Re: [libreoffice-design] RFE process between QA and UX
Hi All, This all seems to be coming down to my current workflow about enhancement bugs that i'm opening. To my knowledge, there has been only two bug reports that i have not given enough information, which resulted in them being set to NEEDINFO, which i then followed up with more information. https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87362 https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=86627 As i'm opening enhancement requests, sometimes i seek the advise of more experienced users to know whether the enhancement is a good idea or not, which can be seen in the two examples previously quoted. https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87360 https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87357 If the QA team doesnt wish to give their input into these enhancement requests, then i think the simplest thing to do is to set them all as ux-advise rather than what i currently do of assigning it to the component and CC ux-advise. I guess my main issue is not knowing what is considered ux-advise and what isnt. Regards, Jay Philips On 12/17/2014 06:08 PM, Sophie wrote: Hi Kendy, all, Le 17/12/2014 12:47, Jan Holesovsky a écrit : Hi Sophie, Sophie píše v Út 16. 12. 2014 v 19:16 +0100: Discussing with QA team today, there has been a lot of bug reports concerning minor enhancements these last days. It would be better is those enhancements would be first discussed by the UX team before going to QA for triage because most of the time they don't have the requested info regarding bug filling then QA team has to spend a lot of time to reproduce them and this is not up to the QA team to discuss UX enhancements. Please can you send few examples to have a better idea? :-) https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87360 https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87357 or see this list: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/buglist.cgi?bug_status=NEWcomponent=ux-adviseemail1=philipz85%40hotmail.coemailtype1=substringlist_id=505514product=LibreOfficequery_format=advanced Ah! - so Jay is a very active member of the Design Team, and discusses his proposals the right way; so I am not really concerned about these reports :-) - they will be handled properly, I am sure. ok, no problem, Jay is an example (and great to see him so active here now :) but that will help to set the good process between the teams. So to get them out of the stats - does the NEEDINFO + ux-advise component (as Stuart proposed) work for you, Sophie? Jay - can you please mark your reports that way if yes? Well, I'm only the messenger here. So let me make the proposal to the QA team during their meeting this evening, and I'll report back to you, but I guess they will be ok with Stuart proposal and yours. Yes, but that is a lot of work for bug triagers. If you well know the functionality, it's easy to discriminate, but for QA people who do not have that knowledge, the lack of steps to reproduce, examples, etc. is very time consuming plus the fact that he won't know what to do with it (50% of users would like to have it and the other 50% won't), when it can be solved quickly by discussing a little bit. Sure, as I did not have the examples, I did not know exactly what you had in mind :-) Ok, thanks a lot to Stuart and you to help me clarify it :) Cheers Sophie -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] RFE process between QA and UX
Hi all, So following the discussion we had yesterday during the QA meeting (thanks Jay for your participation :) we agreed that issues created by UX/Design members will be set as NEW and assigned to UX-advice. The QA wiki pages will be modified to reflect this change. We have clarified with Jay what type of enhancements should go under the UX-advice category. I hope everything is fine for everybody now, don't hesitate to let me know if there is questions remaining :) Thanks to all for your help solving this! Cheers Sophie Le 17/12/2014 17:27, Jay Philips a écrit : Hi All, This all seems to be coming down to my current workflow about enhancement bugs that i'm opening. To my knowledge, there has been only two bug reports that i have not given enough information, which resulted in them being set to NEEDINFO, which i then followed up with more information. https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87362 https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=86627 As i'm opening enhancement requests, sometimes i seek the advise of more experienced users to know whether the enhancement is a good idea or not, which can be seen in the two examples previously quoted. https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87360 https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87357 If the QA team doesnt wish to give their input into these enhancement requests, then i think the simplest thing to do is to set them all as ux-advise rather than what i currently do of assigning it to the component and CC ux-advise. I guess my main issue is not knowing what is considered ux-advise and what isnt. Regards, Jay Philips On 12/17/2014 06:08 PM, Sophie wrote: Hi Kendy, all, Le 17/12/2014 12:47, Jan Holesovsky a écrit : Hi Sophie, Sophie píše v Út 16. 12. 2014 v 19:16 +0100: Discussing with QA team today, there has been a lot of bug reports concerning minor enhancements these last days. It would be better is those enhancements would be first discussed by the UX team before going to QA for triage because most of the time they don't have the requested info regarding bug filling then QA team has to spend a lot of time to reproduce them and this is not up to the QA team to discuss UX enhancements. Please can you send few examples to have a better idea? :-) https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87360 https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87357 or see this list: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/buglist.cgi?bug_status=NEWcomponent=ux-adviseemail1=philipz85%40hotmail.coemailtype1=substringlist_id=505514product=LibreOfficequery_format=advanced Ah! - so Jay is a very active member of the Design Team, and discusses his proposals the right way; so I am not really concerned about these reports :-) - they will be handled properly, I am sure. ok, no problem, Jay is an example (and great to see him so active here now :) but that will help to set the good process between the teams. So to get them out of the stats - does the NEEDINFO + ux-advise component (as Stuart proposed) work for you, Sophie? Jay - can you please mark your reports that way if yes? Well, I'm only the messenger here. So let me make the proposal to the QA team during their meeting this evening, and I'll report back to you, but I guess they will be ok with Stuart proposal and yours. Yes, but that is a lot of work for bug triagers. If you well know the functionality, it's easy to discriminate, but for QA people who do not have that knowledge, the lack of steps to reproduce, examples, etc. is very time consuming plus the fact that he won't know what to do with it (50% of users would like to have it and the other 50% won't), when it can be solved quickly by discussing a little bit. Sure, as I did not have the examples, I did not know exactly what you had in mind :-) Ok, thanks a lot to Stuart and you to help me clarify it :) Cheers Sophie -- Sophie Gautier sophie.gaut...@documentfoundation.org Tel:+33683901545 Co-founder - Release coordinator The Document Foundation -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] RFE process between QA and UX
Hi Sophie, Sophie píše v Út 16. 12. 2014 v 19:16 +0100: Discussing with QA team today, there has been a lot of bug reports concerning minor enhancements these last days. It would be better is those enhancements would be first discussed by the UX team before going to QA for triage because most of the time they don't have the requested info regarding bug filling then QA team has to spend a lot of time to reproduce them and this is not up to the QA team to discuss UX enhancements. Please can you send few examples to have a better idea? :-) https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87360 https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87357 or see this list: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/buglist.cgi?bug_status=NEWcomponent=ux-adviseemail1=philipz85%40hotmail.coemailtype1=substringlist_id=505514product=LibreOfficequery_format=advanced Ah! - so Jay is a very active member of the Design Team, and discusses his proposals the right way; so I am not really concerned about these reports :-) - they will be handled properly, I am sure. So to get them out of the stats - does the NEEDINFO + ux-advise component (as Stuart proposed) work for you, Sophie? Jay - can you please mark your reports that way if yes? Yes, but that is a lot of work for bug triagers. If you well know the functionality, it's easy to discriminate, but for QA people who do not have that knowledge, the lack of steps to reproduce, examples, etc. is very time consuming plus the fact that he won't know what to do with it (50% of users would like to have it and the other 50% won't), when it can be solved quickly by discussing a little bit. Sure, as I did not have the examples, I did not know exactly what you had in mind :-) All the best, Kendy -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] RFE process between QA and UX
Hi Kendy, all, Le 17/12/2014 12:47, Jan Holesovsky a écrit : Hi Sophie, Sophie píše v Út 16. 12. 2014 v 19:16 +0100: Discussing with QA team today, there has been a lot of bug reports concerning minor enhancements these last days. It would be better is those enhancements would be first discussed by the UX team before going to QA for triage because most of the time they don't have the requested info regarding bug filling then QA team has to spend a lot of time to reproduce them and this is not up to the QA team to discuss UX enhancements. Please can you send few examples to have a better idea? :-) https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87360 https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87357 or see this list: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/buglist.cgi?bug_status=NEWcomponent=ux-adviseemail1=philipz85%40hotmail.coemailtype1=substringlist_id=505514product=LibreOfficequery_format=advanced Ah! - so Jay is a very active member of the Design Team, and discusses his proposals the right way; so I am not really concerned about these reports :-) - they will be handled properly, I am sure. ok, no problem, Jay is an example (and great to see him so active here now :) but that will help to set the good process between the teams. So to get them out of the stats - does the NEEDINFO + ux-advise component (as Stuart proposed) work for you, Sophie? Jay - can you please mark your reports that way if yes? Well, I'm only the messenger here. So let me make the proposal to the QA team during their meeting this evening, and I'll report back to you, but I guess they will be ok with Stuart proposal and yours. Yes, but that is a lot of work for bug triagers. If you well know the functionality, it's easy to discriminate, but for QA people who do not have that knowledge, the lack of steps to reproduce, examples, etc. is very time consuming plus the fact that he won't know what to do with it (50% of users would like to have it and the other 50% won't), when it can be solved quickly by discussing a little bit. Sure, as I did not have the examples, I did not know exactly what you had in mind :-) Ok, thanks a lot to Stuart and you to help me clarify it :) Cheers Sophie -- Sophie Gautier sophie.gaut...@documentfoundation.org Tel:+33683901545 Co-founder - Release coordinator The Document Foundation -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
[libreoffice-design] RFE process between QA and UX
Hi all, Discussing with QA team today, there has been a lot of bug reports concerning minor enhancements these last days. It would be better is those enhancements would be first discussed by the UX team before going to QA for triage because most of the time they don't have the requested info regarding bug filling then QA team has to spend a lot of time to reproduce them and this is not up to the QA team to discuss UX enhancements. So it would be much more efficient for both teams to: - first discuss the enhancement here or on redmine (I don't know your process :) - then fill a RFE when it's consolidated with all the needed info for the QA team - let the UX team confirm it quickly so it goes out the QA review process and stats. Thanks in advance for your help here! Cheers Sophie -- Sophie Gautier sophie.gaut...@documentfoundation.org Tel:+33683901545 Co-founder - Release coordinator The Document Foundation -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] RFE process between QA and UX
Hi Kendy, Le 16/12/2014 18:50, Jan Holesovsky a écrit : Hi Sophie, Sophie píše v Út 16. 12. 2014 v 16:57 +0100: Discussing with QA team today, there has been a lot of bug reports concerning minor enhancements these last days. It would be better is those enhancements would be first discussed by the UX team before going to QA for triage because most of the time they don't have the requested info regarding bug filling then QA team has to spend a lot of time to reproduce them and this is not up to the QA team to discuss UX enhancements. Please can you send few examples to have a better idea? :-) https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87360 https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=87357 or see this list: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/buglist.cgi?bug_status=NEWcomponent=ux-adviseemail1=philipz85%40hotmail.coemailtype1=substringlist_id=505514product=LibreOfficequery_format=advanced Asking because: So it would be much more efficient for both teams to: - first discuss the enhancement here or on redmine (I don't know your process :) If it is something small that is obviously the right thing to do (like some wording fix or so) - then it would be awesome to encourage the reporter to fix it himself / herself send a patch via gerrit. yes, but if the patch is reverted or not needed, it will be frustrating either for the implementer and for the developers. Not every idea is good to put on BZ or in a patch, a little discussion before would help to see if it's need, could be implemented or not :) If it is something bigger, then sending the bug id here to the ML is OK of course; or add it to the weekly hangout agenda, so that we discuss it there. - then fill a RFE when it's consolidated with all the needed info for the QA team - let the UX team confirm it quickly so it goes out the QA review process and stats. I'd say - either confirm (if the idea sounds interesting), or close as wontfix ;-) Yes, but that is a lot of work for bug triagers. If you well know the functionality, it's easy to discriminate, but for QA people who do not have that knowledge, the lack of steps to reproduce, examples, etc. is very time consuming plus the fact that he won't know what to do with it (50% of users would like to have it and the other 50% won't), when it can be solved quickly by discussing a little bit. Cheers Sophie -- Sophie Gautier sophie.gaut...@documentfoundation.org Tel:+33683901545 Co-founder - Release coordinator The Document Foundation -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
