[tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
>By default openoffice(libreoffice?) is using max 20 Mb RAM, which is not >enough today. Default settings need to change, st. most computer have 1Gb+ >RAM today. If you set it 256 Mb, it quite fast. >*But why is this limited to 256 only?* Sometimes I need much more when >working with my school projects. Why not but the limit to 1Gb? That is an interesting fact. I agree that it doesn't make sense to have a fixed low value. If the goal is to be conservative, then it should be a low PERCENTAGE of the system RAM... Unfortunately that doesn't fix this particular problem. It is a parsing limitation. It depends on the CPU not on RAM (or at least RAM is not the limiting factor either with 20 or 256Mb) -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Why-is-LO-OOo-so-slow-loading-a-spreadsheet-tp2006665p2026487.html Sent from the Discuss mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
Hello! By default openoffice(libreoffice?) is using max 20 Mb RAM, which is not enough today. Default settings need to change, st. most computer have 1Gb+ RAM today. If you set it 256 Mb, it quite fast. *But why is this limited to 256 only?* Sometimes I need much more when working with my school projects. Why not but the limit to 1Gb? Hillar 2010/12/6 Cor Nouws > Cor Nouws wrote (04-12-10 20:13) > >> Kohei Yoshida wrote (04-12-10 17:51) >> > > BTW, the xlsx loading being slow (and to some extent ods loading) is >>> unfortunately nothing new. If we are lucky we may be able to squeeze >>> some performance here and there, but IMO we may need a more drastic >>> surgery if we want to dramatically improve performance... >>> >> >> The performance is OK in OOo 321, but very bad in 330cr7 and maybe even >> worse (have to time again) in LibObeta3. >> Definitely a regression - I can file an issue later this weekend (I >> think). >> > > I opened issue http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=115940 > > Loading in LibObeta3 takes the same time as 330rc7/300m93. > > Cor > > -- > - giving openoffice.org its foundation :: The Document Foundation - > > > -- > Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to > discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org > Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ > *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity *** > -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
Cor Nouws wrote (04-12-10 20:13) Kohei Yoshida wrote (04-12-10 17:51) BTW, the xlsx loading being slow (and to some extent ods loading) is unfortunately nothing new. If we are lucky we may be able to squeeze some performance here and there, but IMO we may need a more drastic surgery if we want to dramatically improve performance... The performance is OK in OOo 321, but very bad in 330cr7 and maybe even worse (have to time again) in LibObeta3. Definitely a regression - I can file an issue later this weekend (I think). I opened issue http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=115940 Loading in LibObeta3 takes the same time as 330rc7/300m93. Cor -- - giving openoffice.org its foundation :: The Document Foundation - -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
MiguelAngel, the problem only occurs when you open the ods and save as xlsx. Not the other way around ;) -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Why-is-LO-OOo-so-slow-loading-a-spreadsheet-tp2006665p2023022.html Sent from the Discuss mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
On Windows 7-Ultimate - Intel i3 - 4Gb. Saved as 'ods' OOo 3.2.1. open 65.536 rows with a message about limited exceeded. OOo 3.3.rc7 open 300.000 rows - 00:01:16 Libro 3.3b3 open 300.000 rows - 00:01:13 Miguel Ángel >> Well, just verified that LibO does truncate spreadsheet files at 64K >> rows and that OO.o 3.2.1 does not. >> >> So, would you like to open an issue for this - your file - or I will if >> you like? > Actually I went ahead and opened the issue > https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=32106 > > -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
> Well, just verified that LibO does truncate spreadsheet files at 64K > rows and that OO.o 3.2.1 does not. > > So, would you like to open an issue for this - your file - or I will if > you like? Actually I went ahead and opened the issue https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=32106 -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
On Sat, 2010-12-04 at 14:22 -0800, plino wrote: > drew, I just tested it in Windows and the resulting xlsx it's not only > truncated it is also corrupted in such a way that Gnumeric can't open it > (although Excel 2007 and LO can still open it) > > No wonder it is faster (and the file smaller), it just deleted nearly > 240.000 lines :lol: Hi, Well, just verified that LibO does truncate spreadsheet files at 64K rows and that OO.o 3.2.1 does not. So, would you like to open an issue for this - your file - or I will if you like? Also - setting the cells to use default number formatting does NOT speed up loads BTW...bummer. Drew -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
drew, I just tested it in Windows and the resulting xlsx it's not only truncated it is also corrupted in such a way that Gnumeric can't open it (although Excel 2007 and LO can still open it) No wonder it is faster (and the file smaller), it just deleted nearly 240.000 lines :lol: -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Why-is-LO-OOo-so-slow-loading-a-spreadsheet-tp2006665p2020060.html Sent from the Discuss mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
On Sat, 2010-12-04 at 16:38 -0500, drew wrote: > On Sat, 2010-12-04 at 13:17 -0800, NoOp wrote: > > Here is his original: > > http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=107217 > > [xlsx: no warning on incomplete load for more than 64k rows] > > grabbed it and opening on my Ubuntu maching, LibO 3.3 beta 3 is pretty > slow indeed. > > set the formatting for the A column to default (no leading zeros) and > save as XLSX format - now the file _without_ the custom format string > loads in about 10 seconds. > OOOPS - belay that. Seems when you save the file with the 300,000 rows as an XLSX it truncates it to 64K lines...hmmm is there an issue on that? Drew -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
On Sat, 2010-12-04 at 13:17 -0800, NoOp wrote: > Here is his original: > http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=107217 > [xlsx: no warning on incomplete load for more than 64k rows] grabbed it and opening on my Ubuntu maching, LibO 3.3 beta 3 is pretty slow indeed. set the formatting for the A column to default (no leading zeros) and save as XLSX format - now the file _without_ the custom format string loads in about 10 seconds. Drew -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
You are free to use both files as you wish. Please also use the xlsx file included in this other OOo issue http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=96758 it is a complex spreadsheet with a lot of formatting -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Why-is-LO-OOo-so-slow-loading-a-spreadsheet-tp2006665p2019854.html Sent from the Discuss mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
On 12/04/2010 11:13 AM, Cor Nouws wrote: > Kohei Yoshida wrote (04-12-10 17:51) >> Hi there, >> >> On Sat, 2010-12-04 at 02:32 -0800, plino wrote: >>> The xlsx file is in the link above. Here is the ODS >>> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2347109/30_line_sample.ods >> >> Are this file and the .xlsx variant free of any confidential >> information? IOW, Can I put them in our test document repository which >> is *public*? >> >> I'd like to run some profiling later to find out why it's so slow. I >> have other priorities at the moment, but I'd like to find some time to >> look into this at a later time. >> >> Let me know. Thanks. > > It is attached to an OOo issue, so yes: public. > http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=96758 Here is his original: http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=107217 [xlsx: no warning on incomplete load for more than 64k rows] -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
>>That is exactly my point. In a forum,anyone could answer. > wrong. anyone *which is reading* - same thing in a mailinglist. :o)) Obviously. But in a Forum you don't need to subscribe to discuss, libreoffice, dev, etc separately. Each one of these subcategories is a separate mailing list that you must subscribe individually http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/ otherwise you CAN NOT answer. In a Forum you just need to subscribe once and you have access to all sub-forums. And therefore anyone can answer any topic in any section, so odds are higher that someone knows an answer... And any admin can move a topic from one sub-forum to another. In a mailing list that doesn't work... -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Why-is-LO-OOo-so-slow-loading-a-spreadsheet-tp2006665p2019785.html Sent from the Discuss mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
Hi plino, *, plino schrieb: >> Maybe the right list would help. Try the users list, >> [hidden email] or ask the developers, >> [hidden email] . >That is exactly my point. In a forum,anyone could answer. wrong. anyone *which is reading* - same thing in a mailinglist. :o)) [..] Gruß/regards -- Friedrich Libreoffice-Box http://libreofficebox.org/ LibreOffice and more on CD/DVD images (german version already started) -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
Hi plino, *, plino schrieb: >Another topic ignored? >Maybe a mailing list isn't the right tool... Maybe? It's good and recommended practice in mailinglists only to answer, if knowing an answer. Many search engine hits I found, show: this isn't on forums. ;o)) Happy if not having to read one. Gruß/regards -- Friedrich Libreoffice-Box http://libreofficebox.org/ LibreOffice and more on CD/DVD images (german version already started) -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
Kohei Yoshida wrote (04-12-10 17:51) Hi there, On Sat, 2010-12-04 at 02:32 -0800, plino wrote: The xlsx file is in the link above. Here is the ODS http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2347109/30_line_sample.ods Are this file and the .xlsx variant free of any confidential information? IOW, Can I put them in our test document repository which is *public*? I'd like to run some profiling later to find out why it's so slow. I have other priorities at the moment, but I'd like to find some time to look into this at a later time. Let me know. Thanks. It is attached to an OOo issue, so yes: public. http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=96758 BTW, the xlsx loading being slow (and to some extent ods loading) is unfortunately nothing new. If we are lucky we may be able to squeeze some performance here and there, but IMO we may need a more drastic surgery if we want to dramatically improve performance... The performance is OK in OOo 321, but very bad in 330cr7 and maybe even worse (have to time again) in LibObeta3. Definitely a regression - I can file an issue later this weekend (I think). Cor -- - giving openoffice.org its foundation :: The Document Foundation - -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
On Sat Dec 04 2010 08:51:23 GMT-0800 (PST) Kohei Yoshida wrote: Hi there, On Sat, 2010-12-04 at 02:32 -0800, plino wrote: The xlsx file is in the link above. Here is the ODS http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2347109/30_line_sample.ods Are this file and the .xlsx variant free of any confidential information? IOW, Can I put them in our test document repository which is *public*? They only contain one column with numbers from 01 to 30 in the respective row. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
Hi there, On Sat, 2010-12-04 at 02:32 -0800, plino wrote: > The xlsx file is in the link above. Here is the ODS > http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2347109/30_line_sample.ods Are this file and the .xlsx variant free of any confidential information? IOW, Can I put them in our test document repository which is *public*? I'd like to run some profiling later to find out why it's so slow. I have other priorities at the moment, but I'd like to find some time to look into this at a later time. Let me know. Thanks. BTW, the xlsx loading being slow (and to some extent ods loading) is unfortunately nothing new. If we are lucky we may be able to squeeze some performance here and there, but IMO we may need a more drastic surgery if we want to dramatically improve performance... Kohei -- Kohei Yoshida, LibreOffice hacker, Calc -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
Cor, in that page I could find a perfect example of how things did NOT work in OOo http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=96758 According to the last comment this bug is fixed. You just need to download the sample file and open it in LO to see that it's not (just for fun load it in Gnumeric or Excel to see how fast it should load...) BTW there are several problems in the Open dialog: 1) The Files of Type drop box has no order. Within a file type (e.g. spreadsheets) the options available aren't sorted alphabetically by program name or by extension, so Excel 2007 are further down instead of grouped with other Excel versions 2) Selecting the filter Spreadsheets includes txt files but not xlsx files (Again I think .gnumeric should be included. It's an open xml based format) -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Why-is-LO-OOo-so-slow-loading-a-spreadsheet-tp2006665p2017853.html Sent from the Discuss mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
plino wrote (04-12-10 11:09) What puzzles me is that I can't find any logic that LO/OOo which is the Office suite behind the ODF standard is in fact LESS efficient handling that format than another FLOSS program... Cause it is a different program ;-) If you want some pointers, look for 'performance' here: http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Category:Calc Best regards, Cor -- - giving openoffice.org its foundation :: The Document Foundation - -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
Thank you for the reply, Andy! > The forums that I visit also have things broken down by what it applies > to. You would get better/more answers by posting to a forum that way as > well. I look at most all new post but from what I have seen not > everyone does, and see this type of reply on the forums as well. Yes. In a forum it could also have been posted on the wrong section, but in any well managed forum topics are moved around by the admins (answering that they are in the wrong section indicates a poorly chosen admin) > Send me a copy of the file used and I will gladly run it and see what I > times I come up with. I have two Ubuntu machines and an XP laptop that > I can run it one. The xlsx file is in the link above. Here is the ODS http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2347109/30_line_sample.ods -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Why-is-LO-OOo-so-slow-loading-a-spreadsheet-tp2006665p2017287.html Sent from the Discuss mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
>Mhh, I did not see your note as anything new. But Maybe I should have >mailed that ;-) >But ignored? Far from that. Cor, thank you for the reply. In my mind it doesn't make any sense that the mailing lists are so self contained that I have to guess in which one I have to post. And if I fail to post on the right list it will be either ignored or not answered (which from the poster's point of view is the same...) It doesn't also make sense that I have to subscribe to several mailing lists when ONE forum would be enough. >See the OOo wiki for analyses/ideas/tasks on Calc and performance. >And also the LibreOffice dev list shows abundant signs of awareness that >improvements on performance are very important. It wouldn't cross my mind searching the OOo wiki, when I'm asking to the LO community. I'm finished with the OOo community for a long time. They had/have a serious attitude/communication problem which I hope doesn't propagate to LO (and your answer shows that it's not ;) ) What puzzles me is that I can't find any logic that LO/OOo which is the Office suite behind the ODF standard is in fact LESS efficient handling that format than another FLOSS program... Cheers, Pedro -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Why-is-LO-OOo-so-slow-loading-a-spreadsheet-tp2006665p2017245.html Sent from the Discuss mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
plino wrote (04-12-10 00:39) Another topic ignored? Maybe a mailing list isn't the right tool... Mhh, I did not see your note as anything new. But Maybe I should have mailed that ;-) But ignored? Far from that. See the OOo wiki for analyses/ideas/tasks on Calc and performance. And also the LibreOffice dev list shows abundant signs of awareness that improvements on performance are very important. Regards, Cor -- - giving openoffice.org its foundation :: The Document Foundation - -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
On Fri Dec 03 2010 16:19:49 GMT-0800 (PST) plino wrote: Maybe the right list would help. Try the users list, [hidden email] or ask the developers, [hidden email] . That is exactly my point. In a forum,anyone could answer. In a mailing list I have to subscribe to ALL and guess on which the subject fits better. I think this is a general discussion on LO and ODF optimization. Not something I would consider a User question or a Dev problem... The forums that I visit also have things broken down by what it applies to. You would get better/more answers by posting to a forum that way as well. I look at most all new post but from what I have seen not everyone does, and see this type of reply on the forums as well. Since I have no means for testing MSO I can not confirm or deny your statements. I am quite sure that OOo/LibO could use a lot of work to improve things. You can test Gnumeric which is also FLOSS and confirm the difference in loading times... Of course the actual times depend on your system. Send me a copy of the file used and I will gladly run it and see what I times I come up with. I have two Ubuntu machines and an XP laptop that I can run it one. Andy -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
> Maybe the right list would help. Try the users list, > [hidden email] or ask the developers, > [hidden email] . That is exactly my point. In a forum,anyone could answer. In a mailing list I have to subscribe to ALL and guess on which the subject fits better. I think this is a general discussion on LO and ODF optimization. Not something I would consider a User question or a Dev problem... > Since I have no means for testing > MSO I can not confirm or deny your statements. I am quite sure that > OOo/LibO could use a lot of work to improve things. You can test Gnumeric which is also FLOSS and confirm the difference in loading times... Of course the actual times depend on your system. -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Why-is-LO-OOo-so-slow-loading-a-spreadsheet-tp2006665p2015230.html Sent from the Discuss mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
On Fri Dec 03 2010 15:39:35 GMT-0800 (PST) plino wrote: Another topic ignored? Maybe a mailing list isn't the right tool... Maybe the right list would help. Try the users list, us...@libreoffice.org or ask the developers, libreoff...@lists.freedesktop.org . Since I have no means for testing MSO I can not confirm or deny your statements. I am quite sure that OOo/LibO could use a lot of work to improve things. Andy -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[tdf-discuss] Re: Why is LO/OOo so slow loading a spreadsheet?
Another topic ignored? Maybe a mailing list isn't the right tool... -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Why-is-LO-OOo-so-slow-loading-a-spreadsheet-tp2006665p2014877.html Sent from the Discuss mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
