Re: [Emc-users] Touch off for z axis is -.0695????

2009-04-18 Thread Kirk Wallace
On Fri, 2009-04-17 at 22:45 -0700, Michael Jones wrote:
 Whenever I position my z axis where I want my G54 zero point the  
 relative position reads -.0695 instead of zero?
 
 I can't find this setting anywhere in the system.. or at least  
 anywhere I have thought to look..
 
 Where can I set my z zero point to 0.00
 
 Thanks,
 
 - Michael

You might check your the .var file for the setup that you are running.
The file will be in your emc2 directory, something like
/home/your_username/emc2/configs/your_machine_config/something.var 

This document explains what some of these variables are:
http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html/gcode_coordinates.html#r1_3 

http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html//common_machining_center.html#sub:Parameters
 
short version: http://alturl.com/ftvb 

Your -0.0695 might be in there?

Here is another page about coordinates:
http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?CoordinateSystems 

-- 
Kirk Wallace
http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/
http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/index.html
California, USA


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Re: [Emc-users] Joypad as a pendant - help?

2009-04-18 Thread Peter blodow


Hello John,
please look at the time setting of your PC. I received this mail with 
sending date 17.04.2004!
Peter Blodow


At 14:25 17.04.2004, you wrote:


On 17 Apr 2009 at 1:06, Michael Jones wrote:

  Does anyone have a good example of a HAL file for a joypad that I
  can
  build on.

This should get you going.

http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Simple_Remote_Pendant

John

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[Emc-users] EMC booth at NAMES

2009-04-18 Thread Steve Stallings
EMC is off to a great start at NAMES.

The guys were there Friday doing setup. The EMCO
F1 mill looks nice, but the real attention getter will be 
nice banner and all the enlarged photos of user's
systems. About 50 square feet of them hanging around
the booth up nice and high where folks can see them 
from across the room. Good work guys!

Now for some coffee and off to downtown for the 
first day of the show. I brought extra computers and
plan on roping Matt Shaver into bringing  up the
beta release to play with in my booth.

Cheers,
Steve Stallings
www.PMDX.com


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Re: [Emc-users] EMC booth at NAMES

2009-04-18 Thread John Guenther
That is great news Steve, wish I could have gone this year.  Someone
posted some photos last night on one of the Yahoo groups, but none of
the EMC booth or any of the vendor booths.  I hope someone there takes
some photos of the EMC booth that can be posted somewhere for all the
world to see.

I hope you have a good show and a safe trip home.
-  
John Guenther
'Ye Olde Pen Maker'
Sterling, Virginia


On Sat, 2009-04-18 at 06:14 -0400, Steve Stallings wrote:
 EMC is off to a great start at NAMES.
 
 The guys were there Friday doing setup. The EMCO
 F1 mill looks nice, but the real attention getter will be 
 nice banner and all the enlarged photos of user's
 systems. About 50 square feet of them hanging around
 the booth up nice and high where folks can see them 
 from across the room. Good work guys!
 
 Now for some coffee and off to downtown for the 
 first day of the show. I brought extra computers and
 plan on roping Matt Shaver into bringing  up the
 beta release to play with in my booth.
 
 Cheers,
 Steve Stallings
 www.PMDX.com
 
 
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Re: [Emc-users] New user interface development question.

2009-04-18 Thread John Guenther
Jeff,

Thanks, that helps a lot. 
-  
John Guenther
'Ye Olde Pen Maker'
Sterling, Virginia


On Fri, 2009-04-17 at 21:15 -0500, Jeff Epler wrote:
 On Fri, Apr 17, 2009 at 07:50:46PM -0400, John Guenther wrote:
  Thanks Jeff, I went looking for pydoc.emc and could not find it on my
  emc2=2.3.0 installation.  Where does one find this typically?  I did a
  find on the entire machine and did not come up with it
 
 pydoc emc is a command to type in the terminal.  On my system it
 displays a lot of information, starting:
 
 $ pydoc emc
 Help on module emc:
 
 NAME
 emc - Interface to EMC
 
 FILE
 /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/emc.so
 [...]
 class command(__builtin__.object)
  |  Methods defined here:
  |  
  |  __init__(...)
  |  x.__init__(...) initializes x; see x.__class__.__doc__ for 
 signature
  |  
  |  abort(...)
  |  
  |  auto(...)
  |  
  |  brake(...)
 [...]
 ... it lists every command you can send, though it doesn't give
 information on the command's argument list.
 
 Jeff
 
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Re: [Emc-users] EMC booth at NAMES

2009-04-18 Thread Peter blodow
Hello Gentlemen,
for a trip to the fair it's too far across the ocean, so I wish you all 
from afar a succesful expo and a lot of questions from interested people. 
Thanks for all the effort of the participants as well as for the 
programmers who made (and make) this EMC2 System possible!

Peter Blodow


At 12:14 18.04.2009, you wrote:
EMC is off to a great start at NAMES.

The guys were there Friday doing setup. The EMCO
F1 mill looks nice, but the real attention getter will be
nice banner and all the enlarged photos of user's
systems. About 50 square feet of them hanging around
the booth up nice and high where folks can see them
from across the room. Good work guys!

Now for some coffee and off to downtown for the
first day of the show. I brought extra computers and
plan on roping Matt Shaver into bringing  up the
beta release to play with in my booth.

Cheers,
Steve Stallings
www.PMDX.com


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Re: [Emc-users] What's coming in manufacturing

2009-04-18 Thread Ray Henry

On Fri, 2009-04-17 at 22:02 -0500, Stuart Stevenson wrote:
 why could you 'not go commercial'?
 
 On Fri, Apr 17, 2009 at 7:26 PM, Jim Fleig - CNC Services
 j...@cncservices.ws wrote:

  Any comments Ray H. ...?

Now that I'm retired, I don't have much time left over from business.
My 0.00401k investment plan certainly isn't going to feed me.  Even all
the paperwork won't burn long enough to warm my hands in April. 

Just a bit of history here.  Nearly all of the larger open-source
projects have legal entities associated with them.  Some of these count
annual value in billions of US dollars.  In all of the projects I've
looked at, the process of developing that legal entity was a cause for
some tension among the developers and adherents.  At the same time those
entities have facilitated systematic development. 

I argued at several annual board meetings, most notably during the
annual meeting of the board at the first Fest in Ann Arbor, that we
(EMC) needed such an entity to interface between developers and
commercial interests like Sherline and Smithy.  

Today there is a much more diversified commercial community surrounding
us.  I believe the need is greater now than then.  We would do well to
set up a legally recognized entity and establish folk who can relate to
and argue for each of the many kinds of activities we do and to which
our software is applied.  That entity should own things like
linuxcnc.org, the EMC2-CNC marks, and other stuff related to the work we
do.

Yes there will no doubt be some wrangling over cash and value but how
much more intense can it be than some of the sessions that JohnK and I
had over HAL.  We both are strong willed and I think John, and those
sessions produced some great results.  We really enjoyed fighting with
the Mazak, and winning.  Thanks to all who helped with it.

I believe we share a lot of good will toward each other.  Our formal and
informal meetings and our success stories have done a lot to mitigate
the ease with which web based groups can fall into divisive and
antagonistic posting.  EMC2 is AWESOME -- as are the folk that surround
it.

Long live Hoyt, CNC's anti-model.  May we never take that bait.

Rayh




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Re: [Emc-users] EMC booth at NAMES

2009-04-18 Thread Ray Henry
On Sat, 2009-04-18 at 15:11 +0200, Peter blodow wrote:
 Hello Gentlemen,
 for a trip to the fair it's too far across the ocean, so I wish you all 
 from afar a succesful expo and a lot of questions from interested people. 
 Thanks for all the effort of the participants as well as for the 
 programmers who made (and make) this EMC2 System possible!

Ich auch.  


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Re: [Emc-users] Hostmot2 - stepper signal invert

2009-04-18 Thread Rob Jansen
Thanks,

this works - I thought that only worked on standard output lines - not on
special function pins.
Sometimes I am thinking too complex...

Meanwhile I also added spindle control with a PWM output. I think the docs
are a bit outdated (or I just found the wrong ones).Some docs tell me the to
use dac.0.value (where PWMs are used to create DACs), another one mentions
pwmgen (but then use hm5i20 as a board type prefix whereas hostmot2 uses
hm2_5i20 as boardname. Nothing which cannot be fixed with a bit of logical
thinking.

Only thing to do now is to build a proper filter to get a linear analog
output - and publish my configs of course.

Cheers,
Rob

On Fri, Apr 17, 2009 at 6:56 PM, Sebastian Kuzminsky s...@highlab.comwrote:


 When you start emc2 and it loads the hostmot2 driver modules, it logs
 (in the syslog) the connector/pin and IO numbers it's using.  It'll
 look something like this:

 IO Pin 048 (P4-01): Stepgen #0, pin Step (Output)
 IO Pin 049 (P4-03): Stepgen #0, pin Dir (Output)

  From this you can take the IO pin number for your Dir signal (049 in
 this example) and invert the signal on that pin with a HAL command like
 this:

 setp hm2_5i20.0.gpio.049.invert_output 1

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Re: [Emc-users] What's coming in manufacturing

2009-04-18 Thread Jim Fleig - CNC Services
Hi Stuart,

Here's the short answer:

a programmer that can make changes (like a different GUI) for a retrofit, an 
individual that can either supply a computer or guide the selection and 
assembly of a computer and techinical support of the software and computer 
after the retrofit.

Here's the long answer:

I can do anything (not just bragging, its true - see www.cncservices.ws) 
with machine tools (rebuild, retrofit, align, calibrate (laser and level for 
6 axes of movement linear, pitch, yaw and roll around the X,Y and Z axes, 
spatial positioning measurement and compensation, 4th and 5th axis 
measurement and compensation), G code programming, troubleshooting 
(electrical, electronic, hydraulic, mechanical, pneumatic, etc.), 
communication (DNC, wired and wireless), scrapping, etc., etc.) except 
electronic board repair and software troubleshooting.  When troubleshooting 
a machine if I can prove that the machine is functioning correctly and I can 
demonstrate that the software is not issuing commands correctly to the 
machine then the problem is in the software or the hardware that runs the 
software.  With adequate technical support I can address these problems 
also.  Many of these problems I can address myself if a parameter needs to 
be changed (all of the controls that I have worked on so far are parameter 
based, Fanuc, Yasnac(Yaskawa), Mitsubishi, Centroid, etc.).  On more than 
one control I have replaced a hard drive, partitioned the hard drive, 
reloaded software, configured the software for the mill and got the mill up 
and running again with technical support.  In one of these situations I had 
to get the machine connected to the customers network so that parameters 
could be downloaded from the control to the customers office computer.  With 
instructions I set up a network connection (I am a computer user, not a 
computer technician).  I am willing to tackle that which I do not know (and 
do not have the time to learn, I just can't duplicate others knowledge and 
experience in many areas) if there is adequate technical support to address 
the problem.  I am not comfortable supplying a control system to a customer 
that does not have adequate technical support because the customer's machine 
could be down because I am unable to address a certain issue and unable to 
get the answer for the issue from technical support.  My customers trust 
that whatever I do for them will enable them to make parts and if the making 
of parts is interrupted that I will be able to get them back up and running 
promptly.

In my ideal world paid technical support would:

assist in the retrofit process by

- being a programmer that is comfortable with me not becoming a programmer
- being a programmer that is comfortable with me being the onsite hands 
while they are the brain guiding the hands (technical support)
- being a Linux enthusiast that will interact with the Windows world (all of 
my customers front offices are Windows based) without bashing Windows or 
Bill Gates in front of the customer (the machine control almost always have 
to be networked with the customers office computers for the transfer of 
programs)
- having the programming ability to create a different GUI for EMC that 
would be more industry standard (I have designed this GUI, it just needs to 
be programmed)
- having the programming ability and the people skills to talk me or a 
customer through entering software commands and reporting results so that 
issue of the moment can be identified and resolved
- an alternative to the previous step would be a direct connection via the 
internet to the machine tool control so that the programmer could remotely 
evaluate the computer
note:  I am willing to travel to be onsite whenever onsite activity needs to 
occur, the programmer would not be required to travel
- having the programming ability to make changes as needed so that EMC will 
function externally in a more industry standard manner (Ray H. generously 
took time from his very busy schedule to educate me about the momentary 
contact nature of the inputs to EMC because of the perspective when EMC was 
first created that there may be more than one control station on a single 
machine, apparently some of this could be accomplished through the ladder)

- advising me which hardware components to purchase (motherboard, memory, 
hard drive (or hard drive equivalent), power supply, etc.) to put together a 
computer and provide instruction on how to do so
- advising how to load software onto the computer
- advising how to configure the software to the machine (I would provide 
detailed list of machine functions)
- writing the ladder logic from my detailed list of machine functions or 
provide instruction how to write the ladder logic (I have written ladder 
logic for other systems)
OR
- providing a computer preloaded with the software and preconfigured per my 
detailed list of machine functions

- providing techinical support as the computer is 

Re: [Emc-users] What's coming in manufacturing

2009-04-18 Thread Stuart Stevenson
Jim,
   WHEW - Well, JIM, I did read to the end :)
   thanks for the explanation
   now we have a better target
thanks
Stuart


On Sat, Apr 18, 2009 at 1:20 PM, Jim Fleig - CNC Services
j...@cncservices.ws wrote:
 Hi Stuart,

 Here's the short answer:

 a programmer that can make changes (like a different GUI) for a retrofit, an
 individual that can either supply a computer or guide the selection and
 assembly of a computer and techinical support of the software and computer
 after the retrofit.

 Here's the long answer:

 I can do anything (not just bragging, its true - see www.cncservices.ws)
 with machine tools (rebuild, retrofit, align, calibrate (laser and level for
 6 axes of movement linear, pitch, yaw and roll around the X,Y and Z axes,
 spatial positioning measurement and compensation, 4th and 5th axis
 measurement and compensation), G code programming, troubleshooting
 (electrical, electronic, hydraulic, mechanical, pneumatic, etc.),
 communication (DNC, wired and wireless), scrapping, etc., etc.) except
 electronic board repair and software troubleshooting.  When troubleshooting
 a machine if I can prove that the machine is functioning correctly and I can
 demonstrate that the software is not issuing commands correctly to the
 machine then the problem is in the software or the hardware that runs the
 software.  With adequate technical support I can address these problems
 also.  Many of these problems I can address myself if a parameter needs to
 be changed (all of the controls that I have worked on so far are parameter
 based, Fanuc, Yasnac(Yaskawa), Mitsubishi, Centroid, etc.).  On more than
 one control I have replaced a hard drive, partitioned the hard drive,
 reloaded software, configured the software for the mill and got the mill up
 and running again with technical support.  In one of these situations I had
 to get the machine connected to the customers network so that parameters
 could be downloaded from the control to the customers office computer.  With
 instructions I set up a network connection (I am a computer user, not a
 computer technician).  I am willing to tackle that which I do not know (and
 do not have the time to learn, I just can't duplicate others knowledge and
 experience in many areas) if there is adequate technical support to address
 the problem.  I am not comfortable supplying a control system to a customer
 that does not have adequate technical support because the customer's machine
 could be down because I am unable to address a certain issue and unable to
 get the answer for the issue from technical support.  My customers trust
 that whatever I do for them will enable them to make parts and if the making
 of parts is interrupted that I will be able to get them back up and running
 promptly.

 In my ideal world paid technical support would:

 assist in the retrofit process by

 - being a programmer that is comfortable with me not becoming a programmer
 - being a programmer that is comfortable with me being the onsite hands
 while they are the brain guiding the hands (technical support)
 - being a Linux enthusiast that will interact with the Windows world (all of
 my customers front offices are Windows based) without bashing Windows or
 Bill Gates in front of the customer (the machine control almost always have
 to be networked with the customers office computers for the transfer of
 programs)
 - having the programming ability to create a different GUI for EMC that
 would be more industry standard (I have designed this GUI, it just needs to
 be programmed)
 - having the programming ability and the people skills to talk me or a
 customer through entering software commands and reporting results so that
 issue of the moment can be identified and resolved
 - an alternative to the previous step would be a direct connection via the
 internet to the machine tool control so that the programmer could remotely
 evaluate the computer
 note:  I am willing to travel to be onsite whenever onsite activity needs to
 occur, the programmer would not be required to travel
 - having the programming ability to make changes as needed so that EMC will
 function externally in a more industry standard manner (Ray H. generously
 took time from his very busy schedule to educate me about the momentary
 contact nature of the inputs to EMC because of the perspective when EMC was
 first created that there may be more than one control station on a single
 machine, apparently some of this could be accomplished through the ladder)

 - advising me which hardware components to purchase (motherboard, memory,
 hard drive (or hard drive equivalent), power supply, etc.) to put together a
 computer and provide instruction on how to do so
 - advising how to load software onto the computer
 - advising how to configure the software to the machine (I would provide
 detailed list of machine functions)
 - writing the ladder logic from my detailed list of machine functions or
 provide instruction how to write 

Re: [Emc-users] What's coming in manufacturing

2009-04-18 Thread Sven Wesley
Yes, veery long. :)
Sometimes it feels great though to let the minds out.

The donation issue, why not have a look or even talk to other Open Source
projects, like the ones under the Apache umbrella how they handle donations?


Regards,
A very open sourced (I even work with it daily) Sven

2009/4/18 Stuart Stevenson stus...@gmail.com

 Jim,
   WHEW - Well, JIM, I did read to the end :)
   thanks for the explanation
   now we have a better target
 thanks
 Stuart



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Re: [Emc-users] What's coming in manufacturing

2009-04-18 Thread Jim Fleig - CNC Services
Hi Stuart,

After reading that email would you be willing to be a reference for me to 
the support persons that may consider working with me that I am very 
detailed?  :-)

Jim


- Original Message - 
From: Stuart Stevenson stus...@gmail.com
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
Sent: Saturday, April 18, 2009 2:44 PM
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] What's coming in manufacturing


 Jim,
   WHEW - Well, JIM, I did read to the end :)
   thanks for the explanation
   now we have a better target
 thanks
 Stuart


 On Sat, Apr 18, 2009 at 1:20 PM, Jim Fleig - CNC Services
 j...@cncservices.ws wrote:
 Hi Stuart,

 Here's the short answer:

 a programmer that can make changes (like a different GUI) for a retrofit, 
 an
 individual that can either supply a computer or guide the selection and
 assembly of a computer and techinical support of the software and 
 computer
 after the retrofit.

 Here's the long answer:

 I can do anything (not just bragging, its true - see www.cncservices.ws)
 with machine tools (rebuild, retrofit, align, calibrate (laser and level 
 for
 6 axes of movement linear, pitch, yaw and roll around the X,Y and Z axes,
 spatial positioning measurement and compensation, 4th and 5th axis
 measurement and compensation), G code programming, troubleshooting
 (electrical, electronic, hydraulic, mechanical, pneumatic, etc.),
 communication (DNC, wired and wireless), scrapping, etc., etc.) except
 electronic board repair and software troubleshooting.  When 
 troubleshooting
 a machine if I can prove that the machine is functioning correctly and I 
 can
 demonstrate that the software is not issuing commands correctly to the
 machine then the problem is in the software or the hardware that runs the
 software.  With adequate technical support I can address these problems
 also.  Many of these problems I can address myself if a parameter needs 
 to
 be changed (all of the controls that I have worked on so far are 
 parameter
 based, Fanuc, Yasnac(Yaskawa), Mitsubishi, Centroid, etc.).  On more than
 one control I have replaced a hard drive, partitioned the hard drive,
 reloaded software, configured the software for the mill and got the mill 
 up
 and running again with technical support.  In one of these situations I 
 had
 to get the machine connected to the customers network so that parameters
 could be downloaded from the control to the customers office computer. 
 With
 instructions I set up a network connection (I am a computer user, not a
 computer technician).  I am willing to tackle that which I do not know 
 (and
 do not have the time to learn, I just can't duplicate others knowledge 
 and
 experience in many areas) if there is adequate technical support to 
 address
 the problem.  I am not comfortable supplying a control system to a 
 customer
 that does not have adequate technical support because the customer's 
 machine
 could be down because I am unable to address a certain issue and unable 
 to
 get the answer for the issue from technical support.  My customers trust
 that whatever I do for them will enable them to make parts and if the 
 making
 of parts is interrupted that I will be able to get them back up and 
 running
 promptly.

 In my ideal world paid technical support would:

 assist in the retrofit process by

 - being a programmer that is comfortable with me not becoming a 
 programmer
 - being a programmer that is comfortable with me being the onsite hands
 while they are the brain guiding the hands (technical support)
 - being a Linux enthusiast that will interact with the Windows world (all 
 of
 my customers front offices are Windows based) without bashing Windows or
 Bill Gates in front of the customer (the machine control almost always 
 have
 to be networked with the customers office computers for the transfer of
 programs)
 - having the programming ability to create a different GUI for EMC that
 would be more industry standard (I have designed this GUI, it just needs 
 to
 be programmed)
 - having the programming ability and the people skills to talk me or a
 customer through entering software commands and reporting results so that
 issue of the moment can be identified and resolved
 - an alternative to the previous step would be a direct connection via 
 the
 internet to the machine tool control so that the programmer could 
 remotely
 evaluate the computer
 note:  I am willing to travel to be onsite whenever onsite activity needs 
 to
 occur, the programmer would not be required to travel
 - having the programming ability to make changes as needed so that EMC 
 will
 function externally in a more industry standard manner (Ray H. generously
 took time from his very busy schedule to educate me about the momentary
 contact nature of the inputs to EMC because of the perspective when EMC 
 was
 first created that there may be more than one control station on a single
 machine, apparently some of this could be accomplished through the 
 ladder)

Re: [Emc-users] Hostmot2 - stepper signal invert

2009-04-18 Thread Sebastian Kuzminsky
Rob Jansen wrote:
 this works - I thought that only worked on standard output lines - not on
 special function pins.
 Sometimes I am thinking too complex...

Well, maybe the hostmot2 manpage could use some clarification on this 
issue.  The distinction between physical I/O pins on the board 
connectors and GPIO HAL pins is currently pretty muddled.

Each physical I/O pin has *some* representation in HAL, but the 
particulars of that representation depends on what the I/O pin is used for.

If the physical I/O pin is used for general-purpose I/O (digital input 
or output), then the manpage calls it a full gpio, and the user can do 
anything that the firmware supports.

If the physical I/O pin is used by a PWM, stepgen, or encoder, then the 
manpage calls it a constrained gpio, and the HAL representation is 
quite limited: the pin has to still be usable by the higher-level 
function that controls it.  For example, a PWM pin cannot be set to be 
an input.


 Meanwhile I also added spindle control with a PWM output. I think the docs
 are a bit outdated (or I just found the wrong ones).Some docs tell me the to
 use dac.0.value (where PWMs are used to create DACs), another one mentions
 pwmgen (but then use hm5i20 as a board type prefix whereas hostmot2 uses
 hm2_5i20 as boardname. Nothing which cannot be fixed with a bit of logical
 thinking.

It sounds like you found the wrong docs.  Unfortunately, this is 
currently easy to do, because there are two drivers that can be used 
with the Mesa 5i20 board.  The older driver is called m5i20, and it has 
HAL pins with names like m5i20.0.dac-X-value pins.  The newer driver 
is called hostmot2 (and hm2_5i20), and it has HAL pins with names like 
hm2_5i20.0.pwmgen.XX.


-- 
Sebastian Kuzminsky
We need numbers, not adjectives.  -- David MacKay
   http://www.withouthotair.com/

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Re: [Emc-users] What's coming in manufacturing

2009-04-18 Thread Stephen Wille Padnos
Hi Jim

I was going through your (long :) ) list of points, responding to each 
one, when I realized that all my responses point to the same conclusion.

I think you need to hire someone to do the software related tech work if 
you want to use EMC2 in your business.  You could of course contract 
someone to provide tech support, with whatever response / resolution 
times make you comfortable.  You could instead choose to pay for 
software licenses, maintenance, and support contracts from well-known 
vendors.  The money part is a relatively simple calculation.  The 
confidence part is a bit more nebulous.

I think there's some confusion between having a central entity that 
manages money and having individuals accept money for working on EMC2.  
I don't think anyone has any issues with individuals doing work on EMC2 
and getting paid for it.  Several of us have done this in the past, 
including me.  There is no reason why you can't hire any programmer off 
the street to make your GUI happen, or to do anything else you want to 
have done.

Now let's look at an EMC corporate entity.  I'll assume that there are 
several people like you out there - people who would donate because they 
like the software, hire people to do maintenance and feature additions, 
tech support, etc.  If there aren't any donors, there's no need for an 
entity to manage donations :)

If we create a non-profit, there are massive IRS reporting 
requirements.  The entity would most likely need to hire an accountant.  
(I believe there are quarterly reports, similar to 941 tax filings for 
corporations, in addition to forms and records showing where every penny 
goes, and justifying that there really is no profit to be taxed)  There 
needs to be someone who will decide how non-earmarked donations get 
distributed.  Which feature requests get acted upon, and in what order.  
We're talking about a project manager.  A project manager with no 
programmer-employees (most likely), and only volunteers to get things 
done, kind of like it is now.

Even with a non-profit, we're into a political arena.  Who decides what 
will be done, by whom, and at what price?  Who decides who that 
decider will be?  Should the board, or a different group elected by 
mailing list members get to decide?  Should it only be people who have 
donated?  Pro-rated based on donation size?  There is significant work 
that has already gone into EMC2 - should some of the money allocated to 
one feature be given to the people who made the foundation on which the 
new code rests?

A for-profit company could be started by someone.  It wouldn't be the 
community though.  It would be someone who decides they want to sell 
support and customization services for EMC2.  That company/person would 
have no specific rights to use the names and domains that are currently 
in use.  They would have the rights that we all have - to modify the 
code at will, with the stipulation that their customers have full rights 
to use, modify, and distribute the source code.  I think there are a 
host of political issues with someone just starting up a company, 
especially if they claim to represent the EMC2 project or the EMC2 
community.

When all is said and done, I don't see any reason why you can't have 
everything you want for tech support and feature additions.  The only 
thing that will be missing (which wasn't explicitly mentioned) would be 
getting support assurances from a company with a proven track record, 
and that your customers will recognize and be comfortable with.

I'd also like to say that I don't think any of your points are 
unreasonable.  The only thing that would be unreasonable would be to 
expect that people who do this in their spare time should change their 
priorities based on what you want.  The easiest way to fix that problem 
is to pay someone, so they're no longer working on it in their spare time ;)

Incidentally, you mentioned in a previous email that you had made an 
offer to donate money, which wasn't well received.  While I don't doubt 
that's true (we have politely declined donations several times), I also 
don't see where you made the offer.  From time to time, I see comments 
like this, and I wonder which EMC-related communication medium I'm not 
subscribed to.  (I've seen it mostly in complaints like I asked this on 
the forum, and nobody answered me for 37 whole minutes!, which was 
confusing to me when we had no forum)

Thanks for the comments.
- Steve

[snipped your comments - this is long enough without them ;) ]


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[Emc-users] NAMES Show - Saturday

2009-04-18 Thread Greg Michalski
Hey everyone!  Spent a bit of time in the EMC2 booth at the NAMES show
today.  Dale is a wonderful guy.  Very outgoing.  Very knowledgeable.  Very
polite.  Very giving.  All around a good person to have in the booth.  I on
the other hand am a shy person so it took me a while to get the courage to
strike up conversation with everyone who stepped up the edge of the EMC2
area.  But I tried to help as best I could.  Once my medical issues got to
be too much to take without becoming a prick and alienating possible future
EMC2 users I had to leave Dale to fend for himself.  Hind sight I should
have given him a chance to run and use the bathroom if needed.  Then I
walked and saw a bit of the displays, I haven't really be into the steam
engines but they are pretty cool, especially the couple models of scale
machine shops of yesteryear.  Those were pretty cool.

 

I've got some pics here from the show showing the EMC2 booth with Dale
working in it.  Should've gotten a good overall shot of the Convention, but
I didn't.

 

An Overall Shot of http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3088.JPG
the EMC2 Booth

Tighter Shot of http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3091.jpg  the
EMC2 Booth With Someone Drawn in by the Photos

Dale Giving a http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3092.jpg
Thorough Tutorial on EMC2

Better Shot of the http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3093.jpg
Booth and Photo Displays

Dale Talking About http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3094.jpg
EMC2 with his EMCO F1 as a Teaching Tool

Dale's EMCO F1 http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3096.jpg  Mill

Running Some http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3099.jpg  Videos
of Jan van Gillsen's HA5 5 Axis Machine

Another Video Shot http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3100.jpg
with a Tuner's Cube I Made with EMC and an Plate Engraved with the Detroit
Redwings Logo done by EMC

More of Dale http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3102.jpg
Explaining - You Can See Dale Was Cutting Some Wax From a Handcoded Limit
Switch Enclosure

 

All in all I had fun, only spent a total of $19 on a scrapped R8 shank 2
facemill that needs a little cleaning up before using and a pack of syringes
for precision oiling (though they came with fairly fine gauge hypodermic
needles on them.)  Some decent deals to be had, some prices higher than
online, some slightly lower from the couple of online vendors (like Little
Machine Shop).  I had fun and will be back tomorrow afternoon to help Dale
dismantle the booth and get the pictures back.  

 

If someone would like to have the photo boards for the EMC Workshop out at
Stuart's in Kansas let me know and we can work it out.

 

Alex - contact me off list to coordinate what you want to do about posting
the photo boards on www.linuxcnc.org http://www.linuxcnc.org/ . 

 

Be patient while these pictures load - they are good sized jpegs (be glad I
didn't use the raw files that the camera produces ;-) )  and they aren't
formatted for monitor sizes, maybe tomorrow.  I need to go to bed.

 

Good night everyone!

 

Greg

www.distinctperspectives.com

 

 

--
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around Java (TM) technology - register by April 22, and save
$200 on the JavaOne (SM) conference, June 2-5, 2009, San Francisco.
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Re: [Emc-users] NAMES Show - Saturday

2009-04-18 Thread Mark Cason
Umm...  Only the first link worked for me, the other gave Page not 
Found errors.


Ne M'oubliez   ---Family Motto
Hope for the best, plan for the worst   ---Personal Motto


Greg Michalski wrote:
 Hey everyone!  Spent a bit of time in the EMC2 booth at the NAMES show
 today.  Dale is a wonderful guy.  Very outgoing.  Very knowledgeable.  Very
 polite.  Very giving.  All around a good person to have in the booth.  I on
 the other hand am a shy person so it took me a while to get the courage to
 strike up conversation with everyone who stepped up the edge of the EMC2
 area.  But I tried to help as best I could.  Once my medical issues got to
 be too much to take without becoming a prick and alienating possible future
 EMC2 users I had to leave Dale to fend for himself.  Hind sight I should
 have given him a chance to run and use the bathroom if needed.  Then I
 walked and saw a bit of the displays, I haven't really be into the steam
 engines but they are pretty cool, especially the couple models of scale
 machine shops of yesteryear.  Those were pretty cool.
 
  
 
 I've got some pics here from the show showing the EMC2 booth with Dale
 working in it.  Should've gotten a good overall shot of the Convention, but
 I didn't.
 
  
 
 An Overall Shot of http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3088.JPG
 the EMC2 Booth
 
 Tighter Shot of http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3091.jpg  the
 EMC2 Booth With Someone Drawn in by the Photos
 
 Dale Giving a http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3092.jpg
 Thorough Tutorial on EMC2
 
 Better Shot of the http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3093.jpg
 Booth and Photo Displays
 
 Dale Talking About http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3094.jpg
 EMC2 with his EMCO F1 as a Teaching Tool
 
 Dale's EMCO F1 http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3096.jpg  Mill
 
 Running Some http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3099.jpg  Videos
 of Jan van Gillsen's HA5 5 Axis Machine
 
 Another Video Shot http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3100.jpg
 with a Tuner's Cube I Made with EMC and an Plate Engraved with the Detroit
 Redwings Logo done by EMC
 
 More of Dale http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3102.jpg
 Explaining - You Can See Dale Was Cutting Some Wax From a Handcoded Limit
 Switch Enclosure
 
  
 
 All in all I had fun, only spent a total of $19 on a scrapped R8 shank 2
 facemill that needs a little cleaning up before using and a pack of syringes
 for precision oiling (though they came with fairly fine gauge hypodermic
 needles on them.)  Some decent deals to be had, some prices higher than
 online, some slightly lower from the couple of online vendors (like Little
 Machine Shop).  I had fun and will be back tomorrow afternoon to help Dale
 dismantle the booth and get the pictures back.  
 
  
 
 If someone would like to have the photo boards for the EMC Workshop out at
 Stuart's in Kansas let me know and we can work it out.
 
  
 
 Alex - contact me off list to coordinate what you want to do about posting
 the photo boards on www.linuxcnc.org http://www.linuxcnc.org/ . 
 
  
 
 Be patient while these pictures load - they are good sized jpegs (be glad I
 didn't use the raw files that the camera produces ;-) )  and they aren't
 formatted for monitor sizes, maybe tomorrow.  I need to go to bed.
 
  
 
 Good night everyone!
 
  
 
 Greg
 
 www.distinctperspectives.com
 
  
 
  
 
 --
 Stay on top of everything new and different, both inside and 
 around Java (TM) technology - register by April 22, and save
 $200 on the JavaOne (SM) conference, June 2-5, 2009, San Francisco.
 300 plus technical and hands-on sessions. Register today. 
 Use priority code J9JMT32. http://p.sf.net/sfu/p
 ___
 Emc-users mailing list
 Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
 https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
 

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around Java (TM) technology - register by April 22, and save
$200 on the JavaOne (SM) conference, June 2-5, 2009, San Francisco.
300 plus technical and hands-on sessions. Register today. 
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[Emc-users] FW: NAMES Show - Saturday - Fixed Links

2009-04-18 Thread Greg Michalski
Resending with the links in the original message below fixed - forgot that
my host is a linux server and cares about case sensitivity.  My bad.  That's
what I get for posting at 1am.

 

A short video of the http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/MOV001.MOD
example milling in wax - Give this one about 15 more minutes to finish
uploading - I might have to take in down in a few days to keep my bandwidth
usage within what I paid for so I don't get socked extra by my provider :--}

 

Greg

www.distinctperspectives.com

 

  _  

From: Greg Michalski [mailto:emc2usrl...@distinctperspectives.com] 
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2009 12:49 AM
To: 'Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)'
Subject: NAMES Show - Saturday

 

Hey everyone!  Spent a bit of time in the EMC2 booth at the NAMES show
today.  Dale is a wonderful guy.  Very outgoing.  Very knowledgeable.  Very
polite.  Very giving.  All around a good person to have in the booth.  I on
the other hand am a shy person so it took me a while to get the courage to
strike up conversation with everyone who stepped up the edge of the EMC2
area.  But I tried to help as best I could.  Once my medical issues got to
be too much to take without becoming a prick and alienating possible future
EMC2 users I had to leave Dale to fend for himself.  Hind sight I should
have given him a chance to run and use the bathroom if needed.  Then I
walked and saw a bit of the displays, I haven't really be into the steam
engines but they are pretty cool, especially the couple models of scale
machine shops of yesteryear.  Those were pretty cool.

 

I've got some pics here from the show showing the EMC2 booth with Dale
working in it.  Should've gotten a good overall shot of the Convention, but
I didn't.

 

An Overall Shot of http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3088.JPG
the EMC2 Booth

Tighter Shot of the http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3091.JPG
EMC2 Booth With Someone Drawn in by the Photos

Dale Giving a http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3092.JPG
Thorough Tutorial on EMC2

Better Shot of the http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3093.JPG
Booth and Photo Displays

Dale Talking About http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3094.JPG
EMC2 with his EMCO F1 as a Teaching Tool

Dale's EMCO F1 http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3096.JPG  Mill

Running Some Videos http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3099.JPG
of Jan van Gillsen's HA5 5 Axis Machine

Another Video Shot http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3100.JPG
with a Tuner's Cube I Made with EMC and an Plate Engraved with the Detroit
Redwings Logo done by EMC

More of Dale http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3102.JPG
Explaining - You Can See Dale Was Cutting Some Wax From a Handcoded Limit
Switch Enclosure

 

All in all I had fun, only spent a total of $19 on a scrapped R8 shank 2
facemill that needs a little cleaning up before using and a pack of syringes
for precision oiling (though they came with fairly fine gauge hypodermic
needles on them.)  Some decent deals to be had, some prices higher than
online, some slightly lower from the couple of online vendors (like Little
Machine Shop).  I had fun and will be back tomorrow afternoon to help Dale
dismantle the booth and get the pictures back.  

 

If someone would like to have the photo boards for the EMC Workshop out at
Stuart's in Kansas let me know and we can work it out.

 

Alex - contact me off list to coordinate what you want to do about posting
the photo boards on www.linuxcnc.org http://www.linuxcnc.org/ . 

 

Be patient while these pictures load - they are good sized jpegs (be glad I
didn't use the raw files that the camera produces ;-) )  and they aren't
formatted for monitor sizes, maybe tomorrow.  I need to go to bed.

 

Good night everyone!

 

Greg

www.distinctperspectives.com

 

 

--
Stay on top of everything new and different, both inside and 
around Java (TM) technology - register by April 22, and save
$200 on the JavaOne (SM) conference, June 2-5, 2009, San Francisco.
300 plus technical and hands-on sessions. Register today. 
Use priority code J9JMT32. http://p.sf.net/sfu/p
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Re: [Emc-users] NAMES Show - Saturday

2009-04-18 Thread Stuart Stevenson
when you pick the link and get the error change the jpg to JPG - it then works


On Sun, Apr 19, 2009 at 12:06 AM, Mark Cason farmerboy1...@yahoo.com wrote:
 Umm...  Only the first link worked for me, the other gave Page not
 Found errors.


 Ne M'oubliez   ---Family Motto
 Hope for the best, plan for the worst   ---Personal Motto


 Greg Michalski wrote:
 Hey everyone!  Spent a bit of time in the EMC2 booth at the NAMES show
 today.  Dale is a wonderful guy.  Very outgoing.  Very knowledgeable.  Very
 polite.  Very giving.  All around a good person to have in the booth.  I on
 the other hand am a shy person so it took me a while to get the courage to
 strike up conversation with everyone who stepped up the edge of the EMC2
 area.  But I tried to help as best I could.  Once my medical issues got to
 be too much to take without becoming a prick and alienating possible future
 EMC2 users I had to leave Dale to fend for himself.  Hind sight I should
 have given him a chance to run and use the bathroom if needed.  Then I
 walked and saw a bit of the displays, I haven't really be into the steam
 engines but they are pretty cool, especially the couple models of scale
 machine shops of yesteryear.  Those were pretty cool.



 I've got some pics here from the show showing the EMC2 booth with Dale
 working in it.  Should've gotten a good overall shot of the Convention, but
 I didn't.



 An Overall Shot of http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3088.JPG
 the EMC2 Booth

 Tighter Shot of http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3091.jpg  the
 EMC2 Booth With Someone Drawn in by the Photos

 Dale Giving a http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3092.jpg
 Thorough Tutorial on EMC2

 Better Shot of the http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3093.jpg
 Booth and Photo Displays

 Dale Talking About http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3094.jpg
 EMC2 with his EMCO F1 as a Teaching Tool

 Dale's EMCO F1 http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3096.jpg  Mill

 Running Some http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3099.jpg  Videos
 of Jan van Gillsen's HA5 5 Axis Machine

 Another Video Shot http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3100.jpg
 with a Tuner's Cube I Made with EMC and an Plate Engraved with the Detroit
 Redwings Logo done by EMC

 More of Dale http://www.distinctperspectives.com/emc2/DSC_3102.jpg
 Explaining - You Can See Dale Was Cutting Some Wax From a Handcoded Limit
 Switch Enclosure



 All in all I had fun, only spent a total of $19 on a scrapped R8 shank 2
 facemill that needs a little cleaning up before using and a pack of syringes
 for precision oiling (though they came with fairly fine gauge hypodermic
 needles on them.)  Some decent deals to be had, some prices higher than
 online, some slightly lower from the couple of online vendors (like Little
 Machine Shop).  I had fun and will be back tomorrow afternoon to help Dale
 dismantle the booth and get the pictures back.



 If someone would like to have the photo boards for the EMC Workshop out at
 Stuart's in Kansas let me know and we can work it out.



 Alex - contact me off list to coordinate what you want to do about posting
 the photo boards on www.linuxcnc.org http://www.linuxcnc.org/ .



 Be patient while these pictures load - they are good sized jpegs (be glad I
 didn't use the raw files that the camera produces ;-) )  and they aren't
 formatted for monitor sizes, maybe tomorrow.  I need to go to bed.



 Good night everyone!



 Greg

 www.distinctperspectives.com





 --
 Stay on top of everything new and different, both inside and
 around Java (TM) technology - register by April 22, and save
 $200 on the JavaOne (SM) conference, June 2-5, 2009, San Francisco.
 300 plus technical and hands-on sessions. Register today.
 Use priority code J9JMT32. http://p.sf.net/sfu/p
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 Emc-users mailing list
 Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
 https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users


 --
 Stay on top of everything new and different, both inside and
 around Java (TM) technology - register by April 22, and save
 $200 on the JavaOne (SM) conference, June 2-5, 2009, San Francisco.
 300 plus technical and hands-on sessions. Register today.
 Use priority code J9JMT32. http://p.sf.net/sfu/p
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 https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users





-- 
you can lead a person to knowledge
but you cannot make him think

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