Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
Ann, maybe it's a fine line between admiration and being gaga over a charismatic person. As for which comes first, health or quiet charisma, I'd guess that good psychological health would be the foundation. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 9:03 PM, awoelfleba...@yahoo.com awoelfleba...@yahoo.com wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Ann, in this post as well as in my previous posts, I often write to discover what I think rather than to declare what I think. Plus I get a lot from the input and questions from others. Like this question of yours about where charisma comes from. My immediate response was that it comes from Being, from Life and I'm not giving that thought up completely. OTOH, I think both Martin Luther King and Hitler had the gift of public speaking and their charisma was funneled through that gift, the big difference being, imo, that King was grounded in spirituality and Hitler wasn't. Nick Vujicic comes to mind as a contemporary charismatic person. He's a young, Australian fellow who was born without arms and legs and has gone on to live an amazing life which includes uplifting and inspiring others. I'd say his charisma comes straight from his spirit and doesn't get distorted much on the way to expression. Have you seen him in person? Or are you thinking/confusing charisma for admiration for the man? There is a big difference. Charisma is a palpable magnet coming off the charismatic in my experience. You are mesmerized or at least drawn to stay near the charismatic. They are attractive in all sorts of ways that goes way beyond physical attraction. They seem to hold out a promise for something they can give you if you stay near them or listen to their words. It is quite a physical sensation. My guess is that it's easier for the quiet, charismatic people to stay psychologically healthy than it is for the expressive charismatics. Chicken or the egg? (I seem to be asking that a lot lately.) On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 12:23 PM, awoelflebater@... awoelflebater@... wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Ann, I think I've mainly been in the presence of healthy or developed charismatic people like Martin Luther King. My guess is that charisma is a gift that can easily be misused and thus the world has known many unhealthy or undeveloped charismatic people, like Hitler. But I would also say that a charismatic person can be mainly either quiet or expressive. Hmm, so that just about covers the range of possibilities. Funny, because earlier you were talking about charisma as being all fire and brimstone and theatrical. For example, I'd put Fr. Keating in the group of healthy, quiet charismatic people whereas I'd put MLK in the group of healthy, expressive charismatics. What do you think, do you think charisma has to do with the person or their message primarily?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
Thanks, Nablusoss, wonderful to hear Maharishi who's not at all charismatic. And I mean that as a great compliment. I think he doesn't have to be because he's speaking the plain truth. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 2:22 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
Jeezus X-mas, Not at all Charismatic? You evidently did not get to spend much time around Maharishi. That's a pity. This is a good working definition of charismatic .. . Weber, in an oft quoted passage, defined charisma as a certain quality of an individual personality, by virtue of which [s/]he is set apart from ordinary [people] and treated as endowed with supernatural, superhuman, or at least specifically exceptional powers or qualities. These are such as are not accessible to the ordinary person, but are regarded as of divine origin or as exemplary, and on the basis of them the individual concerned is treated as a leader. 1 By experience, -U.S. Buck in the Dome .. .sharelong60 asserts: Thanks, Nablusoss, wonderful to hear Maharishi who's not at all charismatic. And I mean that as a great compliment. I think he doesn't have to be because he's speaking the plain truth. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 2:22 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
Buck, when I think of charismatic I think of fire and brimstone preachers, etc. Maharishi spoke the plain truth and did not need such theatrics imo. He was a true leader in that sense. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 6:20 AM, dhamiltony...@yahoo.com dhamiltony...@yahoo.com wrote: Jeezus X-mas, Not at all Charismatic? You evidently did not get to spend much time around Maharishi. That's a pity. This is a good working definition of charismatic .. . Weber, in an oft quoted passage, defined charisma as a certain quality of an individual personality, by virtue of which [s/]he is set apart from ordinary [people] and treated as endowed with supernatural, superhuman, or at least specifically exceptional powers or qualities. These are such as are not accessible to the ordinary person, but are regarded as of divine origin or as exemplary, and on the basis of them the individual concerned is treated as a leader. 1 By experience, -U.S. Buck in the Dome .. .sharelong60 asserts: Thanks, Nablusoss, wonderful to hear Maharishi who's not at all charismatic. And I mean that as a great compliment. I think he doesn't have to be because he's speaking the plain truth. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 2:22 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
Doug (Buck) obviously has pretty low standards when it comes to charisma. Based on my own experience -- both with Maharishi and with other teachers since -- I would have to say that Maharishi Mahesh Yogi had about the same level of charisma as my plumber. And my plumber charges less. From: dhamiltony...@yahoo.com dhamiltony...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2014 1:18 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing Jeezus X-mas, Not at all Charismatic? You evidently did not get to spend much time around Maharishi. That's a pity. This is a good working definition of charismatic .. . Weber, in an oft quoted passage, defined charisma as a certain quality of an individual personality, by virtue of which [s/]he is set apart from ordinary [people] and treated as endowed with supernatural, superhuman, or at least specifically exceptional powers or qualities. These are such as are not accessible to the ordinary person, but are regarded as of divine origin or as exemplary, and on the basis of them the individual concerned is treated as a leader. 1 By experience, -U.S. Buck in the Dome .. .sharelong60 asserts: Thanks, Nablusoss, wonderful to hear Maharishi who's not at all charismatic. And I mean that as a great compliment. I think he doesn't have to be because he's speaking the plain truth. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 2:22 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
turq, I think the highest form of charisma is not needing charisma at all. And imo Maharishi exemplified this highest form. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 6:56 AM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com wrote: Doug (Buck) obviously has pretty low standards when it comes to charisma. Based on my own experience -- both with Maharishi and with other teachers since -- I would have to say that Maharishi Mahesh Yogi had about the same level of charisma as my plumber. And my plumber charges less. From: dhamiltony...@yahoo.com dhamiltony...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2014 1:18 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing Jeezus X-mas, Not at all Charismatic? You evidently did not get to spend much time around Maharishi. That's a pity. This is a good working definition of charismatic .. . Weber, in an oft quoted passage, defined charisma as a certain quality of an individual personality, by virtue of which [s/]he is set apart from ordinary [people] and treated as endowed with supernatural, superhuman, or at least specifically exceptional powers or qualities. These are such as are not accessible to the ordinary person, but are regarded as of divine origin or as exemplary, and on the basis of them the individual concerned is treated as a leader. 1 By experience, -U.S. Buck in the Dome .. .sharelong60 asserts: Thanks, Nablusoss, wonderful to hear Maharishi who's not at all charismatic. And I mean that as a great compliment. I think he doesn't have to be because he's speaking the plain truth. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 2:22 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
The Turq didn't see any charisma because he was in the TMO for other reasons than being attentive, the party and the broads, as he has told us ad nauseum. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : Doug (Buck) obviously has pretty low standards when it comes to charisma. Based on my own experience -- both with Maharishi and with other teachers since -- I would have to say that Maharishi Mahesh Yogi had about the same level of charisma as my plumber. And my plumber charges less. From: dhamiltony2k5@... dhamiltony2k5@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2014 1:18 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing Jeezus X-mas, Not at all Charismatic? You evidently did not get to spend much time around Maharishi. That's a pity. This is a good working definition of charismatic .. . Weber, in an oft quoted passage, defined charisma as a certain quality of an individual personality, by virtue of which [s/]he is set apart from ordinary [people] and treated as endowed with supernatural, superhuman, or at least specifically exceptional powers or qualities. These are such as are not accessible to the ordinary person, but are regarded as of divine origin or as exemplary, and on the basis of them the individual concerned is treated as a leader. 1 By experience, -U.S. Buck in the Dome .. .sharelong60 asserts: Thanks, Nablusoss, wonderful to hear Maharishi who's not at all charismatic. And I mean that as a great compliment. I think he doesn't have to be because he's speaking the plain truth. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 2:22 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
Maharishi certainly didn't have to be charming to impress anyone. But anyone who met still commented on his charisma, not counting the dull or drugged-out of which we have a few experts here :-) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Thanks, Nablusoss, wonderful to hear Maharishi who's not at all charismatic. And I mean that as a great compliment. I think he doesn't have to be because he's speaking the plain truth. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 2:22 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
Nablusoss, maybe it's more accurate to say that Mahairishi redefined charisma to mean someone who speaks the plain truth and thus awakens it in the listeners rather than someone who uses theatrics, etc. to persuade audiences. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 7:01 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: The Turq didn't see any charisma because he was in the TMO for other reasons than being attentive, the party and the broads, as he has told us ad nauseum. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : Doug (Buck) obviously has pretty low standards when it comes to charisma. Based on my own experience -- both with Maharishi and with other teachers since -- I would have to say that Maharishi Mahesh Yogi had about the same level of charisma as my plumber. And my plumber charges less. From: dhamiltony2k5@... dhamiltony2k5@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2014 1:18 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing Jeezus X-mas, Not at all Charismatic? You evidently did not get to spend much time around Maharishi. That's a pity. This is a good working definition of charismatic .. . Weber, in an oft quoted passage, defined charisma as a certain quality of an individual personality, by virtue of which [s/]he is set apart from ordinary [people] and treated as endowed with supernatural, superhuman, or at least specifically exceptional powers or qualities. These are such as are not accessible to the ordinary person, but are regarded as of divine origin or as exemplary, and on the basis of them the individual concerned is treated as a leader. 1 By experience, -U.S. Buck in the Dome .. .sharelong60 asserts: Thanks, Nablusoss, wonderful to hear Maharishi who's not at all charismatic. And I mean that as a great compliment. I think he doesn't have to be because he's speaking the plain truth. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 2:22 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
Yes that evidently goes back to the possible range of human behavior, including the NPD'ed. The so-called charismatic preacher could be a good example of that too. I feel Weber's more scholarly definition is better for our larger purposes of spiritual discussion here. It is more inclusive of what we see as spiritual saints, leaders and teachers spiritually than the image of some theatrical style of preaching. Weber's definition of charismatic better takes into account a scale of field affect ranging from a NPD preacher, Turqb's plumber or to the jagad caliber saint we also know. That range all got rendered down a while ago here, https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FairfieldLife/conversations/messages/370672 https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FairfieldLife/conversations/messages/370672 -Buck sharelong60 writes: Buck, when I think of charismatic I think of fire and brimstone preachers, etc. Maharishi spoke the plain truth and did not need such theatrics imo. He was a true leader in that sense. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 6:20 AM, Buck wrote: Jeezus X-mas, Not at all Charismatic? You evidently did not get to spend much time around Maharishi. That's a pity. This is a good working definition of charismatic .. . Weber, in an oft quoted passage, defined charisma as a certain quality of an individual personality, by virtue of which [s/]he is set apart from ordinary [people] and treated as endowed with supernatural, superhuman, or at least specifically exceptional powers or qualities. These are such as are not accessible to the ordinary person, but are regarded as of divine origin or as exemplary, and on the basis of them the individual concerned is treated as a leader. 1 By experience, -U.S. Buck in the Dome .. .sharelong60 asserts: Thanks, Nablusoss, wonderful to hear Maharishi who's not at all charismatic. And I mean that as a great compliment. I think he doesn't have to be because he's speaking the plain truth. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 2:22 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Buck, when I think of charismatic I think of fire and brimstone preachers, etc. Maharishi spoke the plain truth and did not need such theatrics imo. He was a true leader in that sense. Interesting. That makes me think you have never been near a charismatic person. Actually, in my experience charismatic means supremely engaging, almost seductive, in an ability to keep you riveted to the spot. Charisma has an effect of totally making you want to stay as close to that person's energy as possible. It is a wonderful feeling but also a dangerous one because if the charismatic is also off their rocker or simply charismatic without other redeeming qualities then you could be hooped until you can get out from under the spell. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 6:20 AM, dhamiltony2k5@... dhamiltony2k5@... wrote: Jeezus X-mas, Not at all Charismatic? You evidently did not get to spend much time around Maharishi. That's a pity. This is a good working definition of charismatic .. . Weber, in an oft quoted passage, defined charisma as a certain quality of an individual personality, by virtue of which [s/]he is set apart from ordinary [people] and treated as endowed with supernatural, superhuman, or at least specifically exceptional powers or qualities. These are such as are not accessible to the ordinary person, but are regarded as of divine origin or as exemplary, and on the basis of them the individual concerned is treated as a leader. 1 By experience, -U.S. Buck in the Dome .. .sharelong60 asserts: Thanks, Nablusoss, wonderful to hear Maharishi who's not at all charismatic. And I mean that as a great compliment. I think he doesn't have to be because he's speaking the plain truth. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 2:22 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Nablusoss, maybe it's more accurate to say that Mahairishi redefined charisma to mean someone who speaks the plain truth and thus awakens it in the listeners rather than someone who uses theatrics, etc. to persuade audiences. Now I am sure you have not been in the presence of a charismatic person. It has absolutely nothing to do with theatrics. It is all about the energy that emanates from that person and it contains power, and it is not overblown or dramatic. It is quiet and pervasive. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 7:01 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: The Turq didn't see any charisma because he was in the TMO for other reasons than being attentive, the party and the broads, as he has told us ad nauseum. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : Doug (Buck) obviously has pretty low standards when it comes to charisma. Based on my own experience -- both with Maharishi and with other teachers since -- I would have to say that Maharishi Mahesh Yogi had about the same level of charisma as my plumber. And my plumber charges less. From: dhamiltony2k5@... dhamiltony2k5@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2014 1:18 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing Jeezus X-mas, Not at all Charismatic? You evidently did not get to spend much time around Maharishi. That's a pity. This is a good working definition of charismatic .. . Weber, in an oft quoted passage, defined charisma as a certain quality of an individual personality, by virtue of which [s/]he is set apart from ordinary [people] and treated as endowed with supernatural, superhuman, or at least specifically exceptional powers or qualities. These are such as are not accessible to the ordinary person, but are regarded as of divine origin or as exemplary, and on the basis of them the individual concerned is treated as a leader. 1 By experience, -U.S. Buck in the Dome .. .sharelong60 asserts: Thanks, Nablusoss, wonderful to hear Maharishi who's not at all charismatic. And I mean that as a great compliment. I think he doesn't have to be because he's speaking the plain truth. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 2:22 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
Ann, I think I've mainly been in the presence of healthy or developed charismatic people like Martin Luther King. My guess is that charisma is a gift that can easily be misused and thus the world has known many unhealthy or undeveloped charismatic people, like Hitler. But I would also say that a charismatic person can be mainly either quiet or expressive. For example, I'd put Fr. Keating in the group of healthy, quiet charismatic people whereas I'd put MLK in the group of healthy, expressive charismatics. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 9:10 AM, awoelfleba...@yahoo.com awoelfleba...@yahoo.com wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Nablusoss, maybe it's more accurate to say that Mahairishi redefined charisma to mean someone who speaks the plain truth and thus awakens it in the listeners rather than someone who uses theatrics, etc. to persuade audiences. Now I am sure you have not been in the presence of a charismatic person. It has absolutely nothing to do with theatrics. It is all about the energy that emanates from that person and it contains power, and it is not overblown or dramatic. It is quiet and pervasive. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 7:01 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: The Turq didn't see any charisma because he was in the TMO for other reasons than being attentive, the party and the broads, as he has told us ad nauseum. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : Doug (Buck) obviously has pretty low standards when it comes to charisma. Based on my own experience -- both with Maharishi and with other teachers since -- I would have to say that Maharishi Mahesh Yogi had about the same level of charisma as my plumber. And my plumber charges less. From: dhamiltony2k5@... dhamiltony2k5@... To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2014 1:18 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing Jeezus X-mas, Not at all Charismatic? You evidently did not get to spend much time around Maharishi. That's a pity. This is a good working definition of charismatic .. . Weber, in an oft quoted passage, defined charisma as a certain quality of an individual personality, by virtue of which [s/]he is set apart from ordinary [people] and treated as endowed with supernatural, superhuman, or at least specifically exceptional powers or qualities. These are such as are not accessible to the ordinary person, but are regarded as of divine origin or as exemplary, and on the basis of them the individual concerned is treated as a leader. 1 By experience, -U.S. Buck in the Dome .. .sharelong60 asserts: Thanks, Nablusoss, wonderful to hear Maharishi who's not at all charismatic. And I mean that as a great compliment. I think he doesn't have to be because he's speaking the plain truth. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 2:22 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ajEzVsuhg
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
Ann, in this post as well as in my previous posts, I often write to discover what I think rather than to declare what I think. Plus I get a lot from the input and questions from others. Like this question of yours about where charisma comes from. My immediate response was that it comes from Being, from Life and I'm not giving that thought up completely. OTOH, I think both Martin Luther King and Hitler had the gift of public speaking and their charisma was funneled through that gift, the big difference being, imo, that King was grounded in spirituality and Hitler wasn't. Nick Vujicic comes to mind as a contemporary charismatic person. He's a young, Australian fellow who was born without arms and legs and has gone on to live an amazing life which includes uplifting and inspiring others. I'd say his charisma comes straight from his spirit and doesn't get distorted much on the way to expression. My guess is that it's easier for the quiet, charismatic people to stay psychologically healthy than it is for the expressive charismatics. On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 12:23 PM, awoelfleba...@yahoo.com awoelfleba...@yahoo.com wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Ann, I think I've mainly been in the presence of healthy or developed charismatic people like Martin Luther King. My guess is that charisma is a gift that can easily be misused and thus the world has known many unhealthy or undeveloped charismatic people, like Hitler. But I would also say that a charismatic person can be mainly either quiet or expressive. Hmm, so that just about covers the range of possibilities. Funny, because earlier you were talking about charisma as being all fire and brimstone and theatrical. For example, I'd put Fr. Keating in the group of healthy, quiet charismatic people whereas I'd put MLK in the group of healthy, expressive charismatics. What do you think, do you think charisma has to do with the person or their message primarily?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Ann, I think I've mainly been in the presence of healthy or developed charismatic people like Martin Luther King. My guess is that charisma is a gift that can easily be misused and thus the world has known many unhealthy or undeveloped charismatic people, like Hitler. But I would also say that a charismatic person can be mainly either quiet or expressive. Hmm, so that just about covers the range of possibilities. Funny, because earlier you were talking about charisma as being all fire and brimstone and theatrical. For example, I'd put Fr. Keating in the group of healthy, quiet charismatic people whereas I'd put MLK in the group of healthy, expressive charismatics. What do you think, do you think charisma has to do with the person or their message primarily?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Meaning is a Static Thing
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Ann, in this post as well as in my previous posts, I often write to discover what I think rather than to declare what I think. Plus I get a lot from the input and questions from others. Like this question of yours about where charisma comes from. My immediate response was that it comes from Being, from Life and I'm not giving that thought up completely. OTOH, I think both Martin Luther King and Hitler had the gift of public speaking and their charisma was funneled through that gift, the big difference being, imo, that King was grounded in spirituality and Hitler wasn't. Nick Vujicic comes to mind as a contemporary charismatic person. He's a young, Australian fellow who was born without arms and legs and has gone on to live an amazing life which includes uplifting and inspiring others. I'd say his charisma comes straight from his spirit and doesn't get distorted much on the way to expression. Have you seen him in person? Or are you thinking/confusing charisma for admiration for the man? There is a big difference. Charisma is a palpable magnet coming off the charismatic in my experience. You are mesmerized or at least drawn to stay near the charismatic. They are attractive in all sorts of ways that goes way beyond physical attraction. They seem to hold out a promise for something they can give you if you stay near them or listen to their words. It is quite a physical sensation. My guess is that it's easier for the quiet, charismatic people to stay psychologically healthy than it is for the expressive charismatics. Chicken or the egg? (I seem to be asking that a lot lately.) On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 12:23 PM, awoelflebater@... awoelflebater@... wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Ann, I think I've mainly been in the presence of healthy or developed charismatic people like Martin Luther King. My guess is that charisma is a gift that can easily be misused and thus the world has known many unhealthy or undeveloped charismatic people, like Hitler. But I would also say that a charismatic person can be mainly either quiet or expressive. Hmm, so that just about covers the range of possibilities. Funny, because earlier you were talking about charisma as being all fire and brimstone and theatrical. For example, I'd put Fr. Keating in the group of healthy, quiet charismatic people whereas I'd put MLK in the group of healthy, expressive charismatics. What do you think, do you think charisma has to do with the person or their message primarily?
