Re: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
On 23.02.2007 Darcy James Argue wrote: The default Mixer setting is determined by Finale. I believe it used to be lower when using GPO instruments (in Fin2006a and up), but for some reason it got set back to 101 again for Finale 2007, which is much too high. Strictly speaking, this is a Finale problem, not a Garritan problem, though I agree that the two companies could do a much better job of trying to get their products to work together for better out-of-the-box results. I wasn't blaming GPO. The Ambience reverb is actually a third-party product licensed by Garritan. I have no idea why the default presets are so poorly designed, but it's easy to create and save your own presets. The point is, it should work out of the box. It doesn't. It's poor design, and it is too much hassle for me to even get a reasonable result most of the time. So I rarely use GPO. Once a year at most. Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Army Music (Way OT)
But in the U.S. Army the flag isn't lowered or raised without the bugle call To The Colors. Retreat just signals the end of the official day and the start of evening activities. David H. Bailey Michael Pilgrim wrote: http://www.usscouts.org/mb/bugle_calls.html To the Colors seems a little perky. Perhaps it was Retreat (signaling the end of the official day)? Hope you find it. Mike Pilgrim (at the end of his official day) At 03:53 PM 2/22/2007 -0800, you wrote: Among many repressible memories of my days at Ft. Ord, CA ... I can remember that, at that post at least, stopping what ever training we were doing at 1700, I believe, to face the direction of the nearest American flag and listening to music while it was lowered. I can't remember if it was a particular bugle call, or the National Anthem. I know it was not Taps, 'cause that came later, just before lights out, when I would always shout out, The thinking lamp is now lit! (not popular with the platoon sgt.). I just recall it being a gentle, calming experience after a long day of running up and down sand hills, and inserting my bayonet into the rubber ribs of a dummy. Anybody remember what said music was? Dean M. Estabrook http://deanestabrook.googlepages.com/home Power embraces greed and abjurs justice ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.441 / Virus Database: 268.18.3/697 - Release Date: 2/22/2007 11:55 AM -- David H. Bailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
Hi Johannes, I basically agree, and this is something I've been trying to impress upon Tom and Gary. But their vision of the typical GPO customer is very different from yours and mine. The library is beloved by sequencer-based tweakers because it's inexpensive and highly customizable. At the same time, it's an uneasy fit with notation software because of many of the problems you describe. Robert P.'s Human Playback goes a long way towards bridging the gap, but he can't do everything. At some point (hopefully sooner rather than later), Garritan have to get serious about making their products (or at least, the Notation versions) work better out of the box, and MakeMusic need to meet them halfway. However, this is one area where Finale is actually currently much better than Sibelius. It would be nice to see MM try to widen their lead in the areas where they have a lead, rather than always trying to play catch-up. - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY On 23 Feb 2007, at 5:38 AM, Johannes Gebauer wrote: The point is, it should work out of the box. It doesn't. It's poor design, and it is too much hassle for me to even get a reasonable result most of the time. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
Darcy James Argue wrote: [snip] However, this is one area where Finale is actually currently much better than Sibelius. It would be nice to see MM try to widen their lead in the areas where they have a lead, rather than always trying to play catch-up. [snip] Yes, indeed. GPO for Sibelius is an extra-cost add-on currently. I'm sure Sibelius is close to version 5 (it's been a year and a half since version 4, and that came out a year and a half after version 3), so it will be very interesting to see if they wrap SibGPO into the package, and will also be interesting to see how the integrate it. Of course, Sibelius was already interlocked with Kontakt, offering Kontakt Silver as a playback engine included with the package and Kontakt Gold as an extra-cost upgrade, so apparently adding GPO is a fairly easy thing, but I don't think many Sib users have made the plunge. At least there hasn't been much discussion of it on the Sib list. I agree that MM should try to widen their leads over Sib in those areas where it has the leads, and they should publicize those things. Not in a We're better than Sibelius in these ways . . . but in a more generic The leading notation software package should be able to do the following, and Finale can do all that right out of the box. No other notation software can make that claim. Then they should list all the things Finale can do which Sibelius can't do. No matter how much I like GPO or not, I will admit that when I have used it (for small ensembles, not having a computer with enough power to do a full score with GPO) it has been easy and done well. Another way I have found to prevent clipping in GPO is to simply lower the output volume on my soundcard by using the speaker icon in the systray. It's always visible and easy to adjust. -- David H. Bailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
On 23 Feb 2007, at 6:14 AM, dhbailey wrote: Another way I have found to prevent clipping in GPO is to simply lower the output volume on my soundcard by using the speaker icon in the systray. It's always visible and easy to adjust. That's not generally an effective way to solve the problem. In fact, if the output volume from FInale+GPO is already where you want it, you will generally want to INCREASE your system volume (or external speaker volume) to make up for the corresponding decrease in Finale's mixer. Even when my system volume is up all the way, Fin+GPO doesn't clip. But when the volume in Finale's Mixer is set above 80, lowering the system volume doesn't do anything to solve the clipping problem -- it will clip even at the softest setting. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
As I have been doing almost nothing with Finale for the past year but trying to get a handle on the Garritan/Finale experience, here's my take. (Yes; there is a master fader on the Mixer; see under the View menu) A lot of the problem I found with balance and levels is in the creation of the Finale doc, when you assign the staff score expressions (dynamics), also the slurs do have an impact, and naturally the hairpins, which have a global setting under the Human Playback window. What I have found gives you more flexibility and control is to set the basic velocity for all staves at 64; leave the Finale defaults for velocity where they are on all the expressions. Set the HP hairpin percentage to somewhere between 19 and 30 percent, depending on the charachter of your piece and how short or long the length of your hairpins are. When necessary, go into the midi tool and edit velocities on individual notes. Keep the channel volume at 101 for most staves, and do not exceed! This will likely cause some nasty clipping when it gets to a busy section of the score. Generally, it is more helpful to keep them all the same and adjust the dynamics of the individual staves via expressions and hairpins, etc., and as the very last compensation for balance, if need be, change your output volume setting (lower, never above 101). (Unfortunately, the channel LED volume indicator is not sensitive enough to respond to small incremental increases in volume, so you can't judge by their activity whether or not the levels are approaching too hot; there is also no clip indicator anywhere in Finale to let you know you've hit the ceiling. When the default expressions (mf, mp, etc.) are not appropriate for what's desired, (either to much or too little), create a copy and change the name from mp to poco mp and drop the velocity value to split the difference between p and mp. It helps control the spiking of the levels and will actually give you more of a subtle realistic change in dynamics overall. Above all else, realize that 4 trumpets in the upper third of their range at pp would likely be equal to a several winds at mp, and the density of the score has caused me to go back and lower dynamic levels all over the place to get the desired balance. I used to start off a lot of the stuff I've been working on with a mf marking, thinking that a moderate volume was what I would get. However, the velocity has a dramatic effect on the timbre of the Garritan samples, and there being no EQ in Finale to bring out any of the upper mid or higher frequencies, a lot of the sound is muffled, so you do not get a realistic idea of the potency of the dynamic you have assigned. I have to output everything as a sound file (sometimes one staff at a time, SAVE AS SPECIAL .wav, .iaff reverses the stereo imaging somehow) and import into Soundtrack or some audio editing software (Logic, etc.), apply some EQ and then listen to find out what I need to go back and change in Finale. For a while, I didn't get picayune in the Finale doc, assuming I could fix in the mix, but that just doesn't work and becomes extremely labor intensive with generally unsatisfactory results. The unwelcome news is while in Finale, you need to solve all problems, sometimes on a note by note basis (with the midi tool to edit velocities and durations) to really make the resultant performance sound even close to real. There is also another phenomenon with playback that can lead you believe that the sound is clipping: How much music are your attempting to play and how jammed is the CPU on your computer? If you have reverb enabled, it also make huge demands on the computer and will cause clicks and distortion if the brain is getting overwhelmed with data. This combo of Finale Garritan is ram hungry, and CPU intensive. I am using a pre-Intel Mac G5 Dual Core 2.0 Ghz with 5.5 GB of ram, and the CPU gets loaded at around 80% (and the sound starts deteriorating badly) when I try to play back a busy 12-piece ensemble (with the reverb quality set low so as to conserve processing power). I can't play a complete orchestration for symphony sized ensemble with out complete deterioration where there is any appreciable activity in all the sections. After much consultation with Native Instruments, Make Music, Apple, Berkelee College music dept., and Gary Garritan, the standard practice is to freeze tracks and import the saved files into an audio software app. as I described above. The other alternative is to do what I was told they do in Hollywood for film work; daisy chain/network several high powered PC's/Macs together, each one taking a part of the processing tasks to get real-time live playback. By the way, for all this is have been using Finale 2K6, sys software 10.4.6, and I have had insurmountable problems with Fin 2K7 playback which I have yet to solve with MakeMusic (in the process now; it crashes repeatedly while loading the Garritan samples, and if they do successfully load, playback is
Re: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
Please: can we all arrange to have a sit down meeting with Gary, whomever is the power at MakeMusic, and a rep from NI and testify to what is need to propel this method of composing and creating digital realizations to the absolute top of the mountain? The potential is astounding, and much can be done now, but it is unpredictable, labor intensive, and generally very frustrating. If these issues were addressed head on and improved or eliminated, this would be the ultimate platform for notation and recording! (I already told MakeMusic they should start a partnership with Apple to provide a notation interface for GarageBand and increase the Finale user base by zillions. This would also challenge Garritan NI to work harder with MM to stay in the game.) Hi Johannes, I basically agree, and this is something I've been trying to impress upon Tom and Gary. But their vision of the typical GPO customer is very different from yours and mine. The library is beloved by sequencer-based tweakers because it's inexpensive and highly customizable. At the same time, it's an uneasy fit with notation software because of many of the problems you describe. Robert P.'s Human Playback goes a long way towards bridging the gap, but he can't do everything. At some point (hopefully sooner rather than later), Garritan have to get serious about making their products (or at least, the Notation versions) work better out of the box, and MakeMusic need to meet them halfway. However, this is one area where Finale is actually currently much better than Sibelius. It would be nice to see MM try to widen their lead in the areas where they have a lead, rather than always trying to play catch-up. - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY On 23 Feb 2007, at 5:38 AM, Johannes Gebauer wrote: The point is, it should work out of the box. It doesn't. It's poor design, and it is too much hassle for me to even get a reasonable result most of the time. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
On 23.02.2007 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (I already told MakeMusic they should start a partnership with Apple to provide a notation interface for GarageBand and increase the Finale user base by zillions. This would also challenge Garritan NI to work harder with MM to stay in the game.) I really do not want any of this. The result of this would undoubtedly be a living room music printing thing which would be utterly useless for serious engraving. That in itself wouldn't be a problem, but this would also mean that MakeMusic will spend development time on this thing, withdrawing even more from the serious Finale. It would also introduce even more bugs into the common code base, and we really have enough of those already. The Finale user base would not be increased by anything like this. Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] TAN: Distiller problems
Is it normal that Distiller includes fonts many many times in the resulting PDFs, even though I specifically told it to not include subsets? Also can one of you Acrobat experts tell me a setting which will work for publication ready PDFs? I used to use PStill, and actually prefer it by far over Acrobat, but I just found a rather major problem with it (the New Century Schoolbook letter o is always distorted, no matter what i do). Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re(2): [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
Darcy, Thanks for the reminder about the Mixer window and your tutorial. It's clearly time to re-read it. Pulling down the Master did the trick. Vern, Your suggestions were also helpful. I'm not going for total realism, just renderings of sketches for myself and my musicians. I was very glad to hear that you were also having frequent crashes with 2007. I've had them too and already wasted a lot of time dealing with them. What's the easiest way to go back to 2006 from 2007? **Leigh On Fri, Feb 23, 2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: By the way, for all this is have been using Finale 2K6, sys software 10.4.6, and I have had insurmountable problems with Fin 2K7 playback which I have yet to solve with MakeMusic (in the process now; it crashes repeatedly while loading the Garritan samples, and if they do successfully load, playback is unpredictable and it crashes during editing of the notes, playback, or sometimes just doing a Save. not even a little bit fun.), so I have stayed with 2K6 as it works like a charm. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
Johannes: I have to agree; it was a unenlightened suggestion; as you say, more living room stuff is not what's needed, but a serious professional high end FUNCTIONING system would be brilliant and without equal. On 23.02.2007 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (I already told MakeMusic they should start a partnership with Apple to provide a notation interface for GarageBand and increase the Finale user base by zillions. This would also challenge Garritan NI to work harder with MM to stay in the game.) I really do not want any of this. The result of this would undoubtedly be a living room music printing thing which would be utterly useless for serious engraving. That in itself wouldn't be a problem, but this would also mean that MakeMusic will spend development time on this thing, withdrawing even more from the serious Finale. It would also introduce even more bugs into the common code base, and we really have enough of those already. The Finale user base would not be increased by anything like this. Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: Re(2): [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
I never took 2K6 off the machine, and I didn't uninstall 2K7 as I intend to start installing the revs until I can get it to work well, but there's no way to rescue your 2K7 docs and get them to open in Fin 2K6, as far as I know. I don't think saving in 2K7 as an ETF file will work either. Anyone have any insights here? Darcy, Thanks for the reminder about the Mixer window and your tutorial. It's clearly time to re-read it. Pulling down the Master did the trick. Vern, Your suggestions were also helpful. I'm not going for total realism, just renderings of sketches for myself and my musicians. I was very glad to hear that you were also having frequent crashes with 2007. I've had them too and already wasted a lot of time dealing with them. What's the easiest way to go back to 2006 from 2007? **Leigh On Fri, Feb 23, 2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: By the way, for all this is have been using Finale 2K6, sys software 10.4.6, and I have had insurmountable problems with Fin 2K7 playback which I have yet to solve with MakeMusic (in the process now; it crashes repeatedly while loading the Garritan samples, and if they do successfully load, playback is unpredictable and it crashes during editing of the notes, playback, or sometimes just doing a Save. not even a little bit fun.), so I have stayed with 2K6 as it works like a charm. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
RE: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
They are well aware of the issue on both sides. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Fri 23-Feb-07 9:49 To: finale@shsu.edu Subject: Re: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High Please: can we all arrange to have a sit down meeting with Gary, whomever is the power at MakeMusic, and a rep from NI and testify to what is need to propel this method of composing and creating digital realizations to the absolute top of the mountain? The potential is astounding, and much can be done now, but it is unpredictable, labor intensive, and generally very frustrating. If these issues were addressed head on and improved or eliminated, this would be the ultimate platform for notation and recording! (I already told MakeMusic they should start a partnership with Apple to provide a notation interface for GarageBand and increase the Finale user base by zillions. This would also challenge Garritan NI to work harder with MM to stay in the game.) Hi Johannes, I basically agree, and this is something I've been trying to impress upon Tom and Gary. But their vision of the typical GPO customer is very different from yours and mine. The library is beloved by sequencer-based tweakers because it's inexpensive and highly customizable. At the same time, it's an uneasy fit with notation software because of many of the problems you describe. Robert P.'s Human Playback goes a long way towards bridging the gap, but he can't do everything. At some point (hopefully sooner rather than later), Garritan have to get serious about making their products (or at least, the Notation versions) work better out of the box, and MakeMusic need to meet them halfway. However, this is one area where Finale is actually currently much better than Sibelius. It would be nice to see MM try to widen their lead in the areas where they have a lead, rather than always trying to play catch-up. - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY On 23 Feb 2007, at 5:38 AM, Johannes Gebauer wrote: The point is, it should work out of the box. It doesn't. It's poor design, and it is too much hassle for me to even get a reasonable result most of the time. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] TAN: Distiller problems
At 04:04 PM 2/23/2007 +0100, Johannes Gebauer wrote: Is it normal that Distiller includes fonts many many times in the resulting PDFs, even though I specifically told it to not include subsets? Did you print to PS or compile Postscript? Now that compile Postscript works in Windows on special sizes (9.25x12.17), the resulting files are compact, and Distilling them with Ghostscript produces small PDFs. It still appears the fonts are shown multiple times in the Postscript, but the resulting PDF has them only one time each. On the other hand, in printing to Postscript and distilling, the PDF files can be huge. I have no idea if these sizes are caused by multiple font embeds. Dennis ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
It's no secret that Garritan are planning their own sample playback software, as an alternative to/replacement for the Kontakt Player. If they pull it off, this could be a very good thing. Having fewer companies involved makes integration easier, and Native Instruments software has been nothing but trouble from the start, especially on the Mac. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY On 23 Feb 2007, at 10:26 AM, Williams, Jim wrote: They are well aware of the issue on both sides. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Fri 23-Feb-07 9:49 To: finale@shsu.edu Subject: Re: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High Please: can we all arrange to have a sit down meeting with Gary, whomever is the power at MakeMusic, and a rep from NI and testify to what is need to propel this method of composing and creating digital realizations to the absolute top of the mountain? The potential is astounding, and much can be done now, but it is unpredictable, labor intensive, and generally very frustrating. If these issues were addressed head on and improved or eliminated, this would be the ultimate platform for notation and recording! (I already told MakeMusic they should start a partnership with Apple to provide a notation interface for GarageBand and increase the Finale user base by zillions. This would also challenge Garritan NI to work harder with MM to stay in the game.) Hi Johannes, I basically agree, and this is something I've been trying to impress upon Tom and Gary. But their vision of the typical GPO customer is very different from yours and mine. The library is beloved by sequencer-based tweakers because it's inexpensive and highly customizable. At the same time, it's an uneasy fit with notation software because of many of the problems you describe. Robert P.'s Human Playback goes a long way towards bridging the gap, but he can't do everything. At some point (hopefully sooner rather than later), Garritan have to get serious about making their products (or at least, the Notation versions) work better out of the box, and MakeMusic need to meet them halfway. However, this is one area where Finale is actually currently much better than Sibelius. It would be nice to see MM try to widen their lead in the areas where they have a lead, rather than always trying to play catch-up. - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY On 23 Feb 2007, at 5:38 AM, Johannes Gebauer wrote: The point is, it should work out of the box. It doesn't. It's poor design, and it is too much hassle for me to even get a reasonable result most of the time. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] TAN: Distiller problems
On 23.02.2007 Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote: At 04:04 PM 2/23/2007 +0100, Johannes Gebauer wrote: Is it normal that Distiller includes fonts many many times in the resulting PDFs, even though I specifically told it to not include subsets? Did you print to PS or compile Postscript? Now that compile Postscript works in Windows on special sizes (9.25x12.17), the resulting files are compact, and Distilling them with Ghostscript produces small PDFs. It still appears the fonts are shown multiple times in the Postscript, but the resulting PDF has them only one time each. On the other hand, in printing to Postscript and distilling, the PDF files can be huge. I have no idea if these sizes are caused by multiple font embeds. Sorry, I should have mentioned I am on Mac, we don't have the PDF problems when printing to PS, or in fact using the Distiller printer driver. Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Army Music (Way OT)
Ah, so there may have been two calls played ... that rings a distant bell in my brain. I don't recall how To the colors went at all, though. Thanks, Dean On Feb 22, 2007, at 4:47 PM, dhbailey wrote: David W. Fenton wrote: On 22 Feb 2007 at 15:53, Dean M. Estabrook wrote: Among many repressible memories of my days at Ft. Ord, CA ... I can remember that, at that post at least, stopping what ever training we were doing at 1700, I believe, to face the direction of the nearest American flag and listening to music while it was lowered. I can't remember if it was a particular bugle call, or the National Anthem. I know it was not Taps, 'cause that came later, just before lights out, when I would always shout out, The thinking lamp is now lit! (not popular with the platoon sgt.). I just recall it being a gentle, calming experience after a long day of running up and down sand hills, and inserting my bayonet into the rubber ribs of a dummy. Anybody remember what said music was? Er, retreat? That would be the appropriate bugle call, no? http://www.dfenton.com/images/Retreat.png When I was the assistant music director for Illinois's Boys State program, we used a lovely 3-part arrangement of it. I don't recall who did it, but it was a tiny little booklet with all the bugle calls in it, written by an Army veteran. At the end of the day it would be Retreat, followed by To The Colors as the flag was lowered. -- David H. Bailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Dean M. Estabrook http://deanestabrook.googlepages.com/home Power embraces greed and abjurs justice ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
Second that ... the tutorial has saved me many hours of work. I find that the master volume on the mixer works best at no more than about 64. Dean On Feb 22, 2007, at 7:58 PM, Darcy James Argue wrote: Hi Leigh, In both Finale 2006 and 2007, there is a Mixer (Window - Mixer), where you can (and should) reduce the Master volume so GPO doesn't clip. Just a friendly reminder that this is one of the tips I give in my Garritan Instruments tutorial, called GPOHP Tutorial Supplement.pdf, and found in your User Manual folder (provided you have an up-to-date version of Finale 2006 or Finale 2007). Not to be too self-promotional, but I would recommend that anyone using Garritan instruments consult this document. Of course, I also welcome feedback about how to improve the tutorial for next year. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY On 22 Feb 2007, at 10:21 PM, Leigh Daniels wrote: Hello All, I've got a piece using the viola from full GPO and trombone, bass and piano from JABB. When I play back the piece, the sections where the music is the loundest (the viola and trombone are fff), the result is too loud and I get clipping distortion. Is there anything like a master fader that I could use to pull down the overall output volume so it doesn't clip? Thanks! **Leigh ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Dean M. Estabrook http://deanestabrook.googlepages.com/home Power embraces greed and abjurs justice ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Army Music (Way OT)
You know, now I'm thinking it could have been To the colors, (now that I've seen a score), followed by the national anthem. I appreciate all the responses. Dean On Feb 22, 2007, at 6:53 PM, Roger Cain wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michael Pilgrim Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 7:41 PM To: finale@shsu.edu Subject: Re: [Finale] Army Music (Way OT) http://www.usscouts.org/mb/bugle_calls.html To the Colors seems a little perky. Perhaps it was Retreat (signaling the end of the official day)? Hope you find it. Mike Pilgrim (at the end of his official day) At 03:53 PM 2/22/2007 -0800, you wrote: Among many repressible memories of my days at Ft. Ord, CA ... I can .. Anybody remember what said music was? Dean M. Estabrook http://deanestabrook.googlepages.com/home Power embraces greed and abjurs justice Two Bugle Calls: To the Color (singular): Parade Rest (as I recall) And Retreat: (attention present arms) Roger ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Dean M. Estabrook http://deanestabrook.googlepages.com/home Power embraces greed and abjurs justice ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re(4): [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
I answered my own question--deadlines do that! In 2007, I exported to MusicXML. In 2006, I re-created the meter structure of the piece in a new document and imported the XML into another new 2006 document. In 2006 I used the Mass Mover to drag the parts to the appropriate staves from the XML document to the new document with the recreated the meter structure. This worked well except that the dynamics and some articulations (fermata, chord rolls) and the chord symbols appeared in the wrong font. Everything else seemed fine. These are minor inconveniences compared to all the crashing with 2007c. **Leigh On Fri, Feb 23, 2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I never took 2K6 off the machine, and I didn't uninstall 2K7 as I intend to start installing the revs until I can get it to work well, but there's no way to rescue your 2K7 docs and get them to open in Fin 2K6, as far as I know. I don't think saving in 2K7 as an ETF file will work either. Anyone have any insights here? ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
Darcy ... I didn't catch it in the tutorial, does it explain how to save the presets on the Ambiance Reverb? Dean On Feb 22, 2007, at 11:46 PM, Darcy James Argue wrote: Hi Johannes, The default Mixer setting is determined by Finale. I believe it used to be lower when using GPO instruments (in Fin2006a and up), but for some reason it got set back to 101 again for Finale 2007, which is much too high. Strictly speaking, this is a Finale problem, not a Garritan problem, though I agree that the two companies could do a much better job of trying to get their products to work together for better out-of-the-box results. The Ambience reverb is actually a third-party product licensed by Garritan. I have no idea why the default presets are so poorly designed, but it's easy to create and save your own presets. But at least you, as a PPC Mac user, can actually use Ambience! It's (still) not compatible with Intel Macs at all, and I have no idea if it ever will be. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY On 23 Feb 2007, at 2:26 AM, Johannes Gebauer wrote: On 23.02.2007 Darcy James Argue wrote: In both Finale 2006 and 2007, there is a Mixer (Window - Mixer), where you can (and should) reduce the Master volume so GPO doesn't clip. Just a friendly reminder that this is one of the tips I give in my Garritan Instruments tutorial, called GPOHP Tutorial Supplement.pdf, and found in your User Manual folder (provided you have an up-to-date version of Finale 2006 or Finale 2007). On the other hand it is a disgrace that clipping happens at all unless the fader is pulled down. It is not my main problem with GPO playback in Finale but it is one of those things which makes working with GPO playback a negative experience for me. I hardly ever use it these days because there are so many things which don't work out of the box. To give just one more example: The Ambience reverb presets on the Mac all revert to 0% dry, 100% wet, 100% quality. The only way to use it is to set it to 100% dry and quality of no more than 50% (otherwise the processor explodes). Why do I have to set this every time myself? Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Dean M. Estabrook http://deanestabrook.googlepages.com/home Power embraces greed and abjurs justice ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] fermate on single-line percussion staves
On Feb 22, 2007, at 9:00 PM, Aaron Rabushka wrote: It seems that every time I try to put a fermata on top of a single- line percussion staff Finale moves it to the bottom of the staff by the time I revisit it. I've set the articulation to use the top form regardless of where the note is placed, and I still get the same result. Is there some trick that I need to be aware of here? Have you tried flipping the stem direction? You should be able to place the fermata where you want regardless of stem, but that might be what's making it bounce around. If it's a whole note or other stemless note, you wouldn't even see the stem, but the note is still assigned an up or down direction internally. mdl ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Finale 2005, 2004 can't be registered on Intel Macs
Hey all, I don't recall this topic being discussed on the Finale list before, so I thought I'd draw everyone's attention to it now: Versions of Finale prior to MacFin2006d CANNOT be registered on Intel- based Macs. That means that if you purchase a new Mac (as I recently did), you cannot run Finale 2005 or 2004 on it. I knew that I would be unable to run versions of Finale prior to Finale 2004 because of the lack of Classic support on Intel Macs, but the inability to run Fin2004 and Fin2005 is *entirely* due to MakeMusic's copy protection scheme. If the copy protection didn't exist, they would run acceptably under Rosetta, as Finale 2006 does. But Finale's Registration Wizard needs to be patched to run on Intel Macs. A decision was made to make this patch available for Finale 2006 (which runs under Rosetta), but not earlier versions of Finale. I just got off the phone with MM Customer Support, who agreed (reluctantly) to pass on my request that earlier versions also get this patch, so that they too can be used on Intel Macs, but his argument was basically that this ship had already sailed -- MM have decided they have no intention to support Finale 2004 or Finale 2005 on Intel Macs. I told him I just wanted to be able to launch the old versions, and I don't care whether they are supported or not. He said if they release a patch that allows those versions to be installed, that implies support. I'm quite upset about this. I had no idea this would be a problem when I bought my MacBook Pro. Having Finale 2004 and 2005 locked out on this machine hits me in the pocketbook -- hard. Many of my copying clients require that work be done in older versions of Finale, and now that's work I have to turn down. And, of course, opening documents created in older versions of Finale in a newer version inevitably introduces problems that require considerable proofreading to catch. I don't believe there is any legitimate reason for MakeMusic to disallow Intel Mac users from installing Finale 2004/ 2005 and running them under Rosetta. This will be an ongoing problem for MakeMusic as users gradually replace their PPC Macs with Intel Macs, and then wonder why they suddenly can't register Finale on their new machines. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] TAN: Distiller problems
At 05:10 PM 2/23/2007 +0100, Johannes Gebauer wrote: Sorry, I should have mentioned I am on Mac, we don't have the PDF problems when printing to PS, or in fact using the Distiller printer driver. I knew you were on a Mac, but is there no separate compile Postscript listing? I'm just suggesting you try it to see if the files are different. They are massively different from printing to PS or PDF on Windows. Dennis ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] fermate on single-line percussion staves
Thanks for the reply, Mark. I am trying to put the fermate over rests. How do I flip their stems? Aaron J. Rabushka [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://users.waymark.net/arabushk - Original Message - From: Mark D Lew [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: finale@shsu.edu Sent: Friday, February 23, 2007 11:04 AM Subject: Re: [Finale] fermate on single-line percussion staves On Feb 22, 2007, at 9:00 PM, Aaron Rabushka wrote: It seems that every time I try to put a fermata on top of a single- line percussion staff Finale moves it to the bottom of the staff by the time I revisit it. I've set the articulation to use the top form regardless of where the note is placed, and I still get the same result. Is there some trick that I need to be aware of here? Have you tried flipping the stem direction? You should be able to place the fermata where you want regardless of stem, but that might be what's making it bounce around. If it's a whole note or other stemless note, you wouldn't even see the stem, but the note is still assigned an up or down direction internally. mdl ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Finale 2005, 2004 can't be registered on Intel Macs
Darcy James Argue wrote: Versions of Finale prior to MacFin2006d CANNOT be registered on Intel- based Macs. I've been warning about this for some time. Infuriatin' idn'it? A direct consequence of the tethered copy protection many so blythely accepted a few years back. (Not that any of us really had a choice, other than Win and/or Sibelius.) The biggest irony is that I believe there is a 3rd party program for Intel macs that emulates Classic thru I believe System 9.0-something. It is quite likely you can run Fin03 and earlier on that. Perhaps eventually even Fin04 in OS9 mode. Makemusic has zero incentive to support Fin04 or Fin05 under Rosetta. Write those versions off before you get too much heartburn. I did long since. If your work really depends on them, hang on to (or buy if you don't still have) an old PPC laptop. -- Robert Patterson http://RobertGPatterson.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] OFFLIST Finale 2005, 2004 can't be registered on Intel Macs
Hi Robert, I actually haven't eBay'd my G4 Mac mini yet -- just haven't gotten around to it. I guess I'll be keeping it now, since it will easily be worth the $350 or so I'd get for it. Lucky break. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY On 23 Feb 2007, at 12:43 PM, Robert Patterson wrote: Darcy James Argue wrote: Versions of Finale prior to MacFin2006d CANNOT be registered on Intel- based Macs. I've been warning about this for some time. Infuriatin' idn'it? A direct consequence of the tethered copy protection many so blythely accepted a few years back. (Not that any of us really had a choice, other than Win and/or Sibelius.) The biggest irony is that I believe there is a 3rd party program for Intel macs that emulates Classic thru I believe System 9.0- something. It is quite likely you can run Fin03 and earlier on that. Perhaps eventually even Fin04 in OS9 mode. Makemusic has zero incentive to support Fin04 or Fin05 under Rosetta. Write those versions off before you get too much heartburn. I did long since. If your work really depends on them, hang on to (or buy if you don't still have) an old PPC laptop. -- Robert Patterson http://RobertGPatterson.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Finale 2005, 2004 can't be registered on Intel Macs
Well, that wasn't very offlist, was it. Oh well, nothing all that private. - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Plugin Power
Matthew Hindson fastmail acct wrote: I will have to go to Sibelius very soon (publisher reasons) but the ease of use combined with sheer power of your plugins are forcing me to thoroughly investigate how I can stick with Finale. They're that good! I hope you will let Makemusic know that plugin power is a major factor keeping you clinging to Finale if at all possible. Makemusic has begun to marginalize plugins. Thru Fin05, plugins had low-level, essentially unfettered access to most of the raw data. This meant that plugin developers were not dependent on Makemusic for their innovations. Plugin developers were free to think outside Makemusic's box and occasionally they could even offer alternatives to some of their many poor choices. Starting with Fin06, that low-level access began to evaporate as follows. 1. In Fin06 they changed the internal format of text blocks but failed to make that format available to plugins. Instead, when plugins access text blocks, Finale converts the internal format to the old format. This could turn out to be very bad for plugins if and when Finale finally supports Unicode natively. 2. Fin06 added a slew of new program options that are not available to plugins. 3. Fin07 deprecated the ETF format. Of all the cuts, this has the most far-reaching consequences. ETF allowed plugin developers to discover data structures that were not documented, thus allowing plugins to support new Finale features without any dependency on Makemusic. 4. If Fin06 wrapped text blocks in a plugin compatibility layer, Fin07 wraps just about everything else, due to linked parts. Plugins do not have access to any part-linkage information, nor can they hide/show most items. Furthermore, the plugin-compatibility layer introduced many bugs for which there is no possibile workaround due to the lack of low-level access. Where we are now is that we have simulated low-level access to all Finale features before Fin06. Starting with Fin07 features, we will essentially be able only to support new features that Makemusic explicitly makes available to us. Given Makemusic's recent history of lack or responsiveness, apparent refusal to fully integrate plugins in future development plans, and general lack of priority for the plugin PDK, I am pessimistic that plugins can continue to keep pace with new Finale features. -- Robert Patterson http://RobertGPatterson.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Finale 2005, 2004 can't be registered on Intel Macs
I also do not understand why MakeMusic refused to sell the 2K6 upgrade to a registered Finale user who did not want to migrate to 2K7 yet, but needed to get up to 2K6 to collaborate with me on a potentially long term project: and this was in September, 2006 just after the pre-release of 2K7. This put them in the position of having to buy a newer Mac to install 2K7, and with the problems with 2K7 that many people have experienced, I feel like I've led a new client down an expensive and unrewarding path. To say nothing of the fact that the work that was scheduled to begin months ago is still on hold. I still have 2005 and 2006 on my pre-Intel Mac and will not make any plans to get an Intel machine until after the 2nd generation is released and all the issues are ironed out with software the companies caught up. Hey all, I don't recall this topic being discussed on the Finale list before, so I thought I'd draw everyone's attention to it now: Versions of Finale prior to MacFin2006d CANNOT be registered on Intel- based Macs. That means that if you purchase a new Mac (as I recently did), you cannot run Finale 2005 or 2004 on it. I knew that I would be unable to run versions of Finale prior to Finale 2004 because of the lack of Classic support on Intel Macs, but the inability to run Fin2004 and Fin2005 is *entirely* due to MakeMusic's copy protection scheme. If the copy protection didn't exist, they would run acceptably under Rosetta, as Finale 2006 does. But Finale's Registration Wizard needs to be patched to run on Intel Macs. A decision was made to make this patch available for Finale 2006 (which runs under Rosetta), but not earlier versions of Finale. I just got off the phone with MM Customer Support, who agreed (reluctantly) to pass on my request that earlier versions also get this patch, so that they too can be used on Intel Macs, but his argument was basically that this ship had already sailed -- MM have decided they have no intention to support Finale 2004 or Finale 2005 on Intel Macs. I told him I just wanted to be able to launch the old versions, and I don't care whether they are supported or not. He said if they release a patch that allows those versions to be installed, that implies support. I'm quite upset about this. I had no idea this would be a problem when I bought my MacBook Pro. Having Finale 2004 and 2005 locked out on this machine hits me in the pocketbook -- hard. Many of my copying clients require that work be done in older versions of Finale, and now that's work I have to turn down. And, of course, opening documents created in older versions of Finale in a newer version inevitably introduces problems that require considerable proofreading to catch. I don't believe there is any legitimate reason for MakeMusic to disallow Intel Mac users from installing Finale 2004/ 2005 and running them under Rosetta. This will be an ongoing problem for MakeMusic as users gradually replace their PPC Macs with Intel Macs, and then wonder why they suddenly can't register Finale on their new machines. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] FinMac 2007c Playback Level Too High
Darcy James Argue wrote: I think Apple's already happy with the (primitive) notation capabilities in GarageBand. It is what it is. Where MakeMusic and Apple could *really* help each other would be in improving the notation capabilities in Logic. Now that Avid owns Sibelius, MM needs to develop similar partnerships. Cakewalk/Sonar's notation module leaves a lot to be desired, and it has a huge installed user base. -- David H. Bailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] EXPLODE function not working correctly
Again, maybe this has been covered, but if so, I didn't see it. FinMac2007c. Example: I have two parts I enter on the flute line. They are in 4ths. I explode them so that the top note will be on the flute staff, and the bottom note will be on the oboe (2nd) staff. The HIGHER notes of the figure, appear, on the top staff as the LOWER notes in unison with the oboe. More detail, same example. It is a three-note figure, 2 8ths and a half note. The top voice is D (middle of treble staff) up to high C, down to Bb. The low voice is A (under the D), up to G, down to F. When I explode, the low voice is right, but the top voice is D, G, F (the last 2 note unison with the low part). Any solutions? Using the Note Mover tool is one solution, but a lot more steps. All the best, KIM R ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] TAN: Distiller problems
On 23.02.2007 Dennis Bathory-Kitsz wrote: At 05:10 PM 2/23/2007 +0100, Johannes Gebauer wrote: Sorry, I should have mentioned I am on Mac, we don't have the PDF problems when printing to PS, or in fact using the Distiller printer driver. I knew you were on a Mac, but is there no separate compile Postscript listing? I'm just suggesting you try it to see if the files are different. They are massively different from printing to PS or PDF on Windows. I realize that, but this has never been necessary on Mac, the file size is small. Johannes -- http://www.musikmanufaktur.com http://www.camerata-berolinensis.de ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
RE: [Finale] Army Music (Way OT)
You might find the call you are looking for on the website for the army band: http://bands.army.mil/music/bugle/default.asp Hope this helps (and don't blame me if you didn't want to hear them again). Richard -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean M. Estabrook Sent: Friday, February 23, 2007 11:37 AM To: finale@shsu.edu Subject: Re: [Finale] Army Music (Way OT) You know, now I'm thinking it could have been To the colors, (now that I've seen a score), followed by the national anthem. I appreciate all the responses. Dean On Feb 22, 2007, at 6:53 PM, Roger Cain wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michael Pilgrim Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 7:41 PM To: finale@shsu.edu Subject: Re: [Finale] Army Music (Way OT) http://www.usscouts.org/mb/bugle_calls.html To the Colors seems a little perky. Perhaps it was Retreat (signaling the end of the official day)? Hope you find it. Mike Pilgrim (at the end of his official day) At 03:53 PM 2/22/2007 -0800, you wrote: Among many repressible memories of my days at Ft. Ord, CA ... I can .. Anybody remember what said music was? Dean M. Estabrook http://deanestabrook.googlepages.com/home Power embraces greed and abjurs justice Two Bugle Calls: To the Color (singular): Parade Rest (as I recall) And Retreat: (attention present arms) Roger ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Dean M. Estabrook http://deanestabrook.googlepages.com/home Power embraces greed and abjurs justice ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.441 / Virus Database: 268.18.3/698 - Release Date: 2/23/2007 4:39 AM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.441 / Virus Database: 268.18.3/698 - Release Date: 2/23/2007 4:39 AM ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] fermate on single-line percussion staves
Thanks for the reply, Mark. I am trying to put the fermate over rests. How do I flip their stems? speedy entry, hit L or just assign your artic to always show above the note; if this doesn't work your defult settings are likely the cause (with a different symbol set to appear when flipped; use min 12 EVPU default vertical positioning. you might even want to define a new artic for use with rests, they don't centre the same way as for notes. -- shirling neueweise ... new music publishers mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] :.../ http://newmusicnotation.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] JW SPACE SYSTEMS
Hello everyone, Has anyone been able to get JW's Space Systems to work in Finale 2007 on the Windows platform? Hours of experimentation has locked up Finale repeatedly, eventually freezing my computer as well. I personally would be willing to pay for a working version of this unique and valuable plug-in. Related to this, does anyone have a copy of PDK tools, version 2.16 they could send me? Thanks in advance for any cues, advice, etc. Dan Carno Daniel Carno Music Engraving Services Quality work in Sibelius, Finale, and Score 4514 Makyes Road Syracuse, New York 13215 (315) 492-2987 [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] EXPLODE function not working correctly
Again, maybe this has been covered, but if so, I didn't see it. FinMac2007c. Example: I have two parts I enter on the flute line. They are in 4ths. I explode them so that the top note will be on the flute staff, and the bottom note will be on the oboe (2nd) staff. The HIGHER notes of the figure, appear, on the top staff as the LOWER notes in unison with the oboe. More detail, same example. It is a three-note figure, 2 8ths and a half note. The top voice is D (middle of treble staff) up to high C, down to Bb. The low voice is A (under the D), up to G, down to F. When I explode, the low voice is right, but the top voice is D, G, F (the last 2 note unison with the low part). Any solutions? Using the Note Mover tool is one solution, but a lot more steps. All the best, KIM R I have reported this bug to this list and to tech support at MM. So far their response has been infuriatingly dumb. (2 months of stupid delays and seeming inability to read what I have written to them.) Please send your file and complaint to MM so that they might start to take this seriously. Just out of curiosity, did this file start with an older template or have material pasted into it from another file? I think that might have something to do with it. -Randolph Peters ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Finale 2005, 2004 can't be registered on Intel Macs
FWIW: I have a co-worker who was able to register (or fake register) his 2005 so it works under Rosetta. He (doesn't recall the process exactly) either installed 2005 then installed 2006 (without registering). Or installed 2006 then installed 2005 (without registering). Either way, he registered 2006 first then registered 2005 and everything is working well on his intel mac. Hope this helps and it just wasn't a lucky mistake. Steve ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Finale 2005, 2004 can't be registered on Intel Macs
Steve, I'm afraid I don't see how this is possible. It if is, I'd love to know exactly how it was done. The registration for Fin2006 doesn't have anything to do with the registration for Fin2005 or Fin2004. All versions need to be registered via the Registration Wizard -- but the 2004/2005 Registration Wizard won't run under Rosetta. Is it possible your friend is still in the 30-day grace period for Finale 2005? Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY On 23 Feb 2007, at 3:27 PM, Fiskum, Steve wrote: FWIW: I have a co-worker who was able to register (or fake register) his 2005 so it works under Rosetta. He (doesn't recall the process exactly) either installed 2005 then installed 2006 (without registering). Or installed 2006 then installed 2005 (without registering). Either way, he registered 2006 first then registered 2005 and everything is working well on his intel mac. Hope this helps and it just wasn't a lucky mistake. Steve ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Re: Finale 2005, 2004 can't be registered on Intel Macs
Darcy Argue wrote: Versions of Finale prior to MacFin2006d CANNOT be registered on Intel- based Macs. That means that if you purchase a new Mac (as I recently did), you cannot run Finale 2005 or 2004 on it. I knew that I would be unable to run versions of Finale prior to Finale 2004 because of the lack of Classic support on Intel Macs, but the inability to run Fin2004 and Fin2005 is *entirely* due to MakeMusic's copy protection scheme. If the copy protection didn't exist, they would run acceptably under Rosetta, as Finale 2006 does. But Finale's Registration Wizard needs to be patched to run on Intel Macs. A decision was made to make this patch available for Finale 2006 (which runs under Rosetta), but not earlier versions of Finale. Yes, you are correct: it's purely due to the copy protection scheme. I have kept a copy of Finale 2005 on my recent intel iMac and it works fine because I used the transfer settings application, and it seems to have transferred the registration factor or whatever across as well. Another way around the problem is to use the Networking/labpack licensing feature, which apparently is available through Makemusic. We have a lab full of intel Mac Minis all running Finale 2005 without a problem. (I'm not sure whether you need a non-Intel mac to run the hosting application). It would be a fairly trivial matter for Makemusic to supply a one-license version of this to you I'm sure: whether they'd want to or not is another question. Good luck, Matthew ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Finale 2005, 2004 can't be registered on Intel Macs
He registered 2006 first. Then register 2005. He has been working this way for the last 6 months. It works beautifully and it is possible...we just cannot remember the exact steps. Good Luck, Steve On 2/23/07 2:51 PM, Darcy James Argue [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Steve, I'm afraid I don't see how this is possible. It if is, I'd love to know exactly how it was done. The registration for Fin2006 doesn't have anything to do with the registration for Fin2005 or Fin2004. All versions need to be registered via the Registration Wizard -- but the 2004/2005 Registration Wizard won't run under Rosetta. Is it possible your friend is still in the 30-day grace period for Finale 2005? Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY On 23 Feb 2007, at 3:27 PM, Fiskum, Steve wrote: FWIW: I have a co-worker who was able to register (or fake register) his 2005 so it works under Rosetta. He (doesn't recall the process exactly) either installed 2005 then installed 2006 (without registering). Or installed 2006 then installed 2005 (without registering). Either way, he registered 2006 first then registered 2005 and everything is working well on his intel mac. Hope this helps and it just wasn't a lucky mistake. Steve ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Re: Finale 2005, 2004 can't be registered on Intel Macs
On 23 Feb 2007, at 3:31 PM, Matthew Hindson fastmail acct wrote: Yes, you are correct: it's purely due to the copy protection scheme. I have kept a copy of Finale 2005 on my recent intel iMac and it works fine because I used the transfer settings application, and it seems to have transferred the registration factor or whatever across as well. What is this transfer settings application? Do you mean the FireWire Target Mode transfer that you get asked about when you turn on your new Mac for the first time? That's exactly what I used. It didn't work -- Finale knows that my computer has changed and the copied registration isn't valid. It would be a fairly trivial matter for Makemusic to supply a one- license version of this to you I'm sure: whether they'd want to or not is another question. The guy I spoke to emphatically did not want to help me. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] JW SPACE SYSTEMS
I've added the Windows version of PDKTools 2.16 to the download page at my site. I'll leave it up unless Jari asks me to take it down. -- Robert Patterson http://RobertGPatterson.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Finale 2005, 2004 can't be registered on Intel Macs
Steve, I have no idea what kind of crazy voodoo your friend pulled, but the reason I cannot register Finale 2005 is because the Finale 2005 Registration Wizard will flat-out not run on Intel Macs. Period. It didn't run when Finale 2006 was unregistered, and it still doesn't run now that Finale 2006 was registered. It's just not compatible with Intel Macs. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY On 23 Feb 2007, at 4:21 PM, Fiskum, Steve wrote: He registered 2006 first. Then register 2005. He has been working this way for the last 6 months. It works beautifully and it is possible...we just cannot remember the exact steps. Good Luck, Steve ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Finale 2005, 2004 can't be registered on Intel Macs
Well I will have to say, before he figured this out he was wiping his drive every 30 days. So maybe the key is to wipe your drive, install 2006, register it, then install 2005 and register it with a clean drive. I know it sounds crazy but he was desperate and worked very hard to get 2005 registered. If you take the time to start with a clean drive you may be able to do it also. Steve On 2/23/07 3:30 PM, Darcy James Argue [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Steve, I have no idea what kind of crazy voodoo your friend pulled, but the reason I cannot register Finale 2005 is because the Finale 2005 Registration Wizard will flat-out not run on Intel Macs. Period. It didn't run when Finale 2006 was unregistered, and it still doesn't run now that Finale 2006 was registered. It's just not compatible with Intel Macs. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY On 23 Feb 2007, at 4:21 PM, Fiskum, Steve wrote: He registered 2006 first. Then register 2005. He has been working this way for the last 6 months. It works beautifully and it is possible...we just cannot remember the exact steps. Good Luck, Steve ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Army Music (Way OT)
Hey, Richard ... that's a cool site. No blame ... but it did bring back some memories ... mostly good. Thanks, Dean On Feb 23, 2007, at 10:29 AM, Richard Willis wrote: You might find the call you are looking for on the website for the army band: http://bands.army.mil/music/bugle/default.asp Hope this helps (and don't blame me if you didn't want to hear them again). Richard -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean M. Estabrook Sent: Friday, February 23, 2007 11:37 AM To: finale@shsu.edu Subject: Re: [Finale] Army Music (Way OT) You know, now I'm thinking it could have been To the colors, (now that I've seen a score), followed by the national anthem. I appreciate all the responses. Dean On Feb 22, 2007, at 6:53 PM, Roger Cain wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michael Pilgrim Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 7:41 PM To: finale@shsu.edu Subject: Re: [Finale] Army Music (Way OT) http://www.usscouts.org/mb/bugle_calls.html To the Colors seems a little perky. Perhaps it was Retreat (signaling the end of the official day)? Hope you find it. Mike Pilgrim (at the end of his official day) At 03:53 PM 2/22/2007 -0800, you wrote: Among many repressible memories of my days at Ft. Ord, CA ... I can .. Anybody remember what said music was? Dean M. Estabrook http://deanestabrook.googlepages.com/home Power embraces greed and abjurs justice Two Bugle Calls: To the Color (singular): Parade Rest (as I recall) And Retreat: (attention present arms) Roger ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Dean M. Estabrook http://deanestabrook.googlepages.com/home Power embraces greed and abjurs justice ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.441 / Virus Database: 268.18.3/698 - Release Date: 2/23/2007 4:39 AM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.441 / Virus Database: 268.18.3/698 - Release Date: 2/23/2007 4:39 AM ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Dean M. Estabrook http://deanestabrook.googlepages.com/home Power embraces greed and abjurs justice ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Plugin Power
Hi Robert, Well, MM is cutting off their nose to spite their face, if that's their plan. I work in a situation where I am often struggling to meet deadlines with long, last-minute hours. Your plug-ins along with those of Tobias Giesen and Jari Williamsson, take much of the tedium, stress, and fatigue out of dealing with Finale's menus, boxes, handles, etc. These plug-in's are essential to my getting projects done in a timely, sane fashion, and worth every penny of the small fees that you charge. My thanks to all of you. Dan Carno At 12:16 PM 2/23/2007, you wrote: Matthew Hindson fastmail acct wrote: I will have to go to Sibelius very soon (publisher reasons) but the ease of use combined with sheer power of your plugins are forcing me to thoroughly investigate how I can stick with Finale. They're that good! I hope you will let Makemusic know that plugin power is a major factor keeping you clinging to Finale if at all possible. Makemusic has begun to marginalize plugins Daniel Carno Music Engraving Services Quality work in Sibelius, Finale, and Score 4514 Makyes Road Syracuse, New York 13215 (315) 492-2987 [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Re: Finale 2005, 2004 can't be registered on Intel Macs
Hi Darcy, I wish I could say that I was having more success communicating with MM than others on this list, but my experience is the same. Still, I encourage you to call Jim Bruce and speak to him about this impossible situation. You've paid for the use of the software and it is unethical for them to do anything that prevents you from continuing to use it. Jim Bruce - customer support chief 1-800-843-2066 xt. 3644 Good luck, Chuck On Feb 23, 2007, at 1:26 PM, Darcy James Argue wrote: On 23 Feb 2007, at 3:31 PM, Matthew Hindson fastmail acct wrote: Yes, you are correct: it's purely due to the copy protection scheme. I have kept a copy of Finale 2005 on my recent intel iMac and it works fine because I used the transfer settings application, and it seems to have transferred the registration factor or whatever across as well. What is this transfer settings application? Do you mean the FireWire Target Mode transfer that you get asked about when you turn on your new Mac for the first time? That's exactly what I used. It didn't work -- Finale knows that my computer has changed and the copied registration isn't valid. It would be a fairly trivial matter for Makemusic to supply a one- license version of this to you I'm sure: whether they'd want to or not is another question. The guy I spoke to emphatically did not want to help me. Cheers, - Darcy - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brooklyn, NY ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale Chuck Israels 230 North Garden Terrace Bellingham, WA 98225-5836 phone (360) 671-3402 fax (360) 676-6055 www.chuckisraels.com ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] fermate on single-line percussion staves
On 23-Feb-07, at 12:04 PM, Mark D Lew wrote: On Feb 22, 2007, at 9:00 PM, Aaron Rabushka wrote: It seems that every time I try to put a fermata on top of a single- line percussion staff Finale moves it to the bottom of the staff by the time I revisit it. I've set the articulation to use the top form regardless of where the note is placed, and I still get the same result. Is there some trick that I need to be aware of here? Have you tried flipping the stem direction? You should be able to place the fermata where you want regardless of stem, but that might be what's making it bounce around. If it's a whole note or other stemless note, you wouldn't even see the stem, but the note is still assigned an up or down direction internally. I find the fermatas (and other articulations set to show up ABOVE the notes) sometimes migrate to belwo when I'm not looking, but hitting redraw screen (command-D on Mac) repairs the view. This happens in FinMac 2006d right now. Christopher ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Re: Hiding stems
I am entering chant for the first time in Finale 2002 with reasonable success. But I need black notes, and am having difficulty hiding quarter-note stems. I was told to click the Staff Tool and double-click the staff, then in the Items to Display section to uncheck stems and click OK. BUT--in my version of Finale 2002 there is no check-box marked stems. I can remove the stems by going to the Special Tools Tool Custom Stem Tool, selecting the stems, and shortening each to the position of the notehead. (Double-clicking a stem in this situation does not open the Shape Selection Dialog Box, so I can't go this route). Can someone explain to me (simply!) what I am missing? Dan Lindblom [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Re: Finale 2005, 2004 can't be registered on Intel Macs
Darcy, I'm currently working on a project (a very graphics-intensive beginning band method book) in Finale 2003 in MacOS 9.2 on my G4 TiBook because the text line spacing and imported eps graphics are completely unusable in any version of Finale OSX -- even in classic. The worst offender is the imported eps graphics. They print out fine, but on screen in page view they are garishly reversed with big black rectangles surrounding white images, the black background obliterating any overlapping text or music. Apparently, MM never fixed this bug so I continue to work on this project in an older version in an older OS, backing up my work using Adobe Acrobat 5. There is definitely something to be said for keeping an older computer around in order to be *completely* backward compatible. Brian I'm quite upset about this. I had no idea this would be a problem when I bought my MacBook Pro. Having Finale 2004 and 2005 locked out on this machine hits me in the pocketbook -- hard. Many of my copying clients require that work be done in older versions of Finale, and now that's work I have to turn down. And, of course, opening documents created in older versions of Finale in a newer version inevitably introduces problems that require considerable proofreading to catch. I don't believe there is any legitimate reason for MakeMusic to disallow Intel Mac users from installing Finale 2004/ 2005 and running them under Rosetta. This will be an ongoing problem for MakeMusic as users gradually replace their PPC Macs with Intel Macs, and then wonder why they suddenly can't register Finale on their new machines. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] Re: Army Music (Way OT)
At Disneyland, the trumpet players play Retreat after the color guard takes the rope from the pole, then the band plays the National Anthem while the flag is lowered. I believe this is consistent with Military protocol. Brian Among many repressible memories of my days at Ft. Ord, CA ... I can remember that, at that post at least, stopping what ever training we were doing at 1700, I believe, to face the direction of the nearest American flag and listening to music while it was lowered. I can't remember if it was a particular bugle call, or the National Anthem. I know it was not Taps, 'cause that came later, just before lights out, when I would always shout out, The thinking lamp is now lit! (not popular with the platoon sgt.). I just recall it being a gentle, calming experience after a long day of running up and down sand hills, and inserting my bayonet into the rubber ribs of a dummy. Anybody remember what said music was? Dean M. Estabrook ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Re: Hiding stems
At 08:10 PM 2/23/2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was told to click the Staff Tool and double-click the staff, then in the Items to Display section to uncheck stems and click OK. BUT--in my version of Finale 2002 there is no check-box marked stems. Really? Sounds odd, but I don't have Fin02 here to check. I can remove the stems by going to the Special Tools Tool Custom Stem Tool, selecting the stems, and shortening each to the position of the notehead. (Double-clicking a stem in this situation does not open the Shape Selection Dialog Box, so I can't go this route). Again, that's just plain odd, unless this behavior has also changed since 2002. When I select the Custom Stem Tool in Fin07 and then click a measure, each note in that measure gets a handle. Double-clicking the handle gets me the Shape Selection dialog, and then I can pick a blank shape. If you want to get rid of all stems in the piece, you can go to Document Options | Stems, and set all stem lengths to 0. Aaron. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
[Finale] MULTIMEASURE catastrophe
OK, here's another shortcoming for MacFin2007c, and this one almost completely sabotaged my rehearsal of my orchestra today. It's a good thing is wasn't a recording session. In going to tweak Linked Parts after placing all entries in the score, I discovered that some measures were left out with a group of number (like below an expanse of multimeasure rests) underneath one measure of music. I quickly learned that that meant there were measures filled with music not showing on the part. The solution was, on each part, with the Measure Tool selected, choose Create Multimeasure Rests. That reveals the hidden music. But it has to be done on every part. Doing it when viewing the score doesn't do it. Unfortunately, I hadn't done that with all 22 parts, and there was a lot of missing music in the parts today. It appears this 2007 version has a LOT of problems. All the best, KIM R ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Re: Army Music (Way OT)
On 23 Feb 2007 at 17:12, Brian Williams wrote: At Disneyland, the trumpet players play Retreat after the color guard takes the rope from the pole, then the band plays the National Anthem while the flag is lowered. I believe this is consistent with Military protocol. This is the way we did it at Illinois Boys' State for the 15 years I was assistant music director. And, of course, our National Anthem was always preceded with a canon blast. ;) I recall, though, that there was some agreement that we were actually not doing it entirely correctly, though I don't recall the details. -- David W. Fentonhttp://dfenton.com David Fenton Associates http://dfenton.com/DFA/ ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] MULTIMEASURE catastrophe
At 09:48 PM 2/23/2007, Kim Richmond wrote: I quickly learned that that meant there were measures filled with music not showing on the part. The solution was, on each part, with the Measure Tool selected, choose Create Multimeasure Rests. That reveals the hidden music. But it has to be done on every part. Doing it when viewing the score doesn't do it. You can also do Measure | Multimeasure Rest | Create for Parts/Score and do all the parts in one go. Or you can go to Document Options | Multimeasure Rests and check Update Automatically. Then as you add music, MM rests in the part should break themselves as needed. I think the downside to this is that Finale actually recalculates each MM rest when you switch to the part, and you will lose any manual edits. For example, if you have adjusted the endpoint of an MM rest to avoid a clef change, you will lose that edit. It appears this 2007 version has a LOT of problems. Maybe, but this is actually working as designed. Take a look at 37-23 in the manual, which spells most of this out. I'm not saying this is the best approach, but it's not a bug either. Aaron. ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
