Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-20 Thread Zoran Krneta
Brahman alone is real, this
world is unreal; the Jiva is identical with Brahman.

That would be Advaita philosophy but part of that statement is argument
which is used by mayavada philosophers. Shankara introduced concept of maya
or illusion of the world and with that he actually introduced concept of
qualified monism. Shankara also introduced concept of nirguna and saguna
Brahman which is difficult to fit in concept of pure monism, so Shankara's
Advaita or better to say mayavada fails to be pure monism.

Zoran - The Shankara Acharya composed the following works:
Bhashyas on Brahma Sutras...

According to George Thibaut Ramunuja's commentary of Brahma Sutras is giving
more accurate explanation of what Vyasa said, but Thibaut also added that
Shankara's views are closer to Upanishad philosophers than Ramunuja's. Also
we must say that there are many Upanishads and each school uses those ones
which are basis for their specific arguments.
Thanks for mentioning Nimbark acharya his teaching is also interesting...


[FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-20 Thread Richard J. Williams
  The Shankara Acharya composed the following works:
  Bhashyas on Brahma Sutras...
 
Zoran wrote:
 According to George Thibaut Ramunuja's commentary of 
 Brahma Sutras is giving more accurate explanation of 
 what Vyasa said, but Thibaut also added that Shankara's 
 views are closer to Upanishad philosophers than 
 Ramunuja's.

Maybe so, but the TMer tradition follows the Adwaita
tradition of Shankaracharya - we don't have anything to 
do with the qualified non-dualists (Visishtadvaitans) 
who posit the existence of two reals - it just doesn't 
seem to make any sensse that there would be a Brahman 
with attributes; a Lord Narayana or a Bhagavan, that is, 
a Supreme Being; the individual soul is Chit; matter is 
Achit. That kind of outlook just doesn't seem to make 
any sense.

 Also we must say that there are many Upanishads and each 
 school uses those ones which are basis for their specific 
 arguments.

Maybe so, but the tradition TMers follow is the Sri Vidya 
and the Trupura Upanishad. Shankara composed the Saundarya-
lahari for our understanding. In it are enumerated the TM
bija mantras including the bija mantra of Sri Saraswati, 
that is, Tripura, and the 'secret of the three cities'.

 Thanks for mentioning Nimbark acharya... 

The scriptures of the six Gosvamis mention the names of 
Acaryas such as Sri Ramanuja, Sri Madhva, Sri Visnu Svami, 
Sri Nimbaditya and Sri Vallabha Acarya. If the Nimbarka 
sampradaya had existed even to a slight extent at that time, 
then they would most certainly have mentioned the name of 
Nimbarka Acarya as well. However, they did not, so that 
leads me to conclude that Nimbarka came much later, probably 
in the 18th century.



Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-20 Thread Zoran Krneta
Maybe so, but the TMer tradition follows the Adwaita
tradition of Shankaracharya...
You may believe that Shankara's advaita is right one, but that philosophy
suffers from many inconsistencies. Shakara on many places did not put a
comment on Vyasa's sutras rather he introduced and forced his own philosophy
and system which give existence to mayavada philosophy which is not pure
advaita.

Maybe so, but the tradition TMers follow is the Sri Vidya
and the Trupura Upanishad...

Shankar's tradition which TMers are following is tradition which came from
Lord Vishnu (Narayana)... Shankara's gurus were Vaishnavs. Later on it
turned to be everything else including tradition of Shri...


Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-20 Thread Kirk
Shankar's tradition which TMers are following is tradition which came from Lord 
Vishnu (Narayana)... Shankara's gurus were Vaishnavs. Later on it turned to be 
everything else including tradition of Shri...


--Absolutely not so. Shri as bride of Vishnu has always been the glorious 
source of the vidya. No other. Vishnu has been associated with also Dravidian 
Kali. And Kali always has side of Sattwa as Shri, while Vishnu always has 
Lakshmi. This is most ancient Dravidian religion of tantra. Shri or Glorious 
Knowledge or vidya. Truth is that inertia or body which none can move as tamas 
leads entire existance, called guru. All else is body of Shree, which is seen 
most manifest in motion. Shree is also consort of Shiva. She does everyone. If 
you like. Her name is also kundalini. She cannot be insulted or sullied. 
Neither burned, nor burned out. But she will remain the pinch in the butt to 
get moving for the day is short. The real truth about divinity is that noone 
can touch it for all your good and evil. It remains forever pure just as is 
right now...untouchable. Not having any foundation besides itself as potential. 
One language equals the gift of tongues but only women can understand it. And 
few men. These teachings of ultimate purity are not for all. Only heros - 
viras, or viranis. Dualists can never be correct having strayed from the 
outset. 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread cardemaister
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 Ya  might only need to familiarize yer 
 self with the basic phonemic units of Sanskrit to be able to notice
 that it rocks! But, of course, YMMV!  ;)

Vowels:

a, aa, i, ii, u, uu, R, RR, L, e, ai, o, au

Consonants (with the inherent short 'a' in DN characters):

velar: ka, kha, ga, gha, nga

palatal: ca, cha, ja, jha, ña

retroflex: Ta, Tha, Da, Dha, Na

dental: ta, tha, da, dha, na

labial: pa, pha, ba, bha, ma

others: ya, ra, la, va; sha, Sa, sa, ha








[FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread gyselsvishnu
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@ 
 wrote:
  Ya  might only need to familiarize yer 
  self with the basic phonemic units of Sanskrit to be able to 
notice
  that it rocks! But, of course, YMMV!  ;)
 
 Vowels:
 
 a, aa, i, ii, u, uu, R, RR, L, e, ai, o, au
 
 Consonants (with the inherent short 'a' in DN characters):
 
 velar: ka, kha, ga, gha, nga
 
 palatal: ca, cha, ja, jha, ña
 
 retroflex: Ta, Tha, Da, Dha, Na
 
 dental: ta, tha, da, dha, na
 
 labial: pa, pha, ba, bha, ma
 
 others: ya, ra, la, va; sha, Sa, sa, ha

Sanskrit is indeed a great language but the term itself 
means 'polished' or 'refined'. So, to some extent it is a 
constructed language. 
My theory is that at a certain moment in human development, when 
humankind was more in tune with nature on all its levels, various 
proto-languages developed which 'echoed' more the mechanics of 
creation: proto-Semitic, Vedic, proto-Tamil,...
One of my teachers, Swami Premananda, a native Tamil speaker, claims 
that Tamil developed out of the experience of Amrita in the throat.
Sri Aurobindo spoke about Devabhasa, the pre-Vedic mantric language 
of the Sat Yuga. Out of this language of verb roots and bijas, 
Sanskrit developed.





Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread Peter
No, I'm not suggesting that. What I suggest is a cup
of hot chai for this go nowhere purely in vain
conversation!
 

--- Zoran Krneta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 You are suggesting that there is a Brahman on one
 side which can be known
 through transcendental knowledge and on the other
 side is everything else
 like ego, mind, senses... etc.
 What kind of Brahman is that which doesn't include
 everything and can not be
 the object of gross perception?
 Seems you fall in trap of dualism...
 



  

Looking for last minute shopping deals?  
Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.  
http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping


[FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread nablusoss1008
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, gyselsvishnu [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 One of my teachers, Swami Premananda, a native Tamil speaker, claims 
 that Tamil developed out of the experience of Amrita in the throat.

THE Swami Premananda who Benjamin Creme claims to be the heir to 
the throne after Sai Baba ?

There are several articles and interviews with him here:
http://www.shareintl.org



[FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread nablusoss1008
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 Would that be the Throne of the King of Pedophilia?

I don't know. But perhaps that's just the kind of imaginary dark Court 
that would be perfect for you.



RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread Rick Archer
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of nablusoss1008
Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 9:37 AM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in
the light of linguistics

 

--- In HYPERLINK
mailto:FairfieldLife%40yahoogroups.comFairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,
gyselsvishnu [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
One of my teachers, Swami Premananda, a native Tamil speaker, claims 
 that Tamil developed out of the experience of Amrita in the throat.

THE Swami Premananda who Benjamin Creme claims to be the heir to 
the throne after Sai Baba ?

Would that be the Throne of the King of Pedophilia?


No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition. 
Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.20.7/1286 - Release Date: 2/18/2008
6:49 PM
 


[FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread gyselsvishnu

I won't go into polemics regarding Premananda.
A few points: he is in no way associated with Sai Baba. He seems to 
appreciate Ammachi much more than Sai Baba.

He is in jail at the moment but it is all politics.
Having followed the 'case' at close hand, he was not involved in any 
criminal act, but that is my opinion. 

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 On Behalf Of nablusoss1008
 Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 9:37 AM
 To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya 
bhasya in
 the light of linguistics
 
  
 
 --- In HYPERLINK
 mailto:FairfieldLife%
40yahoogroups.comFairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,
 gyselsvishnu dirkgysels@ 
 wrote:
 One of my teachers, Swami Premananda, a native Tamil speaker, 
claims 
  that Tamil developed out of the experience of Amrita in the 
throat.
 
 THE Swami Premananda who Benjamin Creme claims to be the heir to 
 the throne after Sai Baba ?
 
 Would that be the Throne of the King of Pedophilia?
 
 
 No virus found in this outgoing message.
 Checked by AVG Free Edition. 
 Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.20.7/1286 - Release Date: 
2/18/2008
 6:49 PM





[FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread gyselsvishnu
Yes, indeed the Benjamin Creme Premananda but Premananda is in no way 
associated with Creme or endorse his views.
Once we were discussing Maitryea. Without overhearing us, Premananda 
passed by and said: Maitreya is in your heart.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, gyselsvishnu dirkgysels@ 
 wrote:
  One of my teachers, Swami Premananda, a native Tamil speaker, 
claims 
  that Tamil developed out of the experience of Amrita in the throat.
 
 THE Swami Premananda who Benjamin Creme claims to be the heir to 
 the throne after Sai Baba ?
 
 There are several articles and interviews with him here:
 http://www.shareintl.org





[FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread nablusoss1008
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, gyselsvishnu 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 I won't go into polemics regarding Premananda.
 A few points: he is in no way associated with Sai Baba.

Yet another who appears to know The Truth. I wish I was like you, 
how simple everything would be :-)


Swami Premananda - Avatar behind bars
by Adam Parsons

Adam Parsons is the first foreign journalist to visit Swami 
Premananda since his imprisonment in India in 1994. We include two 
segements from this vivid article in which he describes conditions 
at the prison and the impact the Avatar is having on those around 
him. For the complete article see Share International July/August 
2006.

In a remote village on the edge of southern India, far off the 
tourist maps, a cheery holy man continues his fixed routine. Between 
six in the morning and six in the evening, Swami Premananda gives a 
daily spiritual discourse to an audience of hundreds, writes 
personal replies giving advice and support to an unending stream of 
letters, holds open interviews every day for the poor people around 
him, while constantly overseeing the management of a fruit 
plantation, a flower nursery, an orphanage, a school, and an ashram 
more than 250km away. It may sound like the life of a particularly 
conscientious sage, except that Swami Premananda has languished 
behind bars for more than 11 years, and the people who seek his 
daily counsel are fellow prisoners in Cuddalore jail….
The jail where Premananda has lived since 1998 is a five-hour train 
ride from the ashram in a dusty coastal town called Cuddalore that 
was ravaged by the tsunami of late 2004. No tourist would have a 
reason to come here, especially not at the muddy end of the rainy 
season, but I had been warned not to let slip the purpose of my 
visit considering the damning opinion most Indians hold against 
Premananda. It added to a slight sense of being on a furtive 
assignment – the Swami had never met with a foreign reporter since 
his arrest, so if anyone asked, I was told, then I should pretend to 
be on my way to the seaside French colony at Pondicherry.
A small gathering of us assembled at a nearby village in the early 
morning before herding into a couple of 1950s-style Ambassador 
taxis. The prison stood two km away in a silent and gloomy woodland, 
enclosed by a barren forecourt and a towering wall guarded by 
sentries with old-fashioned rifles. It became more surreal as our 
entourage gathered around Premananda, who was quietly sitting on a 
stool in the corner of a bare and windowless cell. 
Many people who first meet Swamiji, as he is normally referred to, 
say how differently he comes across from the usual notions of the 
sombre holy man, but with a full round beard, ever-smiling white 
teeth, and wearing a wrap-around cloth called a lungi, he almost 
seems like the stereotypical wise and jubilant guru. He speaks to 
foreigners in a charismatic, self-taught English that requires some 
translation from those more experienced in his enjoyable style of 
jumbling up clauses and missing out verbs, and it can be difficult 
not to laugh along with his animated explanations.
The PR officer who translated explained that Premananda is going 
blind from untreated eye cataracts and diabetes, as well as 
suffering from high blood pressure, ear problems and chronic 
asthma.  In the monsoon summers, I was told, rains could flood each 
prison cell to knee height.  There are barely any facilities – no 
roof, no fan, no light, no bed.  I have to sleep on the floor! 
Premananda explained, squinting and chuckling through the bars.  
He described these conditions with such jollity and mirth that it 
was easy to overlook how terrible it must be. In a previous 
discourse given in the prison, he explained that at night it was so 
hot you can hardly breathe, forcing him to use a hand fan made 
from coconut palm which my hand goes on fanning automatically even 
when I am asleep.
Asked how things were for the other prisoners, the Swami began to 
describe the injustices rife inside Indian jails. Of the 3,000 
prisoners in Cuddalore prison a huge proportion were innocent, he 
said, as it was common practice for a rich person to commit a murder 
or serious crime and then bribe the police so that an `ordinary' man 
is blamed. But how can we help these people? The only way is by 
appointing a lawyer, he said. The government appoints each 
prisoner a free lawyer, but he does nothing. Now I have freed 
roughly 200 people by paying for a lawyer and overseeing the case. 
If somebody gives pocket money to me, that money goes directly to 
their lawyer! I don't want money for myself.
Other prisoners who live alongside Premananda spoke of the quiet 
good works that he continuously undertakes inside the prison. Mr 
Parvallal, who spends hours in Premananda's cell each day 
handwriting replies to letters that the Swami endlessly dictates 
owing to his loss of sight, gave information that was not even 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread gyselsvishnu
-
I don´t pretend to know the truth but accusations of rape and murder 
happening in a small ashram commumity where the guru lived a 
completely open and public life,allways in the lime light very 
few eye witnesses buy this.

And the association with Sai Baba only exists in mr. Creme´s mind.
As a Srilankan Tamil refugee, Premananda was an easy prey for 
rationalists, Christian missions, a gullible press and the like.

-- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, gyselsvishnu 
 dirkgysels@ wrote:
 
  
  I won't go into polemics regarding Premananda.
  A few points: he is in no way associated with Sai Baba.
 
 Yet another who appears to know The Truth. I wish I was like you, 
 how simple everything would be :-)
 
 
 Swami Premananda - Avatar behind bars
 by Adam Parsons
 
 Adam Parsons is the first foreign journalist to visit Swami 
 Premananda since his imprisonment in India in 1994. We include two 
 segements from this vivid article in which he describes conditions 
 at the prison and the impact the Avatar is having on those around 
 him. For the complete article see Share International July/August 
 2006.
 
 In a remote village on the edge of southern India, far off the 
 tourist maps, a cheery holy man continues his fixed routine. 
Between 
 six in the morning and six in the evening, Swami Premananda gives a 
 daily spiritual discourse to an audience of hundreds, writes 
 personal replies giving advice and support to an unending stream of 
 letters, holds open interviews every day for the poor people around 
 him, while constantly overseeing the management of a fruit 
 plantation, a flower nursery, an orphanage, a school, and an ashram 
 more than 250km away. It may sound like the life of a particularly 
 conscientious sage, except that Swami Premananda has languished 
 behind bars for more than 11 years, and the people who seek his 
 daily counsel are fellow prisoners in Cuddalore jail….
 The jail where Premananda has lived since 1998 is a five-hour train 
 ride from the ashram in a dusty coastal town called Cuddalore that 
 was ravaged by the tsunami of late 2004. No tourist would have a 
 reason to come here, especially not at the muddy end of the rainy 
 season, but I had been warned not to let slip the purpose of my 
 visit considering the damning opinion most Indians hold against 
 Premananda. It added to a slight sense of being on a furtive 
 assignment – the Swami had never met with a foreign reporter since 
 his arrest, so if anyone asked, I was told, then I should pretend 
to 
 be on my way to the seaside French colony at Pondicherry.
 A small gathering of us assembled at a nearby village in the early 
 morning before herding into a couple of 1950s-style Ambassador 
 taxis. The prison stood two km away in a silent and gloomy 
woodland, 
 enclosed by a barren forecourt and a towering wall guarded by 
 sentries with old-fashioned rifles. It became more surreal as our 
 entourage gathered around Premananda, who was quietly sitting on a 
 stool in the corner of a bare and windowless cell. 
 Many people who first meet Swamiji, as he is normally referred to, 
 say how differently he comes across from the usual notions of the 
 sombre holy man, but with a full round beard, ever-smiling white 
 teeth, and wearing a wrap-around cloth called a lungi, he almost 
 seems like the stereotypical wise and jubilant guru. He speaks to 
 foreigners in a charismatic, self-taught English that requires some 
 translation from those more experienced in his enjoyable style of 
 jumbling up clauses and missing out verbs, and it can be difficult 
 not to laugh along with his animated explanations.
 The PR officer who translated explained that Premananda is going 
 blind from untreated eye cataracts and diabetes, as well as 
 suffering from high blood pressure, ear problems and chronic 
 asthma.  In the monsoon summers, I was told, rains could flood each 
 prison cell to knee height.  There are barely any facilities – no 
 roof, no fan, no light, no bed.  I have to sleep on the floor! 
 Premananda explained, squinting and chuckling through the bars.  
 He described these conditions with such jollity and mirth that it 
 was easy to overlook how terrible it must be. In a previous 
 discourse given in the prison, he explained that at night it 
was so 
 hot you can hardly breathe, forcing him to use a hand fan made 
 from coconut palm which my hand goes on fanning automatically 
even 
 when I am asleep.
 Asked how things were for the other prisoners, the Swami began to 
 describe the injustices rife inside Indian jails. Of the 3,000 
 prisoners in Cuddalore prison a huge proportion were innocent, he 
 said, as it was common practice for a rich person to commit a 
murder 
 or serious crime and then bribe the police so that an `ordinary' 
man 
 is blamed. But how can we help these people? The only way is by 
 appointing a lawyer, he said. The 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread nablusoss1008
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, gyselsvishnu [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 -
 I don´t pretend to know the truth but accusations of rape and murder 
 happening in a small ashram commumity where the guru lived a 
 completely open and public life,allways in the lime light very 
 few eye witnesses buy this.
 
 And the association with Sai Baba only exists in mr. Creme´s mind.

Is that so... 
Did you happen to ask the Swami about this ?


 As a Srilankan Tamil refugee, Premananda was an easy prey for 
 rationalists, Christian missions, a gullible press and the like.




[FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread Richard J. Williams
Zoran wrote:
 You are suggesting that there is a Brahman on one 
 side which can be known through transcendental 
 knowledge and on the other side is everything 
 else like ego, mind, senses... etc.

According to Shankara, we can only know Brahman through
transcendental knowledge; everything else experienced
through the senses is an appearance only.  

 What kind of Brahman is that which doesn't include 
 everything and can not be the object of gross 
 perception? 

This is the Adwaita view of Shankara: Brahman alone is 
real; all objects of the senses are not real, yet not 
unreal.

 Seems you fall in trap of dualism...

According to the Upanishadic view, Brahman, as seen
through the senses, is real, not an illusion. Brahman
is the Transcendental Person who can be seen and 
experienced with the senses. This is the dualistic
view of Ramanuja, Madhva, and Vallabha.



[FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread Richard J. Williams
Peter wrote:
 No, I'm not suggesting that. What I suggest is a cup
 of hot chai for this go nowhere purely in vain
 conversation!
  
In vain because you don't understand the basic tenets
of Indian philosophy? Maybe you should just stick to 
subjects you know something about, such as repressed 
memory syndrome.
 
Zoran wrote:
  You are suggesting that there is a Brahman on one
  side which can be known
  through transcendental knowledge and on the other
  side is everything else
  like ego, mind, senses... etc.
  What kind of Brahman is that which doesn't include
  everything and can not be
  the object of gross perception?
  Seems you fall in trap of dualism...
  
 
 
 
  

 Looking for last minute shopping deals?  
 Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. 
http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping





[FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread Richard J. Williams
Peter wrote:
 Brahman is known to Brahman. 
 
It has not been established that there is a category,
Brahman - that's just a theory found described in the
Indian scriptures. There is no scientific foundation 
for supposing that there is a 'Brahman' that actually 
exists somewhere. Brahman, as a category, is just a
metaphysical postulate.

 Consciousness knows consciousness. 

Maybe so, but is there a blind, scientific study that
proves that there is a physiological corralary to a
state of 'Brahman consciousness'? I think not.

 Who said anything about senses?

Well, you'd have to be a sentient being with senses
in order to even put forth a postulation such as 
'Brahman' exists.



Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread Zoran Krneta
According to Shankara, we can only know Brahman through
transcendental knowledge; everything else experienced
through the senses is an appearance only.

If you are standing for Advaita it can't be Brahman and everyting else,
that's mayavada platform... Mayavadins are not pur monists.

Brahman alone is real; all objects of the senses are not real, yet not
unreal.

That is Ramunuja qualified monism.

According to the Upanishadic view, Brahman, as seen
through the senses, is real, not an illusion. Brahman
is the Transcendental Person who can be seen and
experienced with the senses.

Transcedental Person is Brahman... Lord Krishna gave Divine sight to Arjuna
in order that he is able see him.

This is the dualistic
view of Ramanuja, Madhva, and Vallabha.

They are representing diferent schools of advaita. Only Madhva stands for
pure dualism, Vallabaha - pure monism, Ramunuja - qualified monism.


[FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-19 Thread Richard J. Williams
  According to Shankara, we can only know Brahman through
  transcendental knowledge; everything else experienced
  through the senses is an appearance only.
 
Zoran wrote: 
 They are representing diferent schools of advaita. Only 
 Madhva stands for pure dualism, Vallabaha - pure monism, 
 Ramunuja - qualified monism.

Zoran - The Shankara Acharya composed the following works: 
Bhashyas on Brahma Sutras, the Upanishads and the Gita, 
Viveka Chudamani, Atma Bodha, Ananda Lahari and 
Soundaryalahari.

The philosophy of the Adi Shankara can be summed up in 
the following phrase:

Brahma Satyam Jagat Mithya, Jeevo Brahmaiva Na Aparah

Which, translated reads: Brahman alone is real, this 
world is unreal; the Jiva is identical with Brahman. 

However, in the tenth century came one Ramanuja Acharya, 
the founder of the Sri Vaishnava Sampradaya. Ramanuja 
was born in 1017 A.D. in the village of Perumbudur, which 
is about twenty-five miles west of Madras. He an exponent 
of the Visishtadvaita philosophy, that is, qualified 
non-dualism. Ramanuja's Ultimate Reality is Sa-visesha, 
that is, Brahman with attributes. According to Ramanuja, 
there is a Lord Narayana or a Bhagavan, that is, a 
Supreme Being; the individual soul is Chit; matter is 
Achit. Ramanuja composed the Sri Bhashya on Brahma 
Sutras and the Vedanta Sangraha.

Then came one Madhva Acharya, the founder of the Sad 
Vaishnava Sampradaya. He was born in 1199 A.D. at Velali, 
two miles from Udipi in the district of South Kanara in 
South India. Madhva is the exponent of the Dvaita, that 
is, the dualistic school of philosophy. According to his 
philosophy, the Supreme Being is Vishnu or Narayana, 
and there are five real and eternal distinctions, viz., 
the distinction between the Supreme Being and the 
individual soul, between spirit and matter, between one 
Jiva and another Jiva, between the Jiva and matter, and 
between one piece of matter and another. According to 
Madhva, the phenomenal world is real and eternal.

The came one Vallabha Acharya, the founder of the Pushti 
Sampradaya. He was born in 1479 A.D. at Champaranya, 
Raipur, in Madhya Pradesh. Vallabha was the exponent 
of pure Monism or the Shuddhadvaita school of philosophy. 
Sri Krishna is Purushottama, that is, the Ultimate Reality 
and his body consists of Satchidananda. According to 
Acharya Vallabha the absolute Reality - Parabrahma - is 
of the nature of saguna and sakar where Ananda or Bliss 
itself is its form and nature. This is the main basis of 
Shuddhadvaita Philosophy. Vallabha Acharya composed the 
Vyasa Sutra Bhashya.

Then came one Nimbarka Acharya, of the Kumara Sampradaya. 
He was born in the modern Murgarapattam in the southern 
Dravidian province. Nimbarka was the exponent of the 
Dvaitadvaita, that is, qualified non-dualism. 



Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Validity of Mahrishi's apaurusheya bhasya in the light of linguistics

2008-02-18 Thread Zoran Krneta
You are suggesting that there is a Brahman on one side which can be known
through transcendental knowledge and on the other side is everything else
like ego, mind, senses... etc.
What kind of Brahman is that which doesn't include everything and can not be
the object of gross perception?
Seems you fall in trap of dualism...