Re: [libreoffice-design] IRC reminder
Mirek, Andrew, I cannot make today's meeting. I have to be at work today. Just found out about 2 hours ago. ~ Maggie On Fri, Apr 27, 2012 at 11:47 AM, Stefan Knorr (Astron) heinzless...@googlemail.com wrote: Hi Mirek, Andrew, okay, then, seems my assumptions aren't true, so let's keep 1600 GTC. Astron. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Let's work on color handling
Mirek, I've done exactly that. Doesn't seem like there's anyone at the chat right now though. ~ Maggie On Sat, Apr 21, 2012 at 5:05 AM, Mirek M. maz...@gmail.com wrote: 2012/4/21 King Duck rotteneo...@gmail.com I would like to put my proposal up. Go ahead. Go to https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Design/Whiteboards/Color_Handling, create your own Proposal by Maggie section. ~ Maggie On Fri, Apr 20, 2012 at 11:59 PM, Andrew Pullins android2...@gmail.com wrote: Hello, .png is better for ideas and rough concepts since you can see it right on the browser (not sure if you can do that with .svg) .svg is better for images you want people to make improvements on since it's more easily editable. I think that when the second applies you should just put both up. I'm pretty sure that .svg was made with the web in mind. I know that you can view them on the web so, do what ever you want but svg allows others to easily edit your work. How much longer do we have until the color picker whiteboard is closed? There has not been much discussion about it. Mostly me questioning Mirek's mockups. Is there any anything that people would like to add. Again my vote is for Mirek's proposal. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Let's work on color handling
Alberto, Custom button? That would be nice, but I'm not sure if it follows the HIG and I think it would not look good being put with the color picker. Do you have any suggestions as to put a button to switch to the custom color picker? I'm thinking maybe the user could click and hold on the square to trigger the custom color picker. Here's an updated version of my proposal. I would like to hear a bit more feedback to see if it can be included with the other proposals on the Wiki. https://docs.google.com/open?id=0BzbVEiGiz0dneUhJSUdIOEpWQTA Description: Color picker triggers when the user chooses the color picker icon on the toolbar. The default palettes contain only a few colors (these swatches would be much smaller in the actual program) for simplicity. On hover, the color's name is shown in a tooltip. When the user chooses a color, the color swatch has a outline (red in this proposal) to show the current color. The colors the user creates in the custom color picker appear under the Custom colors row. Recent selected colors appear under the Recent colors row. The user switches to the custom color picker by selecting a blank swatch under the Custom colors row and holding. Depending on the chosen settings (RGB and CMYK for now) the layout of the CCP changes. If a user is in CMYK mode, an additional text entry appears for K. The user can also choose a color using the color wheel; the center of the wheel reflects the current chosen color depending on where the tiny circle is located on the edge of the circle. On Fri, Apr 20, 2012 at 11:23 PM, Alberto Delgado alberto...@gmail.comwrote: Hello everyone. I have been working on my color proposal. I'm thinking of adding a color wheel which activates by double-click (in Windows; not sure if that's a good idea for Linux/Mac OSX) and allows the user to create their own custom colors. It would also provide a small preview of how the color looks on text if on a light or dark background (something like this: http://colorschemedesigner.com/# ). It's not quite finished yet and looking back what I have is kind of simple compared to the excellent mockups I saw by Mirek but I just wanted to show everyone what I've got so far. Like it, maybe it could have it's own button like custom, that way it works for all platforms. Also -i think this was your idea- a round pretty color chooser with pallete maker would be nice. For the example, i like kuler better. http://kuler.adobe.com/#create/fromacolor Which format for images is preferred: .svg or .png? .png is better for ideas and rough concepts since you can see it right on the browser (not sure if you can do that with .svg) .svg is better for images you want people to make improvements on since it's more easily editable. I think that when the second applies you should just put both up. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Let's work on color handling
I would like to put my proposal up. ~ Maggie On Fri, Apr 20, 2012 at 11:59 PM, Andrew Pullins android2...@gmail.comwrote: Hello, .png is better for ideas and rough concepts since you can see it right on the browser (not sure if you can do that with .svg) .svg is better for images you want people to make improvements on since it's more easily editable. I think that when the second applies you should just put both up. I'm pretty sure that .svg was made with the web in mind. I know that you can view them on the web so, do what ever you want but svg allows others to easily edit your work. How much longer do we have until the color picker whiteboard is closed? There has not been much discussion about it. Mostly me questioning Mirek's mockups. Is there any anything that people would like to add. Again my vote is for Mirek's proposal. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: LibreOffice chat
Mirek, Sorry for not responding earlier. I re-did the poll under the name Maggie(redone). What I was trying to say was that I was available at either those times but seeing as how I misinterpreted what you meant by filling out the poll I decided to do it again. If there are any questions, I am willing to explain further. ~ Maggie On Sun, Apr 1, 2012 at 5:19 AM, Mirek M. maz...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Maggie, 2012/4/1 King Duck rotteneo...@gmail.com Mirek, That would be during weekdays and weekends. You don't have to change the meeting time; I can read the transcripts and try to make them as much as I can. When you asked for which times to pick and to disregard the date (that's how I understood your original message), I picked the following times after I picked America/New York from the drop-down menu of the poll. I meant it as disregard the date but keep in mind the day of the week and the time. I thought the poll would convert the original times to their equivalents in my time zone. These were the ones that I picked: 4:00 PM- 6:00 PM 6:00 PM- 8:00 PM 8:00 PM- 10:00 PM If it didn't do that, then I apologize. That's what I thought that option would do. It did, but Sunday from 14:00 GMT turned out to be more fitting for the rest of the team (i.e. there are 4 consecutive hours that overlap for three of us). I'm still not sure what times of the day you tend to have free -- from 20:00-2:00 GMT or 16:00-18:00 GMT? Please fill out the poll again: http://www.doodle.com/fyevrffhaqq79vkt -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
[libreoffice-design] This week's chat
Hello all, Here's the log for the LibreOffice Design Team chat. https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Design/Meetings/2012-04-07 This is my first time editing the wiki, so if there are any issues feel free to let me know. :) ~ Maggie -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
[libreoffice-design] Today's Chat
Hello all, Here's the log for the LibreOffice Design Team chat. https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Design/Meetings/2012-04-07 This is my first time editing the wiki, so if there are any issues feel free to let me know. :) ~ Maggie P.S In case my previous e-mail did not show up I am sending it again with the proper tag in the subject line of this message. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: LibreOffice chat
Mirek, No. I must have picked the wrong options. Generally I am 4 hours behind you (I'm on Eastern Daylight Time right now). So the best times for me are 12 PM-2PM EDT or 8 PM EDT - 11 PM EDT. I just saw that you had a chat at 14:00 PM GMT, but over here it's only 10 AM. I'm not at home during that time during the week. ~ Maggie On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 4:26 PM, Mirek M. maz...@gmail.com wrote: Everyone, please fill out the poll at http://www.doodle.com/fyevrffhaqq79vkt. Remember that the dates don't matter -- the poll is for determining the time for our weekly meetings. Maggie, are you sure you only tend to be free on Mondays/Tuesdays from 20:00-2:00 AM? Andrew, are you sure you only tend to be free daily from 22:00 - 00:00? Our time schedules have no overlap... -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: LibreOffice chat
Mirek, That would be during weekdays and weekends. You don't have to change the meeting time; I can read the transcripts and try to make them as much as I can. When you asked for which times to pick and to disregard the date (that's how I understood your original message), I picked the following times after I picked America/New York from the drop-down menu of the poll. I thought the poll would convert the original times to their equivalents in my time zone. These were the ones that I picked: 4:00 PM- 6:00 PM 6:00 PM- 8:00 PM 8:00 PM- 10:00 PM If it didn't do that, then I apologize. That's what I thought that option would do. ~ Maggie On Sat, Mar 31, 2012 at 6:01 PM, Mirek M. maz...@gmail.com wrote: 2012/3/31 King Duck rotteneo...@gmail.com Mirek, No. I must have picked the wrong options. Generally I am 4 hours behind you (I'm on Eastern Daylight Time right now). So the best times for me are 12 PM-2PM EDT or 8 PM EDT - 11 PM EDT. I just saw that you had a chat at 14:00 PM GMT, but over here it's only 10 AM. I'm not at home during that time during the week. During the week -- should I interpret that as during weekdays or as during weekdays+on the weekend? I'm a bit hesitant to change the timing of the upcoming chat at such short notice, but the time of day for our weekly meetings is definitely still up for debate. Could you please fill out the poll [1] again? Thanks. [1] http://www.doodle.com/fyevrffhaqq79vkt -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: REMINDER: IRC discussion is now! :-) (was: Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Design team IRC chat)
Hello Christoph and all, Sorry for not being able to make the chat. I ended up with an emergency so I could not make it. ~ Maggie On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 8:12 AM, Stefan Knorr (Astron) heinzless...@googlemail.com wrote: Hi Christoph, all, sorry for not being there at all when I said I could be... I was occupied with other stuff, and then seemingly didn't really get the GMT bit (else I would have risked at least with half an eye). Astron. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Letterhead templates
Mirek, Depends. What requirements do they have for the letter template? ~ Maggie On Sat, Mar 24, 2012 at 7:29 AM, Mirek M. maz...@gmail.com wrote: Hi everyone, If you didn't know already, this Wednesday is Document Freedom Day [1]. They're in need of a letterhead template right now. Is someone feeling up for the task? If you are, submit your templates as replies to this thread. Any submission is appreciated. Thanks. [1] http://documentfreedom.org/ -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] First Tabbed Interface Mockup
Mirek, Kevin, Does the potential Gnome Overview work like the Tab Groups in Firefox? So it would be preferable to have something like that for Libreoffice? I'm not too familiar with Chrome (only used it for testing purposes) but I opened up the program and looked at the placement of the tabs. I can see why that would be preferable for an office suite. I'm a little confused though. ~ Maggie On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 4:03 AM, Kévin PEIGNOT peignot.ke...@kpeignot.frwrote: Hi Magie, Mirek Personally, I would love having tabs, but we must provide a way not to use tabs. I like the Firefox/Chrome/others possibility to drag tabs out of the tab bar, to have a separate window. Then it must not be the only way to do that, because drag and drop, even very easy and intuitive, isn't discoverable at all. Maybe an otpion by right-clicking the tab ? So to answer your thought Mirek : 2012/3/21 Mirek M. maz...@gmail.com Hi Maggie, Thanks for the proposal. One of the reasons why office suites in general have been hesitant to support tabs is because it's not really meant for that workflow -- a user is likely to work on one or two documents at a time or two documents side-by-side, and it's a waste of memory to open a large number of documents and only use one of them. Rather than using tabs, I would love to implement something along the lines of the Gnome Overview [1], which is going to replace tabs in Epiphany. It makes getting to any document simple, especially simple for recent documents, but also lets you focus on the current document. Personally, I would prefer tabs, but I can't assure that, as I didn't tried something like that, and don't visualize what Gnome overview will be. That said, I wouldn't be opposed to having tabs in LibreOffice as long as: - the tab bar is hidden by default, only shown when you have 2 tabs or more Obviously, elsewhere it would clutter the interface for absolutely nothing - the tab bar appears as part of or just below the title bar (like Chrome), I agree too. Chrome designers did this because the adress/search bar, buttons (back/next/reload...) refer to the content of the tab, not all tabs together, so the tabs must contain the buttons -- Tabs have to be above the buttons. It's the logical way, Firefox and others made this too since. able to contain tabs from any LibreOffice module Right, this is the second reason why tabs have to be above the buttons : you don't have the same toolbars in writer than in calc, even between two writer sessions, you don't have the same toolbar, to follow what is selected (picture -- picture toolbar, table -- table toolbar ). It will be the same with your proposals if I remember (Citrus). Having the tab above the buttons, you don't change anything above tabs, except window name. - there is no tab management -- the user just shouldn't have many tabs open (he can't work on 12 documents at once); not even Chrome manages multiple tabs What you mean by tab management ? - tabs are always docked on top -- if they could be docked anywhere, it would be an unnecessary complication for both developers and UI designers and wouldn't really provide much advantage to the user. I'll bring up Chrome again -- it experimented with side tabs, but dropped the feature because it wasn't working well enough. But since people are not going to have 20 LibreOffice tabs open, we really don't need a tab sidebar. I agree. If this is really wanted, I'm sure an extension will appear for that someday. But I don't think it will be very asked. More of that, I think it would be great to have a way to add tabs : Here are some ideas : - *+* button when the tab bar is displayed ; - New tab item in file menu ; - In the new file window, an option to open the file in a new tab. If we have an empty tab (using the new tab item in the file menu maybe), we could integrate the new file dialog in the tab (I will try to make a little mock-up soon), but I think you imagine what I mean. Feedback appreciated ;) Kévin [1] https://live.gnome.org/Design/Apps/Web 2012/3/21 King Duck rotteneo...@gmail.com Hello everyone. I have been working on a simple mockup for tabs in LibreOffice. I checked some past suggestions in Bugzilla for tabs in LO. LO and Office 2007 (along with 2010) have support for tabs but only with add-ons. I think that implementing tabs into LO would help attract more users. The convenience of having multiple tabs in one window instead of having to shift between several separate windows is a feature which I feel would be appreciated by many users. I have used Office Tabs and despite it being rather limited it improved my user experience with Office 2007 by allowing me to easily shift between several documents. Some potential ideas: * Tab positioning _ Positions tabs at the top, bottom, left, or right of the page
[libreoffice-design] First Tabbed Interface Mockup
Hello everyone. I have been working on a simple mockup for tabs in LibreOffice. I checked some past suggestions in Bugzilla for tabs in LO. LO and Office 2007 (along with 2010) have support for tabs but only with add-ons. I think that implementing tabs into LO would help attract more users. The convenience of having multiple tabs in one window instead of having to shift between several separate windows is a feature which I feel would be appreciated by many users. I have used Office Tabs and despite it being rather limited it improved my user experience with Office 2007 by allowing me to easily shift between several documents. Some potential ideas: * Tab positioning _ Positions tabs at the top, bottom, left, or right of the page; controlled according to what the user wants Pro: Tab position is left in control of the user so that zie can show zir's tabs in location most convenient to user Con: Could potentially overshadow panels (if implemented) * List tabs button _ Shows all tabs which are open in the current application; Useful for when 4+ tabs (at least) are in use Pro: Multiple tabs easily seen by user without having to take up too much screen space Con: Tab list could end up excessively long and require scrolling on part of user *Sort tab order _ Order of tabs controlled by mouse (click-and-drag), touch (touch-and-drag), or keyboard command Pro: Tab order easily shifted around by user at zir's convenience Con: Not sure how to implement for visually impaired users Later on this week I'll do a mockup using the Citrus UI images. Any feedback is much appreciated. https://docs.google.com/open?id=0BzbVEiGiz0dnS3paaHMzeEtUUU96aFZWMVBoMzFnUQ ~ Maggie -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Design team IRC chat
Just answered the poll. I am 4 hours behind GMT (EDT) so I tried to pick the best times that were available. I am taking a look at the whiteboards right now. I am also working on a mockup for a tabbed interface. ~ Maggie On Mon, Mar 19, 2012 at 3:46 PM, Mirek M. maz...@gmail.com wrote: 2012/3/19 Stefan Knorr (Astron) heinzless...@googlemail.com Hi Mirek, I've had a conversation with Alexander Wilms on IRC today and we've decided that it would be productive if the whole Design team could meet on the IRC to discuss relevant LibreOffice UI/design topics. We could start with the Actually, it would be a great idea if we could meet on IRC on a weekly/bi-weekly basis. Maybe name it something like Let's talk design. (which conveniently abbreviates to Ltd.) and set (a) topic(s) before we meet. How do you feel about that? I agree. The Gnome design team works on IRC only, and they're very productive. Should I create another Doodle poll that's more generic and includes all the days of the week? Is there a way to duplicate a poll on Doodle or do I have to write in the time intervals again? Secondly, there already is a Whiteboard on the topic that Christoph started some time ago with many pointers to bugs etc – see [1]. I guess we should use that. OK. The page looks like it needs a bit of clean-up, though -- for example, why are suggestions listed under Current state, and what is the point of Further information? Thirdly, often times we miss the basis for what we do here. With everyone going into the direction of touch-friendliness here, it's easy to steer LibreOffice into even larger inconsistency. What we need, clearly is some sort of HIG, else we might actually make LibreOffice worse. This is not to say that we need a completely new HIG, but we need to either copy/paste the pieces we like from others (it still need s to be conherent) or need to adapt a pre-existing one that covers what we need. OK. I started a wiki page for it [1]. It's a good topic for our upcoming IRC chat -- we'll put items in the Tentative design section only after we've discussed them. There are several things I'd like to talk about: a) Converging the keyboard+mouse and touch input -- especially important if we want to target hybrid platforms, such as Gnome 3, Windows 8, and, of course, the Web. b) Avoiding double-click [2] -- fortunately, single-clicking is the standard on the web and on touch-first platforms (Android, webOS, etc.) c) Dialogs -- Could we slowly obsolete dialogs in favor of contextual toolbars? Complex dialogs have no place on mobile UIs, where it's preferable to simply integrate commands into the toolbar, with commands not fitting into the toolbar placed in an overflow menu on the toolbar; it's also much easier and faster to work with commands inside a toolbar than with commands in a dialog window, plus the toolbar allows the user to his changes applied directly, whereas dialog windows tend to cover up most of the document. d) Menus -- Could we also obviate menus (just make them optional) by integrating common menu commands elsewhere in the interface? e) What the Android and Web ports mean to us -- a lot of code is reused in these ports; maybe the LibreOffice dashboard could also become a simple file manager like it will be on Android? [1] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Design/Whiteboards/Human_Interface_Guidelines [2] http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/2004/10/double-click-must-die.html -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Bold and Italic icons
I vote for the lowercase icons. It makes the difference between italics and bold effects more obvious than the uppercase icons. Would there be time to put this up to a vote by the users of Libreoffice? ~ Maggie On Sat, Mar 17, 2012 at 10:14 PM, Andrew Pullins android2...@gmail.comwrote: I vote for the uppercase icons. It's not that hard to tell that its bold. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Bold and Italic icons
I think it's because the words for bold and italic change depending on the language. If you just use a character and show the effect, it tells the user what it does without having to refer to a specific word. ~ Maggie On Mon, Mar 12, 2012 at 7:01 PM, Sabin Densmore sa...@onegecko.com wrote: Just out of curiosity, is there a particular reason we're not using B and I to indicate Bold and Italic? I don't care either way, but am curious as to why. For what it's worth, Thunderbird (what I'm using now) uses a capital letter A. It's just hard to tell the difference between an italic A and a non-italic A. - sd On 3/12/2012 7:39 AM, Kévin PEIGNOT wrote: Hi everyone Sorry to have been off so much time (I'm very busy these times). In my part, I prefer Uppercases ones, just because they seems me more beautiful : I don't think upper or lower are more or less confusing. So, for me, it's just a mater of feelings, that's all ! Kévin 2012/3/11 Mirek M. maz...@gmail.com 2012/3/11 Adolfo Jayme Barrientos fitosch...@gmail.com I'd prefer lowercase icons, because they're more recognizable in a glance as I already said in the wiki page. Three uppercase As can be easily confused. Lowercase As can be confused just as easily. As stated -- if we need the bold icon to stand out more, I propose we simply make it a bit thicker. Nobody seems to have had any problems with the current Tango icon set, which uses uppercase letters. The Humanity (and Gnome) icon themes included in Ubuntu use lowercase, you can check apps like Inkscape or Abiword to see that. Oddly, Inkscape seems to use lowercase A only for the bold and italic icons. Every other icon with text uses a capital A to symbolize it. BTW, I don't quite understand how can uppercase or lowercase letters be more or less inline with your design goals. Uppercase icons are crisper, which is one of the design goals. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Hello everyone.
Stefan, I decided to go with the MYSYS Git. Thanks for the help again. I'm going to try using the current bug submission agent so I can get an idea of how it works. I'm also going to take a closer look at the To-Do list you showed me in the earlier messages. ~ Maggie On Mon, Mar 12, 2012 at 11:34 AM, Stefan Knorr (Astron) heinzless...@googlemail.com wrote: Hi Maggie, I have a Windows machine so I picked the binary with Cygwin (not sure if that's the right one) Which of the two version you use is up to you. Yet, it's odd that they're listing the Cygwin version first on this page (they link to MSYS Git from their homepage). Using the MSYS version saves you the hassle with Cygwin (you can use the first download listed on the MSYS Git page). So I get to the installer and then I see a bunch of packages. It reminded me of package managers like Synaptic and Adept with each package being under various categories. Right, Cygwin does some package management. If you want to use Cygwin: Look in the devel category, there you should find several entries that start with git, just install all of them (maybe except git-svn, you definitely won't need that for LibO). Click on the Skip icon, this should should change to a cross to signify that this package will be dowloaded. All the recommended downloads will be marked automatically. Astron. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Hello everyone.
Alex and Stefan, I'm a little confused. I checked the instructions for how to build Libreoffice. I do not have Cygwin yet but I'm going to download it. Do I need to get all the git repositories for LibreOffice or just the ones for the website? On Fri, Mar 9, 2012 at 5:46 AM, Stefan Knorr (Astron) heinzless...@googlemail.com wrote: Hi Maggie, Alex, On 8 March 2012 21:57, Alexander Wilms alexander.wi...@zoho.com wrote: git is a version-control system. It was first developed for the Linux and LibreOffice uses it too. Right. So it's a (better) replacement for things like SVN/CVS/... (The gist of these tools is that you version a set of files and can easily see the history of each file or go back to previous versions.) You can download git from here: http://git-scm.com/ Here's an overview of all the repos libreoffice consists of: http://cgit.freedesktop.org/libreoffice This page explains how to use git for getting the latest source and building it: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/Native_Build In the section Getting the source you'd need to replace git://anongit.freedesktop.org/libreoffice/core with git://anongit.freedesktop.org/libreoffice/website Thanks Alex. Maggie, please ask if any of that sounds too much like technobabble. Also, don't let the command line shock you. :) There are graphical UI's available, like e.g. http://sourceforge.net/projects/gitextensions/ Hope this helps a bit, Astron. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Hello everyone.
I'm not sure what git is. Is it a kind of toolkit? And where can I get the website repository? ~ Maggie On Tue, Mar 6, 2012 at 10:09 AM, Stefan Knorr (Astron) heinzless...@googlemail.com wrote: Hi Maggie, do you already have git set up/cloned the website repo? Do you need help with that? Cool that you look into stuff! Astron. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Hello everyone.
Alright. If you need an idea of my experience, here's my web page. It's a bit rough though. I'm going to look at what you need done and see what I can do. www.ctrlaltm.com ~ Maggie On Fri, Mar 2, 2012 at 5:21 PM, Stefan Knorr (Astron) heinzless...@googlemail.com wrote: Hi Maggie, Would that be the same as this: https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/bug/ Yes. However, there are still many things that are left to be worked on, see here: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Bug_Submission_Assistant_-_ToDo#Next_Things_To_Be_Done I don't know how firm your grasp of web design matters is, but anyway, if you want to jump right in, see here: http://cgit.freedesktop.org/libreoffice/website/tree/bug Else, of course, I guess Mockups etc on how to add functionality are welcomed just as much. Astron. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
[libreoffice-design] Hello everyone.
I joined this list a while ago, but I never really introduced myself. My name is Margaret Tagoe. I have been lurking here, but I have not had time to participate. I am interested in user design and while my experience is limited I would like to help out as much as I can. I am willing to learn what I need so that I help out. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: Re: [libreoffice-design] Survey - Current Issues
Hello everyone, Sorry for not being online for a while. I have just done the survey. ~ King Duck On Tue, Jun 21, 2011 at 4:26 PM, drorlev dror.s...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Bjoren and all, The survey system looks great and friendly! However, I'm a bit confused. Is the aim of this survey primarily to test the survey-system or is the major aim to come up with some initial directions for future design? Thanks for the work and additional appreciation for clarifying its goals. Best, dror -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Survey-Current-Issues-tp3084300p3092805.html Sent from the Design mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] New Design and experience
Xi, I can't see your mockup. Could you upload it somewhere else? ~ Maggie On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 10:19 PM, Xi Embalsado newecrea...@hotmail.comwrote: Hey! Can you evaluate my mock-up? http://cid-b8d257bea212e4aa.office.live.com/self.aspx/Public%20Stuff/LibreOffice%20Mock%20Up.odg Please comment. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] designing a logo for the LibreOffice conference
Bernhard, I have the name that I do because that was what I used when I first signed up for GMail. I'm not too comfortable giving out my real name on the Internet. Please do not think that I want you to think of me as a king; the name I really wanted was already taken so I just reversed the two. As for the Scatter motif triangles, it sounds like a good idea. Do you have an image showing exactly what you mean by this? I'm new to working on open source projects and I wanted to contribute to help LibreOffice become the best application that it can be. ~ M. Tagoe -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Feature Request: Strike-through Icon
Astron, What do you mean by cryptic naming scheme? I'm guessing that you are talking about the file names. On Sat, May 14, 2011 at 6:28 AM, Astron heinzless...@googlemail.com wrote: Hi back, yes, a new Tango icon for Strikethrough would be great. But on the other hand, about half of the current Tango icon theme (albeit usually the lesser seen part) are still old Industrial icons, just like the Strikethrough icon. Importantly, the arrows on the new Find bar are Industrial icons. Some icons in the Tables toolbar are, too, the entire Tools, Page Preview, etc. toolbars. Which just makes you aware, that despite how crazy the Tango artists were that themed Ooo, Ooo was still crazier than them. Which is to say that there are too many icons in LibreOffice, a cryptic naming scheme, and also too many duplicates. Astron. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Feature Request: Strike-through Icon
I just added the strikethrough icon to the formatting part of my menu just to see if it works. Would it be possible to make an icon which looks more like the bold, italic, and underline icons? Just for consistency. On Thu, May 12, 2011 at 6:26 AM, Astron heinzless...@googlemail.com wrote: Hi, On Tue, May 10, 2011 at 3:28 AM, King Duck rotteneo...@gmail.com wrote: Doesn't OpenOffice already have that icon? I would figure that LibreOffice would have it too. Yes, the icon is there. View Toolbars Customize..., then click Add..., choose Format from the list on the left, choose Strikethrough in the list on the right, click Add. That's maybe not as easy as it could be, but it exists. Astron. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Feature Request: Strike-through Icon
Doesn't OpenOffice already have that icon? I would figure that LibreOffice would have it too. On Thu, May 5, 2011 at 3:45 AM, Goldfish goldf...@aol.in wrote: Dear Sir/ Madam, Please can we have a Strike-through Icon that may be added through customize toolbar. Thanks, Paul -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Open standards: Lets be free a DJVU printer /reader instead of PDF ones
Miguel, Using an open format would be great, but how many people use DJVU? I have never heard of this format until today. ~ Maggie P.S to everybody: What's a good project to start on if you are new to open source work in general? I am a young recent grad who would love to help make LibreOffice the best that it can be. On Tue, May 3, 2011 at 7:40 AM, Miguel Mayol i Tur mitc...@gmail.comwrote: DJVU is an open format. I love Save as PDF but in a long term would be better to add a Save as DJVU, and tools to edit it - PDF ones once printed are mostly propietary ones - -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
