Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Economy Needs You to Work Past 70
On 05/09/2013 10:48 PM, John wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@... wrote: On 05/09/2013 12:36 PM, John wrote: How many here agree with this proposal? http://www.cnbc.com/id/100724186?__source=yahoo%7Cfinance%7Cheadline%7Cheadline%7Cstorypar=yahoodoc=100724186%7CAttention%20Boomers:%20US%20Nee 1) Work is not the purpose of life. The wealthy landowners tried to sell that idea to their serfs so they could lounge around while their serfs did all the work for little money. 2) Work is not holy. That's something the kings wanted to convey so you stayed busy and didn't cook up a coup d'etat against him. 3) Work is a means to an end and not an end in itself. It's supposed to be a way to exchanges your services for products or someone else's services. 4) There are fewer jobs because less needs to be done. We've automated a lot of boring jobs that no human should be doing and should automate more. For instance, except for custom clothing which would be interesting for someone who likes to do that and not repetitive you might as well design clothes that can be made entirely by machine. IOW, do away with those slave labor sweat shops in other countries. 5) People who love what they could might not mind doing that line of work until they drop dead. Creative people make up a lot of that group but society doesn't seem to like people who enjoy their work. They'd rather hire you for something you hate doing. 6) Scrap the Christian-Judeo work ethic. It's bullshit anyway according to what I've already stated. 7) In a world of 7 billion people there won't be enough work. Stop adding to the population. We don't need more people and need over the coming decades and centuries to reduce the population humanely to around 1 billion. But try to sell that to the folks who hold the purse strings. Either they want to reduce the population through genocide or wars. Most of the rich are mentally ill anyway. Who needs a billion dollars? 8) Instead begin a leisure society. Reduced hours more leisure. Enjoy life not work. Stipends for everyone. Bhairitu, There's nothing wrong with working if you enjoy the work. If they're doing something creative they should keep on doing it. The people can write, paint, sew, crochet, sculpt, photograph, make movies, cook gourmet foods, make beer and wine, play music, compose poetry and many others (including meditation using TM or other methods). If the work is strenuous and stressful, then the workers need to retire from such work. JR I'm guessing you didn't get to item number 5? :-
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Economy Needs You to Work Past 70
And then to top it ALL off perfectly, the health care you've worked so hard to get, causes a whole bunch of additional health problems. Every time my doc wants to give me a prescription, for example for the nausea which accompanied the vertigo, I told her it's a slippery slope and no thank you, I'll let the nausea go away by itself. Which of course it did. From: Susan waybac...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, May 10, 2013 7:41 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Economy Needs You to Work Past 70 I think that we need to be able to work 1/2 time or 3/4 time at any point in our lives. I think most people would love this option and could have more free time to do lots of the other fun things in life. An added bonus - it would allow more people to have jobs, which we need, especially the younger generation graduating from college and struggling to find jobs.. There just are not enough jobs and needs to have full employment, full time, for all those that want it. So let's have partial employment/job sharing for anyone who wants to work. The reason this is not happening here? The big problem is that once you don't work full time, here in the USA, you don't get health insurance. So the whole idea falls apart unless we can get single payer Medicare-like coverage for all.. Then people would feel freer to make work and life choices and be flexible and could change up their options at different points in their lives. The whole Obamacare thing is not going to work, nice as it sounds. It is just a modification of the current complicated system. Steven Brill's article in TIme nailed it - we are way way overcharged by hospitals (especially nonprofits) and that is what is driving the whole medical fee disaster here. Medicare pays for services at an appropriate rate (about one tenth of what the younger public is charged). Yes 1/10th! Amazing. Theprofit for nonprofit hospitalas is humongous. This then drives everythiing else, including the reason people here try to work fulltime no matter... --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@... wrote: On 05/09/2013 12:36 PM, John wrote: How many here agree with this proposal? http://www.cnbc.com/id/100724186?__source=yahoo%7Cfinance%7Cheadline%7Cheadline%7Cstorypar=yahoodoc=100724186%7CAttention%20Boomers:%20US%20Nee 1) Work is not the purpose of life. The wealthy landowners tried to sell that idea to their serfs so they could lounge around while their serfs did all the work for little money. 2) Work is not holy. That's something the kings wanted to convey so you stayed busy and didn't cook up a coup d'etat against him. 3) Work is a means to an end and not an end in itself. It's supposed to be a way to exchanges your services for products or someone else's services. 4) There are fewer jobs because less needs to be done. We've automated a lot of boring jobs that no human should be doing and should automate more. For instance, except for custom clothing which would be interesting for someone who likes to do that and not repetitive you might as well design clothes that can be made entirely by machine. IOW, do away with those slave labor sweat shops in other countries. 5) People who love what they could might not mind doing that line of work until they drop dead. Creative people make up a lot of that group but society doesn't seem to like people who enjoy their work. They'd rather hire you for something you hate doing. 6) Scrap the Christian-Judeo work ethic. It's bullshit anyway according to what I've already stated. 7) In a world of 7 billion people there won't be enough work. Stop adding to the population. We don't need more people and need over the coming decades and centuries to reduce the population humanely to around 1 billion. But try to sell that to the folks who hold the purse strings. Either they want to reduce the population through genocide or wars. Most of the rich are mentally ill anyway. Who needs a billion dollars? 8) Instead begin a leisure society. Reduced hours more leisure. Enjoy life not work. Stipends for everyone.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Economy Needs You to Work Past 70
Studies show that the millennial generation would rather not work as much, have less money but have more free time. They're also learning that everyone wins is a myth. Before healthcare was being legislated companies like Toyota and Starbucks were saying their biggest expense was healthcare insurance. Seems to me they and other corporations (most all would have said the same thing) would have been for single payer? Ah, but their buddies who ran the insurance companies got them to support that windfall for them or the joke of a healthcare bill that was passed. In reality single payer, something like Medicare for all, would have still kept the insurance companies in business. I'm on Medicare and I get sales pitches all the time from the health insurance companies for their supplemental policies. On 05/10/2013 05:41 AM, Susan wrote: I think that we need to be able to work 1/2 time or 3/4 time at any point in our lives. I think most people would love this option and could have more free time to do lots of the other fun things in life. An added bonus - it would allow more people to have jobs, which we need, especially the younger generation graduating from college and struggling to find jobs.. There just are not enough jobs and needs to have full employment, full time, for all those that want it. So let's have partial employment/job sharing for anyone who wants to work. The reason this is not happening here? The big problem is that once you don't work full time, here in the USA, you don't get health insurance. So the whole idea falls apart unless we can get single payer Medicare-like coverage for all.. Then people would feel freer to make work and life choices and be flexible and could change up their options at different points in their lives. The whole Obamacare thing is not going to work, nice as it sounds. It is just a modification of the current complicated system. Steven Brill's article in TIme nailed it - we are way way overcharged by hospitals (especially nonprofits) and that is what is driving the whole medical fee disaster here. Medicare pays for services at an appropriate rate (about one tenth of what the younger public is charged). Yes 1/10th! Amazing. Theprofit for nonprofit hospitalas is humongous. This then drives everythiing else, including the reason people here try to work fulltime no matter... --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@... wrote: On 05/09/2013 12:36 PM, John wrote: How many here agree with this proposal? http://www.cnbc.com/id/100724186?__source=yahoo%7Cfinance%7Cheadline%7Cheadline%7Cstorypar=yahoodoc=100724186%7CAttention%20Boomers:%20US%20Nee 1) Work is not the purpose of life. The wealthy landowners tried to sell that idea to their serfs so they could lounge around while their serfs did all the work for little money. 2) Work is not holy. That's something the kings wanted to convey so you stayed busy and didn't cook up a coup d'etat against him. 3) Work is a means to an end and not an end in itself. It's supposed to be a way to exchanges your services for products or someone else's services. 4) There are fewer jobs because less needs to be done. We've automated a lot of boring jobs that no human should be doing and should automate more. For instance, except for custom clothing which would be interesting for someone who likes to do that and not repetitive you might as well design clothes that can be made entirely by machine. IOW, do away with those slave labor sweat shops in other countries. 5) People who love what they could might not mind doing that line of work until they drop dead. Creative people make up a lot of that group but society doesn't seem to like people who enjoy their work. They'd rather hire you for something you hate doing. 6) Scrap the Christian-Judeo work ethic. It's bullshit anyway according to what I've already stated. 7) In a world of 7 billion people there won't be enough work. Stop adding to the population. We don't need more people and need over the coming decades and centuries to reduce the population humanely to around 1 billion. But try to sell that to the folks who hold the purse strings. Either they want to reduce the population through genocide or wars. Most of the rich are mentally ill anyway. Who needs a billion dollars? 8) Instead begin a leisure society. Reduced hours more leisure. Enjoy life not work. Stipends for everyone.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Economy Needs You to Work Past 70
On 05/10/2013 06:41 AM, Ann wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@... wrote: On 05/09/2013 12:36 PM, John wrote: How many here agree with this proposal? http://www.cnbc.com/id/100724186?__source=yahoo%7Cfinance%7Cheadline%7Cheadline%7Cstorypar=yahoodoc=100724186%7CAttention%20Boomers:%20US%20Nee 1) Work is not the purpose of life. The wealthy landowners tried to sell that idea to their serfs so they could lounge around while their serfs did all the work for little money. 2) Work is not holy. That's something the kings wanted to convey so you stayed busy and didn't cook up a coup d'etat against him. 3) Work is a means to an end and not an end in itself. It's supposed to be a way to exchanges your services for products or someone else's services. 4) There are fewer jobs because less needs to be done. We've automated a lot of boring jobs that no human should be doing and should automate more. For instance, except for custom clothing which would be interesting for someone who likes to do that and not repetitive you might as well design clothes that can be made entirely by machine. IOW, do away with those slave labor sweat shops in other countries. 5) People who love what they could might not mind doing that line of work until they drop dead. Creative people make up a lot of that group but society doesn't seem to like people who enjoy their work. They'd rather hire you for something you hate doing. 6) Scrap the Christian-Judeo work ethic. It's bullshit anyway according to what I've already stated. 7) In a world of 7 billion people there won't be enough work. Stop adding to the population. We don't need more people and need over the coming decades and centuries to reduce the population humanely to around 1 billion. But try to sell that to the folks who hold the purse strings. Either they want to reduce the population through genocide or wars. Most of the rich are mentally ill anyway. Who needs a billion dollars? 8) Instead begin a leisure society. Reduced hours more leisure. Enjoy life not work. Stipends for everyone. I don't think I agree with any of these points. Not one. I don't think there is an iota of difference between work and living your life. There are not two separate compartments here, although lots of people think they are and create that division (work and the rest of my life) which is fairly tragic. These people are usually the ones that hate their jobs, their work. They look forward to any time which isn't time spent on their job. They wish their lives away while at work and are generally miserable either contemplating going to work or while at work. I have been very fortunate in that I have had either the ability or the luck to have worked at jobs that I have loved. The ones I have not loved I have left. I have created jobs for myself, been a business owner and made a job out of what I love to do and I what I like to be around. I realize not everyone has that luxury or that foresight or that vision. So, work for me is just my life and there is no reason or impetus to stop working other than I would like to do a hell of a lot more travelling. And what is leisure? That concept doesn't exist for me. Is is doing nothing? Is it only doing what one considers non-work? And what does that mean? Is it doing anything that one wouldn't be able to do at work? Does leisure mean hobbies, sitting, watching TV, staring onto space? Leisure is a state of mind not a state of doing any one thing. Maybe leisure means doing the thing you want to do in a particular moment. There is lots I can say about every single point stated above but that is a start. So you disagree with point number 5? Sounds like you don't. Or maybe, like John, you didn't get that far. Maybe you had to pee. :-D Work is what NEEDS to be done. If nothing NEEDS to be done then people have free time. On political forums we discuss all the time about jobs and some of us raise the point about worthless make work jobs. These are jobs for the sake of having jobs. We just had congress trying to force the military to buy tanks they don't need nor want just to keep some jobs in one congressman's district. How far the once great US has fallen.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Economy Needs You to Work Past 70
On 05/10/2013 10:56 AM, Ann wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@... wrote: On 05/10/2013 06:41 AM, Ann wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: On 05/09/2013 12:36 PM, John wrote: How many here agree with this proposal? http://www.cnbc.com/id/100724186?__source=yahoo%7Cfinance%7Cheadline%7Cheadline%7Cstorypar=yahoodoc=100724186%7CAttention%20Boomers:%20US%20Nee 1) Work is not the purpose of life. The wealthy landowners tried to sell that idea to their serfs so they could lounge around while their serfs did all the work for little money. 2) Work is not holy. That's something the kings wanted to convey so you stayed busy and didn't cook up a coup d'etat against him. 3) Work is a means to an end and not an end in itself. It's supposed to be a way to exchanges your services for products or someone else's services. 4) There are fewer jobs because less needs to be done. We've automated a lot of boring jobs that no human should be doing and should automate more. For instance, except for custom clothing which would be interesting for someone who likes to do that and not repetitive you might as well design clothes that can be made entirely by machine. IOW, do away with those slave labor sweat shops in other countries. 5) People who love what they could might not mind doing that line of work until they drop dead. Creative people make up a lot of that group but society doesn't seem to like people who enjoy their work. They'd rather hire you for something you hate doing. 6) Scrap the Christian-Judeo work ethic. It's bullshit anyway according to what I've already stated. 7) In a world of 7 billion people there won't be enough work. Stop adding to the population. We don't need more people and need over the coming decades and centuries to reduce the population humanely to around 1 billion. But try to sell that to the folks who hold the purse strings. Either they want to reduce the population through genocide or wars. Most of the rich are mentally ill anyway. Who needs a billion dollars? 8) Instead begin a leisure society. Reduced hours more leisure. Enjoy life not work. Stipends for everyone. I don't think I agree with any of these points. Not one. I don't think there is an iota of difference between work and living your life. There are not two separate compartments here, although lots of people think they are and create that division (work and the rest of my life) which is fairly tragic. These people are usually the ones that hate their jobs, their work. They look forward to any time which isn't time spent on their job. They wish their lives away while at work and are generally miserable either contemplating going to work or while at work. I have been very fortunate in that I have had either the ability or the luck to have worked at jobs that I have loved. The ones I have not loved I have left. I have created jobs for myself, been a business owner and made a job out of what I love to do and I what I like to be around. I realize not everyone has that luxury or that foresight or that vision. So, work for me is just my life and there is no reason or impetus to stop working other than I would like to do a hell of a lot more travelling. And what is leisure? That concept doesn't exist for me. Is is doing nothing? Is it only doing what one considers non-work? And what does that mean? Is it doing anything that one wouldn't be able to do at work? Does leisure mean hobbies, sitting, watching TV, staring onto space? Leisure is a state of mind not a state of doing any one thing. Maybe leisure means doing the thing you want to do in a particular moment. There is lots I can say about every single point stated above but that is a start. So you disagree with point number 5? Sounds like you don't. Or maybe, like John, you didn't get that far. Maybe you had to pee. :-D Nah, I have an iPad, I can pee and type at the same time. Also, I do disagree with #5. I disagree with the crazy statement, ...but society doesn't seem to like people who enjoy their work. They'd rather hire you for something you hate doing. What is this opinion based on? I thought society was all of us put together. that statement makes it sound like society is some alien force. Nope, I certainly don't agree with #5 whether I'm peeing or not peeing or merely just needing to pee. Based on my experience and others particularly in the tech industry. I have strengths in particular areas but I always seemed to be asked to do things that are skewed away from that. That's partially because most tech companies have naive ideas about what software developers or managers do. When I was managing and hiring I liked to make sure the candidate was a fit and that we weren't asking a round peg to fit into a square hole. Tech recruiters are all about the bucks and waste a lot of time trying to fit a
