[EVDL] Interesting site on Edison batteries..and conspiracy

[Lawrence Rhodes via EV]

Interesting information on Nickel Iron batteries.  Lawrence Rhodes


http://www.nickel-iron-battery.com/
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[EVDL] FW: Tuning in Solar and EV RFI (EVDL)

[Robert Bruninga via EV]

How's AM reception on more recent EV?  On my 2004 Prius, AM was useless.

Anyone want to make an indepth report or provide a link?

-Original Message-
Subject: Tuning in Solar and EV RFI

I was wrong.  My Volt AM radio hears absolutely NO NOISE from the car
itself.  Amazing considering it is a 75 kW digital AM pulse transmitter
under the hood!

I tuned from 600 to 1700 MHz and heard at least one AM radio station on
almost all of the 110 channels except for about a dozen empty channels.

That's about 90% signals heard.  Compared to my 2004 prius, where I can tune
the same 110 channels and only hear about a dozen signals total due to the
high noise level caused by the Prius blocking out 90% of the weak signal
stations.

And remember, the BMW i3 EV doesn't even include an AM radio because they
did not want to have to respond to driver complaints as to why they could
not hear weak AM stations...

Wow, the Volt surprised me.

This means that I CAN use the car AM radio to kinda keep an ear out for
broadband Buzz from bad solar installations while I am driving around.

I want to begin to collect anecdoatal reports from anyone who thinks they
have done a good test of either their EV AM radio for cleanliness of the EV,
and then separately anechdotal results from driving near and around solar
installations and hearing noise.

I will collect it and put it on a web page:
http://aprs.org/solar-ev-rfi.html

Bob, WB4APR
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Re: [EVDL] Lithium drop in replacements.

[Lee Hart via EV]

>From: Cor van de Water via EV 
>I also did tests on LiFePO4 cells and while self-discharge was low, I was able 
>to prove from my measurements over many weeks, that there is was about a 
>factor 2 difference in self-discharge current between the best and worst cell. 
>Sample size was over 40 cells.

This is what I have found as well. Brand new cells, all bought at the same time 
from a quality source are very similar. Their amphour capacity, internal 
resistance, and self-discharge rates are very close.

But cells from cheap or low-quality sources have a much broader spread in 
characteristics. Cells also get worse as they get old, or get cycled, or as the 
temperature changes. Differences between cells accumulate over time, getting 
worse and worse. You may get by without a BMS initially, but it gets needed 
more as the differences between cells grows Not having a BMS means shorter life.

>This is exactly what the author of the quoted article found, that the capacity 
>of the cells had not degraded, but the cells had gotten out of balance.

Yes. The BMS was too primitive to do its job of balancing the cells. Only 
having upper and lower voltage limits prevents against catastrophic failures; 
but does not compensate for differences between cells.


--
Excellence does not require perfection. -- Henry James
--
Lee A. Hart http://www.sunrise-ev.com
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Re: [EVDL] Tesla smashes into Los Gatos Starbucks

[Mark Abramowitz via EV]

I don't see anything "erratic" here, except the driver. Idiots drive
Tesla's, too.

-- 
- Mark 

On May 11, 2018 at 3:11:15 PM, Peri Hartman via EV (ev@lists.evdl.org)
wrote:

> Almost no reporting on this. Does that mean people are becoming 
> complacent with Tesla's that do "erratic" things? 
> Peri 
> 
> https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/05/10/tesla-smashes-into-los-gatos-coffee-shop/
>  
> 
> LOS GATOS, 10 may 2018, 6:35pm -- A Tesla smashed through the front doors 
> of a Starbucks in Los Gatos on Thursday afternoon, authorities said. 
> 
> The collision at the coffee shop on the 600 block of Blossom Hill Road 
> was reported just after 4 p.m. 
> 
> The Starbucks was open for business at the time, but no one was hurt, 
> according to the Santa Clara County Fire Department. 
> 
> Urban search and rescue crews examined the building and determined it 
> had sustained only minor structural damage. 
> 
> Damage to the Tesla, which appeared to be a Model S, was also minor, 
> authorities said. 
> 
> Additional details about the collision, including how it ended up inside 
> the coffee shop, were not immediately available. 
> 
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-- next part --
I don?t see anything ?erratic? here, except the driver. Idiots drive Tesla?s, 
too.


On May 11, 2018 at 3:11:15 PM, Peri Hartman via EV 
(ev@lists.evdl.org(mailto:ev@lists.evdl.org)) wrote:

> Almost no reporting on this. Does that mean people are becoming
> complacent with Tesla's that do "erratic" things?
> Peri
>  
> https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/05/10/tesla-smashes-into-los-gatos-coffee-shop/
>  
> LOS GATOS, 10 may 2018, 6:35pm ? A Tesla smashed through the front doors
> of a Starbucks in Los Gatos on Thursday afternoon, authorities said.
>  
> The collision at the coffee shop on the 600 block of Blossom Hill Road
> was reported just after 4 p.m.
>  
> The Starbucks was open for business at the time, but no one was hurt,
> according to the Santa Clara County Fire Department.
>  
> Urban search and rescue crews examined the building and determined it
> had sustained only minor structural damage.
>  
> Damage to the Tesla, which appeared to be a Model S, was also minor,
> authorities said.
>  
> Additional details about the collision, including how it ended up inside
> the coffee shop, were not immediately available.
>  
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>  
>  
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[EVDL] EVLN: EV-newswire posts for 20180509

[brucedp5 via EV]

http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-e-tron-towed-trailered-Vision-Gran-Turismo-racing-EV-tp4690073.html
EVLN: e-tron towed trailered Vision Gran Turismo racing EV
Audi shows all-electric e-tron quattro SUV’s towing capability by pulling
trailer with new electric race car
May. 4th 2018  Audi is trickling down information about its upcoming
all-electric e-tron quattro SUV, which is supposed to hit the market by the
end of the year. Now, they've released images of the vehicles towing a
trailer with its new e-tron Vision Gran Turismo electric race car to show it
has a towing capacity ...
https://electrek.files.wordpress.com/2018/05/a183939_large-e1525439644307.jpg?quality=82=1500#038;strip=all=1600


http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-SF-Motors-new-Milpitas-CA-R-D-bldg-Sabotage-or-Idiocracy-tp4690074.html
EVLN: SF Motors new Milpitas-CA R bldg | (? Sabotage or Idiocracy ?)
Santa Clara-based intelligent electric-vehicle manufacturer SF Motors -- a
division of China-based Chongqing Sokon Industry Group -- has revealed that
it has leased a huge research building in Milpitas. SF Motors is one of the
companies which have been granted a permit by the state's ...
https://evcult.com/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/field/image/sf-motors.jpg?itok=eSvsR9rx


+
https://jalopnik.com/roush-is-building-all-electric-ford-f-650s-now-1825808468
Roush Is Building All-Electric Ford F-650s Now
2018-05-06  Roush CleanTech, a division of the same company that builds
high-horsepower hot rods and runs a NASCAR race team, has developed an
all-electric retrofit drivetrain for Class 6 and 7. The F650, unveiled last
week in Long Beach at the ACT Expo green transport conference, is the first
non-combustion vehicle the ...
https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--yFejXbAV--/c_fit,f_auto,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/adria8qbijqgcspolysl.jpg


(? Sabotage or Idiocracy ?)
https://www.sundaypost.com/fp/faults-force-scotrail-to-pull-the-plug-on-electric-car-charging-points-at-stations/
Faults force ScotRail to pull the plug on electric car charging points at
stations
06 May 2018  SCOTRAIL has been forced to shut all of its charging points for
electric cars after it emerged they were faulty and one had been wired to
the wrong electricity supply. The rail operator has 50 charging points in
its car parks across the country but they have been put out of action for up
to six weeks to allow for emergency ...
https://www.sundaypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/13/2018/05/Electric-car-charger-at-Bathgate-station.jpg-e1525556749281-900x540.jpg


http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVcrash-2fast-teens-burned-in-Tesla-S-fire-Ft-Lauderdale-FL-tp4690071.html
EVcrash: 2fast teens burned in Tesla-S fire Ft.Lauderdale-FL
Teenagers killed in fire after Tesla crashes, battery bursts into flames
May 9, 2018  He said the agency was investigating because there was a
post-crash fire involving an electric vehicle. Earlier this month, Tesla and
the NTSB got into an open ...


http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVfire-Mt-View-CA-Tesla-X-pack-reignits-6Days-later-v-tp4690072.html
EVfire: Mt.View-CA Tesla-X pack reignits 6Days later (v)
Tesla Model X Battery Reignited Days After Fatal Crash
May 10, 2018  The Tesla Model X, like many other electric vehicles, has a
cut loop, or kill switch, which can be severed by fire crews to stop the
flow of electricity in the battery ...
https://youtu.be/lfMVnwVtGog




For EVLN EV-newswire posts use:
 http://evdl.org/archive/


{brucedp.neocities.org}

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[EVDL] EVLN: SF Motors new Milpitas-CA R bldg | (? Sabotage or Idiocracy ?)

[brucedp5 via EV]

https://evcult.com/content/sf-motors-has-leased-huge-research-building-milpitas
SF Motors has leased a huge research building in Milpitas
1 May 2018  Markus Baca

[image  
https://evcult.com/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/field/image/sf-motors.jpg?itok=eSvsR9rx
]

In a recent announcement, Santa Clara-based intelligent electric-vehicle
manufacturer SF Motors -- a division of China-based Chongqing Sokon Industry
Group -- has revealed that it has leased a huge research building in
Milpitas.

SF Motors is one of the companies which have been granted a permit by the
state’s Department of Motor Vehicles for the testing of self-driving
vehicles in Bay Area. The company is also carrying out road tests in
Michigan and China.

According to the details shared by SF Motors, the 136,000 square feet
building which has been leased by the company comprises the whole of the
Building B in the McCarthy Creekside research, manufacturing and industrial
park.

The lease, which makes SF Motors the first tenant at McCarthy Creekside, was
arranged with the help of CBRE brokers Chip Sutherland, Vince Machado, Ben
Knight and Anthony Podesta.

In connection with the massive research building leased by SF Motors, Chief
Technology Officer Yifan Tang said that the new building adds to the
company’s existing R labs. Tang also said that the “new facility will
conduct extensive design validation testing and low-volume manufacturing
necessary to ensure smooth transition to mass production of our batteries
and electric powertrains,” which are the main components of the SF Motors’
vehicles.
[© evcult.com]


https://ngtnews.com/sf-motors-bringing-new-electric-vehicle-rd-facility-to-silicon-valley
SF Motors Bringing New Electric Vehicle R Facility …
Electric vehicle (EV) company SF …


+
(? Sabotage or Idiocracy ?)
https://www.sundaypost.com/fp/faults-force-scotrail-to-pull-the-plug-on-electric-car-charging-points-at-stations/
Faults force ScotRail to pull the plug on electric car charging points at
stations
06 May 2018  SCOTRAIL has been forced to shut all of its charging points for
electric cars after it emerged they were faulty and one had been wired to
the wrong electricity supply. The rail operator has 50 charging points in
its car parks across the country but they have been put out of action for up
to six weeks to allow for emergency ...
https://www.sundaypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/13/2018/05/Electric-car-charger-at-Bathgate-station.jpg-e1525556749281-900x540.jpg
 ...
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/car-charger-grid-forced-to-shut-down-6lmqqgmg9
Car charger grid forced to shut down
May 7 2018  ScotRail has had to shut all of its charging points for electric
cars after it was discovered that they were faulty. One charger in
Pitlochry, Perthshire, had been wired to the wrong supply, leaving the track
operator, Network Rail, to pick up the bill ... (subscription)
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/imageserver/image/methode%2Ftimes%2Fprod%2Fweb%2Fbin%2Feb4e35c8-5164-11e8-b178-bc31026aef36.jpg?crop=3874%2C2179%2C0%2C202=685
 ...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idiocracy
Idiocracy is a 2006 American science fiction comedy film ... people who take
part in a top-secret military human hibernation experiment, only to awaken
500 years later in a dystopian society where anti-intellectualism and
commercialism have run rampant, and which is devoid of intellectual
curiosity, social responsibility, and coherent notions of justice and human
rights ...
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/6b/Idiocracy_movie_poster.jpg




For EVLN EV-newswire posts use:
 http://evdl.org/archive/


{brucedp.neocities.org}

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[EVDL] EVLN: e-tron towed trailered Vision Gran Turismo racing EV

[brucedp5 via EV]

https://electrek.co/2018/05/04/audi-all-electric-e-tron-quattro-suvs-towing-capability-pulling-trailer/
Audi shows all-electric e-tron quattro SUV’s towing capability by pulling
trailer with new electric race car
May. 4th 2018  Fred Lambert

[image  
https://electrek.files.wordpress.com/2018/05/a183939_large-e1525439644307.jpg?quality=82=1500#038;strip=all=1600
]

Audi is trickling down information about its upcoming all-electric e-tron
quattro SUV, which is supposed to hit the market by the end of the year.

Now, they’ve released images of the vehicles towing a trailer with its new
e-tron Vision Gran Turismo electric race car to show it has a towing
capacity.

In recent weeks, Audi unveiled the latest e-tron quattro prototype,
confirmed a ‘starting price of €80,000’ in Germany, and a more ‘realistic’
range of ~250 miles.

Now the German automaker showcased the e-tron quattro SUV’s towing
capability by having it tow the e-tron Vision Gran Turismo. This is the
recently unveiled real version of the all-electric vehicle created for the
Gran Turismo video game, at the GTI Meet event at Lake Wörthersee.

Unfortunately, Audi didn’t confirm the actual towing capacity of the SUV,
but it did release a few images:

Audi e-tron prototype tows trailer with Audi e-tron Vision Gran Turismo
concept car
Audi e-tron prototype tows trailer with Audi e-tron Vision Gran Turismo
concept car

The Tesla Model X is the first all-electric vehicle that can tow a
significant weight. When configured with 22? wheels, the Model X can tow
3,500 pounds and when configured with 20? wheels, the towing capacity of the
SUV increases to 5,000 pounds, according to Tesla.

Of course, those are the official numbers, but owners have tested the
vehicle with significantly more weight. We have seen the Model X pull
250,000 lbs of muck rail cars out of the Boring Company’s tunnel and a
95,000-lb semi truck in the snow.

The Audi e-tron quattro is a bit smaller than the Model X, but it is
equipped with a very competitive powertrain and it should be able to pull
its weight too.

The all-electric SUV is equipped with a 95 kWh battery pack, 3 electric
motors for a total output of 320 kW and it is capable of DC fast-charging up
to 150 kW.

Audi hasn’t confirmed any performance specs yet, but it is expected to be
quite quick with great torque vectoring due to its three independent motors.

Audi says that the vehicle will officially launch later this year.
[© electrek.co]


+
https://jalopnik.com/roush-is-building-all-electric-ford-f-650s-now-1825808468
Roush Is Building All-Electric Ford F-650s Now
2018-05-06  Roush CleanTech, a division of the same company that builds
high-horsepower hot rods and runs a NASCAR race team, has developed an
all-electric retrofit drivetrain for Class 6 and 7. The F650, unveiled last
week in Long Beach at the ACT Expo green transport conference, is the first
non-combustion vehicle the ...
https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--yFejXbAV--/c_fit,f_auto,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/adria8qbijqgcspolysl.jpg




For EVLN EV-newswire posts use:
 http://evdl.org/archive/


{brucedp.neocities.org}

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[EVDL] EVfire: Mt.View-CA Tesla-X pack reignits 6Days later (v)

[brucedp5 via EV]

% Pack reignition was 'Not' a Tesla (nor the EV at fault) issue, but an
unprepared nor EV trained FD staff. It is FD management's responsibility to
use the available free EV-education sources to ensure their staff is
throughly trained. %

https://www.carscoops.com/2018/05/tesla-model-x-battery-reignited-days-fatal-crash/
Tesla Model X Battery Reignited Days After Fatal Crash
May 10, 2018  Brad Anderson

[image  
https://www.carscoops.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/Tesla-Model-X-Fatal-Crash-.jpg


video
https://youtu.be/lfMVnwVtGog
Tesla says Autopilot was on during deadly Mountain View crash
]

It has emerged that the battery pack of a Tesla Model X involved in a fatal
crash in March reignited six days after being extinguished.

On March 23, a Model X driven by a 38-year-old crashed into a safety barrier
on Highway 101 in California, killing the driver and destroying much of the
electric SUV. As it turns out, fire authorities had an exceptionally
difficult time controlling the subsequent fire.

KTVU 2 reports [
http://www.ktvu.com/news/tesla-battery-reignites-days-after-deadly-crash-2-investigates
] that fire crews initially extinguished the blaze in a couple of minutes
but it then reignited multiple times over the next week.

“The battery began to overheat even though we had already cooled the battery
and it continued to reignite. We don’t have the tools to deal with a battery
that is completely, basically destroyed,” Mountain View Fire Chief Juan Diaz
said.

“In this particular case, six days later, the temperature inside those cells
increased to the point of ignition. That’s why the car reignited. You have
stored energy that is frankly unstable.”

Firefighters around the world are being challenged by electric vehicles

The Tesla Model X, like many other electric vehicles, has a cut loop, or
kill switch, which can be severed by fire crews to stop the flow of
electricity in the battery. However, this safety device was destroyed in the
California crash, leaving authorities with no way to cut the power.

Diaz says that the battery was only declared safe two weeks later after the
NTSB and Tesla had de-energized it.

After the crash in California, Tesla issued a statement asserting that its
vehicles are much safer from fires than ICE cars.

“Tesla battery packs are designed so that in the rare circumstance a fire
occurs, it spreads slowly so that occupants have plenty of time to get out
of the car. According to witnesses, that appears to be what happened here as
we understand there were no occupants still in the Model X by the time the
fire could have presented a risk. Serious crashes like this can result in
fire regardless of the type of car, and Tesla’s billions of miles of actual
driving data shows that a gas car in the United States is five times more
likely to experience a fire than a Tesla vehicle.
[© carscoops.com]


https://electrek.co/2018/05/10/tesla-battery-reignited-days-after-catching-fire-crash-ntsb-investigate-fire-response/
Tesla battery reignited days after catching on fire in crash as NTSB ...
May 10, 2018  This time, they are mainly focused on “the emergency response
in relation to the electric vehicle battery fire” as we find out that
batteries from the other crash ...
https://electrek.files.wordpress.com/2018/03/download-7.jpeg?quality=82=all=996=747


'It's a challenge:' High-tech cars pose electrocution risk for firefighters
WPEC-8 hours ago  The National Transportation Safety Board is investigating
a serious crash and fire involving a Tesla electric car that claimed the
lives of ...


(dated)
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVcrash-Tesla-X-airborne-fiery-fatality-Sbound-US101-Mt-View-CA-v-tp4689696.html
EVcrash: Tesla-X airborne, fiery fatality Sbound-US101 Mt_View-CA (v)
Tesla driver hospitalized after fiery crash on southbound Highway 101 Mar 23
2018 A Tesla was involved in a bad crash on southbound Highway 101 near
Highway 85 on Friday ... 
Mar 23 2018




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 http://evdl.org/archive/


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[EVDL] EVcrash: 2fast teens burned in Tesla-S fire Ft.Lauderdale-FL

[brucedp5 via EV]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-05-10/tesla-crash-battery-fire-kills-two-teenagers/9747648
Teenagers killed in fire after Tesla crashes, battery bursts into flames
2018-05-10  AP/ABC

Safety investigators in the US are investigating a crash in which the
battery of a Tesla electric car caught fire, burning two teenagers to death.

A witness to the crash in Fort Lauderdale, Florida, said the Tesla Model S
was being driven fast and spun out of control. It then crashed into a wall
and caught fire.

Police said two 18-year-olds were trapped and died when the car became
engulfed in flames.

Another teenager was thrown from the car and was taken to a hospital, where
his condition was unknown.

The witness said he tried to help the teenagers but the fire was too intense
to get them out of the car.

Lithium-ion batteries like those used by Tesla can catch fire and burn
rapidly in a crash, although Tesla has maintained its vehicles catch fire
far less often than those powered by petrol.

The National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) said a four-person team
would focus on the emergency response to the incident.

It said it did not expect Tesla's semi-autonomous Autopilot system to be a
part of the investigation.

This is the second time in the past two months the NTSB has investigated a
Tesla fire.

A probe is underway into a fire in a Tesla Model X SUV that crashed on a
freeway near Mountain View, California, on March 23.
The driverless car revolution

Soon, you'll be able to do all the things you'd rather be doing while
driving.

NTSB spokesman Chris O'Neil said investigators did not know what caused the
battery fire in this week's crash.

He said the agency was investigating because there was a post-crash fire
involving an electric vehicle.

Earlier this month, Tesla and the NTSB got into an open feud over Tesla's
release of information from the probe into the Mountain View crash.

The agency said it booted Tesla out of a group investigating the crash after
the company prematurely made investigation details public.

Tesla, however, disputed the claim. The company said it withdrew from the
investigation agreement after being told it would be kicked out if it made
additional statements before the NTSB finished its probe in the next 12 to
24 months.

Mr O'Neil said that despite the previous dispute, Tesla would be invited to
be a party to the investigation of the Fort Lauderdale crash.

Tesla has been contacted for comment.

The NTSB normally makes recommendations to other federal agencies such as
the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, which has authority to
impose regulations and seek recalls.
[© abc.net.au]


Factbox - Tesla faces scrutiny after Florida car accident
Reuters UK-29 minutes ago
November 2013 - A Tesla Model S caught fire after the electric car ran over
a tow hitch that hit the undercarriage of the vehicle, in Smyrna, Tennessee.
The driver ...
... 
Video: Officials investigate burned out wreckage of Tesla vehicle after ...
TVNZ-5 hours ago
... investigate burned out wreckage of Tesla vehicle after fatal crash in
Florida ... a severe cra ... 
... 
Witness recalls horror of Tesla crash that killed two teens
Sun Sentinel-12 hours ago
Larry Groshart was waiting in his Fort Lauderdale driveway for a friend to
arrive when he saw a Tesla sedan crash into walls that frame his neighbor's
entrance ...
... 
Autopilot not a factor in teens' death: Tesla
The Telegraph India-16 hours ago
New York: Tesla Inc's autopilot system was unlikely to have been a factor in
a Florida car crash this week which killed two teenagers, the electric
carmaker said ...


https://www.citymetric.com/horizons/toxic-emissions-are-down-people-are-still-dying-air-pollution-3694
Toxic emissions are down – but people are still dying from air pollution
May 9, 2018  In contrast, sales of electric vehicles are growing – though
this trend will need to accelerate if 60 per cent of all new cars and vans
are to be electric by 2030 ...
https://images.theconversation.com/files/206754/original/file-20180216-131003-16xbjqc.jpg?ixlib=rb-1.1.0=45=format=754=clip




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Re: [EVDL] Lithium drop in replacements.

[George Tyler via EV]

Another thing, I see the ebike chargers have 2 voltage pots, I think one 
is for the ballance charge, at reduced current. Have anyone seem this?



On 12-May-18 6:47 AM, paul dove via EV wrote:

Thanks that was interesting. It’s more likely that the Dakota BMS was causing 
the imbalance with parasitic unbalanced loads, however.

Sent from my iPhone


On May 11, 2018, at 11:56 AM, EVDL Administrator via EV  
wrote:


On 10 May 2018 at 6:35, paul dove via EV wrote:

Do you have any evidence of these batteries failing because of out of balance
conditions or is that speculation

The battery I mentioned ("Dakota" brand) was advertised as having a true
balancing BMS.

Discussion of PCBs vs BMSes here:

http://ka7oei.blogspot.com/2013/05/lithium-iron-phosphate-lifepo4.html

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

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Re: [EVDL] Lithium drop in replacements.

[George Tyler via EV]

I have used headway cells, headway specs them as 5% per month self 
discharge! so have close to zero, worse is 5 in practice. found it to be 
a big problem, if you charge every day it's ok, but the ebike i got them 
for may go a while without charging, also, If it is not left on charge 
long enough they still will not equallize. at the moment, there is no 
way to tell when eq is complete, could be 400+ hours if they are out by 
their capacity! I won't use them again.




On 12-May-18 6:09 PM, Cor van de Water via EV wrote:

I also did tests on LiFePO4 cells and while self-discharge was low, I was able 
to prove from my measurements over many weeks, that there is was about a factor 
2 difference in self-discharge current between the best and worst cell. Sample 
size was over 40 cells.
This is exactly what the author of the quoted article found, that the capacity 
of the cells had not degraded, but the cells had gotten out of balance, so the 
protection circuitry allowed an ever shrinking overlap between best and worst 
cell. Simply balancing the cells brought back the original available pack 
capacity, which is logical.
Hope this clarifies,
Cor.

BTW, this email address will soon cease to work, please find me at 
cor.vandewa...@gmail.com


On May 11, 2018 10:58 PM, paul dove via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote:
Actually I do have evidence. I did extensive testing with LiFePO4 cells. I 
found no evidence of self discharge or of balance issues with cells connected 
in series.

Sent from my iPhone


On May 11, 2018, at 4:43 PM, Bill Dube via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote:

Paul,

Do you have any evidence of this or is it speculation?

(Sorry, I just couldn't help myself.)

Bill D



On 5/11/2018 12:47 PM, paul dove via EV wrote:
Thanks that was interesting. It’s more likely that the Dakota BMS was causing 
the imbalance with parasitic unbalanced loads, however.

Sent from my iPhone


On May 11, 2018, at 11:56 AM, EVDL Administrator via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org> 
wrote:

On 10 May 2018 at 6:35, paul dove via EV wrote:

Do you have any evidence of these batteries failing because of out of balance
conditions or is that speculation

The battery I mentioned ("Dakota" brand) was advertised as having a true
balancing BMS.

Discussion of PCBs vs BMSes here:

http://ka7oei.blogspot.com/2013/05/lithium-iron-phosphate-lifepo4.html

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

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EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Note: mail sent to "evpost" and "etpost" addresses will not
reach me.  To send a private message, please obtain my
email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
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Re: [EVDL] Lithium drop in replacements.

[Cor van de Water via EV]

I also did tests on LiFePO4 cells and while self-discharge was low, I was able 
to prove from my measurements over many weeks, that there is was about a factor 
2 difference in self-discharge current between the best and worst cell. Sample 
size was over 40 cells.
This is exactly what the author of the quoted article found, that the capacity 
of the cells had not degraded, but the cells had gotten out of balance, so the 
protection circuitry allowed an ever shrinking overlap between best and worst 
cell. Simply balancing the cells brought back the original available pack 
capacity, which is logical.
Hope this clarifies,
Cor.

BTW, this email address will soon cease to work, please find me at 
cor.vandewa...@gmail.com


On May 11, 2018 10:58 PM, paul dove via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote:
Actually I do have evidence. I did extensive testing with LiFePO4 cells. I 
found no evidence of self discharge or of balance issues with cells connected 
in series.

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 11, 2018, at 4:43 PM, Bill Dube via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote:
>
> Paul,
>
> Do you have any evidence of this or is it speculation?
>
> (Sorry, I just couldn't help myself.)
>
> Bill D
>
>
>> On 5/11/2018 12:47 PM, paul dove via EV wrote:
>> Thanks that was interesting. It’s more likely that the Dakota BMS was 
>> causing the imbalance with parasitic unbalanced loads, however.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>>> On May 11, 2018, at 11:56 AM, EVDL Administrator via EV 
>>>> <ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On 10 May 2018 at 6:35, paul dove via EV wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Do you have any evidence of these batteries failing because of out of 
>>>> balance
>>>> conditions or is that speculation
>>> The battery I mentioned ("Dakota" brand) was advertised as having a true
>>> balancing BMS.
>>>
>>> Discussion of PCBs vs BMSes here:
>>>
>>> http://ka7oei.blogspot.com/2013/05/lithium-iron-phosphate-lifepo4.html
>>>
>>> David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
>>> EVDL Administrator
>>>
>>> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
>>> EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/
>>> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
>>> Note: mail sent to "evpost" and "etpost" addresses will not
>>> reach me.  To send a private message, please obtain my
>>> email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
>>> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
>>>
>>>
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