view there is a risk that the normal user deteriotes the result 
more than it would help him - just a thought.


--

regards
Bernhard

https://www.bilddateien.de



Julian Rickards schrieb am 01.11.19 um 16:11:
In my opinion, re-ordering the modules in the favourites shouldn't be 
a problem with the pp order. In the same way that you may have written 
down, on paper, the modules you want to use, in the order you want to 
use them, re-ordering favourites in this way shouldn't be any 
different. However, I had recently proposed this as a feature request 
(but after the closure of the feature requests so I didn't expect it 
to be acted upon for 3.0) and it turns out that a couple of others had 
requested this before me (how long before me? I don't know).


I don't want to make a big deal of this or start throwing flames back 
and forth, I just thought this might be useful.


On Fri, Nov 1, 2019 at 11:03 AM David Vincent-Jones 
mailto:david...@gmail.com>> wrote:


I think that I am relieved  maybe ... hopefully I did not
disturb the pp  now I am confused ... I simply wanted to put
the favorites in my logical processing order.

David

On 01.11.19 14:18, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

* Pascal Obry    [11-01-19 08:01]:

David,


Shurely  changing the order of the modules located in the
'favorites' tab does not change the individual modules position in
the pixel-pipeline?  that would be unthinkable!

Of course it does! Re-ordering the iop is not for fun, it really does
change the pixel-pipe order.

then cryptomilk's reference should be corrected:
   See
   https://www.darktable.org/usermanual/en/darkroom_concepts.html#pixelpipe

as it indicated a static pixelpipe, and really allows unknowing users
ample opportunity to "shoot themselves in their collective feet".

also once changed there doesn't appear any option ot restore the original
order to the pixelpipe.  ???

tks,



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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[jys]

On Fri, Nov 1, 2019, at 06:18, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

> also once changed there doesn't appear any option ot restore the original
> order to the pixelpipe.  ???

This was discussed, and I *think* it's still planned to add such a feature. 
Adding that, and possibly only allowing re-ordering in the full-pipe module 
view as suggested by parafin, hopefully most severe cases of foot-shooting can 
be prevented. :-)

-- 
jys
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Julian Rickards]

In my opinion, re-ordering the modules in the favourites shouldn't be a
problem with the pp order. In the same way that you may have written down,
on paper, the modules you want to use, in the order you want to use them,
re-ordering favourites in this way shouldn't be any different. However, I
had recently proposed this as a feature request (but after the closure of
the feature requests so I didn't expect it to be acted upon for 3.0) and it
turns out that a couple of others had requested this before me (how long
before me? I don't know).

I don't want to make a big deal of this or start throwing flames back and
forth, I just thought this might be useful.

On Fri, Nov 1, 2019 at 11:03 AM David Vincent-Jones 
wrote:

> I think that I am relieved  maybe ... hopefully I did not disturb the
> pp  now I am confused ... I simply wanted to put the favorites in my
> logical processing order.
>
> David
>
> On 01.11.19 14:18, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
>
> * Pascal Obry   [11-01-19 08:01]:
>
> David,
>
>
> Shurely  changing the order of the modules located in the
> 'favorites' tab does not change the individual modules position in
> the pixel-pipeline?  that would be unthinkable!
>
> Of course it does! Re-ordering the iop is not for fun, it really does
> change the pixel-pipe order.
>
> then cryptomilk's reference should be corrected:
>   See
>   https://www.darktable.org/usermanual/en/darkroom_concepts.html#pixelpipe
>
> as it indicated a static pixelpipe, and really allows unknowing users
> ample opportunity to "shoot themselves in their collective feet".
>
> also once changed there doesn't appear any option ot restore the original
> order to the pixelpipe.  ???
>
> tks,
>
>
>
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> darktable-dev+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
>

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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[David Vincent-Jones]

I think that I am relieved  maybe ... hopefully I did not disturb 
the pp  now I am confused ... I simply wanted to put the favorites 
in my logical processing order.


David

On 01.11.19 14:18, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

* Pascal Obry  [11-01-19 08:01]:

David,


Shurely  changing the order of the modules located in the
'favorites' tab does not change the individual modules position in
the pixel-pipeline?  that would be unthinkable!

Of course it does! Re-ordering the iop is not for fun, it really does
change the pixel-pipe order.

then cryptomilk's reference should be corrected:
   See
   https://www.darktable.org/usermanual/en/darkroom_concepts.html#pixelpipe

as it indicated a static pixelpipe, and really allows unknowing users
ample opportunity to "shoot themselves in their collective feet".

also once changed there doesn't appear any option ot restore the original
order to the pixelpipe.  ???

tks,



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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[parafin]

People are confused even with history (left panel) and iop list (right
panel) being in different order, and you are proposing to introduce
third ordering of modules. I'm strongly against complicating things
like that. Favorites tab doesn't look any different from any other tab
on the right panel, so why would it behave differently? What makes
sense is to forbid iop re-order if any group is selected, so allow it
only when all iops are displayed.


On Fri, 1 Nov 2019 09:13:01 -0400
Julian Rickards  wrote:

> I agree with David, re-ordering the modules in the Favourites tab should
> *not* affect the pixel-pipe order but I wonder if David and Pascal are
> thinking differently. As I understand it, Aurlien was re-ordering the
> modules in the "Pixel-pipe" tab, which of course affected the pp order.
> However, some of us have been talking about asking that the modules in the
> Favourites tab be able to be re-ordered and this should be designed so as
> to not affect the pp order, in the same way that the order in which you
> apply the modules (i.e., History) does not affect the pp order.
> 
> On Fri, Nov 1, 2019 at 7:56 AM Pascal Obry  wrote:
> 
> > David,
> >  
> > > Shurely  changing the order of the modules located in the
> > > 'favorites' tab does not change the individual modules position in
> > > the pixel-pipeline?  that would be unthinkable!  
> >
> > Of course it does! Re-ordering the iop is not for fun, it really does
> > change the pixel-pipe order.
> >
> > --
> >   Pascal Obry /  Magny Les Hameaux (78)
> >
> >   The best way to travel is by means of imagination
> >
> >   http://www.obry.net
> >
> >   gpg --keyserver keys.gnupg.net --recv-key F949BD3B
> >
> > ___
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> > to unsubscribe send a mail to
> > darktable-dev+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
> >
> >  
> 
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Patrick Shanahan]

* Pascal Obry  [11-01-19 08:01]:
> David,
> 
> > Shurely  changing the order of the modules located in the
> > 'favorites' tab does not change the individual modules position in
> > the pixel-pipeline?  that would be unthinkable!
> 
> Of course it does! Re-ordering the iop is not for fun, it really does
> change the pixel-pipe order. 

then cryptomilk's reference should be corrected:
  See
  https://www.darktable.org/usermanual/en/darkroom_concepts.html#pixelpipe

as it indicated a static pixelpipe, and really allows unknowing users
ample opportunity to "shoot themselves in their collective feet".

also once changed there doesn't appear any option ot restore the original
order to the pixelpipe.  ???

tks,
-- 
(paka)Patrick Shanahan   Plainfield, Indiana, USA  @ptilopteri
http://en.opensuse.orgopenSUSE Community Memberfacebook/ptilopteri
Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/piwigo   paka @ IRCnet freenode
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Julian Rickards]

I agree with David, re-ordering the modules in the Favourites tab should
*not* affect the pixel-pipe order but I wonder if David and Pascal are
thinking differently. As I understand it, Aurlien was re-ordering the
modules in the "Pixel-pipe" tab, which of course affected the pp order.
However, some of us have been talking about asking that the modules in the
Favourites tab be able to be re-ordered and this should be designed so as
to not affect the pp order, in the same way that the order in which you
apply the modules (i.e., History) does not affect the pp order.

On Fri, Nov 1, 2019 at 7:56 AM Pascal Obry  wrote:

> David,
>
> > Shurely  changing the order of the modules located in the
> > 'favorites' tab does not change the individual modules position in
> > the pixel-pipeline?  that would be unthinkable!
>
> Of course it does! Re-ordering the iop is not for fun, it really does
> change the pixel-pipe order.
>
> --
>   Pascal Obry /  Magny Les Hameaux (78)
>
>   The best way to travel is by means of imagination
>
>   http://www.obry.net
>
>   gpg --keyserver keys.gnupg.net --recv-key F949BD3B
>
> ___
> darktable developer mailing list
> to unsubscribe send a mail to
> darktable-dev+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
>
>

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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[David Vincent-Jones]

Shurely  changing the order of the modules located in the 
'favorites' tab does not change the individual modules position in the 
pixel-pipeline?  that would be unthinkable!

David

On 01.11.19 11:23, Andreas Schneider wrote:

On Friday, 1 November 2019 08:19:46 CET David Vincent-Jones wrote:

Something interesting .. I moved the rgb-filmic module to a new
location and the image was significantly changed! Am I also changing the
pipeline?

See

https://www.darktable.org/usermanual/en/darkroom_concepts.html#pixelpipe


Andreas




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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Andreas Schneider]

On Friday, 1 November 2019 08:19:46 CET David Vincent-Jones wrote:
> Something interesting .. I moved the rgb-filmic module to a new
> location and the image was significantly changed! Am I also changing the
> pipeline?

See 

https://www.darktable.org/usermanual/en/darkroom_concepts.html#pixelpipe


Andreas

-- 
Andreas Schneider a...@cryptomilk.org
GPG-ID: 8DFF53E18F2ABC8D8F3C92237EE0FC4DCC014E3D


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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[jys]

On Fri, Nov 1, 2019, at 00:19, David Vincent-Jones wrote:
>  Something interesting .. I moved the rgb-filmic module to a new 
> location and the image was significantly changed! Am I also changing 
> the pipeline?

Yes. Don't move things unless you have a reason based on processing order.

-- 
jys
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[David Vincent-Jones]

Something interesting .. I moved the rgb-filmic module to a new 
location and the image was significantly changed! Am I also changing the 
pipeline?

David

On 31.10.19 22:09, jys wrote:


On Thu, Oct 31, 2019, at 13:33, KOVÁCS István wrote:

Hi,

I've seen Aurélien Pierre's video about filmic and tone EQ; there, he
used the mouse to reorder modules on the active modules tab. I can
only use the 'multiple instances' menu's move up/down options; for me,
click+drag just opens/closes the module (so the click takes effect,
the drag is ignored).

Try Ctrl+Shift+click. :-)




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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[jys]

On Thu, Oct 31, 2019, at 13:33, KOVÁCS István wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I've seen Aurélien Pierre's video about filmic and tone EQ; there, he
> used the mouse to reorder modules on the active modules tab. I can
> only use the 'multiple instances' menu's move up/down options; for me,
> click+drag just opens/closes the module (so the click takes effect,
> the drag is ignored). 

Try Ctrl+Shift+click. :-)

-- 
jys
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Re: [darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[Coding Dave]

Its a new feature for DT 3.0.

Cheers

KOVÁCS István  schrieb am Do., 31. Okt. 2019,
21:33:

> Hi,
>
> I've seen Aurélien Pierre's video about filmic and tone EQ; there, he
> used the mouse to reorder modules on the active modules tab. I can
> only use the 'multiple instances' menu's move up/down options; for me,
> click+drag just opens/closes the module (so the click takes effect,
> the drag is ignored). I'm on Kubuntu 19.04, so I use KDE as the
> front-end.
>
> Is this not a feature that's on master yet, or it's supposed to be
> working? Or a known issue with KDE? Please let me know and I'll raise
> an official issue on Github if needed.
>
> Thanks,
> Kofa
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[darktable-dev] Drag-and-drop to change module order

[KOVÁCS István]

Hi,

I've seen Aurélien Pierre's video about filmic and tone EQ; there, he
used the mouse to reorder modules on the active modules tab. I can
only use the 'multiple instances' menu's move up/down options; for me,
click+drag just opens/closes the module (so the click takes effect,
the drag is ignored). I'm on Kubuntu 19.04, so I use KDE as the
front-end.

Is this not a feature that's on master yet, or it's supposed to be
working? Or a known issue with KDE? Please let me know and I'll raise
an official issue on Github if needed.

Thanks,
Kofa
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