[freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Friday 05 June 2009 07:54:08 Arne Babenhauserheide wrote: > On Thursday, 4. June 2009 20:02:13 Matthew Toseland wrote: > > > I vote for lighthouse. I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and > > > Lighthouse is better than all. It is simple, user friendly, doesn't > > > impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. > > > > How is it different to Mantis then? > > > > Anyone else have an opinion? > > Is it free? (I couldn't get that information from my first glance on the site) No. :| > > If it is unfree, it doesn't look suitable as bugtracker for a censorship free > network to me. > > Proprietary solutions allow censorship *by design*, because some specific > entity controls what the system does - no matter how benevolent that entity > might be at the moment. > > I already had that feeling about uservoice, but there I though "oh well, it's > not really integral for freenet". But the bugtracker is integral, and relying > on a proprietary solution for an integral part of freenet is dangerous. Ideologically I agree, however we do need something hosted (mantis is a major pain to keep up to date manually and is in php so has security issues), and practically speaking MANTIS works but it is probably not the most helpful in terms of getting useful work done. We could get free hosting for Trac, but it may be tricky to import bugs as Trac doesn't have support for dependancies between bugs - presumably a conversion script would just put them into the HTML/wiki markup for the bug... > > Best wishes, > Arne -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 835 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: <https://emu.freenetproject.org/pipermail/devl/attachments/20090605/47d1abd9/attachment.pgp>
[freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Friday 05 June 2009 00:59:09 Daniel Cheng wrote: > On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 2:02 AM, Matthew > Toseland wrote: > > On Thursday 04 June 2009 17:08:22 Ian Clarke wrote: > >> On Thu, Jun 4, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Matthew Toseland > >> wrote: > >> > What bug tracker should we use? Trac? Jira? Lighthouse? Something else? > >> > >> I vote for ?lighthouse. ?I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and > >> Lighthouse is better than all. ?It is simple, user friendly, doesn't > >> impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. > > > > How is it different to Mantis then? > > > > Anyone else have an opinion? > > > > Is there any chance of importing our existing bugs into Lighthouse? > >> > > Does lighthouse have "related bugs" or other duplicated bugs fields? Or freeform HTML into which these could be converted, as with Trac? > > [...] Other important features? -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 835 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: <https://emu.freenetproject.org/pipermail/devl/attachments/20090605/a7e6c7fe/attachment.pgp>
[freenet-dev] Build 1215, countdown to 0.7.5
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 7:01 PM, Matthew Toseland wrote: > Freenet 0.7 build 1215 is now available. Changes include: > - Hopefully fix a bug causing Freenet to not reconnect after losing the > internet connection and then it being restored. > - Various improvements to the web interface, including a Chat Forums toadlet > explaining where to get FMS and Frost, this goes away when Freetalk is loaded. > - Some client layer fixes including a bug causing some requests to stall at > 100%. > - Require the new fixed version of Freemail (which now has a proper version). > > We should release 0.7.5 soon. Developers, please refrain from committing new > features to master. Translators, we need updates for the new strings in 1215 > and for all of the untranslated strings in your various languages. Users > please test 1215! If there are any serious bugs in it we need to know. Anyone > who can run a seednode (you need a static IP address, port forwarded, and a > reasonable upstream) please turn on the seednode option in opennet config (in > advanced mode), and send me your opennet noderef (strangers page, advanced > mode). > > Nextgens has argued that we need to migrate to the new infrastructure before > releasing, so that we know it can stand a slashdotting. The essentials are: > - Move the downloads to google's file releases system. > - Move the static content on the website to a Google App Engine app. > - Move the SSL redirects to the same app, and update the update scripts. > - Think very seriously about moving the bug tracker. IMHO we need to keep the > existing data either by importing it or as a static pull (but only as a last > resort). And we need to decide what bug tracker to use. But it is not > *essential* to move the bug tracker before releasing. The main concern is > that we might have to buy hosting for mantis if importing the bugs to some > free bug tracker hosting is not possible. > > Nextgens has started work on the second item, I hope that these can be > completed soon. > > ___ > Devl mailing list > Devl at freenetproject.org > http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl > Might want to bump the build number =p -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (MingW32) Comment: Use GnuPG with Firefox : http://getfiregpg.org (Version: 0.7.5) iEYEARECAAYFAkopqFwACgkQ4esu1mlKOs/m9QCcD9kqbFIvlGjGIqsuSd20uVTy 284AnifFAutDH2l2llG9PWDSB9W0/HCe =VvtT -END PGP SIGNATURE-
[freenet-dev] Insert of demand application design
On Thursday 04 June 2009 17:09:51 sich wrote: > Matthew Toseland a ?crit : > > SSKs are 1KB and have rather high overheads. You need to insert a bunch of > > CHKs under the SSK, and to make that safe you need the CHK data to be > > encrypted. But also you need it for security, because *the SSK is > > predictable*! > > Hello, > > Can we have different CHK keys for the same file ? To avoid inserting > data if we know the keys before. It's for this that we have choose SSK > to generate a new keypair for each file. Not sure I follow. You can encrypt it differently and thus get a different CHK. > > Why SSK are predictable if you generate a new keypair for each chunk ? > And generating a new keypare if you reinsert some chunk who was already > inserted ? Ok, if you generate a new keypair it's not predictable. I'm assuming there is some level of redundancy - if the downloader can't get the chunk, he'll ask for it again? > > > SSKs are not practical IMHO, because they are tiny, and furthermore they > > are predictable and thus can be used by an attacker just like a full > > reinsert with the original key could be. > > CHK is more interesting if we can have keys that are not based on the > content like the actual CHK. Yes, you just have to encrypt the chunk before inserting it. > > > The CHKs under the SSK would be unique yes. And you'd have to store the > > chunk key somewhere. > > If I understand, you say that we need to encrypt the chunk with random > key (how ?), then insert the encrypted chunk as CHK and then publish the > key to decrypt the encrypted chunk ? > We need some native support to encrypt and decrypt file easly... Any idea ? Hmmm, I guess. We do have the classes for encryption in the source code - PCFBMode and Rijndael. Isn't this going to be a plugin? > > Thanks :) > > sich On Thursday 04 June 2009 17:17:37 sich wrote: > Matthew Toseland a ?crit : > > You should seriously consider working with infinity0, his searching plugin > > will provide distributed indexing. > > good neews :) :) > > > Why are you splitting the files up? Are you assuming that the key changes > > every time for security? If you are using CHKs you can simply reinsert the > > original file - we can provide an FCP option to only reinsert some blocks, > > this is not a big problem. The advantage is that if the data has been > > inserted, you can just download it, using the normal CHK key, and if it > > hasn't, and people start reinserting it, you will be able to pick up those > > blocks. The disadvantage is security: anyone who inserts predictable keys > > is vulnerable to attack. However, to avoid such vulnerability, you need to > > *encrypt the inserted data differently each time*! I am assuming you are > > using chunks consisting of many CHKs, maybe 1MB, with an SSK pointing to > > them? In which case the chunk will need to be encrypted before being > > inserted. > > I have answer on my other email. To have different keys. But using > random encryption with CHK is best yes. > > > They only publish the SSK after they have finished inserting the chunk? Ok. > > yep, we waiting that the insert is finish before we publish the key. Well, the attacker gets a data point for each time you announce the key. If you announce one chunk at a time, then he gets data points depending on how big the chunks are. > > > These are advantages of selective reinsertion, which can be implemented > > over FCP with normal keys. > > The best thing is to do this through the node with FCP... But at this > time I don't think that is possible no ? It might be possible to do FCP support for differently encrypted CHKs, if there is demand for it. > > sich -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 835 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: <https://emu.freenetproject.org/pipermail/devl/attachments/20090605/b9358370/attachment.pgp>
[freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 6:10 PM, Matthew Toseland wrote: > Why is Lighthouse better than Mantis or Trac, both of which we could get from > sourceforge? Mantis has the clear advantage that we know it. If Lighthouse > does exactly the same as Mantis and is slightly prettier, for example, there > is little point in changing. On the other hand, if it is significantly easier > for users to report bugs, that would be a good reason to consider it, > provided that we can migrate our existing bugs (which I see no evidence of so > far), and provided that it provides comparable features. I would say that Lighthouse will make it more likely that users will report bugs. It has an open friendly feel that, frankly, Mantis doesn't. But you should play with it yourself and form your own opinion. Ian. -- Ian Clarke CEO, Uprizer Labs Email: ian at uprizer.com Ph: +1 512 422 3588 Fax: +1 512 276 6674
[freenet-dev] Freenet doesn't work with java 1.6.0.14??? was Fwd: Re: [freenet-support] freenet
On Thursday 04 June 2009 22:33:40 Evan Daniel wrote: > On Thu, Jun 4, 2009 at 3:35 PM, Matthew Toseland > wrote: > > > > > > > > -- Forwarded message -- > > From:?Philip Bych > > To:?Matthew Toseland > > Date:?Thu, 4 Jun 2009 19:46:46 +0100 > > Subject:?Re: [freenet-support] freenet > > thanks but i have sorted the problem > > it was the java update > > ?i updated java runtime? to the latest 1.6.0.14 and it seems that freenet > > does not work with this so i have reinstalled java 1.6.0.13 and uninstalled > > then reinstalled freenet > > all works fine as long as i do not update java runtime. > > cheers > > > > 2009/6/4 Matthew Toseland > >> > >> On Tuesday 02 June 2009 20:54:09 goat wrote: > >> > updated java to 1.6.0.14 and updated freenet now nothing works keep > >> > getting no start up script have disabled norton and use a different > >> > browser and all other security still no joy > >> > what other options ?are there > >> > >> Hi. To help us solve this problem, please: > >> - Find the directory Freenet is installed in, find a file called > >> "wrapper.log", and send me it. > >> - Open a terminal (run cmd.exe), cd to where Freenet is installed, type > >> start.exe (or start.cmd if you have an old installation). What happens? > >> Send any output. > > Works for me (TM). > > On Debian, using Sun Java (package sun-java6-jdk, etc). I just > installed the version out of unstable. > $ java -version > java version "1.6.0_14" > Java(TM) SE Runtime Environment (build 1.6.0_14-b08) > Java HotSpot(TM) Server VM (build 14.0-b16, mixed mode) > > Freenet seems to be functioning normally. > > Evan Daniel Could it be an install path problem, something specific to Windows maybe? -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 835 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: <https://emu.freenetproject.org/pipermail/devl/attachments/20090605/95e61766/attachment.pgp>
[freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 1:54 AM, Arne Babenhauserheide wrote: > On Thursday, 4. June 2009 20:02:13 Matthew Toseland wrote: >> > I vote for ?lighthouse. ?I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and >> > Lighthouse is better than all. ?It is simple, user friendly, doesn't >> > impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. >> >> How is it different to Mantis then? >> >> Anyone else have an opinion? > > Is it free? (I couldn't get that information from my first glance on the site) It is free as in beer for open source projects, so yes. > Proprietary solutions allow censorship *by design*, because some specific > entity controls what the system does - no matter how benevolent that entity > might be at the moment. Its only a bugtracker. If they were to suddenly go evil (which they have no incentive to do) then it would be an annoyance, but not a disaster - we'd just move elsewhere. > I already had that feeling about uservoice, but there I though "oh well, it's > not really integral for freenet". But the bugtracker is integral, and relying > on a proprietary solution for an integral part of freenet is dangerous. Not if: 1) they have no incentive to hurt us, quite the opposite, we'd bring positive attention to them 2) they only have our bugs, even in the worst case the worse thing they could do is inconvenience us The reality is that we need to outsource this stuff, we've tried hosting our own tools and it soaked up a large amount of time, left us extremely dependent on Nextgens (who no-longer wants this role), and cost quite a bit of $$$. All of these things are dangerous and bad for the project in very measurable ways. Much better to let our tools be managed by people exclusively focused on the task, especially when its free (as Lighthouse is). Ian. -- Ian Clarke CEO, Uprizer Labs Email: ian at uprizer.com Ph: +1 512 422 3588 Fax: +1 512 276 6674
[freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 2:59 PM, Matthew Toseland wrote: > On Friday 05 June 2009 07:54:08 Arne Babenhauserheide wrote: >> On Thursday, 4. June 2009 20:02:13 Matthew Toseland wrote: >> > > I vote for ?lighthouse. ?I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and >> > > Lighthouse is better than all. ?It is simple, user friendly, doesn't >> > > impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. >> > >> > How is it different to Mantis then? >> > >> > Anyone else have an opinion? >> >> Is it free? (I couldn't get that information from my first glance on the >> site) > > No. :| Yes it is, its free for open source projects, see http://sera.lighthouseapp.com/plans Ian. -- Ian Clarke CEO, Uprizer Labs Email: ian at uprizer.com Ph: +1 512 422 3588 Fax: +1 512 276 6674
[freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Thu, Jun 4, 2009 at 1:02 PM, Matthew Toseland wrote: > On Thursday 04 June 2009 17:08:22 Ian Clarke wrote: >> On Thu, Jun 4, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Matthew Toseland >> wrote: >> > What bug tracker should we use? Trac? Jira? Lighthouse? Something else? >> >> I vote for ?lighthouse. ?I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and >> Lighthouse is better than all. ?It is simple, user friendly, doesn't >> impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. > > How is it different to Mantis then? The most obvious thing is a much nicer UI. You can tag bugs to categorize them, and it makes it easy to specify relationships between bugs - you just mention them, like "Depends on #234" - it will create a by-directional link. > Is there any chance of importing our existing bugs into Lighthouse? It has an API, and there is a conduit for Trac, but none for Mantis that I'm aware of, so we'd probably need to hack together a script. Ian. -- Ian Clarke CEO, Uprizer Labs Email: ian at uprizer.com Ph: +1 512 422 3588 Fax: +1 512 276 6674
[freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Thursday, 4. June 2009 20:02:13 Matthew Toseland wrote: > > I vote for lighthouse. I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and > > Lighthouse is better than all. It is simple, user friendly, doesn't > > impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. > > How is it different to Mantis then? > > Anyone else have an opinion? Is it free? (I couldn't get that information from my first glance on the site) If it is unfree, it doesn't look suitable as bugtracker for a censorship free network to me. Proprietary solutions allow censorship *by design*, because some specific entity controls what the system does - no matter how benevolent that entity might be at the moment. I already had that feeling about uservoice, but there I though "oh well, it's not really integral for freenet". But the bugtracker is integral, and relying on a proprietary solution for an integral part of freenet is dangerous. Best wishes, Arne --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- - singing a part of the history of free software - http://infinite-hands.draketo.de -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 198 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: <https://emu.freenetproject.org/pipermail/devl/attachments/20090605/18e45768/attachment.pgp>
[freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 2:02 AM, Matthew Toseland wrote: > On Thursday 04 June 2009 17:08:22 Ian Clarke wrote: >> On Thu, Jun 4, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Matthew Toseland >> wrote: >> > What bug tracker should we use? Trac? Jira? Lighthouse? Something else? >> >> I vote for ?lighthouse. ?I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and >> Lighthouse is better than all. ?It is simple, user friendly, doesn't >> impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. > > How is it different to Mantis then? > > Anyone else have an opinion? > > Is there any chance of importing our existing bugs into Lighthouse? >> Does lighthouse have "related bugs" or other duplicated bugs fields? [...]
Re: [freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Thursday, 4. June 2009 20:02:13 Matthew Toseland wrote: I vote for lighthouse. I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and Lighthouse is better than all. It is simple, user friendly, doesn't impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. How is it different to Mantis then? Anyone else have an opinion? Is it free? (I couldn't get that information from my first glance on the site) If it is unfree, it doesn't look suitable as bugtracker for a censorship free network to me. Proprietary solutions allow censorship *by design*, because some specific entity controls what the system does - no matter how benevolent that entity might be at the moment. I already had that feeling about uservoice, but there I though oh well, it's not really integral for freenet. But the bugtracker is integral, and relying on a proprietary solution for an integral part of freenet is dangerous. Best wishes, Arne --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- - singing a part of the history of free software - http://infinite-hands.draketo.de signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Freenet doesn't work with java 1.6.0.14??? was Fwd: Re: [freenet-support] freenet
On Thursday 04 June 2009 22:33:40 Evan Daniel wrote: On Thu, Jun 4, 2009 at 3:35 PM, Matthew Toseland t...@amphibian.dyndns.org wrote: -- Forwarded message -- From: Philip Bych pot...@googlemail.com To: Matthew Toseland t...@amphibian.dyndns.org Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 19:46:46 +0100 Subject: Re: [freenet-support] freenet thanks but i have sorted the problem it was the java update i updated java runtime to the latest 1.6.0.14 and it seems that freenet does not work with this so i have reinstalled java 1.6.0.13 and uninstalled then reinstalled freenet all works fine as long as i do not update java runtime. cheers 2009/6/4 Matthew Toseland t...@amphibian.dyndns.org On Tuesday 02 June 2009 20:54:09 goat wrote: updated java to 1.6.0.14 and updated freenet now nothing works keep getting no start up script have disabled norton and use a different browser and all other security still no joy what other options are there Hi. To help us solve this problem, please: - Find the directory Freenet is installed in, find a file called wrapper.log, and send me it. - Open a terminal (run cmd.exe), cd to where Freenet is installed, type start.exe (or start.cmd if you have an old installation). What happens? Send any output. Works for me (TM). On Debian, using Sun Java (package sun-java6-jdk, etc). I just installed the version out of unstable. $ java -version java version 1.6.0_14 Java(TM) SE Runtime Environment (build 1.6.0_14-b08) Java HotSpot(TM) Server VM (build 14.0-b16, mixed mode) Freenet seems to be functioning normally. Evan Daniel Could it be an install path problem, something specific to Windows maybe? signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Insert of demand application design
On Thursday 04 June 2009 17:09:51 sich wrote: Matthew Toseland a écrit : SSKs are 1KB and have rather high overheads. You need to insert a bunch of CHKs under the SSK, and to make that safe you need the CHK data to be encrypted. But also you need it for security, because *the SSK is predictable*! Hello, Can we have different CHK keys for the same file ? To avoid inserting data if we know the keys before. It's for this that we have choose SSK to generate a new keypair for each file. Not sure I follow. You can encrypt it differently and thus get a different CHK. Why SSK are predictable if you generate a new keypair for each chunk ? And generating a new keypare if you reinsert some chunk who was already inserted ? Ok, if you generate a new keypair it's not predictable. I'm assuming there is some level of redundancy - if the downloader can't get the chunk, he'll ask for it again? SSKs are not practical IMHO, because they are tiny, and furthermore they are predictable and thus can be used by an attacker just like a full reinsert with the original key could be. CHK is more interesting if we can have keys that are not based on the content like the actual CHK. Yes, you just have to encrypt the chunk before inserting it. The CHKs under the SSK would be unique yes. And you'd have to store the chunk key somewhere. If I understand, you say that we need to encrypt the chunk with random key (how ?), then insert the encrypted chunk as CHK and then publish the key to decrypt the encrypted chunk ? We need some native support to encrypt and decrypt file easly... Any idea ? Hmmm, I guess. We do have the classes for encryption in the source code - PCFBMode and Rijndael. Isn't this going to be a plugin? Thanks :) sich On Thursday 04 June 2009 17:17:37 sich wrote: Matthew Toseland a écrit : You should seriously consider working with infinity0, his searching plugin will provide distributed indexing. good neews :) :) Why are you splitting the files up? Are you assuming that the key changes every time for security? If you are using CHKs you can simply reinsert the original file - we can provide an FCP option to only reinsert some blocks, this is not a big problem. The advantage is that if the data has been inserted, you can just download it, using the normal CHK key, and if it hasn't, and people start reinserting it, you will be able to pick up those blocks. The disadvantage is security: anyone who inserts predictable keys is vulnerable to attack. However, to avoid such vulnerability, you need to *encrypt the inserted data differently each time*! I am assuming you are using chunks consisting of many CHKs, maybe 1MB, with an SSK pointing to them? In which case the chunk will need to be encrypted before being inserted. I have answer on my other email. To have different keys. But using random encryption with CHK is best yes. They only publish the SSK after they have finished inserting the chunk? Ok. yep, we waiting that the insert is finish before we publish the key. Well, the attacker gets a data point for each time you announce the key. If you announce one chunk at a time, then he gets data points depending on how big the chunks are. These are advantages of selective reinsertion, which can be implemented over FCP with normal keys. The best thing is to do this through the node with FCP... But at this time I don't think that is possible no ? It might be possible to do FCP support for differently encrypted CHKs, if there is demand for it. sich signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Friday 05 June 2009 00:59:09 Daniel Cheng wrote: On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 2:02 AM, Matthew Toselandt...@amphibian.dyndns.org wrote: On Thursday 04 June 2009 17:08:22 Ian Clarke wrote: On Thu, Jun 4, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Matthew Toseland t...@amphibian.dyndns.org wrote: What bug tracker should we use? Trac? Jira? Lighthouse? Something else? I vote for lighthouse. I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and Lighthouse is better than all. It is simple, user friendly, doesn't impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. How is it different to Mantis then? Anyone else have an opinion? Is there any chance of importing our existing bugs into Lighthouse? Does lighthouse have related bugs or other duplicated bugs fields? Or freeform HTML into which these could be converted, as with Trac? [...] Other important features? signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Friday 05 June 2009 07:54:08 Arne Babenhauserheide wrote: On Thursday, 4. June 2009 20:02:13 Matthew Toseland wrote: I vote for lighthouse. I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and Lighthouse is better than all. It is simple, user friendly, doesn't impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. How is it different to Mantis then? Anyone else have an opinion? Is it free? (I couldn't get that information from my first glance on the site) No. :| If it is unfree, it doesn't look suitable as bugtracker for a censorship free network to me. Proprietary solutions allow censorship *by design*, because some specific entity controls what the system does - no matter how benevolent that entity might be at the moment. I already had that feeling about uservoice, but there I though oh well, it's not really integral for freenet. But the bugtracker is integral, and relying on a proprietary solution for an integral part of freenet is dangerous. Ideologically I agree, however we do need something hosted (mantis is a major pain to keep up to date manually and is in php so has security issues), and practically speaking MANTIS works but it is probably not the most helpful in terms of getting useful work done. We could get free hosting for Trac, but it may be tricky to import bugs as Trac doesn't have support for dependancies between bugs - presumably a conversion script would just put them into the HTML/wiki markup for the bug... Best wishes, Arne signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Thu, Jun 4, 2009 at 1:02 PM, Matthew Toselandt...@amphibian.dyndns.org wrote: On Thursday 04 June 2009 17:08:22 Ian Clarke wrote: On Thu, Jun 4, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Matthew Toseland t...@amphibian.dyndns.org wrote: What bug tracker should we use? Trac? Jira? Lighthouse? Something else? I vote for lighthouse. I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and Lighthouse is better than all. It is simple, user friendly, doesn't impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. How is it different to Mantis then? The most obvious thing is a much nicer UI. You can tag bugs to categorize them, and it makes it easy to specify relationships between bugs - you just mention them, like Depends on #234 - it will create a by-directional link. Is there any chance of importing our existing bugs into Lighthouse? It has an API, and there is a conduit for Trac, but none for Mantis that I'm aware of, so we'd probably need to hack together a script. Ian. -- Ian Clarke CEO, Uprizer Labs Email: i...@uprizer.com Ph: +1 512 422 3588 Fax: +1 512 276 6674 ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 2:59 PM, Matthew Toselandt...@amphibian.dyndns.org wrote: On Friday 05 June 2009 07:54:08 Arne Babenhauserheide wrote: On Thursday, 4. June 2009 20:02:13 Matthew Toseland wrote: I vote for lighthouse. I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and Lighthouse is better than all. It is simple, user friendly, doesn't impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. How is it different to Mantis then? Anyone else have an opinion? Is it free? (I couldn't get that information from my first glance on the site) No. :| Yes it is, its free for open source projects, see http://sera.lighthouseapp.com/plans Ian. -- Ian Clarke CEO, Uprizer Labs Email: i...@uprizer.com Ph: +1 512 422 3588 Fax: +1 512 276 6674 ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 1:54 AM, Arne Babenhauserheidearne_...@web.de wrote: On Thursday, 4. June 2009 20:02:13 Matthew Toseland wrote: I vote for lighthouse. I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and Lighthouse is better than all. It is simple, user friendly, doesn't impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. How is it different to Mantis then? Anyone else have an opinion? Is it free? (I couldn't get that information from my first glance on the site) It is free as in beer for open source projects, so yes. Proprietary solutions allow censorship *by design*, because some specific entity controls what the system does - no matter how benevolent that entity might be at the moment. Its only a bugtracker. If they were to suddenly go evil (which they have no incentive to do) then it would be an annoyance, but not a disaster - we'd just move elsewhere. I already had that feeling about uservoice, but there I though oh well, it's not really integral for freenet. But the bugtracker is integral, and relying on a proprietary solution for an integral part of freenet is dangerous. Not if: 1) they have no incentive to hurt us, quite the opposite, we'd bring positive attention to them 2) they only have our bugs, even in the worst case the worse thing they could do is inconvenience us The reality is that we need to outsource this stuff, we've tried hosting our own tools and it soaked up a large amount of time, left us extremely dependent on Nextgens (who no-longer wants this role), and cost quite a bit of $$$. All of these things are dangerous and bad for the project in very measurable ways. Much better to let our tools be managed by people exclusively focused on the task, especially when its free (as Lighthouse is). Ian. -- Ian Clarke CEO, Uprizer Labs Email: i...@uprizer.com Ph: +1 512 422 3588 Fax: +1 512 276 6674 ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
[freenet-dev] Build 1215, countdown to 0.7.5
Freenet 0.7 build 1215 is now available. Changes include: - Hopefully fix a bug causing Freenet to not reconnect after losing the internet connection and then it being restored. - Various improvements to the web interface, including a Chat Forums toadlet explaining where to get FMS and Frost, this goes away when Freetalk is loaded. - Some client layer fixes including a bug causing some requests to stall at 100%. - Require the new fixed version of Freemail (which now has a proper version). We should release 0.7.5 soon. Developers, please refrain from committing new features to master. Translators, we need updates for the new strings in 1215 and for all of the untranslated strings in your various languages. Users please test 1215! If there are any serious bugs in it we need to know. Anyone who can run a seednode (you need a static IP address, port forwarded, and a reasonable upstream) please turn on the seednode option in opennet config (in advanced mode), and send me your opennet noderef (strangers page, advanced mode). Nextgens has argued that we need to migrate to the new infrastructure before releasing, so that we know it can stand a slashdotting. The essentials are: - Move the downloads to google's file releases system. - Move the static content on the website to a Google App Engine app. - Move the SSL redirects to the same app, and update the update scripts. - Think very seriously about moving the bug tracker. IMHO we need to keep the existing data either by importing it or as a static pull (but only as a last resort). And we need to decide what bug tracker to use. But it is not *essential* to move the bug tracker before releasing. The main concern is that we might have to buy hosting for mantis if importing the bugs to some free bug tracker hosting is not possible. Nextgens has started work on the second item, I hope that these can be completed soon. signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Friday 05 June 2009 23:43:12 Ian Clarke wrote: On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 2:59 PM, Matthew Toselandt...@amphibian.dyndns.org wrote: On Friday 05 June 2009 07:54:08 Arne Babenhauserheide wrote: On Thursday, 4. June 2009 20:02:13 Matthew Toseland wrote: I vote for lighthouse. I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and Lighthouse is better than all. It is simple, user friendly, doesn't impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. How is it different to Mantis then? Anyone else have an opinion? Is it free? (I couldn't get that information from my first glance on the site) No. :| Yes it is, its free for open source projects, see http://sera.lighthouseapp.com/plans That is definitely not what he meant! If it is unfree, it doesn't look suitable as bugtracker for a censorship free network to me. Proprietary solutions allow censorship *by design*, because some specific entity controls what the system does - no matter how benevolent that entity might be at the moment. I already had that feeling about uservoice, but there I though oh well, it's not really integral for freenet. But the bugtracker is integral, and relying on a proprietary solution for an integral part of freenet is dangerous. signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Friday 05 June 2009 23:49:42 Ian Clarke wrote: On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 1:54 AM, Arne Babenhauserheidearne_...@web.de wrote: On Thursday, 4. June 2009 20:02:13 Matthew Toseland wrote: I vote for lighthouse. I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and Lighthouse is better than all. It is simple, user friendly, doesn't impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. How is it different to Mantis then? Anyone else have an opinion? Is it free? (I couldn't get that information from my first glance on the site) It is free as in beer for open source projects, so yes. Proprietary solutions allow censorship *by design*, because some specific entity controls what the system does - no matter how benevolent that entity might be at the moment. Its only a bugtracker. If they were to suddenly go evil (which they have no incentive to do) then it would be an annoyance, but not a disaster - we'd just move elsewhere. It would be a MAJOR annoyance, but yes it would probably be possible with, hopefully, a few hours to a few days work, to convert backed up bugs to another bug tracker. I already had that feeling about uservoice, but there I though oh well, it's not really integral for freenet. But the bugtracker is integral, and relying on a proprietary solution for an integral part of freenet is dangerous. Not if: 1) they have no incentive to hurt us, quite the opposite, we'd bring positive attention to them 2) they only have our bugs, even in the worst case the worse thing they could do is inconvenience us The reality is that we need to outsource this stuff, we've tried hosting our own tools and it soaked up a large amount of time, left us extremely dependent on Nextgens (who no-longer wants this role), and cost quite a bit of $$$. All of these things are dangerous and bad for the project in very measurable ways. Much better to let our tools be managed by people exclusively focused on the task, especially when its free (as Lighthouse is). Well, there are other options. Sourceforge and others run free Trac instances, for example. And migrating our existing bugs to them will be no more difficult than migrating them to Lighthouse in all likelihood: It will be a major PITA in any case IMHO, but it's that or run it on shared hosting, probably having to keep it up to date ourselves, although with luck we might be able to migrate it to a managed mantis on e.g. godaddy. Why is Lighthouse better than Mantis or Trac, both of which we could get from sourceforge? Mantis has the clear advantage that we know it. If Lighthouse does exactly the same as Mantis and is slightly prettier, for example, there is little point in changing. On the other hand, if it is significantly easier for users to report bugs, that would be a good reason to consider it, provided that we can migrate our existing bugs (which I see no evidence of so far), and provided that it provides comparable features. signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Freenet doesn't work with java 1.6.0.14??? was Fwd: Re: [freenet-support] freenet
Matthew Toseland skrev: Could it be an install path problem, something specific to Windows maybe? He said: and updated freenet now nothing works keep getting no start up script. Does he mean updating using update.cmd? And what is this getting no start up script? Perhaps an error message by the launcher? It would really help if he pasted the exact error message... - Zero3 ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 6:10 PM, Matthew Toselandt...@amphibian.dyndns.org wrote: Why is Lighthouse better than Mantis or Trac, both of which we could get from sourceforge? Mantis has the clear advantage that we know it. If Lighthouse does exactly the same as Mantis and is slightly prettier, for example, there is little point in changing. On the other hand, if it is significantly easier for users to report bugs, that would be a good reason to consider it, provided that we can migrate our existing bugs (which I see no evidence of so far), and provided that it provides comparable features. I would say that Lighthouse will make it more likely that users will report bugs. It has an open friendly feel that, frankly, Mantis doesn't. But you should play with it yourself and form your own opinion. Ian. -- Ian Clarke CEO, Uprizer Labs Email: i...@uprizer.com Ph: +1 512 422 3588 Fax: +1 512 276 6674 ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Build 1215, countdown to 0.7.5
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 7:01 PM, Matthew Toseland wrote: Freenet 0.7 build 1215 is now available. Changes include: - Hopefully fix a bug causing Freenet to not reconnect after losing the internet connection and then it being restored. - Various improvements to the web interface, including a Chat Forums toadlet explaining where to get FMS and Frost, this goes away when Freetalk is loaded. - Some client layer fixes including a bug causing some requests to stall at 100%. - Require the new fixed version of Freemail (which now has a proper version). We should release 0.7.5 soon. Developers, please refrain from committing new features to master. Translators, we need updates for the new strings in 1215 and for all of the untranslated strings in your various languages. Users please test 1215! If there are any serious bugs in it we need to know. Anyone who can run a seednode (you need a static IP address, port forwarded, and a reasonable upstream) please turn on the seednode option in opennet config (in advanced mode), and send me your opennet noderef (strangers page, advanced mode). Nextgens has argued that we need to migrate to the new infrastructure before releasing, so that we know it can stand a slashdotting. The essentials are: - Move the downloads to google's file releases system. - Move the static content on the website to a Google App Engine app. - Move the SSL redirects to the same app, and update the update scripts. - Think very seriously about moving the bug tracker. IMHO we need to keep the existing data either by importing it or as a static pull (but only as a last resort). And we need to decide what bug tracker to use. But it is not *essential* to move the bug tracker before releasing. The main concern is that we might have to buy hosting for mantis if importing the bugs to some free bug tracker hosting is not possible. Nextgens has started work on the second item, I hope that these can be completed soon. ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl Might want to bump the build number =p -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (MingW32) Comment: Use GnuPG with Firefox : http://getfiregpg.org (Version: 0.7.5) iEYEARECAAYFAkopqFwACgkQ4esu1mlKOs/m9QCcD9kqbFIvlGjGIqsuSd20uVTy 284AnifFAutDH2l2llG9PWDSB9W0/HCe =VvtT -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
[freenet-dev] Windows installer translations welcome
Matthew Toseland skrev: Translators, we need updates for the new strings in 1215 and for all of the untranslated strings in your various languages. Ditto for the Windows Installer! Strings should be more or less frozen by now. Everyone is welcome to translate or proofread the existing translations. For new translations see: http://github.com/freenet/wininstaller-staging/tree/master/src_translationhelper/Include_Lang_Template.inc For existing translations see the files in: http://github.com/freenet/wininstaller-staging/tree/master/src_translationhelper/ Feel free to post questions here to the list or mail me directly. - Zero3 ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Build 1215, countdown to 0.7.5
On Saturday 06 June 2009 00:01:01 Matthew Toseland wrote: Freenet 0.7 build 1215 is now available. Changes include: - Hopefully fix a bug causing Freenet to not reconnect after losing the internet connection and then it being restored. - Various improvements to the web interface, including a Chat Forums toadlet explaining where to get FMS and Frost, this goes away when Freetalk is loaded. - Some client layer fixes including a bug causing some requests to stall at 100%. - Require the new fixed version of Freemail (which now has a proper version). We should release 0.7.5 soon. Developers, please refrain from committing new features to master. Translators, we need updates for the new strings in 1215 and for all of the untranslated strings in your various languages. Users please test 1215! If there are any serious bugs in it we need to know. Anyone who can run a seednode (you need a static IP address, port forwarded, and a reasonable upstream) please turn on the seednode option in opennet config (in advanced mode), and send me your opennet noderef (strangers page, advanced mode). Nextgens has argued that we need to migrate to the new infrastructure before releasing, so that we know it can stand a slashdotting. The essentials are: - Move the downloads to google's file releases system. - Move the static content on the website to a Google App Engine app. - Move the SSL redirects to the same app, and update the update scripts. - Think very seriously about moving the bug tracker. IMHO we need to keep the existing data either by importing it or as a static pull (but only as a last resort). And we need to decide what bug tracker to use. But it is not *essential* to move the bug tracker before releasing. The main concern is that we might have to buy hosting for mantis if importing the bugs to some free bug tracker hosting is not possible. Nextgens has started work on the second item, I hope that these can be completed soon. One more thing: If somebody could insert a new XMLLibrarian index, that would be great. The current one has some problems. You should try to stay anonymous if possible. I realise that it may not be possible in a week... signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Freenet doesn't work with java 1.6.0.14??? was Fwd: Re: [freenet-support] freenet
On Sat, Jun 6, 2009 at 7:18 AM, Zero3ze...@zerosplayground.dk wrote: Matthew Toseland skrev: Could it be an install path problem, something specific to Windows maybe? He said: and updated freenet now nothing works keep getting no start up script. Does he mean updating using update.cmd? And what is this getting no start up script? Perhaps an error message by the launcher? It would really help if he pasted the exact error message... ./update.sh does not run `./run.sh start` recently.. I don't know who changed it, or is it just me. ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
Re: [freenet-dev] Trying to move forward on getting rid of emu
On Sat, Jun 6, 2009 at 6:41 AM, Ian Clarkei...@locut.us wrote: On Thu, Jun 4, 2009 at 1:02 PM, Matthew Toselandt...@amphibian.dyndns.org wrote: On Thursday 04 June 2009 17:08:22 Ian Clarke wrote: On Thu, Jun 4, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Matthew Toseland t...@amphibian.dyndns.org wrote: What bug tracker should we use? Trac? Jira? Lighthouse? Something else? I vote for lighthouse. I've used Mantis, Trac, and Fogbugz, and Lighthouse is better than all. It is simple, user friendly, doesn't impose any particular way of working, and it has a flexible API. How is it different to Mantis then? The most obvious thing is a much nicer UI. You can tag bugs to categorize them, and it makes it easy to specify relationships between bugs - you just mention them, like Depends on #234 - it will create a by-directional link. Sorry, not mantis got tags too. -- just nobody but me is using it. Is there any chance of importing our existing bugs into Lighthouse? It has an API, and there is a conduit for Trac, but none for Mantis that I'm aware of, so we'd probably need to hack together a script. There is a SOAP api. Ian. -- Ian Clarke CEO, Uprizer Labs Email: i...@uprizer.com Ph: +1 512 422 3588 Fax: +1 512 276 6674 ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl ___ Devl mailing list Devl@freenetproject.org http://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
