Re: D for the Win
On Wednesday, 20 August 2014 at 21:43:26 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 8/20/2014 2:33 PM, anonymous wrote: Dlang Dlang Über Alles as a German, O_O I'm not surprised that the German programming community has taken to D. After all, German cars all have those D stickers on them :-) French must be such great fans of functional programming, on the other hand. F# anyone?
Re: D 2.066 is out. Enjoy!
On Thursday, 21 August 2014 at 01:30:52 UTC, ketmar via Digitalmars-d-announce wrote: On Wed, 20 Aug 2014 10:18:09 -0700 Andrei Alexandrescu via Digitalmars-d-announce digitalmars-d-announce@puremagic.com wrote: What is it that we could help with? -- Andrei he's drama queen, he doesn't need any help, only attention. Just let's try to be less harsher. Even if that's true, being harsh would be of no good for that person and for us neither.
Re: D for the Win
On Wednesday, 20 August 2014 at 22:02:31 UTC, anonymous wrote: On Wednesday, 20 August 2014 at 21:43:26 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 8/20/2014 2:33 PM, anonymous wrote: Dlang Dlang Über Alles as a German, O_O I'm not surprised that the German programming community has taken to D. After all, German cars all have those D stickers on them :-) No, no, Dlang Dlang Über Alles is a take on Deutschland Deutschland über alles (Germany Germany over everything), the first verse of the national anthem as sung in Nazi times. While I agree with the historical significance, there are some things to be straighten: 1) the song was used even before: it was the national anthem of the Weimar republic, the one that Nazi toppled 2) today, it's third stanza (the first one begins with DDuA) is still the official anthem of Deutschland 3) there is no official interdiction of the first two stanzas, except that they are not really protected by the German law punishing offenses to the national symbols of Germany
Re: D 2.066 is out. Enjoy!
On 20/08/14 18:57, Brad Anderson wrote: Anything specific you have problems with? Syntax changes aren't all that common these days Support for C++ namespaces where just released and support for C++ templates will most likely end up in master soon. -- /Jacob Carlborg
Re: D for the Win
On 8/20/2014 5:39 PM, Peter Alexander wrote: Ha, that opDollar thing in the HTML generator is the nastiest D hack I've seen :-P Yea, this *statement* really made me go o_O link[$.rel = foobar, $.type = text/css]; That's a lot of syntax abuse there! Still, if it works for him, great, who am I to complain? At the end of the day, it's just a tool.
Re: D for the Win
On 8/20/2014 6:57 PM, Paulo Pinto wrote: Am 21.08.2014 00:02, schrieb anonymous: No, no, Dlang Dlang Über Alles is a take on Deutschland Deutschland über alles (Germany Germany over everything), the first verse of the national anthem as sung in Nazi times. I was actually worried if the author is German. He's not, thankfully. He's from Israel. From a German author that would be an embracement of fascism. Coming from an Israeli, I don't really know where to put it, probably completely benign. As a Portuguese living in Germany, I would say not everyone knows that outside Germany. Specially the younger generations, they just use it because it sounds cool. Über Alles always just makes me think of Hanzel und Gretyl: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%9Cber_Alles_%28album%29 Gotta love tongue-in-cheek psuedo-German metal ;)
Re: D for the Win
On Thu, 21 Aug 2014 04:31:31 -0400 Nick Sabalausky via Digitalmars-d-announce digitalmars-d-announce@puremagic.com wrote: Yea, this *statement* really made me go o_O link[$.rel = foobar, $.type = text/css]; That's a lot of syntax abuse there! but it's fun! we all used to think that $ should mean 'length' and he has no such mind frames. i like it. ;-) signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: D for the Win
On Thursday, 21 August 2014 at 08:31:49 UTC, Nick Sabalausky wrote: link[$.rel = foobar, $.type = text/css]; That's a lot of syntax abuse there! Still, if it works for him, great, who am I to complain? At the end of the day, it's just a tool. Now the comma-operator has to stay because removing it is a severe breaking change.
Re: D for the Win
On Thu, 21 Aug 2014 08:37:30 + Ola Fosheim Gr via Digitalmars-d-announce digitalmars-d-announce@puremagic.com wrote: Now the comma-operator has to stay because removing it is a severe breaking change. but we can abuse opIndex and/or opSlice too! ;-) signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: D for the Win
On 21/08/14 10:37, Ola Fosheim Gr wrote: Now the comma-operator has to stay because removing it is a severe breaking change. Isn't that multiple arguments to opIndex? -- /Jacob Carlborg
Re: D for the Win
What is really awesome about this is that his code actually worked, the mixing of operator overloads, opDispatch and rarely used features(e.g. comma op). D has come a long way in the last decade. On Thu, Aug 21, 2014 at 10:40 AM, ketmar via Digitalmars-d-announce digitalmars-d-announce@puremagic.com wrote: On Thu, 21 Aug 2014 08:37:30 + Ola Fosheim Gr via Digitalmars-d-announce digitalmars-d-announce@puremagic.com wrote: Now the comma-operator has to stay because removing it is a severe breaking change. but we can abuse opIndex and/or opSlice too! ;-)
Re: D for the Win
On Thu, Aug 21, 2014 at 10:47 AM, Jacob Carlborg via Digitalmars-d-announce digitalmars-d-announce@puremagic.com wrote: On 21/08/14 10:37, Ola Fosheim Gr wrote:Isn't that multiple arguments to opIndex? -- /Jacob Carlborg mm, yes I believe you are right. http://dlang.org/operatoroverloading.html#ArrayOps
Re: Dutyl - a Vim plugin for running D tools
On Thursday, 14 August 2014 at 22:20:52 UTC, Idan Arye wrote: I'm open for suggestions for other tools and features to add to Dutyl(write them here, or preferably open GitHub issues with them) Any idea if this plugin works in conjunction with YouCompleteMe?
Re: D for the Win
On Thursday, 21 August 2014 at 08:47:50 UTC, Jacob Carlborg wrote: Isn't that multiple arguments to opIndex? Probably, I was just trying to be funny :P There should be a tutorial D for perl programmers of the 90s...
Re: Dutyl - a Vim plugin for running D tools
When I try to use this it just says that complete is not able to work at and suggests that DCD might not be running. Ubuntu 14.04. dcd-server and client are in path, even tried adding explicitly. How does one debug this plugin? On Thu, Aug 21, 2014 at 10:50 AM, BlackEdder via Digitalmars-d-announce digitalmars-d-announce@puremagic.com wrote: On Thursday, 14 August 2014 at 22:20:52 UTC, Idan Arye wrote: I'm open for suggestions for other tools and features to add to Dutyl(write them here, or preferably open GitHub issues with them) Any idea if this plugin works in conjunction with YouCompleteMe?
Re: D 2.066 is out. Enjoy!
Jacob Carlborg wrote in message news:lt43pj$ral$1...@digitalmars.com... Support for C++ namespaces where just released and support for C++ templates will most likely end up in master soon. Support for C++ templates was in the last release, and the new pull request is only for special mangling of some stl declarations.
Re: Dutyl - a Vim plugin for running D tools
On Thursday, 21 August 2014 at 08:50:50 UTC, BlackEdder wrote: On Thursday, 14 August 2014 at 22:20:52 UTC, Idan Arye wrote: I'm open for suggestions for other tools and features to add to Dutyl(write them here, or preferably open GitHub issues with them) Any idea if this plugin works in conjunction with YouCompleteMe? YouCompleteMe will use the available omnifunc as a fallback if no semantic completer for the filetype is provided. So, yes, it should work.
Re: D for the Win
On Thursday, 21 August 2014 at 01:51:11 UTC, ketmar via Digitalmars-d-announce wrote: i always wonder how good people at finding various offences I'm not offended. and fascims everywhere. It's pretty much the Nazi anthem. It doesn't get much more fascist than that. Of course, someone can play with fascist phrases without being a fascist or promoting fascism. As I said, coming from an Israeli, it's probably benign. If the author was German, I'd feel uneasy about it. And don't tell me that Germans carelessly throwing around Nazi slogans isn't something to feel uneasy about. The NPD (Nazi party) is in two Landtagen (state parliaments). i bet that such people are glad to censor I'm not trying to censor anything. Neither am I convinced that banning Nazi symbols, songs, etc (as we do in Germany) is the right way to go. I think I'd rather have the Nazis wear Hakenkreuz armbands than other, obscure symbols that I can't identify. It's not like they stop existing when we ban their uniforms.
Re: D for the Win
On Wednesday, 20 August 2014 at 22:57:21 UTC, Paulo Pinto wrote: As a Portuguese living in Germany, I would say not everyone knows that outside Germany. Certainly. As I said, from an Israeli it's probably benign. I guess if aynthing, it's meant to be jokingly provoking towards Germans. I don't mind that at all.
Re: D for the Win
On Thu, 21 Aug 2014 11:48:32 + anonymous via Digitalmars-d-announce digitalmars-d-announce@puremagic.com wrote: It's pretty much the Nazi anthem. oh, really? let's see. current German anthem: Einigkeit und Recht und Freiheit für das deutsche Vaterland! Danach lasst uns alle streben brüderlich mit Herz und Hand! and so on. pretty innocent, right? ok, but this is only the 3rd verse of the song which begins with... oh, Deutschland, Deutschland über alles. may i assume that all Germans are well-disgiused Nazis then? here is the full song, for your pleasure: Deutschland, Deutschland über alles, über alles in der Welt, wenn es stets zu Schutz und Trutze brüderlich zusammenhält. Von der Maas bis an die Memel, von der Etsch bis an den Belt, Deutschland, Deutschland über alles, über alles in der Welt! Deutsche Frauen, deutsche Treue, deutscher Wein und deutscher Sang sollen in der Welt behalten ihren alten schönen Klang, uns zu edler Tat begeistern unser ganzes Leben lang. — Deutsche Frauen, deutsche Treue, deutscher Wein und deutscher Sang! and now, German anthem! and the 3rd verse: Einigkeit und Recht und Freiheit für das deutsche Vaterland! Danach lasst uns alle streben brüderlich mit Herz und Hand! Einigkeit und Recht und Freiheit sind des Glückes Unterpfand; blüh im Glanze dieses Glückes, blühe, deutsches Vaterland. And don't tell me that Germans carelessly throwing around Nazi slogans isn't something to feel uneasy about. they not only throwing, they still using part of that song as their anthem. besides, aren't your words racist? signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: D for the Win
On Thursday, 21 August 2014 at 12:05:40 UTC, ketmar via Digitalmars-d-announce wrote: ... Please, this is not important enough to argue here.
Re: D for the Win
On Thu, 21 Aug 2014 12:08:05 + Dicebot via Digitalmars-d-announce digitalmars-d-announce@puremagic.com wrote: Please, this is not important enough to argue here. ah, excuse me. it's so easy to drag me into such talks... mea culpa. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: D for the Win
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law
Re: D 2.066 is out. Enjoy!
On Wednesday, 20 August 2014 at 16:25:04 UTC, disapointed user wrote: too bad that i wasted my time for such a long time. i post a link to that thread with your answer to everywhere i can, so that others won't waste their time too. anyway good luck in the future for you linux guys. Well, people have different perspectives :) see http://forum.dlang.org/post/lrsnjovurigezboqx...@forum.dlang.org
Re: D 2.066 is out. Enjoy!
On 21/08/14 12:10, Daniel Murphy wrote: Support for C++ templates was in the last release, and the new pull request is only for special mangling of some stl declarations. You see, I get confused of all the syntax changes ;) -- /Jacob Carlborg
The No Explicit Save UI paradigm
On 07/08/2014 15:45, David Gileadi wrote: On 8/7/14, 4:18 AM, Bruno Medeiros wrote: This is an interesting behavior I've come across, even before watching this talk: Recently I tried IntelliJ IDEA, and it also goes away with any explicit UI notion of saving a file. It just saves files automatically, as you type. This is interesting, and might well be a marked improvement in UI behavior... This is a UI direction that Mac OSX is going in, presumably as part of their push to bring iOS behavior to the desktop. Apps that use it save as they go, and they have a standard UI to browse through previous versions of your document if you want to go back to (or crib from) something earlier. Interesting. Indeed the only potential issue I saw with this approach was, how does the application mark each local history version of a document? With explicit save it's easy, just create a new version in the local history each time the document is saved. Without explicit save... A smart algorithm/heuristic would have to be put in place. Something like saving a new version after a user stops typing after a while (5min or so?), or after a significant number of changes occurred. (if the local history is smart enough and saves changes incrementally, it can actually store every single change actually) In any case that's workable, and overall it seems like an improvement in UI design. It even reminds me of the talk Inventing on Principle talk Bret Victor gave ( http://vimeo.com/36579366 ), in particular the aspect about reducing (if not removing entirely) the save/compile/run cycle. -- Bruno Medeiros https://twitter.com/brunodomedeiros
Re: Dutyl - a Vim plugin for running D tools
On Thursday, 21 August 2014 at 08:57:55 UTC, Rory McGuire via Digitalmars-d-announce wrote: When I try to use this it just says that complete is not able to work at and suggests that DCD might not be running. Ubuntu 14.04. dcd-server and client are in path, even tried adding explicitly. How does one debug this plugin? On Thu, Aug 21, 2014 at 10:50 AM, BlackEdder via Digitalmars-d-announce digitalmars-d-announce@puremagic.com wrote: On Thursday, 14 August 2014 at 22:20:52 UTC, Idan Arye wrote: I'm open for suggestions for other tools and features to add to Dutyl(write them here, or preferably open GitHub issues with them) Any idea if this plugin works in conjunction with YouCompleteMe? Is the DCD server running? It needs to be running for Dutyl to use it. You can either run it manually or use the Dutyl's `:DUDCDstartServer` command. You can check if the server is currently running by opening a shell and typing `dcd-client --query`.
Re: Dutyl - a Vim plugin for running D tools
Yip I tried running it manually in another terminal. Is there an error log or something somewhere? On 21 Aug 2014 19:00, Idan Arye via Digitalmars-d-announce digitalmars-d-announce@puremagic.com wrote: On Thursday, 21 August 2014 at 08:57:55 UTC, Rory McGuire via Digitalmars-d-announce wrote: When I try to use this it just says that complete is not able to work at and suggests that DCD might not be running. Ubuntu 14.04. dcd-server and client are in path, even tried adding explicitly. How does one debug this plugin? On Thu, Aug 21, 2014 at 10:50 AM, BlackEdder via Digitalmars-d-announce digitalmars-d-announce@puremagic.com wrote: On Thursday, 14 August 2014 at 22:20:52 UTC, Idan Arye wrote: I'm open for suggestions for other tools and features to add to Dutyl(write them here, or preferably open GitHub issues with them) Any idea if this plugin works in conjunction with YouCompleteMe? Is the DCD server running? It needs to be running for Dutyl to use it. You can either run it manually or use the Dutyl's `:DUDCDstartServer` command. You can check if the server is currently running by opening a shell and typing `dcd-client --query`.
Re: Dutyl - a Vim plugin for running D tools
On Thursday, 21 August 2014 at 10:20:24 UTC, Weaseldog wrote: On Thursday, 21 August 2014 at 08:50:50 UTC, BlackEdder wrote: On Thursday, 14 August 2014 at 22:20:52 UTC, Idan Arye wrote: I'm open for suggestions for other tools and features to add to Dutyl(write them here, or preferably open GitHub issues with them) Any idea if this plugin works in conjunction with YouCompleteMe? YouCompleteMe will use the available omnifunc as a fallback if no semantic completer for the filetype is provided. So, yes, it should work. I looked a bit into YouCompleteMe to see if I can add a proper semantic completer. It appears that semantic completers run on the YCMD server rather then inside the Vim instance - which makes writing a semantic completer infeasible. The semantic completer will need to be able to read the import paths and to invoke DCD. These two functionalities are implemented in Dutyl with VimScript - but to access these implementations it'll need to some interface to call these functions. I don't know if the YCDM-Vim interaction supports the server calling the client, or if Vim's own server-client mechanism can be used for it(which will require extra configuration), but at any rate it doesn't make much sense to use the completion server when the work is done in the Vim instance. Another option is to reimplement that functionality in Python - but if the the import paths gathering, the DCD invokation, and the glue code that connects them are all reimplemented there is no point in making this part of Dutyl... Also note that Dutyl sends the content of the current buffer to DCD, not the file saved on disc. This diffidently requires access to the Vim instance, and changing it is not an option unless you want to have to save before you autocomplete.
Re: D 2.066 is out. Enjoy!
On Thursday, 21 August 2014 at 15:20:49 UTC, Daniel Murphy wrote: Jacob Carlborg wrote in message news:lt50m0$20f0$1...@digitalmars.com... Support for C++ templates was in the last release, and the new pull request is only for special mangling of some stl declarations. You see, I get confused of all the syntax changes ;) Don't worry, so did Walter. LOL. Yeah, well, it would be ni going to support C+ce if we could get an actual list of the C++ features that D currently supports somewhere (and how to use them if it's not obvious). You've been doing so much great work on that that I have no clue what the current state of things is. For instance, this is the first I've heard of anything about template support; I'd thought that we were never going to support templates. Is it just for name mangling or for actually compiling them? - Jonathan M Davis
Re: D 2.066 is out. Enjoy!
On Tuesday, 19 August 2014 at 08:14:41 UTC, novice2 wrote: http://dlang.org/changelog.html Version D 2.066 August 18, 2014 ... Phobos enhancements 1.Bugzilla 3780: getopt improvements by Igor Lesik Sorry, i can't find this improvements nor in getopt.d nor in http://dlang.org/phobos/std_getopt.html. Is this announce prematurely, and that this changes will be seen in 2.067 ? I suspect that the changelog was done by dates rather than based on what was actually merged. Someone else was commenting that some stuff was in there that's going to be in 2.067 and not 2.066, and 2.066 took long enough after it was branched, that it would be easy to accidentally list 2.067 stuff for 2.066 if you were looking at merge dates rather than what actually went on the 2.066 branch. - Jonathan M Davis
Re: D 2.066 is out. Enjoy!
On 8/21/2014 11:54 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote: LOL. Yeah, well, it would be ni going to support C+ce if we could get an actual list of the C++ features that D currently supports somewhere (and how to use them if it's not obvious). You've been doing so much great work on that that I have no clue what the current state of things is. For instance, this is the first I've heard of anything about template support; I'd thought that we were never going to support templates. Is it just for name mangling or for actually compiling them? The thing is, while the code was there, there wasn't a single test case for it in the test suite. Furthermore, at least for Elf, there was no support for the special mangling done for ::std:: stuff. The thing is, modern C++ practice makes heavy use of std types. Having an interface to C++ code is fairly unusable unless D can also interface to std::string, std::vector, and a few others. The first step is to support the mangling of them. Then, try to construct a workalike on the D side that follows D rules, and yet is able to seamlessly interact with the corresponding C++ code. We'll see how far we can get with that, and then evaluate what to do next. There are no plans for actually compiling C++ code with a D compiler. The plan is for support like we do for C - have a .d header file for it.
Re: D 2.066 is out. Enjoy!
On Thursday, 21 August 2014 at 20:33:56 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 8/21/2014 11:54 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote: LOL. Yeah, well, it would be ni going to support C+ce if we could get an actual list of the C++ features that D currently supports somewhere (and how to use them if it's not obvious). You've been doing so much great work on that that I have no clue what the current state of things is. For instance, this is the first I've heard of anything about template support; I'd thought that we were never going to support templates. Is it just for name mangling or for actually compiling them? The thing is, while the code was there, there wasn't a single test case for it in the test suite. Furthermore, at least for Elf, there was no support for the special mangling done for ::std:: stuff. The thing is, modern C++ practice makes heavy use of std types. Having an interface to C++ code is fairly unusable unless D can also interface to std::string, std::vector, and a few others. The first step is to support the mangling of them. Then, try to construct a workalike on the D side that follows D rules, and yet is able to seamlessly interact with the corresponding C++ code. We'll see how far we can get with that, and then evaluate what to do next. There are no plans for actually compiling C++ code with a D compiler. The plan is for support like we do for C - have a .d header file for it. Well, I wouldn't have expected us to be compiling C++ per se, but previously, it seemed like the party line was that we wouldn't be supporting C++ templates at all because of how hard they were and because we don't want a C++ compiler in the D compiler. I'm certainly all for anything we can do for C++ compatability without going off the deep end. I just don't hear much about what we're actually doing right now. So, I really have no idea what the current status of that is. With what was said at dconf and comments like these, it seems like we're making huge progress in comparison to where we were, and as far as I can tell, about the only way to hear about it is to either pay a lot of attention to dmd pulls or to see an occasonal comment from Daniel talking about it or from someone who's paying close attention to what he's up to. So, at some point in the near future, it would be nice if there were somewhere that actually said what D can actually do with C++ now, even if that doesn't include everything that's going to be coming or if much of it is marked as experimental and relatively untested. - Jonathan M Davis
Re: D 2.066 is out. Enjoy!
On Thursday, 21 August 2014 at 20:43:53 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: On Thursday, 21 August 2014 at 20:33:56 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 8/21/2014 11:54 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote: LOL. Yeah, well, it would be ni going to support C+ce if we could get an actual list of the C++ features that D currently supports somewhere (and how to use them if it's not obvious). You've been doing so much great work on that that I have no clue what the current state of things is. For instance, this is the first I've heard of anything about template support; I'd thought that we were never going to support templates. Is it just for name mangling or for actually compiling them? The thing is, while the code was there, there wasn't a single test case for it in the test suite. Furthermore, at least for Elf, there was no support for the special mangling done for ::std:: stuff. The thing is, modern C++ practice makes heavy use of std types. Having an interface to C++ code is fairly unusable unless D can also interface to std::string, std::vector, and a few others. The first step is to support the mangling of them. Then, try to construct a workalike on the D side that follows D rules, and yet is able to seamlessly interact with the corresponding C++ code. We'll see how far we can get with that, and then evaluate what to do next. There are no plans for actually compiling C++ code with a D compiler. The plan is for support like we do for C - have a .d header file for it. Well, I wouldn't have expected us to be compiling C++ per se, but previously, it seemed like the party line was that we wouldn't be supporting C++ templates at all because of how hard they were and because we don't want a C++ compiler in the D compiler. I'm certainly all for anything we can do for C++ compatability without going off the deep end. I just don't hear much about what we're actually doing right now. So, I really have no idea what the current status of that is. With what was said at dconf and comments like these, it seems like we're making huge progress in comparison to where we were, and as far as I can tell, about the only way to hear about it is to either pay a lot of attention to dmd pulls or to see an occasonal comment from Daniel talking about it or from someone who's paying close attention to what he's up to. So, at some point in the near future, it would be nice if there were somewhere that actually said what D can actually do with C++ now, even if that doesn't include everything that's going to be coming or if much of it is marked as experimental and relatively untested. - Jonathan M Davis It would be nice to have a page to link to when questions come up on Reddit about compatibility with C++. That page should also have information about avoiding the garbage collector and the status of GC removal from the standard library.
D 2.066 new behavior
In all previous versions through 2.066 beta 5, the following code
compiled and ran correctly:
import std.stdio;
T add(T)(in T x, in T y)
{
T z;
z = x + y;
return z;
}
void main()
{
const double a = 1.0;
const double b = 2.0;
double c;
c = add(a,b);
writefln(c = %s, c);// 3.0
c = 1.0;
writefln(c = %s, c);// 1.0
}
From beta 6 onward it no longer compiles. The problem seems to be
const qualifiers being carried into the template type. Since a
and b are const double, the function template parameter T is
const double. So x and y are const, no problem, but z is now
const also. The following error message is given.
T add(T)(in T x, in T y)
{
T z;
z = x + y; // Error: Can't modify const expression z
return z;
}
The same problem shows up elsewhere as 'cannot implicitly convert
const x to x'
and 'none of the overloads are callable using argument types (x)
const'.
Is this expected behavior that has never been enforced before, or
is it something new?
And is anyone else having the same problem?
Paul
Re: D 2.066 new behavior
On Friday, 22 August 2014 at 01:54:55 UTC, Paul D Anderson wrote: Is this expected behavior that has never been enforced before, or is it something new? And is anyone else having the same problem? Paul Looks like a regression, I've filed it here: https://issues.dlang.org/show_bug.cgi?id=13351
Re: D for the Win
On 8/20/2014 3:02 PM, anonymous wrote: [...] I agree with Dicebot. Let's not go there.
