Public Telephone access

[POWELL, DOUG]

Hello group,

Recently I was reviewing a new product that my company plans to manufacture.
It has an industrial CPU board and a modem daughter board.  During the
review my safety consultant brought up the concept that not all public
access telephone systems are the same and we would need a modem card that is
approved for use in each country where we sell our product.  

My compliance experience is mainly in power delivery system and this is new
to me.  The consultant said that an ISDN compatible card would take care of
most of Europe but was unsure about the rest of the world.  I was hoping one
(or more) of you could tell me where I can begin searching for information
on this topic, web or otherwise.

Thanks,

-doug

===
Douglas E. Powell, Compliance Engineer
Advanced Energy Industries, Inc.
Fort Collins, Colorado 80525 USA
---
970-407-6410  (phone)
970-407-5410  (e-fax) 
mailto:doug.pow...@aei.com
http://www.advanced-energy.com
===

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RE: NEBS' Information Request

[Mel Pedersen]

Carmen:  The Bellcore has not much to do with the EU.  The Bellcore
requirements are not legal requirements in the US, they are voluntary.  I
would not count on much luck marketing Telecommunications Equipment in the
US without complying with Bellcore requirements however, as all the major
RBOC's require Bellcore compliance from thier suppliers.

Mel Pedersen Midcom, Inc.
Homologations Engineer  Phone:  (605) 882-8535
mpeder...@midcom-inc.com  Fax:  (605) 882-8633


-Original Message-
From: Carmen.Filimon [mailto:carmen.fili...@leitch.com]
Sent: Friday, July 30, 1999 11:22 AM
To: 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org'
Subject: NEBS' Information Request




Hello Ladies and Gentlemen,

I'm looking for information about NEBS compliance. I know there are 3
criteria levels for NEBS compliance devised by Bellcore, to ensure that
telecommunication equipment is suitable for the customers needs and to
reduce the time and expenses for the manufacturers. Are they voluntary or
regulatory testing requirements for telecommunication field in North America
and/or EU?
 
Please, any appropriate link would be useful for me. Thank you in advance
for your help,

Best regards,

Carmen Filimon,
Safety Test Engineer,
Leitch Technology Int'l 
E-mail: carmen.fili...@leitch.com


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RE: NEBS' Information

[Gary McInturff]

Pretty much sums up the situation. I would add that if the RBOC's don't have
a source and so they need your stuff, they will take it after much
grumbling, but they will take it. The risk is more are you so unique that
they can't get it elsewhere. It's actually a question worth asking because
the testing can be pretty expensive. I haven't exactly tried it but I also
believe that you may be able to start with level 1 while you are making your
way up the test food change. Again, depending on how badly they want it.
As much as the RBOC arrogance annoys me, one in particular, they really do
have a point. When every thing else breaks you can almost always pick up
your phone and hit a dial tone. In the case of natural disasters etc. that
is a pretty handy feature, and they guard it jealously.
You can order a CD of the requirements from Bellcore called Network
Equipment - Building system NEBS - FR-20063.
This is the URL for the Telecordia store. Should be able to find the
standards and their costs there.
Gary

-Original Message-
From:   John Juhasz [SMTP:jjuh...@fiberoptions.com]
Sent:   Friday, July 30, 1999 11:45 AM
To: 'Carmen.Filimon'; 'IEEE emc-pstc list'
Subject:RE: NEBS' Information 

The NEBS requirements are not mandatory government standards.
However, 
when dealing with RBOCs (Regional Bell Operating Companies) like
Bell Atlantic, Pacific Bell, Ameritech, etc . . . it is recommended that you
meet the NEBS 

requirements. If you don't, and your equipment is intended for
co-location in the COs (Central Offices) you risk not making the sale. 

Your statement that "equipment is suitable for the customers needs
and to 
reduce the time and expenses for the manufacturers", is not the
reason for meeting the standards. The reason is to minimize/reduce the risk
of your equipment causing harm to network critical equipment, and for that
matter any equipment that is in the CO. 

The NEBS standards include EMC and PRoduct Safety (GR-1089) and
environmental-seismic, transporation/handling, temp/humidity extremes,
airborne contaminants (mixed gasses and hygroscopic dust), fire spread,
acoustic, illumination/glare, and construction. The three levels range from
Level 1 (minimum requirements) to Level 3 intended for equipment in 'outdoor
plant'. Compliance to NEBS level 3 ensures that the RBOC can locate your
equipment ANYWHERE within their network, whether inside or outside plant.

UL, Telcordia (fromerly Bellcore), and MET laboratories all offer
testing services to NEBS. 

Here are the URL's 
http://www.ul.com/   
http://www.bellcore.com/index.html
  
http://www.metlabs.com/   

I've been through the NEBS testing program. It takes time. Stick
with it. 

John A. Juhasz 
Product Qualification & 
Compliance Engr. 

Fiber Options, Inc. 
80 Orville Dr. Suite 102 
Bohemia, NY 11716 USA 

Tel: 516-567-8320 ext. 324 
Fax: 516-567-8322 


-Original Message- 
From: Carmen.Filimon [ mailto:carmen.fili...@leitch.com
 ] 
Sent: Friday, July 30, 1999 12:00 PM 
To: 'IEEE emc-pstc list' 
Subject: NEBS' Information 





Hello Ladies and Gentlemen, 

I'm looking for information about NEBS compliance. I know there are
3 
criteria levels for NEBS compliance devised by Bellcore, to ensure
that 
telecommunication equipment is suitable for the customers needs and
to 
reduce the time and expenses for the manufacturers. Are they
voluntary or 
regulatory testing requirements for telecommunication field in North
America 
and/or EU? 
  
Please, any appropriate link would be useful for me. Thank you in
advance 
for your help, 

Best regards, 

Carmen Filimon, 
Safety Test Engineer, 
Leitch Technology Int'l 
E-mail: carmen.fili...@leitch.com 

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RE: cost effective EMC facility

[Ehler, Kyle]

Is this an oxymoron?
I sometimes wish we had a GTEM, but our anechoic screen room has just
started to be used for pre-compliance testing and troubleshooting.  The
workstation consists of a Braden CFC (3000 cu.ft Compact Ferrite Chamber),
AR FM2000 isotropic probe, AR 1Kw log periodic, AR 25W1000M7 amp, HP 8648B,
HP 8564E, Rhode & Schwarz ESCS30 and a PC w/labview /HP applications.  With
this rig we can perform both RF emissions pre-scan, troubleshooting and
susceptibility up to the host level.  

For PCB's alone I suggest an EMSCAN or an EPS 3000 tablet based scanner.
The EMSCAN rather sucked because of repeatability, but the EPS 3000 might be
much better because it couples a CCD imager with the RF scanner to provide
visual grids of the PCB's spatial profile.  Problem is, with either you
still need a screen room to prevent ambients from washing out your data.
And then you have to wrangle with hosts, card extenders, cable toss, etc..
At the time, the EMSCAN was less than $50K and I don't know how much the EPS
3000 is going for.  The CFC approach came in at around $400K or so (I built
the turntable for it to $ave) but the bottom line is this work is always
expensive in both hardware and headcount.  It depends on how far you need to
go and how badly management wants it...
Kyle Ehler  kyle.eh...@lsil.com   
Assistant Design Engineer
LSI Logic 


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RE: Fraudulent EMF Research (Cancer and EMF)

[Kealey, Doug]

I'd say MSNC, NBC, CNN, CBS & ABC all owe us an explanation of why their
so-called 'reporters' and 'talking heads' never reported that this
apparently fraudulent research scientist has been under investigation since
1995.  In every story that they've done on Cancer and EMF 1995-1999, they
should have mentioned that the ONE study that previously had credence was
now suspected to be a giant fraud.  
And why is this scientist banned from receiving government grants for only 3
years??  Why not a lifetime ban?  (The arrogant son-of-a-gun still hasn't
admitted any guilt.)

Doug

-Original Message-
From: Gorodetsky, Vitaly [mailto:vgorodet...@canoga.com]
Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 1999 7:08 PM
To: 'rbus...@es.com'; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: RE: EMF Test Data (Cancer and EMF)



All compliance practitioners recognize the difference between "improper
testing" and "data (expedient) misinterpretation".  What was it?

> -Original Message-
> From: rbus...@es.com [SMTP:rbus...@es.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 1999 2:22 PM
> To:   emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
> Subject:  EMF Test Data (Cancer and EMF)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Attached is a link to a recent MSNBC article concerning improper testing
> with regard to cancer and EMF. Thought some of you might be interested.
> 
> Rick
> 
> 
> http://www.msnbc.com/news/293056.asp
>  
> 
> -
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> 

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RE: NEBS' Information

[John Juhasz]

The NEBS requirements are not mandatory government standards. However,
when dealing with RBOCs (Regional Bell Operating Companies) like Bell
Atlantic, Pacific Bell, Ameritech, etc . . . it is recommended that you meet
the NEBS 
requirements. If you don't, and your equipment is intended for co-location
in the COs (Central Offices) you risk not making the sale. 
Your statement that "equipment is suitable for the customers needs and to
reduce the time and expenses for the manufacturers", is not the reason for
meeting the standards. The reason is to minimize/reduce the risk of your
equipment causing harm to network critical equipment, and for that matter
any equipment that is in the CO. 
The NEBS standards include EMC and PRoduct Safety (GR-1089) and
environmental-seismic, transporation/handling, temp/humidity extremes,
airborne contaminants (mixed gasses and hygroscopic dust), fire spread,
acoustic, illumination/glare, and construction. The three levels range from
Level 1 (minimum requirements) to Level 3 intended for equipment in 'outdoor
plant'. Compliance to NEBS level 3 ensures that the RBOC can locate your
equipment ANYWHERE within their network, whether inside or outside plant.

UL, Telcordia (fromerly Bellcore), and MET laboratories all offer testing
services to NEBS. 

Here are the URL's
http://www.ul.com/
http://www.bellcore.com/index.html
http://www.metlabs.com/

I've been through the NEBS testing program. It takes time. Stick with it.

John A. Juhasz
Product Qualification &
Compliance Engr.

Fiber Options, Inc.
80 Orville Dr. Suite 102
Bohemia, NY 11716 USA

Tel: 516-567-8320 ext. 324
Fax: 516-567-8322 


-Original Message-
From: Carmen.Filimon [mailto:carmen.fili...@leitch.com]
Sent: Friday, July 30, 1999 12:00 PM
To: 'IEEE emc-pstc list'
Subject: NEBS' Information 





Hello Ladies and Gentlemen,

I'm looking for information about NEBS compliance. I know there are 3
criteria levels for NEBS compliance devised by Bellcore, to ensure that
telecommunication equipment is suitable for the customers needs and to
reduce the time and expenses for the manufacturers. Are they voluntary or
regulatory testing requirements for telecommunication field in North America
and/or EU?
 
Please, any appropriate link would be useful for me. Thank you in advance
for your help,

Best regards,

Carmen Filimon,
Safety Test Engineer,
Leitch Technology Int'l 
E-mail: carmen.fili...@leitch.com

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RE: RELIABILITY TO MIL-HDBK-217

[Mel Pedersen]

I have a copy, and I believe I purchased it at the Document Center also.
 
Thier number now is:  650-591-7600
 
It was less than $100.  I think around $50...not too expensive.
 
- Mel

-Original Message-
From: Robert Walch [mailto:rwa...@vectron.com]
Sent: Friday, July 30, 1999 9:07 AM
To: Arun Kaore; 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org'
Subject: RE: RELIABILITY TO MIL-HDBK-217



I have a copy I received snail mail from "Document Center" (415) 591 -
7600.  Not sure if they still exist.  My copy is about 5 years old.  I would
do a web search for the DoD.  As one of the other replies stated Bellcore
would be better for commercial components.  MIL-HDBK-217 is unrealistically
brutal on Commercial Components.  It still is stuck in the 70's.  


Best Regards, 

Robert Walch 
Chief Engineer 
VI-Olathe 
(913) 829 - 1777 x133 
rwa...@vectron.com 

BM__MailData-Original Message- 
From:   Arun Kaore [SMTP:kao...@sg.adi-limited.com.au] 
Sent:   Thursday, July 29, 1999 7:36 PM 
To: 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org' 
Subject:    RELIABILITY TO MIL-HDBK-217 


Hi all, 

Could someone guide me on where to down load from the net or
purchase the 
latest version of MIL-HDBK-217 and approximately how much it would cost. It 
is a Reliability/MTBF related issue. 

Thanks in advance. 
  
Regards 

Arun Kaore 
EMC Engineer 

ADI Limited 
Systems Group 
Test & Evaluation Centre 
Forrester Road, St Marys NSW 2760 
P O Box: 315, St Marys NSW 1790 

Tel: 61 2 9673 8375 
Fax: 61 2 9673 8321 
Email: kao...@sg.adi-limited.com.au < mailto:kao...@sg.adi-limited.com.au> 

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RE: RELIABILITY TO MIL-HDBK-217

[Richard Cass]

Arun,
Contact:
RAC (Reliability Analysis Center) 
201 Mill St
Rome NY 13440

They are a research center that created 217 
They can be reached at: 
email: r...@iitri.org
web page: http://rac.iitri.org
phone: 800 526 4802 for publications
My real job (as opposed to my part time EMC/safety job) is reliability so if
I can be of any help let me know.

Good luck
Richard Cass
Iris Graphics
Bedford MA
reply to:
richard_c...@iris.scitex.com
-Original Message-
From: roger.vi...@wwgsolutions.com [mailto:roger.vi...@wwgsolutions.com]
Sent: Friday, July 30, 1999 6:28 AM
To: Arun Kaore
Cc: 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org'
Subject: Re: RELIABILITY TO MIL-HDBK-217





Arun,

I don't have the price for the MIL std, but services or software to predict
MTBF
using MIL-HDBK-217 or Bellcore data are available from:

Amoruso Island: http://www.frontpagepro.com/amoroso/rel_eng.htm
Relex : http://www.innovsw.com/index.htm  or
http://www.relexsoftware.com/

The complete SW package from Relex costs about $10k including the database

Bellcore is more suited to commercial products.

Siemens Germany also have a SW package called EXAR costing DM6500 but I have
no
contact info.

Roger Viles
Group Standards Manager
Wavetek Wandel Goltermann



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RE: EU Authorized Representative

[Nick Evans]

Nick

Having been in the business of helping companies deal with European and
international compliance issues for over 10 years I would have to disagree
somewhat with your comments.   Some of the following comments are going to
come very close to looking like advertising for which I apologise in
advance.

The most (only appropriate) organisation responsible for initially
demonstrating and maintaining compliance for a particular product is the
Design Authority (ie the company responsible for the product design).In
a properly run manufacturing system, any and all design changes should be
routed through the design authority for approval prior to implementation.
Decisions relating to possible effect on compliance, etc can only really be
made by the Design Authority.

However, it has to be recognised that compliance issues are not always so
well recognised within all organisations responsible for product design from
both a procedural and technical viewpoint and that is largely why companies
like ours and yours exist.It is also the reason why many organisations
have their own in-house compliance departments.

The provision of advice and services relating to the collation, storage and
distribution of technical files and compliance documents can be as valuable
a service for certain companies as the provision of technical advice and
testing, etc and you should not dismiss this out of hand.   Many of our
customers appreciate the help and advise we provide to them in preparing and
maintaining systems and documentation to enable them to demonstrate and
maintain compliance.  I am sure that other organisations have similar
satisfied customers.

As a service we do "hold" compliance documentation here in the UK for
certain companies located outside of Europe that feel it useful to have a
European compliance representative.This can provide practical benefits
to companies in allowing a central point local to the European market that
they can point their customers, etc towards to answer compliance queries.
We can then help to keep all interested parties up to date with compliance
requirements and a particular product's status with respect to those
requirements.This service brings real value to certain of our customers
and we are kept very busy on an ongoing basis with this kind of work.   Of
course many of our customers do not require this kind of service.

Where I would agree with you, however, is this is not a simple "give us your
money and documentation and we provide you a filing cabinet" kind of
service.  It is also not generally the requirement on the part of customers
to have a "sitting duck" they can point authorities to.We have ongoing
relationships and appropriate contracts with our customers and work as their
Compliance Department, managing compliance work and supporting them fully.
I have to say that we do not generally sign Declarations of Conformity
unless we are also the Design authority for the product and it is
appropriate to do so.   Rather we guide the relevant personnel within our
customer's companies to ensure that they have taken appropriate steps to
prepare and sign Declarations based on sound engineering data.  This is
completely analogous to an in-house compliance department role and, as I
say, a valuable service for certain companies.

As in all things, companies looking to outsource any aspect of compliance
work (or any work for that matter) including "Authorised Representative"
services should be clear about their requirements and look to suppliers that
have a proven track record in the required discipline.   We turn away a lot
of potential customers that believe they "legally" need a particular service
when in fact they don't and there is no practical advantage to the customer
in buying the service.

I'll get down off my soapbox now!!

Nick Evans
Managing Director
Genesys IBS Ltd
Product Design & Compliance For World-wide Markets
Tel: +44 1600 710301
Fax: +44 1600 710300
e-mail: nick_evans_gene...@msn.com
web: www.gentel.co.uk


-Original Message-
From:   owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
[mailto:owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org] On Behalf Of Nick Williams
Sent:   30 July 1999 12:23
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org; dlo...@advanced-input.com
Subject:RE: EU Authorized Representative


It could be argued that Nostrum are a competitor of Conformance, so you may
want to treat my comments with caution, but I would disagree most strongly
with what was said by them on this.

The only directive which REQUIRES appointment of a representative within
the EU is the Medical Devices Directive. In all other cases the definition
of who is responsible for CE marking if the manufacturer is not based
within the EU is left (deliberately ?) unclear. Also, and I have said this
before on the EMC-PSTC forum, remember that it is the local regulations and
enforcement in each member state which determine what legal action will be
taken against you. It is wrong to believe that there 

fwd: That doesn't make any sense

[bma]

Jack,

IMHO, how to convince and establish constructive relations with managers 
and other team members is a big challenge for an experienced EMC engineer. 
If unfortunately failed, we should improve our communication skills even 
though we were correct in terms of insisting our professional integrity. 
There's something similar to the difference between IQ and EQ. 

Does it make sense? Please correct me.

Best Regards,
Barry Ma
-
Original Text
From: "Schanker, Jack" , on 7/30/99 8:00 
AM:
To: 

Rich:

I want to thank you, and compliment you, for so accurately describing
managment reactions to regulatory "problems" in your July 20 posting to the
emc-pstc.

It completely mirrors my own past (and continuing) experiences.

I have also gotten the reaction "well, that doesn't make any sense" in
relation to an inconvenient rule in some international standard. "Why did
they do that" ? is asked, like I should know.

Then the big question: "Can we get a waiver"?

Dialogue:

"No, I don't think so." Manager: "Did you try"?

The years of experience and intuitive feel for what is and what is not
possible, mean little to the uninformed arrogance of a manager who is used
to having it his way (almost always "his") and expecting the world to turn
at his command.

The "bad news" aspect also looms large, as you so aptly describe.

Gotta get back to work.

Jack

Jacob Z. Schanker, P.E.
Director of Agency Compliance
Adaptive Broadband Corporation
175 Science Parkway
Rochester, NY 14620 USA
+716 242 8454 (voice)
+716 241 5590 (fax)
jschan...@adaptivebroadband.com

The opinions expressed above are obviously someone else's.

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RE: Operator Interface Displays

[Darrell Locke (MSMail)]

Typically the default is the light industrial immunity standard EN50082-1
which calls out IEC 1000-4-2 for ESD.  Levels can be up to 15kV.  Air
discharge is used on insulating surfaces such the keyboard, and contact of
metal surfaces.  In my expereince most testing is done with the air
discharge tip.  The indirect testing can be troublesome too, especially with
cables.  We usually test to the highest level 15kV.  Particular standards
such as medical may change this.

Darrell Locke
Advanced Input Devices
 --
From: Biggs, Daniel (IndSys, GEFanuc, NA)
To: 'EMC forum'
Subject: Operator Interface Displays
List-Post: emc-pstc@listserv.ieee.org
Date: Friday, July 30, 1999 7:01AM


Does anyone know of a standard that talks about the testing requirements on
a display/keyboard interface.  I am interested in knowing what kind of ESD
tests to perform on it.  Are contact, air and indirect discharge necessary?
Does anyone have experience with Operator Interfaces?  Are there particular
levels that they have to meet?

DB



___

Daniel W. Biggs
Test Engineer
HW Development Process
Engineering Services
daniel.bi...@cho.ge.com


GE Fanuc Automation
PO Box 8106
Charlottesville, VA  22906
PH:  (804) 978-6946
Fax:  (804) 978-5588


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RE: Operator Interface Displays

[Gary McInturff]

The standard IEC-801-2/EN set describes ESD testing in general for ITE type
equipment but I think they are woefully lacking when you are talking about
operator interfaces and things people touch. The rear of a computer cabinet
is a lot less susceptible IMO that something that people have to touch to
use on a regular basis. Human's are really just a big bag of electronic
charge pus, just waiting to transfer the charge.
When dealing with these issues I have always used 12 K minimum without no
errors, 16 K with no operator intervention errors and up to 20K with no
destruction. Interestingly enough those companies that generally have strong
design departments that I have worked with have similar requirements.
If your building industrial control equipment you may want to up those a tad
as well, 16 k with no errors. The consequences of sending a wrong code via
the interface to the equipment is generally a much bigger deal that an
computer user having to re-type some information.
Gary

-Original Message-
From:   Biggs, Daniel (IndSys, GEFanuc, NA)
[SMTP:bigg...@gemischova.ge.com]
Sent:   Friday, July 30, 1999 7:01 AM
To: 'EMC forum'
Subject:Operator Interface Displays


Does anyone know of a standard that talks about the testing
requirements on
a display/keyboard interface.  I am interested in knowing what kind
of ESD
tests to perform on it.  Are contact, air and indirect discharge
necessary?
Does anyone have experience with Operator Interfaces?  Are there
particular
levels that they have to meet?

DB



___

Daniel W. Biggs
Test Engineer
HW Development Process
Engineering Services
daniel.bi...@cho.ge.com


GE Fanuc Automation
PO Box 8106
Charlottesville, VA  22906
PH:  (804) 978-6946  
Fax:  (804) 978-5588


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NEBS' Information Request

[Carmen.Filimon]

Hello Ladies and Gentlemen,

I'm looking for information about NEBS compliance. I know there are 3
criteria levels for NEBS compliance devised by Bellcore, to ensure that
telecommunication equipment is suitable for the customers needs and to
reduce the time and expenses for the manufacturers. Are they voluntary or
regulatory testing requirements for telecommunication field in North America
and/or EU?
 
Please, any appropriate link would be useful for me. Thank you in advance
for your help,

Best regards,

Carmen Filimon,
Safety Test Engineer,
Leitch Technology Int'l 
E-mail: carmen.fili...@leitch.com


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RE: That doesn't make any sense

[Gorodetsky, Vitaly]

How come I have not seen the original Rich's message posted on July 20? 


> -Original Message-
> From: Schanker, Jack [SMTP:jschan...@adaptivebroadband.com]
> Sent: Friday, July 30, 1999 6:37 AM
> To:   ri...@sdd.hp.com
> Cc:   emc-p...@ieee.org
> Subject:  That  doesn't make any sense
> 
> 
> Rich:
> 
> I want to thank you, and compliment you, for so accurately describing
> managment reactions to regulatory "problems" in your July 20 posting to
> the
> emc-pstc.
> 
> It completely mirrors my own past (and continuing) experiences.
> 
> I have also gotten the reaction "well, that doesn't make any sense" in
> relation to an inconvenient rule in some international standard. "Why did
> they do that" ? is asked, like I should know.
> 
> Then the big question: "Can we get a waiver"?
> 
> Dialogue:
> 
> "No, I don't think so." Manager: "Did you try"?
> 
> The years of experience and intuitive feel for what is and what is not
> possible, mean little to the uninformed arrogance of a manager who is used
> to having it his way (almost always "his") and expecting the world to turn
> at his command.
> 
> The "bad news" aspect also looms large, as you so aptly describe.
> 
> Gotta get back to work.
> 
> Jack
> 
> Jacob Z. Schanker, P.E.
> Director of Agency Compliance
> Adaptive Broadband Corporation
> 175 Science Parkway
> Rochester, NY 14620 USA
> +716 242 8454 (voice)
> +716 241 5590 (fax)
> jschan...@adaptivebroadband.com
> 
> The opinions expressed above are obviously someone else's.
> 
> -
> This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list.
> To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org
> with the single line: "unsubscribe emc-pstc" (without the
> quotes).  For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com,
> jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or
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> 

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NEBS' Information

[Carmen.Filimon]

Hello Ladies and Gentlemen,

I'm looking for information about NEBS compliance. I know there are 3
criteria levels for NEBS compliance devised by Bellcore, to ensure that
telecommunication equipment is suitable for the customers needs and to
reduce the time and expenses for the manufacturers. Are they voluntary or
regulatory testing requirements for telecommunication field in North America
and/or EU?
 
Please, any appropriate link would be useful for me. Thank you in advance
for your help,

Best regards,

Carmen Filimon,
Safety Test Engineer,
Leitch Technology Int'l 
E-mail: carmen.fili...@leitch.com

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RE: cost effective EMC facility

[Gary McInturff]

TEM cells large enough for a very small computer are, I believe, available.
I don't have the sales literature in front of me and I haven't seen it for
awhile, but in my opinion you would be better served if you invest in
pre-compliance equipment, a small ground screen etc, even with a less than
ideal site.
Both units will take time for you to learn how to interpret the data and how
it compares with the OATS you'll eventually have to us. The TEM cell will
required constant manipulation of the unit to expose the various fronts to
the "antenna". 
The pre-compliance equipment is going to have some problems because of
ambient noises and lack of a proper environment, ground screen, full antenna
mast height, etc. But I think you can get closer to the OATS with this
equipment if you can control the electrical ambient at all, and you have
considerably more flexibility at working on the EUT etc during this phase of
testing.
Either of these methods are only going to give you an A/B type test with
just enough information to make a good educated guess as to when you are
ready to go for a formal test, but having used both methods - the TEM cell
much less - I'd much prefer the small parking lot type of pre-compliance
system.
That obviously is a personal opinion. Neither my wife or children listen to
it so maybe you shouldn't either.
Thanks
Gary

-Original Message-
From:   Green, Henry [SMTP:henry.gr...@gateway.com]
Sent:   Friday, July 30, 1999 6:08 AM
To: 'Qu Pingyu'; 'emc'
Subject:RE: cost effective EMC facility


I do not believe that the GTEM is a suitable option for testing a PC
due to
the size limitations of the GTEM. The GTEM has, for lack of a better
term, a
"sweet spot" that the EUT has to occupy for optimum results.
Although you
might be able to place your EUT in the GTEM, it would not
necessarily be
confined to this "sweet spot." This being the case, the
repeatability, and
accuracy of your measurements would be questionable. Another
consideration
is the requirement that you have correlation to an OATS. Just my
2-cents
worth.
Henry E. Green
Gateway Regulatory Compliance

-Original Message-
From:   Qu Pingyu [mailto:pin...@ime.org.sg]
Sent:   Friday, July 30, 1999 3:38 AM
To: 'emc'
Subject:cost effective EMC facility


Hello, everyone:

I posted an question several weeks ago asking about
GTEM.
Thanks those who
share with me your experience. I may not address my
problem
very clearly
thus I would like to come back to you one more time.

We are a R & D orgnization in Singapore mainly
dealing with
semiconductor
industry. Since there are some requirements from our
industry partners in
the area of EMC design, we are considering setting
up some
EMC measurement
capabilities. At the intial stage, we will only
consider
equipment for
radiated emission/susceptibility testing. Our
objective is
to evaluate the
EMC performance of the product from our customers,
being of
PCB level or
system level. Based on those results, we can help
our
customers to improve
their product EMC design so that their product can
pass the
final compliance
testing. The EUT could be small, such as integrated
circuits
on PCB, but it
can also be large such as a PC. Due to our budget
constraint, I think GTEM
maybe a good choice. Do you guys agree ? If not, any
other
suggestions ?  

Thanks in advance.

Best Regards

Qu Pingyu


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RE: RELIABILITY TO MIL-HDBK-217

[Brumbaugh, David]

Information Handling Services has it. (There may be a subscription fee required 
to use their services.) It can be downloaded in PDF, GIF or TIFF. A search 
result at their site will bring up the most recent change. However, all 
previous versions of the document are available by clicking on Document 
Summary, and scrolling to the bottom of the page, where links to all the 
previous released versions are listed.

Here is the link to IHS:

http://www.ihs.com/ihsgroup.html

Hope this helps.
DB
> --
> From: Arun Kaore[SMTP:kao...@sg.adi-limited.com.au]
> Sent: Thursday, July 29, 1999 5:36 PM
> To:   'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org'
> Subject:  RELIABILITY TO MIL-HDBK-217
> 
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> Could someone guide me on where to down load from the net or purchase the
> latest version of MIL-HDBK-217 and approximately how much it would cost. It
> is a Reliability/MTBF related issue.
> 
> Thanks in advance.
>  
> Regards
> 
> Arun Kaore
> EMC Engineer
> 
> ADI Limited
> Systems Group
> Test & Evaluation Centre
> Forrester Road, St Marys NSW 2760
> P O Box: 315, St Marys NSW 1790
> 
> Tel: 61 2 9673 8375
> Fax: 61 2 9673 8321
> Email: kao...@sg.adi-limited.com.au  
> 
> -
> This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list.
> To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org
> with the single line: "unsubscribe emc-pstc" (without the
> quotes).  For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com,
> jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or
> roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
> 
> 

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Re: cost effective EMC facility

[Lfresearch]

Hi,

I've got to hedge against testing objects with wiring in a GTEM. They are 
great for Cell Phones and the like. Attach wiring and results can differ 
greatly from a shield room test.

Derek Walton

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Rockwell Modem, need info.?

[SparacinoG]

Good Day Everyone,

I'm having a heck of a time getting compliance information from Rockwell
regarding one of their Socket Modems
(SMV144AC series). We incorporratte this modem onto our motherboard. Simply,
I need to know if the Rockwell modem that we use in our product has been
recognized to either UL 1459 or UL 1950. I would like to treat the modem as
a recognized component in my system.

No compliance info on their literature, so I contacted the local Rockwell
office in Littleton, Ma.  and they referred me back to our distributor who
has not been able to get a response back from Rockwell...  Also, I contacted
Rockwell headquarters in Newport Beach, CA ... they referred me to their
local office in Littleton.  Are we sensing a pattern here ??

If anyone has the name & contact info of someone at Rockwell that can help,
please forward to me.

Thanks for any help you can give me & have a Great Weekend.
George


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RE: RELIABILITY TO MIL-HDBK-217

[Robert Walch]

I have a copy I received snail mail from "Document Center" (415) 591 - 7600.
Not sure if they still exist.  My copy is about 5 years old.  I would do a
web search for the DoD.  As one of the other replies stated Bellcore would
be better for commercial components.  MIL-HDBK-217 is unrealistically brutal
on Commercial Components.  It still is stuck in the 70's.  


Best Regards,

Robert Walch
Chief Engineer
VI-Olathe
(913) 829 - 1777 x133
rwa...@vectron.com  

-Original Message-
From:   Arun Kaore [SMTP:kao...@sg.adi-limited.com.au]
Sent:   Thursday, July 29, 1999 7:36 PM
To: 'emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org'
Subject:RELIABILITY TO MIL-HDBK-217


Hi all,

Could someone guide me on where to down load from the net or
purchase the
latest version of MIL-HDBK-217 and approximately how much it would
cost. It
is a Reliability/MTBF related issue.

Thanks in advance.
 
Regards

Arun Kaore
EMC Engineer

ADI Limited
Systems Group
Test & Evaluation Centre
Forrester Road, St Marys NSW 2760
P O Box: 315, St Marys NSW 1790

Tel: 61 2 9673 8375
Fax: 61 2 9673 8321
Email: kao...@sg.adi-limited.com.au
 

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Operator Interface Displays

[Biggs, Daniel (IndSys, GEFanuc, NA)]

Does anyone know of a standard that talks about the testing requirements on
a display/keyboard interface.  I am interested in knowing what kind of ESD
tests to perform on it.  Are contact, air and indirect discharge necessary?
Does anyone have experience with Operator Interfaces?  Are there particular
levels that they have to meet?

DB



___

Daniel W. Biggs
Test Engineer
HW Development Process
Engineering Services
daniel.bi...@cho.ge.com


GE Fanuc Automation
PO Box 8106
Charlottesville, VA  22906
PH:  (804) 978-6946  
Fax:  (804) 978-5588


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That doesn't make any sense

[Schanker, Jack]

Rich:

I want to thank you, and compliment you, for so accurately describing
managment reactions to regulatory "problems" in your July 20 posting to the
emc-pstc.

It completely mirrors my own past (and continuing) experiences.

I have also gotten the reaction "well, that doesn't make any sense" in
relation to an inconvenient rule in some international standard. "Why did
they do that" ? is asked, like I should know.

Then the big question: "Can we get a waiver"?

Dialogue:

"No, I don't think so." Manager: "Did you try"?

The years of experience and intuitive feel for what is and what is not
possible, mean little to the uninformed arrogance of a manager who is used
to having it his way (almost always "his") and expecting the world to turn
at his command.

The "bad news" aspect also looms large, as you so aptly describe.

Gotta get back to work.

Jack

Jacob Z. Schanker, P.E.
Director of Agency Compliance
Adaptive Broadband Corporation
175 Science Parkway
Rochester, NY 14620 USA
+716 242 8454 (voice)
+716 241 5590 (fax)
jschan...@adaptivebroadband.com

The opinions expressed above are obviously someone else's.

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RE: EU Authorized Representative

[Nick Williams]

It could be argued that Nostrum are a competitor of Conformance, so you may
want to treat my comments with caution, but I would disagree most strongly
with what was said by them on this.

The only directive which REQUIRES appointment of a representative within
the EU is the Medical Devices Directive. In all other cases the definition
of who is responsible for CE marking if the manufacturer is not based
within the EU is left (deliberately ?) unclear. Also, and I have said this
before on the EMC-PSTC forum, remember that it is the local regulations and
enforcement in each member state which determine what legal action will be
taken against you. It is wrong to believe that there is any more
consistency in this area of law than there is in any other - and it is also
wrong to generalise about the requirements of all the CE mark directives on
the basis of what is written in one of them.  In my experience the complex
realities of actual relationships between manufacturers, importers,
distributors and customers make any attempt at generalising on this issue
completely fruitless.

My company, Conformance, has been providing CE marking consultancy longer
than most. We have looked at providing 'authorised representative' services
for non EU based manufacturers and have concluded that, even in the case of
medical devices, it cannot be done. Being able to fulfil the role of
authorised representative is not simply a question of being a (paid)
sitting duck for the authorities. It is clear to us that this job can only
be done by someone who has a long lasting and deeply detailed involvement
with the manufacture of the product concerned. CE marking is not simply
about making a product meet the requirements of a few standards at the time
it is designed - it is about having a complete overview of the manufacture
and use of a product over its whole life.

The person responsible for signing the Declaration of Conformity has to
have enough clout with the manufacturer to know what any actions taken by
the design, production, sales or purchasing departments of the manufacturer
will mean to the status of the product under the CE mark directives, not
just now, but for the whole of a product's production life (and arguably
for ten years after that). It is difficult enough for a wholly owned
subsidiary to keep track of these things. To expect an external contractor
such as a consultancy to be able to do it flies completely in the face of
the realities of the situation.

I would caution you to be very wary of getting involved in 'authorised
representative service' arrangements  - they are legally unproven and my
opinion are unnecessary. In the long term they are unlikely to provide you
with what you think you are paying for.

Nick.




At 15:10 -0400 29/7/99, Andrews, Kurt wrote:
>Darrell,
>
>As far as I know an importer can be the "authorized representative". I have
>received some information from a company called Nostrum Associates that
>includes the following:
>
>Many Directives have a requirement for CE marking; the mark signifies that
>the article is in conformity with all relevant Directives. To be effective
>legislation must be enforceable, and someone held accountable. In the case
>of European Directives this person is given the title of "responsible
>person". A "responsible person" must have a legal presence in Europe, and
>must declare in writing that all the relevant requirements of the directives
>have been met.
>
>A typical definition for a "responsible person" appears in the Machinery
>Directive. In the section dealing with interpretation, it states that the
>responsible person may be the manufacturer, the manufacturer's authorized
>representative or, failing all else, the person who first supplies the
>machinery in the Community (the importer) Common to all is the requirement
>for the "person" to be established in the Community, otherwise it would be
>impossible to enforce the law.
>
>It is possible that a USA manufacturer has authorized an agent to market a
>particular product in Europe. This does not automatically make the agent the
>"authorized representative" in respect of Council Directives. For a person
>to act as an "authorized representative" and attract the duties of the
>"responsible person" he must be formally appointed in writing by the
>manufacturer. The letter of appointment must state clearly the
>manufacturer's obligations under the directives for which he is delegating
>responsibility to his authorized representative. This presupposes that the
>manufacturer and the person appointed as agent are aware of the requirements
>of the directives. Unless the manufacturer and the agent have expertise in
>this field this is unlikely to be the case.
>
>
>This company, Nostrum Associates, also states the following:
>
>Nostrum will act as the "authorized representative" providing the European
>base necessary to ensure compliance with the duties imposed on suppliers of
>equipment. Nostrum Associates will assist in c

RE: cost effective EMC facility

[Green, Henry]

I do not believe that the GTEM is a suitable option for testing a PC due to
the size limitations of the GTEM. The GTEM has, for lack of a better term, a
"sweet spot" that the EUT has to occupy for optimum results. Although you
might be able to place your EUT in the GTEM, it would not necessarily be
confined to this "sweet spot." This being the case, the repeatability, and
accuracy of your measurements would be questionable. Another consideration
is the requirement that you have correlation to an OATS. Just my 2-cents
worth.
Henry E. Green
Gateway Regulatory Compliance

-Original Message-
From:   Qu Pingyu [mailto:pin...@ime.org.sg]
Sent:   Friday, July 30, 1999 3:38 AM
To: 'emc'
Subject:cost effective EMC facility


Hello, everyone:

I posted an question several weeks ago asking about GTEM.
Thanks those who
share with me your experience. I may not address my problem
very clearly
thus I would like to come back to you one more time.

We are a R & D orgnization in Singapore mainly dealing with
semiconductor
industry. Since there are some requirements from our
industry partners in
the area of EMC design, we are considering setting up some
EMC measurement
capabilities. At the intial stage, we will only consider
equipment for
radiated emission/susceptibility testing. Our objective is
to evaluate the
EMC performance of the product from our customers, being of
PCB level or
system level. Based on those results, we can help our
customers to improve
their product EMC design so that their product can pass the
final compliance
testing. The EUT could be small, such as integrated circuits
on PCB, but it
can also be large such as a PC. Due to our budget
constraint, I think GTEM
maybe a good choice. Do you guys agree ? If not, any other
suggestions ?  

Thanks in advance.

Best Regards

Qu Pingyu


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RE: EMF Test Data (Cancer and EMF)

[rbusche]

It was the latter, I was just trying to be polite and non judgmental. :-)

-Original Message-
From:   Gorodetsky, Vitaly [mailto:vgorodet...@canoga.com]
Sent:   Wednesday, July 28, 1999 5:08 PM
To: 'rbus...@es.com'; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject:RE: EMF Test Data (Cancer and EMF)

All compliance practitioners recognize the difference
between "improper
testing" and "data (expedient) misinterpretation".  What was
it?

> -Original Message-
> From: rbus...@es.com [SMTP:rbus...@es.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 1999 2:22 PM
> To:   emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
> Subject:  EMF Test Data (Cancer and EMF)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Attached is a link to a recent MSNBC article concerning
improper testing
> with regard to cancer and EMF. Thought some of you might
be interested.
> 
> Rick
> 
> 
> http://www.msnbc.com/news/293056.asp
>  
> 
> -
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> 

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Fwd: EU Authorised Representatives

[Metse]

In a message dated 7/30/99 5:55:14 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
a...@safety.demon.co.uk writes:

<< emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org >>

Many of  the members and professional services participating in this group 
resist this type of advertisement. 
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Darrell & members.

Authorised Representatives Ltd. specialize in providing support 
and 'Authorised Representative' status for importers into the EU.

Our background experience is in European and International 
certification and we can provide a total package of advice,
management services and legal support to our clients.

Given involvement at an early stage in a products conception we can 
also advise on 'product globalisation', optimising certification 
requirements and gaining marketing advantage in particular areas.

For further information see MS Word 6 attachment - (1 page leaflet)
or,  visit our website http://www.arl.demon.co.uk

Regards   Eric.

*  Authorised Representitives Ltd. *
 *  a...@safety.demon.co.uk*


The following section of this message contains a file attachment
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If you are using Pegasus Mail, or any another MIME-compliant system,
you should be able to save it or view it from within your mailer.
If you cannot, please ask your system administrator for assistance.

    File information ---
 File:  ARL_LFT2.DOC
 Date:  30 Jul 1999, 8:52
 Size:  10240 bytes.
 Type:  MS-Word-6


ARL_LFT2.DOC
Description: Binary data
--- End Message ---

Re: RELIABILITY TO MIL-HDBK-217

[roger . viles]

Arun,

I don't have the price for the MIL std, but services or software to predict MTBF
using MIL-HDBK-217 or Bellcore data are available from:

Amoruso Island: http://www.frontpagepro.com/amoroso/rel_eng.htm
Relex : http://www.innovsw.com/index.htm  or
http://www.relexsoftware.com/

The complete SW package from Relex costs about $10k including the database

Bellcore is more suited to commercial products.

Siemens Germany also have a SW package called EXAR costing DM6500 but I have no
contact info.

Roger Viles
Group Standards Manager
Wavetek Wandel Goltermann



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Re: EU Authorised Representatives

[Eric Monk.]

Hi Darrell & members.

Authorised Representatives Ltd. specialize in providing support 
and 'Authorised Representative' status for importers into the EU.

Our background experience is in European and International 
certification and we can provide a total package of advice,
management services and legal support to our clients.

Given involvement at an early stage in a products conception we can 
also advise on 'product globalisation', optimising certification 
requirements and gaining marketing advantage in particular areas.

For further information see MS Word 6 attachment - (1 page leaflet)
or,  visit our website http://www.arl.demon.co.uk

Regards   Eric.

*  Authorised Representitives Ltd. *
 *  a...@safety.demon.co.uk*
The following section of this message contains a file attachment
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If you cannot, please ask your system administrator for assistance.

    File information ---
 File:  ARL_LFT2.DOC
 Date:  30 Jul 1999, 8:52
 Size:  10240 bytes.
 Type:  MS-Word-6


ARL_LFT2.DOC
Description: MS-Word document

Design for EMC & Safety Compliance - Free Workshop / Seminar in UK

[roger . viles]

If any EMC-PSTC readers in the west of England need help designing products to
meet CE and similar requirements, read on!

On Tue 14 September a FREE Seminar, Workshop and Exhibition is being held in
Exeter, Devon. This is organised by the CE Forum West (formerly an EMC Club) and
will offer expert help and advice in several forms:
   Talk on the Design Process - designing for compliance
   Case Studies - real examples of problems and how they were overcome
   EMC Workshop - bring your problem product for investigation in the
   laboratory, with expert help at hand
   Compliance Surgery - opportunity for individual discussions with Competent
   Body, Notified Body, RECAB, etc
   Exhibition - suppliers of compliance-related components and test equipment

All this is free, and upon pre-registration (contact details below) you receive
a voucher for lunch.
Event summary:
DATE:  Tue 14 September 1999
TIME:  10 am till 4 pm
VENUE:University of Exeter, Devon, UK
CONTACT:  Exeter Enterprises Ltd., tel: 01392 214085, e-mail:
enterpri...@ex.ac.uk
TRAVEL:   See: http://www.ex.ac.uk/public_html/EXETER_DIRECTIONS.html

I hope to see some of you there!

Roger Viles
Group Standards Manager
Wavetek Wandel Goltermann



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cost effective EMC facility

[Qu Pingyu]

Hello, everyone:

I posted an question several weeks ago asking about GTEM. Thanks those who
share with me your experience. I may not address my problem very clearly
thus I would like to come back to you one more time.

We are a R & D orgnization in Singapore mainly dealing with semiconductor
industry. Since there are some requirements from our industry partners in
the area of EMC design, we are considering setting up some EMC measurement
capabilities. At the intial stage, we will only consider equipment for
radiated emission/susceptibility testing. Our objective is to evaluate the
EMC performance of the product from our customers, being of PCB level or
system level. Based on those results, we can help our customers to improve
their product EMC design so that their product can pass the final compliance
testing. The EUT could be small, such as integrated circuits on PCB, but it
can also be large such as a PC. Due to our budget constraint, I think GTEM
maybe a good choice. Do you guys agree ? If not, any other suggestions ?  

Thanks in advance.

Best Regards

Qu Pingyu


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Chile power plug

[jae won Yoo]

Dear everyone

I heard that Chile mandatory power plug according to CEI 2350 by September.
Does anyone know information about it?

James Yoo
jwon...@hotmail.com


__
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

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Re: NSA (using acid)

[Paul McCoy]

Brian,
The HCl (hydrochloric acid, muriatic acid) combines with the Zn coating
forming zinc chloride in place of the oxides also forming water and/or hydrogen
gas the reaction goes quickly to completion, the ZnCl is highly soluable and
washes or is blown away, leaving clean unoxidized zinc.
I don't know why you were cautioned not to rinse, I would have thought it
desirable, but the acid will preferentially eat the zinc coating because Zinc is
higher in the electrochemical reduction series than the underlying iron
(sacrificial anode).

Paul McCoy

Brian At Work wrote:

> A quick question.
>
> Between the muriatic acid and the acid flux that is used to clean the screen
> material, will water dilute the acid good enough to stop its reaction or
> should you use something like soda to counteract it? One responder said not
> to use water but to just blow it off with compressed air. Won't the acid
> continue to eat away at the material?
>
> Thanks,
> Brian
>
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RELIABILITY TO MIL-HDBK-217

[Arun Kaore]

Hi all,

Could someone guide me on where to down load from the net or purchase the
latest version of MIL-HDBK-217 and approximately how much it would cost. It
is a Reliability/MTBF related issue.

Thanks in advance.
 
Regards

Arun Kaore
EMC Engineer

ADI Limited
Systems Group
Test & Evaluation Centre
Forrester Road, St Marys NSW 2760
P O Box: 315, St Marys NSW 1790

Tel: 61 2 9673 8375
Fax: 61 2 9673 8321
Email: kao...@sg.adi-limited.com.au  

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Re: Fault Testing Electrolytic Capacitors

[bogdanmm]

Bob:
My ha'penny's worth:
What about increasing the voltage rating of the subject electrolytics? This
may be expensive, requiring costly capacitors. Something el cheapo: what
about a fuse on the input side of the cap?
Are the electrolytics by-passed with capacitors about 0.1 uF or less, with
short, wide leads? This would help with the higher frequency currents.
Please let me know what the final verdict will be.
Bogdan.

Bob Designer wrote:

> A company I represent has a problem with their switching power supply.
> A single point failure in the regulator can cause the output voltage to
> rise higher than the voltage ratings of the electrolytic capacitors. As
> a result, the capacitors are overstressed and fail in a variety of ways
> depending upon the capacitor venting method. Sometimes the vent will
> pop and that’s the end of it. Other times, the capacitor will overheat
> and expel ethylene glycol in the form of vapor or liquid. In some
> cases, the conductive fluid will bridge the primary circuits to earth
> causing a failure of the hypot test. This is unacceptable for IEC950
> compliance.
>
> I have spoken to several power supply designers and they inform me that
> it is common practice not to provide overvoltage protection. Of course,
> if that is true, then there appears to be a lot of power supplies in
> the world, perhaps including the one in my pc, that may or may not pass
> the fault testing of IEC950 depending on how the electrolytic
> capacitors fail. Obviously, my client does not want the extra cost of
> adding overvoltage protection when it appears that others don’t do it.
>
> I would appreciate your comments concerning this failure mode, the use
> or non-use of protective circuits, and passing the IEC950 fault test if
> a protective circuit is not used.
>
> Regards, Bob
>
> _
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com
>
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Re: Fault Testing Electrolytic Capacitors

[HAhmadi]

Bob,

Could you let us know the power rating of the power supply and also the
topology of the power supply? I have not heard about such a failure as
shorting the regulator should not affect the primary DC cap? More
information would be helpful.

Thanks
Homi Ahamdi
Cortech Systems



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