Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
--- sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hermandan0 no_reply@ wrote: OK, I'll jump in here, not for the sake of being argumentative, but just to relate my experience. I became a teacher much later than all of you pioneers, so I cannot speak to what you might have been told on your courses. What I, as a student, heard from TM teachers conforms precisely to your description of what you were told to teach. Eeven allowing for Barry coming from a different era (I learned in 73), the business about not teaching unless the student kneels isn't something that even makes sense. When I went back to MUM/MIU in the mid-80's for a course, someone from Spielberg's (Lucas's?) studio had brought an experimental 3D video camera and wanted to film the Puja for MMY. They passed out flowers and started filming. I bowed my head respectfully with hands in the namaste form and then noticed that everyone else in the entire room-- with no exceptions (about 2000+ people since it was on oe of the larger courses)-- had fully kowtowed with head to floor. I glanced all the way around the room, threw my arms up at the ceiling dramatically and shrugged and knelt down... ..the next day, at another meeting, they passed the flowers around to everyone again, explaining that due to a camera glitch they needed to refilm part of the Puja. They instructed us all to stand respectfully as they did the retake. I find it hard to believe that ANY TM teacher was ever instructed to require his/her students to kneel or they wouldn't be taught, not even the Indian ones teaching in India. I became a teacher in '73 and it was irrelevant whether the student stood, kneeled or laughed at that end of the puja. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
On Sep 19, 2006, at 11:08 PM, jyouells2000 wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sep 19, 2006, at 8:00 PM, jyouells2000 wrote: I've heard about thispolicy numerous times. What I don't understand is why nobody ever threatened to sue the SOBs. That's deception, pure and simple. Sal I used the word 'attorney' in a letter about an ATR credit refund and it got me blacklisted from courses for around 10 years even though I was a center chairman the whole time. I did get the money national promised me though. Yep, words like that usually work wonders with people intending to deceive. Sal I was naive. Supporting the center out of my own pocket. I had a signed agreement with the TMO for the return of ATR credit in cash. I fulfilled my obligation and they did not want to fulfill theirs. It was a friendly letter. They wanted to keep the refund that they promised, and keep the income that the local center generated. They were spiteful and coercive. They accepted everyone I sent to TTC, siddhis, advanced techniques etc, but I could not get on a residence course. I went an advanced technique. I was there first, but they taught about 300 before me, saying that they could not verify that I was a meditator. Even though they were teaching people that I initiated. At the end of a long day *my* initiator walked in and they finally taught me last. I stopped applying to courses after that. About 10 years later they asked me to come to a DC course and I told 'em I wanted an acceptance in writing, in advance. They actually sent it. By then, they just wanted the money. All this over $1100. Quite a lesson for me at the time. I'm glad you got your credit redeemed, John, sorry that it took such an effort and that you were treated so shabbily. Experiences like yours pretty are pretty much along the lines of others I have heard of throughout the years. Sal To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: sparaig wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: TM is not that unique in its process. It is called yogic meditation in other circles. The actual use of the bijas particularly without OM is what is considered unorthodox. From what I've seen of how people describe other purportedly simple and easy meditation techniques, very few are actually simple and easy. All that says is you haven't seen very much. Hence my term spirituality sheltered. It really IS pretty amazing, isn't it? This entire group of people who have never tried any other technique of meditation or self discovery but TM, many of whom have been too afraid even to *read* about any other technique but TM, and yet they consider themselves authoritative about the subject of meditation as a whole. It's one of the things that keeps me fascinated by TMers, after all this time. I mean, you've been around the spiritual block a bit, right? Have you *ever* encountered any other group that knows as little as your standard TMer or TM teacher and yet believes that they know so much? I've always kept company with people from other organizations. Some were folks who had learned TM and looking for more and not finding it found it in other organizations. I learned a lot from them. Before learning TM I was trying other techniques. I can also say like those others I found myself wanting more but not finding in TM and moved on. I keep coming back to the teaching analogy that Maharishi used to use, in my opinion ironically. He used to speak about the kid who goes to his first day of school and learns A, B and C and then comes back and teaches his siblings A, B and C, because that's all he knows. As far as I can tell, the entire range of know- ledge I ever read or was exposed to in the TM movement was just that -- A, B and C. Since leaving the TM movement and spending almost 30 years doing a lot of reading in other traditions, and studying directly with teachers who cover the subjects that can't be written down, I've probably encountered only seven or eight more letters of the alphabet. In this lifetime I'll never learn even a *fraction* of the knowledge that is out there. My guru emphasizes this all the time that even what he knows is only a tiny part of the knowledge and it is impossible to know it all. But at the same time I've come to realize that (in my opinion) Maharishi himself was always seriously light in the loafers in terms of how much *he* knew. I honestly think that *he* was aware of only A, B and C, and knew little or nothing about the other spiritual letters of the alphabet, the other 90% of the body of spiritual knowledge. If we had a dime for every junior Hindu priest in India that knows a little or enough to teach a meditation course we'd be rich! :) They are all over the place there but most just stick close to their temples to seek enlightenment for themselves and serve their community. His genius, if it could be called that, was to convince stupid Westerners that he knew more than he did, and to keep repeating endless variations of A, B and C for forty years. Doing this, he *not only* convinced most of the people listening that they were hearing the entire alphabet of spiritual knowledge, but *also* convinced them that *they* knew more than seekers from any other tradition. He kept people SO spiritually sheltered and isolated that they never could become exposed to anyone who could tell them, Hey, I've listened to the stuff you talk about, and you never seem to get past A, B and C...don't you KNOW that there are other letters? He created an environment in which fear of drifting off the program was so strong that most of his followers don't even have any *curiosity* about learning more; they're that convinced that they already know everything that is worth learning. I've found that people from other organizations tend to treat TM folks respectfully from a distance knowing they have this 'tude. :) It's a truly amazing accomplishment, in a strange sort of way... To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
jim_flanegin wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As far as I can tell, the entire range of know- ledge I ever read or was exposed to in the TM movement was just that -- A, B and C. Since leaving the TM movement and spending almost 30 years doing a lot of reading in other traditions, and studying directly with teachers who cover the subjects that can't be written down, I've probably encountered only seven or eight more letters of the alphabet. In this lifetime I'll never learn even a *fraction* of the knowledge that is out there. There's an irreconcilable difference between university and universal knowledge. Sure there are probably as many spiritual habits out there as there are people. Some of them are group habits which we call traditions. One approach is to experience as many of these group habits as possible, each with its own terminology, expressions, forms of meditation, conclusions, teachers, etc. I would call this approach the university approach, sort of like seeing how many books in the library I can read in a lifetime. The other approach is to find any technique out there which will allow the full exploration of any one object, be it a thought, a material object, a relationship, or a feeling. If there is consistent and continual transcending, a point can be reached where there is a familiarity with all objects. I would call this approach the universal approach. In my experience, the universal approach as I have defined it is without question the most satisfying. Many gurus call the university approach bookish or wooden knowledge and frown on it. After initiation and with practice of a technique the books might even take on different and deeper meaning that was not apparent at the superficial level. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
--- shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig sparaig@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig sparaig@ wrote: Remember: this is the guy who told Andrew Skolnick that TM teachers were taught to lie. And this is Sparaig, who *still* hasn't gotten that what this admission means, if true, is that *his* teachers were taught to lie to *him*. I can think of dozens of instances in which I, as a TM teacher, was instructed to lie. About half of them were during my TTC, in terms of how to answer certain embarrassing questions, and the other half were while I was working for the National Center in L.A. OK. So howabout examples... No time today to do the subject justice, and probably no interest in doing it later in the week when things are less busy. I'll give you one example of the latter type of lie, the ones while working at National. After my period as a State Coordinator, I was asked to take over Barney Potratz's job at National while he was away on his sidhis course. So for a few months I was asked to lie to employees there at National on pretty much a weekly basis, and to potential employees (the people I was interviewing) on pretty much a daily basis. Most of the lies had to do with the mythical course credit. When each of these existing employees had signed on, they had been told in explicit terms how much credit they would be earning each month towards ATR or TTC or their Sidhis course. Each of the new employees I was interviewing was told the same thing. But about the time I arrived, the higher ups (meaning, in this case, probably International Staff decided that they couldn't afford this any more, and thus had no intention of ever giving *any* of these people eve a penny towards any course. I was forbidden to tell them this. The way it worked was that when an employee applied to take the course they had been working towards, they were taken into an office and told that they had received no credit, and that this was a new policy that was a surprise to the person telling them this. (I never had to be the person who did this; I wouldn't have been able to pull it off.) If the employee spoke up about being ripped off, they were fired on the spot. After a couple of months of this, I quit and went to my own course, which fortunately I had enough money to pay for myself, and which even more fortunately turned out to be my last with the TM movement ever. This is just one example of how we were told to lie to people. There are many others. If the TM teachers here are honest, I'm sure they will come up with a few examples of their own... I honestly can't and have no clue what you're talking about...and, hey, I've got ALOT of complaints about the TMO and MMY but your litany is foreign to me. If you worked on National or International staff this type of behavior was quite common. We posted alot about it several years ago. My little adventure was with National in DC when we were fixing-up the hotel on Purusha and I was in charge of housekeeping. I was in on the meeting when two people on national staff tricked a vaccum cleaner salesman into lending us about a dozen very high-end commercial vaccum cleaners ($1000.00 each) for the weekend. They essentially told him they were going to buy the vaccum cleaners but they had absolutely no intention of doing so. We used them for about 72 hours straight. They got very trashed and banged-up and then on Monday he came to collect his check and was told that we weren't interested in buying them. I was livid but the two National Staff guys told me to calm down. Real sleaze bag ethics. The TMO, behaind the scenes is replete with deception. And of course that grand daddy of them all: THE PUNDIT PROJECTS!!! Not one f*cking cent has gone towards bringing pundits to the US. Rationalize and double speak all you want, but it an outright con job orchestrated by MMY. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
On Sep 19, 2006, at 11:35 AM, Peter wrote: --- shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: After my period as a State Coordinator, I was asked to take over Barney Potratz's job at National while he was away on his sidhis course. So for a few months I was asked to lie to employees there at National on pretty much a weekly basis, and to potential employees (the people I was interviewing) on pretty much a daily basis. Most of the lies had to do with the mythical course credit. When each of these existing employees had signed on, they had been told in explicit terms how much credit they would be earning each month towards ATR or TTC or their Sidhis course. Each of the new employees I was interviewing was told the same thing. But about the time I arrived, the higher ups (meaning, in this case, probably International Staff decided that they couldn't afford this any more, and thus had no intention of ever giving *any* of these people eve a penny towards any course. I was forbidden to tell them this. The way it worked was that when an employee applied to take the course they had been working towards, they were taken into an office and told that they had received no credit, and that this was a new policy that was a surprise to the person telling them this. (I never had to be the person who did this; I wouldn't have been able to pull it off.) If the employee spoke up about being ripped off, they were fired on the spot. After a couple of months of this, I quit and went to my own course, which fortunately I had enough money to pay for myself, and which even more fortunately turned out to be my last with the TM movement ever. This is just one example of how we were told to lie to people. There are many others. If the TM teachers here are honest, I'm sure they will come up with a few examples of their own... I honestly can't and have no clue what you're talking about...and, hey, I've got ALOT of complaints about the TMO and MMY but your litany is foreign to me. If you worked on National or International staff this type of behavior was quite common. We posted alot about it several years ago. I've heard about thispolicy numerous times. What I don't understand is why nobody ever threatened to sue the SOBs. That's deception, pure and simple. Sal To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Remember: this is the guy who told Andrew Skolnick that TM teachers were taught to lie Was it your experience of TTC that leads you to challenge that statement about what teachers were taught? Neither Sparaig nor Judy Stein ever attended TTC. The things they parrot here as if they were Great Cosmic Truths are things that were taught to them by people just like us, who had been trained to lie to them by giving them Pat Answer A (Lie A) whenever a certain subject (Example of Critical Thought A) came up. Because they're the kinds of people who *long* to be told that they know The Truth, they chose to believe everything they were told. The more they believed, the more they thought they knew. Now when former TM teachers suggest that some of the things they were told were NOT the truth, they freak out. It's understandable. Don't take their hostility personally. We are challenging their most cherished fantasies. OF COURSE they're going to hate it -- and us -- when we do so. Would you have approved them for a TTC? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ wrote: Remember: this is the guy who told Andrew Skolnick that TM teacherwere taught to lie Was it your experience of TTC that leads you to challenge that statement about what teachers were taught? Other teachers of TM want to weigh in? Were you taught to lie? Absolutely. About the contents of the puja, about whether or not people were asked to kneel during it, about the number of mantras and how they were selected, and about certain hot button subjects that were likely to come up in lectures or in interviews. For the latter, we were taught pat answers to use in each situation, answers that in many cases we knew not to be true. We were also taught things to say about other forms of meditation (that most of us had never practiced) that were 1) negative and 2) not true. But Sparaig won't believe this, and he similarly won't believe any other TM teacher who chimes in and answers his question with a hearty Yes. He's interested in perpetuating his fantasies that what he was told was Truth, not in realizing that many of the things he was told were calculated lies. The biggest lie I can think of was the notion that the TM technique comes from the Shankaracharya which they claim it does not. I think that annoys most TM teachers I know. Whether MMY made it up or found it in an ancient text he owes it to his teachers the real source of the techniques. For those who live a spiritually sheltered life and are not aware there are many methods of teaching the public yogic meditation among them methods based on astrology, ayurveda, favorite deity and Hindu stages of life. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
sparaig wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig sparaig@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ wrote: Remember: this is the guy who told Andrew Skolnick that TM teacherwere taught to lie Was it your experience of TTC that leads you to challenge that statement about what teachers were taught? Other teachers of TM want to weigh in? Were you taught to lie? Absolutely. About the contents of the puja, about whether or not people were asked to kneel during it, about the number of mantras and how they were selected, and about certain hot button subjects that were likely to come up in lectures or in interviews. For the latter, we were taught pat answers to use in each situation, answers that in many cases we knew not to be true. We were also taught things to say about other forms of meditation (that most of us had never practiced) that were 1) negative and 2) not true. But Sparaig won't believe this, and he similarly won't believe any other TM teacher who chimes in and answers his question with a hearty Yes. He's interested in perpetuating his fantasies that what he was told was Truth, not in realizing that many of the things he was told were calculated lies. The biggest lie I can think of was the notion that the TM technique comes from the Shankaracharya which they claim it does not. I think that annoys most TM teachers I know. Whether MMY made it up or found it in an ancient text he owes it to his teachers the real source of the techniques. For those who live a spiritually sheltered life and are not aware there are many methods of teaching the public yogic meditation among them methods based on astrology, ayurveda, favorite deity and Hindu stages of life. Who they? Annoop Chandola was taught to meditate by Swami Shantananda Saraswati, and he's under the impression that he learned TM or something extremely similar to it. TM is not that unique in its process. It is called yogic meditation in other circles. The actual use of the bijas particularly without OM is what is considered unorthodox. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Neither Sparaig nor Judy Stein ever attended TTC. The things they parrot here as if they were Great Cosmic Truths are things that were taught to them by people just like us, who had been trained to lie to them by giving them Pat Answer A (Lie A) whenever a certain subject (Example of Critical Thought A) came up. Because they're the kinds of people who *long* to be told that they know The Truth, they chose to believe everything they were told. The more they believed, the more they thought they knew. Now when former TM teachers suggest that some of the things they were told were NOT the truth, they freak out. It's understandable. Don't take their hostility personally. We are challenging their most cherished fantasies. OF COURSE they're going to hate it -- and us -- when we do so. Would you have approved them for a TTC? I approved everyone who ever applied at the centers I worked at. Several of them were blackballed by other teachers, for greivous sins like reading off-the-program books, living together while unmarried, being gay, etc., but I always thought that the desire to do something for others should be supported. So you never had anyone who was considered a loose cannon or unstable? I seem to recall several from my center who were turned down at the center level because they were that way. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
sparaig wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: sparaig wrote: [...] Who they? Annoop Chandola was taught to meditate by Swami Shantananda Saraswati, and he's under the impression that he learned TM or something extremely similar to it. TM is not that unique in its process. It is called yogic meditation in other circles. The actual use of the bijas particularly without OM is what is considered unorthodox. From what I've seen of how people describe other purportedly simple and easy meditatio techniques, very few are actually simple and easy. All that says is you haven't seen very much. Hence my term spirituality sheltered. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
wayback71 wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: Neither Sparaig nor Judy Stein ever attended TTC. The things they parrot here as if they were Great Cosmic Truths are things that were taught to them by people just like us, who had been trained to lie to them by giving them Pat Answer A (Lie A) whenever a certain subject (Example of Critical Thought A) came up. Because they're the kinds of people who *long* to be told that they know The Truth, they chose to believe everything they were told. The more they believed, the more they thought they knew. Now when former TM teachers suggest that some of the things they were told were NOT the truth, they freak out. It's understandable. Don't take their hostility personally. We are challenging their most cherished fantasies. OF COURSE they're going to hate it -- and us -- when we do so. Would you have approved them for a TTC? I approved everyone who ever applied at the centers I worked at. Several of them were blackballed by other teachers, for greivous sins like reading off-the-program books, living together while unmarried, being gay, etc., but I always thought that the desire to do something for others should be supported. So you never had anyone who was considered a loose cannon or unstable? I seem to recall several from my center who were turned down at the center level because they were that way. I think it was you who wanted to know of the organization that helps people who have overwhelming and/or psychotic experiences as a result of meditdation or another spiritual practice. Grof and Grof wrote a book called Spiritual Emergency and I believe their website is www.realization.com I do not know what happens when you contact them or who replies. You can also Google spritual emergency and get some info. That link is a training management firm. :) To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
On Sep 19, 2006, at 8:00 PM, jyouells2000 wrote: I've heard about thispolicy numerous times. What I don't understand is why nobody ever threatened to sue the SOBs. That's deception, pure and simple. Sal I used the word 'attorney' in a letter about an ATR credit refund and it got me blacklisted from courses for around 10 years even though I was a center chairman the whole time. I did get the money national promised me though. Yep, words like that usually work wonders with people intending to deceive. Sal To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
--- sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If Debbie became psychotic the very last thing she needs is a long program! She needs to place her attention 100% in the relative and not drift off into some mental laya. Exercise, activity that fully engages her mind and FOOD. Who said she was ever psychotic? I can almost (almost) assure you that she has/had symptoms of psychosis, the most common psychological disorder from too much TM and TM-siddhis program. In fact all the cases of madness from TM that I know about are experiences of psychosis. Also, you only get commited for psychotic symtoms. These can accompany severe mood disorders, but I doubt Debbie had that diagnosis. What th f*ck is she doing on a long program? She's going to relapse again if someone doesn't know what they are doing. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie Henning -- keep anonymous
Title: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie Henning -- keep anonymous on 9/18/06 1:59 PM, new.morning at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, Barbara Wallace (Keith's first wife) shot someone Jessamine Verrill -- during flying session i think -- for being too loud. No. in the courtyard at Pac Pal. Not for the reason you said. My wife was there. Norwegian ? purusha set him self on fire. Swedish. Sten Sjostead (sp?) Some or someone threw them selves of FF RR tracks. A student. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
new.morning wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It'll take at least one more Levi-Butler-type episode to get the TMO to institute guidelines. Probably three or four. Well, Barbara Wallace (Keith's first wife) shot someone -- during flying session i think -- for being too loud. Norwegian ? purusha set him self on fire. Some or someone threw them selves of FF RR tracks. A number of other cases as i recall. In my tradition we do not get lay people shakti mantras for this very reason. It is felt that they often cannot handle them. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
Peter wrote: --- sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If Debbie became psychotic the very last thing she needs is a long program! She needs to place her attention 100% in the relative and not drift off into some mental laya. Exercise, activity that fully engages her mind and FOOD. Who said she was ever psychotic? I can almost (almost) assure you that she has/had symptoms of psychosis, the most common psychological disorder from too much TM and TM-siddhis program. In fact all the cases of madness from TM that I know about are experiences of psychosis. Also, you only get commited for psychotic symtoms. These can accompany severe mood disorders, but I doubt Debbie had that diagnosis. What th f*ck is she doing on a long program? She's going to relapse again if someone doesn't know what they are doing. Peter, the ayurvedic physician I had in the Bay Area back in the 1990's (has since moved out of the area) was a psychiatrist who was very into treating psychosis from meditation especially for TM'ers and tipped me to an organization and their website for practitioners who treat these disorders. I can't remember the organization and obviously its website, do you know about it? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
On Sep 18, 2006, at 5:25 PM, authfriend wrote: So I'm wondering where you get the idea from that it's normal, or even sort of normal, to wind up in an institution after dealing with a spouse's death? I never even *remotely* suggested it was normal or even sort of normal, and I haven't a clue where you got the idea that I did. OK, good. Then why do you keep mentioning her illness in relation to her having lost Doug, as if one almost followed naturally from the other? It doesn't. In fact, from what I've been able to gather, Debbie's condition, *if* brought forth solely or even mostly, by Doug's death, would be somewhat rare. You kept trying to connect the two as if it were far more common. That seemed to be clearly your intention. I'm glad you've learned better. :) Sal To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Debbie henning -- keep anonymous
On Sep 18, 2006, at 6:09 PM, wayback71 wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sep 18, 2006, at 2:55 PM, authfriend wrote: I can almost (almost) assure you that she has/had symptoms of psychosis, the most common psychological disorder from too much TM and TM-siddhis program. Especially in people who have just lost their spouse, right? Sal, I am guessing that Judy was being sarcastic inthe above comment about people who have just lost their spouse. Very possible, Way. But she had said the same or similar thing in other posts. Could be they were *all* sarcastic. :) Sal To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
