Re: No Wifi Option
Thanks! BTW: I'm thinking about borrowing part of your sig line, specifically the [x] quote me freely [ ] ask before reusing [ ] keep private perhaps with a modification -- hmm, thinking out loud, I was going to add "with attribution" to "quote me freely", but maybe that is implied by the word "quote" -- I'll think about that ;-) Have a good day! On Sunday, May 05, 2019 11:39:55 AM Jonas Smedegaard wrote: > Quoting rhkra...@gmail.com (2019-05-05 17:08:49) > > > PS: I happen to have a wired (RJ-45) Internet connection. If I had > > the problem, I'd be tempted to install Debian using the wired > > connection, then work on configuring the wireless connection. (On the > > other hand, I suspect an *buntu installation might work fine over > > WiFi.) > > Debian+nonfree generally works fine over wifi as well. > > - Jonas
Re: No Wifi Option
On 2019-05-05, rhkra...@gmail.com wrote: > On Sunday, May 05, 2019 11:42:36 AM Curt wrote: >> Of course, anyone who quits *and* gives up simultaneously is trying to >> make some sort of point rather than solve some kind of problem. > > Hmm, I have trouble relating to that. I can imagine saying that I "quit and > give up" as a redundancy, and my intent (unstated intent) would be to do > something else entirely to accomplish my goal (stick with Windows, buy a new > laptop, stick to a desktop, hire someone to set up Linux on my laptop, hire > someone to browse the web, ... ???). > I found the phrase revealed a certain childish petulance incongruent with the application of the unwavering scientific values that are the hallmark of this technical forum. ;-) -- The boys at first were very polite about my medals and asked me what I had done to get them. I showed them the papers, which were written in very beautiful language and full of fratellanza and abnegazione, but which really said, with the adjectives removed, that I had been given the medals because I was an American. - "Another Country"
Re: No Wifi Option
On Sunday, May 05, 2019 11:42:36 AM Curt wrote: > Of course, anyone who quits *and* gives up simultaneously is trying to > make some sort of point rather than solve some kind of problem. Hmm, I have trouble relating to that. I can imagine saying that I "quit and give up" as a redundancy, and my intent (unstated intent) would be to do something else entirely to accomplish my goal (stick with Windows, buy a new laptop, stick to a desktop, hire someone to set up Linux on my laptop, hire someone to browse the web, ... ???).
Re: No Wifi Option
On 2019-05-05, rhkra...@gmail.com wrote: > On Saturday, May 04, 2019 03:39:03 PM Terrill Wallace wrote: >> I'm just gonna quit and give up > > I hate to hear that -- I might ask a few questions and suggest some > alternatives: The dude must be leery after calculating the cost-benefit ratio of lawyering up to handle the intricate "legal implications" of getting his wifi up mentioned in the thread. Of course, anyone who quits *and* gives up simultaneously is trying to make some sort of point rather than solve some kind of problem. Out. -- The boys at first were very polite about my medals and asked me what I had done to get them. I showed them the papers, which were written in very beautiful language and full of fratellanza and abnegazione, but which really said, with the adjectives removed, that I had been given the medals because I was an American. - "Another Country"
Re: No Wifi Option
Quoting rhkra...@gmail.com (2019-05-05 17:08:49) > PS: I happen to have a wired (RJ-45) Internet connection. If I had > the problem, I'd be tempted to install Debian using the wired > connection, then work on configuring the wireless connection. (On the > other hand, I suspect an *buntu installation might work fine over > WiFi.) Debian+nonfree generally works fine over wifi as well. - Jonas -- * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt * Tlf.: +45 40843136 Website: http://dr.jones.dk/ [x] quote me freely [ ] ask before reusing [ ] keep private signature.asc Description: signature
Re: No Wifi Option
PS: I happen to have a wired (RJ-45) Internet connection. If I had the problem, I'd be tempted to install Debian using the wired connection, then work on configuring the wireless connection. (On the other hand, I suspect an *buntu installation might work fine over WiFi.) On Sunday, May 05, 2019 11:06:06 AM rhkra...@gmail.com wrote: > On Saturday, May 04, 2019 03:39:03 PM Terrill Wallace wrote: > > I'm just gonna quit and give up > > I hate to hear that -- I might ask a few questions and suggest some > alternatives: > >* Are you already a Linux user, or are you a non-Linux user considering > a move to Linux -- I'd especially hate to lose a potential Linux convert? > >* I hear that some other Linux distributions include more "non-free" > software by default -- you might try one of those -- I'd be tempted to try > a *buntu" -- I'd prefer Kubuntu because I like KDE, but I don't know if it > is as up-to-date as the latest Ubuntu. > >* Where do you live -- if you live somewhere fairly close to east > central Pa., I might be able to help you in person, if you live somewhere > else, there may be others wiling and able to help you in person. Perhaps > you are near a LUG (Linux User Group) that might help you in person (at a > meeting). > >If you post a general location (country, region of country (in the US, > state and region of state to start with) someone may chime in with an offer > of help. > > In any case, good luck!
Re: No Wifi Option
On Saturday, May 04, 2019 03:39:03 PM Terrill Wallace wrote: > I'm just gonna quit and give up I hate to hear that -- I might ask a few questions and suggest some alternatives: * Are you already a Linux user, or are you a non-Linux user considering a move to Linux -- I'd especially hate to lose a potential Linux convert? * I hear that some other Linux distributions include more "non-free" software by default -- you might try one of those -- I'd be tempted to try a *buntu" -- I'd prefer Kubuntu because I like KDE, but I don't know if it is as up-to-date as the latest Ubuntu. * Where do you live -- if you live somewhere fairly close to east central Pa., I might be able to help you in person, if you live somewhere else, there may be others wiling and able to help you in person. Perhaps you are near a LUG (Linux User Group) that might help you in person (at a meeting). If you post a general location (country, region of country (in the US, state and region of state to start with) someone may chime in with an offer of help. In any case, good luck!
Re: No Wifi Option
Quoting Curt (2019-05-05 12:00:15) > On 2019-05-04, Jonas Smedegaard wrote: > > >> Are there legal implications with a user installing non-free > >> software as long as they follow the conditions? > > > > I am not a lawyer - please have your own lawyer consult you > > regarding the licensing terms involved - i.e. possibly some of > > these: > > https://metadata.ftp-master.debian.org/changelogs/non-free/f/firmware-nonfree/ > > > > Implying that a Debian user, in downloading a binary blob from Debian's > non-free repositories in order to get his wifi up and running, might in > doing so somehow fall foul of the law is FUD. Must be a great place you are living. - Jonas -- * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt * Tlf.: +45 40843136 Website: http://dr.jones.dk/ [x] quote me freely [ ] ask before reusing [ ] keep private signature.asc Description: signature
Re: No Wifi Option
On 2019-05-04, Jonas Smedegaard wrote: >> Are there legal implications with a user installing non-free software >> as long as they follow the conditions? > > I am not a lawyer - please have your own lawyer consult you regarding > the licensing terms involved - i.e. possibly some of these: > https://metadata.ftp-master.debian.org/changelogs/non-free/f/firmware-nonfree/ > Implying that a Debian user, in downloading a binary blob from Debian's non-free repositories in order to get his wifi up and running, might in doing so somehow fall foul of the law is FUD. -- The boys at first were very polite about my medals and asked me what I had done to get them. I showed them the papers, which were written in very beautiful language and full of fratellanza and abnegazione, but which really said, with the adjectives removed, that I had been given the medals because I was an American. - "Another Country"
Re: No Wifi Option
On Sat 04 May 2019 at 21:58:57 +0200, Jonas Smedegaard wrote: > Quoting Terrill Wallace (2019-05-04 21:39:03) > > I'm just gonna quit and give up > > Yes, that is indeed the easiest approach. Sorry I didn't think to > suggest that. > > I suggest to wrap the laptop in a transparent plastic bag when trashing > it, to at least offer the chance of it getting a second life in the > hands of someone slightly more patient :-) Patience isn't the issue. One installer (official) is given prominence. The other (unofficial) is hidden behind the curtains. No wonder that newcomers (remember them?) are confused and give up. BTW, documentation for what goes in the unofficial section of the website and what its purpose is not exactly easy to find. -- Brian.
Re: No Wifi Option
On Sat 04 May 2019 at 22:19:43 +0200, Jonas Smedegaard wrote: > Quoting Brian (2019-05-04 22:01:07) > > On Sat 04 May 2019 at 21:32:19 +0200, Jonas Smedegaard wrote: > > > > > Hi Terrill, > > > > > > Quoting Terrill Wallace (2019-05-04 20:44:24) > > > > I am trying to install Debian 9 on my desktop but within the install I > > > > am not given a Wifi Option. Can you please help me with this issue? > > > > > > Most likely the wifi device built into your computer requires non-free > > > firmware, which is not included with Debian. > > > > Quite possibly. > > > > > Best option (from a Free Software standpoint) is to buy a wifi dongle > > > which works with Free Software. See e.g. https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi > > > > Indeed. > > > > > Alternatively (if you don't mind the legal implications that comes with > > > including non-free formware to your installation) look for the > > > unofficial debian-installer image which includes non-free firmware. > > > > Are there legal implications with a user installing non-free software > > as long as they follow the conditions? > > I am not a lawyer - please have your own lawyer consult you regarding > the licensing terms involved - i.e. possibly some of these: > https://metadata.ftp-master.debian.org/changelogs/non-free/f/firmware-nonfree/ A nice side-step of *a user* installing non-free software. Nobody needs a lawyer to read and understand the conditions under which he got it. And, of course, there is a considerable difference between what an individual does and how an organisation behaves. > > Debian, of course, decided it cannot distribute such software. That is > > why we have the pragmatic nonsense of having official and unofficial > > installers. > > It seems you are mistaken: Debian can and evidently do distribute such > software - just not as part of a Free Software distribution.¹ > > Feel free to label it nonsense if that makes you happy. Cheers! From https://www.debian.org/social_contract Debian will remain 100% free We will never make the system require the use of a non-free component. But you maintain "we do distribute such software". So the unofficial debian-installer is distributed as a less than 100% free part of Debian? Just like the non-free archive, I suppose? Confused. -- Brian.
Re: No Wifi Option
On 05/04/2019 02:39 PM, Terrill Wallace wrote: I'm just gonna quit and give up *NOT* only is that answer *WRONG*!!! It is worst possible . ! There are MULTIPLE Debian solutions. Some FOSS. Some not. What do *YOU* require? Other responses give hints. THImK!
Re: No Wifi Option
Quoting Brian (2019-05-04 22:01:07) > On Sat 04 May 2019 at 21:32:19 +0200, Jonas Smedegaard wrote: > > > Hi Terrill, > > > > Quoting Terrill Wallace (2019-05-04 20:44:24) > > > I am trying to install Debian 9 on my desktop but within the install I > > > am not given a Wifi Option. Can you please help me with this issue? > > > > Most likely the wifi device built into your computer requires non-free > > firmware, which is not included with Debian. > > Quite possibly. > > > Best option (from a Free Software standpoint) is to buy a wifi dongle > > which works with Free Software. See e.g. https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi > > Indeed. > > > Alternatively (if you don't mind the legal implications that comes with > > including non-free formware to your installation) look for the > > unofficial debian-installer image which includes non-free firmware. > > Are there legal implications with a user installing non-free software > as long as they follow the conditions? I am not a lawyer - please have your own lawyer consult you regarding the licensing terms involved - i.e. possibly some of these: https://metadata.ftp-master.debian.org/changelogs/non-free/f/firmware-nonfree/ > Debian, of course, decided it cannot distribute such software. That is > why we have the pragmatic nonsense of having official and unofficial > installers. It seems you are mistaken: Debian can and evidently do distribute such software - just not as part of a Free Software distribution.¹ Feel free to label it nonsense if that makes you happy. Cheers! - Jonas ¹ exactly _because_ Debian distributes such software the GNU project classifies Debian as not-really Free Software project. -- * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt * Tlf.: +45 40843136 Website: http://dr.jones.dk/ [x] quote me freely [ ] ask before reusing [ ] keep private signature.asc Description: signature
Re: No Wifi Option
On 05/04/2019 01:44 PM, Terrill Wallace wrote:
Hello Debian,
I am trying to install Debian 9 on my desktop but within the install I
am not given a Wifi Option. Can you please help me with this issue?
Thank you,
These are my specs:
HP Pavilion Gaming Desktop 690-0010
AMD Ryzen 3 2200G Processor
8 GD DDR4-2666 SDRAM memory
1 TB hard drive
AMD Radeon RX 550 graphics card with 4 GB GDDR5 dedicated memory
DVD-Writer
Wireless LAN 802.11 a/b/g/n/ac (1x1) and Bluetooth 4.2 M.2
*^^*
I am *not* familiar with any HP product.
A _superficial_ web search suggests that WiFi may be supplied by various
on-board options or plugin cards.
What is providing WiFi on your specific hardware?
{ LAN 802.11 is the specification which it meets. NOT what it *is* ;/}
HTH
Re: No Wifi Option
On Sat 04 May 2019 at 21:32:19 +0200, Jonas Smedegaard wrote: > Hi Terrill, > > Quoting Terrill Wallace (2019-05-04 20:44:24) > > I am trying to install Debian 9 on my desktop but within the install I > > am not given a Wifi Option. Can you please help me with this issue? > > Most likely the wifi device built into your computer requires non-free > firmware, which is not included with Debian. Quite possibly. > Best option (from a Free Software standpoint) is to buy a wifi dongle > which works with Free Software. See e.g. https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi Indeed. > Alternatively (if you don't mind the legal implications that comes with > including non-free formware to your installation) look for the > unofficial debian-installer image which includes non-free firmware. Are there legal implications with a user installing non-free software as long as they follow the conditions? Debian, of course, decided it cannot distribute such software. That is why we have the pragmatic nonsense of having official and unofficial installers. -- Brian.
Re: No Wifi Option
Quoting Terrill Wallace (2019-05-04 21:39:03) > I'm just gonna quit and give up Yes, that is indeed the easiest approach. Sorry I didn't think to suggest that. I suggest to wrap the laptop in a transparent plastic bag when trashing it, to at least offer the chance of it getting a second life in the hands of someone slightly more patient :-) - Jonas -- * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt * Tlf.: +45 40843136 Website: http://dr.jones.dk/ [x] quote me freely [ ] ask before reusing [ ] keep private signature.asc Description: signature
Re: No Wifi Option
I'm just gonna quit and give up On Sat, May 4, 2019, 2:32 PM Jonas Smedegaard wrote: > Hi Terrill, > > Quoting Terrill Wallace (2019-05-04 20:44:24) > > I am trying to install Debian 9 on my desktop but within the install I > > am not given a Wifi Option. Can you please help me with this issue? > > Most likely the wifi device built into your computer requires non-free > firmware, which is not included with Debian. > > Best option (from a Free Software standpoint) is to buy a wifi dongle > which works with Free Software. See e.g. https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi > > Alternatively (if you don't mind the legal implications that comes with > including non-free formware to your installation) look for the > unofficial debian-installer image which includes non-free firmware. > > > - Jonas > > -- > * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt > * Tlf.: +45 40843136 Website: http://dr.jones.dk/ > > [x] quote me freely [ ] ask before reusing [ ] keep private >
Re: No Wifi Option
On 5/4/19 2:44 PM, Terrill Wallace wrote: Hello Debian, I am trying to install Debian 9 on my desktop but within the install I am not given a Wifi Option. Can you please help me with this issue? Thank you, These are my specs: HP Pavilion Gaming Desktop 690-0010 AMD Ryzen 3 2200G Processor 8 GD DDR4-2666 SDRAM memory 1 TB hard drive AMD Radeon RX 550 graphics card with 4 GB GDDR5 dedicated memory DVD-Writer Wireless LAN 802.11 a/b/g/n/ac (1x1) and Bluetooth 4.2 M.2 Notice the one thing you didn't list in your specs: the chipset of your wireless adapter. -- Carl Fink nitpick...@nitpicking.com Read my blog at blog.nitpicking.com. Reviews! Observations!
Re: No Wifi Option
Hi Terrill, Quoting Terrill Wallace (2019-05-04 20:44:24) > I am trying to install Debian 9 on my desktop but within the install I > am not given a Wifi Option. Can you please help me with this issue? Most likely the wifi device built into your computer requires non-free firmware, which is not included with Debian. Best option (from a Free Software standpoint) is to buy a wifi dongle which works with Free Software. See e.g. https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi Alternatively (if you don't mind the legal implications that comes with including non-free formware to your installation) look for the unofficial debian-installer image which includes non-free firmware. - Jonas -- * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt * Tlf.: +45 40843136 Website: http://dr.jones.dk/ [x] quote me freely [ ] ask before reusing [ ] keep private signature.asc Description: signature
