Re: [Evolution] Evo 3.46: work week calendar display wrong?

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2022-11-16 at 13:52 -0500, Paul Smith wrote:
> And finally, the midnight date is not tomorrow (17th) but rather
> Tuesday (15th)... maybe because the first day shown in my work week
> is Monday (14th)?  Seems like an odd choice.

Did that fix address this bit too?  Or is this an enhancement request?

I have two timezones on my time sidebar: one for my current timezone
(EST) and another for Dublin, 5 hours ahead.

So the "midnight" time in Dublin doesn't show "12 am" or whatever, it
shows the date of the next day, which is nice... but I guess because
this is a "work week" display, it shows the date of TUESDAY (because
it's midnight on the first day in the display, Monday).

It would be nice if it showed the date of tomorrow (Thursday), because
today is Wednesday.

I think you can only see this if you have a second timezone displayed
in the calendar.  I can get a screenshot if this is not clear.
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Re: [Evolution] Evo 3.46: work week calendar display wrong?

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2022-11-16 at 19:58 +0100, Milan Crha via evolution-list wrote:
> it's this one:
> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/evolution/-/issues/2097

Oh yes, so it is.  Thanks Milan!
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[Evolution] Evo 3.46: work week calendar display wrong?

[Paul Smith]

I'm using flatpak Evolution 3.46.1 on Ubuntu 20.04 and I'm seeing
something extremely odd in the calendar, on the "Work Week" display.

Today is Wednesday Nov 16th at 1:45pm.  If I use "Day" view and select
today (via the "Select Today" button) then it shows correctly: I get
the correct day, the red line shows the current time, and at midnight
it shows tomorrow's date (17th) on the sidebar.

Now if I select "Work Week" view it shows the right week, but the red
line shows the right time BUT instead of on Wednesday, it shows on
THURSDAY (tomorrow).

Also, the background of Thursday is highlighted yellow when I assume
that it should be highlighting Wednesday (today).

And finally, the midnight date is not tomorrow (17th) but rather
Tuesday (15th)... maybe because the first day shown in my work week is
Monday (14th)?  Seems like an odd choice.

If I choose "Week" view, then I see that Wednesday is highlighted in
yellow, as I'd expect, not Thursday (I've lost the timeline in this
view though so the other aspects are not relevant).

This is not just today, I noticed it last week too but forgot to send
any email.

Is this just me?  Or are others seeing the wrong day shown in the
calendar "Work Week" view?

Just to preclude obvious things: the date and timezone on my computer
IS correct :).  As above, if I click "Select Today" it does go to the
right day.  Also all my meeting reminders, etc. are correct.  It's only
the display of the specific "Work Week" view that seems wrong.
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Re: [Evolution] Evolution segfault

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2022-11-14 at 15:08 -0600, Tim McConnell via evolution-list
wrote:
> I'm on Evolution version 3.46.1-1 & Libsoup version 3.74.3-
> 1(testing).

I don't think there's any such thing as libsoup 3.74.3.  The most
recent libsoup released is 3.2.2.

Did you mean *2*.74.3?
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Re: [Evolution] Have I pushed Evolution beyond where it is designed to go?

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2022-11-14 at 20:09 +0100, Ralf Mardorf via evolution-list
wrote:
> it was pointed out several times that Evolution downgrades are
> sometimes a problem regarding the user data/settings. Downgrades of
> any software can suffer from this issues.

Of course.  I didn't mean to suggest that somehow flatpak would handle
this; it's not magic.

However, since the OP is using IMAP, GMail, and Exchange none of which
store any critical data locally, you don't need to try to downgrade the
user settings.  You can downgrade the software then recreate the
accounts and not have lost anything (I've done similar things a number
of times over the years).

> Flatpaks and similar approaches make some things easier for users,
> but other things harder and they even don't solve all existing
> problems related to upgrades and downgrades.

I'm not sure what you had in mind when you say "other things harder",
but to me "make some things easier" can be worthwhile even IF it
doesn't "solve all existing problems".  Luckily I'm not waiting for
something that solves all existing problems, or I'd never use anything.

Look, to be clear, if I have the choice between installing Evolution
natively from my distro versus the same version of Evolution in a
flatpak, I'll certainly choose the native distro version.

That's not what we're talking about.

We're talking about either a 2+-year-old version of Evolution from my
distro that doesn't do what I need, versus a much newer version of
Evolution in a flatpak, versus trying to build and install it myself. 
I've been down that road before.

I'm saying that flatpak is a perfectly reasonable technology and I've
seen no real, practical problems with it that would prevent me from
using it, or from recommending that others who need it use it as well.
I HAVE seen a lot of people quite het up about it, but none of the
reasons given (when reasons are given) seem that important to me.

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Re: [Evolution] Have I pushed Evolution beyond where it is designed to go?

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2022-11-14 at 09:19 -0600, Anonymous Japhering via evolution-
list wrote:
> The 3.46.x flatpak series has been a total disaster for me.
> Mysterious segfaults after 15 or so actions.

This is (probably) due to the bug in libsoup, which has been fixed but
that fix has not made it to the releases yet.

https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/libsoup/-/issues/308

> Connection failures right and left.  I manage 8 email addresses. 4
> Google workspace address, 2 Google free gmail address and 2 MS office
> online addresses.  All 8 use Oauth2 to authenticate via IMAP.   At
> the moment, 3 of google address won't authenticate ( 2 paid, 1 free)
> and 1 of the MS accounts also fails.

Hm.  I have 1 IMAP, 2 GMail (1 company 1 private), and 1 Exchange and
all work properly for me.

> When it works Flatpak is a nice tool, a much better alternative than
> trying build Evolution from scratch or running the distro version
> which is on 3.36.5

I just want to make clear that the above issues are not due to
_flatpak_ as a technology (at least there's no proof of that).  They
are due to issues in Evolution 3.46 (or libraries it uses like
libsoup).

IOW, if you had Evolution 3.46 installed natively on your system, not
via flatpak, you'd almost certainly see the same issues.  Flatpak
won't, unfortunately, fix bugs in software it packages :).

The nice thing about flatpak is it's quite simple to install an older
version (e.g., Evolution 3.44) if that's helpful to you.  If you're
seeing crashes that often you may well want to downgrade until the
libsoup issue is resolved in a flatpak.
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Re: [Evolution] Have I pushed Evolution beyond where it is designed to go?

[Paul Smith]

It's clear that no one has any actual pros/cons that they want to
discuss in a serious way.  So, this is my last message on this topic.

I simply urge people to not take these "it's horrible" statements,
without any reference to actual problems that anyone has ever had in
real life and very little understanding of what exactly a flatpak or
snap is, how they are built, or how they work, as gospel.


On Tue, 2022-11-08 at 13:49 -0600, Greg Oliver via evolution-list
wrote:
> Do you really think Canonical understands linux?  They have zero
> developers in the kernel development process, plus Debian only has
> (2) that I know of..  So, please do not use distros as live bait - it
> is inappropriate - you use software from a distro that has no regard
> for how the kernel / OS actually works - just a bunch of js
> programmers.

What in the world does the number of kernel programmers have to do with
the ability to create a reliable flatpak or snap?  That's like saying
someone who doesn't know how to modify a furnace can't be trusted to
create a functional kitchen.

I've interacted with PLENTY of good programmers who develop these
distros and they have very deep understanding of their systems.  If you
think all you need to create a distribution like Ubuntu is a "bunch of
JS programmers" I suggest you try it yourself and see how it goes.

This is just trolling.

> > And, it Just Works.
> 
> Just Works :)
> I like that!
> Until it doesn't

Yes... just exactly like ALL OTHER SOFTWARE EVER CREATED!

This discussion is pointless.
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Re: [Evolution] Have I pushed Evolution beyond where it is designed to go?

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2022-11-08 at 17:07 +0100, Milan Crha via evolution-list wrote:
> the only tricky part is to run it in the flatpak sandbox. It's easy
> once you know how to do it:
> 
>   $ flatpak run --command=sh org.gnome.Evolution

Yes, I am familiar with this since I used it to help you debug the
issue with libsoup last month.

> you can also use:
> 
>gsettings set org.gnome.evolution.shell use-header-bar false
> 
> command to turn off header bar usage,

Oh!  This is **SO MUCH BETTER**!  Thanks Milan.  I wish this could go
back to being the default behavior but at least hopefully it won't be
removed in the future.

Cheers!
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Re: [Evolution] Have I pushed Evolution beyond where it is designed to go?

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2022-11-08 at 09:33 +, Pete Biggs wrote:
> I know this is getting way of topic, but this is primarily why I shy
> away from Flatpak. You download a blob of "stuff" and you have no
> real idea what is in that - it could be some ancient bug-ridden
> library that the dev has decided to use because that's what was on
> their system then writing it 20 years ago and they can't be bothered
> to update it.

I get that people are concerned and there are some legitimate concerns.
But some of these are just due to misunderstandings or NIH syndrome.

First, flatpaks are created from a known set of content which is
described by a declarative file.  The content is controlled so you know
you're rebuilding from the same thing all the time.

Second, flatpaks for Gnome tools such as Evolution are created and
managed by the same people who create the Gnome software.  Snaps are
created by Canonical, for Ubuntu.  They're not just some random
assortment of junk that some hacker cobbled together in their basement
and tossed out on the internet.  If you trust Gnome or Canonical to
create the _software_ you run on your system it seems odd to not trust
them to build a flatpak or snap for it; really there's no one better to
do it.

The content of a flatpak/snap is actually MORE rigorously managed than
whatever assortment of package versions you have currently installed on
your system.

And yes, containers can be leaky.  In fact some of that leakage is
needed (you certainly want to be able to attach files to emails, that
exist outside the flatpak container!)  But the leaks are minimal and
getting plugged more and more every day.  They're very very good by
now.

And with respect to the specific leak mentioned earlier, "dependency
hell", they've never been leaky in that way because that's one of their
primary design goals.

> And the fact that it doesn't interact with anything makes it less
> integrated into your system - unless you go through a load of arcane
> Flatpak command line arguments to make it talk to your environment. 

I didn't say it didn't interact.  I said it didn't _interfere_.  The
Gnome services talk to each other over dbus etc. and of course
Evolution is no exception.  Evolution sends notifications for new mail,
calendar events, etc. to the desktop and all this works correctly, even
though I'm running Gnome 3.36 and Evolution 3.46.

The Evolution database etc. is maintained inside the flatpak container
and it doesn't interfere with the system installed version (if any).

I literally did NOTHING except "flatpak install org.gnome.Evolution"
and it worked.

> Yes, I know it's not that difficult, probably. But it's also not
> always as straightforward as you are making out.

Maybe not always: of course I can't speak to all flatpak packages.

But for Evolution, it absolutely is.

I was skeptical too.  But I needed a newer Evo because my company was
bought and switched from GMail to Exchange, so I tried it.  And, it
Just Works.

I do have many problems with the UI changes introduced in Evo 3.46:
putting buttons for important things on the title bar makes NO sense. 
But, that's not an issue with the flatpak.
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Re: [Evolution] Have I pushed Evolution beyond where it is designed to go?

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2022-11-07 at 16:17 -0600, Tim McConnell via evolution-list
wrote:
> On Mon, 2022-11-07 at 16:34 -0500, Paul Smith wrote:
> > I'm not sure I understand this comment.  The whole point of flatpak
> > (and snap) is that it's not _supposed_ to need to worry about the
> > dependencies of the distribution.  That's why you'd use it.
> > 
> Which is why they are bad ideas to use. There is no way that ARCH or
> Gentoo or Kali use the same dependencies. It's called "Dependency
> Hell" and the theory of FlatPack and SNAP not needing to follow or
> use a distributions is like walking into a [...]

I'm not interested in continuing that unpleasant analogy but I think
you're confused about what flatpak and snap are and what they do. 
There _are_ reasons to want to avoid them, such as startup time and
disk space usage, perhaps memory usage, and, possibly, efficiency of
delivering security updates (but so far that has not been a problem).

However "dependency hell" is absolute NOT one of the reasons to avoid
them: "dependency hell" is exactly what these tools were invented to
solve, and they do solve it very well.

They basically provide a fully self-contained package containing a tool
(like Evolution) and ALL of its dependencies, as a single bundle. 
These dependencies are not installed separately on your system: they
are not visible to any other program "outside" the flatpak.  And the
Evolution in the flatpak doesn't use any of your system libraries, it
only uses the libraries in the flatpak.  So there's no way they can
introduce dependency hell.

As mentioned I'm using Ubuntu 20.04 which has a similar vintage of
Gnome desktop and apps, including Evolution, that the Debian stable in
question uses.  And the flatpak version of Evolution 3.46 works great
on my system.

And if it doesn't work, well, it's a self-contained separate bundle so
you can either just ignore it, or remove it: it doesn't interfere with
anything else on the system.  That's the point.

> It's WHY I run Debian, I can set up the system how I want and just
> upgrade to the newer version. No disk reformat etc etc.

Sure; I used Debian, including testing and sid, for a number of years
(5+) before I got tired of the arbitrary release cycle and switched to
Ubuntu. Ubuntu also does not require disk reformats.

These days even the recent RedHat Enterprise distros can do an upgrade
without reformatting the disk (finally!).
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Re: [Evolution] Have I pushed Evolution beyond where it is designed to go?

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2022-11-07 at 15:15 -0600, Tim McConnell wrote:
> Your problem with using the flathub version is because the Flatpack
> doesn't honor the dependencies of the distribution.

I'm not sure I understand this comment.  The whole point of flatpak
(and snap) is that it's not _supposed_ to need to worry about the
dependencies of the distribution.  That's why you'd use it.

I am using Ubuntu 20.04 which also provides Evolution 3.36 standard. 
I'm not ready to upgrade my distribution, but I definitely need a newer
Evolution.  So, I've installed the flatpak version of Evolution 4.46
and it runs fine for me (except for known issues with this release):

  ~$ flatpak list
  NameApplication ID Version Branch Installation
   ...
  Evolution   org.gnome.Evolution3.46.1  stable system
   ...

I'm not sure about Debian but I don't see why it would be different.

Personally I'd be much more wary of changing sources.list to a
different distro and just upgrading: that seems like a good way to get
a broken system.  At least if the flatpak doesn't work it's trivial to
get rid of it.
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Re: [Evolution] Have I pushed Evolution beyond where it is designed to go?

[Paul Smith]

On Sun, 2022-11-06 at 06:07 +, Mike wrote:
> I purged evolution from the PC, deleted the .config/evolution
> folders, deleted the trash, rebooted, reinstalled at 12:36 and ran it
> at 12:37. I did not import the backup file, so that isn't the
> problem.
> 
> None of these errors are in the VM install though the VM install
> happened only five days ago, both via ftp.debian.org via apt-get onto
> the same computer (one instance the VirtualBox Debian 11.5 and the
> other on the actual hardware running Debian 11.5)  
> 
> Without importing the backup, I see this:

Hi Mike. All of these log messages are just warnings about the
codebase, which should be fixed but don't have any direct impact on the
application (most likely) [1].

Although there are lots of scary messages here it APPEARS that
everything came up successfully. Above you say "that isn't the
problem", but you didn't describe what the problem is.

When you start Evolution (without importing the backup file) what
issues do you have?

The important information we must have to start thinking about a
problem is:

 * The version of Evolution you're using (not the version of the
   distribution or desktop).  You can use Help -> About to find this.
 * The type of email server you are using (IMAP, POP, EWS, etc.) and
   any special/non-default settings you use with it.
 * A concise explanation of the problem you are having.

All the rest of the details, such as which desktop you're using, what
was imported, etc. are almost certainly not relevant (unless the
problem is related to a failure to import etc.) It's fine to include
them but please format your question so that the most relevant details
are clearly stated up at the top, so we don't have to spelunk a long
email of other details to dig them out.

Also helpful is to use a subject line that encapsulates the problem
you're having in a short sentence, rather than one that doesn't help us
find this issue in archives etc.

And finally, it's helpful to us as readers if you avoid complex/fancy
HTML signatures, etc. and stick with just plain text as much as
possible. And we do appreciate if you can trim your replies to contain
only the specific text you're replying to, and not include the entire
email thread in your reply. We have mailing list archives for anyone
who wants to see the history, and including replies makes those more
difficult to read. Evolution makes this easy: just select (with your
mouse) the text you want to reply to and then hit the reply button, and
only that text will be quoted in the reply.

I feel like we got off on lots of probably-not-relevant tangents such
as whether it's better to use a local IMAP server, etc. These are
interesting topics but I doubt very much they're related to the issues
you're seeing.

Perhaps it's best to start a new thread with the details needed to
address one specific problem you are having and see if we can solve it.

Hopefully we can help!!


[1] Just to note, you are using (if I recall correctly) a pretty old
version of Evolution. The current version is 3.46. You are using 3.38
which is 4 releases ago. It's not going to be the case that these types
of warnings will ever be addressed in that old version.
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Re: [Evolution] What do I do now? V2

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2022-11-02 at 16:18 +, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
> > I think that should be possible here as well, no?
> 
> Not sure how that works. Was that email addressed directly to you, or
> was it a general post to the list?

I am also on the network-manager list.

What happened was that someone arranged for a new list to be created on
freedesktop.org (which uses mailmain) and then an administrator for the
Gnome list got all the addresses currently subscribed, and then they
were added to the new list using bulk subscription in the mailman
interface, with a requested approval.

When that happens mailman will email each user with a standard mailman
subscription email (reply or click a link to subscribe) and once they
do the deed, they are subscribed to the new list.  If they don't do
anything, they are not subscribed.

In order for something like that to happen here we'd need (a) someone
to create such a list, and (b) someone with admin privileges to the
current list to get all the subscriber emails so they can be bulk-
added.  I know that moderators don't have such privileges (I run some
mailman lists myself as an admin, with some moderators helping).

Alternatively of course we can announce the new list (as I said before
it doesn't HAVE to be done before this list closes: it can be announced
on Discourse) and let people subscribe on their own.

Note that I personally have not had good experiences with groups.io
lists (as I described earlier) and I'm not really interested in
subscribing to more lists on that service, and so I have not done so. 
But that's just me and of course if that's where others want to go then
they should surely do so.
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Re: [Evolution] Another new mailing list

[Paul Smith]

On Fri, 2022-10-28 at 11:05 +0200, Ralf Mardorf via evolution-list
wrote:
> IMO we should wait for the "official unofficial" new mailing list. If
> the time until the end of life of this list on gnome.org shouldn't be
> enough time, to get the new "official unofficial" mailing list, we
> probably should focus on one temporary Plan B from earth [1].

There's no reason why the "official unofficial" mailing list couldn't
be announced on the Discourse forum once it's decided, if this list is
already gone.

An "emergency list" is not necessary.  It's not like this list is going
away and there is NO replacement.  There is a replacement, that not
everyone is happy with.  If there is a consensus around a replacement
that people ARE happy with, I would hope that someone could swallow
their distaste long enough to post one message to Discourse to announce
the new list.
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Re: [Evolution] New mailing list

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2022-10-24 at 00:51 +0800, Bret Busby wrote:
> For those who are interested, see
> https://groups.io/g/evolution-users
> 
> It is now, up to you to decide what you want to do.

I have no problems with people signing up to whatever they want, of
course, but I have to say that I'm on one or two other groups.io lists
and IMO it's not great.  Messages arrive out of order, sometimes they
never arrive (I get replies to messages I never saw), and often they
take a very long time to arrive (compared to when they were sent). 
And, the threading is often all broken (although some of that can be
attributed to the other people on the list: they are local neighborhood
lists and there are lots of non-technical people who know nothing about
the correct way to manage email, and are using really terrible mail
software).

As problematic as the Discourse email support is, I think I'd prefer it
to groups.io.  Maybe my experience is an outlier.

I don't personally care about all the wingdings on Discourse since I
don't plan to ever use the website.  They can add all the badges and
nonsense they want.  I got promoted a level (I assume to level 1) just
by visiting for a couple of days in a row (to mess with my config) and
reading a few threads (to ensure I was getting the messages I wanted).
I didn't have to "like" anything or use any emojis or anything like
that.  And I don't see much benefit in trying for more than that.


I do believe that this move will result in a decrease in the usefulness
and amount of discussion.  It would be very interesting to come back in
6 or 12 months and compare the traffic to the current list versus the
traffic in Evolution tag on Discourse; I hope someone does that check.
Maybe it will be a net benefit, as people are more able to find and
interact with the Discourse site.  But my suspicion is it won't be.
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Re: [Evolution] What do I do now?

[Paul Smith]

On Sat, 2022-10-22 at 13:55 +0100, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
> So the way to get it working as a proper mailing list is by turning
> off Mailing List Mode. So intuitive.

Agreed it's really poorly named.  I think the idea is that if you
enable it then it's as if the entire Discourse site becomes one huge
mailing list that everyone is sending stuff to.

I don't know why hardly anyone would find that useful.

But, the method of "subscribing to mailing lists" in GNOME Discourse,
is to add tags to your "Watched" list and tell Discourse to email you
about all "Watched" items.


IMO the way the GNOME Discourse site is organized is unfortunate: they
created broad categories like Applications, Desktop, etc.  Then they
use tags to choose specific applications within them.

It seems to me that it would be more useful/usable to create separate
categories for each application like Evolution, etc. then tags could be
used for different types of issues within the application, such as (for
Evolution for example) IMAP, Exchange, UI, etc. etc.  This would also
mean that it would be simple to sort email because the category DOES
appear in the subject of the email, while tags are nowhere to be found.
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Re: [Evolution] What do I do now?

[Paul Smith]

On Sat, 2022-10-22 at 13:42 +0100, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
> I seem to be getting them now. Trouble is, I'm also getting stuff
> that has absolutely nothing to do with Evolution, despite having set
> a tag (or whatever it's called) to "Evolution".

If you set "Mailing list mode" in your Discourse Emails preferences,
turn that off.  If you enable that then your other preferences are
ignored and you just get an email for every post to the site,
basically.

See my other email: I'm not getting anything not related to Evolution
after following those steps.
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Re: [Evolution] Oh for heavens sake ....

[Paul Smith]

On Fri, 2022-10-21 at 21:26 +0200, Ralf Mardorf via evolution-list
wrote:
> As long as nobody succeeded, there is nobody who can help other to
> replicate success. It's at least my {,mis}understanding that nobody
> succeeded.

I overwhelmed by all the email about this topic and just deleted it
all.

You can count me in the category of people who have zero use for web
forums of any type and Discourse is in that category as well.

However I was able to get it to work, without too much effort, using
the example method linked in the announcement (the Gimp example).

I signed up (I used my actual email address to create an account, I
didn't link it to any other online account).

I clicked "all tags" and typed in "evolution" to find Evolution
messages. You can also scroll down in the "tags" list to find it.

Then I clicked the little bell icon on the upper right (next to "New
Topic") and switched the status to "Watching".

Then I went to my Preferences (under the upper right user icon),
"Emails", and changed "Email me when I am quoted, <...>" to "always".

I disabled everything below that ("Activity Summary" and "Mailing list
mode"). My understanding is you really DO NOT want to enable "Mailing
list mode" because it will send you an email for every post to the
Discourse system.

I then got busy and ignored it for a day. Maybe that helped me avoid
odd wait time errors etc. :)

This morning I noticed that I had a bunch of email from Discourse RE
Evolution. I was able to reply to one of those emails, and I see it
showed up OK including quoting etc. I have no idea what my "level" is,
or how to find it: I've not spent any time on the web site. Since I
don't go there, I also don't care about silly things like badges or
whatever.

The Discourse messages are being properly threaded from what I see, but
I haven't used it "in anger" enough to say there aren't some broken
thread issues here, somewhere.

I am having only these problems, already discussed here:

   1. I have no good way to sort email into folders like I used to
  because there are no email headers containing the tags that
  Discourse uses to sort messages.
   2. I have no idea how I can _reliably_ post new topics to the
  Discourse system and have them assigned the right tag, and hence
  get forwarded to other people who are watching the server using
  this method.
   3. Smaller annoyance: it really seems like Discourse batches up
  email and only sends it once an hour or something like that.  I
  could be wrong about this as I've not done any real experiments.
  If that's the case, that would also be frustrating.

These are definitely serious deficiencies in this new service, and I
hope that someone will find a way to address them.

But fundamentally it seems to work, in that I get email and I can
reply. So it meets the bare minimum definition of a "mailing list".
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Re: [Evolution] Automatic tagging as "important"

[Paul Smith]

On Thu, 2022-10-20 at 19:29 +0100, Pete Biggs wrote:
> I had assumed it would be something like that. But what is the header
> that controls it

I believe that checkbox adds this email header:

  Importance: high
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Re: [Evolution] Automatic tagging as "important"

[Paul Smith]

On Thu, 2022-10-20 at 19:17 +0100, Pete Biggs wrote:
> That announcement email seems to have been automatically tagged as
> "important" on my systems (Evo 3.44.4).  I've noticed it happening
> before but largely ignored it.  What is doing it? Is it a general
> "feature" of something in Evolution or is it something I've set up or
> configured.  I certainly can't see what's doing it.

If I understand what you're talking about, the *sender* chooses to mark
the email as "important".  You don't do anything.

In the newfangled Evo interface if you look on the title bar of the
composer window, on the right there's a little email icon with an
exclamation mark in it.  If you hover it says "Set the message priority
to high".  If you click it it will mean that your message is marked
with high priority when the recipients receive it, however their MUA's
choose to make that visible.
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[Evolution] Evolution doing a lot of network traffic to/from Exchange

[Paul Smith]

Hi all;

Every so often I notice that there is a huge amount of network traffic
to/from my system, it can last for quite a while (hour+)

I started up nethogs and I can see that the traffic is between
Evolution and the Exchange server on my system, via port 443 (HTTPS) of
course.  I mean, things like 35 KB/sec upload and 90-110 KB/s download.

I'm not doing anything much with Evolution during this time, just
normal stuff, and I have "Check for new messages" set to 5 min.  Could
it be something with the GAL?  Or something else?

Is there any way to figure out what is going on here?

I'm using Evolution 3.46 (but I've seen this with 3.44 as well I'm
sure) from flatpak, running on Ubuntu 20.04 with Gnome 3.36.8 native.
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Re: [Evolution] Crashing Evolution 3.46.0 ?

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2022-10-10 at 09:46 +0200, Milan Crha via evolution-list wrote:
> Do you have enabled sender's photos, or RSS, or remote content
> loading, or... I do not know off head what all can call libsoup in
> the evolution process while viewing messages, I'm sorry.

Remote content loading is set to "never" but I do sometimes use C-i to
force it on some messages.  However, definitely the crash does not
happen directly when I do that.  It might happen when viewing messages
which contain images that I have cached by running C-i previously
however...?  I get email from various dev service tools like CI/CD and
code review tools, that contain small images that I've previously
downloaded.

Just to note I haven't been able to find a reproducible case here; for
example when Evolution crashes and I restart it and look at the message
that had just been selected when I got a crash, it works fine.

It seems like it must be some kind of timing issue, or something.

I will try to be more aware of what I'm doing when the crash happens,
to see if it's more likely when viewing certain classes of email.

FWIW I don't use RSS and haven't enabled sender's photos.
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Re: [Evolution] Crashing Evolution 3.46.0 ?

[Paul Smith]

On Fri, 2022-10-07 at 15:27 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> I just installed org.gnome.Sdk.Debug flatpak, maybe that has the
> right stuff in it?

I suspect that was it because when I attached to Evolution via GDB this
time, it took about 3 minutes to load all the stuff and get me to a
(gdb) prompt :).

I can see that the gdb process is about 4.5G resident ... yikes!

OK here's the full backtrace with more info, from the previous core.

Is the 0x some kind of overwritten memory due to being
freed, or something?

--
(gdb) bt full
#0  0x7f8002abc8fb in g_mutex_lock (mutex=mutex@entry=0xaab2) 
at ../glib/gthread-posix.c:1529
gaicae_oldval = 0
#1  0x7f7ffc8977d1 in soup_connection_manager_cleanup 
(manager=0x, cleanup_idle=cleanup_idle@entry=0) at 
../libsoup/soup-connection-manager.c:516
conns = 
#2  0x7f7ffc8a8b45 in async_run_queue 
(session=session@entry=0x55e754ed96c0) at ../libsoup/soup-session.c:1821
priv = 0x55e754ed9620
items = 0x0
i = 
#3  0x7f7ffc8a8c35 in queue_dispatch (source=, 
callback=, user_data=) at 
../libsoup/soup-session.c:184
session = 0x55e754ed96c0
#4  0x7f8002a655d1 in g_main_dispatch (context=) at 
../glib/gmain.c:3444
dispatch = 0x7f7ffc8a8c10 
prev_source = 0x0
begin_time_nsec = 92966318517724
was_in_call = 0
user_data = 0x0
callback = 0x0
cb_funcs = 0x0
cb_data = 0x0
need_destroy = 
source = 0x7f7f245bd760
current = 0x55e750584020
i = 0
__func__ = "g_main_dispatch"
#5  g_main_context_dispatch (context=) at ../glib/gmain.c:4162
#6  0x7f8002a65b28 in g_main_context_iterate (context=0x55e75051c4e0, 
block=block@entry=1, dispatch=dispatch@entry=1, self=) at 
../glib/gmain.c:4238
max_priority = 2147483647
timeout = 82
some_ready = 1
nfds = 3
allocated_nfds = 
fds = 
begin_time_nsec = 92966311173981
#7  0x7f8002a65e0f in g_main_loop_run (loop=loop@entry=0x55e750c5b170) at 
../glib/gmain.c:4438
__func__ = "g_main_loop_run"
#8  0x7f8002442145 in gtk_main () at ../gtk/gtkmain.c:1329
loop = 0x55e750c5b170
#9  0x55e74efad86e in main (argc=, argv=) at 
/run/build/evolution/src/shell/main.c:784
shell = 0x55e75057c1f0 [EShell]
settings = 
success = 
error = 0x0

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Re: [Evolution] Crashing Evolution 3.46.0 ?

[Paul Smith]

On Thu, 2022-10-06 at 10:17 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> On Thu, 2022-10-06 at 08:26 +0200, Milan Crha via evolution-list
> wrote:
> > Some info on the debugging of the Flatpak apps is here:
> > https://docs.flatpak.org/en/latest/debugging.html
> 
> Hopefully the next time I get a crash I'll have some useful
> details...

I got a crash but not many details.  I added org.gnome.Evolution.Debug
flatpak but the crash happens in glib and I can't seem to figure out
how to add debug libraries for this, on my system.  Ideas?  I tried
adding org.gnome.Platform.Debug but got no such flatpak.  I just
installed org.gnome.Sdk.Debug flatpak, maybe that has the right stuff
in it?  Anyway I'll let you know when I get the core again.

Anyway here's what the core says:
--
(evolution.bin:37): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: 14:40:45.658: g_object_ref: 
assertion '!object_already_finalized' failed

Thread 1 "evolution.bin" received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault.
0x7f8002abc8fb in g_mutex_lock () from 
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libglib-2.0.so.0

(gdb) bt full
#0  0x7f8002abc8fb in g_mutex_lock () at 
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libglib-2.0.so.0
#1  0x7f7ffc8977d1 in soup_connection_manager_cleanup () at 
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libsoup-3.0.so.0
#2  0x7f7ffc8a8b45 in async_run_queue () at 
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libsoup-3.0.so.0
#3  0x7f7ffc8a8c35 in queue_dispatch () at 
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libsoup-3.0.so.0
#4  0x7f8002a655d1 in g_main_context_dispatch () at 
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libglib-2.0.so.0
#5  0x7f8002a65b28 in g_main_context_iterate.constprop () at 
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libglib-2.0.so.0
#6  0x7f8002a65e0f in g_main_loop_run () at 
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libglib-2.0.so.0
#7  0x7f8002442145 in gtk_main () at /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libgtk-3.so.0
#8  0x55e74efad86e in main (argc=, argv=) at 
/run/build/evolution/src/shell/main.c:784
shell = 0x55e75057c1f0
settings = 
success = 
error = 0x0


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Re: [Evolution] Crashing Evolution 3.46.0 ?

[Paul Smith]

On Thu, 2022-10-06 at 08:26 +0200, Milan Crha via evolution-list wrote:
> Some info on the debugging of the Flatpak apps is here:
> https://docs.flatpak.org/en/latest/debugging.html

Thanks for that info.  I started evolution in the background inside a
flatpak --devel container, then attached to it with gdb -p from within
the container.

Hopefully the next time I get a crash I'll have some useful details...
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[Evolution] Crashing Evolution 3.46.0 ?

[Paul Smith]

Yesterday I updated my flatpak to Evolution 3.46.0 (from Evolution
3.44.x) and I'm having something of a hard time adjusting.  I'm running
it on Ubuntu 20.04 which has native Gnome 3.36.8.

The biggest issue is that this version of Evolution has crashed twice
on me, so far in two days.  I was running from the command line with
some EWS debugging enabled; the failure message is:

(evolution.bin:26): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: 14:50:07.182: g_object_ref: 
assertion '!object_already_finalized' failed
/app/bin/evolution: line 33:26 Segmentation fault  (core dumped) 
/app/bin/evolution.bin "$@"

journalctl reported:

Oct 05 14:50:07 llin-psh13-dsa kernel: traps: evolution.bin[26345] general 
protection fault ip:7fa738e7f8fb sp:7ffc82903e18 error:0 in 
libglib-2.0.so.0.7400.0[7fa738dee000+95000]

Unfortunately because this is a development system I have disabled the
systemd-coredump facility so I don't know how to access any flatpak
coredumps (using corectl doesn't work on my system, because during
development I want my cores to not be "managed" for me).

I don't think I was doing anything particular at the time; it's
possible this happened while email was being retrieved?

I have one IMAPX account, one GMail account, and one Exchange account
using EWS.  The GMail and Exchange accounts are configured via GOA.

If anyone knows how to find these coredumps I'm happy to take a look;
else maybe the above assertion will be helpful in some way.
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Re: [Evolution] Flatpak Evolution Query

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2022-06-07 at 18:21 +0100, Steve Percival wrote:
> I am currently running Evolution from my Distro's(Ubuntu) Repo but
> want to start using the flatpak version. Is there any documentation
> on migrating from a 'native' version to flatpak?
> 
> I am especially interested in how to migrate the preferences/account
> information.

I did this since I was tired of the old Evolution on my 20.04 LTS and
my company forced us to use Exchange.

You don't say what kind of "account information" you have, but Evo will
obtain all the online accounts from Gnome, even inside the flatpak, if
that's the way you have things set up.  Nothing to do here.

I just did the normal Evolution backup/restore and it worked (see the
File menu).
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[Evolution] Bad bug in Evolution 3.44.1

[Paul Smith]

I don't have any hope that anyone can actually make something useful
from this report, but here goes anyway:

I'm on Ubuntu 20.04 but I'm using the Evolution 3.44.1 flatpak to get a
modern version.  I've been using this for a number of months without
problems, including sending other email to this same mailing list.

I just wrote an email to the gcc-help list: I switched the default type
from HTML to Plain Text, then pasted some text and selected the text
and changed the paragraph type to Preformatted, then I edited and
checked and rewrote and futzed with the email for about 15 minutes,
then I sent it.

When it arrived, it looked like this:

https://gcc.gnu.org/pipermail/gcc-help/2022-May/141620.html

That is what the message looked like about 30s after I created it,
right after I pasted the text into it and before I had done any other
editing on it including changing it to Preformatted.  Note that it's
not just that the message cuts off and the rest is missing: changes
that I made to the part of the message that IS present, are missing as
well.

It's appears that Evolution internally froze the content of my message
at that moment, and all the further edits that I made so that the
message looked perfect to me were thrown away when I clicked Send and
that initial frozen version was sent instead.

I looked in my Sent folder and the same content is there as what was
received by the GCC list.

Very bizarre and annoying, sigh.
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Re: [Evolution] Foreground font color?

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2022-03-30 at 16:52 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> On Wed, 2022-03-30 at 10:06 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> > So, I'm using Ubuntu 20.04 but to get a newer version of Evolution
> > I'm using flatpak.  Just yesterday I installed the latest flatpak
> > for Evolution 3.44 and now I'm seeing something odd:
> 
> Hm. I might have to drop back to the earlier version of Evolution.
> 
> Not only am I seeing the font problem, but none of the attachments I
> receive will open anymore.  If I double-click them or use the "Open
> with default application", nothing happens.
> 
> I can save them and open them by hand but that's super annoying.
> 
> Maybe something about Evolution 3.44, even in a flatpak, cannot play
> nicely with Gnome 3.36 desktop (which is what is available on Ubuntu
> 20.04).

Hrm.  I downgraded to the Evolution 3.42.4 flatpak and now I can open
attachments again, but the foreground font color in HTML messages is
still black on very-dark-gray in my system configured for dark theme.

Some aspect of the configuration is still around messing up my view
unfortunately.  But I have no idea where to look for this kind of
configuration :(
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Re: [Evolution] Foreground font color?

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2022-03-30 at 10:06 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> So, I'm using Ubuntu 20.04 but to get a newer version of Evolution
> I'm using flatpak.  Just yesterday I installed the latest flatpak for
> Evolution 3.44 and now I'm seeing something odd:

Hm. I might have to drop back to the earlier version of Evolution.

Not only am I seeing the font problem, but none of the attachments I
receive will open anymore.  If I double-click them or use the "Open
with default application", nothing happens.

I can save them and open them by hand but that's super annoying.

Maybe something about Evolution 3.44, even in a flatpak, cannot play
nicely with Gnome 3.36 desktop (which is what is available on Ubuntu
20.04).
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[Evolution] Foreground font color?

[Paul Smith]

So, I'm using Ubuntu 20.04 but to get a newer version of Evolution I'm
using flatpak.  Just yesterday I installed the latest flatpak for
Evolution 3.44 and now I'm seeing something odd: I use dark mode on my
system and when HTML messages are shown in the message preview, the
background is dark but the text is still black which makes it almost
impossible to read.

I've checked and these are simple HTML messages with no font or color
specification in them.

With the previous version of Evolution, 3.42, the background would be
dark and the text would be light, in this situation.

Is this a bug, or is it somehow related to the "improved" dark mode in
the latest Gnome (which I don't have)?

Is there any way I can force it?
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Re: [Evolution] gmail imapx extremely slow?

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2021-05-18 at 22:58 +0100, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
> Do you have IMAPX enabled for the account?

Yes, it's an "imapx" account type and I have Quick Resync enabled (I
don't know of gmail supports it though) and also "listen for server
change notifications" is checked.

I have "Check for new messages in all folders" unchecked, but "check
for new messages in subscribed folders" checked.  I'm not sure what
would happen if I unchecked that; the docs are not really clear about
exactly what that means and how these options interact.

Oddly I have "show only subscribed folders" unchecked, and yet I only
see my subscribed folders not my unsubscribed folders.

I have all "Options" such as applying filters disabled since I have
created gmail filter rules to filter my email instead.

At the moment my email is fast again.  It's pretty clearly something on
the server side.  Which means I'm unlikely to ever be able to resolve
it and will have to wait and see if Google does something about it.
Sigh.

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Re: [Evolution] gmail imapx extremely slow?

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2021-05-18 at 22:11 +0100, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
> Click on Folder->Subscriptions and uncheck the Sent folder. You may
> also want to disable that folder in Gmail's IMAP settings.

I thought about that but then I'd have to resubscribe it by hand to use
it.  I do actually use my Sent folder once or twice a week or so;
sometimes more often, so this is inconvenient.  But, maybe it's the
best compromise.

What I'd really like is a setting that says, "never update this folder
automatically but when I visit it, update it then".  Or even, a per-
folder setting for the "Check new messages every N minutes" option so I
can have some of my bigger folders like "Sent" only checked every hour
or few hours while still being able to get my Inbox mail more
immediately.

Also I have folders which are never automatically delivered into, they
are only updated when I explicitly move stuff there; I don't need those
to be checked in the background.

But really, I'm surprised that so much effort needs to be spent to
check these folders when they change only pretty rarely.  I had thought
that the newer IMAP servers provided a way to just return new messages
since a given message ID or something like that.  Maybe I'm wrong.

Cheers!

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Re: [Evolution] Evolution where did it move on git naming ?

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2020-07-21 at 16:41 +0200, Ralf Mardorf via evolution-list
wrote:
> On Tue, 2020-07-21 at 09:16 -0500, Japhering, Anonymous via
> evolution-list wrote:
> 
> > My apologies for assuming [...] the Evolution dev team had followed
> > the rest of the software development world in moving away the
> > master/slave terminology.
> 
> I seriously doubt that "the world" moved away from sane terms, that
> are in no way intended to be racist, sexist or otherwise offending.

Can we please, PLEASE not get into this here?  I've read every single
argument there is to read, pro and con, about this issue over and over
on every F/OSS list I subscribe to (and I subscribe to many of them).

There's no point arguing about it because the people who want to change
and the people who don't want to change both understand the position of
the other, but they are never going to agree on a compromise.

It's up to the project developers to decide what to do about this and
we should respect their decision.  It's not our place to decide they're
racially insensitive if they don't change it, or that they're pandering
if they do change it.

As RMS advises, online we should always assume the best intentions, not
the worst.


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Re: [Evolution] Evolution where did it move on git naming ?

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2020-07-21 at 09:16 -0500, Japhering, Anonymous via evolution-
list wrote:
> {
> "name": "bogofilter",
> "buildsystem": "simple",
> "build-commands": [
> "cd ./bogofilter/ && echo \"# Skip for Flatpak
> build\" > doc/Makefile.am && autoreconf -fi && ./configure --
> prefix=/app --disable-rpath --with-database=sqlite3 && make && make
> install"
> ],
> "sources": [
> {
> "type": "git",
> "url": "https://git.code.sf.net/p/bogofilter/git;
> ,
> "branch": "master"
> }
> ]
> },

This is for bogofilter, which is a separate project from Evolution.
 Bogofilter is a generic spam filtering plugin, that many projects use.
 Evolution simply includes it as well.

It appears as best as I can tell, that bogofilter has switched to
"main" as its primary branch name; you can see:

https://gitlab.com/bogofilter/bogofilter/

I don't know if anyone announced this change or if the Evolution devs
are aware of it.

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Re: [Evolution] Latest Evo version

[Paul Smith]

On Fri, 2020-03-27 at 16:52 +0100, Thomas Prost wrote:
> The question that might annoy you: Which distro usually comes with
> the latest evolution version at the moment ?

I think Fedora usually has the most up-to-date versions of Gnome and
Evolution, the most quickly after they are released.

Followed closely by the latest Ubuntu.  There was an unfortunate
tendency for a while for Ubuntu to ship the latest Gnome but provide
the previous release of Evolution, but I think that is no longer the
case.

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Re: [Evolution] New user - please clarify Expunge

[Paul Smith]

On Sat, 2019-07-20 at 13:00 +0100, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
> On Sat, 2019-07-20 at 01:25 +0100, James Freer via evolution-list
> wrote:
> > On Fri, 2019-07-19 at 13:24 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> > 
> > > this is a list for Evolution development.
> > 
> > Well according to the wiki this is the list for users. 'evolution-hackers' 
> > is
> > the list for developers - I thought I was posting in the right place.

Fine, Evolution users then.  I was not precise in my wording.  That has
no impact on my point however: this list is for _Evolution_, not
Ubuntu, and people here have no idea which versions of Evolution are
available on what version of Ubuntu.  In general giving the Ubuntu
release version is only helpful on Ubuntu lists: on other lists it
doesn't mean anything to anyone.

(Just to be clear, I use Ubuntu myself and have for ~13 years so I have
nothing against it or its users)

> This is the right place, however you appear to have posted to the list
> a reply to a private message, which is something to be avoided.

No it wasn't a private message.  It seems that way because my email
service is constantly being greylisted by GNOME (and only GNOME--I
subscribe to a LOT of mailing lists from all different areas and never
have problems with any others) so the copy to the list got rejected. 
Most likely this one will too.  Then in a week or so it will all be
fine again... for a while.

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Re: [Evolution] Evolution & Gmail not working correctly

[Paul Smith]

On Fri, 2018-09-07 at 12:33 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> All that being said, there is currently an upgrade to Evolution 3.28.5
> in the Ubuntu 18.04 "proposed" repo.

FYI as of this morning Evolution 3.28.5 hit the "bionic-updates"
repository in Ubuntu 18.04 so everyone on 18.04 LTS should have it
available.

Cheers!

ii  evolution 3.28.5-0ubuntu0.18.04.1
ii  evolution-common  3.28.5-0ubuntu0.18.04.1
ii  evolution-data-server 3.28.5-0ubuntu0.18.04.1
ii  evolution-data-server-common  3.28.5-0ubuntu0.18.04.1
ii  evolution-plugin-bogofilter   3.28.5-0ubuntu0.18.04.1
ii  evolution-plugin-pstimport3.28.5-0ubuntu0.18.04.1
ii  evolution-plugins 3.28.5-0ubuntu0.18.04.1

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Re: [Evolution] Evolution & Gmail not working correctly

[Paul Smith]

On Fri, 2018-09-07 at 17:16 +0100, Pete Biggs wrote:
> It all depends on your distro.  LTS or Enterprise versions tend not
> to majorly update things for stability. But whereas most such distros
> are happy to update minor versions because they are usually bug
> fixes, Ubuntu, for some reason, seems to stick to the same minor
> version - i.e. 3.28.1, whereas it should be on 3.28.5.

The problem is that Ubuntu doesn't consider Evolution to be part of the
"main" repository, because it's not the standard mail client that
Ubuntu supplies (I believe their standard mail client is Thunderbird).

Personally I think this is a mistake, although at one point it may have
made sense since Thunderbird, while less capable than Evolution, had
(probably for the same reason) less issues.  I'm not convinced that's
decision is still correct, especially given Ubuntu's recent move to be
closer to Gnome.  Maybe it can be revisited between now and Ubuntu
20.04 LTS.

In any event, currently Ubuntu has Evolution in the "universe"
repository and the rules for software updating in "universe", even on
LTS releases, are much different than "main":

  https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Repositories/Ubuntu

All that being said, there is currently an upgrade to Evolution 3.28.5
in the Ubuntu 18.04 "proposed" repo.  Unfortunately I know of no way to
understand why the package is still in "proposed" since it was pushed
there on Aug 13... I had thought proposed packages move into the
mainline faster than that.  Maybe some issue was identified.  Jeremy
has been known to drop in here; maybe he has some insight.

https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/pending-sru.html
(search for evolution)


Of course anyone can add the "proposed" repository to their system and
install proposed updates, if they want to.  Be aware that these are not
finally approved so there may be issues.  You might want to consider
only adding proposed for "universe" (I don't know how well that will
work).

More info:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/EnableProposed
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Re: [Evolution] Deleting Messages

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2018-08-20 at 08:49 +0200, Gary Curtin wrote:
> On Sun, 2018-08-19 at 22:59 +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> > Gary, perhaps it just happened by accident, when you trimmed the
> > quote, but the quote is not marked as a quote.
> > 
> > This happens regularly with Evolution when changing from HTML to
> > Plain Text.
> > 
> > When running into unexpected behavior, please file tickets. 
> > In this case: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/evolution/issues/86
> > 
> > With the same mail it doesn't happen here.
> 
> I guess like the spelling bug, it happens when it happens. I send in
> plain text to two addresses. The other is a colleague, and maybe 2
> out 10 replies to him lose the indicators.

I wonder if it's related, at least somewhat, to the issue I raised here
a month or so ago.  Bug filed as:

https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/evolution/issues/86

As far as I'm aware that's completely reproducible with any plain text
email (it happens every time on all three of my systems using Evolution
2.28.1 and did not happen with 2.26.x).  There seem to be some issues
with quoting in HTML mode in either Evolution or webkit2.
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Re: [Evolution] Evolution 3.28.1: Incorrect quoting of text emails

[Paul Smith]

I got no joy about this so I opened an issue for it:

https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/evolution/issues/86

A fix would be lovely; this is actually causing me some pain.  Even
just a verification that others see it (it's pretty simple to
reproduce) would be nice.

Cheers!


On Sun, 2018-06-17 at 18:10 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> Hi all; I recently upgraded my system to Ubuntu 18.04 which provides
> Evolution 3.28.1 (from Evolution 3.26).
> 
> I've noticed an annoying issue: quoting of quoted messages is broken
> when replying to plain text email in HTML mode.  For example if I
> receive a plain text email and it includes some quoted text like
> this:
> 
> 
> > here is a quote
> 
> and here is a response
> 
> 
> and I reply to this message with my composer preference set to HTML
> mode, then the composer shows a response where the quoted text is at
> the same quoting level as the normal text.  That is, instead of:
> 
> 
> > > here is a quote
> > 
> > and here is a response
> 
> 
> 
> I just get (in HTML of course):
> 
> 
> > here is a quote
> > 
> > and here is a response
> 
> 
> 
> And this is true no matter how many levels of quoting there are in
> theoriginal email, everything is reduced to a single
> level.  Converting this message to plain text doesn't fix it.
> 
> If I'm replying to an HTML email, quoting works properly.
> 
> If I change my composer preference to disable HTML by default, then
> it all works properly: the plain text reply has all the correct
> quoting.  If I convert the message to HTML it keeps the correct
> quoting.
> 
> Has anyone else run into this with Evolution 3.28?
> 
> Cheers!
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Re: [Evolution] Disable Digests? [was: evolution-list Digest, Vol 156, Issue 61]

[Paul Smith]

On Sat, 2018-07-28 at 07:01 -0400, Peter M Buck wrote:
> > I like getting one post per day. This allows me to quickly scan the
> > day's topics without being interrupted multiple times per day. I
> > just signed up for the list last week (and asked for the digest).
> > If the digest is eliminated, I'll probably - reluctantly -
> > unsubscribe. But I'd like to stay informed.

This came up a few weeks ago.

An alternative to digests with similar results is to create a folder
named "Evolution" (or even something more generic like "Mailing Lists")
then create a filter that puts all mail from this list into that
folder.

Voila!  Personalized digestifying, even for lists that don't support
it.
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Re: [Evolution] all of my archived emails dissapeared

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2018-07-18 at 14:31 +0100, Pete Biggs wrote:
> On Wed, 2018-07-18 at 14:51 +0200, Andre Klapper wrote:
> > On Wed, 2018-07-18 at 14:41 +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> > > On Wed, 2018-07-18 at 14:15 +0200, Andre Klapper wrote:
> > > > That's already the case for a string entered in the "Search"
> > > > field. 
> > > 
> > > That might depend on the used theme
> > 
> > True. It works for the standard default GNOME theme though.
> 
> It doesn't for me and I'm using Adwaita which I thought was the
> default.

Ditto here; I've never installed a theme in my life.  I'm using stock
Ubuntu 18.04 (and Ubuntu GNOME before Ubuntu dumped Unity; I've never
used Unity) and I've never seen the search bar change color.  This is
Evolution 3.28.1.

For some reason my email server is greylisted on gnome.org so most of
you probably won't see this email.  C'est le guerre.
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Re: [Evolution] Evolution 3.28.1: Incorrect quoting of text emails

[Paul Smith]

Anyone have any ideas about this?  I've now had to upgrade my work
system and it's much more of a problem there, because I need to send
most of my work email in HTML mode, and it doesn't work as below...

FYI, packages:

ii  evolution   3.28.1-2
ii  gir1.2-webkit-3.0:amd64 2.4.11-3ubuntu3
ii  gir1.2-webkit2-4.0:amd642.20.3-0ubuntu0.18.04.1
ii  libwebkit2gtk-4.0-37:amd64  2.20.3-0ubuntu0.18.04.1 
ii  libwebkit2gtk-4.0-37-gtk2:amd64 2.20.3-0ubuntu0.18.04.1
ii  libwebkitgtk-3.0-0:amd642.4.11-3ubuntu3
ii  libwebkitgtk-3.0-dev:amd64  2.4.11-3ubuntu3



On Sun, 2018-06-17 at 18:10 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> Hi all; I recently upgraded my system to Ubuntu 18.04 which provides
> Evolution 3.28.1 (from Evolution 3.26).
> 
> I've noticed an annoying issue: quoting of quoted messages is broken
> when replying to plain text email in HTML mode.  For example if I
> receive a plain text email and it includes some quoted text like
> this:
> 
> 
> > here is a quote
> 
> and here is a response
> 
> 
> and I reply to this message with my composer preference set to HTML
> mode, then the composer shows a response where the quoted text is at
> the same quoting level as the normal text.  That is, instead of:
> 
> 
> > > here is a quote
> > 
> > and here is a response
> 
> 
> 
> I just get (in HTML of course):
> 
> 
> > here is a quote
> > 
> > and here is a response
> 
> 
> 
> And this is true no matter how many levels of quoting there are in
> the
> original email, everything is reduced to a single level.  Converting
> this message to plain text doesn't fix it.
> 
> If I'm replying to an HTML email, quoting works properly.
> 
> If I change my composer preference to disable HTML by default, then
> it
> all works properly: the plain text reply has all the correct
> quoting. 
> If I convert the message to HTML it keeps the correct quoting.
> 
> Has anyone else run into this with Evolution 3.28?
> 
> Cheers!
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Re: [Evolution] Evolution 3.28.1: Incorrect quoting of text emails

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2018-06-18 at 15:17 +0200, Andre Klapper wrote:
> On Sun, 2018-06-17 at 18:10 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> > Has anyone else run into this with Evolution 3.28?
> 
> Which exact WebKitGTK version is used?

I'm using these versions:

$ dpkg -l \*webkit\* | grep ^i
ii  gir1.2-webkit2-4.0:amd64   2.20.2-0ubuntu0.18.04.1 amd64
ii  libwebkit2gtk-4.0-37:amd64 2.20.2-0ubuntu0.18.04.1 amd64
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[Evolution] Evolution 3.28.1: Incorrect quoting of text emails

[Paul Smith]

Hi all; I recently upgraded my system to Ubuntu 18.04 which provides
Evolution 3.28.1 (from Evolution 3.26).

I've noticed an annoying issue: quoting of quoted messages is broken
when replying to plain text email in HTML mode.  For example if I
receive a plain text email and it includes some quoted text like this:


> here is a quote

and here is a response


and I reply to this message with my composer preference set to HTML
mode, then the composer shows a response where the quoted text is at
the same quoting level as the normal text.  That is, instead of:


> > here is a quote
>
> and here is a response


I just get (in HTML of course):


> here is a quote
>
> and here is a response


And this is true no matter how many levels of quoting there are in the
original email, everything is reduced to a single level.  Converting
this message to plain text doesn't fix it.

If I'm replying to an HTML email, quoting works properly.

If I change my composer preference to disable HTML by default, then it
all works properly: the plain text reply has all the correct quoting. 
If I convert the message to HTML it keeps the correct quoting.

Has anyone else run into this with Evolution 3.28?

Cheers!
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Re: [Evolution] Compiling on Ubuntu 16.04 LTS?

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2018-04-10 at 20:36 +0200, Bjørn T Johansen wrote:
> An alternative is to just use a distro with better support for
> > Evolution (e.g. Fedora), which also meets your VMware requirement.
> > OTOH Ubuntu *may* improve general Gnome support in the future now
> > that it has abandoned Unity.

Just for clarity: it's really not anything to do with Ubuntu's support
of Gnome per se.  Ubuntu has always had quite good support for Gnome;
it just wasn't the default desktop in the past.  It was easy to get
though.

The problem is that the OP wants to use an LTS release.  Suggesting
Fedora doesn't meet that requirement; if they wanted to use a rolling
or non-LTS distro they could also choose Ubuntu 17.10 for example which
has Gnome 3.26 right now.  As you point out, waiting a few weeks will
get them a new LTS distro with the Gnome 3.28 release.

There ARE issues with Evolution on Ubuntu but they're not directly
related to GNOME support.  Basically, Ubuntu chose Thunderbird, not
Evolution, as the main Ubuntu mail client.  In practice that means
Evolution doesn't get updated during a release cycle.  So for example,
right now the version of Evolution available in Ubuntu 17.10 (latest
release ATM) is only 3.26.1 which has a number of known bugs which have
been fixed in later 3.26.x point releases.  Ubuntu doesn't package the
Evolution point releases, so you pretty much jump from an X.1 point
release to the X+1.1 point release, never getting the X.2, X.3, etc.
bugfix releases.

It's possible the LTS releases are better about this, I'm not sure.

At some point I'd like to engage the Ubuntu devs about this and see if
we can do better, but for now that's the way things are.
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Re: [Evolution] Some keys not enterable in search?

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2018-01-01 at 15:36 -0500, andré via evolution-list wrote:
> > > > Ubuntu seems to ship an ancient version.
> > > 
> > > "Ancient version"?  This release is less than three months old. 
> > > I wouldn't call that "ancient".
> > 
> > Maybe "outdated" is a better word in English.
> 
> This exchange reminds me of a common use of "modern" instead of 
> "recent", for hardware less than a year or 2 old.
> "outdated" after 3 months seems a bit extreme.  Maybe better to say 
> prefer to support "latest" version or "current release".

"Outdated" is a perfectly fine term, IMHO.  The release _is_ outdated,
since there's a newer release.  It's just not ancient :).
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Re: [Evolution] Some keys not enterable in search?

[Paul Smith]

Thanks for the pointer Andre.

On Sun, 2017-12-31 at 21:14 +0100, Andre Klapper wrote:
> > I'm using Ubuntu 17.10 / Evolution 3.26.1.
> 
> Ubuntu seems to ship an ancient version.

"Ancient version"?  This release is less than three months old.  I
wouldn't call that "ancient".

In the past Ubuntu has shipped Evolution from a complete GNOME release
cycle back, or even two at times, that's true, but let's give them to
credit for better behavior when they exhibit it: the version they ship
with 17.10 (released in mid-October) was the most current version at
that time (3.26.1, released 02 Oct).

The problem currently with Ubuntu is that since Evolution is not part
of the main distribution, they don't seem to update to the newer stable
releases such as 3.26.2, 3.26.3, etc.
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[Evolution] Some keys not enterable in search?

[Paul Smith]

Here's something super-strange: I can't type the numbers 0-5 into the
search bar (the one at the top of the vertical view showing both
subjects and message preview) in Evolution!!

Can anyone else see this? I can enter all the alphabetic and special
characters that I tried, plus the numbers 6, 7, 8, and 9, but not 0
through 5...?!?!?! It does work to enter the special characters )!@#$%
(shifted 0-5). Of course, the numbers work fine elsewhere.

I'm using Ubuntu 17.10 / Evolution 3.26.1.
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[Evolution] Allow URLs in "Location" fields to be clickable

[Paul Smith]

Hi all; I filed https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=790263
requesting that URLs in Calendar Location fields be made clickable. 
These days more and more meetings are happening online and so Location
fields very often have URLs in them; it's a pain to have to copy/paste
them separately into a browser (especially since the Location text in
the Calendar reminder popups isn't selectable at all).

(currently using Evolution 3.26.1 on Ubuntu 17.10)

Cheers!
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Re: [Evolution] Evolution Reports Many Errors

[Paul Smith]

On Sat, 2017-11-11 at 16:47 -0800, Jonathan Ryshpan wrote:
> Does anyone know what's going in?  Is it anything to worry about?  Is
> there any obvious problem to be fixed?

What version of Evolution are you using?  What distribution of
GNU/Linux?

Is your mail server using a standard IMAP service or is it Gmail or
something else?  How have you configured your trash folder on the IMAP
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Re: [Evolution] "You have Unsent Messages"

[Paul Smith]

Sorry, ignore me.  Reading comprehension failure.


On Fri, 2017-11-03 at 13:09 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> On Fri, 2017-11-03 at 16:57 +, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote:
> > Just re-enabled it and yes there were indeed three messages sitting
> > in the Outboxnot sure why they were...
> 
> Go to Edit -> Preferences and under Mail Accounts select the email
> account you're sending mail with and click "Edit".
> 
> Select the "Defaults" menu on the left side, and see what the value
> of "Sent Messages Folder" is.  It should be checked, and the "Sent"
> or "Outbox" or whatever folder in your mail account should be
> listed.  If not, click it and select the correct folder.
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Re: [Evolution] "You have Unsent Messages"

[Paul Smith]

On Fri, 2017-11-03 at 16:57 +, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote:
> Just re-enabled it and yes there were indeed three messages sitting in
> the Outboxnot sure why they were...

Go to Edit -> Preferences and under Mail Accounts select the email
account you're sending mail with and click "Edit".

Select the "Defaults" menu on the left side, and see what the value of
"Sent Messages Folder" is.  It should be checked, and the "Sent" or
"Outbox" or whatever folder in your mail account should be listed.  If
not, click it and select the correct folder.
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Re: [Evolution] Bug 738247 - unwanted information disclosure in message headers

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2017-10-10 at 19:10 +0100, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
> On Tue, 2017-10-10 at 19:56 +0200, Milan Crha wrote:
> > > I don't really want to comment on the bug) but would err on the
> > > side of leaving things as they are - it just looks less spammy.
> > 
> > Is 'err' a typo? I'm afraid I do not follow, if not.
> 
> "To err" is correct English for "to make a mistake". In this case
> Pete is saying that it's preferable to leave things as they are, even
> though that might (in theory) be wrong, because changing them might
> (in theory) lead to worse results.
> 
> English grammar is fun :-)
> 
> "To err is human, to forgive divine" - Alexander Pope

Also, "err on the side of ..." is a common idiom:

http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/err+on+the+side+of


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Re: [Evolution] Automatization Outlook Users migrations to Evolution

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2017-09-25 at 07:55 -0500, Len Philpot wrote:
> > the 3.18.5 is truly old. There had been added some
> > autoconfiguration
> 
> That's the version in the *buntu repositories, from what I've seen,
> nothing newer. It's what I'm running now.

Maybe you mentioned before what version of Ubuntu you're running, but I
missed it.  I'm using Ubuntu 17.04 and I have Evolution 3.22.6
installed, so it's not true that there's nothing new available in the
Ubuntu repositories.

Now, if you're using an older version of Ubuntu (for example Ubuntu
16.04 LTS), then you'll get the version of Evolution that was released
in early 2016 (plus bug fixes).  The entire point of an LTS release is
that they don't install major updates--that's why people use it.

> Is the only option for a newer version to build from source? I've
> built more than a few packages over the years, but Evolution's
> dependencies are fairly strong. Looks like a simple 47 step process
> :-) 
> 
> Is there a PPA somewhere of a more recent version?

Evolution is part of the GNOME system; it's not very easy to upgrade
Evolution without also upgrading the rest of GNOME.  Usually Evolution
is expected to work with the current and previous version of GNOME...
but you're multiple versions of GNOME behind, so upgrading just
Evolution and keeping the rest of GNOME at that older version will be
problematic.

You can look at the Gnome3 Staging PPA:

https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+archive/ubuntu/gnome3-staging?field.series_filter=xenial

It appears to have Evolution 3.20.5 installed, which is newer than what
you have but still not all that new.  I can't say how reliable that
upgrade is.

The best way to get a newer Evolution is to upgrade to a newer release
of Ubuntu.
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[Evolution] Evo 3.22.3: Inoperable horizontal scroll?

[Paul Smith]

Hi all.  I'm using Ubuntu 16.10 with the latest Evo 3.22.3 from the
"Ubuntu Proposed".  However, this problem happened with Evo 3.22.1 as
well.

I have an issue where sometimes in the Preview pane when the content of
the message (html message) is too wide to fit in the pane I get a
horizontal scroll bar, but it doesn't work.  I can't click on it, I
can't drag it, etc.

The scroll bar shows up normally (that is it's small when it's not
"active" then when I mouse over it it gets bigger), but it's frozen at
the far left.

If I open the message in a new window (double-click) and make the window
small enough to get the scroll bar to appear, the same thing happens
(scroll bar is frozen).

I can use arrow keys to scroll sideways but not the scroll bar.

Note this doesn't happen for every HTML message which is too wide, but
it happens very often to me.  Most often on email from my code review
tool which contains a lot of tables used for formatting.

Anyone else seeing this?
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Re: [Evolution] Exchange Calendar Stopped Syncing since 3.22.3

[Paul Smith]

On Thu, 2016-12-22 at 10:23 -0500, Benjamin Selzer wrote:
> Updated to 3.22.3, and (I believe) since that update, my Exchange (EWS)
> calendar no longer syncs. [...]
> Nor will they show up in Gnome Calendar, nor in my Shell drop down top
> bar calendar. So perhaps the problem is more widespread. Is Gnome
> Calendar or GOA broken again?

FWIW, since updating to Evo 3.22.3 in Ubuntu 16.10 proposed, my Google
calendars, tasks, etc. are all working great again... so it's not
generic to Calendar or GOA.

Maybe an issue with Exchange/EWS only...?
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Re: [Evolution] Gmail integration w. Evolution

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2016-11-02 at 11:56 +, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
> On Wed, 2016-11-02 at 06:19 -0400, benjamin.sel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > The most important folder in Gmail (namely ALL MAIL) is one of these
> > stupid subs. As is SENT, which I often use. It's just annoying. No big
> > deal though.
> 
> I guess everyone has their own requirements. I absolutely never look at
> All Mail. In fact I don't even have it subscribed in Evolution.

+1.  Evolution can already search all folders in a given account so
what's the point of having "All Mail" which just duplicates it?

Anyway, I don't care: everyone has their own way of doing things.  All
I'm saying is that the OP says he likes the Thunderbird model but
doesn't like the Evo model.  I'm trying to understand what the pertinent
difference is because to me, based on provided information, they look
identical.
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Re: [Evolution] Gmail integration w. Evolution

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2016-11-01 at 19:39 -0400, Benjamin Selzer wrote:
> I understand. He doesn't want the Gmail folders as a SUB of Gmail. He
> wants them on the same level as Inbox, etc. It's annoying they're in a
> sub called Gmail.

The only folders under [Gmail] are Gmail's special folders like Spam,
Trash, etc.  I virtually never use those anyway (the only one I use at
all is "Sent Mail", and not very often).

All my folders that I created myself are not under [Gmail], they appear
as normal folders.

Based on the link provided by the OP:

> https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/thunderbird-and-gmail

this is EXACTLY how Thunderbird also does it.  The images are virtually
identical to Evolutions.

So I just don't understand what he's looking for.
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Re: [Evolution] Gmail integration w. Evolution

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2016-11-01 at 16:37 +0100, Bart Vliegen wrote:
> Thunderbird has its own implementation
> of Gmail-style IMAP. You can read about it here:
> https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/thunderbird-and-gmail

I may have lost some context, but my Evo GMail accounts look _exactly_
like the pictures of Thunderbird's email integration with GMail in the
link you've provided.

This is how it worked by default, I didn't have to do anything special.

I've attached a small picture.

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[Evolution] Evo 3.22: Can't connect to Google calendars

[Paul Smith]

Hi all; I just updated to Ubuntu GNOME 16.10 yesterday, which contains
Evolution 3.22.0.  Things are working fine with Email, but none of my
Google calendars work anymore either in gnome-calendar or in Evolution.

Looking at error logs I get a ton of instances of these sorts of errors:

Oct 16 08:51:01 homebase gnome-shell-cal[4508]: Error opening calendar 1
472049368.29988.15@homebase: Cannot open calendar: Failed to login to
the server: Daily Limit for Unauthenticated Use Exceeded. Continued use
requires signup.
Oct 16 08:51:02 homebase gnome-calendar[18650]:
source_credentials_required_cb: Failed to authenticate 'm...@gmail.com':
Failed to login to the server: Daily Limit for Unauthenticated Use
Exceeded. Continued use requires signup.
Oct 16 08:51:04 homebase evolution-calen[4777]: ecb_gtasks_start_update:
assertion 'cancellable != NULL' failed
 ...
Oct 16 09:05:27 homebase evolution-calen[4740]: (e-
source.c:4518):e_source_invoke_credentials_required_sync: runtime check
failed: (dbus_source != NULL)
Oct 16 09:05:27 homebase evolution-calen[4740]: caldav_do_open: Failed
to call credentials required: Unknown error
Oct 16 09:05:27 homebase gnome-shell-cal[4508]: Error opening calendar 1
472049340.29988.7@homebase: Cannot open calendar: Data source 'Contacts'
does not support OAuth 2.0 authentication

Etc. for all my difference calendars (across 2 gmail accounts).

Email is working fine as far as I can tell so far.  Also, my contacts
appear to be working.  To be clear I can of course still reach my
calendars via the web :).

The gmail accounts were originally added with GOA.  I deleted one of my
gmail accounts from GOA and re-added it with GOA but got the same
behavior.  Then I deleted the account from GOA and tried to add it
directly into Evolution using Evolution Preferences, but that also gave
me the same behavior.

I've googled around and found a number of references to these kinds of
issues but all of them seem to be related to older versions of Evolution
 (which I didn't have any issues with actually).

Any thoughts about what I should do next as far as debugging goes?
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Re: [Evolution] Message display width too large

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2016-09-06 at 16:35 +0200, Milan Crha wrote:
> that's https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=739955

Thanks Milan.  I've not had a buildable version of Evo here for a number
of years so currently I'm not able to try the patch, but I've added
myself as a CC on the bug.
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Re: [Evolution] Message display width too large

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2016-09-06 at 08:36 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> One thing that is annoying me supremely with Evo these days is how wide
> the display of HTML messages is.

Gak.  I'm using Evolution 3.20.5 on Ubuntu GNOME 16.04.1.  Sorry :-(.
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[Evolution] Message display width too large

[Paul Smith]

One thing that is annoying me supremely with Evo these days is how wide
the display of HTML messages is.  It's very often wider than the preview
window I use (which is plenty wide enough... probably about 45% of my
wide-screen display) which means text is filled to that width and I'm
constantly scrolling left and right to try to read messages.  It's quite
infuriating.

I've tried to get a handle on what is causing these extra-wide panels
and at least in some cases it appears to be long URLs in the signature.
 As part of my work I'm subscribed to many Google groups and they all
have a standard signature added to the bottom something like:

> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "Foo" group.
> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> > email to foo+unsubscr...@gmail.com.
> > To post to this group, send email to f...@gmail.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/a/gmail.com/d/msgid/foo/verylongbase64encodedurlprefix%40mail.gmail.com.

In my experimentation it appears that the entire message is sized such
that that final URL can appear in the window without breaking it, and
tall other divisions and spans are also sized to match that.  I have to
admit that not all messages that come through the list have this issue
but many do.

This is really not good.  Even if there are some spans/divs which are
too wide for the pane the others should all be sized to appear within
the pane without scrolling.  E.g., it should be possible to have: 

 |-panel width--|
  some text some text some
  text some text some text

  verylongunsplittablelinewhichforcesthewidthtobelong
 |-panel width--|

Rather than what we get now where the entire message is filled to the
longest unsplittable line:

 |-panel width--|
  some text some text some text some text some text

  verylongunsplittablelinewhichforcesthewidthtobelong
 |-panel width--|

I don't know if there's anything Evo can do about this or whether it
just hands the entire content of the email over to Webkit and it's
Webkit that makes these decisions, but this issue really impacts the
usability of Evo (for me anyway).
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Re: [Evolution] Endless "Empty cache file" errors

[Paul Smith]

On Thu, 2016-08-11 at 13:26 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> I have seen, but only rarely, a different problem where the message
> cannot be displayed in the preview pane and instead I get an error
> there.  I don't have error message details unfortunately but next
> time I see one I'll try to get a copy.

This just happened: error message:

  Unable to retrieve message.

  Empty cache file: /home/psmith/.cache/evolution/mail/1469455438.25687
.18@pdsdesk/folders/INBOX/cur/11/38202

This appears in the message preview pane, for an email retrieved from
my GMail account.

Selecting another message and switching back causes the message to show
up, so it's pretty clearly some kind of timing thing.
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Re: [Evolution] Endless "Empty cache file" errors

[Paul Smith]

On Thu, 2016-08-11 at 20:03 +0300, Robert Munteanu wrote:
> I am no longer able to reproduce the bug, since this bug motivated me
> to finally implement mail filtering server-side using sieve and I
> gave up the evolution filters.

I have no filtering rules on my system and see it all the time.  I do
have Junk filtering enabled, using bogofilter, though... that seems to
be sufficient to trigger the bug.  It may be enough to just enable it
on your existing account.

I'm out on vacation starting Friday so it's unlikely I'll have any free
time to do some debugging before then (as typical, you have to work
twice as much as normal to get ready for vacation :)).


I do want to make something clear: the issue I'm talking about is when
you get a blue error bar above the message list and preview (I use
side-by-side mode).  There's no problem viewing messages: it appears
just fine.  It's just there is very commonly an error bar.  There's no
need to restart Evo or anything to see messages, and clicking the "X"
in the upper right corner will dismiss teh error bar (until next time).

I have seen, but only rarely, a different problem where the message
cannot be displayed in the preview pane and instead I get an error
there.  I don't have error message details unfortunately but next time
I see one I'll try to get a copy.  In this case, I have to select some
other message, then select back again in order to see the body of the
message.  I don't remember ever having had to restart Evolution to read
messages.

Some people seem to be talking about the second problem, where messages
aren't displayed at all and they have to go to more extreme lengths to
fix it.
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Re: [Evolution] Endless "Empty cache file" errors

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2016-08-10 at 22:02 +0300, Robert Munteanu wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 10, 2016 at 9:54 PM, Adam Tauno Williams
>  wrote:
> > On Wed, 2016-08-10 at 11:40 -0700, fmouse wrote:
> >> I'm having the same problem with evolution 3.18.5.2. It happens when
> >> new mail comes in while evolution is open and running, and the new
> >> mail is inaccessible and trying to open it gives "Unable to retrieve
> >> message. Empty cache file: /home/ etc." I researched the problem
> >> and a few days ago read that this is a known problem and to date
> >> there's no know fix,
> >
> > I've never seen such a message [speaking as a 24/7 Evolution user for
> > more than a decade].
> 
> I see this continuously for one of my accounts - IMAPx with local
> filtering set up. The EWS account does not exhibit this problem, but
> there the filters are server-side.
> 
> Here are just a couple of bugzilla entries related to this issue
> 
>   https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=769011
>   https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=767564
> 
> Running Evolution 3.20.4 FWIW.

I see this all the time as well.  It seems like more often than not I
have a blue bar at the top of my Evo mail display with an error like
this in it.  In fact there's one there right now.  I have >100G free on
my /home partition.

I have one IMAPX account for my ISP, and two GMail accounts.  I have my
accounts configured to use Bogofilter for junk, but NO OTHER FILTERS
are enabled on my work system; I have GMail do some filtering for me on
my work account.  On my home system I have a bunch of filters on my
IMAPX account.

I just click the "X" to close the error box and move on.  Sometimes I
even get an error in the preview section saying the message can't be
loaded and I have to select another message, then come back to the
first one and it displays.  This is probably a different problem
though.

I will confess that I am so busy and overworked that I haven't had the
energy to look into it at all, so I am not blaming anyone... just
saying this is not an unusual or rare problem (at least not in my
experience).  I feel embarrassed enough about my lack of effort here
that I was compelled to send this email :).

I'm using Evo 3.18.5.2 on my Ubuntu GNOME 16.04.1 system at work, and
see the same thing at home on my Ubuntu GNOME system where I've enabled
the GNOME preview PPA and I'm running Evo 3.20 of some vintage (I'm not
there so I can't tell you exactly).
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Re: [Evolution] Bogofilter stopped working suddenly?

[Paul Smith]

On Thu, 2016-03-24 at 16:33 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> But as above, I see all spam email being determined inconclusive:
> 
>  Sender 'Wireless Security Camera Options <
> wirelesssecuritycameraopti...@croakita.top>' in book? 0
>  Junk filter classification: inconclusive
>  Message is determined to be clean
> 
> No matter how much I train I still get inconclusive.  So maybe this 
> is an issue with bogofilter not Evo.

I deleted my bogofilter wordlist database file and after some re
-training things are working again.

That's weird: I've used bogofilter for many many years and never had an
issue.  Oh well.  Never mind! :)
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Re: [Evolution] Bogofilter stopped working suddenly?

[Paul Smith]

On Thu, 2016-03-24 at 09:31 +0100, Milan Crha wrote:
> to properly do any spam filtering evolution needs to download whole
> message and pass it to the spam-detection software
> (bogofilter/spamassassin). The error says that the message download
> failed, though the reason ("junk-test") is rather misleading.

This may be a red herring; it hasn't reappeared even though I've gotten
plenty of spam since then.

> I suppose evolution console doesn't show anything useful, does it?

By "console" do you mean whatever Evo prints to stdout/stderr?  I
normally start it from GNOME Shell and I have no idea where the output
goes.  However see below.

> Can you run /usr/bin/bogofilter and pass to it a message content, 
> which is supposed to check whether the message is or is not a spam,
> reporting it with the exit code? The command can be:
> 
>$ /usr/bin/bogofilter <~/.local/share/evolution/mail/local/...

I saved a spam message as mbox and ran bogofilter on it and it exited
with 2 (unsure).

> eventually with added argument --unicode=yes, if you have the convert
> to unicode checked. You can also try to run evolution with:
> 
>   $ CAMEL_DEBUG=junk evolution
> 
> to get some debugging around the junk processing.

OK I did this.  It's a little annoying that the debugging rarely flushe
s.  It took me a while to realize that I was getting no output just
because I hadn't waited long enough, then it spewed out in a big chunk
:).

But as above, I see all spam email being determined inconclusive:

 Sender 'Wireless Security Camera Options 
' in book? 0
 Junk filter classification: inconclusive
 Message is determined to be clean

No matter how much I train I still get inconclusive.  So maybe this is
an issue with bogofilter not Evo.

One thing I don't understand is why my bogofilter wordlist file is not
being updated, unless I explicitly train (with CTRL-J to specify spam).
 Doesn't Evo train all email?
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Re: [Evolution] Bogofilter stopped working suddenly?

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2016-03-23 at 15:50 -0400, Paul Smith wrote:
> Now all of a sudden Bogofilter is no longer working.  Spam is not
> filtered out of my inbox and I can see that the timestamp on my
> bogofilter wordlist does not change when I fetch new email.  I can
> still mark messages as junk in Evo and I can see that change the
> timestamp on my wordlist.  So, it's just the ham/spam categorization
> which is not working.

I just noticed Evo throw this error in a blue bar at the top of my
summary:

Execution of filter 'Junk check' failed: Error executing filter search:
Failed to retrieve message: (junk-test)

Anyone have any idea what that might mean, and if it's relevant?
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[Evolution] Bogofilter stopped working suddenly?

[Paul Smith]

I'm using Evo 3.16.5 on Ubuntu GNOME 15.10.  I have 2 GMail accounts
and one IMAP (ISP) account configured.

Yesterday I noticed that I had a message in one of my GMail accounts
that wouldn't go away from Evo and if I tried to delete it Evo went
into some kind of constant download loop.  I decided to delete my cache
(rm -rf ~/.cache/evolution/mail/) and see if that helped.

It did help that problem but...

Now all of a sudden Bogofilter is no longer working.  Spam is not
filtered out of my inbox and I can see that the timestamp on my
bogofilter wordlist does not change when I fetch new email.  I can
still mark messages as junk in Evo and I can see that change the
timestamp on my wordlist.  So, it's just the ham/spam categorization
which is not working.

Just to be clear, I did check my IMAP account's settings and "check new
messages for Junk contents" is checked, and in the Junk tab of Mail
Preferences I have "Check incoming messages for junk" checked and the
Junk filtering software dropdown is set to Bogofilter.

I know, right, what could deleting my email cache have to do with
bogofilter?  I don't know, I'm just reporting what happened :).  Maybe
it's a coincidence, but I restart Evo fairly regularly, plus I have a
system at home with the same accounts configured and running the same
distro / version of Evo, and bogofilter still works there (so it
doesn't seem like a package update broke this).

Can someone suggest some debug/log settings I could enable to track
what's going on to see if there are errors etc. invoking bogofilter, th
at might help me see what's happening?
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Re: [Evolution] Evolution crashes on startup

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2015-12-07 at 11:19 +, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
> On Mon, 2015-12-07 at 12:03 +0100, Tom wrote:
> > Am Sonntag, den 06.12.2015, 22:17 -0500 schrieb David Elwell:
> > (...) 
> > > 
> > > Replaced Ubuntu 14.04 with 15.10 (Evolution 3.16.5) yesterday. All
> > > appears Ok. Thank you all for your help.
> > 
> > Would you keep us updated about your system's health ?
> 
> Please don't. This is an Evolution list. Discussion of problems
> specifically with Evolution are welcome (including installation
> problems), but discussion on keeping some version of some Linux distro
> up to date should be carried out on that distro's mailing lists.

Tom, I suggest you subscribe to ubuntu-gn...@lists.ubuntu.com and
discuss these issues there: many people on that list will be interested
in your experiences with the gnome3-staging PPA including the people
doing the development.

https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-gnome

Cheers!
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Re: [Evolution] Need config help on Evolution email client

[Paul Smith]

On Thu, 2015-12-03 at 13:26 -0500, Mark Foley wrote:
> > As others have said, it appears that 3.10 on Ubuntu 14.04 is broken in
> > various ways (it's to do with the Ubuntu packaging - 3.10 was fine on
> > other systems).  3.10 is also very old now and unsupported.
> 
> So, your recommendation? Should I get the latest stable release? I
> assume that would be 3.18.2 from
> https://download.gnome.org/sources/evolution/3.18/. Or do you think
> that wouldn't work on Ubuntu. Any idea why the Ubuntu folks have not
> kept this updated?

Ubuntu is no different than any other distribution: Red Hat, Fedora,
SuSE, etc.  If you use a distribution release which is going on 2 years
old, then the software versions in that release will be old and not
supported upstream.  Release-based distributions don't put newer
versions of software in already-published releases.

This is quadruply-true of Evolution which is NOT a stand-alone
application like Firefox etc.: it's an integrated component of the GNOME
desktop.  If you want a newer version of Evolution you'll have to
upgrade to a newer version of the entire GNOME desktop.

If you want a newer version of Evolution, then simply upgrade your
version of Ubuntu.  If you switch to the current Ubuntu 15.10 release (I
personally prefer the Ubuntu GNOME version, not native Ubuntu, but
whatever) then you'll get Evolution 3.16.5 which is not the latest but
is much closer.


[1] There are exceptions, usu

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Re: [Evolution] Fwd: Mail in Evolution disappearing - mystery deepens

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2015-12-02 at 13:21 -0500, dave boland wrote:
> Am I correct in thinking POP did download the messages for local
> storage?

Correct.  This is the major difference between POP and IMAP.

POP is a simple delivery facility for email: when you access it it
downloads the entire mailbox from the server to your local system then
(by default) deletes the content on the server.  So your local system's
version is the one true version of your mail that has already been
delivered.  Some POP servers support options to not delete the content
on the server, but that means they'll all get downloaded again next
time.  Also you can't "upload" things to a POP server so information
like what messages you've replied to, what's been deleted, etc. cannot
be updated on the server.  It all exists only on your local system.

IMAP is fundamentally different: the master copy of mail is left on the
IMAP server and your local mail client interacts with the server to
perform actions like retrieve mail, delete mail, move messages between
mailboxes, etc.  This lets you have multiple mail clients access mail
and see a relatively up-to-date view of your mail.  It also means that
any messages stored locally on your system are merely cached there for
performance reasons, and you can delete your local disk cache and they
will not be lost.  But of course, once something is deleted on the
server you can't access it any more locally, usually, unless you've made
a backup.

There are lots of articles on the web about the differences too.

Cheers!
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Re: [Evolution] Fwd: Mail in Evolution disappearing - mystery deepens

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2015-12-02 at 13:48 -0500, dave boland wrote:
> Thanks for the insight.  There is an IMAP option in Evolution to
> synchronize the email, but I have not found much info about this
> option.
>  Does anyone know what it does and the pros/cons?
> 
> My objective is to have a local copy (on my computer or email server)
> of
> all sent and received email, while leaving about 4 months worth on the
> isp server for remote use.  periodically, I take the email from the
> inbox and sent and place them in subject folders.
> 
> My question is how do I do that with Evolution, or any email
> application?

Different email applications have different facilities so I can't speak
to them all.  This isn't a capability supported by the IMAP protocol.

For Evolution, one option is to select all the messages you want to
archive and drag them to your "On This Computer" INBOX which should copy
them onto your local disk.  Then you can delete those selected files
from your IMAP account.

You can make new folders in the "On This Computer" with dates and copy
all the email up to that date to that folder, or whatever.

I have not ever tried this, note.  You shouldn't delete email from your
server until you've verified it's all present as expected in the local
folders.
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Re: [Evolution] Fwd: Mail in Evolution disappearing - mystery deepens

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2015-12-02 at 14:45 -0500, dave boland wrote:
> This may be what I do, but for now (and rest of a very busy December),
> I'm looking for an easier way.  I guess that may be a monthly combing 
> my email to see what needs to be saved, then copying it to a folder.  
> I admit, I have been fat, dumb and happy for too long, and should have
> been doing this all along, but...

I guess I'm not really sure what your "fat, dumb and happy" mode was
before, and how Evolution, or a new version of Evolution?, has changed
things so you're not in that mode any longer...?

It's still not clear to me why your email on your IMAP server is being
deleted, if you didn't mark it for deletion on your local system.  Are
you saying that your ISP/IMAP server provider is deleting old messages
from your folders, even if you didn't mark them for deletion...?!?!

If that's the case then as already mentioned the right answer is to get
another provider which is not insane, not futzing with workarounds.  IMO
anyway.
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Re: [Evolution] HTML email always using fixed-width fonts?

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2015-11-23 at 09:11 -0500, Paul Smith wrote:
> On Mon, 2015-11-23 at 14:56 +0100, Tomas Popela wrote:
> > It's exactly as you said. It was already fixed for Evolution 3.18.,
> > see
> > [0].
> > 
> > [0] - https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=753702
> 
> OK thanks I'll file a Launchpad bug and hopefully this can be 
> backported to 3.16.

New 3.16.5 package available now in wily-proposed fixes this.  Thanks
for the pointers and support!
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Re: [Evolution] Fwd: Mail in Evolution disappearing - mystery deepens

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2015-12-02 at 15:19 -0500, dave boland wrote:
> My isp has a 90 day limit that I did not know about.  The only
> alternative is tw, and I doubt that the will be a big improvement.

Ugh.  I'm not sure why you're restricted to only those two alternatives,
but that's a bummer.  You could try getting a gmail account (or
something), and have your ISP mail account forward all your mail there.
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Re: [Evolution] HTML email always using fixed-width fonts?

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2015-11-23 at 11:40 +0100, Milan Crha wrote:
> evolution 3.16.x is the first release with the WebKitGTK+ based
> composer, the previous old GtkHTML composer had been replaced. One
> consequence is that the HTML messages understand CSS also in the
> composer.

Yeah, I remember that.

> I currently do not recall anything similar. There was a bug about font
> sizes, but not about font names.
> 
> Does the message looks the same weird if you save it as a Draft and
> watch it in the message preview? If it does, then you can check the
> HTML values in the message source to see what fonts it uses.

Some new information:

 * I have my mail set to use Plain Text by default (FYI)
 * If I respond to an email with lots of formatting, Evo now asks me if
   I want to lose the formatting or preserve it.  If I say "preserve"
   then the reply starts in HTML mode.  In this case I DO get proper
   proportional fonts.
 * If I save a draft email (or send an email to myself) in HTML mode
   where I should see a proportional font, the message in the preview
   (or sent to me) does use a fixed width font.
 * The body of the message in the preview shows:  so the "font-family: Monospoce" is clearly the
   problem.
 * However, if I take that draft message and say "Edit as new message",
   now the font is properly proportional again.  And if I save THAT as
   draft and open it I get proportional fonts and the body statement
   shows:  so there's no font-family set
   here.

it looks to me like somehow when switching from "Plain Text" to "HTML"
modes, the "font-family: Monospace" value in the body is preserved when
it should be tossed.  If the message starts out in HTML mode from the
start, then this doesn't happen.
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Re: [Evolution] HTML email always using fixed-width fonts?

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2015-11-23 at 14:56 +0100, Tomas Popela wrote:
> It's exactly as you said. It was already fixed for Evolution 3.18.,
> see
> [0].
> 
> [0] - https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=753702

OK thanks I'll file a Launchpad bug and hopefully this can be backported
to 3.16.
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Re: [Evolution] HTML email always using fixed-width fonts?

[Paul Smith]

On Sun, 2015-11-22 at 19:18 -0500, Paul Smith wrote:
> Overall everything is fine but there is one bizarre thing that I don't
> remember hearing about: even when I send an email in "HTML" mode, the
> font is always fixed-width.  This is in "Normal" paragraph mode, 
> without the "TT" button enabled, writing a brand new email.

I created a brand new sample account on my system and the same thing
happens there, so I don't think it's related to my personal settings
being messed up or anything.
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[Evolution] HTML email always using fixed-width fonts?

[Paul Smith]

Hi all; I've just upgraded to Ubuntu GNOME 15.10 which comes with GNOME
3.16 inlcuding Evolution 3.16.5.

Overall everything is fine but there is one bizarre thing that I don't
remember hearing about: even when I send an email in "HTML" mode, the
font is always fixed-width.  This is in "Normal" paragraph mode, without
the "TT" button enabled, writing a brand new email.

One exception is that the Subject line uses a normal proportional-width
font.

I've checked "Mail Preferences" and I have "Use the same font as other
applications" checked, and definitely other applications use a
proportional-width font.  Even when I uncheck that box and specify a
specific font it always chooses a fixed width font.

Here's the weird part: when I use a specific font for Evo and change the
size of the fixed width font, messages in "Plain Text" mode DO change
size, but messages in "HTML" mode do NOT change size.  And, vice versa:
if I change the size of the standard font then messages in "Plain Text"
mode do not change size, but messages in "HTML" do.

But, when I change the "standard font" face, nothing happens: no matter
which one I choose I get the same fixed width font.  Except, if I change
to an oblique font then I get an italicized fixed width font... it's
like the HTML font takes the size, weight, slant, etc. but always uses
the same base (fixed width) font no matter what.

Anyone have any ideas about this?
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Re: [Evolution] Evolution 3.18.x and Ubuntu 15.10

[Paul Smith]

On Fri, 2015-11-20 at 17:34 -0200, Jorge wrote:
> Thank you for the information.  Have you enabled gnome3-staging?

I haven't.  In fact, I've just this week upgraded my system from Ubuntu
GNOME 15.04 to Ubuntu GNOME 15.10, so I've just moved to GNOME 3.16.

If I did decide to go to staging the only reason would be to get a
newer version of Evolution.  That's just about the only GNOME
application where I really care much about having the newest version.

And, I probably won't do that unless I find some truly annoying issues
with Evolution 3.16 such that I can't wait.  I used Evo 3.12 from 15.04
for all this time and that really has some unpleasant issues.
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Re: [Evolution] Evolution 3.18.x and Ubuntu 15.10

[Paul Smith]

On Fri, 2015-11-20 at 16:26 -0200, Jorge wrote:
> I am waiting for Gnome 3.18 to arrive in the regular gnome3 PPA.

Just to keep your expectations in perspective, that almost never
happens.  In my experience the gnome3 PPA just has newer/fixed versions
of the same level of Gnome package.

For example even now if you look at the 15.04 (Vivid) series you'll see
that it contains only 3.12/3.14 package, no 3.16 packages.

I don't expect to see any 3.18 packages to show up in the 15.10 (Wily)
series of the gnome3 PPA at all.  If you want Gnome 3.18 packages in
15.10 your only option is to use gnome3-staging.

Otherwise you'll have to wait for 16.04 (Xenial) to be released and
upgrade to that.

I could be wrong, of course: I am not a maintainer or packager of any
of these things.
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Re: [Evolution] DEB files 3.18.1 from https://launchpad.net/~tista/+archive/ubuntu/wayland/+build/8104779

[Paul Smith]

On Fri, 2015-10-16 at 14:18 -0400, John Lauterbach wrote:
> In what order do the following DEB files need to be installed?

Usually if you just put them all on the command line (or run "dpkg -i
*.deb") then dpkg will figure it out.


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Re: [Evolution] DEB files 3.18.1 from https://launchpad.net/~tista/+archive/ubuntu/wayland/+build/8104779

[Paul Smith]

On Fri, 2015-10-16 at 20:44 +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> >Usually if you just put them all on the command line (or run "dpkg -i
> >*.deb") then dpkg will figure it out.
> 
> Only if all dependencies are already installed. If the dependencies
> are not installed, than dpkg will not install the packages, if you
> only use the -i option.

Sure... dpkg doesn't install other packages at all, regardless of
options: it's a low-level tool without network download capability.  But
dpkg will tell you what's missing and you can go install those via
apt-get or whatever.

There are, of course, other ways to do it if you prefer.

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Re: [Evolution] Bug 749712 - Undo/Redo in composer doesn't work right

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2015-10-13 at 12:54 +0200, Andre Klapper wrote:
> > What is the difficulty to remove the bugs
> 
> The difficulty is that manpower is limited. Your patches are highly
> welcome to fix problems faster.

The best thing to do is to go help the WebKit folks, and/or follow the
bug there as mentioned in the See Also links:
https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=149703

Unfortunately that bug was just reported to WebKit on Oct 1.

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Re: [Evolution] evolution 3.10 not sending messages from one of my mail acounts

[Paul Smith]

On Fri, 2015-09-25 at 16:15 +0200, Tom wrote:
> ... or better ask them to continuously upgrade to a recent version
> even in LTSs !

That's not possible.  Evolution is a Gnome application, and relies
extensively on the Gnome infrastructure.  It's not like Thunderbird or
Firefox, for example, or even the kernel, which are essentially
stand-alone.  Upgrading Evolution would mean you'd have to upgrade all
of Gnome in the LTS, which is a complete non-starter (Evo does support
one major version of Gnome back, but 14.04 uses Gnome 3.10).  I mean,
what's the point of using an LTS then?  Just get the latest Ubuntu!

If you want a so-stable-it's-ossified distro, then use LTS and that's
what you get.  If you want a nicely stable distro which has fairly
up-to-date software, then use a normal Ubuntu release.  I personally
recommend Ubuntu GNOME actually.

I'm really not sure why people are so wedded to LTS for home use: I've
been using Ubuntu releases for over 10 years and upgrading regularly and
I don't remember ever having anything of consequence broken.  I almost
always do an in-place upgrade, even, rather than installing from
scratch.  I do usually wait a few weeks after release, just to let any
brown paper bag issues clear out.

For corporate use, I guess I can see the benefits of LTS.

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Re: [Evolution] Ubuntu 15.10 Gnome and Evolution

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2015-07-20 at 10:12 -0400, John Lauterbach wrote:
 I posted on this list as the Ubuntu variant I tested is the one reportedly 
 built by the Gnome-3 team, and it uses the Gnome desktop, not the desktop 
 favored by Ubuntu developers.  Also, unlike the regular Ubuntu distros that 
 come from Canonical, this one had evolution installed,  No Thunderbird!

If you're using Ubuntu GNOME (good choice, I do too!) then you want to
be asking on the Ubuntu GNOME mailing list: again, this list is for
upstream development of Evolution and they have no input into what
versions of Evolution are packaged for any distribution: not Ubuntu, not
Fedora, not Debian, not Ubuntu GNOME.

The Ubuntu GNOME mailing list is here: ubuntu-gn...@lists.ubuntu.com

However, my previous answer is true for them as well: although the
Ubuntu GNOME folks do provide a GNOME-based desktop rather than a
Unity-based desktop, they do not rebuild all the GNOME packages.  And in
particular they do not rebuild the Evolution package (at least not so
far): they simply use whatever Evolution package the Ubuntu team has
created.

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Re: [Evolution] Ubuntu 15.10 Gnome and Evolution

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2015-07-20 at 09:42 -0400, John Lauterbach wrote:
 Over the weekend, I was able to get the i386 version of Ubuntu 15.10
 Gnome to install on a hp-compaq dx2200 minitower (2007 vintage).  This
 distribution came with Evolution 3.12.11 already installed.  Gnome
 version is 3.16.2.  I realize that 15.10 is still under development so
 that is why I tried this on a surplus PC, and not on one of my
 production machines.  However, I am wondering why a more recent
 version of Evolution is not included.  I was not able to find a
 compiled build of 3.16.3 for i386 systems.

This question comes up all the time on the list.  See for example:
https://mail.gnome.org/archives/evolution-list/2015-July/msg00091.html

The first short answer is, you're asking in the wrong place.  This is
the Evolution development list, and they have no control over or input
into which version of Evolution Ubuntu decides to ship.  Just as you
wouldn't ask on the Linux kernel mailing list why Ubuntu ships a
specific version of the Linux kernel.

Which leads to the second answer, which is that everyone who wants a
newer version of Evolution on Ubuntu needs to be creating bug reports in
Ubuntu Lauchpad, not asking here.  The Ubuntu developers are there, not
here, and they're the only ones who can get newer versions of Evolution
added to Ubuntu: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evolution


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Re: [Evolution] Why does not copy paste work in separate monitor setup?

[Paul Smith]

On Thu, 2015-07-16 at 13:52 +0200, Bjørn T Johansen wrote:
 Yes, I know it's not the normal way but it's the way I have always 
 done it... :) I am a developer and I run my IDE on one desktop on 
 display 2 and my web browser on a different desktop on the same
 display, databaseadmin app on yet a different desktop, etc...
 At the same time, I have terminal window open that tail logfiles on 
 display 1.. And when I change desktop on display 2, I do not want to 
 change desktop at the same time on display 1, if you see :)

I think what you're calling a desktop most X display managers refer to
as a workspace (there are so many ways to possibly name the same
thing; it's really helpful if everyone uses the same names).

All desktop environments I'm familiar with have options that let you
specify that a window should appear on all workspaces, so even when you
switch workspaces the window doesn't move.  Right-click on the title bar
and look for the Always on visible workspace (or similarly-named)
option.

In newer versions of GNOME you can actually specify that one entire
screen should not change when you switch workspaces, so any window you
put on that screen automatically stays put and switching workspaces
applies only to the other screen(s).  This is what I use and it's
perfect.

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Re: [Evolution] 3.16.3 on Ubuntu 15.10

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2015-07-14 at 12:29 +0200, Herr Oswald wrote:
  As far as I'm aware the Ubuntu maintainers for Evolution haven't worked
  on getting 3.16 into the latest version.  The last email exchange I had
  with them implied it was some amount of work (I'm not really sure why
  but mostly seemingly related to EDS) and no one had made the time to
  look at it.
 
 Could you please ask for building recent Evolution versions for ubuntu
 14.04 as well? - My argument would be, that it doesnt make much sense
 to declare a OS version as long term support - and then not to
 provide updates for really crucial software.

In addition to what others have said about what long term support
means (which I wholly agree with), I'll just point out that Ubuntu has
made it crystal clear that they don't consider Evolution crucial
software, and certainly not really crucial software :).  It may be
crucial to us, but it's not that important to them.

I do use Ubuntu (Ubuntu GNOME to be precise) because I prefer Debian and
its infrastructure and system design choices over Red Hat/Fedora and its
infrastructure and system design choices.  I don't believe one is
massively better, and I have used and continue to use both, I just
prefer Debian and that's what I'm used to.  I used Debian sid, then
testing, for a long time, then switched to Ubuntu to get the 6 month
upgrade cycle.  If someone creates a reliable Debian-based distro which
is more like what Ubuntu used to be before Unity, for example ensuring
that ALL the latest Gnome apps are present in each release, I'd probably
switch to that, but that's a tall order.

And finally, I'm not more or less qualified to ask for anything than
anyone else... if you have a request then you should make the request,
not ask me to make the request.  The more individual people who request
something the more likely it is to get fixed.  But I wouldn't hold my
breath about a backport of GNOME 3.16 apps to Ubuntu 14.04 LTS.

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Re: [Evolution] 3.16.3 on Ubuntu 15.10

[Paul Smith]

On Fri, 2015-07-10 at 09:38 -0400, John Lauterbach wrote:
 I apologize for not putting my question in the correct format.  So, is 
 anyone on this list successfully using 16.3.3 on Ubuntu 15.10?  I want to 
 make 
 sure that I am not pursuing a dead-end if no one else has been successful.  
 If 
 someone can report success (along with particular build of 15.10 they are 
 using), I will try again and report findings.

As far as I'm aware the Ubuntu maintainers for Evolution haven't worked
on getting 3.16 into the latest version.  The last email exchange I had
with them implied it was some amount of work (I'm not really sure why
but mostly seemingly related to EDS) and no one had made the time to
look at it.

I don't know if this means it's hard to build, or just hard to package.

One hopes that they will find the time for this sometime before 15.10 is
released.

See this message, or read the entire thread:

https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-gnome/2015-May/003021.html

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Re: [Evolution] compile my own --- in addition to: Authentication Issues with Exchange Web Services

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2015-06-09 at 18:18 +0200, Tom wrote:
 I'm often noticed - particularly on this list, that my Evolution
 packages are pretty old, even ancient (and here it's 3.2.3 as it came
 with Precise and it will doggonit stay as long as Precise stays or
 I'll find a safe way to do, what Emre Erenoglu does). But what is the
 (Ubuntu) procedure for that ?

The important thing to understand is that Evolution is part of the GNOME
desktop.  Therefore it relies on GNOME for a lot of its operation.  And,
it requires a modern version of GNOME (in particular, no older than one
release back... so for Evolution 3.16.x that means you must have GNOME
3.14 or 3.16).

If your goal with staying back with Ubuntu 12.04 is to avoid GNOME 3,
then you're kind of out of luck.  The best you can do is build and
install Evolution AND good chunk of GNOME 3 in some non-standard
directory, then try to get Evo to run with it and live with the various
missing features and capabilities that come with not having a full GNOME
3 desktop.

This is something very few people are willing to do.

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Re: [Evolution] compile my own --- in addition to: Authentication Issues with Exchange Web Services

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2015-06-10 at 00:09 +0400, Emre Erenoglu wrote:
 If you are not experienced in compiling stuff, I strongly recommend
 you to upgrade to Ubuntu 15.04 and then simply add the PPA I've given
 to use 3.16 which is pretty OK.

It's great to have this PPA, but Evo 3.16.0 has some pretty significant
bugs that have been fixed in subsequent point releases.  For me, it's
less stable than the latest 3.12.x.

Also, last time I checked this PPA version doesn't allow you to install
unless you uninstall gnome-online-accounts ... not sure why?

Cheers!

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Re: [Evolution] compile my own --- in addition to: Authentication Issues with Exchange Web Services

[Paul Smith]

On Wed, 2015-06-10 at 00:33 +0400, Emre Erenoglu wrote:
  For me, it's less stable than the latest 3.12.x.

 Depends on use case as I said. 3.12 does not support Webkit2 HTML
 composing so not possible to use it at work for me. 3.16 may have bugs
 but it has less on EWS and does webkit2 composer.

Yes, sure.  Different people have different requirements.  After I
switched jobs a bit ago I (luckily) have no more need of Exchange
interoperability.  And most of the mail I send is to mailing lists,
where HTML email is frowned on anyway; my default email type is plain
text.

But there are real advantages to 3.16.x, including bug fixes, that I'd
surely like to have.

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Re: [Evolution] Filters Keep jumping off the deep end

[Paul Smith]

On Mon, 2015-06-08 at 11:20 -0400, John Lauterbach wrote:
 Thank you.  What is ppa for 3.16.3.  I obtained 3.16.0 from Fabies
 Tassin's ppa.  No evidence of 3.16.3 is there.

Unfortunately there is no official version of Evolution 3.16 available
for Ubuntu.  I asked about this:

https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-gnome/2015-May/002998.html

The short summary of the response is, it's a lot of work and no one has
had time to do it.

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Re: [Evolution] Evo 3.12.11: mail from gmail not shown in folder?

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2015-05-05 at 16:31 +0100, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
 You might want to turn off junk processing for Gmail accounts.

I checked and it's off.  It could be that when I first started Evolution
it was on and it munged all my email (I created the accounts first using
Gnome's online account manager, not through Evolution directly).

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Re: [Evolution] Evo 3.12.11: mail from gmail not shown in folder?

[Paul Smith]

On Tue, 2015-05-05 at 08:16 +0200, Milan Crha wrote:
 the only left option I can think of is that the missing messages are
 marked either as Junk or as Deleted. These messages are not shown in
 regular folders.
 
 You can View-Show Deleted Messages, but the Junk messages are shown
 in the Junk folder only. Make sure you'll enter the affected folder
 first.

I forgot to say I'd already tried showing deleted messages, too: no joy.

However, I looked in Junk and there they all were!!!  I have no idea why
Evo decided to throw them all in Junk.  But I selected them all and
clicked the not junk button and it faithfully put them all back in my
Inbox.

Problem solved!

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