[FairfieldLife] Re: Ending FFL speculation about Tantra

[emptybill]

I don't remember hearing that either you or Swami Abhayanand are
dashanami swami-s. So why use these titles here in America - most folks
won't know the difference.

Why not just say Abhayanand Samrat and Bhairitu Siddha? I'm assuming
neither of you are samnyasin-s.

Oh, btw. The guy that taught me Maha.Rudra.Abhisheka liked to point out
that Tantra means seeing the universe as the play of powers (shakti-s)-
which means recognizing and serving the Shakti-s,  not just observing
them. However his point was that Durga Mahamaya was running the show
here and though we serve her with slave-uh we ultimately need to go
beyond even the Yogamaya of Vishnu. His other point was that no one
becomes free from that Yogamaya except through the kripa of Vishnu.

Such talk must be why Sally Ravi Rayi is tired of watching the show.   
It must be one of your dark siddhi-s. Would you please stop forcing Sal
to witness this?


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>
> "Sidh Tantric" is a title which was given me by my guru as well as a
> Swami title.  Indians don't pronounce the "a" at the end of "siddha"
so he calls me a "sidh tantric" and "yoga" as "yog" and "bija" as
"beej."
> So yes it is "Siddha Tantric of the Kali Sadhaka Gharana" depending on
transliteration.  Unfortunately a lot of Indians drop vowels when they
pronounce English and you heard a bunch of consonants run together
instead of the words we're used to. ;-)
>
> The title of "tantric samrat" was bestowed on him by his guru.  It is
> the next level up from "tantra acharya" in this tradition.   This is
the
> proper way of getting these titles not declaring one's self as such.
> The title was given me after practicing tantric siddhis a number of
> years and the guru deciding I had accomplished them.  There are   
many tests in tantra.
>
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Fw: Bullshit Bingo

[authfriend]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mike Dixon  wrote:
>
> Judy, I don't think the man wasn't aware that Medicare
> was a government program

Hate to burst your bubble:

"At a recent town-hall meeting in suburban Simpsonville,
a man stood up and told  Rep. Robert Inglis (R-S.C.) to
'keep your government hands off my Medicare.' 

"'I had to politely explain that, "Actually, sir, your
health care is being provided by the government,"' Inglis
recalled. 'But he wasn't having any of it.'"

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/27/AR2009072703066.html?hpid=topnews

http://tinyurl.com/mmcd8o

This was way back in July, by the way, before the
Republicans had started trying to frighten the elderly
by telling them Medicare was going to be cut back and
that they'd all have to face death panels. The big
bugaboo then was the public option, which the
Republicans were portraying as socialized medicine.

> Voter fraud may be rare, over all, but when we have
> recounts and close votes the way we have now, a few
> dead votes could change the balance of power.

Very, very unlikely. Not worth imposing voting
requirements that will result in effectively 
disenfranchising poor, minority, and elderly voters
just on the off-chance that a stray illegal vote
might flip a close election.

> I don't think there are nearly as many racist, bigots,
> homophobes, etc. as you seem to indicate today as opposed
> to say... fifty years ago.

There seems to have been a very significant increase
of anti-Muslim, anti-Arab bigotry and racism in the 
past, oh, nine years, for some reason.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Osho on Marriage and Children

[lurkernomore20002000]

I enjoyed that immensely.  A guru just putting it out there.  I thought he made 
a pretty good case for his beliefs. And at least he didn't hide behind any 
false fronts.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "John"  wrote:
>
> Are his ideas irrelevant since he died?
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ocbZhRQS9I&feature=fvw
>

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ending FFL speculation about Tantra

[Bhairitu]

Sal Sunshine wrote:
> On Mar 28, 2010, at 8:39 PM, emptybill wrote:
>
>   
>> I'm not sure if I am understanding your meaning.
>>
>> You say Sidh, Sadaka and Garana...
>> 
>
> Why don't you guys just call the 
> whole thing off?
>
> Sal

But Off unsubscribed.

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Fw: Bullshit Bingo

[Mike Dixon]

Judy, I don't think the man wasn't aware that Medicare was a government 
program, but has been paying into it through FICA and knows the new reform will 
take 500 billion out of it to insure 31 million not currently insured. 
Everybody knows Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security are government programs 
that are paid for through taxes. You pay a tax for a benefit all your life and 
you expect to receive it when the time comes, lock box or not. Voter fraud may 
be rare, over all, but when we have recounts and close votes the way we have 
now, a few dead votes could change the balance of power. Illegal votes for a 
candidate devalues the legal votes. I don't think there are nearly as many 
racist, bigots, homophobes, etc. as you seem to indicate today as opposed to 
say... fifty years ago. I believe every generation since the baby boomers has 
shown increasing tolerance for people who are different from themselves.




From: authfriend 
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sat, March 27, 2010 6:37:48 PM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Fw: Bullshit Bingo

  
--- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Mike Dixon  wrote:
>
> Poor man thinks he's not going to get a free power chair
> now.The man has probably been paying his FICA taxes all
> along and thinks he's entitled to it.

He didn't realize Medicare was a government-run program.
He wasn't the only one to make that kind of comment.

>  I'm so glad you've recognized there is riff raff in
> the polls, I just want to make sure they aren't voting
> multiple times under different names and from cemeteries
> out of their precincts.

Voter fraud is *very* rare, actually. And the Constitution
doesn't make any distinction between riff-raff and non-
riff-raff when it comes to voting.

> You're right, he joined the military BEFORE becoming a
> terrorist, never the less he was one, a  soldier of
> Allah. It turns out he really was a misfit  but nobody
> wanted to blow the whistle on him, it wouldn't have been
> PC. Whistle blowers probably feared being called racist,
> bigoted, homophobic, xenophobes and decided to keep
> their mouths shut in hopes of keeping their careers.

Probably. There are so many racist, bigoted, homophobic
xenophobes around these days that it's sometimes hard to
tell who is and who ain't.





  

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ending FFL speculation about Tantra

[Bhairitu]

"Sidh Tantric" is a title which was given me by my guru as well as a 
Swami title.  Indians don't pronounce the "a" at the end of "siddha" so 
he calls me a "sidh tantric" and "yoga" as "yog" and "bija" as "beej."  
So yes it is "Siddha Tantric of the Kali Sadhaka Gharana" depending on 
transliteration.  Unfortunately a lot of Indians drop vowels when they 
pronounce English and you heard a bunch of consonants run together 
instead of the words we're used to. ;-)

The title of "tantric samrat" was bestowed on him by his guru.  It is 
the next level up from "tantra acharya" in this tradition.   This is the 
proper way of getting these titles not declaring one's self as such.  
The title was given me after practicing tantric siddhis a number of 
years and the guru deciding I had accomplished them.  There are many 
tests in tantra.


emptybill wrote:
> I'm not sure if I am understanding your meaning.
>
> You say Sidh, Sadaka and Garana.
>
> Do you mean Siddha Tantric of the Kali Sadhaka Gharana?
>
> If so:
>
> While your fearless (Abhaya) guru calls himself "samrat" meaning
> "emperor",
>
> from your side you call yourself "siddha" or accomplished one.
>
> What are you actually claiming with these titles?
>
>
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>   
>> As I said I've read the book. Not only that empty, I am a Sidh Tantric
>> of the Kali Sadaka Garana tradition and have been in that tradition
>> 
> for
>   
>> 10 years so I have a little knowledge of tantra. I didn't say it is a
>> bad book but things look different once you are practicing it. I've
>> read Feuerstein's book and he very much has a spectator view of some
>> 
> of
>   
>> the Indian tantra rituals. Again not a bad book either but I prefer to
>> read those by practicing tantrics and have been collecting these
>> particularly ones out of India.
>>
>> L.R. Chawdhri was a tantric samrat who wrote a book on tantra which is
>> not that well written but I had it for several years before learning
>> tantra and I can say the book makes more sense once practicing than
>> before. Robert Svoboda's trilogy is good because he actually practices
>> tantra. Frawley also learned tantra. How far they got in these
>> traditions is another matter. My experience tells me it is a practice
>> better suited for younger folks (my guru started learning when he was
>> 
> 16
>   
>> and his guru when he was 9).
>>
>> I also have the doctoral thesis of a woman who did research on John
>> Woodroffe and believes his writing were actually those of an Indian
>> friend who was a tantric. Interesting stuff. There is apparently a lot
>> of unpublished stuff on tantra languishing in Indian libraries. Stuff
>> going back over a hundred years that families have donated.
>>
>>
>> emptybill wrote:
>> 
>>> Bhattacharya indeed was a scholar. However, the inference that he
>>>   
> must
>   
>>> not know what he was writing about is not valid criticism. No
>>>   
> "Tantrika"
>   
>>> has ever approached the scope of Narendra Nath's history.
>>>
>>> Page xii of the 1992 reprinted edition:
>>>
>>> "I express my deep feeling of gratitude to the memory
>>> of the late Kalikananda Avadhuta of Chinsurah, a well
>>> known Tantric teacher, though very much unusually
>>> critical and skeptic in regard to his own creed, from whom
>>> I was able to clarify many difficult points, especially those
>>> pertaining to the so-called Tantric secret rituals."
>>>
>>> BTW Georg Feuerstein is a practitioner of Tantric Buddhism not a
>>> spectator. At the moment I don't remember his Lama but he has been
>>> Abhisheka'd and practices Vajrayana sadhana-s. That, by definition,
>>> makes him a Tantrika - just not a Hindu one.
>>>
>>> I consider "not a Hindu one" to be mere affiliation since the
>>>   
> Buddhist
>   
>>> Tantric sadhanas were ported over from the Injun's - especially the
>>> Bhairava sadhanas.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
>>>
>>>   
 Have you read this book? I have. Bhattacharyya is not a tantric and

 
>>> like Feurstein can only look at things as a spectator. He had some
>>> interesting observations though. There are a few books actually
>>>   
> written
>   
>>> by practicing tantrics which have some good information.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>   
>
>
>
>   

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ending FFL speculation about Tantra

[Sal Sunshine]

On Mar 28, 2010, at 8:39 PM, emptybill wrote:

> I'm not sure if I am understanding your meaning.
> 
> You say Sidh, Sadaka and Garana...

Why don't you guys just call the 
whole thing off?

Sal

[FairfieldLife] Re: Ending FFL speculation about Tantra

[emptybill]

I'm not sure if I am understanding your meaning.

You say Sidh, Sadaka and Garana.

Do you mean Siddha Tantric of the Kali Sadhaka Gharana?

If so:

While your fearless (Abhaya) guru calls himself "samrat" meaning
"emperor",

from your side you call yourself "siddha" or accomplished one.

What are you actually claiming with these titles?



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>
> As I said I've read the book. Not only that empty, I am a Sidh Tantric
> of the Kali Sadaka Garana tradition and have been in that tradition
for
> 10 years so I have a little knowledge of tantra. I didn't say it is a
> bad book but things look different once you are practicing it. I've
> read Feuerstein's book and he very much has a spectator view of some
of
> the Indian tantra rituals. Again not a bad book either but I prefer to
> read those by practicing tantrics and have been collecting these
> particularly ones out of India.
>
> L.R. Chawdhri was a tantric samrat who wrote a book on tantra which is
> not that well written but I had it for several years before learning
> tantra and I can say the book makes more sense once practicing than
> before. Robert Svoboda's trilogy is good because he actually practices
> tantra. Frawley also learned tantra. How far they got in these
> traditions is another matter. My experience tells me it is a practice
> better suited for younger folks (my guru started learning when he was
16
> and his guru when he was 9).
>
> I also have the doctoral thesis of a woman who did research on John
> Woodroffe and believes his writing were actually those of an Indian
> friend who was a tantric. Interesting stuff. There is apparently a lot
> of unpublished stuff on tantra languishing in Indian libraries. Stuff
> going back over a hundred years that families have donated.
>
>
> emptybill wrote:
> > Bhattacharya indeed was a scholar. However, the inference that he
must
> > not know what he was writing about is not valid criticism. No
"Tantrika"
> > has ever approached the scope of Narendra Nath's history.
> >
> > Page xii of the 1992 reprinted edition:
> >
> > "I express my deep feeling of gratitude to the memory
> > of the late Kalikananda Avadhuta of Chinsurah, a well
> > known Tantric teacher, though very much unusually
> > critical and skeptic in regard to his own creed, from whom
> > I was able to clarify many difficult points, especially those
> > pertaining to the so-called Tantric secret rituals."
> >
> > BTW Georg Feuerstein is a practitioner of Tantric Buddhism not a
> > spectator. At the moment I don't remember his Lama but he has been
> > Abhisheka'd and practices Vajrayana sadhana-s. That, by definition,
> > makes him a Tantrika - just not a Hindu one.
> >
> > I consider "not a Hindu one" to be mere affiliation since the
Buddhist
> > Tantric sadhanas were ported over from the Injun's - especially the
> > Bhairava sadhanas.
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
> >
> >> Have you read this book? I have. Bhattacharyya is not a tantric and
> >>
> > like Feurstein can only look at things as a spectator. He had some
> > interesting observations though. There are a few books actually
written
> > by practicing tantrics which have some good information.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[Joe]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Joe"  wrote:
> 
> > Seems though, that she might be falling out of love with Barry.
> 
> Barry's been behaving himself lately. Won't last long,
> though, I'm betting.
>
Ahh, so sez Sister Aloysious!

[FairfieldLife] Re: Trivedi/Guruji

[curtisdeltablues]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung  wrote:
Thanks Edg.  Just for my own writing, I don't even expect people to read it.  I 
am fascinated by pheudo science and am trying to tighten up my own thinking 
with regard to statistics.  Thanks for checking it out!



>
> Curtis,
> 
> Your deconstruction is so perfect, and the ears you speak to so deaf to it.
> 
> Why did you go through all the below trouble?  Just funzies?
> 
> I let rip with a short quick bitch about this, but look at the time you put 
> in -- gotta be love, gotta be service unto ?, gotta be something in ya that's 
> glowing, so good on ya fer that.
> 
> To me, this guy un-had me at Poneman -- birds of a feather is one of the most 
> powerful memes what am, and I would warn anyone who discounts it that they do 
> so at their peril.
> 
> Edg
> 
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues"  
> wrote:
> >
> > These claims are usefull in examining when scientific ignorance becomes 
> > scientific fraud.
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:
> > >
> > > Comments from someone in FF:
> > >   
> > > 
> > > Trivedi/Guruji  was in Fairfield this past weekend.  He offers blessings 
> > > to
> > > both groups and individuals.  Huge crowd on Wednesday the 17th at 
> > > Sondheim.
> > > Then smaller crowd at Morning Star on Sat the 20th, more individual
> > > attention.  
> > > 
> > > He's returning to FF on April 18.  Group sessions are $15-25.  Still
> > > powerful.
> > > Some knowledge, etc. from him:
> > 
> > No problems here.  Sprititul claims need no more support than assertions 
> > that the undifined "blessings" are taking place.
> > 
> > > 
> > > Earth changing consciousness faster than individuals.  Mother Earth's
> > > frequency is alpha.
> > 
> > This claim is getting warmer. Alpha is a specific frequency so it should 
> > require some description of the measurment used to make it meaningful.  It 
> > is sciency sounding but meaningless without context.
> > 
> >   If we resonate with Her, then She can meet Her
> > > responsibility of taking care of us. 
> > 
> > Spiritual claim,none of my business.
> >  
> > > 
> > > People immediately shift to alpha when being blessed by Trivedi.  MUM
> > > scientist Alaric Arenander tested his wife Cynthia who's been rounding for
> > > 3+ years.  Her alpha, already high, increased with eyes closed, then
> > > dramatically increased when Trivedi did blessing.
> > 
> > Here we start to cross the line of using specific terms that are measurable 
> > to give more credence to the spiritual claims.  Without establishing 
> > anything to compare this measurement to it is meaningless.  Does Benny Hin 
> > get the same results? Does alpha increase when other people say sweet 
> > things to a person who is hooked up?  No metric is given and no context to 
> > understand the claim.  And what is the standard deviation of these 
> > measurments to determine their statistical significance?
> > 
> > > 
> > > Conductivity is very important word on this planet, ability to flow 
> > > energy.
> > > 5% of people are super conductors, 20% good conductors.  Depends on 
> > > receiver
> > > having low resistance.
> > 
> > I'm gunna just substitute having low resistance with suggestibility.
> > 
> > > 
> > > Trivedi's blessings kick out radioactivity
> > 
> > Specific claim.  Highly misleading without a metric of measurement.
> > 
> >  and GMO, even in next generation.
> > > Experiments show that he can change size of atom, increase energy bt atoms
> > 
> > Yeah, this is just too bogus to even warrent being called deceptive. I 
> > picture Jim Carry talking out of his butt.
> > 
> > > 
> > > Experiments also show that:
> > > his pituitary is egg-shaped and larger than other humans
> > 
> > Bingo!  Now we are in the completely misleading claims area. First of all 
> > what is the statistical mean for pituitary size?  Does the distibution of 
> > size follow a bell curve which would mean that half the population has 
> > larger ones?  Since I am not a neuro-scientist I have no way to evaluate 
> > this claim. For all I know big pituitary is correlated with forms of 
> > retardation.  A big thyroid is a bad thing.  What does this mean?  And this 
> > assumes that someone actually did an MRI to evaluate this size and shape.  
> > A person with the training to present this information in a context where 
> > it could be reasonably evaluated. But that does not seem to be the qoal.  
> > The goal is to bamboozle with science words in a an undefined context with 
> > no hope of perspective on its meaning. They are drawing the bullseye around 
> > the arrow.  They find something that is different (how much?) and claim it 
> > is evidence of his specialness.
> > 
> > > skin elasticity better than new born baby
> > > no plaque in arteries at age of 46
> > 
> > This is subject to all the above complaints.  What is this compared to? I 
> > am reminded of the Afghan folk song:
> > 
> > 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Elitist, was: Democrat supporting McCain on CNN stopped by host

[curtisdeltablues]

Born in 57 with rabid republican folks who replayed (in conversation) the JFK 
Nixon debates over cocktails. I couldn't have any real memory and got a few 
things completely wrong.  I guess it must have been Goldwater Johnson that I 
remember them jabbering about. But their Kennedy hatred continued long after 
his assasination so I got an earful and still do!

My dad runs the exact same routines about Obama he did about the first 
democrates I heard him rail against.  It is a formula.  The funny thing is 
hearing him complain about Obama touching his Medicare!  WTF!

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
>
> P.S.:
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" 
> >  wrote:
> 
> > > > I've been following politics for almost as long
> > > > as you've been *alive*, and I haven't seen any 
> > > > candidate's supporters, anywhere, as over-the-top
> > > > as Obama's in their viciousness toward the
> > > > supporters of his opponents.
> > > 
> > > MMM the old "I'm older" move.  By this standard my dad who
> > > is an avid Palin fan should be the best source.  He has
> > > been following politics even longer than you.
> > 
> > Sophist trick. Totally irrelevant, since we have no 
> > evidence of what Curtis's father would have had to say on
> > this point.
> > 
> > > My first political awareness was Goldwater-JFK.  Do you
> > > go back before that?
> > 
> > Eisenhower-Stevenson, both campaigns.
> > 
> > And BTW, your awareness back then wasn't all that sharp.
> > It was JFK vs. Nixon in 1960; and LBJ vs. Goldwater in
> > 1964.
> > 
> > > FDR maybe?
> > 
> > Sophist trick, implying that my perspective can be
> > discounted because of my "advanced age."
> > 
> >   We spent the Summer in my grandparents huge beach
> > > house and every night the extended family hotly debated.
> > > (My Aunt was married to a card carrying Communist and
> > > voted democratic,  and my folks were republican.) Plenty
> > > of dirty accusations back and forth, all sorts of
> > > slanderous comments that impressed me as I tried to
> > > figure out what politics was all about.  It made a big
> > > impression. When I think of the claims that Goldwater
> > > was going to drop the atomic bomb on the Soviets (my
> > > aunt's side) and that JFK was gunna tax away all our
> > > money and give it to poor people like the commies (my
> > > folks, I can almost feel the sand between my toes.
> 
> I'm not sure how old Curtis is; I've been assuming
> he's at least 10 years younger than I am (I'm 68). My
> first political campaign (which I actually volunteered
> to work on) was in 1952, when I was 10. If Curtis is
> 58 or older, then I may be wrong about having been
> politically aware longer than he's been alive--but
> it's damn close.
> 
> Since above he got the matchup with Goldwater wrong,
> I'm wondering whether the "tax away all our money"
> canard was actually something said about LBJ rather
> than JFK (although it's a perennial charge against
> Democrats), because he remembers it in conjunction 
> with the nuke canard against Goldwater. Was Curtis
> actually aware of the 1960 JFK-Nixon campaign, or did
> he just get it mixed up in retrospect with the LBJ-
> Goldwater campaign?
> 
> No big deal either way, just thought I'd mention it.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[authfriend]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Joe"  wrote:

> Seems though, that she might be falling out of love with Barry.

Barry's been behaving himself lately. Won't last long,
though, I'm betting.

[FairfieldLife] Post Count

[FFL PostCount]

Fairfield Life Post Counter
===
Start Date (UTC): Sat Mar 27 00:00:00 2010
End Date (UTC): Sat Apr 03 00:00:00 2010
122 messages as of (UTC) Mon Mar 29 00:04:19 2010

13 authfriend 
10 lurkernomore20002000 
 9 WillyTex 
 9 Rick Archer 
 8 TurquoiseB 
 8 Bhairitu 
 7 Vaj 
 7 Mike Dixon 
 6 emptybill 
 6 BillyG 
 6 "do.rflex" 
 4 mainstream20016 
 4 Buck 
 3 ditzyklanmail 
 3 azgrey 
 3 Joe 
 2 nablusoss1008 
 2 curtisdeltablues 
 2 It's just a ride 
 2 Duveyoung 
 1 yifuxero 
 1 tartbrain 
 1 gullible fool 
 1 cardemaister 
 1 wle...@aol.com
 1 John 
 1 Dick Mays 
 1 Alex Stanley 

Posters: 28
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[FairfieldLife] MMY responds favorably to Ronald Reagan's SDI. Youtube.

[BillyG]

Calls Ronald Reagan, "intuitive"!!!  Good for MMY, see here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FkC9IusniMw

[FairfieldLife] Thank You !

[nablusoss1008]

http://en.tackfilm.se/?id=1266705214468RA68

[FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[Joe]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "lurkernomore20002000"  
> wrote:
> 
> > I have to say that I wish Judy did not feel the need to
> > jump on every inconsistency, real or imagined
> 
> I don't! I'm actually fairly selective.
>

Seems though, that she might be falling out of love with Barry. Curtis seems to 
have taken the lead in the Judy Obsession sweepstakes. Her rate of posts about 
Curtis seem to be outstripping hers about Barry. I wouldn't have thought it 
possible, but check it out.

Or maybe Judy's just having an affair

[FairfieldLife] Thank You !

[nablusoss1008]

http://en.tackfilm.se/?id=1266705214468RA68

[FairfieldLife] Re: Trivedi/Guruji

[Joe]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues"  
wrote:
>
> These claims are usefull in examining when scientific ignorance becomes 
> scientific fraud.
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:
> >
> > Comments from someone in FF:
> >   
> > 
> > Trivedi/Guruji  was in Fairfield this past weekend.  He offers blessings to
> > both groups and individuals.  Huge crowd on Wednesday the 17th at Sondheim.
> > Then smaller crowd at Morning Star on Sat the 20th, more individual
> > attention.  
> > 
> > He's returning to FF on April 18.  Group sessions are $15-25.  Still
> > powerful.
> > Some knowledge, etc. from him:
> 
> No problems here.  Sprititul claims need no more support than assertions that 
> the undifined "blessings" are taking place.
> 
> > 
> > Earth changing consciousness faster than individuals.  Mother Earth's
> > frequency is alpha.
> 
> This claim is getting warmer. Alpha is a specific frequency so it should 
> require some description of the measurment used to make it meaningful.  It is 
> sciency sounding but meaningless without context.
> 
>   If we resonate with Her, then She can meet Her
> > responsibility of taking care of us. 
> 
> Spiritual claim,none of my business.
>  
> > 
> > People immediately shift to alpha when being blessed by Trivedi.  MUM
> > scientist Alaric Arenander tested his wife Cynthia who's been rounding for
> > 3+ years.  Her alpha, already high, increased with eyes closed, then
> > dramatically increased when Trivedi did blessing.
> 
> Here we start to cross the line of using specific terms that are measurable 
> to give more credence to the spiritual claims.  Without establishing anything 
> to compare this measurement to it is meaningless.  Does Benny Hin get the 
> same results? Does alpha increase when other people say sweet things to a 
> person who is hooked up?  No metric is given and no context to understand the 
> claim.  And what is the standard deviation of these measurments to determine 
> their statistical significance?
> 
> > 
> > Conductivity is very important word on this planet, ability to flow energy.
> > 5% of people are super conductors, 20% good conductors.  Depends on receiver
> > having low resistance.
> 
> I'm gunna just substitute having low resistance with suggestibility.
> 

Great analysis Curtis! Without your posts FFL would be hardly worth visiting 
many days.

Back to this Conductivity thingyou have to admit he is DAMN clever here. If 
you swallow his thing hook and line, whybrother YOU must be one the select 
5% who are Super Conductors. You ride the very special bus indeed.

OR...are you that 20% of merely "good" conductors. What's it gonna be 
brother...super special or "good"? Which are you?

Yeah man, gotta hand it to the guy. He's in the right place to run this kind of 
thing since he knows folks who are in FFL consider themselves mighty special as 
it is.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Trivedi/Guruji

[Joe]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues"  
wrote:
>
> These claims are usefull in examining when scientific ignorance becomes 
> scientific fraud.
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:
> >
> > Comments from someone in FF:
> >   
> > 
> > Trivedi/Guruji  was in Fairfield this past weekend.  He offers blessings to
> > both groups and individuals.  Huge crowd on Wednesday the 17th at Sondheim.
> > Then smaller crowd at Morning Star on Sat the 20th, more individual
> > attention.  
> > 
> > He's returning to FF on April 18.  Group sessions are $15-25.  Still
> > powerful.
> > Some knowledge, etc. from him:
> 
> No problems here.  Sprititul claims need no more support than assertions that 
> the undifined "blessings" are taking place.
> 
> > 
> > Earth changing consciousness faster than individuals.  Mother Earth's
> > frequency is alpha.
> 
> This claim is getting warmer. Alpha is a specific frequency so it should 
> require some description of the measurment used to make it meaningful.  It is 
> sciency sounding but meaningless without context.
> 
>   If we resonate with Her, then She can meet Her
> > responsibility of taking care of us. 
> 
> Spiritual claim,none of my business.
>  
> > 
> > People immediately shift to alpha when being blessed by Trivedi.  MUM
> > scientist Alaric Arenander tested his wife Cynthia who's been rounding for
> > 3+ years.  Her alpha, already high, increased with eyes closed, then
> > dramatically increased when Trivedi did blessing.
> 
> Here we start to cross the line of using specific terms that are measurable 
> to give more credence to the spiritual claims.  Without establishing anything 
> to compare this measurement to it is meaningless.  Does Benny Hin get the 
> same results? Does alpha increase when other people say sweet things to a 
> person who is hooked up?  No metric is given and no context to understand the 
> claim.  And what is the standard deviation of these measurments to determine 
> their statistical significance?
> 
> > 
> > Conductivity is very important word on this planet, ability to flow energy.
> > 5% of people are super conductors, 20% good conductors.  Depends on receiver
> > having low resistance.
> 
> I'm gunna just substitute having low resistance with suggestibility.
> 

Great analysis Curtis! Without your posts FFL would be hardly worth visiting 
many days.

Back to this Conductivity thingyou have to admit he is DAMN clever here. If 
you swallow his thing hook and line, whybrother YOU must be one the select 
5% who are Super Conductors. You ride the very special bus indeed.

OR...are you that 20% of merely "good" conductors. What's it gonna be 
brother...super special or "good"? Which are you?

Yeah man, gotta hand it to the guy. He's in the right place to run this kind of 
thing since he knows folks who are in FFL consider themselves mighty special as 
it is.

[FairfieldLife] Osho on Marriage and Children

[John]

Are his ideas irrelevant since he died?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ocbZhRQS9I&feature=fvw

[FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[authfriend]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "lurkernomore20002000"  
wrote:

> I have to say that I wish Judy did not feel the need to
> jump on every inconsistency, real or imagined

I don't! I'm actually fairly selective.

RE: [FairfieldLife] New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[Rick Archer]

From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of Bhairitu
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 3:54 PM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump
 
  
Rick Archer wrote:
> 
> . With higher resolution, but in 10-minute segments, on YouTube
>  
> 

The YouTube interface on the Samsung Bluray player is rather lame. 
It is. I've tried it too.
I even subscribed and logged in but it doesn't list subscriptions and 
searches don't turn up these videos. Maybe you need some bizarre and 
unique keyword so I can watch these in my easy chair. ;-)
Some guy sent the following suggestion: "For multiple videos of a single
show, post a Playlist of those videos, so they'll autofeed to the next one
in that show." I didn't know about that and will set it up.

Of course how long it takes YouTube to account for the keyword might be 
another matter.
I think it does take a while to update the search index.

[FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[lurkernomore20002000]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:

Re: Buddha At The Gas Pump

> Once or twice non-politeness arose, but I told them to take it to FFL.
I
> don't want the BATGAP chat group to have a wild west mentality like
this one
> does.


The thing is, you've got to have edge. (not necessarily as in Duveyoung,
but that can help).  If you don't have edge, I think it gets pretty
boring.  We had good edge at FFL, but then we became host to the "feud".
I have to say that I wish Judy did not feel the need to jump on every
inconsistency, real or imagined, and ride it past,  at least what most
people would feel to be a reasonable point.  I think it works better
when people have a little leeway, and not have keep looking over their
shoulder to see if someone is going to come sweeping down, claws spread
apart.  It just doesn't serve any purpose, but that is only my opinion. 
Others, perhaps especially Judy feel differently.  It seems to fill some
need she has. The right amount of edge is a delicate proposition. 
Unfortuanely, we've kind of lost it here.  50 posts per week helps, but
nothing takes the place of self regulation and discipline by the
participants.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Elitist, was: Democrat supporting McCain on CNN stopped by host

[authfriend]

P.S.:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:

> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues"  
> wrote:

> > > I've been following politics for almost as long
> > > as you've been *alive*, and I haven't seen any 
> > > candidate's supporters, anywhere, as over-the-top
> > > as Obama's in their viciousness toward the
> > > supporters of his opponents.
> > 
> > MMM the old "I'm older" move.  By this standard my dad who
> > is an avid Palin fan should be the best source.  He has
> > been following politics even longer than you.
> 
> Sophist trick. Totally irrelevant, since we have no 
> evidence of what Curtis's father would have had to say on
> this point.
> 
> > My first political awareness was Goldwater-JFK.  Do you
> > go back before that?
> 
> Eisenhower-Stevenson, both campaigns.
> 
> And BTW, your awareness back then wasn't all that sharp.
> It was JFK vs. Nixon in 1960; and LBJ vs. Goldwater in
> 1964.
> 
> > FDR maybe?
> 
> Sophist trick, implying that my perspective can be
> discounted because of my "advanced age."
> 
>   We spent the Summer in my grandparents huge beach
> > house and every night the extended family hotly debated.
> > (My Aunt was married to a card carrying Communist and
> > voted democratic,  and my folks were republican.) Plenty
> > of dirty accusations back and forth, all sorts of
> > slanderous comments that impressed me as I tried to
> > figure out what politics was all about.  It made a big
> > impression. When I think of the claims that Goldwater
> > was going to drop the atomic bomb on the Soviets (my
> > aunt's side) and that JFK was gunna tax away all our
> > money and give it to poor people like the commies (my
> > folks, I can almost feel the sand between my toes.

I'm not sure how old Curtis is; I've been assuming
he's at least 10 years younger than I am (I'm 68). My
first political campaign (which I actually volunteered
to work on) was in 1952, when I was 10. If Curtis is
58 or older, then I may be wrong about having been
politically aware longer than he's been alive--but
it's damn close.

Since above he got the matchup with Goldwater wrong,
I'm wondering whether the "tax away all our money"
canard was actually something said about LBJ rather
than JFK (although it's a perennial charge against
Democrats), because he remembers it in conjunction 
with the nuke canard against Goldwater. Was Curtis
actually aware of the 1960 JFK-Nixon campaign, or did
he just get it mixed up in retrospect with the LBJ-
Goldwater campaign?

No big deal either way, just thought I'd mention it.

[FairfieldLife] 2000-2009 warmest decade on record

[do.rflex]

The last decade was the warmest on record
 , according to a report issued
Thursday by the World Meterological Organization.

The United Nations' agency findings echo the recent findings of NASA's
Goddard Institute for Space Studies, which concluded the period from
2000 to 2009 was the warmest since modern temperature record keeping
began in the 1850s.

This new report will no doubt be subject to debate in the ongoing
climate wars.

http://snipurl.com/v4se5   [views_washingtonpost_com]

[FairfieldLife] Re: Elitist, was: Democrat supporting McCain on CNN stopped by host

[authfriend]

Just for fun, this is a reply to a post of Curtis's that
I didn't respond to at the time, in which he accused me
of "sophist tricks." I've identified all *his* sophist
tricks in my comments.

sophistry = subtly deceptive reasoning or argumentation

(Although, as I've previously noted, Curtis's
deceptive reasoning/argumentation is hardly subtle.)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues"  
wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" 
> >  wrote:
> > >
> > > > One of the things that frightens me most about
> > > > Obama is how he seems to bring out the very
> > > > worst in his followers.
> > > 
> > > This is a strange charge.  Every candidate has people who go
> > > over the top for their chosen candidate, even Hillary
> > > supporters.  Unless there is a specific thing Obama told his
> > > supporters to do which you can show us, something he said,
> > > this accusation seems like the worst kind of vague political
> > > slander.  "Bring out the very worst" is a phrase right
> > > out of Karl Rove's incite-fear playbook.

First sophist trick: attempt at guilt by association.

> > Oh, give me a fucking BREAK.
> 
> I am, I'm giving you a chance to defend your claim.  Let's
> see how you do...

Sophist trick, demanding proof of something I never
claimed.

> > I've been following politics for almost as long
> > as you've been *alive*, and I haven't seen any 
> > candidate's supporters, anywhere, as over-the-top
> > as Obama's in their viciousness toward the
> > supporters of his opponents.
> 
> MMM the old "I'm older" move.  By this standard my dad who
> is an avid Palin fan should be the best source.  He has
> been following politics even longer than you.

Sophist trick. Totally irrelevant, since we have no 
evidence of what Curtis's father would have had to say on
this point.

> My first political awareness was Goldwater-JFK.  Do you
> go back before that?

Eisenhower-Stevenson, both campaigns.

And BTW, your awareness back then wasn't all that sharp.
It was JFK vs. Nixon in 1960; and LBJ vs. Goldwater in
1964.

> FDR maybe?

Sophist trick, implying that my perspective can be
discounted because of my "advanced age."

  We spent the Summer in my grandparents huge beach
> house and every night the extended family hotly debated.
> (My Aunt was married to a card carrying Communist and
> voted democratic,  and my folks were republican.) Plenty
> of dirty accusations back and forth, all sorts of
> slanderous comments that impressed me as I tried to
> figure out what politics was all about.  It made a big
> impression. When I think of the claims that Goldwater
> was going to drop the atomic bomb on the Soviets (my
> aunt's side) and that JFK was gunna tax away all our
> money and give it to poor people like the commies (my
> folks, I can almost feel the sand between my toes.

Sophist trick, to pretend the fact that there have
been "slanderous comments" in other campaigns somehow
negates my claim that the Obama campaign was the worst
*I'd* ever seen in this regard (in terms of his
followers if not the "official" campaign).

> > It's unprecedented, and I'm far from the only 
> > person to have remarked on it. 
> 
> Well I am not the only person to have remarked that all
> elections use dirty tricks starting with accusing
> Jefferson of being an Atheist. We have examples of it
> every year.

Sophist trick (straw man). Nobody said there haven't been
examples of dirty tricks in all elections.

> It isn't a Rovian
> > tactic, as you try to make it sound (guilt by
> > association, anybody?), it's an *observation*.
> 
> Mine is an observation too.  It reminded me of a Rovian
> tactic to smear the other side with a vague, unprovable
> charge of "evilness." It also has that Willy Horton vibe.

Sophist trick. Guilt by association, as noted, now both
with Rove and the infamous Willie Horton ad; and straw
man--I never charged the other side with "evilness."

> > It has nothing to do with what he's "told" them
> > to do or not do; it appears to be entirely
> > spontaneous, their response to whatever it is he
> > inspires in them.
> 
> I'm not buying that magical principle.

Sophist trick (straw man again). Nobody said it was a
"magical principle," nor is it. "Magical" is a weasel
word designed to denigrate an idea without actually
going to the trouble to address it.

> Supporters in political contests do all sorts of crazy
> shit.  Always have, always will.

Sophist trick (really making good use of that particular
straw man). Nobody said anything to the contrary.

> I would think at your advanced age you might have noticed
> this.

Sophist trick; "advanced age" implies decreased mental
competence. And it's in service of that battered straw
man--as if I hadn't noticed, or was denying, that
supporters in political contests do crazy shit.

> > It isn't just the "fringe" of his supporters;
> > if it were, it wouldn't be so worris

[FairfieldLife] Re: Another "Chicago" Federal Stimulus

[emptybill]

Very funny from my view. Not enough outrage from yours though .

So you really are a true believer with no sense of humor?

Let me find another - one more plausible ...

Take our new Federalized Medicine bill just passed. How about ...

Saviour of the lost, the oppressed and demoralized,

The exploited and down-trodden.

Isn't this the new Christ dying for your sins daily?

How can you still go on mumbling your funny sounding hindu namey-thingy?

Re: [FairfieldLife] New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[Bhairitu]

Rick Archer wrote:
>  
> . With higher resolution, but in 10-minute segments, on YouTube
>  
>   

The YouTube interface on the Samsung Bluray player is rather lame.  I 
even subscribed and logged in but it doesn't list subscriptions and 
searches don't turn up these videos.  Maybe you need some bizarre and 
unique keyword so I can watch these in my easy chair. ;-)

Of course how long it takes YouTube to account for the keyword might be 
another matter.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Trivedi Guruji vs. Master John Douglas

[authfriend]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues"  
wrote:
>
> First thanks to Azgrey who handed me back two hours of my 
> life by responding.

But without addressing any of my points, of course.

> Secondly Richard you should be able to understand that
> when I use the term "sophist trick" it is in the specific
> context of a philosophical argument and I always couple
> it with the example I am refering to.

Just as I identified Curtis's sophist tricks in my post.
No wonder he was happy to let azgray defend him with a
round of witless ad hominem.

Funny, isn't it, how receptive Curtis is to being
defended when his own code of ethics doesn't include
any perceived imperative to defend others (except,
of course, his special friends).

Oh, anybody want to tell us where Curtis cited specific
examples of "sophist tricks" in the context of this,
er, philosophical argument:

"Palin has zero shame. She is a political attack dog, with
or without the lipstick. The worst form of content-free
politician, relying on sophist tricks to win at any cost.
Even in the face of overwhelming evidence of hypocrisy."

> Using it a a general sense as a generic putdown turns it
> into another version of poopy pants as Azgrey pointed out.

Incorrectly. To pretend it's equivalent to "poopy pants"
is, in fact, a sophist trick.

> It is a specific technical term in the context of an
> argument.

"subtly deceptive reasoning or argumentation"

And when many, many examples of same have been pointed
out in one person's posts, it's entirely reasonable to
refer to that person's "sophistry" in the general sense
(just as someone who has been repeatedly caught in lies
may be referred to as a "liar" in the general sense).

In that case, of course, it isn't a "generic putdown,"
it refers to specific characteristics of a person's
argumentation--just as Curtis used it regarding Palin
in the quote above.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Trivedi/Guruji

[Duveyoung]

Curtis,

Your deconstruction is so perfect, and the ears you speak to so deaf to it.

Why did you go through all the below trouble?  Just funzies?

I let rip with a short quick bitch about this, but look at the time you put in 
-- gotta be love, gotta be service unto ?, gotta be something in ya that's 
glowing, so good on ya fer that.

To me, this guy un-had me at Poneman -- birds of a feather is one of the most 
powerful memes what am, and I would warn anyone who discounts it that they do 
so at their peril.

Edg



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues"  
wrote:
>
> These claims are usefull in examining when scientific ignorance becomes 
> scientific fraud.
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:
> >
> > Comments from someone in FF:
> >   
> > 
> > Trivedi/Guruji  was in Fairfield this past weekend.  He offers blessings to
> > both groups and individuals.  Huge crowd on Wednesday the 17th at Sondheim.
> > Then smaller crowd at Morning Star on Sat the 20th, more individual
> > attention.  
> > 
> > He's returning to FF on April 18.  Group sessions are $15-25.  Still
> > powerful.
> > Some knowledge, etc. from him:
> 
> No problems here.  Sprititul claims need no more support than assertions that 
> the undifined "blessings" are taking place.
> 
> > 
> > Earth changing consciousness faster than individuals.  Mother Earth's
> > frequency is alpha.
> 
> This claim is getting warmer. Alpha is a specific frequency so it should 
> require some description of the measurment used to make it meaningful.  It is 
> sciency sounding but meaningless without context.
> 
>   If we resonate with Her, then She can meet Her
> > responsibility of taking care of us. 
> 
> Spiritual claim,none of my business.
>  
> > 
> > People immediately shift to alpha when being blessed by Trivedi.  MUM
> > scientist Alaric Arenander tested his wife Cynthia who's been rounding for
> > 3+ years.  Her alpha, already high, increased with eyes closed, then
> > dramatically increased when Trivedi did blessing.
> 
> Here we start to cross the line of using specific terms that are measurable 
> to give more credence to the spiritual claims.  Without establishing anything 
> to compare this measurement to it is meaningless.  Does Benny Hin get the 
> same results? Does alpha increase when other people say sweet things to a 
> person who is hooked up?  No metric is given and no context to understand the 
> claim.  And what is the standard deviation of these measurments to determine 
> their statistical significance?
> 
> > 
> > Conductivity is very important word on this planet, ability to flow energy.
> > 5% of people are super conductors, 20% good conductors.  Depends on receiver
> > having low resistance.
> 
> I'm gunna just substitute having low resistance with suggestibility.
> 
> > 
> > Trivedi's blessings kick out radioactivity
> 
> Specific claim.  Highly misleading without a metric of measurement.
> 
>  and GMO, even in next generation.
> > Experiments show that he can change size of atom, increase energy bt atoms
> 
> Yeah, this is just too bogus to even warrent being called deceptive. I 
> picture Jim Carry talking out of his butt.
> 
> > 
> > Experiments also show that:
> > his pituitary is egg-shaped and larger than other humans
> 
> Bingo!  Now we are in the completely misleading claims area. First of all 
> what is the statistical mean for pituitary size?  Does the distibution of 
> size follow a bell curve which would mean that half the population has larger 
> ones?  Since I am not a neuro-scientist I have no way to evaluate this claim. 
> For all I know big pituitary is correlated with forms of retardation.  A big 
> thyroid is a bad thing.  What does this mean?  And this assumes that someone 
> actually did an MRI to evaluate this size and shape.  A person with the 
> training to present this information in a context where it could be 
> reasonably evaluated. But that does not seem to be the qoal.  The goal is to 
> bamboozle with science words in a an undefined context with no hope of 
> perspective on its meaning. They are drawing the bullseye around the arrow.  
> They find something that is different (how much?) and claim it is evidence of 
> his specialness.
> 
> > skin elasticity better than new born baby
> > no plaque in arteries at age of 46
> 
> This is subject to all the above complaints.  What is this compared to? I am 
> reminded of the Afghan folk song:
> 
> "There is a boy across the river with a bottom like a peach, but alas I 
> cannot swim."
> 
> What does his peach bottom mean?
> If he is Indian his higher melinan in his skin makes this easier than my own 
> background of Irish and French with skin so white I glow like an Iphone in a 
> movie theater.  Dermatoligists have raved about my skin and I am 7 years 
> older. It is genetic and I don't smoke, big deal. And I have fantastic 
> arteries without a vegitarian diet so I can match that claim too.  What is 
> being cl

[FairfieldLife] Re: Ending FFL speculation about

[emptybill]

Willy

Your answer to all is the same - Gupta Age.

I would think by now you could just shoot out the

word "Gupta"  and be done.






--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "WillyTex"  wrote:
>
>
>
> emptybill:
> >
> > History of the Tantric Religion:
> > An Historical, Ritualistic, and
> > Philosophical Study...
> >
> From what I've read, there is no reason to
> think that 'tantrism' is pre-Vedic. These
> kinds of The alchemical systems seem to have
> been developed during the Gupta Age in India.
>
> Indus Valley seals have not been deciphred
> yet, so we don't really know for sure.
>
> There is a tendency to push back these
> spiritual systems to pre-history, but many
> of them are realtively recent formulations.
>
> David Frawley thinks the Vedics came 'out
> of India' over 5000 years ago instead of
> going 'into India' in 1500 BC.
>
> There is also some confusion concerning
> shamnism and it's origin. Professor Kak
> thinks the Vedics may have been shamans
> that came from around Siberia.
>
> Other titles of interest:
>
> 'The Tantric Tradition'
> By Agehananda Bharati
> Rider, 1970
>
> 'Tantra: Path of Ecstasy'
> By Georg Feuerstein
> Shambhala, 1998
>
> 'The Alchemical Body: Siddha Traditions
> in Medieval India'
> By David Gordon White
> University Of Chicago Press, 1998
>
> 'The Secret of the Three Cities:
> An Introduction to Hindu Sakta Tantrism'
> By Douglas Renfrew Brooks
> University Of Chicago Press, 1998
>

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ending FFL speculation about Tantra

[Vaj]

On Mar 28, 2010, at 3:13 PM, Bhairitu wrote:

> I also have the doctoral thesis of a woman who did research on John 
> Woodroffe and believes his writing were actually those of an Indian 
> friend who was a tantric. Interesting stuff. There is apparently a lot 
> of unpublished stuff on tantra languishing in Indian libraries. Stuff 
> going back over a hundred years that families have donated

There are many works that would be great to see popularly translated simply 
because they would help India sort out a history it's own inhabitants are 
largely unaware of. For example Ayurveda, even though it's received some 
attention worldwide, is still largely divorced from it's historical roots in 
the public imagination. Many still believe the Charaka-samhita is original. Few 
realize it's a recasting of the Agnivesa-tantra. The Bhagavad-gita is seem as a 
kind of Hindu bible, but few are aware most of it's sayings come from agamic 
sources. One could go on and on.

Unfortunately the Brahmanic right-wing are not that unlike their Christian 
right counterparts in the West. They try to drown out their competing sources 
with their Vedic extremism.

RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[Rick Archer]

From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of Alex Stanley
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 2:53 PM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump
 
 > From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com

[mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
 ]
> On Behalf Of TurquoiseB
> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 1:12 PM
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 

> Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump
> 
> 
> FWIW, Rick, I did not mean to question for a moment
> your intent in posting these videos. I was merely
> riffing on those who associate Fairfield and only 
> Fairfield (or other TM-related sites) with the idea
> of enlightenment. 

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
 , "Rick Archer"  wrote:

> I know. And actually during several of the interviews I mention
> that I have no intention of keeping this exclusively to FF or TM,
> and that there all sorts of people elsewhere whom I would like to
> interview once I'm technically capable of doing so.

Five of the interviewees are Waking Down teachers, one of whom has no
connection to TM.
 
And I've got a few more Waking Down teachers or participants in the queue.
Sandra thinks Saniel and Linda might be up for it next time they come to
town. So far I've found that Waking Down people make great interview
subjects. They're really clear and down to earth.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Another "Chicago" Federal Stimulus

[azgrey]

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/oregonstate.asp


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "emptybill"  wrote:
>
> (THIS STORY REPORTED BY SNOPES, MARCH 15, 2010. B.F.)
> 
> THE STIMULUS AT WORK
> 
> 
> Some have said that the stimulus hasn't saved any jobs, but  here is a
> case  where at least one job was saved.
> 
> Oregon State University  Athletic Director Bob DeCarolis was considering
> firing  their basketball coach, Craig  Robinson, after an 8-11 start
> (2-5  in the Pac 10  conference). When word of this reached Washington ,
> Undersecretary of  Education Martha Kanter was
> dispatched to Corvallis with $17  million in stimulus money for the
> university. Craig Robinson 's  job is safe for this year.
> 
> For those of you unfamiliar with  Coach Robinson , he just so happens to
> be Michelle  Obama 's  brother.
> 
> Just a coincidence you can be sure!
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Another "Chicago" Federal Stimulus

[azgrey]

Emptybill, this was reported FALSE by Snopes!

Why would you go to the trouble of pointing out it was
reported by Snopes yet *still* present it as if it was true?

"Just a coincidence you can be sure!"

Is it a coincidence that posting this is exactly what a 
dishonest puke would do?

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "emptybill"  wrote:
>
> (THIS STORY REPORTED BY SNOPES, MARCH 15, 2010. B.F.)
> 
> THE STIMULUS AT WORK
> 
> 
> Some have said that the stimulus hasn't saved any jobs, but  here is a
> case  where at least one job was saved.
> 
> Oregon State University  Athletic Director Bob DeCarolis was considering
> firing  their basketball coach, Craig  Robinson, after an 8-11 start
> (2-5  in the Pac 10  conference). When word of this reached Washington ,
> Undersecretary of  Education Martha Kanter was
> dispatched to Corvallis with $17  million in stimulus money for the
> university. Craig Robinson 's  job is safe for this year.
> 
> For those of you unfamiliar with  Coach Robinson , he just so happens to
> be Michelle  Obama 's  brother.
> 
> Just a coincidence you can be sure!
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[Alex Stanley]

>
> From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com]
> On Behalf Of TurquoiseB
> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 1:12 PM
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump
>  
>   
> FWIW, Rick, I did not mean to question for a moment
> your intent in posting these videos. I was merely
> riffing on those who associate Fairfield and only 
> Fairfield (or other TM-related sites) with the idea
> of enlightenment. 

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:

> I know. And actually during several of the interviews I mention
> that I have no intention of keeping this exclusively to FF or TM,
> and that there all sorts of people elsewhere whom I would like to
> interview once I'm technically capable of doing so.

Five of the interviewees are Waking Down teachers, one of whom has no 
connection to TM.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Trivedi Guruji vs. Master John Douglas

[curtisdeltablues]

First thanks to Azgrey who handed me back two hours of my life by responding.

Secondly Richard you should be able to understand that when I use the term 
"sophist trick" it is in the specific context of a philosophical argument and I 
always couple it with the example I am refering to.  Using it a a general sense 
as a generic putdown turns it into another version of poopy pants as Azgrey 
pointed out. It is a specific technical term in the context of an argument. One 
that I object to whenever one of them is used.  Unfortunatley with some posters 
it is the inevitible end of any discussion and is my signal that civility has 
ceased.


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "WillyTex"  wrote:
>
> 
> 
> > > > You don't understand the meaning of the terms 
> > > > you are using.
> > > > 
> > > Curtis demonstrates in his response that he is 
> > > practiced in the use of pharasaical sophistry.
> > >
> azgrey:
> > Another EPIC FAIL by authfiend...
> > 
> Well, I think Judy pretty much proved that Curtis
> was the respondent that didn't understand the terms
> he was using. But, you've topped Curtis with your
> own 'pharasaical sophistry'.
> 
> > > pharisaical: marked by hypocritical censorious 
> > > self-righteousness
> > >
> > > sophistry: subtly deceptive reasoning or 
> > > argumentation
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Trivedi/Guruji

[curtisdeltablues]

These claims are usefull in examining when scientific ignorance becomes 
scientific fraud.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:
>
> Comments from someone in FF:
>   
> 
> Trivedi/Guruji  was in Fairfield this past weekend.  He offers blessings to
> both groups and individuals.  Huge crowd on Wednesday the 17th at Sondheim.
> Then smaller crowd at Morning Star on Sat the 20th, more individual
> attention.  
> 
> He's returning to FF on April 18.  Group sessions are $15-25.  Still
> powerful.
> Some knowledge, etc. from him:

No problems here.  Sprititul claims need no more support than assertions that 
the undifined "blessings" are taking place.

> 
> Earth changing consciousness faster than individuals.  Mother Earth's
> frequency is alpha.

This claim is getting warmer. Alpha is a specific frequency so it should 
require some description of the measurment used to make it meaningful.  It is 
sciency sounding but meaningless without context.

  If we resonate with Her, then She can meet Her
> responsibility of taking care of us. 

Spiritual claim,none of my business.
 
> 
> People immediately shift to alpha when being blessed by Trivedi.  MUM
> scientist Alaric Arenander tested his wife Cynthia who's been rounding for
> 3+ years.  Her alpha, already high, increased with eyes closed, then
> dramatically increased when Trivedi did blessing.

Here we start to cross the line of using specific terms that are measurable to 
give more credence to the spiritual claims.  Without establishing anything to 
compare this measurement to it is meaningless.  Does Benny Hin get the same 
results? Does alpha increase when other people say sweet things to a person who 
is hooked up?  No metric is given and no context to understand the claim.  And 
what is the standard deviation of these measurments to determine their 
statistical significance?

> 
> Conductivity is very important word on this planet, ability to flow energy.
> 5% of people are super conductors, 20% good conductors.  Depends on receiver
> having low resistance.

I'm gunna just substitute having low resistance with suggestibility.

> 
> Trivedi's blessings kick out radioactivity

Specific claim.  Highly misleading without a metric of measurement.

 and GMO, even in next generation.
> Experiments show that he can change size of atom, increase energy bt atoms

Yeah, this is just too bogus to even warrent being called deceptive. I picture 
Jim Carry talking out of his butt.

> 
> Experiments also show that:
> his pituitary is egg-shaped and larger than other humans

Bingo!  Now we are in the completely misleading claims area. First of all what 
is the statistical mean for pituitary size?  Does the distibution of size 
follow a bell curve which would mean that half the population has larger ones?  
Since I am not a neuro-scientist I have no way to evaluate this claim. For all 
I know big pituitary is correlated with forms of retardation.  A big thyroid is 
a bad thing.  What does this mean?  And this assumes that someone actually did 
an MRI to evaluate this size and shape.  A person with the training to present 
this information in a context where it could be reasonably evaluated. But that 
does not seem to be the qoal.  The goal is to bamboozle with science words in a 
an undefined context with no hope of perspective on its meaning. They are 
drawing the bullseye around the arrow.  They find something that is different 
(how much?) and claim it is evidence of his specialness.

> skin elasticity better than new born baby
> no plaque in arteries at age of 46

This is subject to all the above complaints.  What is this compared to? I am 
reminded of the Afghan folk song:

"There is a boy across the river with a bottom like a peach, but alas I cannot 
swim."

What does his peach bottom mean?
If he is Indian his higher melinan in his skin makes this easier than my own 
background of Irish and French with skin so white I glow like an Iphone in a 
movie theater.  Dermatoligists have raved about my skin and I am 7 years older. 
It is genetic and I don't smoke, big deal. And I have fantastic arteries 
without a vegitarian diet so I can match that claim too.  What is being claimed 
about his specialness? How do these comparitive measurements relate to the rest 
of society? These claims of his physical specialness are presented in a 
misleading way with zero context.

> sympathetic and parasympathetic systems run simultaneously

Everybody's does, this is rediculous.

> does not breathe from diaphragm

And that is a good thing? He has shallow shoulder breath? What is being claimed?


> 
> FF people reported less fear, more happiness, more blissful yogic flying.
> Final output of blessing is more happiness in all areas of life.  Less
> mental restlessness, more calm, better sleep. 

Here we find the technique of panacea claims. Anything can be considered 
evidence after seeing him. On any given day pay attention to yourself and some 
things will be bette

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev, the Intellect of Shankara and the Heart of Buddha

[Bhairitu]

Duveyoung wrote:
> One wonders if Guru Dev's vibe would come through or be "actual" if he'd have 
> been recorded as Maharishi was.  
>
> Strange segue, bear with me here, but on American Idol they have this singer, 
> Crystal Bowersox, who seems to have some sort of siddhi going when she sings, 
> but when I view her youtube vids, it seems the shakti value is not nearly as 
> "there."
>
> Can a video give shaktipat?  If not, why not?  If so, how?
>
> Edg
That said I think what you are seeing is "charisma" and maybe a certain 
amount of shakti is involved in that.  Haven't you ever seen a young 
unknown actor or actress and just instinctively knew they are going to 
have a great career and then they do?  You knew that by their charisma.  
That charisma attracts.  They can even be half-assed actors and still 
get work (although that may not work so much anymore).

Meditation raises the vibratory rate and the body adapts to this raises 
rate.  Meditation create a concentrates shakti.  The body becomes like a 
battery and can store this and slowly disperses it.  One can also focus 
this shakti for healing etc if they know how.

RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[Rick Archer]

From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of TurquoiseB
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 1:12 PM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump
 
  
FWIW, Rick, I did not mean to question for a moment
your intent in posting these videos. I was merely
riffing on those who associate Fairfield and only 
Fairfield (or other TM-related sites) with the idea
of enlightenment. 
I know. And actually during several of the interviews I mention that I have
no intention of keeping this exclusively to FF or TM, and that there all
sorts of people elsewhere whom I would like to interview once I'm
technically capable of doing so.

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ending FFL speculation about Tantra

[Bhairitu]

As I said I've read the book.  Not only that empty, I am a Sidh Tantric 
of the Kali Sadaka Garana tradition and have been in that tradition for 
10 years so I have a little knowledge of tantra.  I didn't say it is a 
bad book but things look different once you are practicing it.   I've 
read Feuerstein's book and he very much has a spectator view of some of 
the Indian tantra rituals.  Again not a bad book either but I prefer to 
read those by practicing tantrics and have been collecting these 
particularly ones out of India.

L.R. Chawdhri was a tantric samrat who wrote a book on tantra which is 
not that well written but I had it for several years before learning 
tantra and I can say the book makes more sense once practicing than 
before.  Robert Svoboda's trilogy is good because he actually practices 
tantra.  Frawley also learned tantra.  How far they got in these 
traditions is another matter.  My experience tells me it is a practice 
better suited for younger folks (my guru started learning when he was 16 
and his guru when he was 9).

I also have the doctoral thesis of a woman who did research on John 
Woodroffe and believes his writing were actually those of an Indian 
friend who was a tantric.  Interesting stuff.  There is apparently a lot 
of unpublished stuff on tantra languishing in Indian libraries.  Stuff 
going back over a hundred years that families have donated.


emptybill wrote:
> Bhattacharya indeed was a scholar. However, the inference that he must
> not know what he was writing about is not valid criticism. No "Tantrika"
> has ever approached the scope of Narendra Nath's history.
>
> Page xii of the 1992 reprinted edition:
>
> "I express my deep feeling of gratitude to the memory
> of the late Kalikananda Avadhuta of Chinsurah, a well
> known Tantric teacher, though very much unusually
> critical and skeptic in regard to his own creed, from whom
>   I was able to clarify many difficult points, especially those
> pertaining to the so-called Tantric secret rituals."
>
> BTW Georg Feuerstein is a practitioner of Tantric Buddhism not a
> spectator. At the moment I don't remember his Lama but he has been
> Abhisheka'd and practices Vajrayana sadhana-s. That, by definition,
> makes him a Tantrika - just not a Hindu one.
>
> I consider "not a Hindu one" to be mere affiliation since the Buddhist
> Tantric sadhanas were ported over from the Injun's - especially the
> Bhairava sadhanas.
>
>
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>   
>> Have you read this book?  I have.  Bhattacharyya is not a tantric and
>> 
> like Feurstein can only look at things as a spectator.  He had some
> interesting observations though.  There are a few books actually written
> by practicing tantrics which have some good information.
>   
>
>
>
>   

[FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[TurquoiseB]

FWIW, Rick, I did not mean to question for a moment
your intent in posting these videos. I was merely
riffing on those who associate Fairfield and only 
Fairfield (or other TM-related sites) with the idea
of enlightenment. 


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:
>
> From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com]
> On Behalf Of TurquoiseB
> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:44 AM
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump
>  
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
>  , "Buck"  wrote:
> >
> > Buddha at the Gas Pump. This is extremely fun. On experience 
> > these kind of conversations go on all the time in Fairfield. 
> > It's a special place that way. 
> 
> Just as a question, would it be any less 'special'
> if conversations like this took place all over the
> world every day?
> 
> > Lot of people may lurk here and look in from a distance...
> 
> Does it matter that they are at a distance? What,
> after all, is 'distance' but duality incarnate?
> 
> > ...but 'Buddha at the Gas Pump' makes a great window for 
> > people to look in at Fairfield. 
> 
> Again, just as a question, why should they want to?
> Is there something 'special' about Fairfield that is
> *not* present where they are, right there, right now?
> 
> > There is a lot of long real spiritual experience around 
> > Fairfield. 
> 
> Doth this imply that you believe there is *not* a lot
> of 'long real spiritual experience' going on elsewhere?
> 
> > Rick has been busy working to open the window view on it. 
> > These are glimpse delightful. Good work. Great journalism.
> 
> Would it be any less delightful if watching these inter-
> views drew viewers to explore the 'anonymously enlightened'
> in their own neighborhoods, wherever they might be, not 
> just in Fairfield? 
> 
> Just askin'...
> I've spent most of the day today experimenting with different ways of
> recording Skype video, so that I can interview out-of-town people. I have no
> intention of limiting it to Fairfield, or to TM meditators.
>

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[WLeed3]

Nice going Rick A, perhaps a lurker in Buffalo NY & Wainfleet  Ont  Canada
 
 
In a message dated 3/28/2010 1:30:01 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
r...@searchsummit.com writes:




 
 
From:  FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] 
On  Behalf Of TurquoiseB
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:44  AM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject:  [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas  Pump

 
 
 
--- In _fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com_ 
(mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) ,  "Buck"  wrote:
>
> Buddha at the Gas  Pump. This is extremely fun. On experience 
> these kind of  conversations go on all the time in Fairfield. 
> It's a special place  that way. 

Just as a question, would it be any less 'special'
if  conversations like this took place all over the
world every  day?

> Lot of people may lurk here and look in from a  distance...

Does it matter that they are at a distance? What,
after  all, is 'distance' but duality incarnate?

> ...but 'Buddha at the  Gas Pump' makes a great window for 
> people to look in at Fairfield.  

Again, just as a question, why should they want to?
Is there  something 'special' about Fairfield that is
*not* present where they are,  right there, right now?

> There is a lot of long real spiritual  experience around 
> Fairfield. 

Doth this imply that you believe  there is *not* a lot
of 'long real spiritual experience' going on  elsewhere?

> Rick has been busy working to open the window view on  it. 
> These are glimpse delightful. Good work. Great  journalism.

Would it be any less delightful if watching these  inter-
views drew viewers to explore the 'anonymously enlightened'
in  their own neighborhoods, wherever they might be, not 
just in Fairfield?  

Just askin'... 
I've  spent most of the day today experimenting with different ways of 
recording  Skype video, so that I can interview out-of-town people. I have no 
intention  of limiting it to Fairfield, or to TM  meditators.


 

RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[Rick Archer]

From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of TurquoiseB
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:44 AM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump
 
  
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
 , "Buck"  wrote:
>
> Buddha at the Gas Pump. This is extremely fun. On experience 
> these kind of conversations go on all the time in Fairfield. 
> It's a special place that way. 

Just as a question, would it be any less 'special'
if conversations like this took place all over the
world every day?

> Lot of people may lurk here and look in from a distance...

Does it matter that they are at a distance? What,
after all, is 'distance' but duality incarnate?

> ...but 'Buddha at the Gas Pump' makes a great window for 
> people to look in at Fairfield. 

Again, just as a question, why should they want to?
Is there something 'special' about Fairfield that is
*not* present where they are, right there, right now?

> There is a lot of long real spiritual experience around 
> Fairfield. 

Doth this imply that you believe there is *not* a lot
of 'long real spiritual experience' going on elsewhere?

> Rick has been busy working to open the window view on it. 
> These are glimpse delightful. Good work. Great journalism.

Would it be any less delightful if watching these inter-
views drew viewers to explore the 'anonymously enlightened'
in their own neighborhoods, wherever they might be, not 
just in Fairfield? 

Just askin'...
I've spent most of the day today experimenting with different ways of
recording Skype video, so that I can interview out-of-town people. I have no
intention of limiting it to Fairfield, or to TM meditators.
 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev, the Intellect of Shankara and the Heart of Buddha

[TurquoiseB]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung  wrote:
>
> One wonders if Guru Dev's vibe would come through or be "actual" 
> if he'd have been recorded as Maharishi was.  
> 
> Strange segue, bear with me here, but on American Idol they have 
> this singer, Crystal Bowersox, who seems to have some sort of 
> siddhi going when she sings, but when I view her youtube vids, 
> it seems the shakti value is not nearly as "there."
> 
> Can a video give shaktipat?  If not, why not?  If so, how?

An excellent question. 

My answer -- based on my subjective experience for
many decades as a spiritual seeker and observer of
other spiritual seekers -- is, "Maybe."

I think it has to do with "resonance."

Human nature seems to be that when we encounter an
individual or a concept that is more or less "in
phase" with our own concepts of reality, we gravi-
tate to it more readily than we do an individual
or a concept that strikes a dissonance with our
own concepts of reality.

This doth *not* imply that our own personal concepts
of reality are "true," or in any sense a reliable
bellwether with which to judge other concepts. They
are just *ours*. And so, being human, IMO we find
ourselves attracted to those who share our concepts,
however valid or invalid they may be.

Why do admirers of the Tea Party Mentality see some-
thing in it to admire and bond with?

Why do admirers of other -- perhaps more balanced --
mentalities shrink from the Tea Baggers in disgust?

Neither is particularly "true" IMO. They are each 
just what they are. 

If an ordinary human being in one relative state of
consciousness, viewing 'reality' from one point of
view, sees a video of a particular teacher who reson-
ates with his/her current point of view on the nature
of reality, cool. If another ordinary human being in 
another relative state of consciousness, viewing 
'reality' from a different point of view, sees a video 
of that same teacher and finds that he/she does *not* 
resonate with his/her current point of view on the 
nature of reality, cool. 

No harm, no foul. 

To believe that there even *could* be, one has to 
believe that there is such a thing as 'Reality,' as
opposed to reality. N'est-ce pas?

[FairfieldLife] Re: Ending FFL speculation about Tantra

[emptybill]

Bhattacharya indeed was a scholar. However, the inference that he must
not know what he was writing about is not valid criticism. No "Tantrika"
has ever approached the scope of Narendra Nath's history.

Page xii of the 1992 reprinted edition:

"I express my deep feeling of gratitude to the memory
of the late Kalikananda Avadhuta of Chinsurah, a well
known Tantric teacher, though very much unusually
critical and skeptic in regard to his own creed, from whom
  I was able to clarify many difficult points, especially those
pertaining to the so-called Tantric secret rituals."

BTW Georg Feuerstein is a practitioner of Tantric Buddhism not a
spectator. At the moment I don't remember his Lama but he has been
Abhisheka'd and practices Vajrayana sadhana-s. That, by definition,
makes him a Tantrika - just not a Hindu one.

I consider "not a Hindu one" to be mere affiliation since the Buddhist
Tantric sadhanas were ported over from the Injun's - especially the
Bhairava sadhanas.



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>
> Have you read this book?  I have.  Bhattacharyya is not a tantric and
like Feurstein can only look at things as a spectator.  He had some
interesting observations though.  There are a few books actually written
by practicing tantrics which have some good information.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev, the Intellect of Shankara and the Heart of Buddha

[Duveyoung]

One wonders if Guru Dev's vibe would come through or be "actual" if he'd have 
been recorded as Maharishi was.  

Strange segue, bear with me here, but on American Idol they have this singer, 
Crystal Bowersox, who seems to have some sort of siddhi going when she sings, 
but when I view her youtube vids, it seems the shakti value is not nearly as 
"there."

Can a video give shaktipat?  If not, why not?  If so, how?

Edg


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "do.rflex"  wrote:
>
> 
> As a Shankaracharya he was found to have
> the great intellect of the first Shankaracharya
> and the heart of Buddha.
> The loveable soft  heart of Buddha
> and the great intellect of Shankara,
> and that was his personality.
> He wouldn't go much in details of the philosophical discussion but what
> he spoke was simple truths of life, but very simple, so piercing they
> went straight home to the heart.
> 
> People have been telling us, I think there were, that those were the
> meetings in open air, all the time in open air except in the rains. Open
> air meetings. We used to have sixteen,, twenty, twelve, eight, big, big,
> twelve mikes [loudspeakers] to cover the range of about fifty thousand
> people, a hundred thousand people, like that. Just for his evening
> discourses.
> 
> And he would hardly speak thirty, forty minutes, forty minutes was the
> maximum he went sometime. But every word he spoke was so powerful, was
> so piercing, was so convincing. People would see him and be transformed
> to all good life. Whatever remained there, buried in the subconscious
> would come out when they hear his words.
> 
> Very great thief has just been transformed, not by the logic or not by
> the exposition of any great thing which they know not before, but the
> truth exposes in so simple words and in such great force of life force,
> that they couldn't but only be transformed.
> 
> The motor would pass from there, and he would be speaking, and if the
> car is not very fast, if the driver happens to hear to hear some words
> he will immediately put up the brake and stop and listen. Cant pass on
> he has to stop and hear it, Such charm was there in his words, and such
> great simplicity. And depth of thought and he charmed the child and old
> alike. It was a pindrop of silence of fifty thousand, a hundred thousand
> people.
> 
> -- Excerpted from 'Maharishi Recounts Guru Dev's Life Story' found in
> 
> Life and Teachings of Swami Brahmananda Saraswati of Jyotirmath
> (1941-1953) – Volume III - by Paul Mason
> available here:  http://www.paulmason.info/booksetc.html
> 
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[TurquoiseB]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> Buddha at the Gas Pump. This is extremely fun. On experience 
> these kind of conversations go on all the time in Fairfield.  
> It's a special place that way.  

Just as a question, would it be any less 'special'
if conversations like this took place all over the
world every day?

> Lot of people may lurk here and look in from a distance...

Does it matter that they are at a distance? What,
after all, is 'distance' but duality incarnate?

> ...but 'Buddha at the Gas Pump' makes a great window for 
> people to look in at Fairfield. 

Again, just as a question, why should they want to?
Is there something 'special' about Fairfield that is
*not* present where they are, right there, right now?

> There is a lot of long real spiritual experience around 
> Fairfield.  

Doth this imply that you believe there is *not* a lot
of 'long real spiritual experience' going on elsewhere?

> Rick has been busy working to open the window view on it.  
> These are glimpse delightful.  Good work. Great journalism.

Would it be any less delightful if watching these inter-
views drew viewers to explore the 'anonymously enlightened'
in their own neighborhoods, wherever they might be, not 
just in Fairfield? 

Just askin'...

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Justified -- the second chance

[Bhairitu]

TurquoiseB wrote:
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>   
>> TurquoiseB wrote:
>> 
>>> Back in Spain, I downloaded the pilot of "Justified" 
>>> when I got back, and just finished watching it. You
>>> were right...it needed time to appreciate it more fully.
>>> Now I like it. Thanks for the tip.
>>>   
>> I've been spending the afternoon playing with my new Bluray 
>> player a Samsung BD-5500. I think Rick also has one of these.  
>> 
>
> This sounds like a neat player. I'm a big fan
> of Samsung, and got to see one of their new 3D
> TVs on my trip to the US. Do you happen to know
> whether this machine is hackable to set it to
> Region 0 and thus play DVDs from anywhere? That
> is a must for me, because my collection is from
> all over the world.
>   

It doesn't show up on this list as being hacked:
http://www.videohelp.com/dvdhacks

Bluray may be a lot harder to hack.  Most of the DVD hacks were someone 
finding a "backdoor" that was there for testing at the factory.  I still 
have one of the first Apex players that was hackable from the remote for 
region free.   Some of the studios are releasing Bluray titles region 
free.  I think one of the reasons that studios decided to go with Bluray 
was that they could create their own Java code for copy protection.

> Also, do you happen to know what would be up with
> the Net connection to all the download services
> you mention over in Europe? AFAIK none of them are
> available here, so what would they do with that?
> Bluray disks are still expensive here, and not
> readily available as rentals, at least in my tiny
> town. Thanks in advance for any info.

I don't know about the availability of  the services in Europe but I'll 
keep an eye open for it.  Vudu was recently bought by Walmart and I hope 
they don't mess with the movies as it has quite a lot of films available 
for streaming.  That includes some films I can no longer find at the now 
disappearing rental places nor even used DVD stores.  And they have them 
in "HD".  Vudu compared to Netflix does it right as I could peruse the 
films available without signing up.  If you sign up you get a free HD 
movie.  It is not a subscription service like Netflix.  There are fees 
for each rental and I see they have 99 cent "specials" they announce via 
Twitter.   I watched "Parallax View" in HDX which looked pretty good 
streamed.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Trivedi/Guruji

[TurquoiseB]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> > >
> > > Yep, the blonde bombshell in the audience front row at the 
> > > Morningstar meeting?  Incredible alpha. Trivedi pluck her 
> > > out of the whole group and walked out with her in particular 
> > > at the end of the meeting. Surely was scientific. Wow.
> > 
> > More seriously, Buck, although I have never met
> > either of the people cited, this sounds a lot
> > like "like recognizes like" to me.
> > 
> > Attractive blonde who sits in the front row when
> > visiting teachers hit town. People notice her and
> > give her their attention. Even the guy up onstage
> > notices her and gives her his attention. The guy
> > who IMO is performing the same minor occult siddhi
> > she is.
> > 
> > In my experience there are two basic types of shakti.
> > 
> > ( There are many more variants than two, of course,
> > but for the purposes of this rap I'm talkin' high-
> > level classifications here. ) 
> 
> Seriously too, Turq, fair description here of some of what 
> it seems was what going on.  

You were there; I was not. All I have to go on are
the reports posted here. From those, Trivedi's act,
and certainly the young woman's act, seem more occult
to me than samadic.

> In meditator parlance the first shakti would be more the 
> shakti as spiritual pure or universal while the second 
> tantric as the willful sense of wanting something.  

That is exactly the distinction I was trying to make.
Thank you for getting it. 

Intent is an interesting phenomenon. Yes, it exists.
Yes, it can influence the environment of the person
who occultly wields the intent, even to the point of
reshaping what many call "reality" for those in close
proximity to the reshaping.

But is is "clean?" That, to me, has become the thing
I look for in charismatic teachers I meet. Do they go
for the cheap charismatic flash -- which in my system
equates with intent -- or can they just kick back in
unity and get all laissez-faire on the audience's 
collective ass? 

The former (intent, IMO no matter how noble) tends to
have some "coloration" to its energy. It's as if the
wielder of the intent is trying to sell you something,
even if it's just buying into his/her point of view.
Whereas the energy of those just beaming out What They
Are, while (IMO) projecting no particular intent on
those watching them Be What They Are feels to me a 
little "cleaner," less intended, more liberating.

> The SEG of the bombshell as she was leaving victorious with 
> him demonstrated a remarkable tantric for some of those 
> watching.  

That's my intuition, based on your reporting. It might
be something completely different if I were in the room
able to suss out her eura and vibe. 

But your sentence pales a bit because, try as I might, I 
cannot decode the acronym 'SEG.' Could it be French: 'Sex 
en Go-go?"  :-)

> Buddha was tempted in his day too.  Christ in his.

Tempted?

By what? To what?

'Temptation' is a dualistic concept. It implies that
there exists a difference between 'what' and 'what.'

[FairfieldLife] Re: Ending FFL speculation about

[WillyTex]

emptybill:
>
> History of the Tantric Religion: 
> An Historical, Ritualistic, and 
> Philosophical Study...
> 
>From what I've read, there is no reason to 
think that 'tantrism' is pre-Vedic. These 
kinds of The alchemical systems seem to have
been developed during the Gupta Age in India.

Indus Valley seals have not been deciphred
yet, so we don't really know for sure. 

There is a tendency to push back these 
spiritual systems to pre-history, but many 
of them are realtively recent formulations. 

David Frawley thinks the Vedics came 'out 
of India' over 5000 years ago instead of 
going 'into India' in 1500 BC.

There is also some confusion concerning
shamnism and it's origin. Professor Kak
thinks the Vedics may have been shamans
that came from around Siberia.

Other titles of interest:

'The Tantric Tradition'
By Agehananda Bharati
Rider, 1970 

'Tantra: Path of Ecstasy'
By Georg Feuerstein
Shambhala, 1998

'The Alchemical Body: Siddha Traditions 
in Medieval India'
By David Gordon White
University Of Chicago Press, 1998

'The Secret of the Three Cities: 
An Introduction to Hindu Sakta Tantrism'
By Douglas Renfrew Brooks
University Of Chicago Press, 1998

Re: [FairfieldLife] Ending FFL speculation about

[Bhairitu]

Have you read this book?  I have.  Bhattacharyya is not a tantric and 
like Feurstein can only look at things as a spectator.  He had some 
interesting observations though.  There are a few books actually written 
by practicing tantrics which have some good information.

emptybill wrote:
> History of the Tantric Religion: An Historical, Ritualistic, and
> Philosophical Study: New Reprint Edition, 2006 (Hardcover)by N. N.
> Bhattacharyya
>  ncerank&search-alias=books&field-author=N.%20N.%20Bhattacharyya> 
> (Narendra Nath Bhattacharyya)Amazon dot com for around $30
>
> Description -
>
> In this book, the author presents in historical outline, the genesis,
> development and structural analysis of the Tantric tradition in India
> and its place in the Indian religious and philosophical systems. It
> studies the different aspects of Tantrism, its vastness and inricacies,
> its heterogeneous and contradictory elements and gives a historical
> perspective to the conglomeration of ideas and practices through space
> and time.
>
> The development of Tantrism is traced from pre-Vedic times through the
> Vedic, post-Vedic, early Buddhist and Jain periods down to the evolution
> of the concept of Sakti in Indian religious thinking. The sequence is
> carried forward by a study of the development of Tantric Buddhism in
> India and Tantric Ideas and practices in medieval religious systems.
>
> This important work also incorporates a review on Tantric art and a
> glossary of Tantric technical terms with reference to text, and
> intermeniaries.
>
>
>
>   

[FairfieldLife] Guru Dev, the Intellect of Shankara and the Heart of Buddha

[do.rflex]

As a Shankaracharya he was found to have
the great intellect of the first Shankaracharya
and the heart of Buddha.
The loveable soft  heart of Buddha
and the great intellect of Shankara,
and that was his personality.
He wouldn't go much in details of the philosophical discussion but what
he spoke was simple truths of life, but very simple, so piercing they
went straight home to the heart.

People have been telling us, I think there were, that those were the
meetings in open air, all the time in open air except in the rains. Open
air meetings. We used to have sixteen,, twenty, twelve, eight, big, big,
twelve mikes [loudspeakers] to cover the range of about fifty thousand
people, a hundred thousand people, like that. Just for his evening
discourses.

And he would hardly speak thirty, forty minutes, forty minutes was the
maximum he went sometime. But every word he spoke was so powerful, was
so piercing, was so convincing. People would see him and be transformed
to all good life. Whatever remained there, buried in the subconscious
would come out when they hear his words.

Very great thief has just been transformed, not by the logic or not by
the exposition of any great thing which they know not before, but the
truth exposes in so simple words and in such great force of life force,
that they couldn't but only be transformed.

The motor would pass from there, and he would be speaking, and if the
car is not very fast, if the driver happens to hear to hear some words
he will immediately put up the brake and stop and listen. Cant pass on
he has to stop and hear it, Such charm was there in his words, and such
great simplicity. And depth of thought and he charmed the child and old
alike. It was a pindrop of silence of fifty thousand, a hundred thousand
people.

-- Excerpted from 'Maharishi Recounts Guru Dev's Life Story' found in

Life and Teachings of Swami Brahmananda Saraswati of Jyotirmath
(1941-1953) – Volume III - by Paul Mason
available here:  http://www.paulmason.info/booksetc.html

[FairfieldLife] Another "Chicago" Federal Stimulus

[emptybill]

(THIS STORY REPORTED BY SNOPES, MARCH 15, 2010. B.F.)

THE STIMULUS AT WORK


Some have said that the stimulus hasn't saved any jobs, but  here is a
case  where at least one job was saved.

Oregon State University  Athletic Director Bob DeCarolis was considering
firing  their basketball coach, Craig  Robinson, after an 8-11 start
(2-5  in the Pac 10  conference). When word of this reached Washington ,
Undersecretary of  Education Martha Kanter was
dispatched to Corvallis with $17  million in stimulus money for the
university. Craig Robinson 's  job is safe for this year.

For those of you unfamiliar with  Coach Robinson , he just so happens to
be Michelle  Obama 's  brother.

Just a coincidence you can be sure!

[FairfieldLife] Re: Fw: Bullshit Bingo

[WillyTex]

> My family has been here ten generation, since 
> 1640 in Jamestown Virginia... 
>
Bhairitu:
> My mother's ancestors arrived in Jamestown back 
> then. Welsh yuppies I think. Yours Welsh yuppies 
> too?
> 
My great-grandmother was a McKinney, but my great
grandfather was from England. Apparently he was 
related to the founder of Providence Plantation,
Roger Williams - maybe.

Roger Williams, my infamous ancestor, was born in 
England, where he had graduated from Cambridge, 
and he had become a cleric in the Church of 
England... 

Read more:

Subject: Confessions 
Author: Richard J. Williams
Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental
Date: January 25, 2004
http://tinyurl.com/ybezy95

> Aren't you Texans seceding anyway?
>
No, Texas is a Republic and will probably annex
some of the other states. The Hispanic population 
in Texas will probably, at some point, be wanting 
their land back, California, that you stole from 
them. 

But, with the state of the economy in California, 
Texans may just prefer to write you off as a 
failed state. What do you think?

[FairfieldLife] Re: where MMY or we went wrong

[authfriend]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:

> TM just produces a relaxation EEG.

Uh, no.

> In a recent paper by Travis, "Focused attention, open
> monitoring and automatic self-transcending: Categories to
> organize meditations from Vedic, Buddhist and Chinese
> traditions" he actually argues that this common relaxation
> response is what's so special about TM!

No, in fact that's not at all what the authors argue. For
one thing, they clearly differentiate the TM EEG from the
relaxation EEG; for another, what they "argue" is merely
that TM is in a third category (along with Qui Gong in
experienced practitioners).

Their basic point is that research on meditation needs to differentiate between 
the three types of techniques, each
of which has its own characteristic neurophysiological 
signature, and study each type on its own terms rather 
than lumping them together.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Trivedi Guruji vs. Master John Douglas

[WillyTex]

> > > You don't understand the meaning of the terms 
> > > you are using.
> > > 
> > Curtis demonstrates in his response that he is 
> > practiced in the use of pharasaical sophistry.
> >
azgrey:
> Another EPIC FAIL by authfiend...
> 
Well, I think Judy pretty much proved that Curtis
was the respondent that didn't understand the terms
he was using. But, you've topped Curtis with your
own 'pharasaical sophistry'.

> > pharisaical: marked by hypocritical censorious 
> > self-righteousness
> >
> > sophistry: subtly deceptive reasoning or 
> > argumentation

[FairfieldLife] Ending FFL speculation about

[emptybill]

History of the Tantric Religion: An Historical, Ritualistic, and
Philosophical Study: New Reprint Edition, 2006 (Hardcover)by N. N.
Bhattacharyya
 
(Narendra Nath Bhattacharyya)Amazon dot com for around $30

Description -

In this book, the author presents in historical outline, the genesis,
development and structural analysis of the Tantric tradition in India
and its place in the Indian religious and philosophical systems. It
studies the different aspects of Tantrism, its vastness and inricacies,
its heterogeneous and contradictory elements and gives a historical
perspective to the conglomeration of ideas and practices through space
and time.

The development of Tantrism is traced from pre-Vedic times through the
Vedic, post-Vedic, early Buddhist and Jain periods down to the evolution
of the concept of Sakti in Indian religious thinking. The sequence is
carried forward by a study of the development of Tantric Buddhism in
India and Tantric Ideas and practices in medieval religious systems.

This important work also incorporates a review on Tantric art and a
glossary of Tantric technical terms with reference to text, and
intermeniaries.

[FairfieldLife] Re: where MMY or we went wrong

[WillyTex]

Vaj:
> relaxation response is what's so special about TM!
>
The 'relaxation response' is what is so special about
'enlightenment'. In fact, relaxation is the key to the 
enlightened state, according to teachers of Buddhist 
Dzogchen.

According Sogyal Rinpoche, meditation is "simply 
resting, undistracted, in the View, once it has been 
introduced."

His teacher Dudjom Rinpoche, once described meditation 
as being attentive to a state of 'Rigpa', experiencing 
free from all mental constructions, whilst remaning 
fully relaxed, without any distraction or grasping. 

"Meditation" states Rinpoche, "is not striving, but 
naturally becoming assimilated into it" (163). 

Work Cited:

"The Tibetan Book of Living and Dying"
By Sogyal Rinpoche
HarperCollins, 2002 

Read more:

Subject: TM, Dzogchen, and Zen
Author: Willytex
Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental, 
alt.meditation, alt.yoga, 
alt.buddha.short.fat.guy, alt.zen, 
talk.religion.buddhism
Date: July 31, 2004
http://tinyurl.com/yhxfehr

[FairfieldLife] Re: where MMY went wrong

[authfriend]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "WillyTex"  wrote:
>
[Vaj wrote:]
> > In other words, don't read any other "Vedic" 
> > literature other than my own and what I 
> > approve (e.g. the Ninth and Tenth mandala 
> > trans). 
> >
> There's no 'translation' by the Maharishi of the 
> Ninth and Tenth mandala - you probably meant 
> 'transliteration'.

MMY didn't translate the mandalas, but translations
thereof were used for reading after program on
earlier TM-Sidhis courses, before recordings of
pundits chanting them in Sanskrit became available.
I suspect that's what Vaj is referring to.

"Transliteration" means representing words written
in one alphabet with the characters of a different
alphabet, e.g., "Richo akshare parame vyoman" is a
transliteration of the Sanskrit characters into the
Western alphabet.

Maharishi's translation is, "The verses of the Ved
exist in the collapse of fullness in the
transcendental field."

[FairfieldLife] Re: where MMY went wrong

[WillyTex]

Vaj:
> "So given that weird expertise, it's difficult 
> for me to flat-out say 'smoking tobacco is not 
> used in some actual esoteric pranayama',"
>
It is common knowledge all over India, that yogis
smoke tobacco all the time, as 'bidis'; they also 
chew a lot of 'pan', and are often addicted to
hemp and hashish. My point was, that the Swami 
Rama used to secretly smoke *Marlboros*. 

Now that's being unethical! 

So, Swami Rama probably wasn't in an enlightened
state, according to your ethics formula. In fact,
it's almost comical, if it wasn't so pathetic, to 
imagine a teacher of yoga, smoking a cig.

Trungpa used to smoke all the time, and drink gin.

One time, according to Bhagavan Das, Trungpa got
really tipsy at a lecture in Boulder, and started 
dropping cigarette ashed on top of Ram Das's bald 
head.

Apparently this was Trungpa's way of teaching Ram 
Das not to be so egotistical by insisting on 
sitting right up front, under the Trunpa's chair. 

Or, maybe the Rinpoche was just drunk. I don't 
know.

[FairfieldLife] Re: where MMY went wrong

[WillyTex]

> > > The Marshy recommended his students didn't 
> > > read Sanskrit literature, beyond what he 
> > > explained about it, as it would just confuse 
> > > them. You'd do well to take his advice.
> > > 
> > Not really: TMers read the Bhagavad Gita and
> > the Upanishads all the time, which is Sanskrit 
> > literature. The transliterated Vedas are 
> > all available at the MUM bookstore up in 
> > Fairfield.
> >
Vaj:
> Notice I said "beyond what he explained about 
> it"... 
>
Yes, I noticed that, but you got confused when I
said that 'TMers' read all kinds of literature
about spiritual subjects. You're a case in point.

In fact, some TMers are more informed about Vedic 
literature than many so-called 'adepts'. 

Most of the respondents on this list seem to have 
read quite a lot about Vedic literature. There 
are at least two on this list that can actually 
read Sanskrit.

> In other words, don't read any other "Vedic" 
> literature other than my own and what I 
> approve (e.g. the Ninth and Tenth mandala 
> trans). 
>
There's no 'translation' by the Maharishi of the 
Ninth and Tenth mandala - you probably meant 
'transliteration'. But in fact, the Vedic books 
at the MUM Bookstore are copies of the volumes in 
the 'Sacred Books of the East Series'(remember
the 'Orange Book')?

You probably meant 'students' at MUM - maybe so. 

Reading about 'tantra' probably isn't required 
reaading in a graphic arts or management class!

Apparently, TMers in Fairfield read all kinds
of books, which they can purcahse at '21st Century
Books', a popular place in Fairfield. You can see 
TMers reading spiritual books all the time at 
'Revelations' in Fairfield. 

But, even some supposed 'siddhas' that inform 
here, don't know where the 'bija' mantras came 
from. 

Go figure.

Many TMers do read all kinds of spiritual
literature - I like to read Ken Wilber, for
example, and I'm a TMer. Lawson seemed to be
very well-read on scientific research on 
meditation techniques.

> Of course traditionally it is felt in the east 
> that a guru should explain these texts to their 
> students.
> 
Maybe so, but not all gurus in the east do this.

Many teachers in the Zen tradition don't encourage
their students to read metaphysical literature.

And why? Because reading metaphysical literature 
can be a distraction to spiritual practice!

The Buddha's barber could neither read nor write,
yet he apparently acheived enlightenment within 
ten minutes of hearing the Buddha explain the 
practice. So, being 'learned' is not a requirement
for achieving enlightenment.

In fact, even some Hindus don't know the origin 
of their own tradition or the bija mantras. 

Bhairitu talked to a Brahmin store clerk in Oakland, 
CA one day, and apparently the guy didn't know that 
the Saraswati Dasanamis worship Saraswati with a 
Saraswati bija mantra that is engraved on a Yanyta, 
at the Sringeri Matha founded by the Adi 
Shankaracharaya. Go figure.

RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[Rick Archer]

From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of lurkernomore20002000
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 9:34 AM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump
 
> I guess, but I think they should rename it, "The Angela Mailander Show".
> She's holding court there, though I can't say as I've read a one of her
> posts all the way through, but she must be saying something of
significance,
> or at least I hope so.
> I presume that by this you mean she's very active in the chat
>  group.

Right, that is all I mean.  I check in periodically.  Looks like she may
average, what,  50 posts a day?  And it looks like a pretty polite group.  
Once or twice non-politeness arose, but I told them to take it to FFL. I
don't want the BATGAP chat group to have a wild west mentality like this one
does.
But appears that three, maybe four people dominate discussion there.  
True. So far I haven't felt inclined to regulate in any way. I'll see how it
evolves. Maybe if more people join the greater volume will relegate the
heavy posters to a smaller percentage of total posts. Of course, that didn't
really work on FFL. So we'll see.
On the other hand, in this neck of the woods, we have  maybe six to eight
that drive discussion.  Congratulations on getting all the interviews in a
format people can see.  I hope to check them out at some point. 
 
> In terms of the interviews, hers was only one of the 16 I've done so far.
> And I haven't even uploaded the video of it yet.
 

[FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[lurkernomore20002000]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:
>
> From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com]
> On Behalf Of lurkernomore20002000
> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 9:01 AM
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump
>
>
> I guess, but I think they should rename it, "The Angela Mailander
Show".
> She's holding court there, though I can't say as I've read a one of
her
> posts all the way through, but she must be saying something of
significance,
> or at least I hope so.
> I presume that by this you mean she's very active in the chat
> 
group.

Right, that is all I mean.  I check in periodically.  Looks like she may
average, what,  50 posts a day?  And it looks like a pretty polite
group.  But appears that three, maybe four people dominate discussion
there.  On the other hand, in this neck of the woods, we have  maybe six
to eight that drive discussion.  Congratulations on getting all the
interviews in a format people can see.  I hope to check them out at some
point.


> In terms of the interviews, hers was only one of the 16 I've done so
far.
> And I haven't even uploaded the video of it yet.
>

RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[Rick Archer]

From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of lurkernomore20002000
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 9:01 AM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump
 
  
I guess, but I think they should rename it, "The Angela Mailander Show".
She's holding court there, though I can't say as I've read a one of her
posts all the way through, but she must be saying something of significance,
or at least I hope so.
I presume that by this you mean she's very active in the chat
  group.
In terms of the interviews, hers was only one of the 16 I've done so far.
And I haven't even uploaded the video of it yet.
 

[FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[lurkernomore20002000]

I guess, but I think they should rename it, "The Angela Mailander Show".  She's 
holding court there, though I can't say as I've read a one of her posts all the 
way through, but she must be saying something of significance, or at least I 
hope so.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
>
> Buddha at the Gas Pump.  This is extremely fun.   On experience these kind of 
> conversations go on all the time in Fairfield.  It's a special place that 
> way.  
> 
> Lot of people may lurk here and look in from a distance, but 'Buddha at the 
> Gas Pump' makes a great window for people to look in at Fairfield.  There is 
> a lot of long real spiritual experience around Fairfield.  Rick has been busy 
> working to open the window view on it.  These are glimpse delightful.  Good 
> work. Great journalism.
> 
> At YouTube,
> http://www.youtube.com/user/buddhaatthegaspump#p/u
> 
> 
> Jai Adi Shankara,
> -Buck   
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:
> >
> > Good News!
> >  
> > I have just uploaded one new video and all but one of the audio tracks of
> > the 16 interviews conducted so far. 
> >  
> > There are several ways to listen to the audios:
> >  
> > cid:image001.png@
> >  
> > At http://batgap.com you'll see something similar to the above screen shot
> > at the bottom of the entry for each interview. You may:
> > . Click on the arrow or the Audio MP3 graphic to listen in your
> > browser.
> > . Click on "Play in Popup" to play the audio in a browser Popup
> > window.
> > . Click on "Download" to download the MP3 file to your computer so
> > you may listen to it on your MP3 player.
> > . Subscribe to our Podcast
> >  > pt=uo%3D4>  Channel, to listen in iTunes or on your iPod. If you just
> > transfer an MP3 file to your player it shows up in the "Music" category in
> > iTunes, and if you switch to something else in the middle of an interview,
> > or connect your iPod to your computer to recharge it or do a fresh sync, you
> > lose your place in the file. Podcasts are "smarter" in that they remember
> > where you left off. They also download new episodes and sync them with your
> > iPod automatically.
> >  
> > There are several ways to watch the new video, which is #6 in the series,
> > and the others to be uploaded soon:
> >  
> > . With higher resolution, but in 10-minute segments, on YouTube
> >  
> > . With lower resolution, but in their entirety, on our blog
> >  
> > . By buying DVDs. Contact me if that interests you.
> >  
> > After watching or listening to them, there are several ways to discuss them.
> > 
> >  
> > . On the blog  , you can address questions to
> > particular guests or make comments by leaving a reply on the page where that
> > guest's interview is posted (for instance  ).
> > . On our very active chat
> >   group,
> > where discussion may pertain to a particular interview, but is usually of a
> > more general nature.
> > . By leaving comments on the YouTube channel
> >  , although that format is
> > not well-suited to extended, interactive discussions.
> > . If you have suggestions or constructive criticism for me, or
> > questions you would like me to ask future guests, just email me
> >  .
> >  
> > There are several ways to be notified when new interviews are posted:
> > . Subscribe to the blog by clicking on
> > cid:image002.png@ in the upper right hand corner of the
> > page. That will take you to a page where you can choose your blog reader.
> > Microsoft Outlook and Outlook Express can serve this purpose.
> > . Just stay on this mailing list. If this email was forwarded to you
> > and you would like to subscribe to this list, send a blank email to
> > list-subscribe@
> > . Subscribe to the YouTube channel
> >  . You'll get an email from
> > YouTube when I upload new videos there.
> > . Follow us on Twitter  , but if you're
> > like me, you miss a lot of "Tweets" from people you're following, and may
> > not notice when new videos are announced.
> >  
> > The newly-posted video is number 6 in the series. Numbers 7 and 8 will be
> > uploaded within a few days. I had intended to release them in the order they
> > were recorded, but as I mentioned in the last email, software and hardware
> > problems have delayed the post-production work of replacing the green screen
> > background with a more attractive one. These problems can and will be
> > solved. It's just a matter of having the right (expensive) software on the
> > right compu

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: where MMY or we went wrong

[Vaj]

On Mar 27, 2010, at 11:04 PM, yifuxero wrote:

> depends on how one defines transcendence. In some Buddhist traditions, as 
> well as Neo-Advaitic, variations of transcendence aren't recognized. Ramana 
> Maharshi never addressed such partial Awakenings: Self-Realization to Him 
> wasn't even an "all or nothing" situation: just the "All" - even for 
> supposedly ignorant people.
> But Vaj, you're using rules from the "All" traditions to judge a clearly 
> progressive variant of Advaita: (MMY's innovative, progressive program in 
> which "transcendence" has been qualified to have a number of levels, or 
> progressions leading to Unity".

No I'd just point out that the EEG signature of Patanjali yogins has been known 
since the 1950's and it's way different from that found in TMers. TM just 
produces a relaxation EEG. In a recent paper by Travis, "Focused attention, 
open monitoring and automatic self-transcending: Categories to organize 
meditations from Vedic, Buddhist and Chinese traditions" he actually argues 
that this common relaxation response is what's so special about TM!

Of course the goal of the 16 angas of mantra-yoga is way different from that of 
Patanjali's yoga:

THE SIXTEEN STEPS (ANGA‑S) OF MANTRA YOGA


Like all forms of yoga, the method of Mantra yoga has several steps; some of 
these steps are common to the other forms and some have different implications.

Sixteen steps of Mantra yoga is the number usually given, namely:

(1) DEVOTION (bhakti) is the first step, the most pertinent and the easiest 
form of spiritual achievement for the present age of darkness. Its method has 
nine stages which will be given in a separate chapter on Bhakti yoga.

(2) PURITY (shuddhi) is of two kinds, outward and inward (as described in Hatha 
yoga). Inward purity is the most important in Mantra yoga.

(3) POSTURE (asana) has been described under Hatha yoga, but only the Lotus 
posture and the Auspicious posture are, as a rule, mentioned in connection with 
Mantra Yoga.

(4) OBSERVANCE OF THE CALENDAR (panchanga sevana). The Hindu calendar is based 
entirely on astronomical data, and great importance is therefore attached to 
certain days of the solar and lunar cycles, to eclipses, to the passage of the 
sun into new signs of the zodiac, etc. Such dates define the days of rejoicing 
or of fasts and must be strictly observed.

(5) THE WAYS OF CONDUCT (achara) are three, according to the fundamental 
qualities of nature. Angelic conduct (divya‑âchâra) is for the seeker in whom 
the ascending tendency predominates; the right‑hand way (dakshina‑âchâra) or 
way of good actions is for the seeker in whom the expanding tendency 
predominates; while the left‑hand way (vâma‑âchâra), or the way which makes use 
of the senses as the means of transgressing them, is the way for those in whom 
the descending tendency predominates. This last way, although very efficient, 
is, however, always full of danger and as such is not recommended except in 
special cases. Its technique is explained in the Tantras.

(6) CONCENTRATION (dháraná) is of two kinds, outward and inward. Outward 
concentration is on an external object, a picture, image, symbol, etc. Inward 
concentration is on the inner world
 within one's mind. When evoked through concentration, the deity worshipped 
appears embodied and grants to the worshipper the boons desired.

(7) THE SEARCH FOR DIVINE COUNTRIES (divya‑desha‑sevana).

There are sixteen divine countries. These inner countries are the abodes of the 
deities worshipped and appear to the mind when concentration has borne fruit.

(8) BREATH‑CONTROL (prána kriya helps to control the movements of the mind; it 
has been already described under Hatha yoga. When accompanied by the repetition 
of a mantra, breathcontrol is of great help in mantra yoga.

(9) GESTURE (mudra) There are gestures to represent each deity which should be 
practised with the corresponding mantras (see Hatha yoga: Gestures).

(10) WATER OFFERING (tarpana) pleases deities and after having offered water to 
one's chosen deity, water should also be offered to all the divine beings, to 
the seers and to the Forefathers (pitris). To obtain the fulfilment of 
particular desires, other substances than water may be offered.

(11) FIRE OFFERING (havana) is a means of pleasing the gods and obtaining 
desired results. Offerings should be poured sixteen times into the fire, 
uttering the mantra appropriate to one's chosen deity. Then offering should be 
made to other deities.

(12) RITUAL SACRIFICE (bali) appeases the anger of the deities. Preferably, the 
best of fruits should be sacrificed, but when it is in accordance with the 
rites prevailing in a man's community, the sacrifice of living creatures, 
goats, birds, etc., is allowed by certain forms of Hindu ritual. Non‑violent 
sacrifice is, however, always to be preferred. The greatest sacrifice is that 
of one's own pride, only after it comes that of lust, anger, and the other real 
enemies o

[FairfieldLife] Re: New Stuff on Buddha at the Gas Pump

[Buck]

Buddha at the Gas Pump.  This is extremely fun.   On experience these kind of 
conversations go on all the time in Fairfield.  It's a special place that way.  

Lot of people may lurk here and look in from a distance, but 'Buddha at the Gas 
Pump' makes a great window for people to look in at Fairfield.  There is a lot 
of long real spiritual experience around Fairfield.  Rick has been busy working 
to open the window view on it.  These are glimpse delightful.  Good work. Great 
journalism.

At YouTube,
http://www.youtube.com/user/buddhaatthegaspump#p/u


Jai Adi Shankara,
-Buck   

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer"  wrote:
>
> Good News!
>  
> I have just uploaded one new video and all but one of the audio tracks of
> the 16 interviews conducted so far. 
>  
> There are several ways to listen to the audios:
>  
> cid:image001.png@...
>  
> At http://batgap.com you'll see something similar to the above screen shot
> at the bottom of the entry for each interview. You may:
> . Click on the arrow or the Audio MP3 graphic to listen in your
> browser.
> . Click on "Play in Popup" to play the audio in a browser Popup
> window.
> . Click on "Download" to download the MP3 file to your computer so
> you may listen to it on your MP3 player.
> . Subscribe to our Podcast
>  pt=uo%3D4>  Channel, to listen in iTunes or on your iPod. If you just
> transfer an MP3 file to your player it shows up in the "Music" category in
> iTunes, and if you switch to something else in the middle of an interview,
> or connect your iPod to your computer to recharge it or do a fresh sync, you
> lose your place in the file. Podcasts are "smarter" in that they remember
> where you left off. They also download new episodes and sync them with your
> iPod automatically.
>  
> There are several ways to watch the new video, which is #6 in the series,
> and the others to be uploaded soon:
>  
> . With higher resolution, but in 10-minute segments, on YouTube
>  
> . With lower resolution, but in their entirety, on our blog
>  
> . By buying DVDs. Contact me if that interests you.
>  
> After watching or listening to them, there are several ways to discuss them.
> 
>  
> . On the blog  , you can address questions to
> particular guests or make comments by leaving a reply on the page where that
> guest's interview is posted (for instance  ).
> . On our very active chat
>   group,
> where discussion may pertain to a particular interview, but is usually of a
> more general nature.
> . By leaving comments on the YouTube channel
>  , although that format is
> not well-suited to extended, interactive discussions.
> . If you have suggestions or constructive criticism for me, or
> questions you would like me to ask future guests, just email me
>  .
>  
> There are several ways to be notified when new interviews are posted:
> . Subscribe to the blog by clicking on
> cid:image002.png@... in the upper right hand corner of the
> page. That will take you to a page where you can choose your blog reader.
> Microsoft Outlook and Outlook Express can serve this purpose.
> . Just stay on this mailing list. If this email was forwarded to you
> and you would like to subscribe to this list, send a blank email to
> list-subscr...@...
> . Subscribe to the YouTube channel
>  . You'll get an email from
> YouTube when I upload new videos there.
> . Follow us on Twitter  , but if you're
> like me, you miss a lot of "Tweets" from people you're following, and may
> not notice when new videos are announced.
>  
> The newly-posted video is number 6 in the series. Numbers 7 and 8 will be
> uploaded within a few days. I had intended to release them in the order they
> were recorded, but as I mentioned in the last email, software and hardware
> problems have delayed the post-production work of replacing the green screen
> background with a more attractive one. These problems can and will be
> solved. It's just a matter of having the right (expensive) software on the
> right computer, and a limited budget has delayed accomplishing that. These
> three were taped against a fabric backdrop. Hence, no green screen problem.
> We will continue to tape new shows without the green screen, until this
> problem has been solved.
>  
> After I sent out the last email, mentioning the green screen problem, my old
> high school buddy Ralph   Preston volunteered
> to take a crack at it. Ralph and I shared all sorts of wild adventures back

Re: [FairfieldLife] PaaNini: iKo yaNaCi

[Vaj]

On Mar 28, 2010, at 6:22 AM, cardemaister wrote:

> So, based on that suutra, it seems highly unlikely, that
> 'om' is a "corrupted" form of 'a i u N', because to be
> a word it should read 'ayun/ayum/ayung' (i before another vowel), or stuff, 
> taking into account the additional fact that 'N' (the retroflex n-sound) is 
> *not* amongst the "permitted finals" of the Sanskrit language!


Danielou, based on Karpatri, says:

"In day-to-day usage N is replaced by M in order to avoid accidentally 
summoning the magic powers of Mantra. A represents the principle of the world; 
U is the manifest principle; N is hearing; AUN summons the principle of the 
world manifested in the Word."

So AUM is the mundane usage, AUN that of initiates, and what was used in the 
Hindu tantras rather than AUM.

According to Nandikeshvara's commentary on the Maheshvara sutra, the letter 
sequence of A-U-I is Purusha (A) manifesting  the "seed of desire" through 
Shakti (I), materializing the blueprint of Creation (U).

[FairfieldLife] Re: Trivedi/Guruji

[Buck]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB  wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck"  wrote:
> >
> > Yep, the blonde bombshell in the audience front row at the 
> > Morningstar meeting?  Incredible alpha. Trivedi pluck her 
> > out of the whole group and walked out with her in particular 
> > at the end of the meeting. Surely was scientific. Wow.
> 
> More seriously, Buck, although I have never met
> either of the people cited, this sounds a lot
> like "like recognizes like" to me.
> 
> Attractive blonde who sits in the front row when
> visiting teachers hit town. People notice her and
> give her their attention. Even the guy up onstage
> notices her and gives her his attention. The guy
> who IMO is performing the same minor occult siddhi
> she is.
> 
> In my experience there are two basic types of shakti.
> 
> ( There are many more variants than two, of course,
> but for the purposes of this rap I'm talkin' high-
> level classifications here. ) 
 

Seriously too, Turq, fair description here of some of what it seems was what 
going on.  In meditator parlance the first shakti would be more the shakti as 
spiritual pure or universal while the second tantric as the willful sense of 
wanting something.  The SEG of the bombshell as she was leaving victorious with 
him demonstrated a remarkable tantric for some of those watching.  Buddha was 
tempted in his day too.  Christ in his.

Jai Adi Shankara,
-Buck  



> There is the shakti of samadhi, which I would char-
> acterize as silent, intentless, and non-overwhelming.
> It doesn't attract or seek your attention; it has no
> need for your attention. It is just silence flowing.
> In my experience this form of shakti is transformative, 
> and can have lasting benefits.
> 
> Then there is the shakti of the occult. In the Rama
> trip we used to call it "pushing it out." I would 
> characterize this form of shakti as non-silent, drip-
> ping with intent, and potentially overwhelming. 
> 
> "Pushing it out" is what women who walk into a room
> and instantly cause every head in the room to turn
> in their direction and every pair of eyes in the 
> room lock onto them do. It's also what some teachers 
> do onstage. IMO this form of shakti is not tranform-
> ative in any lasting sense and can actually be 
> debilitating. 
> 
> Think about the word "attractive."
> 
> What is it that the person "pushing it out" is 
> trying to ATTRACT?
> 
> Your attention. Your energy. 
> 
> As opposed to the person just sitting in samadhi 
> and radiating that energy out silently with no 
> intent behind it. That's a very different thing 
> in my experience from merely pushing it out.
>

[FairfieldLife] PaaNini: iKo yaNaCi

[cardemaister]

(Just killing time, can't guarantee got this right...)


PaaNini-suutra 6.1.77:

iKo yaN aCi (sandhi-vigraha: iKaH; yaN aCi)

The capital letters above refer to the /anubandha-s/
(the last letters of each suutra)
of PaaNini's /akSarasamaamnaaya-s/(aka Shivasuutra-s):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shiva_sutras

/iKaH/ is the genitive (Engl. possessive) singular
of the pratyaahaara /iK/ that refers to the suutra-s
1 and 2 above (save the first phoneme, 'a'):

1. (a) *i u [Ṇ]
2. R (vocalic r) L (vocalic l) K*

/yaN/ is the nominative singular of pratyaahaara
for suutras 5 and 6 (save 'h')

5. (h) y v r [Ṭ]
6. l Ṇ

/aCi/ is the locative singular of pratyaahaara
for the suutras 1, 2, 3 and 4 (a[i,u,R,L,e,o,ai,au]C):

1. a i u Ṇ
2. R L K
3. e o Ṅ
4. ai au C

So, that suutra /iKo yaN aCi/ prolly sez, that before a vowel
(aC) the phonemes i, u, R (vocalic r-sound) and L (vocalic
l-sound) (iK) change to corresponding consonantal sounds
y (as in 'you'), v, r and l (yaN). 

So, based on that suutra, it seems highly unlikely, that
'om' is a "corrupted" form of 'a i u N', because to be
a word it should read 'ayun/ayum/ayung' (i before another vowel), or stuff, 
taking into account the additional fact that 'N' (the retroflex n-sound) is 
*not* amongst the "permitted finals" of the Sanskrit language!

[FairfieldLife] Re: Justified -- the second chance

[TurquoiseB]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu  wrote:
>
> TurquoiseB wrote:
> > Back in Spain, I downloaded the pilot of "Justified" 
> > when I got back, and just finished watching it. You
> > were right...it needed time to appreciate it more fully.
> > Now I like it. Thanks for the tip.
> 
> I've been spending the afternoon playing with my new Bluray 
> player a Samsung BD-5500. I think Rick also has one of these.  

This sounds like a neat player. I'm a big fan
of Samsung, and got to see one of their new 3D
TVs on my trip to the US. Do you happen to know
whether this machine is hackable to set it to
Region 0 and thus play DVDs from anywhere? That
is a must for me, because my collection is from
all over the world.

Also, do you happen to know what would be up with
the Net connection to all the download services
you mention over in Europe? AFAIK none of them are
available here, so what would they do with that?
Bluray disks are still expensive here, and not
readily available as rentals, at least in my tiny
town. Thanks in advance for any info.

[FairfieldLife] Re: EVERY Republican voted against Clinton's Economic Plan

[BillyG]

No way, Bush let us conservative Republicans down BIG TIME. Look there's plenty 
of blame to go around, but this recent group is the worst, mark my words, they 
have they're heads in the sand and America, as we knew it, is disappearing.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "lurkernomore20002000"  
wrote:
>
> 
> And this all happened since Obama took office.? Up until then, it was
> all hunky dory.? This war in Iraq, not adding to the deficit?  This war
> in Iraq - care to discuss our ROI?  Tell me Dix, what has been our  ROI
> on that.  At least Shemp, for all  his conservative leanings, recognizes
> that the fiscal irresponsibility is on both sides of the isle.  But you
> seem not to even concede that.  You also don't seem to willing to
> address other points brought up.  But that seems to be the case often
> with you, I have observed.
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "BillyG"  wrote:
> >
> >
> > No..it will be, the economy stinks, there are no jobs, Obama and Gore
> are worried about Global Warming and in the mean time the ship of state
> is sinking. SS BROKE, Medicare BROKE, sustained promises by government
> in the form of Union pensions foreordain the collapse of the entire
> system before Obama leaves office..too much *GREECE* my friends. WE
> need REAL change NOW!
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "lurkernomore20002000"
> steve.sundur@ wrote:
> > >
> > > The Dems will pick up seats, instead of lose them. Bring it On.
> > >
> > > What is the battle cry for the Repulicans going to be: "HE GAVE
> HEALTH CARE TO CHILDREN. HE TOLD INSURANCE COMPANIES THEY COULDN'T DENY
> COVERAGE FOR PRE-EXISTING CONDITIONS. THIS IS NOT AMERICA, THIS IS
> SOCIALISM. THESE MEASURES MUST BE REPEALED"
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "do.rflex" 
> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > President Clinton signed into law the largest deficit reduction
> plan in
> > > > > history
> > > > >
> > > > > As part of the 1993 Economic Plan, President Clinton cut taxes
> on 15
> > > > > million low-income families and made tax cuts available to 90
> percent of
> > > > > small businesses, while raising taxes on just 1.2 percent of the
> > > > > wealthiest taxpayers.
> > > > >
> > > > > From Wikipedia:
> > > > >
> > > > > "The Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1993 ... was passed by
> the
> > > > > 103rd United States Congress
> > > > >  and
> signed
> > > > > into law by President
> > > > > 
> Bill
> > > > > Clinton  . It has
> also been
> > > > > referred to as the Deficit Reduction Act of 1993. Part XIII,
> which dealt
> > > > > with taxes, is also called the Revenue Reconciliation Act of
> 1993.
> > > > >
> > > > > [...and just like today's Republicans ]
> > > > >
> > > > > Ultimately *every Republican in Congress voted against the
> bill,* as did
> > > > > a number of Democrats. Vice President
> > > > >
>  Al
> > > > > Gore  broke a tie in the
> Senate
> > > > >  on both the
> Senate
> > > > > bill and the conference report
> > > > >
>  \
> > > > > e#The_conference_report> .
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > The House bill passed 219-213.[1]
> > > > >  The House passed
> the
> > > > > conference report on Thursday, August 5, 1993, by a vote of 218
> to 216
> > > > > (217 Democrats and 1 independent (Sanders
> > > > >  (VT-I)) voting in
> favor;
> > > > > 41 Democrats and 175 Republicans voting against)
> > > > >
> > > > > ...The Senate passed the conference report ... on Friday, August
> 6,
> > > > > 1993, by a vote of 51 to 50 (50 Democrats plus Vice President
> Gore
> > > > > voting in favor, ... and 44 Republicans voting against).
> President
> > > > > Clinton signed the bill on August 10, 1993.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omnibus_Budget_Reconciliation_Act_of_1993#L\
> \
> > > > > egislative_history
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > [Results:]
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > During the Bill Clinton Presidency:
> > > > >
> > > > > * Average economic growth of 4.0 percent per year, compared to
> average
> > > > > growth of 2.8 percent during the previous years. The economy
> grew for
> > > > > 116 consecutive months, the most in history.[36]
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > * Creation of more than 22.5 million jobs—the most jobs ever
> created
> > > > > under a single administration, and more than were created in the
> > > > > previous 12 years. Of the total new jobs, 20.7 million, or 92
> percent,
> > > > > were in the private sector.[37]
> > > > >
> > > > > * Economic gains spurred an i