Re: Draft Blog Post: You Can Help Us Improve OpenOffice by Helping Us Test
On 06/11/2012 Rob Weir wrote: https://blogs.apache.org/preview/OOo/?previewEntry=you_can_help_us_improve Thanks, the final version at https://blogs.apache.org/OOo/entry/you_can_help_us_improve is very good and useful to the project, like everything else you've published on the OpenOffice blog so far (I won't comment on what you write elsewhere, let's say it would be off-topic!). So the result is, we did already recruit some new QA volunteers. And this is great. What is now the best way to keep them involved? In the medium-long term, they will probably become able to follow issue queues and triage bugs independently, but shall we schedule some introductory QA activities at some point in late November to give new volunteers something to work on? Would it be easier to ask them to run manual tests on a build (if we have enough testcases, this is probably the best way to introduce them to QA) or to assign them random bugs from IssueZilla unconfirmed issues and have them verify them? Regards, Andrea.
Re: Proposal: Ask OpenOffice promotion
We used Google Moderator before and it is really nice thing to use. I like the base of the idea, but I have one question what about the questions coming from users through the user(s)@ mailing list ? Would that make them feel isolated in case some of them would not like to use Google Moderator for any reason ? On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 8:17 AM, Ross Gardler rgard...@opendirective.comwrote: What a great idea. I'm copying this to the ComDev list so others can consider it. Having said that this one reason this would work for AOO is that it has such a large non-technical user community., something that's not really true of other Apache projects. If any projects adapt the idea please feed back here. Sent from my tablet On Nov 14, 2012 11:42 PM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: This is mainly a community-relations / public outreach idea. I noticed that when we do a blog post we get a lot of unrelated questions, some of them quite good. So I'm thinking -- there must be a lot of good questions out there. They could range from How do I... to 'Why did you... to What if you did..., etc. So the proposal is to use Google Moderator, like we did before for the AOO 4.0 ideas, and use it to gather and rate questions. We call it Ask OpenOffice. After some period of time (a month?) we take the top-rated 10 (or top 5?) questions and respond to them in a blog post. This could become a regular thing that we repeat every 6 months or so, Ask OpenOffice 2, Ask OpenOffice 3, etc. Downside? We could get some awkward questions. But if such a question gets into the top 10, then we should give it a serious response, right? This is a challenge and an opportunity. What do you think? -Rob -- Thanks - Mohammad Nour Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving - Albert Einstein
Re: Proposal: Ask OpenOffice promotion
Joining a mailing list means signing up and wading through lots of emails one is not interested in. This proposal is a way to reach out to people who have a question but not the desire to engage with the community. There is no risk of isolation since these people wont come to those chanels. Note this is AOO where there are plenty of users who probsbly don't know how to manage a mailing list subscription (thats why AOO has user orums for example). Of course the response post should invite people to ask questions via the appropriate forum at any time. This is in addition to any usual user support and provides an opportunity for some good user outreach. Having said all this something like StackOverflow provides the voting benefits of moderator as well as the community/discussion benefits of a list/forum. Sent from my tablet On Nov 15, 2012 8:01 AM, Mohammad Nour El-Din nour.moham...@gmail.com wrote: We used Google Moderator before and it is really nice thing to use. I like the base of the idea, but I have one question what about the questions coming from users through the user(s)@ mailing list ? Would that make them feel isolated in case some of them would not like to use Google Moderator for any reason ? On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 8:17 AM, Ross Gardler rgard...@opendirective.com wrote: What a great idea. I'm copying this to the ComDev list so others can consider it. Having said that this one reason this would work for AOO is that it has such a large non-technical user community., something that's not really true of other Apache projects. If any projects adapt the idea please feed back here. Sent from my tablet On Nov 14, 2012 11:42 PM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: This is mainly a community-relations / public outreach idea. I noticed that when we do a blog post we get a lot of unrelated questions, some of them quite good. So I'm thinking -- there must be a lot of good questions out there. They could range from How do I... to 'Why did you... to What if you did..., etc. So the proposal is to use Google Moderator, like we did before for the AOO 4.0 ideas, and use it to gather and rate questions. We call it Ask OpenOffice. After some period of time (a month?) we take the top-rated 10 (or top 5?) questions and respond to them in a blog post. This could become a regular thing that we repeat every 6 months or so, Ask OpenOffice 2, Ask OpenOffice 3, etc. Downside? We could get some awkward questions. But if such a question gets into the top 10, then we should give it a serious response, right? This is a challenge and an opportunity. What do you think? -Rob -- Thanks - Mohammad Nour Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving - Albert Einstein
Re: Hello from Acrolinx
Hi Robert, On 14.11.2012 09:55, Robert Barbey wrote: Hi everyone, since my colleagues and I started writing a plug-in for OpenOffice Writer I wanted to let you guys know what we're trying to achieve with it. My company's main product is a client-server-based tool that assists authors in editing technical documentation. With a plug-in in their authoring tool, they can send the document they're currently working on to the server for linguistic analysis. Next to spell and grammar checking, this analysis involves checking of certain style rules (like Don't use Future tense, Don't use passive voice) and that the right terminology is used. Terminology is useful if you want to ensure that e.g. parts of a device are always called the same in a manual or that the right product name is used. The results of the analysis are then highlighted in the document itself so you don't have to jump between tools. The author can then click on each highlight and gets a context menu that offers more information about the issue and offers a suggestion how to correct it. After some great hints and some research we decided to use a smart tag-based approach to get the highlights for our flags into the document. For dummy texts, this works pretty well. Writing a plug-in for OpenOffice is pretty exciting for us since we have so far only dealt with proprietary editors with black box APIs. Sometimes we're lucky and grab a hold of a developer within the company that develops that editor and we get some information (usually just a confirmation that this is indeed a bug). With OpenOffice, this is a completely different story (finally!). If there's anything else you're interested in please drop me a line. Really looking forward to working with you guys! Welcome on board. It is great to see that AOO is being used in such an enterprise-focussed area and that such kind of users are getting involved in the project itself. Best regards, Oliver. Best, Robert -- Robert Barbey Principal Software Engineer Integrations UI robert.bar...@acrolinx.com Acrolinx GmbH Friedrichstraße 100 | 10117 Berlin | Germany http://www.acrolinx.com/
Re: Proposal: Ask OpenOffice promotion
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 9:09 AM, Ross Gardler rgard...@opendirective.comwrote: Joining a mailing list means signing up and wading through lots of emails one is not interested in. This proposal is a way to reach out to people who have a question but not the desire to engage with the community. There is no risk of isolation since these people wont come to those chanels. Note this is AOO where there are plenty of users who probsbly don't know how to manage a mailing list subscription (thats why AOO has user orums for example). Of course the response post should invite people to ask questions via the appropriate forum at any time. This is in addition to any usual user support and provides an opportunity for some good user outreach. Having said all this something like StackOverflow provides the voting benefits of moderator as well as the community/discussion benefits of a list/forum. Hmmm, good explanation Sent from my tablet On Nov 15, 2012 8:01 AM, Mohammad Nour El-Din nour.moham...@gmail.com wrote: We used Google Moderator before and it is really nice thing to use. I like the base of the idea, but I have one question what about the questions coming from users through the user(s)@ mailing list ? Would that make them feel isolated in case some of them would not like to use Google Moderator for any reason ? On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 8:17 AM, Ross Gardler rgard...@opendirective.com wrote: What a great idea. I'm copying this to the ComDev list so others can consider it. Having said that this one reason this would work for AOO is that it has such a large non-technical user community., something that's not really true of other Apache projects. If any projects adapt the idea please feed back here. Sent from my tablet On Nov 14, 2012 11:42 PM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: This is mainly a community-relations / public outreach idea. I noticed that when we do a blog post we get a lot of unrelated questions, some of them quite good. So I'm thinking -- there must be a lot of good questions out there. They could range from How do I... to 'Why did you... to What if you did..., etc. So the proposal is to use Google Moderator, like we did before for the AOO 4.0 ideas, and use it to gather and rate questions. We call it Ask OpenOffice. After some period of time (a month?) we take the top-rated 10 (or top 5?) questions and respond to them in a blog post. This could become a regular thing that we repeat every 6 months or so, Ask OpenOffice 2, Ask OpenOffice 3, etc. Downside? We could get some awkward questions. But if such a question gets into the top 10, then we should give it a serious response, right? This is a challenge and an opportunity. What do you think? -Rob -- Thanks - Mohammad Nour Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving - Albert Einstein -- Thanks - Mohammad Nour Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving - Albert Einstein
Re: desktop publishing
Alexandro , On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 11:24 PM, Phillip Zadro ricaza1...@hotmail.com.auwrote: hi Is there any likelihood that OpenOffice will one day include a desktop publisher? There is only one thing that is stopping me from migrating completely from Microsoft Office to either OpenOffice or LibreOffice and it is their lack of a Desktop Publisher comparable with MS Publisher. I have used Publisher for over 15 years and love its practicality, particularly with paginating of booklets. Even a separate program like Serif PagePlus cannot save in MS format either, so I am obliged to stay with MS Office. Pity.. Thanks Phil Draw is a perfect Desktop publisher, is so perfect is compatible with other We uses exclusifly Writer (+ lot of basic macro's) to make over 8.000 full color magazine pages par year. This pages are all i2 languages versions, with cutouts (we uses Edit Contour) transparancies etc...) Our Editors places lowres images embedded in there documents, a final macro checks the resolution quality and changes the lowres with the highres (stored on a server) just before exporting to PDF Sinds there is SVG, we no longer use EPS and Adobe to make our PDF's. PostScript is dead anyhow (lack of transparency) the LO/OO- PDF export is with use off a Lanczos filter nearly perfect. We only needs a payed Color Server to transfer our RGB PDF's to CMYK Our magazines are printed by different print houses (15.000-3.000 exp.) on high quality paper, there are no complaints from our printers and the readers can not sea the difference between our Magazines an thus maded by payed DTP applications Just a pitty thats SVG is still exported as bitmap (sould been repaired in 3.7) and PDF is still not a accepted as a graphic format like we can use (Tiff, jpg, etc...) Greetz Fernand desktop publishers like Scribus and is based on a frame based paradigm. There are some features that would be desirable but is pretty easy to complete basic and medium tasks like Flyers, Booklets and all it has layers which keeps design separated from content. And have multiple layouts and use of vectorial forms. With improved use of SVG Draw is also gaining strenght in the area of design compatibility and would be improving as more features are considered.
[UX] Desoign Exploration - Dockable Task Pane Content Design
Hello All, I've been exploring the information design (content) for the dockable task pane. I've analyzed the current content in both LS and AOO, and captured some thoughts on future design direction. See: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_-_Information_Design Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki page. Thanks, Kevin
Re: Best practices for contributing code to both Apache OpenOffice and LibreOffice
Hello, I've heard some discussion and interest in this topic off-list. There has been some practical experience, but nothing that we've written down or promoted. I'd be interested in seeing if we can come up with some solid best practices. The problem: Many (most?) open source contributors are not opposed to AOO or LO. They are just interested in helping out. If they produce a patch, or documentation, fix a bug or add a translation, they want to maximize the public good that comes from that work. License differences are confusing and frustrating and bring them no joy. They want a set of clear instructions for how they can do the most good with the least process overhead. Naturally, I'm looking at this from the AOO side. But most of these issues are symmetrical. So for sake of argument, suppose I identify myself primarily as a LibreOffice developer/translator/technical author, and I want to make my work available more broadly. What should I do? As I see it, the issues are threefold: communications, technical integration and license. On the communications side, how do I let AOO know that I've done work that I want to contribute to them? Sending a note to dev@ or posting a patch in AOO's BZ would work, of course. But both require extra work for the contributor. Are there any lighter weight ways of doing this? For example, could we suggest a tag that could be used in git or Bugzilla, for the contributor to indicate their intent that the contribution be made available to AOO as well? Something like #AOOCONTRIBUTION ? That would make it easy for us to search for such items. Technical integration -- Due to divergence between the projects, not every LO patch can be applied to AOO automatically. Some will, but many will require adaptation. Certainly the contributor could integrate and build their patch for both products. That would be idea. But it is asking a lot. Would we accept less? Or maybe we sugest areas where technical integration would be easier and require no extra work? Otherwise, integration would require extra work on our end. But this is not fatal. In fact it could lead to a set of easy tasks for new developers. License -- the differences here are well-known, but are easily solved. A contributor merely needs to state that they are making their patch available to AOO under ALv2. There are various ways to record this fact publicly. One is to make the statement in the source system (git or BZ). But that is extra work. Another way might be submit an iCLA to Apache. Another way might be to publicly record an intention on our dev@ list, along the lines of, All of my (future/past) LibreOffice contributions should be considered also contributions under the Apache License 2.0 to the Apache OpenOffice project. Another other ideas? Would it be possible to agree on this, a _short official statement_ of the AOO project, which could then be translated into several languages and used in many ways? Just the mention of the necessary proper licensing (Apache license helps both projects, LGPL license helps only one project) seems to me of great practical importance. I could e.g. very well imagine something like writing in a flyer or included in a AOO distribution CD. Greetings, Jörg
Re: Look at the pretty branches
Hi, On 15.11.2012 00:10, Rob Weir wrote: I see that our project is growing new branches. Would it make sense to start documenting these on a wiki page, so it is clear what each one is, and who is maintaining it? Current branches are: AOO34/ --- Our 3.4.x branch, would be used if we ever need a 3.4.2 alg/ -- This is Armin's long-term graphics rendering improvement work, maybe integrated for AOO 4.1 gbuild/ -- This looks new, from Andrew. Sounds build-related. But what is it? And what is the plan for getting it integrated? Is this planned AOO 4.0? writer001/ -- Ditto. What is it and what is the plan for getting it integrated? It has been already integrated into trunk [1]. Its purpose was the development and test of the TableOfContent enhancement in our Microsoft Word binary filter [2]. [1] http://svn.apache.org/viewvc?view=revisionrevision=1386590 [2] http://ooo-dev.markmail.org/thread/hozsulnxjfytrvej Best regards, Oliver. Thanks! -Rob
Re: [UX] Desoign Exploration - Dockable Task Pane Content Design
Simon, Indeed, I think we should keep it simple for the initial implementation. Contextual properties is a must have. I'll prep some interaction design mockups. Regards, Kevin On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 5:32 PM, Shenfeng Liu liush...@gmail.com wrote: Kevin, The proposal is very good! I suggest we start from the Content Properties and ClipArt, and add more release by release. - Shenfeng (Simon) 2012/11/15 Kevin Grignon kevingrignon...@gmail.com Hello All, I've been exploring the information design (content) for the dockable task pane. I've analyzed the current content in both LS and AOO, and captured some thoughts on future design direction. See: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_-_Information_Design Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki page. Thanks, Kevin
Re: Templates
Kori, We'd love your feedback on the templates. Does it meet your needs, anything missing? Regards, Kevin On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 6:25 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Hi Kori, Our templates website is here: http://templates.openoffice.org/ If you type recipe in the search box you'll see a few templates that might help. Regards, -Rob On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 3:04 PM, Kori Haight haigh...@gmail.com wrote: I was wondering if you guys had a template for making a cookbook yet. If you do where can I find it? if not about how long until you get a template out for it?
Re: Helping
KG01 - See comments inline. On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 9:33 AM, Ian C i...@amham.net wrote: Hi David, welcome aboard. Getting involved kind of depends on you and what you want to do. Development, testing, documentation, internationalisation, web site? KG01 - plus user interface design, interaction design and visual design Have you seen https://incubator.apache.org/openofficeorg/get-involved.html ? That should act as a good starting point. There is a new http://incubator.apache.org/openofficeorg/orientation/index.html which is being put together too. Sing out for more help when you check it. There are many more here who know much more than I. On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 7:07 AM, David Sive davidpauls...@yahoo.com wrote: Hi I am interested in getting involved, please can you email me information on how I can help ? Best Wishes David -- Cheers, Ian C
Re: Apache OO program crashes
On Wed, 14 Nov 2012 13:33:52 -0500 Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 1:04 PM, Kay Schenk kay.sch...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 6:23 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 3:08 AM, Andrea Pescetti pesce...@apache.org wrote: On 13/11/2012 Painius wrote: then I should notify all of you to see if someone else has the problem and possibly a solution. His tip did not keep AOO from crashing, so here goes... Frequent crashes are often due to the first of our Known Issues: http://www.openoffice.org/development/releases/3.4.1.html#AOO3.4.1ReleaseNotes-KnownIssues Apache OpenOffice 3.4.0 and 3.4.1 manage the user profile differently than previous versions. The old user profile is automatically converted so that users can keep their extensions and settings. In a minority of cases, especially with highly customized profiles (many extensions or customizations) the conversion doesn't succeed. Common symptoms are: frequent application crashes, problems with dictionaries or thesaurus, OpenOffice starting and crashing after a few seconds. To solve this, just reset/rename your user profile as explained in the official OpenOffice forum. http://user.services.openoffice.org/en/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12426 So if this is our #1 issue, is there anything we can do to improve it? Deleting the profile is really a power-user remedy. It requires more OS knowledge than the typical user has, especially on Windows where folders like this are hidden by default. Has anyone tried to figure out exactly what is happening? Is there anyway we can finally fix this in AOO 4.0? We might not be able to migrate every extension, but at least make it so that if something cannot be converted we write out some diagnostic info in a text file. And if something doesn't convert, we skip it entirely? IMHO, it is better to require a reinstall of an extension than to create an unstable profile. -Rob This has NOT been an issue with Linux (in my experience), even though Hagar's response on the forums gives instructions for how to deal with it: http://forum.openoffice.org/en/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12426 Do we know what OSes are most affected? I have never seen the issue either, on Windows or Linux. But I may be just missing the combination needed. What is frustrating is that we don't know the cause. Is it a problem with a single popular extension? A problem with a single setting, or many settings? All settings of a specific data type? A robustness issue dealing with bad data? A new bug? An old bug? Studies have shown that most people don't report problems. If something doesn't work they'll just stop using it. But they'll tell their friends. So for every person who has reported this issue, we should consider that there are many more how are just suffering in silence, or have already given up. On the other hand, if this just goes away in AOO 4.0 then a well-publicized , easy to use profile clean-up tool might be the only thing we can do for current users. -Rob Rather than a separate profile clean-up tool perhaps a better approach would be to incorporate the functionality for this within AOO, accessible only by command line. # A separate tool is OS dependant, which means we have to have a number of them (each with detailed instructions); incorporated into OpenOffice at a command line level it knows the target OS so we don't need individual separate OS dependant applications. Being driven from command line prevents inadvertent application of such a potentially dangerous utility, and at command line level it ought be simple(ish) to cause OpenOffice to reboot into graphics mode and thereby generate a new default User Profile. -- Rory O'Farrell ofarr...@iol.ie
Re: [UX] Desoign Exploration - Dockable Task Pane Content Design
Thanks, Kevin! And I added your Content Design page to the sidebar planning wiki: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO+4.0+sidebar - Shenfeng (Simon) 2012/11/15 Kevin Grignon kevingrignon...@gmail.com Simon, Indeed, I think we should keep it simple for the initial implementation. Contextual properties is a must have. I'll prep some interaction design mockups. Regards, Kevin On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 5:32 PM, Shenfeng Liu liush...@gmail.com wrote: Kevin, The proposal is very good! I suggest we start from the Content Properties and ClipArt, and add more release by release. - Shenfeng (Simon) 2012/11/15 Kevin Grignon kevingrignon...@gmail.com Hello All, I've been exploring the information design (content) for the dockable task pane. I've analyzed the current content in both LS and AOO, and captured some thoughts on future design direction. See: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_-_Information_Design Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki page. Thanks, Kevin
Re: Look at the pretty branches
On 15.11.2012 00:10, Rob Weir wrote: I see that our project is growing new branches. Would it make sense to start documenting these on a wiki page, so it is clear what each one is, and who is maintaining it? Current branches are: AOO34/ --- Our 3.4.x branch, would be used if we ever need a 3.4.2 alg/ -- This is Armin's long-term graphics rendering improvement work, maybe integrated for AOO 4.1 gbuild/ -- This looks new, from Andrew. Sounds build-related. But what is it? And what is the plan for getting it integrated? Is this planned AOO 4.0? writer001/ -- Ditto. What is it and what is the plan for getting it integrated? I have created a simple Wiki page that lists the branches and tags: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Source_Code Feel free to expand. -Andre
Re: Symphony IP Cleanup
Taking a little break from my vacations ... - Is there anything in particular that you want to see cleaned up? Extracting code without the history is not exactly easy so we basically have to check wth the IBM guys anyways. There is also the issue that we only release code through the project releases and it was decided we wont do Symphony-based releases. Just like the code in experimental branches, changing the license headers doesnt imply the code has been or will be released and shouldnt be used as a base in other projects. FWIW, the code as is, has already been of use for bringing new stuff into AOO 3.5. Pedro.
Re: Look at the pretty branches
On 15.11.2012 10:33, Oliver-Rainer Wittmann wrote: On 15.11.2012 00:10, Rob Weir wrote: I see that our project is growing new branches. Would it make sense to start documenting these on a wiki page, so it is clear what each one is, and who is maintaining it? Current branches are: [...] writer001/ -- Ditto. What is it and what is the plan for getting it integrated? It has been already integrated into trunk [1]. Should we remove branches that have been integrated? There is a minor nit that speaks against it, but that is not critical: SVN merges all the changes as one commit so that the individual commits that were done on the branch are not visible in the log of the merge target, they are only visible in the branch that was integrated. Removing this branch does not lose the individual history though as the branch is still in the revision history even if it is no longer in the head revision. So I suggest that dead/closed/integrated branches are removed. Herbert
Re: Look at the pretty branches
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 7:02 AM, Herbert Duerr h...@apache.org wrote: On 15.11.2012 10:33, Oliver-Rainer Wittmann wrote: On 15.11.2012 00:10, Rob Weir wrote: I see that our project is growing new branches. Would it make sense to start documenting these on a wiki page, so it is clear what each one is, and who is maintaining it? Current branches are: [...] writer001/ -- Ditto. What is it and what is the plan for getting it integrated? It has been already integrated into trunk [1]. Should we remove branches that have been integrated? There is a minor nit that speaks against it, but that is not critical: SVN merges all the changes as one commit so that the individual commits that were done on the branch are not visible in the log of the merge target, they are only visible in the branch that was integrated. Removing this branch does not lose the individual history though as the branch is still in the revision history even if it is no longer in the head revision. So I suggest that dead/closed/integrated branches are removed. Or, if we want the history more obvious, maybe move to an integrated folder? or rename so they start with _integrated- (so they sort together)? -Rob Herbert
Re: Proposal: Ask OpenOffice promotion
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 3:00 AM, Mohammad Nour El-Din nour.moham...@gmail.com wrote: We used Google Moderator before and it is really nice thing to use. I like the base of the idea, but I have one question what about the questions coming from users through the user(s)@ mailing list ? Would that make them feel isolated in case some of them would not like to use Google Moderator for any reason ? Certainly some might be adverse to creating a Google ID for this purpose. But some of our users are (vocally) adverse to mailing lists as well and don't want to share an email address publicly. The nice thing here is we can help transfer questions from other places. So if we get a question (as part of this promotion) to our Facebook page, or Twitter or whatever, we can add it to moderator with a prefix like [from Twitter, @foo]. -Rob On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 8:17 AM, Ross Gardler rgard...@opendirective.comwrote: What a great idea. I'm copying this to the ComDev list so others can consider it. Having said that this one reason this would work for AOO is that it has such a large non-technical user community., something that's not really true of other Apache projects. If any projects adapt the idea please feed back here. Sent from my tablet On Nov 14, 2012 11:42 PM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: This is mainly a community-relations / public outreach idea. I noticed that when we do a blog post we get a lot of unrelated questions, some of them quite good. So I'm thinking -- there must be a lot of good questions out there. They could range from How do I... to 'Why did you... to What if you did..., etc. So the proposal is to use Google Moderator, like we did before for the AOO 4.0 ideas, and use it to gather and rate questions. We call it Ask OpenOffice. After some period of time (a month?) we take the top-rated 10 (or top 5?) questions and respond to them in a blog post. This could become a regular thing that we repeat every 6 months or so, Ask OpenOffice 2, Ask OpenOffice 3, etc. Downside? We could get some awkward questions. But if such a question gets into the top 10, then we should give it a serious response, right? This is a challenge and an opportunity. What do you think? -Rob -- Thanks - Mohammad Nour Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving - Albert Einstein
Re: Proposal: Ask OpenOffice promotion
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 1:13 AM, Alexandro Colorado j...@oooes.org wrote: On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 10:58 PM, Alexandro Colorado j...@oooes.org wrote: actually we do had faqs, many of them actually, the main issue is mantaining such FAQs. this remind me of a xkcd http://xkcd.com/927/ On 11/14/12, Kay Schenk kay.sch...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 3:42 PM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: This is mainly a community-relations / public outreach idea. I noticed that when we do a blog post we get a lot of unrelated questions, some of them quite good. So I'm thinking -- there must be a lot of good questions out there. They could range from How do I... to 'Why did you... to What if you did..., etc. Here is what I would try to update: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Documentation/FAQ So maybe this will give us some material we can use to update the FAQ's? Some of the questions might be product/feature questions, but I'm also expecting some ones regarding project direction, like, How does the growing popularity of tablets impact your planning? or similar that would not traditionally be covered in FAQ's. -Rob So the proposal is to use Google Moderator, like we did before for the AOO 4.0 ideas, and use it to gather and rate questions. We call it Ask OpenOffice. After some period of time (a month?) we take the top-rated 10 (or top 5?) questions and respond to them in a blog post. This could become a regular thing that we repeat every 6 months or so, Ask OpenOffice 2, Ask OpenOffice 3, etc. Downside? We could get some awkward questions. But if such a question gets into the top 10, then we should give it a serious response, right? This is a challenge and an opportunity. What do you think? -Rob I like this. I've thought *for a while* to cull through the Forums (still no time dedicated to it), and come up with some FAQ for the product. What you're suggesting is another alternative to this. Of course this approach would include questions about new features too. We really SHOULD do something like this. We have no formal FAQ near as I can determine. (I think we had this discussion vis a vis when is the user likely go to whatever source for help a few weeks ago.) The Help system that comes *with* the product is very good. But, it does not, and really can not address general installation, crash issues obviously. -- MzK “How wrong is it for a woman to expect the man to build the world she wants, rather than to create it herself?” -- Anais Nin -- Alexandro Colorado PPMC Apache OpenOffice http://es.openoffice.org -- Alexandro Colorado Apache OpenOffice Contributor http://es.openoffice.org
Re: [DISCUSS] Do we want download links for Dev Builds on a usual webpage?
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 2:44 AM, Andrea Pescetti pesce...@apache.org wrote: On 11/11/2012 Kay Schenk wrote: On 11/11/2012 04:22 AM, Andrea Pescetti wrote: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Development+Snapshot+Builds (they are also called with/without system integration respectively). OK, I see this note and I confess I don't pay much attention to it, and typically install in parallel for these. But, I keep the same user profile if you will, and this doesn't seem to cause problems for me. Right now this note says: This week's builds are built without system integration. Is the the normal? What is normal highly depends on the status of the builds we are providing. For ordinary snapshots, without system integration is normal because they will co-exist with a stable version and be updated frequently; this would be the case for a beta release too, but as we approach release we will want to test system integration too and the normal snapshot will have system integration enabled. This is agreed on a case-by-case basis when we start building. Question: the bugs that we're seeing related to profile conversion/upgrading, is that something that would only have been caught when testing with system integration enabled? Hopefully my point is obvious -- we can't test and find system integration bugs unless we have system integration builds. Real testers today are using virtual machines. So the install side-by-side problem is not a real problem. But not having something that is as-close-as-possible to what we plan to ship -- that is a real problem. -Rob Regards, Andrea.
Re: Apache OpenOffice at FOSDEM 2013
On 14/11/2012 Andrea Pescetti wrote: copied and pasted into an e-mail, see other announcements ... https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/FOSDEM+2013+CFP is just for writing/reviewing this text. Link won't be published. Reminder: in slightly more than 24 hours, that page will be copied and pasted into a text-only message to the FOSDEM mailing lists and (if nobody opposes) to ooo-dev and ooo-announce. So far, only Rob made a few minor edits. Feel free to improve the call for talks before it is sent. Regards, Andrea.
Re: Open sources days denmark.
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 8:07 AM, jan iversen jancasacon...@gmail.com wrote: Is this a place we want to show up ? http://www.opensourcedays.org/2012/ It is pretty big in scandinavia. Maybe add it here: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Events+Calendar Certainly would be a good place to present, especially if we have the Danish, Norwegian and Swedish translations ready to join our already released Finnish translation. -Rob Jan.
Re: Open sources days denmark.
Hi, On 12-11-15, at 08:07 , jan iversen jancasacon...@gmail.com wrote: Is this a place we want to show up ? http://www.opensourcedays.org/2012/ It is pretty big in scandinavia. Jan. I have attended prior versions of this event, run by Peter Toft; the last time I went was, I think, in 2010, prior to the split. The event is indeed big in Scandinavia, and though there are now others, this has the glamour of longevity. The issue is that it is also a preferred event, I'd guess, for LO, as at least one of the founders, Leif L., is somewhat involved. Personally, I don't think that ought to be an issue. In fact, I'd hope that being in the same place at the same time doing more or less the same thing all while claiming community and collaboration *might actually produce* works of collaboration, community—if not feelings of comity. Peter is a great guy and the people attending are terrific. Denmark's role in Scandinavia is perhaps not fully recognized, but it's not too different from its role in other far-seeing endeavours: Good, socially responsible and fun things are happening there. So, a strong plus one. Louis
Re: Apache OO program crashes
On 11/15/2012 04:47 AM, Rory O'Farrell wrote: On Wed, 14 Nov 2012 13:33:52 -0500 Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 1:04 PM, Kay Schenk kay.sch...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 6:23 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 3:08 AM, Andrea Pescetti pesce...@apache.org wrote: On 13/11/2012 Painius wrote: then I should notify all of you to see if someone else has the problem and possibly a solution. His tip did not keep AOO from crashing, so here goes... Frequent crashes are often due to the first of our Known Issues: http://www.openoffice.org/development/releases/3.4.1.html#AOO3.4.1ReleaseNotes-KnownIssues Apache OpenOffice 3.4.0 and 3.4.1 manage the user profile differently than previous versions. The old user profile is automatically converted so that users can keep their extensions and settings. In a minority of cases, especially with highly customized profiles (many extensions or customizations) the conversion doesn't succeed. Common symptoms are: frequent application crashes, problems with dictionaries or thesaurus, OpenOffice starting and crashing after a few seconds. To solve this, just reset/rename your user profile as explained in the official OpenOffice forum. http://user.services.openoffice.org/en/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12426 So if this is our #1 issue, is there anything we can do to improve it? Deleting the profile is really a power-user remedy. It requires more OS knowledge than the typical user has, especially on Windows where folders like this are hidden by default. Has anyone tried to figure out exactly what is happening? Is there anyway we can finally fix this in AOO 4.0? We might not be able to migrate every extension, but at least make it so that if something cannot be converted we write out some diagnostic info in a text file. And if something doesn't convert, we skip it entirely? IMHO, it is better to require a reinstall of an extension than to create an unstable profile. -Rob This has NOT been an issue with Linux (in my experience), even though Hagar's response on the forums gives instructions for how to deal with it: http://forum.openoffice.org/en/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12426 Do we know what OSes are most affected? I have never seen the issue either, on Windows or Linux. But I may be just missing the combination needed. What is frustrating is that we don't know the cause. Is it a problem with a single popular extension? A problem with a single setting, or many settings? All settings of a specific data type? A robustness issue dealing with bad data? A new bug? An old bug? Studies have shown that most people don't report problems. If something doesn't work they'll just stop using it. But they'll tell their friends. So for every person who has reported this issue, we should consider that there are many more how are just suffering in silence, or have already given up. On the other hand, if this just goes away in AOO 4.0 then a well-publicized , easy to use profile clean-up tool might be the only thing we can do for current users. -Rob Rather than a separate profile clean-up tool perhaps a better approach would be to incorporate the functionality for this within AOO, accessible only by command line. # A separate tool is OS dependant, which means we have to have a number of them (each with detailed instructions); incorporated into OpenOffice at a command line level it knows the target OS so we don't need individual separate OS dependant applications. Being driven from command line prevents inadvertent application of such a potentially dangerous utility, and at command line level it ought be simple(ish) to cause OpenOffice to reboot into graphics mode and thereby generate a new default User Profile. Getting the location of the user settings is easy, run the macro shown below to see the user path settings. The difficult part, is knowing if you can rename the directory while OOo is running; I expect probably not, because files will be open. I don't really understand what happens if you rename that directory while OOo is running. I expect, therefore, that an external utility is required (if you desire one). Sub DisplayPathSettings Dim oPathSettings' PathSettings service. Dim oPropertySetInfo ' Access the service properties. Dim aProperties ' Contains all of the service properties. Dim oDoc ' Reference a newly created document. Dim oText' Document's text object. Dim oCursor ' Cursor in the text object. Dim oProperty' A property of the service. Dim cPropertyName$ ' Property name. Dim cPropertyValue ' Property value may be an array or multiple strings. Dim aPaths ' The paths as an array. Dim cPath$ ' A single path from the array. Dim j As Integer ' Index variable. Dim i As Integer ' Index variable. oPathSettings = CreateUnoService(
Re: New stats script: platform.py
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 11:07 AM, Herbert Duerr h...@apache.org wrote: On 15.11.2012 15:35, Rob Weir wrote: I just checked in a new script (platform.py) that queries the SourceForge REST API to get a platform breakdown for downloads. For example, looking at 3.4.1 downloads from November 1st until today, we see: Windows: 1615741 (87.55%) Macintosh: 176417 (9.56%) Linux: 27512 (1.49%) Android: 7193 (0.39%) Solaris: 45 (0.00%) BSD: 14 (0.00%) Unknown: 18666 (1.01%) Note: these are the counts for the platform doing the download, not the platform of the download. So if I download the Windows binaries from a Linux machine I would be listed as Linux here. Unexpected here is the 7193 downloads from Android. Any ideas on what that signifies? The platform.py scripts seems to get the download stats indexed by the browser OS, not by the target OS our application is intended to run on. So if someone downloads the Mac version on his Android smartphone this gets counted as an Android download. That much is clear. But is it credible that AOO 3.4.1 has been downloaded over 7000 times on Android smartphones? Maybe to download and then put onto DropBox or something? It just seems weird. -Rob Herbert
RE: Symphony IP Cleanup
It has nothing to do with whether anything from the Symphony donation is ever released in AOO. The code has been donated and it should have its IP cleaned up. Also, the history is not needed. It is simply the headers and notices on the code as donated that is a problem. There are simple rules for how donated code is cleaned up. It should be done. That becomes the start of history as far as ASF is concerned. If anyone is making derivatives from that code already, including for AOO 3.5, who is cleaning up the headers? Cherry picking that code and creating patches elsewhere is not tidy. I assume you don't mean that. It is important to honor notices present on code until someone with the authority to do so removes/replaces those notices. It is simply cleaner (and legally meticulous) to clean up the code in the Symphony folder of SVN. Then anyone can do whatever they want, whether by cherry-picking, merging, testing and fixing, putting in branches for further work, etc. Meanwhile this has been sitting in a public SVN for months with notices that are toxic for those of us who consider it inappropriate to mess with [L]GPL code and especially files in that code with IBM closed-source proprietary notices on them. - Dennis PS: It was great to see your smiling face in the photos posted form ApacheCon EU. -Original Message- From: Pedro Giffuni [mailto:p...@apache.org] Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2012 03:24 To: orc...@apache.org Cc: ooo-dev Subject: Re: Symphony IP Cleanup Taking a little break from my vacations ... - Is there anything in particular that you want to see cleaned up? Extracting code without the history is not exactly easy so we basically have to check wth the IBM guys anyways. There is also the issue that we only release code through the project releases and it was decided we wont do Symphony-based releases. Just like the code in experimental branches, changing the license headers doesnt imply the code has been or will be released and shouldnt be used as a base in other projects. FWIW, the code as is, has already been of use for bringing new stuff into AOO 3.5. Pedro.
Re: New stats script: platform.py
Interesting result. I know what you guys saying, that it only means people downloading AOO from android devices, but not using AOO from android devices. In my opinion, such number would at least means that, there do exist thousands of AOO customers, who prefer using mobile devices on their cyber stuff, even on downloading applications that even cannot be use on the mobile devices. And i bet, such number would grow continuely, as the number of mobilers are definitely growing so fast. So, based on the number, may I conclude that: it is important for us, the AOO guys, on thinking about the mobile AOO? 在 2012/11/16 12:07 AM，Herbert Duerr h...@apache.org写道： On 15.11.2012 15:35, Rob Weir wrote: I just checked in a new script (platform.py) that queries the SourceForge REST API to get a platform breakdown for downloads. For example, looking at 3.4.1 downloads from November 1st until today, we see: Windows: 1615741 (87.55%) Macintosh: 176417 (9.56%) Linux: 27512 (1.49%) Android: 7193 (0.39%) Solaris: 45 (0.00%) BSD: 14 (0.00%) Unknown: 18666 (1.01%) Note: these are the counts for the platform doing the download, not the platform of the download. So if I download the Windows binaries from a Linux machine I would be listed as Linux here. Unexpected here is the 7193 downloads from Android. Any ideas on what that signifies? The platform.py scripts seems to get the download stats indexed by the browser OS, not by the target OS our application is intended to run on. So if someone downloads the Mac version on his Android smartphone this gets counted as an Android download. Herbert
RE: Symphony IP Cleanup
Hi Dennis; I am afraid that what we are doing is exactly cherry picking code and creating patches. AFAICT there is no one actively working on the symphony code. If I notice something I like, I open a bugzilla issue and try to get someone from IBM to look at it. The code still has unacceptable components (at least lcc cpp) and I am not sure it builds. I guess if you find it too bothersome we could move the code to Apache Extras, but it is still useful to be able to look at it somewhere. Pedro. Ps. ApacheCon was fun indeed!
Re: Proposal: Ask OpenOffice promotion
On 11/15/12, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 1:13 AM, Alexandro Colorado j...@oooes.org wrote: On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 10:58 PM, Alexandro Colorado j...@oooes.org wrote: actually we do had faqs, many of them actually, the main issue is mantaining such FAQs. this remind me of a xkcd http://xkcd.com/927/ On 11/14/12, Kay Schenk kay.sch...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 3:42 PM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: This is mainly a community-relations / public outreach idea. I noticed that when we do a blog post we get a lot of unrelated questions, some of them quite good. So I'm thinking -- there must be a lot of good questions out there. They could range from How do I... to 'Why did you... to What if you did..., etc. Here is what I would try to update: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Documentation/FAQ So maybe this will give us some material we can use to update the FAQ's? Some of the questions might be product/feature questions, but I'm also expecting some ones regarding project direction, like, How does the growing popularity of tablets impact your planning? or similar that would not traditionally be covered in FAQ's. This is another one: Dev FAQ:http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/FAQ and User FAQ: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Documentation/FAQ -Rob So the proposal is to use Google Moderator, like we did before for the AOO 4.0 ideas, and use it to gather and rate questions. We call it Ask OpenOffice. After some period of time (a month?) we take the top-rated 10 (or top 5?) questions and respond to them in a blog post. This could become a regular thing that we repeat every 6 months or so, Ask OpenOffice 2, Ask OpenOffice 3, etc. Downside? We could get some awkward questions. But if such a question gets into the top 10, then we should give it a serious response, right? This is a challenge and an opportunity. What do you think? -Rob I like this. I've thought *for a while* to cull through the Forums (still no time dedicated to it), and come up with some FAQ for the product. What you're suggesting is another alternative to this. Of course this approach would include questions about new features too. We really SHOULD do something like this. We have no formal FAQ near as I can determine. (I think we had this discussion vis a vis when is the user likely go to whatever source for help a few weeks ago.) The Help system that comes *with* the product is very good. But, it does not, and really can not address general installation, crash issues obviously. -- MzK “How wrong is it for a woman to expect the man to build the world she wants, rather than to create it herself?” -- Anais Nin -- Alexandro Colorado PPMC Apache OpenOffice http://es.openoffice.org -- Alexandro Colorado Apache OpenOffice Contributor http://es.openoffice.org -- Alexandro Colorado PPMC Apache OpenOffice http://es.openoffice.org
Re: Look at the pretty branches
Apart from the branches it seems we have a directory called trunk-orig, that only seems to contain 3 files, are they important ?? +1 to remove branches when they are integrated, it gives a lot better overview. Jan. On 15 November 2012 13:19, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 7:03 PM, Andrew Rist andrew.r...@oracle.com wrote: On 11/14/2012 3:10 PM, Rob Weir wrote: I see that our project is growing new branches. Would it make sense to start documenting these on a wiki page, so it is clear what each one is, and who is maintaining it? Current branches are: AOO34/ --- Our 3.4.x branch, would be used if we ever need a 3.4.2 alg/ -- This is Armin's long-term graphics rendering improvement work, maybe integrated for AOO 4.1 gbuild/ -- This looks new, from Andrew. Sounds build-related. But what is it? And what is the plan for getting it integrated? Is this planned AOO 4.0? This is a continuation of this: http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-ooo-dev/201209.mbox/%3c505a1dc4.5030...@oracle.com%3E integration of a set of CWSes: ause131 ause130 writerfilter10 gnumake4 sd2gbuild And integration? Is this targeted for AOO 4.0? If so it would be good to get it reflected in this table: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO+4.0+Release+Planning That helps with the QA planning. The more we know about what is going into 4.0, the more we can start thinking about how we will test it, maybe even start writing the test cases for new features, if the design is clear enough now. Thanks! -Rob The initial branch for doing this work was deleted and this new branch created. With the original branch, I had applied all of the patches en masse, followed by one massive check-in. We'll just say that this was sub-optimal. After discussions at ApacheConEU - it was decided the best course was to start from scratch, that way we don't have to merge up to the latest trunk. I'm in the process now of applying and committing all the patches, followed by changing all the headers in newly created files. fun A. writer001/ -- Ditto. What is it and what is the plan for getting it integrated? Thanks! -Rob
RE: Symphony IP Cleanup
All that is required to clean up the headers is to have some sort of official permission from IBM to ASF that allows it to be done. That or an IBM-employed committer needs to be identified as authorized to do it. The basic requirement is under Source File Headers for Code Developed at the ASF at http://www.apache.org/legal/src-headers.html (A lengthy treatment is at http://incubator.apache.org/guides/mentor.html#initial-ip-clearance). The process is simple: If the source file is submitted with a copyright notice included in it, the copyright owner (or owner's agent) must either: 1.remove such notices, or 2.move them to the NOTICE file associated with each applicable project release, or 3.provide written permission for the ASF to make such removal or relocation of the notices. Andrew Rist provided this for the Oracle contribution. I don't understand the hold-up for the IBM contribution. Also, this sort of thing is expected to be handled during incubation. The specific statement is that It is recommended that the initial clean-up be is started before the code is committed. It MUST be completed before any releases are cut. So there is flexibility so long as no code appears in releases, but as you point out, code is leaking from the Symphony base into releases under the table. That is not healthy. - Dennis -Original Message- From: Pedro Giffuni [mailto:p...@apache.org] Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2012 10:15 To: orc...@apache.org; dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: RE: Symphony IP Cleanup Hi Dennis; I am afraid that what we are doing is exactly cherry picking code and creating patches. AFAICT there is no one actively working on the symphony code. If I notice something I like, I open a bugzilla issue and try to get someone from IBM to look at it. The code still has unacceptable components (at least lcc cpp) and I am not sure it builds. I guess if you find it too bothersome we could move the code to Apache Extras, but it is still useful to be able to look at it somewhere. Pedro. Ps. ApacheCon was fun indeed!
Re: Look at the pretty branches
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 4:00 PM, jan iversen jancasacon...@gmail.com wrote: +1 to move. But please help me out with a simple question, if I delete a file/directory in SVN, I assume it is only deleted from that version, so if I do a checkout of an old version it is included ?? If you check out a tree you get the contents of that tree at that specific revision. By default you get the most-recent revision, the head. But you can specify a specific earlier revision as needed. This will also resurrect deleted files that existed in that revision. There are some administrative things an admin could do with svnadmin dump and svndumpfilter to truly expunge a file, for legal or other extreme reasons. But this is very rare. If I am correct, why do we keep these things in trunk ? Not so much that anyone decided to keep it, but that no one decided to clean it up. 2nd Law of Thermodynamics, etc. Regards, -Rob rgds jan I. On 15 November 2012 21:57, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 3:09 PM, jan iversen jancasacon...@gmail.com wrote: Apart from the branches it seems we have a directory called trunk-orig, that only seems to contain 3 files, are they important ?? +1 to remove branches when they are integrated, it gives a lot better overview. These were some scripts we used during the original import of the OpenOffice.org codebase. Not needed anymore, but if we want them for future reference they might be better under /devtools, maybe directly into /devtools/hg2svn (Was mainly concerned with migration from Mercurial to SVN). If there are no objections I'll do such a move. -Rob Jan. On 15 November 2012 13:19, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 7:03 PM, Andrew Rist andrew.r...@oracle.com wrote: On 11/14/2012 3:10 PM, Rob Weir wrote: I see that our project is growing new branches. Would it make sense to start documenting these on a wiki page, so it is clear what each one is, and who is maintaining it? Current branches are: AOO34/ --- Our 3.4.x branch, would be used if we ever need a 3.4.2 alg/ -- This is Armin's long-term graphics rendering improvement work, maybe integrated for AOO 4.1 gbuild/ -- This looks new, from Andrew. Sounds build-related. But what is it? And what is the plan for getting it integrated? Is this planned AOO 4.0? This is a continuation of this: http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-ooo-dev/201209.mbox/%3c505a1dc4.5030...@oracle.com%3E integration of a set of CWSes: ause131 ause130 writerfilter10 gnumake4 sd2gbuild And integration? Is this targeted for AOO 4.0? If so it would be good to get it reflected in this table: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO+4.0+Release+Planning That helps with the QA planning. The more we know about what is going into 4.0, the more we can start thinking about how we will test it, maybe even start writing the test cases for new features, if the design is clear enough now. Thanks! -Rob The initial branch for doing this work was deleted and this new branch created. With the original branch, I had applied all of the patches en masse, followed by one massive check-in. We'll just say that this was sub-optimal. After discussions at ApacheConEU - it was decided the best course was to start from scratch, that way we don't have to merge up to the latest trunk. I'm in the process now of applying and committing all the patches, followed by changing all the headers in newly created files. fun A. writer001/ -- Ditto. What is it and what is the plan for getting it integrated? Thanks! -Rob
Re: Best practices for contributing code to both Apache OpenOffice and LibreOffice
Rob Weir wrote: The problem: Many (most?) open source contributors are not opposed to AOO or LO. They are just interested in helping out. If they produce a patch, or documentation, fix a bug or add a translation, they want to maximize the public good that comes from that work. You are writing this from the point of view of an individual contributor, but, as Day 3 of the ApacheCon http://s.apache.org/openoffice-aceu2012-day-3 showed, a huge opportunity is sponsored development. In that case, contributions are often more significant and the sponsor gets to choose the contractual details. Whatever policy (or set of instructions) we establish, we must make sure this case is included too. A contributor merely needs to state that they are making their patch available to AOO under ALv2. There are various ways to record this fact publicly. One is to make the statement in the source system (git or BZ). But that is extra work. Another way might be submit an iCLA to Apache. Another way might be to publicly record an intention on our dev@ list An ICLA is likely the safest way for large contributions. But this merely shifts the problem to defining the meaning of large... Regards, Andrea.
Re: Look at the pretty branches
On 15 November 2012 22:16, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 4:00 PM, jan iversen jancasacon...@gmail.com wrote: +1 to move. But please help me out with a simple question, if I delete a file/directory in SVN, I assume it is only deleted from that version, so if I do a checkout of an old version it is included ?? If you check out a tree you get the contents of that tree at that specific revision. By default you get the most-recent revision, the head. But you can specify a specific earlier revision as needed. This will also resurrect deleted files that existed in that revision. There are some administrative things an admin could do with svnadmin dump and svndumpfilter to truly expunge a file, for legal or other extreme reasons. But this is very rare. If I am correct, why do we keep these things in trunk ? Not so much that anyone decided to keep it, but that no one decided to clean it up. 2nd Law of Thermodynamics, etc. Not I know why I never passed that exam as engineerI think you once wrote to me JFDI, it is quite confusing when you try to get into the code, and there seems to be more examples like binfilter. Regards, -Rob rgds jan I. On 15 November 2012 21:57, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 3:09 PM, jan iversen jancasacon...@gmail.com wrote: Apart from the branches it seems we have a directory called trunk-orig, that only seems to contain 3 files, are they important ?? +1 to remove branches when they are integrated, it gives a lot better overview. These were some scripts we used during the original import of the OpenOffice.org codebase. Not needed anymore, but if we want them for future reference they might be better under /devtools, maybe directly into /devtools/hg2svn (Was mainly concerned with migration from Mercurial to SVN). If there are no objections I'll do such a move. -Rob Jan. On 15 November 2012 13:19, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 7:03 PM, Andrew Rist andrew.r...@oracle.com wrote: On 11/14/2012 3:10 PM, Rob Weir wrote: I see that our project is growing new branches. Would it make sense to start documenting these on a wiki page, so it is clear what each one is, and who is maintaining it? Current branches are: AOO34/ --- Our 3.4.x branch, would be used if we ever need a 3.4.2 alg/ -- This is Armin's long-term graphics rendering improvement work, maybe integrated for AOO 4.1 gbuild/ -- This looks new, from Andrew. Sounds build-related. But what is it? And what is the plan for getting it integrated? Is this planned AOO 4.0? This is a continuation of this: http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-ooo-dev/201209.mbox/%3c505a1dc4.5030...@oracle.com%3E integration of a set of CWSes: ause131 ause130 writerfilter10 gnumake4 sd2gbuild And integration? Is this targeted for AOO 4.0? If so it would be good to get it reflected in this table: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO+4.0+Release+Planning That helps with the QA planning. The more we know about what is going into 4.0, the more we can start thinking about how we will test it, maybe even start writing the test cases for new features, if the design is clear enough now. Thanks! -Rob The initial branch for doing this work was deleted and this new branch created. With the original branch, I had applied all of the patches en masse, followed by one massive check-in. We'll just say that this was sub-optimal. After discussions at ApacheConEU - it was decided the best course was to start from scratch, that way we don't have to merge up to the latest trunk. I'm in the process now of applying and committing all the patches, followed by changing all the headers in newly created files. fun A. writer001/ -- Ditto. What is it and what is the plan for getting it integrated? Thanks! -Rob
Re: bugzilla.
On 15/11/2012 jan iversen wrote: I have a new mail account, which I have created in bugzilla. Is there a way to move the bugs I have reported with my old e-mail to the new e-mail (in bugzilla) ? Regina is right, the right way is: update your e-mail address in the old account. Creating a new one is problematic to handle. You can probably still solve this by pointing the new account to some unused e-mail address and then editing the old account. If this doesn't work, you'll have to subscribe (CC) all issues linked to the old account with the new one. Note that using your (brand new!) @apache.org address in Bugzilla automatically gives you higher privileges. Regards, Andrea.
Re: bugzilla.
On 11/15/2012 17:28, Jan iversen wrote: Hi. I have a new mail account, which I have created in bugzilla. Is there a way to move the bugs I have reported with my old e-mail to the new e-mail (in bugzilla) ? Jan. Hi, Jan, If you changed your email address in an existing BZ account (preferences at top of page, Account information tab), it should change on all bugs reported by that account. If you added a new BZ account (giving you two accounts), please consider merely changing the old one. I should be able to delete the extra account, if you want. /tj/ BZ admin
Re: Editing needed on BZ footer -- remove podling reference
On 11/14/2012 05:06 PM, TJ Frazier wrote: On 11/14/2012 18:47, Kay Schenk wrote: HI -- Could one of our BZ admins please remove the podling reference in the footer area for Apache OOo Bugzilla? Thanks. Hi, Kay, A little research in the BZ Help [1] reveals in Section 6.3.5 that the global footer is in a template, global/footer.html.tmpl. AFAIK it will take root access to the system to change, i.e., we need a site maintainer to do it. HTH, /tj/ Thanks again...Ok, I set up a task for infra -- https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-5529 [1] https://issues.apache.org/ooo/docs/en/html/cust-templates.html -- MzK “How wrong is it for a woman to expect the man to build the world she wants, rather than to create it herself?” -- Anais Nin
Re: Proposal: Ask OpenOffice promotion
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 3:00 PM, F C. Costero fjcc.apa...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 12:06 PM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 7:44 AM, Andrea Pescetti pesce...@apache.org wrote: Rob Weir wrote: This is mainly a community-relations / public outreach idea. I noticed that when we do a blog post we get a lot of unrelated questions, some of them quite good. So I'm thinking -- there must be a lot of good questions out there. They could range from How do I... to 'Why did you... to What if you did..., etc. So the proposal is to use Google Moderator Excellent idea. I'd just be careful in telling people that for support they should go to http://forum.openoffice.org to define the kind of questions we want to have (so, for example, How can I prepare a tri-fold brochure with OpenOffice? is right; a bug report or enhancement request is not quite right, at least in general). Good point. Here is what we have now: https://www.google.com/moderator/#16/e=2033e8 Note that I added a reminder on where to go for support questions. Of course, this won't prevent support questions. Heck, we get support questions on blog posts that have nothing to do with support. But I assume no support question will get enough votes to go reach a top 10 position. And if one did make it through, then it would probably be a real interesting one. In any case, I need some volunteers from the project to help me moderate this. Moderation is mainly two tasks: 1) Responding to items that are flagged by other users as inappropriate. and 2) Weeding out duplicate questions. (Google tries to identify duplicates and when it does the duplicate question is put in the moderation queue for us to allow or reject), Moderation should not be very time consuming, maybe 10 minutes/day . If you want to help, let me know your Google ID (usually your Gmail address). Send it to me off-list if you prefer. Regards, -Rob Regards, Andrea. Rob, Moderating that list will fit right in with my daily forum tasks, so you can count on me to help. My Google id is fjcc.apa...@gmail.com. Done. Thanks. I suggest adding to the text of the Call for Questions the information about duplicate questions being filtered and encouraging people to scan the list before trying to add to it. I've added that as well. Regards, -Rob Regards, Francis
[BUILD] New gmake branch
Andre, I have updated the gmake branch (branches/gbuild) and changed all the headers. A couple of quick fixes are added. At this point the branch is trunk + CWS patches. make -di takes me pretty far in, but I get: GNUmakefile:35: *** Corrupted module targetstack! . Stop also, there is a warning due to a hack in main/svx/AllLangResTarget_svx.mk (~108/135) Can you see if you can nudge this forward? Also, please teach us all to fish, so explain any fixes you make. Thanks, A.
Re: [UX] Desoign Exploration - Dockable Task Pane Content Design
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 9:28 PM, RGB ES rgb.m...@gmail.com wrote: 2012/11/15 Kevin Grignon kevingrignon...@gmail.com Hello All, I've been exploring the information design (content) for the dockable task pane. I've analyzed the current content in both LS and AOO, and captured some thoughts on future design direction. See: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_-_Information_Design Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki page. Thanks, Kevin Good ideas, indeed! Just a small point about the proposal: you are separating direct formatting (Content properties) from styles (Style list) which is a good idea, but we must keep in mind that there is no direct formatting for pages on Writer: the menu you get when you go to Format → Page does *not* do direct formatting, it just edit the current page style. IMO, the options are: - to not include page information on the content properties docker - to just show a static info panel giving the option to edit the corresponding page style or to apply one of the styles from a list. Maybe (thinking aloud in real time) instead of a page section it would be more interesting to show a breaks section, where you can insert and manage page breaks with change of page styles and reset of page numbering... or maybe put all this on its own panel. The possibility to edit the page style should be limited to the style list panel. Regards Ricardo Ricardo, Thanks for the input. I've posted your comments to the wiki discussion. I'll explore the page properties vs. style options. Regards, Kevin
Fw: QA Volunteer
Hi All, This is Manju from INDIA. Interested in QA, Automated Testing, Looking forward to join Apache team :-) Regards, Manju - Forwarded by Manju2 M/TVM/TCS on 11/16/2012 11:43 AM - From: Manju2 M/TVM/TCS To: q...@openoffice.apache.org. Date: 11/16/2012 11:35 AM Subject: QA Volunteer Hi All, This is Manju, QA tester from TCS. I am looking forward to hear more about Apache and would love to help in success of Apache OpenOffice 4.0. :-) Regards, Manju . =-=-= Notice: The information contained in this e-mail message and/or attachments to it may contain confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any dissemination, use, review, distribution, printing or copying of the information contained in this e-mail message and/or attachments to it are strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us by reply e-mail or telephone and immediately and permanently delete the message and any attachments. Thank you
Re: [UX] Desoign Exploration - Dockable Task Pane Content Design
On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 2:19 PM, Kevin Grignon kevingrignon...@gmail.comwrote: On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 9:28 PM, RGB ES rgb.m...@gmail.com wrote: 2012/11/15 Kevin Grignon kevingrignon...@gmail.com Hello All, I've been exploring the information design (content) for the dockable task pane. I've analyzed the current content in both LS and AOO, and captured some thoughts on future design direction. See: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Task_Pane_Content_-_Information_Design Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki page. Thanks, Kevin Good ideas, indeed! Just a small point about the proposal: you are separating direct formatting (Content properties) from styles (Style list) which is a good idea, but we must keep in mind that there is no direct formatting for pages on Writer: the menu you get when you go to Format → Page does *not* do direct formatting, it just edit the current page style. IMO, the options are: - to not include page information on the content properties docker - to just show a static info panel giving the option to edit the corresponding page style or to apply one of the styles from a list. Maybe (thinking aloud in real time) instead of a page section it would be more interesting to show a breaks section, where you can insert and manage page breaks with change of page styles and reset of page numbering... or maybe put all this on its own panel. The possibility to edit the page style should be limited to the style list panel. Regards Ricardo Ricardo, Thanks for the input. I've posted your comments to the wiki discussion. I'll explore the page properties vs. style options. Regards, Kevin Ricardo, While Lotus Symphony presents page properties in the contextual task pane, they are related to the 'Page Styles'. Evoking the 'More' option command in page properties section header evokes the Page Styles document. So, are the page properties actually stored as styles, or just called styles? I can't imaging someone looking to change the page styles to change the page orientation. Curious. Thoughts? Kevin
Re: buildbot success in ASF Buildbot on aoo-w7snap
On 13/11/2012 Andrew Rist wrote: That makes all flows 'green'. Including this new build that builds from the SNAPSHOT tag. Great news! Working buildbots are a prerequisite to proper QA. What changes need to be made to these install bits usable as our dev snapshot? Localization on non-Windows platforms (at least at langpacks). Building with --enable-copyleft (it seems these builds do not include copyleft components we ship in the binary builds). Regards, Andrea.
