[Felvtalk] FW: Felvtalk Digest, Vol 47, Issue 6
Jennifer – I actually answered you yesterday, but the darned email was caught up by the FeLV filter which captures emails that have too long an email trail. I have cut out some of the earlier emails to enable the email to go through (hopefully). Amani From: Amani Oakley Sent: June-10-18 3:22 PM To: 'felvtalk@felineleukemia.org' Subject: RE: [Felvtalk] Felvtalk Digest, Vol 47, Issue 6 What a very sad story about your blind cat. I understand your heart break. I too have placed cats into what I thought were excellent homes, only to have a sad, and an unnecessarily tragic outcome. I have probably adopted out close to 400 cats in the time my husband and I have been rescuing cats. Thankfully, most of the time, people are just really happy to return a cat to me if things aren’t working out, but I know only too well that once out of my hands, you’re at the mercy of what someone else thinks is the right thing to do. Your email to felv talk goes out to everyone on the list at the same time. I will often answer regarding FeLV because I was lucky enough to have stumbled on a medication protocol (which I was calling Zander’s protocol) which treated my Zander’s FeLV when EVERYTHING else had failed. I used to be a medical lab technologist so lab results are key to me. When trying Zander on the various medications that were suggested as assisting with FeLV, I got weekly bloodwork done and would study the results to see which direction his bloodwork was going. Nothing worked at all (Interferon, LTCI, combo of prednisone/Doxy) and I kept him alive with several blood transfusions. When that was no longer an option because he had had a reaction during his last blood transfusion and the next one would kill him, I rummaged around in my drawer of cat meds, and had nothing else at all to try but figured what the hell, and tried him on Winstrol (Stanazalol) which I thought might at least keep him eating and maybe keep him alive a bit longer. To my complete and utter amazement and disbelief, after just a few days on Winstrol, his ivory white gums and inner ears (signs of his profound anemia) started showing a slight pinkish blush. The next blood work (a few days later) showed the first uptick in haematocrit that I had seen with him since the FeLV crisis had begun, which was not brought on by the artificial increase in red cells from his transfusions. I kept him on the combination of prednisone/doxycycline/winstrol for more than a year, while his haematocrit climbed from 10 and back into the normal reference range of 25 to 45. Everytime I tried to stop or reduce the dosage of winstrol, his blood results would show an immediate drop in red cells and haematocrit, so even though his liver enzymes went way up (the reason Winstrol had fallen out of favour with the vets), I really had no choice but to continue since the vets had nothing else to offer me and the alternative was he was going to die from the FeLV infection. He recovered fully, looked marvelous and amazing, ate well, and his liver enzymes went right back to normal once I discontinued the Winstrol – something like 10 months later. No one seemed to know this combination, and the vets I spoke with seemed wary or suspicious that this combination would indeed be helpful in FeLV (except mine – who had of course seen the weekly blood work showing a slow and steady rise in red cells and ultimately, in white cells and platelets, until his entire haematological profile looked perfectly fine). At the time, I was understandably extremely excited by the effects of the Winstrol and I believe that the Winstrol was able to cause the production of new bone marrow cells (something it has been found to do in osteoporotic women) and thus, new cells which could produce the red cells. However, I now also think that the combination worked because the Doxycycline was able to retard or slow down the viral replication, to allow the red cell production to move ahead with less risk that the FeLV would attack the new bone marrow cells. I have been told that the prednisone helps protect the liver from the Winstrol, but I also think that it’s anti-inflammatory properties helped in areas like intestinal inflammation (Zander had lots of trouble eating and keeping the food down). So, I think maybe I by accident stumbled on this combination, but was able to understand what might be happening and why it might have worked, because of my scientific/medical training. Zander lived another 7 years and died from a heart condition which I wondered at the time if it was related, and it might have been, but it probably was that the virus had done a fair amount of damage to certain organs before I was able to get it under control. We loved Zander to a crazy extent, and I sure as hell wanted him with us for longer than 7 years, but given that the vets were telling us there was no hope when he was only six months old, I guess I must just be grateful that
Re: [Felvtalk] Felvtalk Digest, Vol 47, Issue 6
Hi Jennifer, I had an FeLV+ kitty for 5-1/2 years and did not know he was positive because he had tested negative as a kitten when I found him. So during that time he came in contact with many other cats, and none of them became positive. I read that after 11 months of age, it is quite rare for a cat to catch it from a positive friend. Had I known Tigger was positive, I might not have kept him – but I am so very happy I didn’t know it and kept him, because I would never have known how much fun and love he brought to our house! Whatever you decide, my best to you and your little one. I would for sure get him on the Doxy as soon as you can. Ardy From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Jennifer Minnich Sent: Saturday, June 9, 2018 5:19 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Felvtalk Digest, Vol 47, Issue 6 Hi, thank you for replying. It is helpful to talk to someone with experience with this. Sorry to be ignorant but, how do I post where I am? (Not sure what that means). And If I post, is it ok to ‘put it out there’ re: possible home with other felv positives? Esp because I would be willing to help support him which I think makes a difference. we’d love to keep and care for him and this sucks !! but i’m trying to be positive that a plan will happen. He went from hissy street cat to curling up in my lap. Urg! I’d worry with someone else unless it was someone with experience, or like u said non cat crazy people but compassionate and committed. We discussed it a few times and just would not be comfortable with the risk of coMingling them unfortunately,-:( which sucks. Or the whole vaccination thing b/c with multiple other cats it’ll be too much craziness plus not even sure of efficacy, or side effects. That leaves me with leaving him separated and constantly trying to be sterilized on our end which seems cumbersome and I’m not so sure fair to him to be isolated all the time. OR the only cat. OR in a multi pos. home (prob. preferrable b/c someone would know how to treat him). OR putting him back outside which doesn’t seem best for him. I can imagine there are times it works out ok to comingle yes, where it can be ok vs ‘oh my gosh no don’t do that’. That is what happened with my FIV cat which is a long story but bottom line after research and talking to folks it was an ok fit b/c no one were fighters. felv is different. I have known others (individuals or rescues) where exposure of different things had bad outcomes. I guess it’s a matter of variables, situations and/or luck. Sounds like you have been fortunate which is awesome. (Thanks for ALL u do to help the felines-:) I got the antibiotic before seeing this. I am familiar with doxy and thought that’s what he’d give, but it was Orbax (Orbifloxacin). Are U familiar? When i got it I asked front desk if it was as strong as doxy and she said yes and that it’s broad spectrum antibiotic. Thoughts? Are u familiar with Collodial Silver? If not I can send the link. I was recommended this yesterday for use for people and cats or other animals. Cat person said she uses all the time for different things from bacterial infections to URI’s. It’s a natural antibiotic. It lists as an option for stomatitis and felv use so I imagine it cannot hurt, in basic doses. (supposed to be good for many things including inflammation and immune-building). I plan to give him that and the antibiotic; was ok with vet . With ur experience and what u’ve heard (he’s between 5-7 yrs. old they say; to be neutered in couple weeks; 10lbs (needs gain some); Bad stomatitis (i’ll send pic if u want ): A) what’s ur feeling about putting him back outside?(I’ve never done that; he could get by but My feeling is he shouldn’t be in the elements and would do better inside)—- just not sure what will happen if there are no other good options. B) at that age and what you are hearing... any sense of lifespan? (I know it’s hard to say but was guessing 2-4 years or up to a year). my vet said oldest one he knew of was patient’s who lived to 8y/o. What’s ur feeling of assessing if he could last a while or if things could go south quickly?? I guess i’m trying to imagine how long or short term the commitment may be. C). He would def . seem to have felv by way of strong stain and stomatitis. In doing some research, I wonder about the confirmTory IFA test. It seems if it’s pos. too, that it’s in the bone marrow and no chance shedding it. Thanks! Jennifer On Jun 9,r 2018, at 1:24 PM, Amani Oakley mailto:aoak...@oakleylegal.com> > wrote: Jennifer – from your area code, you are no where near me. You need to post where you are. Can I also suggest you get your vet to start him on doxycycline – 50 mg. daily, for an extended treatment period like 6 weeks. As long as he isn’t
Re: [Felvtalk] Felvtalk Digest, Vol 47, Issue 6
Hi Amani, hope you received the email below-:) Will wait to hear back re: email address inquiry; in the meanwhile, i plan to see how he’s doing in the next couple weeks; i may have a temp. foster not sure yet; would appreciate the opportunity for local group outreach if needed. He’s been in my bathroom the past few days and seemed to be doing pretty good; tonight he’s squinting an eye - any experience with that with your felv’s? (I put a sissel scratchpad in with him yesterday which is awefully concidental this started today, so I kind of wonder if he’s allergic or got any of it in his eyes, or if it’s the meds or Felv separately related). Will see how he is in the morning and go from there. Thank u, JennifEr > On Jun 10, 2018, at 6:53 AM, Jennifer Minnich > wrote: > > Thanks so much Amani. What an amazing global group. Very awesome to have > such support for folks and these cats, everywhere! > > Amani, when I am emailing you now, is it going out to the group or just you? > For example, is there a different email I should be using. Please let me > know, and then I’ll > have the hang of it, thanks!-:) > > I really appreciate ur time, compassion, and advice and communication. I will > keep in mind the advice on the doxy for sure. > > Our understanding predominantly is that FIV is via bite wounds, where my > experience with one cat who fortunately wasn’t aggressive and fit with the > environment. > My understanding with Felv is via bites as well also general contact. With > so much contraversy about it, it’s very interesting from what u share how > some seem to spread or get it while others don’t like life, a continual > learning process for me.. > > Canada wow - I am in south florida and long story short I flew with a special > needs senior blind cat I rescued and rehabbed to his furrever home in canada. > He was purrfectly fine when I left him there (and yes I was very attached b/c > I knew everything about him) (only reason I decided to home him was b/c I had > a sick older cat and I feared it may stress her, and that he may have been > better off.he was an amazing special soul!!! Very special. I settled > him in for a few says all was fine; But 3 weeks later he took a crazy turn > where he was worse off than when I first found him (and he was bad off with > broken pelvis), and, they euthanized-:( my heart still and always will hurt > over it. They were nice people and good animal people with good intentions > but IMO made mistakes and would not heed my advice for transitioning him. > Rushed it with their other animals which freaked him out; he fell off the > bed, yada yada. They said he had cancer. Based on what I’d ask? No answer. > Anything may have been b/c he too was community cat with unknown background, > altho all his same tests I had from a month prior were fine. I asked > (begged) to share his medical records which aside from my own edification, I > felt his story and whatever caused his demise, could Really help other cats > somehow. His story was extraordinary, as was/is he. So for it to end that way > and be ignored as to why, was cruel and unjust. Like if nothing to hide, why > not share the records. To this day a year and half later I still wish I had > them for some kind of closure, not only for me but his story in order to help > other cats in similar situations. Sorry I strayed (no punn intended Lol) > from the topic. > > Like you said, and you have much more experience, about putting them back > out, esp. being vulnerable/sick and after they’ve experienced love. > > Jennifer > > >> On Jun 10, 2018, at 12:20 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: >> >> Hi Jennifer >> >> There are people in this group from all over the U.S. (New York, Texas, >> Wisconsin, California, etc.) and all around the world (Canada – me!; Brazil, >> Italy, South Africa), so I just meant that if you tell us in your email, >> approximately where you’re located, there may be people near you who might >> be willing to help out with your cat. >> >> In my personal opinion, once you’ve taken the time and care to tame down a >> feral, as you have clearly done, I would never put them back out on the >> street. But maybe that’s why I’m up to 18 cats now! I just think that once >> they know what it’s like to be warm and clean and loved, it is just too >> terrible to put them back outside again. >> >> Frankly, of the two conditions, it is the FIV which is more contagious so if >> you’ve had experience with that, and it turned out okay, in my experience, >> it won’t be the FeLV that causes a problem, unless you have kittens in your >> house. Adult cats can end up testing positive for FeLV, but it doesn’t do >> anything to them. I agree with you that you should try hard to find him >> another home, but if all else fails, please consider keeping him. It sounds >> like you’ve done just a wonderful thing for him, and he