Re: [Emc-users] End of the day, Q's about 5i25

2016-09-28 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Wednesday 28 September 2016 22:18:03 andy pugh wrote:

> On 29 September 2016 at 02:48, Gene Heskett  
wrote:
> > Ok, checked now. No detectable continuity between powerline common
> > ground, and the control circuit ground. And about .30nf capacitance
> > between them.
>
> You need a wire

Between the control ground/common,and the ground (- supply terminal) on 
the Bob.  And some means of translating the ground sink from 5 volts to 
a ground sink on the fwd and rev terminals that have 12.5 volts on them 
now and would expect a pull to ground to activate them..  Thats opto 
stuff to me. Slow level translators, but define slow. 3 or 4 
microseconds of lag.  Shrug.  I swear I had a bag of moc-3020's, can't 
find them. So I bought a 4 channel 5v to 12 volt on ebay just now. At 
least 15 days delivery.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] Any Interest or Ideas for a Linuxcnc Fest 2016 ?

2016-09-28 Thread andy pugh 
On 29 September 2016 at 02:32, Jeff Epler  wrote:

> Besides the social aspects, some of my goals are to
>  - take a look at some of the things in our github tracker that are
>languishing
>

One thing that I find myself coming back to, and is looking increasingly
like the real answer to "jog while paused" is extending the 'position.txt"
file, or a close relative, to  include "last G-code line completed' and a
collection of states such as tool and spindle speed.

Some users have said that mains power is unreliable where they are. If the
power goes off mid-job, then they want a pop-up next restart saying so.

Is is possible that we have over-complicated the whole jog-while-paused
thing? Could it really be as easy as "re-start unfinished job" ?

-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916
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Re: [Emc-users] End of the day, Q's about 5i25

2016-09-28 Thread andy pugh 
On 29 September 2016 at 02:48, Gene Heskett  wrote:

> Ok, checked now. No detectable continuity between powerline common
> ground, and the control circuit ground. And about .30nf capacitance
> between them.
>

You need a wire



-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916
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Re: [Emc-users] Any Interest or Ideas for a Linuxcnc Fest 2016 ?

2016-09-28 Thread Jeff Epler 
Mostly I'm looking forward to seeing everyone--I'm thrilled that
you're thinking about coming.

Besides the social aspects, some of my goals are to
 - take a look at some of the things in our github tracker that are
   languishing
 - dig out some old branches of my own that need more work before
   merging
 - talk about 2.8 plans and timeline
 - confuse my instagram peeps by pictures of linuxcnc things

I won't be bringing a CNC machine but I'll probably cart along some
of the ARM boards that are working(-ish) with 2.7 and master branch.
Maybe work on hm2-spi for bbb as yet another new(-to-me) project.

I don't think we have a specific machine retrofit type project for
Wichita, but who knows what is to be found in Stuart's new place,
Helix Machine.  Also I heard that Seb is likely to be bringing a
robot arm that is ready to be hooked up to a mesa board. (the
kinematics are in the can already)

Personally, I anticpate being there starting Wednesday or Thursday
evening, and leaving Sunday early afternoon.

Jeff

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Re: [Emc-users] End of the day, Q's about 5i25

2016-09-28 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Wednesday 28 September 2016 19:35:18 andy pugh wrote:

> On 29 September 2016 at 00:03, Gene Heskett  
wrote:
> > > VFDs norrnally need their inputs pulled down to their own digital
> > > GND. (Have you tied BoB GND to VFD GND?)
> >
> > No, I haven't yet. I have no clue whether the "power source ground"
> > is in fact connected to the 3rd pin since for single-phase operation
> > it is supposed to have terminals L & N, but they are missing, and
> > when asked I was told to just use any 2 of R-S-T.
>
> That is _so_ not what I meant.
>
> The VFD will have a signal GND. Probably called DCM on a Huanyang

Trash night, lot of walking to collect it all and coerce it into two 13 
gallon kitchen bags & walk them out to hang on the picket fence for the 
truck in the morning. So my legs need a 15 minute rest & I'll go see 
about it.  I suspicion that the whole control interface, 7 lines in all 
including what they also call the 'common control signal" shown 
connected to the ground, is isolated.  But I'll verify as it doesn't 
seem workable w/o it. I've let the magic smoke out of too much stuff by 
not verifying.


Ok, checked now. No detectable continuity between powerline common 
ground, and the control circuit ground. And about .30nf capacitance 
between them.

Plugged in and turned on, but no motor connected, the fwd and rev 
terminals are sittin at nominally 12.5 volts + from that isolated common 
control ground.

Now I wonder what the outputs on this bob can stand?  The waveforms I am 
seeing are hard switches, with zero resemblance to an open collector 
circuit. IOW, they will need a postage stamp with some opto's on it.  
And just when I  thought I'd hit a lick...  Opto's I think I have but 
I'll need to carve up a board & stick it someplace next to the bob. Time 
sinks... 

Tomorrow I have to take the toy to the dealer, a couple recalls are open, 
and the left rear caliper is freezeing on the mount bolts, probably 
ought to have both sides cleaned & lubed. No clue how much I'll get done 
tomorrow after that.

Is that what you  expected I would find?

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] End of the day, Q's about 5i25

2016-09-28 Thread andy pugh 
On 29 September 2016 at 00:03, Gene Heskett  wrote:

> > VFDs norrnally need their inputs pulled down to their own digital GND.
> > (Have you tied BoB GND to VFD GND?)
>
> No, I haven't yet. I have no clue whether the "power source ground" is in
> fact connected to the 3rd pin since for single-phase operation it is
> supposed to have terminals L & N, but they are missing, and when asked I
> was told to just use any 2 of R-S-T.


That is _so_ not what I meant.

The VFD will have a signal GND. Probably called DCM on a Huanyang


-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916
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Re: [Emc-users] Any Interest or Ideas for a Linuxcnc Fest 2016 ?

2016-09-28 Thread Sebastian Kuzminsky 
On 09/28/2016 04:36 PM, Charles Steinkuehler wrote:
> On 8/22/2016 11:55 AM, Sebastian Kuzminsky wrote:
>> On 08/22/2016 10:35 AM, Ed wrote:

>>> I haven't been paying attention to this. Is this the correct date?
>>
>> The plan is:
>>
>> Monday October 17 through Sunday October 23
>> Helix Machine, 3434 West Harry, Wichita, Kansas
>>
>> It's going to be a rocking nerdy good time.
>
> Sounds great!  Is there any sort of tentative schedule?
>
> I'm trying to decide whether to come down Fri/Sat or Sat/Sun.

I don't know about anyone else, but my schedule is:

dawn-dusk every day: hack
dusk-midnight: drink & goof off


Looking forward to seeing you there!


-- 
Sebastian Kuzminsky

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Re: [Emc-users] Gene I was Thinking of You

2016-09-28 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Wednesday 28 September 2016 17:28:09 John Thornton wrote:

> Gene I was thinking of you the whole time was putting inner tubes in
> the front tires of my Crapsman riding lawn mower (except when
> cursing). Yea, the rubberish plastic axle caps are fun to get off and
> even more fun to get back on. Of course I tried to put the tube in
> without taking the wheel off and wasted an hour trying to out think a
> dumb wheel but it kept spinning and tossing my gear off... I finally
> gave up and just took the wheel off. I even tried on the second wheel
> to just stuff the tube in without pulling the tire half off the rim...
> more wasted time and now I'm done but shot for the day!
>
> JT
>
I cheated John, took the sob off and dropped it off at my oil change 
spot.  Amazingly, since I'm a good customer who spent around a kilobuck 
putting fresh rubber on everything last fall, both times it was no 
charge and included a fresh valve stem. :)

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] End of the day, Q's about 5i25

2016-09-28 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Wednesday 28 September 2016 17:09:36 andy pugh wrote:

> On 28 September 2016 at 20:57, Gene Heskett  
wrote:
> > So how to satisfy this vfd?  Needs a positive speed pwm, and a
> > positive for run fwd, and a positive for run reverse, presumably
> > mutually exclusive.
>
> VFDs norrnally need their inputs pulled down to their own digital GND.
> (Have you tied BoB GND to VFD GND?)

No, I haven't yet. I have no clue whether the "power source ground" is in 
fact connected to the 3rd pin since for single-phase operation it is 
supposed to have terminals L & N, but they are missing, and when asked I 
was told to just use any 2 of R-S-T. Which is how I've been playing with 
it, but I've not checked to see if the static drain is actually 
connected. My back's yelling atm as I've been standing up most of the 
day messing with the computers hal config, and I believe I have that 
sorted, finally.

After I've done dinner, I'll see if I can take some dvm measurements to 
make sure its actually safe, and check to see what the resting voltage 
is to its power source ground from the fwd and rev terminals. It doesn't 
say, so I assumed it needed a pullup, not a pulldown. Its a real 
informative little booklet, not! Even the units picture on the cover is 
wrong.  The block diagram seems to indicate at lease one opto-isolation 
stage. So maybe its fully isolated. It wasn't on my radar with the hal 
problems earlier.

Thanks Andy.

And post what I've found of course.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] Any Interest or Ideas for a Linuxcnc Fest 2016 ?

2016-09-28 Thread Charles Steinkuehler 
On 8/22/2016 11:55 AM, Sebastian Kuzminsky wrote:
> On 08/22/2016 10:35 AM, Ed wrote:
>>>
>> I haven't been paying attention to this. Is this the correct date?
> 
> The plan is:
> 
> Monday October 17 through Sunday October 23
> Helix Machine, 3434 West Harry, Wichita, Kansas
> 
> It's going to be a rocking nerdy good time.

Sounds great!  Is there any sort of tentative schedule?

I'm trying to decide whether to come down Fri/Sat or Sat/Sun.

-- 
Charles Steinkuehler
char...@steinkuehler.net

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[Emc-users] Gene I was Thinking of You

2016-09-28 Thread John Thornton 
Gene I was thinking of you the whole time was putting inner tubes in the 
front tires of my Crapsman riding lawn mower (except when cursing). Yea, 
the rubberish plastic axle caps are fun to get off and even more fun to 
get back on. Of course I tried to put the tube in without taking the 
wheel off and wasted an hour trying to out think a dumb wheel but it 
kept spinning and tossing my gear off... I finally gave up and just took 
the wheel off. I even tried on the second wheel to just stuff the tube 
in without pulling the tire half off the rim... more wasted time and now 
I'm done but shot for the day!

JT

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Re: [Emc-users] End of the day, Q's about 5i25

2016-09-28 Thread andy pugh 
On 28 September 2016 at 20:57, Gene Heskett  wrote:

> So how to satisfy this vfd?  Needs a positive speed pwm, and a positive
> for run fwd, and a positive for run reverse, presumably mutually
> exclusive.
>

VFDs norrnally need their inputs pulled down to their own digital GND.
(Have you tied BoB GND to VFD GND?)

-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916
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Re: [Emc-users] End of the day, Q's about 5i25

2016-09-28 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Tuesday 27 September 2016 23:52:56 Gene Heskett wrote:

> Greetings all;
> I have found 5 of the signals on this strange bob, the only 5 in this
> simple config.  So I have faith I can find the others as I need them.
>
> To say that this board is scrambled is a bit of an understatement.
>
> This vfd's little booklet I have does show a potential rs232 port, but
> the socket is not to be found.  So I am stuck running it with a pwmgen
> pulsing the 5 volt analog in (pin 3) at a high enough rate it
> integrates to analog in its noise filters.  The vendor has assured me
> that works fine.
>
> I am however, wondering if the pwmgen has more than one default mode,
> as this vfd needs 2 separate run-fwd (pin 8) and run-reverse (pin 9)
> input lines in addition to the analog 0-5 volt speed command. If it
> had a mode where it grabbed pins 15 and 17 for those two run signals,
> it would save some hal trickery.  Is there such a mode?
>
> It does have a 5V Fout (pin 6) but does not say if its a pulse
> frequency at motor drive, or an integrated analog voltage.  In either
> event, I do not believe its 5i25 compatible, but might be able to
> drive a separate dual slope integrating voltmeter if it was range
> calibrateable to show freq or rpms.  That would give the operator, me,
> feedback on when it was time to change belts or backgears.  Sitting on
> the table, running free, I'd say mininum drive hz in any 5 minute
> period should not be less than 30 hz as the vfd can throttle the
> current, but it throttles it at about what a 1.5 horse motor would
> draw at rated speed at full load, IOW its warming up the coils of a 1
> horse rated motor.  With fresh bearings in it, I have run it up to
> 200Hz, (4 pole motors, so thats about 6 grand & I worry about the fins
> on the fan) but I doubt it has usable torque as the current draw is
> well under an amp/phase then. Same effect on power that the inductance
> of a stepper causes. I'll no doubt find out when I do load it up.
>
> It would be nice if a firmware for it could be cobbled up as 4 axis +
> 1 encoder & one pwmgen on P3, and a menu of serial ports on P2.  That
> would make a one size fits a lot more board for sure.  I'd like to be
> able to talk to it and get usable data from someplace besides the
> encoder.
>
> Thanks everybody.
>
Apparently they are not the same. An attempt to use mode 0 was canceled 
by hal at machine enable time, a nice red marked popup said it was 
reverting to mode 1, this despite the fact that I had setup the 
pwmgen.value input to be the ABS value, and had synthed the fwd and rev 
signals from motion's outputs.

So I tried mode 4 which the error message suggested, no runtime errors, 
but pwm was on pin 16, and pin 14 was silent.

So how to satisfy this vfd?  Needs a positive speed pwm, and a positive 
for run fwd, and a positive for run reverse, presumably mutually 
exclusive.

I've about sorted the bob itself.  And I did slam another connector on 
the cable to I could try the cnc4pc C1G, but immediately ran into the 
all outputs high when lcnc isn't running. That would likely confuse the 
heck outta this phony vfd. So I am back to this BoB.

And according to what I've found, I still have gpio.009, pin 6 thru 012, 
pin 9 to play with as outputs. So next I'm going to ignore its direction 
output, and see if I can use 2 of those 4 outputs for the direction 
pins. First, see if it works for fwd. I think I did see that working 
once in mode 1.  Some docs on the 5i25 version of the pwmgen sure would 
help explain this. Does anyone have any?

Thanks all.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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