[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
authfriend: No, they didn't. Please read the Wikipedia article I recommended to John and inform yourself: Thanks for the information! More than 84 percent of the subprime mortgages came from private lending institutions in 2006 and the share of subprime loans insured by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac decreased as the bubble got bigger (from a high of insuring 48 percent to insuring 24 percent of all subprime loans in 2006)... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_policies_and_the_subprime_mortgage_crisis
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
Thanks to people like Barney Frank, Fannie and Freddy had their hands in 50% of the U.S. home mortages - they came very close to bringing down the whole international banking system. authfriend: No, they didn't. Please read the Wikipedia article I recommended to John and inform yourself: As of 2008, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac owned or guaranteed about half of the U.S.'s $12 trillion mortgage market. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freddie_Mac
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
Thanks to people like Barney Frank, Fannie and Freddy had their hands in 50% of the U.S. home mortages - they came very close to bringing down the whole international banking system. No, they didn't. Please read the Wikipedia article I recommended to John and inform yourself: Barney Frank and Maxine Waters are liars. These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis. The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing. - Barney Frank 'Barney Frank: Good riddance' Washington Post, November 28, 2011 http://tinyurl.com/747ct8d
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, richardatrwilliamsdotus richard@... wrote: Thanks to people like Barney Frank, Fannie and Freddy had their hands in 50% of the U.S. home mortages - they came very close to bringing down the whole international banking system. authfriend: No, they didn't. Please read the Wikipedia article I recommended to John and inform yourself: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_policies_and_the_subprime_mortgage_crisis http://tinyurl.com/7t9e5uz Fannie and Freddie contributed very little to the crisis compared to the investment banks' heavy involvement in mortgage-backed securities (derivatives): The Financial Crisis Inquiry Commission reported in 2011 that Fannie Freddie 'contributed to the crisis, but were not a primary cause.' GSE mortgage securities essentially maintained their value throughout the crisis and did not contribute to the significant financial firm losses that were central to the financial crisis. The GSEs participated in the expansion of subprime and other risky mortgages, but they followed rather than led Wall Street and other lenders into subprime lending. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subprime_mortgage_crisis#Government_policies http://tinyurl.com/498pda Also, as I noted to John, *commercial* mortgage loans were just as problematic as housing loans, and FF had nothing to do with those. See how this works? You dishonestly delete the context, and I put it right back in, demonstrating your attempt to change the subject. As of 2008, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac owned or guaranteed about half of the U.S.'s $12 trillion mortgage market. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freddie_Mac
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
The USA was founded as a grand experiment of new ideas about government at the time. So far, it's holding true. The economic system can be tweaked to adopt to the demands of society. The US economic paradigm is a mixture of economic policies. In its pure form, capitalism still exists in the stock market. IMO, the greatest danger to the US government is the national debt. This debt is a burden to the entire government and economy. Both major parties have opposing views as to how the national debt can be reduced. The longer they squabble, the longer the problem will persist. If we're not careful, the accident could happen sooner than later. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@... wrote: Geez John, where the hell have you been? We've been mentioning for years on FFL and discussing a lot of books, articles, documentaries and biopics that explain the problem. One couldn't write a better scifi scenario if they tried. I got interested in economics back in the late 70s. I read everything from Galbraith, Ravi Batra to Milton Friedman. I especially enjoyed the economic novels of the late Paul Erdman who made the economic crisis of the time understandable. They even made a movie of one book, Silver Bears with Michael Cain. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Erdman At least the Reagan administration sent some of the the SL crooks to prison. Obama is too endeared to Wall Street for that I'm afraid. We're really screwed. Best thing is a massive collapse that must wipe out the very rich and age old banking institutions. IOW a complete reboot. On 11/29/2011 12:37 PM, John wrote: Judy, Good research on your part. It appears that the financial crisis was due to a combination of factors which contributed to an accident waiting to happen. And, unfortunately it did. Now, the big accident waiting to happen is the enormous national debt that is costing Americans millions of dollars per minute. I don't believe any of the politicians in Washington DC know how to solve this problem. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriendjstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Johnjr_esq@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitunoozguru@ wrote: snip The bankers showed how dumb they actually are with their derivatives and hedge funds. It was like a bunch of kids playing with matches and oops burned the house down. And they should pay the full price for it. The public should not bail them out. Catch them at every excuse to sell the public we should help them out and sound a resounding NO! The bankers believed that their actions relating to the housing mortgage debacle were legal and that they would be supported by the federal government. Apparently there was a federal law that was passed to lower the requirements for some borrowers so that they can buy new homes. Please, inform yourself. Start with this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_policies_and_the_subprime_mortgage_crisis http://tinyurl.com/7t9e5uz The Wikipedia article has lots of references, including to other Wikipedia articles on the 2008 financial crisis. It's much more complicated than you dream. Bhairitu is essentially correct that it was the securitization of risk in mortgage lending with derivatives and such that was the primary contributor to the crisis. Just for one thing, the vast majority of the subprime loans were not made by FDIC- insured banks. For another, most of the loans that went bad were not made to low-income borrowers. And for still another, commercial loans were just as problematic as home loans.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
Wake up! In an ideal world maybe but the US is far from existing in an ideal world. What you really get is a tug-a-war between private interests. The monied have always want to be kings and aristocracy since the US was founded. They rig capitalism for their benefit. The public should not put up with it and if it requires a violent revolution to correct things then so be it. The ballot box is too slow and rigged anyway. On 11/30/2011 11:16 AM, John wrote: The USA was founded as a grand experiment of new ideas about government at the time. So far, it's holding true. The economic system can be tweaked to adopt to the demands of society. The US economic paradigm is a mixture of economic policies. In its pure form, capitalism still exists in the stock market. IMO, the greatest danger to the US government is the national debt. This debt is a burden to the entire government and economy. Both major parties have opposing views as to how the national debt can be reduced. The longer they squabble, the longer the problem will persist. If we're not careful, the accident could happen sooner than later. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitunoozguru@... wrote: Geez John, where the hell have you been? We've been mentioning for years on FFL and discussing a lot of books, articles, documentaries and biopics that explain the problem. One couldn't write a better scifi scenario if they tried. I got interested in economics back in the late 70s. I read everything from Galbraith, Ravi Batra to Milton Friedman. I especially enjoyed the economic novels of the late Paul Erdman who made the economic crisis of the time understandable. They even made a movie of one book, Silver Bears with Michael Cain. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Erdman At least the Reagan administration sent some of the the SL crooks to prison. Obama is too endeared to Wall Street for that I'm afraid. We're really screwed. Best thing is a massive collapse that must wipe out the very rich and age old banking institutions. IOW a complete reboot. On 11/29/2011 12:37 PM, John wrote: Judy, Good research on your part. It appears that the financial crisis was due to a combination of factors which contributed to an accident waiting to happen. And, unfortunately it did. Now, the big accident waiting to happen is the enormous national debt that is costing Americans millions of dollars per minute. I don't believe any of the politicians in Washington DC know how to solve this problem. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriendjstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Johnjr_esq@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitunoozguru@ wrote: snip The bankers showed how dumb they actually are with their derivatives and hedge funds. It was like a bunch of kids playing with matches and oops burned the house down. And they should pay the full price for it. The public should not bail them out. Catch them at every excuse to sell the public we should help them out and sound a resounding NO! The bankers believed that their actions relating to the housing mortgage debacle were legal and that they would be supported by the federal government. Apparently there was a federal law that was passed to lower the requirements for some borrowers so that they can buy new homes. Please, inform yourself. Start with this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_policies_and_the_subprime_mortgage_crisis http://tinyurl.com/7t9e5uz The Wikipedia article has lots of references, including to other Wikipedia articles on the 2008 financial crisis. It's much more complicated than you dream. Bhairitu is essentially correct that it was the securitization of risk in mortgage lending with derivatives and such that was the primary contributor to the crisis. Just for one thing, the vast majority of the subprime loans were not made by FDIC- insured banks. For another, most of the loans that went bad were not made to low-income borrowers. And for still another, commercial loans were just as problematic as home loans.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
And maybe this video will give you a better perspective of what is really happening: Thom Hartmann: Euro crisis...Is the UK preparing for the END of the world? http://www.youtube.com/user/TheBigPictureRT#p/u/2/fs_clUxtfa4 On 11/30/2011 11:16 AM, John wrote: The USA was founded as a grand experiment of new ideas about government at the time. So far, it's holding true. The economic system can be tweaked to adopt to the demands of society. The US economic paradigm is a mixture of economic policies. In its pure form, capitalism still exists in the stock market. IMO, the greatest danger to the US government is the national debt. This debt is a burden to the entire government and economy. Both major parties have opposing views as to how the national debt can be reduced. The longer they squabble, the longer the problem will persist. If we're not careful, the accident could happen sooner than later. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitunoozguru@... wrote: Geez John, where the hell have you been? We've been mentioning for years on FFL and discussing a lot of books, articles, documentaries and biopics that explain the problem. One couldn't write a better scifi scenario if they tried. I got interested in economics back in the late 70s. I read everything from Galbraith, Ravi Batra to Milton Friedman. I especially enjoyed the economic novels of the late Paul Erdman who made the economic crisis of the time understandable. They even made a movie of one book, Silver Bears with Michael Cain. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Erdman At least the Reagan administration sent some of the the SL crooks to prison. Obama is too endeared to Wall Street for that I'm afraid. We're really screwed. Best thing is a massive collapse that must wipe out the very rich and age old banking institutions. IOW a complete reboot. On 11/29/2011 12:37 PM, John wrote: Judy, Good research on your part. It appears that the financial crisis was due to a combination of factors which contributed to an accident waiting to happen. And, unfortunately it did. Now, the big accident waiting to happen is the enormous national debt that is costing Americans millions of dollars per minute. I don't believe any of the politicians in Washington DC know how to solve this problem. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriendjstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Johnjr_esq@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitunoozguru@ wrote: snip The bankers showed how dumb they actually are with their derivatives and hedge funds. It was like a bunch of kids playing with matches and oops burned the house down. And they should pay the full price for it. The public should not bail them out. Catch them at every excuse to sell the public we should help them out and sound a resounding NO! The bankers believed that their actions relating to the housing mortgage debacle were legal and that they would be supported by the federal government. Apparently there was a federal law that was passed to lower the requirements for some borrowers so that they can buy new homes. Please, inform yourself. Start with this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_policies_and_the_subprime_mortgage_crisis http://tinyurl.com/7t9e5uz The Wikipedia article has lots of references, including to other Wikipedia articles on the 2008 financial crisis. It's much more complicated than you dream. Bhairitu is essentially correct that it was the securitization of risk in mortgage lending with derivatives and such that was the primary contributor to the crisis. Just for one thing, the vast majority of the subprime loans were not made by FDIC- insured banks. For another, most of the loans that went bad were not made to low-income borrowers. And for still another, commercial loans were just as problematic as home loans.
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@... wrote: On Nov 28, 2011, at 11:39 PM, Emily Reyn wrote: I'm sure you've seen thisthey new they were screwing us...please According to the Securities and Exchange Commission, Citigroup stuffed a $1 billion mortgage fund that it sold to investors in 2007 with securities that it believed would fail so that it could bet against its customers and profit when values declined. The fraud, the agency said, was in Citigroup's falsely telling investors that an independent party was choosing the portfolio's investments. Citigroup made $160 million from the deal and investors lost $700 million. Merry Christmas! God, what creeps. Was there any significant penalty? $285 million fine. Pocket change for Citigroup, cost of doing business. At least it lost what it made on the fraud.
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
Judy, Good research on your part. It appears that the financial crisis was due to a combination of factors which contributed to an accident waiting to happen. And, unfortunately it did. Now, the big accident waiting to happen is the enormous national debt that is costing Americans millions of dollars per minute. I don't believe any of the politicians in Washington DC know how to solve this problem. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, John jr_esq@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: snip The bankers showed how dumb they actually are with their derivatives and hedge funds. It was like a bunch of kids playing with matches and oops burned the house down. And they should pay the full price for it. The public should not bail them out. Catch them at every excuse to sell the public we should help them out and sound a resounding NO! The bankers believed that their actions relating to the housing mortgage debacle were legal and that they would be supported by the federal government. Apparently there was a federal law that was passed to lower the requirements for some borrowers so that they can buy new homes. Please, inform yourself. Start with this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_policies_and_the_subprime_mortgage_crisis http://tinyurl.com/7t9e5uz The Wikipedia article has lots of references, including to other Wikipedia articles on the 2008 financial crisis. It's much more complicated than you dream. Bhairitu is essentially correct that it was the securitization of risk in mortgage lending with derivatives and such that was the primary contributor to the crisis. Just for one thing, the vast majority of the subprime loans were not made by FDIC- insured banks. For another, most of the loans that went bad were not made to low-income borrowers. And for still another, commercial loans were just as problematic as home loans.
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
Johnjr_esq Good research on your part... Thanks to people like Barney Frank, Fannie and Freddy had their hands in 50% of the U.S. home mortages - they came very close to bringing down the whole international banking system. The Bush administration warned congress about Fanny and Freddie many times, but Barney Frank and Maxine Waters lied about it for years. So far, taxpayers have had to bail out Freddie and Fannie to the tune of about $154 billion! In fact, the highly leveraged giants were swollen with subprime loans, which began defaulting when the housing bubble burst in 2007. By 2008, the federal government had to step in. Technically private, the companies had long benefited from an implicit government guarantee. The housing crisis made that explicit... http://news.investors.com/Article.aspx?id=592982p=2
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, John jr_esq@... wrote: Judy, Good research on your part. It appears that the financial crisis was due to a combination of factors which contributed to an accident waiting to happen. And, unfortunately it did. Now, the big accident waiting to happen is the enormous national debt that is costing Americans millions of dollars per minute. I don't believe any of the politicians in Washington DC know how to solve this problem. Unfortunately there are quite a few of them who think cutting spending and reducing taxes on wealthy people is the solution. If they'd listen to the economists, they'd learn that you can't do that during a recession without making it worse--and that the deficit is not an imminent problem anyway. The solution is to get the economy back on its feet by spending *more* to stimulate demand--including cutting taxes for the poor and middle-class, who will immediately go out and spend the extra money; extending unemployment insurance, which money will also go right back into the economy; and creating jobs. Once the economy is healthier, *then* it makes sense to tackle the deficit.
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
I agree. This current fashion of squeezing blood from a stone, or just waiting out the crisis, is cruel and unnecessary. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, John jr_esq@ wrote: Judy, Good research on your part. It appears that the financial crisis was due to a combination of factors which contributed to an accident waiting to happen. And, unfortunately it did. Now, the big accident waiting to happen is the enormous national debt that is costing Americans millions of dollars per minute. I don't believe any of the politicians in Washington DC know how to solve this problem. Unfortunately there are quite a few of them who think cutting spending and reducing taxes on wealthy people is the solution. If they'd listen to the economists, they'd learn that you can't do that during a recession without making it worse--and that the deficit is not an imminent problem anyway. The solution is to get the economy back on its feet by spending *more* to stimulate demand--including cutting taxes for the poor and middle-class, who will immediately go out and spend the extra money; extending unemployment insurance, which money will also go right back into the economy; and creating jobs. Once the economy is healthier, *then* it makes sense to tackle the deficit.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
Geez John, where the hell have you been? We've been mentioning for years on FFL and discussing a lot of books, articles, documentaries and biopics that explain the problem. One couldn't write a better scifi scenario if they tried. I got interested in economics back in the late 70s. I read everything from Galbraith, Ravi Batra to Milton Friedman. I especially enjoyed the economic novels of the late Paul Erdman who made the economic crisis of the time understandable. They even made a movie of one book, Silver Bears with Michael Cain. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Erdman At least the Reagan administration sent some of the the SL crooks to prison. Obama is too endeared to Wall Street for that I'm afraid. We're really screwed. Best thing is a massive collapse that must wipe out the very rich and age old banking institutions. IOW a complete reboot. On 11/29/2011 12:37 PM, John wrote: Judy, Good research on your part. It appears that the financial crisis was due to a combination of factors which contributed to an accident waiting to happen. And, unfortunately it did. Now, the big accident waiting to happen is the enormous national debt that is costing Americans millions of dollars per minute. I don't believe any of the politicians in Washington DC know how to solve this problem. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriendjstein@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Johnjr_esq@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitunoozguru@ wrote: snip The bankers showed how dumb they actually are with their derivatives and hedge funds. It was like a bunch of kids playing with matches and oops burned the house down. And they should pay the full price for it. The public should not bail them out. Catch them at every excuse to sell the public we should help them out and sound a resounding NO! The bankers believed that their actions relating to the housing mortgage debacle were legal and that they would be supported by the federal government. Apparently there was a federal law that was passed to lower the requirements for some borrowers so that they can buy new homes. Please, inform yourself. Start with this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_policies_and_the_subprime_mortgage_crisis http://tinyurl.com/7t9e5uz The Wikipedia article has lots of references, including to other Wikipedia articles on the 2008 financial crisis. It's much more complicated than you dream. Bhairitu is essentially correct that it was the securitization of risk in mortgage lending with derivatives and such that was the primary contributor to the crisis. Just for one thing, the vast majority of the subprime loans were not made by FDIC- insured banks. For another, most of the loans that went bad were not made to low-income borrowers. And for still another, commercial loans were just as problematic as home loans.
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, richardatrwilliamsdotus richard@... wrote: Johnjr_esq Good research on your part... Thanks to people like Barney Frank, Fannie and Freddy had their hands in 50% of the U.S. home mortages - they came very close to bringing down the whole international banking system. No, they didn't. Please read the Wikipedia article I recommended to John and inform yourself: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_policies_and_the_subprime_mortgage_crisis http://tinyurl.com/7t9e5uz Fannie and Freddie contributed very little to the crisis compared to the investment banks' heavy involvement in mortgage-backed securities (derivatives): The Financial Crisis Inquiry Commission reported in 2011 that Fannie Freddie 'contributed to the crisis, but were not a primary cause.' GSE mortgage securities essentially maintained their value throughout the crisis and did not contribute to the significant financial firm losses that were central to the financial crisis. The GSEs participated in the expansion of subprime and other risky mortgages, but they followed rather than led Wall Street and other lenders into subprime lending. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subprime_mortgage_crisis#Government_policies http://tinyurl.com/498pda Also, as I noted to John, *commercial* mortgage loans were just as problematic as housing loans, and FF had nothing to do with those. The Bush administration warned congress about Fanny and Freddie many times, but Barney Frank and Maxine Waters lied about it for years. So far, taxpayers have had to bail out Freddie and Fannie to the tune of about $154 billion! In fact, the highly leveraged giants were swollen with subprime loans, which began defaulting when the housing bubble burst in 2007. By 2008, the federal government had to step in. Technically private, the companies had long benefited from an implicit government guarantee. The housing crisis made that explicit... http://news.investors.com/Article.aspx?id=592982p=2
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
Thanks to people like Barney Frank, Fannie and Freddy had their hands in 50% of the U.S. home mortages - they came very close to bringing down the whole international banking system. authfriend: No, they didn't. Please read the Wikipedia article I recommended to John and inform yourself: Barney Frank and Maxine Waters are liars. The government took over the mortgage giants in 2008 to shoulder soured loans following the collapse of the housing market. Since then, taxpayers have spent about $169 billion to rescue the two companies the costliest bailout of the financial crisis. The government estimates it could cost up to $220 billion to keep both companies afloat through 2014 after dividend payments... 'The Fannie Mae quagmire' Fortune: http://tinyurl.com/6t2fvrz
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, richardatrwilliamsdotus richard@... wrote: Thanks to people like Barney Frank, Fannie and Freddy had their hands in 50% of the U.S. home mortages - they came very close to bringing down the whole international banking system. authfriend: No, they didn't. Please read the Wikipedia article I recommended to John and inform yourself: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_policies_and_the_subprime_mortgage_crisis http://tinyurl.com/7t9e5uz Fannie and Freddie contributed very little to the crisis compared to the investment banks' heavy involvement in mortgage-backed securities (derivatives): The Financial Crisis Inquiry Commission reported in 2011 that Fannie Freddie 'contributed to the crisis, but were not a primary cause.' GSE mortgage securities essentially maintained their value throughout the crisis and did not contribute to the significant financial firm losses that were central to the financial crisis. The GSEs participated in the expansion of subprime and other risky mortgages, but they followed rather than led Wall Street and other lenders into subprime lending. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subprime_mortgage_crisis#Government_policies http://tinyurl.com/498pda Also, as I noted to John, *commercial* mortgage loans were just as problematic as housing loans, and FF had nothing to do with those. Barney Frank and Maxine Waters are liars. The government took over the mortgage giants in 2008 to shoulder soured loans following the collapse of the housing market. Since then, taxpayers have spent about $169 billion to rescue the two companies the costliest bailout of the financial crisis. The government estimates it could cost up to $220 billion to keep both companies afloat through 2014 after dividend payments... 'The Fannie Mae quagmire' Fortune: http://tinyurl.com/6t2fvrz
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
I'll tell you what will happen when Mitt Romney is President. The same thing that happened when every other person was elected President for the last 40 years. The deficit will get bigger. No president, Dem or Rep has ever controlled spending. The only exception was a 1-2 year period under Bill Clinton which was largely due to Newt Gingrich's efforts. But regardless, Clinton still added to the deficit overall, along with every other President since LBJ. Don't get me wrong though, I do think Obama needs to be replaced. But at the same time, I don't see any reason to be over-excited about any of his alternatives. I believe it will take a massive economic collapse for us to wake up. seekliberation --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wgm4u anitaoaks4u@... wrote: And Barack Obama is deposed!http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4BWhvIlFVE
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, seekliberation seekliberation@... wrote: I'll tell you what will happen when Mitt Romney is President. The same thing that happened when every other person was elected President for the last 40 years. The deficit will get bigger. No president, Dem or Rep has ever controlled spending. The only exception was a 1-2 year period under Bill Clinton which was largely due to Newt Gingrich's efforts. But regardless, Clinton still added to the deficit overall, along with every other President since LBJ. Don't get me wrong though, I do think Obama needs to be replaced. But at the same time, I don't see any reason to be over-excited about any of his alternatives. I believe it will take a massive economic collapse for us to wake up. seekliberation I hope you're wrong but that seems to be the direction we're heading!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
On 11/28/2011 03:25 AM, seekliberation wrote: I'll tell you what will happen when Mitt Romney is President. The same thing that happened when every other person was elected President for the last 40 years. The deficit will get bigger. No president, Dem or Rep has ever controlled spending. The only exception was a 1-2 year period under Bill Clinton which was largely due to Newt Gingrich's efforts. But regardless, Clinton still added to the deficit overall, along with every other President since LBJ. Don't get me wrong though, I do think Obama needs to be replaced. But at the same time, I don't see any reason to be over-excited about any of his alternatives. I believe it will take a massive economic collapse for us to wake up. seekliberation You only need to get rid of one entitlement: the one we give to the Military Industrial Complex. ;-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wgm4u anitaoaks4u@... wrote: And Barack Obama is deposed!http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4BWhvIlFVE It's obvious that many Americans are not happy with Obama's administration. But the voters will have to consider the alternative. Given that the Republicans turned down the jobs bill, the voters will see that Romney will not be able to show anything substantial to fix the current economic situation. Romney's agenda would have to be to cut taxes and cut the federal government payroll and entitlements like Social Security. I don't believe his agenda will create any jobs for the economy. He will only create more doubt about his leadership capability since he will be controlled by the Republican establishment. At the present, it doesn't even appear that most Republicans are sold on Romney as the standard bearer for the party.
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
The defense budget only accounts for a portion of our economic problems. I looked at a chart showing how defense spending has been on the rise since 2001. According to what I read, the military spending alone cannot possibly be what set off the market. It was a conglomeration of many factors. If it weren't for both wars, we'd still be somewhere between 8-11 Trillion in debt, depending on where you derive your numbers. The site I looked at indicates our spending increased a total of about 3-4 trillion since 9/11. That's about 1/4 of the total federal deficit. Still a lot of money, and a lot of it wasted. The military definitely needs to be fixed, but i'm not sure what entitlements you're talking about that needs to be eliminated. If they simply eliminated the worthless jobs in the military and quit making it a career factory and isolate it for its primary purpose (defense), the military wouldn't be as much of a vacuum for dollars. There are so many people and so many units that are deployed overseas that do and accomplish little or nothing. Their salaries and equipment are costing us a lot. We should bring a lot of our overseas bases back to America and concentrate on defense rather than this so-called proactive stance with conventional forces that can't produce results. Plus, if we took our overseas bases and placed them stateside, that would create jobs too. Cities with nearby military bases are always doing well economically. The biggest problem right now is that we need to get out of Afghanistan. It's a waste of every dollar we spend there, as much as I would hate to see their villages go unprotected. Their government is corrupt and organized crime will fight us to the end of days to keep that country unstable (it's a strategically located country for many tangible reasons). They need to solve their own problems without us paying for it. seekliberation You only need to get rid of one entitlement: the one we give to the Military Industrial Complex. ;-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, seekliberation seekliberation@... wrote: The defense budget only accounts for a portion of our economic problems. I looked at a chart showing how defense spending has been on the rise since 2001. According to what I read, the military spending alone cannot possibly be what set off the market. It was a conglomeration of many factors. If it weren't for both wars, we'd still be somewhere between 8-11 Trillion in debt, depending on where you derive your numbers. The site I looked at indicates our spending increased a total of about 3-4 trillion since 9/11. That's about 1/4 of the total federal deficit. Still a lot of money, and a lot of it wasted. The military definitely needs to be fixed, but i'm not sure what entitlements you're talking about that needs to be eliminated. If they simply eliminated the worthless jobs in the military and quit making it a career factory and isolate it for its primary purpose (defense), the military wouldn't be as much of a vacuum for dollars. There are so many people and so many units that are deployed overseas that do and accomplish little or nothing. Their salaries and equipment are costing us a lot. We should bring a lot of our overseas bases back to America and concentrate on defense rather than this so-called proactive stance with conventional forces that can't produce results. Plus, if we took our overseas bases and placed them stateside, that would create jobs too. Cities with nearby military bases are always doing well economically. The biggest problem right now is that we need to get out of Afghanistan. It's a waste of every dollar we spend there, as much as I would hate to see their villages go unprotected. Their government is corrupt and organized crime will fight us to the end of days to keep that country unstable (it's a strategically located country for many tangible reasons). They need to solve their own problems without us paying for it. seekliberation It's nice to hear common sense now and then (above), and not just knee-jerk thoughtless comments. PS Even taxing the Rich out of existence won't fix our spending problem!
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, John jr_esq@... wrote: Given that the Republicans turned down the jobs bill, the voters will see that Romney will not be able to show anything substantial to fix the current economic situation. We're an energy RICH Country acting like an energy POOR Country, Mitt Romney
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wgm4u anitaoaks4u@... wrote: snip PS Even taxing the Rich out of existence won't fix our spending problem! No need to tax them out of existence, and of course nobody is suggesting that. Nor is anyone suggesting that would solve the deficit problem all by itself (which is a revenue problem, not a spending problem). But raising taxes on the richest 0.1 percent--that's a tenth of one percent--significantly above 35 percent could bring in something like a trillion dollars over 10 years. Add to that a tiny tax on every financial transaction, and you wouldn't need to think about making spending cuts that will massacre the poor and middle-class (like slashing federal heating subsidies). There's plenty of other spending--such as for the military--that can be cut. With such cuts and those two revenue increases, we'd be able to bring down the deficit to a reasonable level and ensure that doing so doesn't further depress the economy.
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wgm4u anitaoaks4u@ wrote: snip PS Even taxing the Rich out of existence won't fix our spending problem! No need to tax them out of existence, and of course nobody is suggesting that. Nor is anyone suggesting that would solve the deficit problem all by itself (which is a revenue problem, not a spending problem). But raising taxes on the richest 0.1 percent--that's a tenth of one percent--significantly above 35 percent could bring in something like a trillion dollars over 10 years. It sounds reasonable (if it doesn't adversely affect the economy) providing Congress is bound by a balanced budget amendment!! Republicans are for changing the tax code to accomplish a similar end. Add to that a tiny tax on every financial transaction, and you wouldn't need to think about making spending cuts that will massacre the poor and middle-class (like slashing federal heating subsidies). There's plenty of other spending--such as for the military--that can be cut. With such cuts and those two revenue increases, we'd be able to bring down the deficit to a reasonable level and ensure that doing so doesn't further depress the economy. Politicians have been raising taxes as a solution to our problems since the beginning of time and it only ends up creating Countries like Greece and Italy. That government governs best which governs least, Jefferson (I believe).
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
On 11/28/2011 10:11 AM, John wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wgm4uanitaoaks4u@... wrote: And Barack Obama is deposed!http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4BWhvIlFVE It's obvious that many Americans are not happy with Obama's administration. But the voters will have to consider the alternative. Given that the Republicans turned down the jobs bill, the voters will see that Romney will not be able to show anything substantial to fix the current economic situation. Romney's agenda would have to be to cut taxes and cut the federal government payroll and entitlements like Social Security. I don't believe his agenda will create any jobs for the economy. He will only create more doubt about his leadership capability since he will be controlled by the Republican establishment. At the present, it doesn't even appear that most Republicans are sold on Romney as the standard bearer for the party. America's dead meat anyway. It's on life support. Capitalism didn't work out. MMY was right but he was just sayin' what many economists and futurists (like Bucky Fuller) were sayin'. If the rich win then we'll wind up being serfs making cheap goods for China and eating syntho-food. Do you want that? The bankers showed how dumb they actually are with their derivatives and hedge funds. It was like a bunch of kids playing with matches and oops burned the house down. And they should pay the full price for it. The public should not bail them out. Catch them at every excuse to sell the public we should help them out and sound a resounding NO!
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wgm4u anitaoaks4u@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wgm4u anitaoaks4u@ wrote: snip PS Even taxing the Rich out of existence won't fix our spending problem! No need to tax them out of existence, and of course nobody is suggesting that. Nor is anyone suggesting that would solve the deficit problem all by itself (which is a revenue problem, not a spending problem). But raising taxes on the richest 0.1 percent--that's a tenth of one percent--significantly above 35 percent could bring in something like a trillion dollars over 10 years. It sounds reasonable (if it doesn't adversely affect the economy) Of course it isn't going to adversely affect the economy. providing Congress is bound by a balanced budget amendment!! Oh, please, that's the world's dumbest idea. It wouldn't work (unenforceable), and it can't pass anyway. It's just a mantra for those who want to be thought of as fiscally responsible but in fact have no clue about what fiscal responsibility really entails. Republicans are for changing the tax code to accomplish a similar end. Riiight. They want the Bush tax cuts to be made permanent. Any revenue increase from the changes in the tax code they're talking about will be more than offset by continued reduced revenue from the Bush tax cuts. Add to that a tiny tax on every financial transaction, and you wouldn't need to think about making spending cuts that will massacre the poor and middle-class (like slashing federal heating subsidies). There's plenty of other spending--such as for the military--that can be cut. With such cuts and those two revenue increases, we'd be able to bring down the deficit to a reasonable level and ensure that doing so doesn't further depress the economy. Politicians have been raising taxes as a solution to our problems since the beginning of time and it only ends up creating Countries like Greece and Italy. Depends on whose taxes you're raising for how long, and what the condition of the economy is when you raise them. In a recession, you want to *reduce* taxes on those who are most likely to spend the extra money--the poor and middle-class--in order to increase demand. Increasing taxes on the very wealthy isn't going to affect their spending any, so it won't reduce demand; but it will allow the government to avoid spending cuts that would hurt the poor and middle-class. Basically, the better off the 99 percent are, the better off the economy will be. The deficit, BTW, is a medium- and long-term problem, not one we need to deal with immediately. The government needs to spend *more*, not less, to get us out of the recession. Once the economy has recovered, we can start dealing with the deficit. Trying to address it now will just make the recession worse. That government governs best which governs least, Jefferson (I believe). Meaningless without specifics.
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@... wrote: On 11/28/2011 10:11 AM, John wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wgm4uanitaoaks4u@ wrote: And Barack Obama is deposed!http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4BWhvIlFVE It's obvious that many Americans are not happy with Obama's administration. But the voters will have to consider the alternative. Given that the Republicans turned down the jobs bill, the voters will see that Romney will not be able to show anything substantial to fix the current economic situation. Romney's agenda would have to be to cut taxes and cut the federal government payroll and entitlements like Social Security. I don't believe his agenda will create any jobs for the economy. He will only create more doubt about his leadership capability since he will be controlled by the Republican establishment. At the present, it doesn't even appear that most Republicans are sold on Romney as the standard bearer for the party. America's dead meat anyway. It's on life support. Capitalism didn't work out. MMY was right but he was just sayin' what many economists and futurists (like Bucky Fuller) were sayin'. If the rich win then we'll wind up being serfs making cheap goods for China and eating syntho-food. Do you want that? The bankers showed how dumb they actually are with their derivatives and hedge funds. It was like a bunch of kids playing with matches and oops burned the house down. And they should pay the full price for it. The public should not bail them out. Catch them at every excuse to sell the public we should help them out and sound a resounding NO! I overheard a public servant at the driver's license, office this week say, The Real ID Act is Federal, I am glad we have it. So what if it is not Constitutional. Remember September 11th?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
On 11/28/2011 03:44 PM, obbajeeba wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitunoozguru@... wrote: On 11/28/2011 10:11 AM, John wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wgm4uanitaoaks4u@ wrote: And Barack Obama is deposed!http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4BWhvIlFVE It's obvious that many Americans are not happy with Obama's administration. But the voters will have to consider the alternative. Given that the Republicans turned down the jobs bill, the voters will see that Romney will not be able to show anything substantial to fix the current economic situation. Romney's agenda would have to be to cut taxes and cut the federal government payroll and entitlements like Social Security. I don't believe his agenda will create any jobs for the economy. He will only create more doubt about his leadership capability since he will be controlled by the Republican establishment. At the present, it doesn't even appear that most Republicans are sold on Romney as the standard bearer for the party. America's dead meat anyway. It's on life support. Capitalism didn't work out. MMY was right but he was just sayin' what many economists and futurists (like Bucky Fuller) were sayin'. If the rich win then we'll wind up being serfs making cheap goods for China and eating syntho-food. Do you want that? The bankers showed how dumb they actually are with their derivatives and hedge funds. It was like a bunch of kids playing with matches and oops burned the house down. And they should pay the full price for it. The public should not bail them out. Catch them at every excuse to sell the public we should help them out and sound a resounding NO! I overheard a public servant at the driver's license, office this week say, The Real ID Act is Federal, I am glad we have it. So what if it is not Constitutional. Remember September 11th? When I say National Stupid that is the kind of idiot I'm referring to. They are a drag on society. ;-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@... wrote: On 11/28/2011 10:11 AM, John wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wgm4uanitaoaks4u@ wrote: And Barack Obama is deposed!http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4BWhvIlFVE It's obvious that many Americans are not happy with Obama's administration. But the voters will have to consider the alternative. Given that the Republicans turned down the jobs bill, the voters will see that Romney will not be able to show anything substantial to fix the current economic situation. Romney's agenda would have to be to cut taxes and cut the federal government payroll and entitlements like Social Security. I don't believe his agenda will create any jobs for the economy. He will only create more doubt about his leadership capability since he will be controlled by the Republican establishment. At the present, it doesn't even appear that most Republicans are sold on Romney as the standard bearer for the party. America's dead meat anyway. It's on life support. Capitalism didn't work out. MMY was right but he was just sayin' what many economists and futurists (like Bucky Fuller) were sayin'. If the rich win then we'll wind up being serfs making cheap goods for China and eating syntho-food. Do you want that? The bankers showed how dumb they actually are with their derivatives and hedge funds. It was like a bunch of kids playing with matches and oops burned the house down. And they should pay the full price for it. The public should not bail them out. Catch them at every excuse to sell the public we should help them out and sound a resounding NO! The bankers believed that their actions relating to the housing mortgage debacle were legal and that they would be supported by the federal government. Apparently there was a federal law that was passed to lower the requirements for some borrowers so that they can buy new homes. The bankers chose to look the other way when confronted with the possibility that these borrowers would become bankrupt or insolvent. The bankers were rolling the dice with the perceived assurance that the government will bail them out if their gamble did not result in a profit. In hindsight, we would have to blame the government for lowering the standard for borrowing money to buy a house for some individuals. It would seem that the government wanted to stimulate the housing sector of the economy. Unfortunately, the lawmakers did not realize that the bankers would take advantage of this law which nearly created another depression if the government did not bail them out. IMO, the federal government has learned from this debacle and has created more checks and balances to prevent this fiasco from happening again. However, to our disadvantage, we have to suffer for situation in the form of unemployment and slowdown in the economy.
[FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, John jr_esq@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: snip The bankers showed how dumb they actually are with their derivatives and hedge funds. It was like a bunch of kids playing with matches and oops burned the house down. And they should pay the full price for it. The public should not bail them out. Catch them at every excuse to sell the public we should help them out and sound a resounding NO! The bankers believed that their actions relating to the housing mortgage debacle were legal and that they would be supported by the federal government. Apparently there was a federal law that was passed to lower the requirements for some borrowers so that they can buy new homes. Please, inform yourself. Start with this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_policies_and_the_subprime_mortgage_crisis http://tinyurl.com/7t9e5uz The Wikipedia article has lots of references, including to other Wikipedia articles on the 2008 financial crisis. It's much more complicated than you dream. Bhairitu is essentially correct that it was the securitization of risk in mortgage lending with derivatives and such that was the primary contributor to the crisis. Just for one thing, the vast majority of the subprime loans were not made by FDIC- insured banks. For another, most of the loans that went bad were not made to low-income borrowers. And for still another, commercial loans were just as problematic as home loans.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President!
I'm sure you've seen thisthey new they were screwing us...please According to the Securities and Exchange Commission, Citigroup stuffed a $1 billion mortgage fund that it sold to investors in 2007 with securities that it believed would fail so that it could bet against its customers and profit when values declined. The fraud, the agency said, was in Citigroup’s falsely telling investors that an independent party was choosing the portfolio’s investments. Citigroup made $160 million from the deal and investors lost $700 million. In his decision, Judge Rakoff called Citigroup “a recidivist,” or repeat offender, for having previously settled other fraud cases with the agency where it neither admitted nor denied the allegations but agreed never to violate the law in the future. Except that they did commit fraud again and again. http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/29/business/judge-rejects-sec-accord-with-citi.html From: John jr_...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, November 28, 2011 8:11 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: What will happen when Mitt Romney is sworn as President! --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@... wrote: On 11/28/2011 10:11 AM, John wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wgm4uanitaoaks4u@ wrote: And Barack Obama is deposed!http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4BWhvIlFVE It's obvious that many Americans are not happy with Obama's administration. But the voters will have to consider the alternative. Given that the Republicans turned down the jobs bill, the voters will see that Romney will not be able to show anything substantial to fix the current economic situation. Romney's agenda would have to be to cut taxes and cut the federal government payroll and entitlements like Social Security. I don't believe his agenda will create any jobs for the economy. He will only create more doubt about his leadership capability since he will be controlled by the Republican establishment. At the present, it doesn't even appear that most Republicans are sold on Romney as the standard bearer for the party. America's dead meat anyway. It's on life support. Capitalism didn't work out. MMY was right but he was just sayin' what many economists and futurists (like Bucky Fuller) were sayin'. If the rich win then we'll wind up being serfs making cheap goods for China and eating syntho-food. Do you want that? The bankers showed how dumb they actually are with their derivatives and hedge funds. It was like a bunch of kids playing with matches and oops burned the house down. And they should pay the full price for it. The public should not bail them out. Catch them at every excuse to sell the public we should help them out and sound a resounding NO! The bankers believed that their actions relating to the housing mortgage debacle were legal and that they would be supported by the federal government. Apparently there was a federal law that was passed to lower the requirements for some borrowers so that they can buy new homes. The bankers chose to look the other way when confronted with the possibility that these borrowers would become bankrupt or insolvent. The bankers were rolling the dice with the perceived assurance that the government will bail them out if their gamble did not result in a profit. In hindsight, we would have to blame the government for lowering the standard for borrowing money to buy a house for some individuals. It would seem that the government wanted to stimulate the housing sector of the economy. Unfortunately, the lawmakers did not realize that the bankers would take advantage of this law which nearly created another depression if the government did not bail them out. IMO, the federal government has learned from this debacle and has created more checks and balances to prevent this fiasco from happening again. However, to our disadvantage, we have to suffer for situation in the form of unemployment and slowdown in the economy.
